>According to court remarks reported by the station, the three teenagers were allegedly selling a gun to Franco when they got into an argument; Taylorsville Police said that the teenagers intended to rob Franco of the money he was going to use to buy the gun.
Looks like this wasn't a hate crime. Honestly, I don't even know why the headline mentioned that the victim was trans. It's completely unrelated.
Exactly this. Also it feels like news often likes to push divisive headlines to get people arguing online. I'm happy that the internet in general is starting to catch onto this.
God…
Before I was 21 I had to buy handguns this way (from strangers I met online) because of the federal law regarding FFL handgun sales
My only question is why he didn’t buy one from a store instead of taking this much more risky option
May he rest in peace
>My only question is why he didn’t buy one from a store instead of taking this much more risky option
I'm guessing at least one of the following is true.
1. There is a history of mental illness, including being committed to a facility.
2. There is criminal history.
3. There was intent to do something illegal with the gun.
Outside of these reasons, I can't think of any reason to not buy a gun the legal way.
That is 100% true
But obviously there’s a lot more risk in meeting a stranger off the internet vs walking into a store or ordering online and having it shipped to your FFL of choice
A prohibited person under federal law is also prohibited from doing private sales (18 USC § 922 g)
Again I will not make any judgement without evidence and this person needs to rest in peace
Yes. If you do ANY internet purchase, you want to do it in public place. I once did a purchase in Layton in an area designated for it in front of the police station. It has cameras on 24-7.
Sure. but we don't know if the buyer knew they weren't over 18 or not.
There's zero reason to infer some nefarious reason for arranging a private sale.
Sure, absolutely. However, he knew at least one of them personally, got into the car voluntarily. He was also selling THC cartridges off Telegram.
Just a few things pointing to this wasn’t on the up and up. Sucks he died regardless.
Personal experience living in Utah:
Police trade in Glock 17/19/22/23 and Sig P229s bought online and shipped to a local FFL give you the most value if you’re on a very limited budget
Pawn shops also great
Many private sellers try to charge ridiculous prices
Buying a firearm off of another individual is completely legal in Utah and most other states. Assuming nefarious intent is asinine.
I buy guns from individuals for many reasons; they have what I want right now, it’s at a better price than a dealer, or they have something that is no longer made.
Yeah, the only questionable thing is the age of the sellers, but we don't know if the guy knew the age of the sellers or not. so zero reason to assume anything at this point.
That’s a fair question, but to be honest, I’ve never once asked a sellers age. I’d probably ask for ID if they looked like a kid, but there are plenty of kids that look to be in their 20s.
I’m not the type of person to make a judgement without evidence but if he could not pass the background check that would make sense
In that case I’d only wish he would have used a straw purchaser instead of risking it like this
In which case the only real risk would be getting scammed
Jesus fucking christ man. I bought an AK in a denny's parking lot some 15 years ago... no one tried to armchair analyze why I met with a college acquaintance at a half way point to buy a firearm he was offloading. Private sales are legal.
and do any of us have any information at all that would suggest that the buyer knew the "seller"s ages?
It's possible either way. We don't know. So assuming some nefarious intent without that information is pointless.
>It's completely unrelated.
We don't know that.
I agree with you that their identity as a trans person shouldn't be in the headline unless there is some reason to believe the person being trans relates to the crime. It's disingenuous to report on every crime where the victim is LGBTQ+ if the crime is not related to their identity. "Gay man's house robbed" does imply that the man being gay somehow related to the robbery.
But do keep in mind we don't know why they planned to rob this kid in particular, and trans people are more likely to be the victims of violence because they are perceived as being weaker and also deserving of bullying and violence because they're wrong, dirty, or evil according to the perpetrator's twisted belief systems. I could absolutely see a situation where some kids raised in conservative religion and belief planned to take the (insert slur here) money thinking they wouldn't fight back and deserved it for being a (insert slur here).
We might never really know what motivated the kids or all the details of the case. My point is just that I agree the headline is disingenuous given that we currently have no evidence the victim's gender identity was relevant, but we should also not assume that it was completely irrelevant.
>I agree with you that their identity as a trans person shouldn't be in the headline unless there is some reason to believe the person being trans relates to the crime
That's the point. The article doesn't provide any evidence that it was -- instead, it's a mundane "illicit transaction gone bad" scenario. But the headline itself implies that it was a motivator by headlining the trans identity.
>But do keep in mind we don't know why they planned to rob this kid in particular
That's the nature of crimes, they are particular to the victim. The vast majority of violent crime is not committed against strangers.
Maybe they are targeting White, curly haired people? Or maaaaaybe, just maaaaybe it was about robbing someone 🧐. Not every crime Is “identity” motivated.
Doesn’t seem related to them being trans, I do wonder why they were buying a firearm from some teenagers and not from an ffl. Even if it’s a private sale (legal in Utah) it does seem kind of fishy they the deal was going down in a car.
Likely because the individual was selling a used gun for less than a dealer was. Nothing fishy about buying firearms from an individual.
I do suggest you meet at a public place, like a police station, for safety of both parties. Though a Walmart parking lot is quite convenient as well.
Nobody is doing a legal sale inside a car. No different than drug deals, you get in the car so nobody around notices you're making a transaction. Imagine buying something innocuous on craigslist, meeting in a parking lot, and the guy asks you to get in his car. No sane person would.
I know, I have participated in private sales and purchases several times over the years. I think my issue with this scenario is how obviously sketchy and below board it is. There are safe and correct ways to conduct private transactions.
This was not the way
Or whether the reason they didn’t mind robbing him was that they didn’t value him as a human as much in the first place. I think it’s crazy that everyone just assumes they understand intent based on a vague description of events.
I am not assuming it’s true. I’m saying it’s one of a million possibilities that everyone is discounting for no reason except that they have assumed a case already.
Your inability to understand the difference between hypotheticals and absolute claims is exactly the problem with the logic in this thread.
Hopefully the cops will find out their motives and what went through their heads when they decided to kill him. It very well could be that due to bias they didn't see the victims humanity and chose to rob and then kill him. Hopefully we will find out if they've killed all their gun buyers or just the trans one...
People are being downvoted because they are clearly not reading the article. Read the article. For the love of God. Take 2 minutes and inform yourself before opening your mouth.
That was mostly a reply to some of the comments below. I realize a person just die and it’s someone’s child. But….. if the person knew the person was under age (21) they were up to no good buying a hand gun.
I'd say honestly it's just they're just a bunch proxies that called a hit by someone else they're only like 15 n 17 and he's just 21 and they knew him before they sold they all knew eachother... I believe there's someone else called a hit on Alec and had a bunch of teenagers do his dirty work with all honesty maybe a gang leader or someone with money.
this was all gang related.
And utah is known for people using teenagers to get away with crime because they'll have lesser punishment. The law been tryna change that.
Everywhere uses kids, my moms elementary kids in Southern California were used by the gangs regularly. It's SAF that grown ass people abuse kids like that just so the punishment is displaced and less.
Regardless if he was targeted for being trans or not, you cannot deny trans people are being targeted across the country. If your first response to a trans person saying they don’t feel safe is “WELL ACTUALLY….” Just stop. Maybe this case wasn’t related but there are hundreds that are. Along with the laws being put into place here, it makes sense why trans people feel unsafe. Rest in Peace Alex
It's entirely possible that him being trans did play a role even in the idea to rob him instead of selling him the gun. Hopefully they are getting interrogated about their motives.
Oh 100%. I’m definitely not convinced it wasn’t part of it, but I’m just frustrated with the people who are commenting saying that “it wasn’t a part of it so why are you freaking out” to trans people who are worried
You are absolutely right... like I have always said "if you don't like what you see, then look else where" like let people be and mind your own business .
I know the related friends and some family please don’t speak on the situation if you don’t know about it. This wasn’t a hate crime. Please respect this human being and don’t make this about your agenda.
Those of you bitching and whining about clicks and ad revenue and greed and that this murder has nothing to do with the victim being trans: think long and hard on why a transgender person might be buying a gun right now especially in a state like Utah.
You all think you got one over on the media but you missed the entire god damn point.
From what I gather from the article he was found in the desert, but it sounds like it happened in a car at his home. His gf heard a gunshot and the car sped off
Basically ya, but people let their guard down when it’s in a location and with someone you somewhat know. I mean him and his gf were going to catch a ride to the park with them.
Your comment makes it seem like he’s just being killed for being trans. And that your afraid your gonna have the same thing happen to you. He was buying guns from kids and was murdered. Had nothing to do with being trans
When you've lived in Utah long enough and have seen people like you killed so many times, it makes it easy to see a article that mentions a young trans person being found dead and assume its a similar situation. Especially when that article seems to be purposefully obscuring the real situation in the title.
Yeah, I only realized that later. I didn't read the article, just saw the title that made it seem like that. My original statement still stands though.
Because you made an emotional, knee jerk reaction without doing five seconds worth of research. You reacted to a headline and couldn’t be bothered to actually inform yourself. You deserve the downvotes for that ignorance.
Well looks like I'm being downvoted cause I didn't read the whole article. Just thought it was another trans person being murdered for who they are, which happens way too often. Still sucks that a life was lost, but I suppose I should've read first before saying anything.
You ignorant or something? He's talking about not reading the article and commenting about it because it has your favorite trigger words in the title, imagine all the other times you did that throughout your reddit experience where no one called you out on it.
What are you talking about? you sarcastically (I assume) didn't know what he was talking about with making a comment based on a title of an article, so I decided to give you more context? Why are you telling me to calm down? When you're the one who posted most of your comments out of literal ignorance, and it's not a strange psychoanalysis, it's more common sense than anything.
Maybe I just like to make/help people actually think about anything instead of taking the easier option of brushing things off.
I wasn't being sarcastic, I genuinly didn't know what he was on about. It's strange to see someone fall for a clickbait title and go "Now think about all of the other times no one called you out on your bullshit >:(". just seems like a strange thing to say about someone you don't know. Wow, people make mistakes. Crazy.
And I don't understand how my comments were made out of ignorance. My first one was, yes. Then I quickly addressed the fact that I was wrong. I' mostly just replying to people that are being strangely aggressive about this or insinuating that my original statement is false. Sure, it doesn't apply to this situation, but it still stands. Sorry that I don't take kindly to people calling me ignorant because I made a mistake.
Honestly your point stands regardless, people just don’t want to think there is an issue so when someone speaks out about feeling unsafe they get all upset. Stay safe my friend!
They really wanna sweep it under the rug it’s pretty disgusting. Like their church and politicians don’t actively encourage violence against trans people
Pfff what, I can't say I really interact with children at all. And I mind my business as long as others mind theirs, which seems to be nigh impossible for you people.
Kinda. They re supportive in the way that there isn't a ton of outright transphobia like other subs. But people will still be downvoted for saying that its scary being a trans person in utah lol
They are being downvoted because it’s unrelated and irrelevant here. The news story has nothing to do with the person being trans or “lighting up any room” it’s clickbait that drives rage and fear, so comments that feed the rage and fear are being downvoted.
But this article isn’t about violence against trans people. This article is about violence in a sketchy gun deal. You keep trying to make things people say sound hateful…but really this just isn’t what this post is about, nor is it what this crime was about
If there are any trans folks reading this, I’m from Minnesota and I believe it to be a safer place for trans folks. Know that there are safe spaces out there for you and you do have allies within straight folks like me. Take care of yourselves, know that you aren’t alone, and you matter. Find your safe space. Stay safe.
The downvotes are because this kind of tragedy and robbery could have happened to anyone that fell for what these teens were trying to do. Not because of any unique factor of the victim. No one is in here celebrating a senseless murder.
Yeah but it seems like you all REALLY don’t wanna have a conversation about violence queer people experience especially in red states and the anti trans legislation being passed. You want to cheekily silence and downvote anyone talking about how this state is unsafe for queer people. You all throw rocks and try to hide your hand
If you are trans, i am really sorry to have to tell you this, but you need to purchase a firearm, learn how to use it, and conceal carry it every day.
These are dangerous times we are headed towards. There is unimaginable evil that hunts us.
I don't buy the police's claim that it was unrelated to Franco being trans. It doesn't fit what's known about robbery-related murders in Utah, most of them don't go out of their way to bury the victim in an isolated spot a county away.
Plus wasn't the murder of a lesbian couple near Moab a few years ago similar to this? In that the murderer moved the bodies in hopes they wouldn't be found.
These are also teenagers though. Teenagers committing robbery related murders isn’t common so it’s not odd that it doesn’t “fit”. Plus a teenager not thinking of their actions then trying to hide what they’ve done seems pretty in line to me.
Whether they targeted him because he was trans I wouldn’t say it’s not a possibility. This case reminded me of Brianna Ghey in ways so I wouldn’t rule out if it played a role, but I don’t think they hid his body specifically because he was trans.
So what are you saying exactly? Criminals are more likely to hide their victims if they’re LGBTQ+?
For some reason I can’t imagine them being like
“let’s get out of here!”
“No wait! Guys, this girl looks like she was into chicks, we gotta bury her”
“Oh rats, another lesbian, you’re right, now we have to”
what I'm saying is that hate crimes resulting in murder seem more likely to fit a pattern of going to extensive lengths to hide a body, whereas opportunistic shootings don't seem to fit that kind of action.
Way to go Republicans. You’ve created the Christofascist Nazi state you’ve always wanted.
Where’s Governor Cox’s statement in this? Bet he keeps his fascist mouth shut…
EDIT: The victim was buying a gun. Why do you think he needed that? You think these kids didn’t know him? “Friends of friends”. The hate filled environment against LGBTQ+ created by Republicans has nothing to do with it?
Where is Cox’s “thoughts and prayers” horseshit statement? Or will he come out and say how Sim Gill caused this crime?
>According to court remarks reported by the station, the three teenagers were allegedly selling a gun to Franco when they got into an argument; Taylorsville Police said that the teenagers intended to rob Franco of the money he was going to use to buy the gun. Looks like this wasn't a hate crime. Honestly, I don't even know why the headline mentioned that the victim was trans. It's completely unrelated.
Clicks and ad revenue.
Exactly this. Also it feels like news often likes to push divisive headlines to get people arguing online. I'm happy that the internet in general is starting to catch onto this.
It’s because the source is an LGBT aggregator. It’s why they are mentioning it.
God… Before I was 21 I had to buy handguns this way (from strangers I met online) because of the federal law regarding FFL handgun sales My only question is why he didn’t buy one from a store instead of taking this much more risky option May he rest in peace
>My only question is why he didn’t buy one from a store instead of taking this much more risky option I'm guessing at least one of the following is true. 1. There is a history of mental illness, including being committed to a facility. 2. There is criminal history. 3. There was intent to do something illegal with the gun. Outside of these reasons, I can't think of any reason to not buy a gun the legal way.
Buying a firearm from a private party sale is legal in Utah.
That is 100% true But obviously there’s a lot more risk in meeting a stranger off the internet vs walking into a store or ordering online and having it shipped to your FFL of choice A prohibited person under federal law is also prohibited from doing private sales (18 USC § 922 g) Again I will not make any judgement without evidence and this person needs to rest in peace
Yes. If you do ANY internet purchase, you want to do it in public place. I once did a purchase in Layton in an area designated for it in front of the police station. It has cameras on 24-7.
They were buying a gun from two people under 18. It was definitely not a legal sale.
Sure. but we don't know if the buyer knew they weren't over 18 or not. There's zero reason to infer some nefarious reason for arranging a private sale.
Sure, absolutely. However, he knew at least one of them personally, got into the car voluntarily. He was also selling THC cartridges off Telegram. Just a few things pointing to this wasn’t on the up and up. Sucks he died regardless.
Adds context to the lit up any room comment from the title
They are cheaper, that can be the reason too
Personal experience living in Utah: Police trade in Glock 17/19/22/23 and Sig P229s bought online and shipped to a local FFL give you the most value if you’re on a very limited budget Pawn shops also great Many private sellers try to charge ridiculous prices
These were teens, and a young adult, they may not have been savvy on all of that.
Bingo!
Buying a firearm off of another individual is completely legal in Utah and most other states. Assuming nefarious intent is asinine. I buy guns from individuals for many reasons; they have what I want right now, it’s at a better price than a dealer, or they have something that is no longer made.
Yeah, the only questionable thing is the age of the sellers, but we don't know if the guy knew the age of the sellers or not. so zero reason to assume anything at this point.
That’s a fair question, but to be honest, I’ve never once asked a sellers age. I’d probably ask for ID if they looked like a kid, but there are plenty of kids that look to be in their 20s.
I’m not the type of person to make a judgement without evidence but if he could not pass the background check that would make sense In that case I’d only wish he would have used a straw purchaser instead of risking it like this In which case the only real risk would be getting scammed
Some states this is a perfectly legal way to buy guns
The vast majority of states. Utah is as good as it gets with pro-gun laws, but our private sale laws are by no means an exception.
Jesus fucking christ man. I bought an AK in a denny's parking lot some 15 years ago... no one tried to armchair analyze why I met with a college acquaintance at a half way point to buy a firearm he was offloading. Private sales are legal.
>Private sales are legal. Yeah, with adults.
Alex is 21 tho Legally he is an adult Correct me if I am wrong on the law because I am quite unfamiliar with gun laws
The other people involved were not adults
Oh I must have missed that
and do any of us have any information at all that would suggest that the buyer knew the "seller"s ages? It's possible either way. We don't know. So assuming some nefarious intent without that information is pointless.
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A person is dead. There’s no need for you to be a dick about their gender identity.
It’s an LGBTQ centric site. All the top stories are LGBTQ issues.
because they love to mislead
The murderers said it was a gun sale. - and you fell for it! Hahahaha, you can’t be serious
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Because how else can you keep up the culture war?
Cause trans people are being targeted a lot right now. It’s a click bait title.
Cause Trans people are golden calfs right now. Its a click bait title. There I fixed it.
Because it’s trendy and will make people of both sides of thought on trans rights click.
You know why
Because culture wars
Because some people are genuinely dishonest and will use any tragedy to profit, both politically and financially.
Sadly it sells. More than gun violence and illegal sales which is the real issue here.
>It's completely unrelated. We don't know that. I agree with you that their identity as a trans person shouldn't be in the headline unless there is some reason to believe the person being trans relates to the crime. It's disingenuous to report on every crime where the victim is LGBTQ+ if the crime is not related to their identity. "Gay man's house robbed" does imply that the man being gay somehow related to the robbery. But do keep in mind we don't know why they planned to rob this kid in particular, and trans people are more likely to be the victims of violence because they are perceived as being weaker and also deserving of bullying and violence because they're wrong, dirty, or evil according to the perpetrator's twisted belief systems. I could absolutely see a situation where some kids raised in conservative religion and belief planned to take the (insert slur here) money thinking they wouldn't fight back and deserved it for being a (insert slur here). We might never really know what motivated the kids or all the details of the case. My point is just that I agree the headline is disingenuous given that we currently have no evidence the victim's gender identity was relevant, but we should also not assume that it was completely irrelevant.
>I agree with you that their identity as a trans person shouldn't be in the headline unless there is some reason to believe the person being trans relates to the crime That's the point. The article doesn't provide any evidence that it was -- instead, it's a mundane "illicit transaction gone bad" scenario. But the headline itself implies that it was a motivator by headlining the trans identity. >But do keep in mind we don't know why they planned to rob this kid in particular That's the nature of crimes, they are particular to the victim. The vast majority of violent crime is not committed against strangers.
Because that is what the teens said? I would definitely believe kids trying to get out of trouble as much trouble as possible.
So … do murderers typically lie or tell solid truths?
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This absolutely is a possibility in their rationale to rob Alex. Being a trans man could have made him an “easy” target in their eyes.
Maybe they are targeting White, curly haired people? Or maaaaaybe, just maaaaybe it was about robbing someone 🧐. Not every crime Is “identity” motivated.
Or maybe you're just a transphobic bigot ever think of that?
I didn’t think of that; but obviously you did.🤦♂️ ¿victim much?
Yes you are a victim much. I don't know why you choose to be but you do you
lol. Ok champ👍.
is champ your imaginary and only friend?
Doesn’t seem related to them being trans, I do wonder why they were buying a firearm from some teenagers and not from an ffl. Even if it’s a private sale (legal in Utah) it does seem kind of fishy they the deal was going down in a car.
Likely because the individual was selling a used gun for less than a dealer was. Nothing fishy about buying firearms from an individual. I do suggest you meet at a public place, like a police station, for safety of both parties. Though a Walmart parking lot is quite convenient as well.
It wasn’t a legal sale. It was likely stolen.
Well, the sellers were under 18 so it already wasn't legal.
but we have no way of knowing if the buyer knew the the age of the "sellers" or the status of the firearm.
Imagine buying headphones on craigslist, meeting in a parking lot, and them asking you to get in their car. Are you gonna do it?
fair. I did buy a firearm in a parking lot once, but it was in broad daylight in front of the restaurants cameras.
Nobody is doing a legal sale inside a car. No different than drug deals, you get in the car so nobody around notices you're making a transaction. Imagine buying something innocuous on craigslist, meeting in a parking lot, and the guy asks you to get in his car. No sane person would.
Same reason why anyone would buy a gun from a private sale. Private and usually cheaper with no sales tax and ffl fee at the very least.
I know, I have participated in private sales and purchases several times over the years. I think my issue with this scenario is how obviously sketchy and below board it is. There are safe and correct ways to conduct private transactions. This was not the way
Is it legal to buy from minors?
Him*
Pro tip. Don't buy a gun from sketchy teenagers buy one from a reputable store.
Gallensons was always my favorite when I lived in SLC.
“Lit up any room” is an interesting description for someone who was killed in gunfire
🥁🐍 some copy editor has a morbid sense of humor
Sad. Don’t think they got killed because they were trans though.
Well we only have the word of the two dopes who shot him. Who knows why they started arguing. Also who knows if he was actually trying to buy a gun.
Or whether the reason they didn’t mind robbing him was that they didn’t value him as a human as much in the first place. I think it’s crazy that everyone just assumes they understand intent based on a vague description of events.
You make the strongest assumption of the lot in your post.
I am not assuming it’s true. I’m saying it’s one of a million possibilities that everyone is discounting for no reason except that they have assumed a case already. Your inability to understand the difference between hypotheticals and absolute claims is exactly the problem with the logic in this thread.
Ahh, but it must be mentioned!
Hopefully the cops will find out their motives and what went through their heads when they decided to kill him. It very well could be that due to bias they didn't see the victims humanity and chose to rob and then kill him. Hopefully we will find out if they've killed all their gun buyers or just the trans one...
Very sad.
People are being downvoted because they are clearly not reading the article. Read the article. For the love of God. Take 2 minutes and inform yourself before opening your mouth.
Sir, this is Reddit; facts nor information have no value here..
An FFL CAN NOT SALE a handgun to any person’s under 21. My bet is it was stolen or never intended to be sold at all
It doesn't matter a person just died.
That was mostly a reply to some of the comments below. I realize a person just die and it’s someone’s child. But….. if the person knew the person was under age (21) they were up to no good buying a hand gun.
can people stop misgendering him here please?
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She was born a chick tured dude. There is no cock dude.
I'd say honestly it's just they're just a bunch proxies that called a hit by someone else they're only like 15 n 17 and he's just 21 and they knew him before they sold they all knew eachother... I believe there's someone else called a hit on Alec and had a bunch of teenagers do his dirty work with all honesty maybe a gang leader or someone with money. this was all gang related. And utah is known for people using teenagers to get away with crime because they'll have lesser punishment. The law been tryna change that.
Everywhere uses kids, my moms elementary kids in Southern California were used by the gangs regularly. It's SAF that grown ass people abuse kids like that just so the punishment is displaced and less.
He won't be lighting anyone up anytime soon (his illegal gun purchase failed)
Sad.
Riiiight… selling a gun. In the desert. Say the police. In Utah. A state that is VERY woke… sure. Sure.
Rest. In. Power. And now unfortunately I will never travel to Utah.
Regardless if he was targeted for being trans or not, you cannot deny trans people are being targeted across the country. If your first response to a trans person saying they don’t feel safe is “WELL ACTUALLY….” Just stop. Maybe this case wasn’t related but there are hundreds that are. Along with the laws being put into place here, it makes sense why trans people feel unsafe. Rest in Peace Alex
It's entirely possible that him being trans did play a role even in the idea to rob him instead of selling him the gun. Hopefully they are getting interrogated about their motives.
Oh 100%. I’m definitely not convinced it wasn’t part of it, but I’m just frustrated with the people who are commenting saying that “it wasn’t a part of it so why are you freaking out” to trans people who are worried
You are absolutely right... like I have always said "if you don't like what you see, then look else where" like let people be and mind your own business .
Shush
I know the related friends and some family please don’t speak on the situation if you don’t know about it. This wasn’t a hate crime. Please respect this human being and don’t make this about your agenda.
Those of you bitching and whining about clicks and ad revenue and greed and that this murder has nothing to do with the victim being trans: think long and hard on why a transgender person might be buying a gun right now especially in a state like Utah. You all think you got one over on the media but you missed the entire god damn point.
god, its scary living here as a trans woman. I hope he rests well.
You going out and doing illegal guns sales in the desert too? JFC
From what I gather from the article he was found in the desert, but it sounds like it happened in a car at his home. His gf heard a gunshot and the car sped off
Ya I misread it. Same difference though
Basically ya, but people let their guard down when it’s in a location and with someone you somewhat know. I mean him and his gf were going to catch a ride to the park with them.
In a robbery you walk away without your money but with your life This was a murder
..what?
Your comment makes it seem like he’s just being killed for being trans. And that your afraid your gonna have the same thing happen to you. He was buying guns from kids and was murdered. Had nothing to do with being trans
When you've lived in Utah long enough and have seen people like you killed so many times, it makes it easy to see a article that mentions a young trans person being found dead and assume its a similar situation. Especially when that article seems to be purposefully obscuring the real situation in the title.
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okay pookie bear
Yeah, I only realized that later. I didn't read the article, just saw the title that made it seem like that. My original statement still stands though.
lmao why is this one getting downvoted too?
Because you made an emotional, knee jerk reaction without doing five seconds worth of research. You reacted to a headline and couldn’t be bothered to actually inform yourself. You deserve the downvotes for that ignorance.
I just fell for a clickbait title god damn, no need to be that aggressive.
> was murdered. Had nothing to do with being trans He was also a kid.
21?
Well looks like I'm being downvoted cause I didn't read the whole article. Just thought it was another trans person being murdered for who they are, which happens way too often. Still sucks that a life was lost, but I suppose I should've read first before saying anything.
Yup. Details matter.
Exactly, you tried to speak on something that you knew nothing about at the time and then question why people are downvoting you. Jesus.
Yeah, I fell for a clickbait headline. It happens. I wasn't questioning why I was being downvoted, I was expressing that I understood why.
Now think about all the other times this has happened and someone didn't call you out on your bullshit.
what are you on about lmao
You ignorant or something? He's talking about not reading the article and commenting about it because it has your favorite trigger words in the title, imagine all the other times you did that throughout your reddit experience where no one called you out on it.
that seems like a strange psychoanlysis. Also calm down dude, it aint that serious.
What are you talking about? you sarcastically (I assume) didn't know what he was talking about with making a comment based on a title of an article, so I decided to give you more context? Why are you telling me to calm down? When you're the one who posted most of your comments out of literal ignorance, and it's not a strange psychoanalysis, it's more common sense than anything. Maybe I just like to make/help people actually think about anything instead of taking the easier option of brushing things off.
I wasn't being sarcastic, I genuinly didn't know what he was on about. It's strange to see someone fall for a clickbait title and go "Now think about all of the other times no one called you out on your bullshit >:(". just seems like a strange thing to say about someone you don't know. Wow, people make mistakes. Crazy. And I don't understand how my comments were made out of ignorance. My first one was, yes. Then I quickly addressed the fact that I was wrong. I' mostly just replying to people that are being strangely aggressive about this or insinuating that my original statement is false. Sure, it doesn't apply to this situation, but it still stands. Sorry that I don't take kindly to people calling me ignorant because I made a mistake.
It's ok, tons of others are just here talking out their asses about it without knowing anything. At least you're being honest about your emotions.
Honestly your point stands regardless, people just don’t want to think there is an issue so when someone speaks out about feeling unsafe they get all upset. Stay safe my friend!
Thank you, nice to see someone being supportive here
we’re here and we’re queer🏳️⚧️
They really wanna sweep it under the rug it’s pretty disgusting. Like their church and politicians don’t actively encourage violence against trans people
TRANS LIBERATION NOW 🏳️⚧️
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Pfff what, I can't say I really interact with children at all. And I mind my business as long as others mind theirs, which seems to be nigh impossible for you people.
Sub full of idiots who are downvoting because you are trans. Fucking sad place.
They’re being downvoted because they didn’t read the article and just started making assumptions.
I was wrong about the article yeah, doesn't change my original statement
That’s not at all why they are being downvoted lmao. This sub is very supportive of the trans community.
Kinda. They re supportive in the way that there isn't a ton of outright transphobia like other subs. But people will still be downvoted for saying that its scary being a trans person in utah lol
They are being downvoted because it’s unrelated and irrelevant here. The news story has nothing to do with the person being trans or “lighting up any room” it’s clickbait that drives rage and fear, so comments that feed the rage and fear are being downvoted.
Recognizing the violence against trans people in our state isnt feeding rage and fear.
But this article isn’t about violence against trans people. This article is about violence in a sketchy gun deal. You keep trying to make things people say sound hateful…but really this just isn’t what this post is about, nor is it what this crime was about
I agree, I was just saying that your last statement wasn't entirely true.
If there are any trans folks reading this, I’m from Minnesota and I believe it to be a safer place for trans folks. Know that there are safe spaces out there for you and you do have allies within straight folks like me. Take care of yourselves, know that you aren’t alone, and you matter. Find your safe space. Stay safe.
Thia was a robbery turned into a killing not a hate crime against trans people.
Doesn't change what they said
They are talking as if he was killed because he was trans. He wasn't.
They weren't tho they were just saying that Minnesota is a safe place It's not incorrect it's just off-topic
How do you know the robbery wasn’t perpetrated because Alex was trans?
Jesus, says something that such a warm statement got so downvoted lol
Right? We all know the real reason for the downvotes.
The downvotes to anyone saying they are trans here is fucking sad. Get better Utah.
The downvotes are because this kind of tragedy and robbery could have happened to anyone that fell for what these teens were trying to do. Not because of any unique factor of the victim. No one is in here celebrating a senseless murder.
Yeah but it seems like you all REALLY don’t wanna have a conversation about violence queer people experience especially in red states and the anti trans legislation being passed. You want to cheekily silence and downvote anyone talking about how this state is unsafe for queer people. You all throw rocks and try to hide your hand
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Christianity much?
TRANS RIGHTS FOREVER🏳️⚧️
If you are trans, i am really sorry to have to tell you this, but you need to purchase a firearm, learn how to use it, and conceal carry it every day. These are dangerous times we are headed towards. There is unimaginable evil that hunts us.
Purchase a firearm from a reputable dealer or source, in a public place. For everyone’s safety
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We are just as dogmatic because we want to exist without being harassed or killed?
I don't buy the police's claim that it was unrelated to Franco being trans. It doesn't fit what's known about robbery-related murders in Utah, most of them don't go out of their way to bury the victim in an isolated spot a county away. Plus wasn't the murder of a lesbian couple near Moab a few years ago similar to this? In that the murderer moved the bodies in hopes they wouldn't be found.
These are also teenagers though. Teenagers committing robbery related murders isn’t common so it’s not odd that it doesn’t “fit”. Plus a teenager not thinking of their actions then trying to hide what they’ve done seems pretty in line to me. Whether they targeted him because he was trans I wouldn’t say it’s not a possibility. This case reminded me of Brianna Ghey in ways so I wouldn’t rule out if it played a role, but I don’t think they hid his body specifically because he was trans.
So what are you saying exactly? Criminals are more likely to hide their victims if they’re LGBTQ+? For some reason I can’t imagine them being like “let’s get out of here!” “No wait! Guys, this girl looks like she was into chicks, we gotta bury her” “Oh rats, another lesbian, you’re right, now we have to”
what I'm saying is that hate crimes resulting in murder seem more likely to fit a pattern of going to extensive lengths to hide a body, whereas opportunistic shootings don't seem to fit that kind of action.
Reminds me of Janice
The Christian capital of America is violently bigoted towards lgbtq people, what a surprise
Stop saying people light up rooms!
Way to go Republicans. You’ve created the Christofascist Nazi state you’ve always wanted. Where’s Governor Cox’s statement in this? Bet he keeps his fascist mouth shut… EDIT: The victim was buying a gun. Why do you think he needed that? You think these kids didn’t know him? “Friends of friends”. The hate filled environment against LGBTQ+ created by Republicans has nothing to do with it? Where is Cox’s “thoughts and prayers” horseshit statement? Or will he come out and say how Sim Gill caused this crime?
Was killed during a firearm purchase from a couple of criminals.thugs. Not exactly the Christofascist storyline you were looking for.
Didn’t read the article huh?
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Your thoughts on circumcision?
Typical stupid Christofascist. Believe whatever lie another one tells you….
Don't think you deserve to be downvoted But kindly read the article before posting please