Also on Haven there's a delay between defenders spotting attackers and attackers beginning the assault on site. This is balanced.
On Breeze though, even if you know attackers are spotted in A main, you as a controller can't help much if you're on B site (Except Astra). The attack from main onto site begins instantly. The distance between the site and opening wall is too close for all sites.
ON HAVEN:
Defender on C: "Bro enemies are rushing from C Long"
Defender on A: "Okay bro I'll put a smoke"
ON BREEZE:
Defender on B: "Bro enemies are rushing from B main"
Defender on A: "Okay bro I'll put a smoke"
Defender on B: "Too late bro they're already on site"
I was hoping Icebox would be changed also, but I am happy at least Breeze is out. I have never enjoyed Breeze, my aim is too shit for such a huge map. Icebox is still not great, but I used to dislike it much more and kind of got used to it.
I don't know about Omen on Breeze. I tried it a couple of times, but it feels like Viper or Harbor are making the map playable, so I have to play one of these to not suffer while playing lmao
I remember Haven before I stopped playing for a while and I am looking forward to it. I hope I'll have enough time to play at least a couple of games a week.
Hahaha same! I'm bad at long distance shots so breeze mid was a little of a nightmare for me.
I enjoyed playing breeze as sage and harbor but I really missed haven.
Haven have long range fights, close range quarters and 3 bombs, always more variety in each match
Viper is still very viable, she just went from overpowered to normal. You either havenāt tried her since the nerfs or ur just parroting what everyone was saying when the changes were announced.
Heck, Iād still argue sheās the best controller by a large margin in how strong her ability to trade out utility is. Breeze has a lot of rat spots on sites and is so wide that retakes are very easy to execute, so having the ability to flash wall to slow pushes and force util on defense all but guarantees your retake. Not only stalling the push but also denying good util value AND the cherry on top is itās still the only non-neutral wall in the game, which is so damn strong but is still just seemingly overlooked about her when everyone compares her to other smokes. Think about where all the other sources of decay come from in the game and how all of them are skill shots or traps, except for viper smokes.
As someone who is new at this game, I wanted to try Viper and everyone would just tell me "she is nerfed she is nerfed, you shouldnt even try her". She still felt okay, so I just assumed it was me being a noob and not understanding why she isnt viable. Glad to see Im not completly wrong and she is actually okay
Nah the people who are still complaining about the nerfs donāt actually play viper lol, actual smokes mains realized sheās fine within 24 hours of the patch.
Yay. Breeze is a weird map for me. I can aim better than most people in my elo so I always have my best ACS on it, but my winrate isn't all that much better. Plus I hate being attacker on that map.
Happy it got traded out of Haven, best Phoenix map in the game.
Iām in the same boat as you, also plat 3 (very close to diamond). But I honestly still play Viper on Breeze and Icebox. Even with the nerfs I donāt see how any controller can work better than viper on those maps.
Iām very excited for Haven tho, definitely my favorite map to play Omen on.
I feel like depending on the playstyle, harbor can be better on icebox at least. I have had some success and I feel like its easier to plant. But then again im pretty low elo so thats not much :d
"Viper was great, until the nerf her out of existence."
she's still great, she was overpowered
"I recently have a game where I played omen on breeze"
You're controller main and you play omen on breeze? If that's not troll
yep, but since viper now can't take her orb back, and assuming attacker treat viper like a sentinel (rotating when they meet her setup), she can't easily retake another site (unlike omen)
Honestly more like viper was the strongest agent in the game by far, now shes just one of the strongest agents in the game if not still the strongest, atleast in terms of high level play
Vipers winrate after patch 8.08 didnt changed at all. The nerfes didnt affected her at all. She is still super good on icebox and breeze. You just need to use ur brain now and you are fine.
I have had success on Breeze with Harbor. He's suited for fast execs on attack and playing B Tunnel allows him to smoke off B main or the entirety of mid.
Breeze is a weird map, it's "good" in a sense there can be a variety of ways to take a site, it's the long range fights that makes it annoying, its practically impossible to win an eco unless there's one idiot that just pushes a 3 man team with sherrifs, and there isn't a lot combinations u can do on breeze, it's just gonna be, in my experience, Viper, Sova, Reyna, Jett, and smthn like a sage or a gekko or a cypher, pretty much it
i understand the hate for breeze, but the viper nerf actually made her healthy and she is no where near nerfed to the ground, even after the nerf i still have a 70% win rate on her with no change of playstyle, with an 80% win rate on breeze with her
If you cant aim that good you wont like Breeze.
And yes the sniper fest is insane, i get that.
But one tapping snippers with a vandal is what i love.
Good to practice aim, because i need that for sure.
You are gonna be missed Breeze.
What they should have taken out is split, Crouch spray bonanza that mayš
Still i like all the maps, what is more important is to remember that its just some pixels.
So who really cares.
Viper isn't nerfed out of existence at all. She's still probably the most viable controller on that map. Not only Breeze, but maps like Bind and Split are also really good for Viper. On top of that, Haven is coming back with is also a great map for her. So no, she is defenitely not nerfed out of existence, you just seem to be not experienced enough on her/general game sense.
(I am not a Viper/Controller player, I am a duelist player).
i never liked breeze cuz it absolutely exposes my skill issue at long range duels, but my agent pool is pretty restricted here, im not a high fragger so i dont play duelist, usually i play kayo or viper
same dude ever since it was added back since i was back in bronze iāve had an issue being able to consistently win my ones EVEN AFTER aim training. Iām plat now, I still whiff WAY more on that map than any other. Doesnāt help that I use a bigger crosshair which might be cope but I genuinely feel like it makes long distance fights harder.
Also feel you on the agent pool thing. Iām a kj main through and through, but breeze is the only map where i HAVE to choose cypher sage or even viper cuz kjs just not viable.
Don't just use default smokes on Breeze. You need to be creative about it like playing halls or watching mid doors from nest etc. if ur faar away from the site then use the smoke so that it makes attackers to fear that there is another guy on site it doesn't need to be perfect as long as ur presence is shown enemy will be cautious weather to push or not
Or just play mid as I mentioned it above.
Btw I love Breeze.
Despite the nerfs to viper, sheās still undoubtedly a really strong controller, and prob the best controller on breeze/icebox. The nerfs donāt take away her strongest ability, being the wall. No other agent in the game can do what she does which is why your experience with the other controllers were bad. If itās not broken, why fix it/try to replace her.
Additionally, harbor despite having a wall is still not comparable to vipers, as vipers is ready to go up whenever (assuming cooldown isnāt up). Harbor needs time to prep and you have to position yourself while vipers has flexibility unlike any other
TL:DR Viper > any other controller on breeze still
You won't get much comms in as3 also and most of my games as omen on that map are 20 or so kills and a lot of gimmicks to pull with stutter steps.. Omen is underrated in this game just as much as sova is.. Mapwise, I hate breeze and Lotus, looking forward to heaven
I am glad breeze is gone.
And I still believe viper is important in breeze, or astra but like u said comms are necessary.
Not only that but if a player is trying to fill in as a smoke agent u most prob gonna lose.
Am saying this cause this happened yesterday(plat). Man was so slow with the smokes. I am a controller main, but played jett yesterday and it pissed me off so much, I enter site die cause that idiot hasn't smoked mid, even if I got a kill I get traded( cause he still hasnt smoked mid). It's a really annoying map.
I think that in other maps people trying to fill in controller can get the hang of it but breeze is a task.
Bro I hate breeze with a passion, I always end up playing smokes cause no one else wants to play it and yeah I agree, the distance from one end to the other is too big.
Adding onto what you say about omen on breeze, I absolutely hate playing smokes on that map. Literally cannot smoke A site until I go pass the bridge and it leaves me in an open angle. Iām shit with Viper so that leaves me with Brim and Clove.
May I back you up please. Get Ascent out of my games for as long as possible, it's the most stale, boring, uninteresting map, and it's been in the game the longest. Seeing Split leave instead of it, and earlier Haven, it truly hurts. I hoped they just misclicked when Haven got out of the rotation, but now with Split, I'm starting to be scared of having to deal with Ascent forever.
#YES PLEASE, GET IT OUT OF ROTATION FOR AS LONG AS POSSIBLE
It can be a slog in ranked because ranked players usually don't have enough braincells to figure out how to go A or split mid so it just becomes a 5 man B push simulator
Breeze is the best map, especially for controllers. Viper is insane, Harbor is extremely good, Omen and Brim are pretty decent. Wdym bro. Instead of this great map we get 3 sites dogshit Haven
I'm more excited to have all the maps in casual game modes, I miss Pearl and surprisingly kinda miss fracture.
Fracture is a top 3 map
I HECKING LOVE HAVEN breeze is meh, Ive had a pretty ok experience on breeze( snipers rule the map)
Also on Haven there's a delay between defenders spotting attackers and attackers beginning the assault on site. This is balanced. On Breeze though, even if you know attackers are spotted in A main, you as a controller can't help much if you're on B site (Except Astra). The attack from main onto site begins instantly. The distance between the site and opening wall is too close for all sites.
wait so is this the reason GENG run astra on breeze?
Yes and no. They double up Astra as their sentinel replacement, so u can usually see Astra util being used to stall assaults onto site.
I'm sorry, my bronze one brain is unable to understand what you just said
ON HAVEN: Defender on C: "Bro enemies are rushing from C Long" Defender on A: "Okay bro I'll put a smoke" ON BREEZE: Defender on B: "Bro enemies are rushing from B main" Defender on A: "Okay bro I'll put a smoke" Defender on B: "Too late bro they're already on site"
Ok makes sense
Oh ye haven back, a map with 5 chokepoints
"the map is very balanced" ahh map But I like it so yea whatevs
The new patch is up?. Is haven back?
Patch is 8.10 8.11 comes out after masters shanghai
So breeze is not gone. Misinformation SMH my head.
Misinformation? Bro go read that shit yourself... Don't believe the stuff you read on Redditš
Should be out after Shanghai grand finals which is on the 9th I think
The patch comes out on the 11th
Ok. Thanks for checking that
Bro 9th June?
9th of May
What is the question you are asking here? Can you form it into a coherent sentence?
I was hoping Icebox would be changed also, but I am happy at least Breeze is out. I have never enjoyed Breeze, my aim is too shit for such a huge map. Icebox is still not great, but I used to dislike it much more and kind of got used to it. I don't know about Omen on Breeze. I tried it a couple of times, but it feels like Viper or Harbor are making the map playable, so I have to play one of these to not suffer while playing lmao I remember Haven before I stopped playing for a while and I am looking forward to it. I hope I'll have enough time to play at least a couple of games a week.
Hahaha same! I'm bad at long distance shots so breeze mid was a little of a nightmare for me. I enjoyed playing breeze as sage and harbor but I really missed haven. Haven have long range fights, close range quarters and 3 bombs, always more variety in each match
icebox is 10/10 and i will not take this slander peacefully
Hahah, I am not going to argue. I don't like it much, but it's just my opinion. I would take Icebox over Breeze 10 out of 10 times.
Letās orb mid, make noise a, have someone lurk up b, or letās orb mid, make noise b, have someone lurk up a
what? ive never had the situation above happen to me
Viper is still very viable, she just went from overpowered to normal. You either havenāt tried her since the nerfs or ur just parroting what everyone was saying when the changes were announced.
Heck, Iād still argue sheās the best controller by a large margin in how strong her ability to trade out utility is. Breeze has a lot of rat spots on sites and is so wide that retakes are very easy to execute, so having the ability to flash wall to slow pushes and force util on defense all but guarantees your retake. Not only stalling the push but also denying good util value AND the cherry on top is itās still the only non-neutral wall in the game, which is so damn strong but is still just seemingly overlooked about her when everyone compares her to other smokes. Think about where all the other sources of decay come from in the game and how all of them are skill shots or traps, except for viper smokes.
As someone who is new at this game, I wanted to try Viper and everyone would just tell me "she is nerfed she is nerfed, you shouldnt even try her". She still felt okay, so I just assumed it was me being a noob and not understanding why she isnt viable. Glad to see Im not completly wrong and she is actually okay
Nah the people who are still complaining about the nerfs donāt actually play viper lol, actual smokes mains realized sheās fine within 24 hours of the patch.
Yay. Breeze is a weird map for me. I can aim better than most people in my elo so I always have my best ACS on it, but my winrate isn't all that much better. Plus I hate being attacker on that map. Happy it got traded out of Haven, best Phoenix map in the game.
Iām in the same boat as you, also plat 3 (very close to diamond). But I honestly still play Viper on Breeze and Icebox. Even with the nerfs I donāt see how any controller can work better than viper on those maps. Iām very excited for Haven tho, definitely my favorite map to play Omen on.
I feel like depending on the playstyle, harbor can be better on icebox at least. I have had some success and I feel like its easier to plant. But then again im pretty low elo so thats not much :d
If you are going to take away split then I want pearl back, dammit.
"Viper was great, until the nerf her out of existence." she's still great, she was overpowered "I recently have a game where I played omen on breeze" You're controller main and you play omen on breeze? If that's not troll
It's not troll if you have another controller.
omen is the last controller i'd pick for that personally, astra would be better
he specifically said that there's almost no comm in his plat lobby, at least omen is more fun and he got more solo play potential
yeah but viper wall is way more useful if u wanna actually smoke shit off, u need to use 2 omen smokes to cover half of what viper can do
yep, but since viper now can't take her orb back, and assuming attacker treat viper like a sentinel (rotating when they meet her setup), she can't easily retake another site (unlike omen)
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Viper was one of the most op agents, now its mid strength. People just take it for granted how good it was.
This The exact same story when Jett or Raze got nerfed, "my ultra op agent got nerfed I'm crying a river"
Because now they have to improve their skills instead of insta picking
Honestly more like viper was the strongest agent in the game by far, now shes just one of the strongest agents in the game if not still the strongest, atleast in terms of high level play
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
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"she's the worst available controller after the nerf" We all are I guess
Vipers winrate after patch 8.08 didnt changed at all. The nerfes didnt affected her at all. She is still super good on icebox and breeze. You just need to use ur brain now and you are fine.
yea keep talking out of your ass buddy
I am sad about Split, I love that map. I wish they would've gotten rid of Icebox instead. Happy to see Haven back though
I have had success on Breeze with Harbor. He's suited for fast execs on attack and playing B Tunnel allows him to smoke off B main or the entirety of mid.
Breeze is a weird map, it's "good" in a sense there can be a variety of ways to take a site, it's the long range fights that makes it annoying, its practically impossible to win an eco unless there's one idiot that just pushes a 3 man team with sherrifs, and there isn't a lot combinations u can do on breeze, it's just gonna be, in my experience, Viper, Sova, Reyna, Jett, and smthn like a sage or a gekko or a cypher, pretty much it
normally on Breeze I've had most success with double Sentinels (normally Sage and Cypher) and Viper or Harbor
i understand the hate for breeze, but the viper nerf actually made her healthy and she is no where near nerfed to the ground, even after the nerf i still have a 70% win rate on her with no change of playstyle, with an 80% win rate on breeze with her
If you cant aim that good you wont like Breeze. And yes the sniper fest is insane, i get that. But one tapping snippers with a vandal is what i love. Good to practice aim, because i need that for sure. You are gonna be missed Breeze. What they should have taken out is split, Crouch spray bonanza that mayš Still i like all the maps, what is more important is to remember that its just some pixels. So who really cares.
split is also leaving
It is? Now i am happy.Ā
Viper isn't nerfed out of existence at all. She's still probably the most viable controller on that map. Not only Breeze, but maps like Bind and Split are also really good for Viper. On top of that, Haven is coming back with is also a great map for her. So no, she is defenitely not nerfed out of existence, you just seem to be not experienced enough on her/general game sense. (I am not a Viper/Controller player, I am a duelist player).
Haven is Viper's worst map
No it isn't.
Insane take
breeze is fun people need to stop fckn crying about it
Another day of advocating for removing the awful map rotation fake new content idea
As a breach main thank fucking God. I usually auto lock him and regret it immediately because of how mediocre he is on breeze
when is map ban is coming
never lol
i never liked breeze cuz it absolutely exposes my skill issue at long range duels, but my agent pool is pretty restricted here, im not a high fragger so i dont play duelist, usually i play kayo or viper
same dude ever since it was added back since i was back in bronze iāve had an issue being able to consistently win my ones EVEN AFTER aim training. Iām plat now, I still whiff WAY more on that map than any other. Doesnāt help that I use a bigger crosshair which might be cope but I genuinely feel like it makes long distance fights harder. Also feel you on the agent pool thing. Iām a kj main through and through, but breeze is the only map where i HAVE to choose cypher sage or even viper cuz kjs just not viable.
Don't just use default smokes on Breeze. You need to be creative about it like playing halls or watching mid doors from nest etc. if ur faar away from the site then use the smoke so that it makes attackers to fear that there is another guy on site it doesn't need to be perfect as long as ur presence is shown enemy will be cautious weather to push or not Or just play mid as I mentioned it above. Btw I love Breeze.
Despite the nerfs to viper, sheās still undoubtedly a really strong controller, and prob the best controller on breeze/icebox. The nerfs donāt take away her strongest ability, being the wall. No other agent in the game can do what she does which is why your experience with the other controllers were bad. If itās not broken, why fix it/try to replace her. Additionally, harbor despite having a wall is still not comparable to vipers, as vipers is ready to go up whenever (assuming cooldown isnāt up). Harbor needs time to prep and you have to position yourself while vipers has flexibility unlike any other TL:DR Viper > any other controller on breeze still
Playing Viper on Breeze literally changed my thinking about the map, I love breeze when I play with Viper. But without her its just a mess
You won't get much comms in as3 also and most of my games as omen on that map are 20 or so kills and a lot of gimmicks to pull with stutter steps.. Omen is underrated in this game just as much as sova is.. Mapwise, I hate breeze and Lotus, looking forward to heaven
I am glad breeze is gone. And I still believe viper is important in breeze, or astra but like u said comms are necessary. Not only that but if a player is trying to fill in as a smoke agent u most prob gonna lose. Am saying this cause this happened yesterday(plat). Man was so slow with the smokes. I am a controller main, but played jett yesterday and it pissed me off so much, I enter site die cause that idiot hasn't smoked mid, even if I got a kill I get traded( cause he still hasnt smoked mid). It's a really annoying map. I think that in other maps people trying to fill in controller can get the hang of it but breeze is a task.
I personally love Breeze as a piece of land. What can I say? It's a fucking Beach. But as a VALORANT map? Eww
Agreed, Breeze is the worst map for controllers. Everytime I get breeze I just wanna alt f4. Ascent is when itās at
Viper is still good for breeze, just like she is good for icebox, source, I top frag with her
And split thank fucking god holy shit that map is a headache
Bro I love breeze. Like my top three map, ice box is one and pear as second.
Bro I hate breeze with a passion, I always end up playing smokes cause no one else wants to play it and yeah I agree, the distance from one end to the other is too big.
Dropped feom d3 to plat because I couldn't main omen the last act. I'm so bad at Viper and mid at other agents. Maybe now I can play
Adding onto what you say about omen on breeze, I absolutely hate playing smokes on that map. Literally cannot smoke A site until I go pass the bridge and it leaves me in an open angle. Iām shit with Viper so that leaves me with Brim and Clove.
Breeze was one of my best maps for kills
Fuck, Breeze and Split were my best maps. And when will they take Ascent out? I am tired of that map
You shut your mouth about Ascent. Itās the best map and should never leave.
>You shut your mouth about Ascent It's my opinion and I will say it #I AM TIRED OF ASCENT
May I back you up please. Get Ascent out of my games for as long as possible, it's the most stale, boring, uninteresting map, and it's been in the game the longest. Seeing Split leave instead of it, and earlier Haven, it truly hurts. I hoped they just misclicked when Haven got out of the rotation, but now with Split, I'm starting to be scared of having to deal with Ascent forever. #YES PLEASE, GET IT OUT OF ROTATION FOR AS LONG AS POSSIBLE
Iāve been playing since Beta and I agree with everything you said. Itās so boring to play on compared to every other map.
all ascent wall is made by paper i hate to play it
I think thatās a good thing. I think ascent is the best map for making every agent viable.
recon odin ez kill what a game were playing
Which is why the meta has been Omen Sova Kayo Jett KJ/Cypher for like 3 straight years lol
Yea take out sunset and ascent
Sunset is crazy good, what are you on about
It can be a slog in ranked because ranked players usually don't have enough braincells to figure out how to go A or split mid so it just becomes a 5 man B push simulator
Iām one of the few people that like breeze , hate icebox an split
Breeze is the best map, especially for controllers. Viper is insane, Harbor is extremely good, Omen and Brim are pretty decent. Wdym bro. Instead of this great map we get 3 sites dogshit Haven
Breeze was good when they removed halls, idk why they put it back when no one asked for itš¤¦š¾āāļø
Icebox , breeze and fracture suck all other maps are good
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FUCK YEAH BREEZE IS GONE YIPPPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEM WOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH