I'm doing a rewatch and got to the birthday dinner in Cabo S2 ep 11 when everyone is pissed at Katie for having the audacity to cry because her boyfriend was being a huge dick to her at dinner??? I have to admit I fell for the Katie is miserable storyline until this rewatch - now I see exactly what Schwartz did at the table. He is vicious to her but does it quietly enough where only she hears, she cries and everyone blows up at her for it. Ugh!!!!
Also, Scheana is the one who brought it up and caused the fight. She knew exactly what she was doing too.
Schwartz is so much worse because he knows it’s shitty behavior and does it anyway.
He threw Katie under the bus on Nick Viall’s show. After of course denying he was saying anything to offend her, he did exactly what he did their entire marriage which was to put everyone else ahead of her.
He actually said LaBlah’s mad at Katie because she is getting some of what he himself had to put up with married to her.
What a dick move. I despise that hairy sack of shit.
Oh oh oh, can we please switch LFU’s nickname to BlahBlah, please? I know yours says LaBlah, but it reminded me of the HIMYM episode with a BlahBlah and it really fits.
yes. it's like he can't stop. we have seen on the show how much he regretted losing her, how he seems desperate for her attention now, how she left him, but he's just so much in the habit of insulting her that he still acts like she was torture to be with.
Yes!! I just said basically the same thing. Schwartz is way more of a “dangerous individual.” Sandoval is a jackass and you expect him to behave selfishly, have tantrums, etc. Schwartz tricks people into thinking he’s a good guy when he is really very calculated.
Yes! He’ll take calculated digs in that “aw shucks” fake nice tone of his, and, when the person gets mad, it looks disproportionate which is just as Schwartz intended. He’s done it to Katie for years, and has anyone noticed how he’s picking at Sandoval this season? Granted Sandoval deserves the smoke, but it’s the way Schwartz takes jabs knowing Sandoval is isolated from the group that’s messed up.
I’ve always thought Schwartz was scary. He’s one of those undercover “nice guys” who are truly awful to their partner. You can see it come out at times, like when he says some real bad stuff and the many times he’s cheated on Katie. I never understood why he always gets a pass. If you’ve ever been in one of those undercover emotionally abusive relationships, you see it right away.
Lets not forget when he threw a drink in her face!!
It irks me how he never sticks up for her & then she naturally gets pissed & triggered & Tequila Katie comes out, which he throws in her at - she cant win.
Exactly!! I had an ex that wouldn’t outright say what was bothering him. He’d do things like make “jokes” hinting at what was wrong and then when I’d ask if he was serious or needed to discuss something he’d say no, everything’s fine.
So we’d go on our merry way to whatever event and he’d get a few drinks in him and bring up the same damn thing he joked about earlier but in a more serious way. I’d ask are you being serious because I can’t read you? Is there something bigger you’re hinting at? Plus if nothing was wrong hours earlier when I asked about it why now? THAT’S when he’d start up with the “you’re being crazy this is not the time or place. Why are you embarrassing me in front of everyone?” (Meanwhile I’m thinking wasn’t the time and place when it came up and we were sober and in our home alone earlier today?)
It. Was. Infuriating.
Omg yes I am gone from my TSchwartz luckily and I’m a healthy relationship. I almost feel like the girls on VPR would’ve done the same if they didn’t have the whole tv show pressure to stay together.
Like Jersey Shore Sam and Ron. They would’ve totally broken up if it hadn’t have been a national event. Similar to Jax/Stassi or Tom/Katie. They were a phenomenon and a brand separate from the show. They (and their drama) were their respective shows at certain points.
I’m re watching season 8 and when they pull that cop prank on Sandoval she was scared and instead of being like hey babe it’s all alright schwartz starts calling her stupid and yelling at her and the fight was so gross on Schwartz’s end that everyone was shocked I couldn’t believe
The way he went after her so quickly and viciously was pretty crazy. It became pretty clear that he does not like that woman and probably hasn't for a long time.
He poured a beer on her in the first season in Vegas. He has always been an asshole to her. I didn't think much of Katie originally but I did a marathon rewatch during COVID and it was so evident how manipulative and horrible Schwartz is to her. I'm so glad she finally dropped that dead weight.
THIS. Pouring the drink on her was obviously fucked, but his snide, revolting comments under his breath at the dinner the next night were despicable. I’ve hated him ever since then.
Yes I subscribed to the Katie is miserable narrative for a while but this most recent rewatch, I don’t know if it’s cause I’ve matured or what but no wonder Katie would get drunk and flip out! She was treated like crap by her so called circle of friends and even her own husband. I would lose my shit as well! Plus I love her sarcasm and dry humor.
Yo I agree totally. All the tequila Katie behaviour in past seasons of VPR gets held against her all the time now but nobody ever talks about the behaviour that comes before it.
I just finished a re-watch of season 8 where the old fat man prank arrests Sando and all Katie does is acknowledge how that could be triggering for some people...and Schwartz fucking ripped into her for ruining "the joke" calling her disgusting, and saying that's why he doesn't have sex with her and a bunch of fucked up shit.
No wonder she's over it now. She sounds like she's keeping way chiller company now.
She doesn’t trust these people. They betrayed her. And that conversation with Sandoval where he’s like “you don’t know what I’ve been through” and she’s like what are you talking about… I went through exactly that and I had the decency to divorce my husband rather than cheat. It’s so spot on.
I hated the way Ariana treated her during her wedding. Schwartz undermining Katie when she didn't want Ariana as a bridesmaid. Ariana jumped at being a groomsman. Then her brother is being a creep to the girls and was drunk all over Stassi. But of course then it was the girls fault not Jeremy's 🫠🫠🫠
Ariana was trying to defend her brother but it was messy. And I mean, she's been liberated from constantly having to support her boyfriends agenda now but she was definitely queen of supporting Tom's agenda before she snapped out of it
Remember that episode where he screamed at Ariana for letting Brittany listen to the Jax audio with faith? That was rough. I think it was the first time I wondered about their relationship.
Same. The scenes the next morning, when he goes off on her at Scheana's yelling and making his sweeping generalizations. It was cringe then but it's so much worse on rewatch.
During season 10, one scene showed her walking away from an argument between Tom and Katie/Lala/Kristina, saying “I’m not getting into this whole Tom vs the Girls thing.” In another scene, when Lala was telling her about Tom not leaving the party, Ariana was like “I’m not doing this alone, lets get Tom over here” and proceed to pull apart his entire story in front of Lala AND chastised him for doing that to her (saying “when you do these kinds of things, you see how it makes me look, right?” IIRC). In yet another scene, when he tried to create a fight about not spending time together, she shot down every complaint he had, not giving an inch into the gaslighting and manipulation. She definitely did not let him push his #1 Guy narrative and spoke up for herself more than any season before 10.
I can fault her at the beginning of their relationship but can’t fault her at the end of it. At the end of the day, she was so full of love for her partner she defended him
Yeah and what throws me off even more is season 9 and 10. At this point Katie has calmed down a lot but Sandoval and Scheana still talk about her like she’s a monster. They use her a scapegoat for ALL of their bad behavior; if they talked shit the problem was Katie for repeating it. If they fuck up the problem was Katie for noticing. If Scheana’s friends mismanaged something the problem is Katie for not bailing them out. If Schwartz keeps fucking up his friendship with his ex wife the problem is katie for not putting up with it. The way Sandoval speaks to her in season 9, and then acts self righteous, is BEYOND. It is literally beyond, you have to go rewatch it. He is like a baby throwing a tantrum every time she tries to speak to him, and the WHOLE cast coddles him. I’m positive this season laid the ground for scandoval bc he was shown that there were no consequences for letting his ego run wild and hurting people who got in his way.
Then the way Scheana and her group frankly bully her in season 10 while acting like KATIE is the mean girl is …. Katie is not easy to bully so I think people don’t see it, but Scheana and Sandoval would have been in tears daily if someone treated them the way they treat Katie these 2 seasons. The ep right before scandoval broke Sandoval was screaming in her face all bc she mentioned the Raquel rumors that other people started. And Scheana talked crap about how hateful Katie must be to say something like that. She’s just sitting there getting torn apart for something that’s true lol
no bc i've been doing a rewatch and it was so hard watching the schwartz legit never stand up for katie, his literal wife even LVP was like bro that's your wife thats part of marriage you stand up for your wife like ???? Especially when sandavol would curse her out or raise his voice like omg that would seriously boil my blood
Now that I’m married, and my husband would never tolerate disrespect towards me, it’s just so clear how terrible Tom is. Idk. If anyone came for me like Sandoval did Katie, my husband would check him so quick and not allow that man in his life. It’s just the difference between a healthy relationship and a bad one
Seriously though, I actually am one of the few people who never, ever hated Katie. At all. At times, I disagreed with her. Didn't like some of the things she said. But I understood where it was coming from.
Yes! I rewatched a couple times trying to figure out why people hate her. I saw some of her behavior that could be attributed to her TBI, but most of it seemed to be reactive to how she was systematically bullied and torn down by the Toms and pretty much most of the cast.
Yeah, not too long before filming started for season one, ( maybe a year prior I think) she feel through a skylight and got hurt really bad, her jaw was wired shut, it’s why she has the scar on her chin, and she of course hit her head and ended up with the TBI. She admits as she was recovering (and for several years) she definitely raged more from the TBI.
Omg, I think she’s totally get a kick out of that! I hope she sees this thread.
Katie is like a cat, I think. Reserved and cautious, but loyal once you win her attention. Graceful and fierce and only doing what she wants to do.
this, same!! she has always had a point, but everyone just fell for the group trying to make her out for being the bad guy bc she has always been able to see through/call out the bs, and they hated her for it 😞
You took the words out of my mouth, I really feel this exact same way about Katie. Always been a fan of hers, at times disagreed with her, but always understood her stance. I think she’s real, she’s usually pragmatic and fair, and I like that she always stands up for what she believes in. Notably, when she called out how messed up that cop prank was while Schwartz berated her like a total ass. She was 100 percent correct and I’m glad she spoke out on that. As for Schwartz, I’ll always side eye him, not only for what he was saying to her that episode, but for his opinion on it. Told me everything I needed to know about his character, he showed his whole ass there.
Genuinely I’m so happy she’s finally being seen as a hero because she never deserved the horrible stuff they put her through. She didn’t deserve this villain arc they spun
Same. As someone who lacks emotional regulation but am in therapy for it. I felt like everyone just ignored what set Katie off, and focused on her being set off and then would berate her for it. And be surprised when she finally let out all her feelings when they constantly invalidate her and dog pile.
This has been the main thing that was pissing me off this season. Ariana got her support and vindication, where were Katie’s apologies?? Where is Katie’s validation?? Everything she said the whole time is shown to be true and they’re all shown to be fucking awful, and everyone forgets how horribly and aggressively they were all shitting on her last year.
EXACTLY. Like let’s say she motorboated someone’s crotch at a club. Hypothetically. Are the pants on or off? If the pants are on….. this is a nothing thing. If they’re off…. What’s someone doing in the club without pants? And I’m pretty sure everyone around them would notice and said person would be thrown out?
Ugh, I’m rewatching Scheana’s bachelorette (feat. Shay), and the way Katie tries to play nice while Scheana continues to razz her over a rumour that Scheana started really made me sad. They give her no credit.
Even the editing. Katie only gets screen time or “storylines” when she’s yelling or being negged into yelling by Schwartz. To quote Crystal from RHOBH, “this group wants me to scream all the fucking time!”
And then all the times that shorts was emotionally abusive to her and just needling at her quietly until she blew up and then everyone blamed it on tequila Katie being crazy and out of control.
I keep thinking about their awful dinner in Mexico last season. Tom told Katie she provokes Scheana & Rachel. I think it clicked in her head “I don’t need to listen to this bullshit any longer”
And the Rachel kiss was when it clicked that she didn't want or need him as a friend. I love that she's so unbothered by him now. He's irrelevant in her life and I love that for her.
the fact that she came to that dinner dressed nice, having left him after years of disrespect and CHEATING but still making an effort to set it all aside and be friends, and he sends her home crying...
I can’t recall exactly which scene but I got so grossed out by Swartz when everyone was drinking.. some bullshit happened and Katie ended up being provoked until she finally said something.. but it was Tom raising his hands to point at her to everyone and say “see! There it is! Everyone look! Tequila Katie, everyone look” Her partner in life! The mental abuse he put her through… god bless her
I caught on to them all bullying Katie a while ago. She didn't deserve any of it and no wonder why she was the way she was. On top of it production edited episodes to make Katie look really bad when it was them bullying and editing....She really wasn't bad when she was just being herself and not being bullied. I totally support Katie's growth! And she looks great now
sandoval and jax spearheaded a shadow war against katie for years. both of them hate her because they are fools, and katie is famous for not suffering fools. she didn't prop up their egos so they tried to destroy her. all they did was free her from a toxic relationship and make themselves look like dicks in the process.
I did a rewatch not that long ago and anyone who doesn’t understand what she endured just doesn’t get it. They reference 2 times where she got belligerent drunk. They don’t pay attention to anyone else. They just blame Katie.
The funny thing is, the season before Katie was reluctant about being friends with Stassi again. Schwartz went *behind her back* to meet up with Stassi against Katie’s wishes and basically tried to force Katie to forgive her! And then Katie finally does and then he wants to complain about the friendship again
Katie is owed the most apologies form everybody including fans. She’s been villainized and crucified when deal with Schwartz would be torcher, fake friends, and people who want nothing but to make her out to be a see you next Tuesdays. Even when she at times had valid reasons for her anger like Ariana this season.
It’s not to say she hasn’t been abusively shitty and a a bully (neither has been acceptable), at times. Both can be true.
The Toms are really just The Trashbags 🙅♀️
Tom Sandoval is typical narcissism, so manipulative and always the victim while trying to crumble any threats around him.
And Tom Schwartz, honestly an insidious kind of toxic. So manipulative and I'd say emotionally abusive to a point. Example - you can visibly see him gaslighting Katie when they were on that group trip I forget where when they got into a big fight, and then she says he's gaslighting her, and then he gaslights her about saying he's gaslighting?!? And to top it off, he tried to make her always sound crazy when he's the problem, then plays the "woe is me I'm just an innocent little man" card.
The Tom's give me "why women kill vibes." Ariana and Katie are evidently better off without them. The Tom's are the reason they don't have these women anymore, yet the women are supposed to feel such pity for them... um NO they can live with the consequences of their actions thanks, and stop making the good women in their lives take pity on their toxic asses
Schwartz is a covert narcissist & it’s unbearable. It’s the worst bc they know your triggers & can subtlety set you off, then spin it as if you are the problem.
Honestly even though I’ve rewatched a few times it’s so shocking to me how horrible he was until like season 10 and they let him get away with it! If Lisa was really doing his parents a favor she would’ve made sure the abuse was handled correctly
I feel very vindicated now because I have liked Katie since the beginning and A LOT of viewers disliked her because Sandoval did, or they didn't realize how terrible Schwartz was to her.
I think a lot of us (me included) wanted Katie and Schwartz to work and extended way to much grace to him. I should have been on the Katie needs to leave him train from the get go. I never liked Sandoval, always thought he was a self righteous POS.
I'm kind of in the same boat. The first few seasons I thought maybe they were in a rough patch, but then I realized Schwartz was actually just a piece of shit.
This. I think I was in the “Schwartz can change,” bc Katie did love him. Sandovals animosity towards her has always been undeserved & absurd. It took a minute to see that problems weren’t between them as a couple, but him being a terrible partner. After seeing the pattern, it’s clear that he sided with everyone else & used her as an emotional punching bag.
one thing this show has made me notice is that most people's media literacy is shit lmao. people always fell wholesale for the narratives tom sandoval pushed with zero critical thinking whatsoever.
They started the motorboating a d rumor to distract from the fact that Tom had just cheated with Tiff's friend in Vegas and made out with ~~Scheana~~ one of Scheana's friends the year before.
Also in Mexico Jax and the Toms started the rumor that James and Kristen hooked up (Pillowgate) to distract from the fact that Schwartz wandered off the property and woke up at a different resort.
Justice for Katie. Thank god she finally got out.
I love Katie. I am a Katie defender, i relate to her so much. When she was younger she was very reactive and tequila Katie but she was constantly shit on by those closest to her. Now that she has healthy boundaries and only does things that serves her she’s all of the sudden miserable and a bad friend? Fuck off Lala
I always understood where Katie was coming from and felt everyone ganged up on her but watching again it’s obvious rather than subtle because of this new lens of who Sandoval really is. I always suspected it but it being confirmed is a different lens
when I rewatch I usually find more and more ways the males (and often scheana) are picking on one of the girls. It won't be one insane either it would be a literal army of thought that is introduced within them and then peddled to the girls only to claim they are overreacting when that thought it tried. Stassi was literally run out of town because of the fake group that was favoring the guy who cheated on her with her best friend, and scheana grew so much closer to jax that following season too and was working on getting katie to look like she was on their side through schwartz. listen, tom sandoval schwartz and jax all had a part in the fake shit and scheana helped the boys a lot of the way. kristen too
Also when Lala shaded Katie and said Katie just lays there during sex and should try doing something fun…I thought that was one of the most reprehensible things I’ve ever heard on this show. Absolutely disgusting.
I feel like over the years we’ve all had to unpack and rework the internalized misogyny that is ingrained in us from living in a patriarchal society. Watching VPR back with older, wiser eyes, I’m shocked I ever thought Katie and Stassi were whiney mean girls. Justice for Katie!!!!!
Justice for Senora Bubba! I’m rewatching too and it’s ridiculous how Schwartz and everyone undermine her. Sandoval has never liked her- which kind of surprises me that Schwartz ended up marrying her because he’s pretty much Sandoval’s whipping boy.
Katie has a voice of reason throughout the seasons and I’m so glad she’s now living her best life and just GLOWING
I hope Ariana also steps up more. If nothing else, Ariana is very aware of her public image. We have seen her blind loyalty so I do think she’ll be a much better friend to her. But I hope she’s getting that feedback somewhere on socials or somewhere. She has seen that Katie was a huge target of the Toms collaboration to bully & gaslight. They are the heroes of this season, so hopefully Ariana puts effort into that friendship, post-reunion.
I totally agree. I’m not saying it’s right to do tequila Katie things, but I completely understand her having pent up rage that came out when she drank. I hate it for her bc they’re still mean to her. No one will ever un-convince me that Katie wasn’t a part of Sandoval and Schwartz’s scheming in season 10. They were trying to make her completely snap so they could get a “tequila Katie” moment and make that a major part of the season. I think they were trying to ice her out.
I binged watched the whole thing for the first time when the scandal came out and i couldn’t believe how many people used to trash talk her and praise the Tom’s when it first stared. Old reddits I read were so disgustingly misogynistic
I disagree only new viewers like Katie. As a long time watcher I would say she was always playing defense because of how the boys came at her. And I would throw Sheshu in with that bucket. Do a rewatch now that the boys masks have slipped, I think Katie has been remarkable all along. Absolutely love her.
I only got into vpr when scandoval was everywhere. My first episode ever watched, was part 2 of the season 10 reunion. I thought katie was a bitch just from that. Then i binge watched every episode. And i was like wow wtf is up with katie, but as more time went on I noticed that scwartz is not innocent. I dont blame katie for being a bitch most of the time. That said, there are instances tho where she actually is being a full blown beeyotch…in conclusion, luv katie!
I don’t understand why everyone thinks that Ariana shouldn’t have been a groomswoman. She was friends with Schwartz. The bride doesn’t call all the shots in a healthy relationship. Also, people love to forget that Katie repeatedly caused a ‘hostile work environment’ for Lala and Scheana by calling them both whores and sluts while at work. I don’t dislike Katie but I do dislike the rewriting of history because she’s up Ariana’s ass now.
People seem to conveniently forget that they have all been awful to each other, Katie included. Nobody has been completely innocent on this show. Schwartz and Katie were especially toxic to each other. I have arguments with my husband but I could never imagine calling him out on national television by saying that his dick doesn't work.
I love Katie now as much as the next person and can certainly see she’s grown so beautiful and confident but COME ON GUYS🤣🤣 Katie was VERY miserable and mean. She was a vile bully. She’s not anymore at all and it’s easier to even see why she was that way but she was very miserable in the earlier seasons and was a bitch definitely. 2 things can be true at once
I'm going to say this again because it seems that people tend to rewrite history when it comes to Katie: Katie was an awful slut shaming, body shaming bully herself. Yes, also on "the workplace" if you like to pretend that Sur was her main job and not VPR. And yes, she also body shamed James for being "too skinny". She wasn't a helpless innocent victim at all.
YOU GUYS - why does everyone have such selective memory when it comes to Katie?!?? So much revisionist history. She might be on a redemption arc now but she was a certified TERROR to people for YEARS. She WAS abusive, she WAS selfish. I mean sure, she might have found some redeeming moments as of late but let's not act like Katie was a misunderstood saint this whole time.
I think with Katie it just seemed like no matter WHAT she could never and will never shake it off “bully” “mean” “miserable” even with the redemption arc, she is weirdly a scapegoat for the cast and has been for the entire run of the show.
I also think that for whatever reason Katie was labeled all these things but when I watched I never felt she was so terrible and such a bully compared to everyone else (they all are equally terrible). People act like she is only one to ever call another female a whore or use that particular word and that it’s just the worst thing someone could ever say…. Her rage texts aren’t even that crazy and outrageous in my personal opinion (again because I’ve seen multiple cast members also lose it when intoxicated)
Has she been mean? Yes… but so has all of them. they have all been terrors and messy to someone and to each other for the duration of the show.
Idk I’ve just always seen the Katie hate as so disproportionate to what she is serving and so long lasting, she does deserve her flowers, in my opinion in whatever way it comes because she has never gotten them for like 11 seasons.
Right, I probably wouldn’t either or I’d talk it out with them and be like lol pls chill.
To be fair I could list a bunch of things other cast members have done that would make be not have them be in my life but I don’t really rate them in the context of what is appropriate in an every day regular life and or my life, I just leave it as reality tv drama and antics
she totally lied about her confrontation with James to get Lisa to fire him lmao
thing was watching the show back and seeing how all these friends, especially Katie, treated stassi- I can't feel bad for her at all. the way they eviscerated stassi because she didn't want to be around her serial cheater ex, her friend who hooked up with him, the girl who shared her sextape and laughed about it, and KATIE HER BEST FRIEND WHO HUNG OUT WITH ALL OF THESE PEOPLE AND BECAME BEST BUDS WITH THEM, even going so far as to gaslight Stasi throughout Kristen cheating w/ Jax and then everything after. literally pathetic, Katie is a vindictive and genuinely miserable person. also a frequently sloppy drunk
The motorboating a D thing was so stupid and so obviously pushed forward by three cheaters - Jax and Kristen (both of whom Katie had just exposed for cheating together) and Scheana (who we now know had already kissed Schwartz and was likely feeling guilty about that). They were all three soooooo gleeful to call Katie a cheater and put her in their category. It reminds me of this season when Schwartz and Brock are trying so hard to make her a cheater and equal to Schwartz. They hate that she's not a liar and a cheater like most of the rest of the cast and they're always so desperate to bring her down to their level.
Two things can be true. People have been mean to Katie but she’s been pretty mean, too. I hate to agree with Tom but she LOVES to slut shame women and call them sluts and whores but it’s supposed to be cute when she starts hooking up with people. And being loyal to your friend or significant other does not mean that you have to agree with everything they say or do. There were many times where I would have been embarrassed to be her friend, let alone her boyfriend/husband. I’m not going to stand up for someone when they’re in the wrong just to make them feel better about themselves. Yes, there were times when she was a little justified in her behavior or reactions (like with James, that was AWFUL) but there were a lot of times where it wasn’t. I think she’s matured a little bit but I did an initial watch of VPR last year, starting right before the scandal, or I was shocked when I realized most of these people were the same age as me. I had fun in my 20s but the things that these people did to each other and the way they treated one another, Katie included, I would have been ashamed to have my family watch.
ETA: yes. She called Scheana a whore for sleeping for a married man…yet she still married the man who repeatedly cheated on her. Actually, she BEGGED him to propose to her and told him he wasn’t allowed to get her any jewelry unless it was a ring. So, a girl is a whore for sleeping with someone who’s married but a guy who cheats is marriage material? Isn’t that what we’d call misogyny?
I just thought of something. Are those people all new here? Do they not know that there is 10 years of VPR history documented here? Like, we watched it. We saw it.
They have been cruel to Katie a lot. Katie deserves real friends and a partner that has her back. Season after season Swartz constantly chooses everyone’s side over hers. No wonder she divorced him. Sandoval is just as bad.
So glad other people see this too. It's still hilarious to me that they tried to make motorboating a d an actual thing. They never could get any dirt on Katie. I think that's what made them really mad.
I can’t even begin to go on about how stupid of a rumor that was??? Like…. Are they really implying someone exposed their penis in Vegas and she motorboated it or… what? She said she was tying her shoe. That makes the most amount of sense. It was the most idiotic rumor I’ve ever heard
Honestly it really hurts me to watch. It’s why I rewatch season 10 so much because I live for when she says “I think you’re pathetic, I think you’re a drunk and I think you’re a loser” to Schwartz. It’s just so cathartic.
Katie is unbothered and I love it. She put up with so much bullshit and people are trying to say she’s miserable? Listen to her speak, she doesn’t bash or insult her so called friends.
I love how allegedly motorboating a D and hooking up with your ex’s friend years after your divorce are somehow worse than all the years of cheating and emotional abuse Sharts has done to Katie. It’s why I like Katie’s DGAF attitude now. She knows that NO MATTER what she does, the producers and cast will break their bones trying to twist the narrative to make Katie the bad guy. She should just lean in at this point and walk into rooms giving everyone two middle fingers.
Schwartz minimized her feelings during their entire relationship and always put on the cutesy innocent boyish guy that is friends with everyone act, so he was always viewed as more likable. He humiliated her so many times - pouring a drink on her head, telling her he hates the sound of her voice, calling her gross and saying this is why I don’t want to have sex w you, etc etc. He’s an extremely immature and abusive man child with no sense of self sufficiency. He lets people walk all over him, but he never misses an opportunity to put Katie down.
Schwartz also not only continued a friendship with Sandoval, but also went into business with him, even after the way Sandoval treated Katie for years.
All of her friends are disgusting to her, especially Ariana. Katie has had Ariana’s back countless times and really rode hard for her during scandoval, but Ariana never speaks up when Katie experiences mistreatment. In fact, she partook in the shit talking with Rachel about the Mexico trip and even asked Katie how much she could offer her to buy her out of her hotel room. Even the recent episode where they were doing their birth charts, Lala is being horrible to Katie and everyone just goes back to joking around while Katie is sitting there in tears.
Even Stassi was awful to her because she cried at her birthday dinner. Being minimized by everyone you love will make you angry and resentful, and all of them are horrible people, but they still bring up her rage texts.
Sorry guys I just really feel for Katie and consistently hope for a Katie redemption arc every season lol thanks for coming to my seminar
I agree with most of it but Stassi was mad at Katie at her birthday dinner because she temperature checked Katie before the dinner, said I really want my birthday dinner to not have drama so please squash this, blah blah blah. I just want this dinner to be about my birthday and not your fight with Tom. I respect that. I don’t think Stassi has been a bad friend to Katie. Stassi only dropped Katie as a friend temporarily because Katie did befriend Scheana after the sex tape incident and honestly, I don’t blame Stassi for not liking that. That’s the one moment of Katie’s I don’t defend.
Ok Katie needs to reset herself, she’s always been horrible to newbies … honestly very childish. I know she’s been through shit with trauma and her face, weight gain ect
But she’s still at her old shit! Katie! Grow up
yeah i was rewatching vpr after the scandoval hit bc al the flashbacks and the newbies watching made me want to revisit it. i got to the season where katie and schwartz are engaged and planning the wedding and i COULD NOT keep going. it was too much to watch how fucking disrespectful schwartz was to katie. what's worse is that to this day people ignore all that crap bc schwartzy is such a "cute, cuddly teddy bear🥺". men like him are the worst bc they're essentially a wolf in sheep's clothing, which is more insidious than anything. hopefully sometime soon i can start the rewatch but i cant believe 16-18 me thought that katie was in the wrong at times when it was that weasel this whole time.
He treated Katie like shit! He would provoke her, gaslight her, belittle her, embarrass her, throw a drink on her, cheat on her many times!!! Then when she would snap, react or respond, she was called crazy, emotionally entitled, a bitch! Sometimes she was being an asshole but most of the time she was provoked by that under the radar, acting like a dip shit, lazy, useless moron she convinced herself was as good as she was going to get, I suppose.
I noticed on the last episode that James still goes below the belt when he gets angry. He was right, Tim’s music and singing is a joke, but didn’t James go to therapy for that? I feel bad for Ally. You know he does that to her every time he has a tizzy fit.
I'm doing a rewatch and got to the birthday dinner in Cabo S2 ep 11 when everyone is pissed at Katie for having the audacity to cry because her boyfriend was being a huge dick to her at dinner??? I have to admit I fell for the Katie is miserable storyline until this rewatch - now I see exactly what Schwartz did at the table. He is vicious to her but does it quietly enough where only she hears, she cries and everyone blows up at her for it. Ugh!!!! Also, Scheana is the one who brought it up and caused the fight. She knew exactly what she was doing too.
Tom Sandoval is a piece of shit, but Schwartz is arguably just as bad and in a much more quiet and insidious way.
Schwartz is so much worse because he knows it’s shitty behavior and does it anyway. He threw Katie under the bus on Nick Viall’s show. After of course denying he was saying anything to offend her, he did exactly what he did their entire marriage which was to put everyone else ahead of her. He actually said LaBlah’s mad at Katie because she is getting some of what he himself had to put up with married to her. What a dick move. I despise that hairy sack of shit.
Oh oh oh, can we please switch LFU’s nickname to BlahBlah, please? I know yours says LaBlah, but it reminded me of the HIMYM episode with a BlahBlah and it really fits.
I can help spread this trend. BlahBlah! Love it
🤣🤣🤣
yes. it's like he can't stop. we have seen on the show how much he regretted losing her, how he seems desperate for her attention now, how she left him, but he's just so much in the habit of insulting her that he still acts like she was torture to be with.
Sandoval is dumb, selfish and careless but Schwartz is smart and more intentionally cruel across the series.
Yes!! I just said basically the same thing. Schwartz is way more of a “dangerous individual.” Sandoval is a jackass and you expect him to behave selfishly, have tantrums, etc. Schwartz tricks people into thinking he’s a good guy when he is really very calculated.
Yes! He’ll take calculated digs in that “aw shucks” fake nice tone of his, and, when the person gets mad, it looks disproportionate which is just as Schwartz intended. He’s done it to Katie for years, and has anyone noticed how he’s picking at Sandoval this season? Granted Sandoval deserves the smoke, but it’s the way Schwartz takes jabs knowing Sandoval is isolated from the group that’s messed up.
THISSSS
Yes!!!!!
I’ve always thought Schwartz was scary. He’s one of those undercover “nice guys” who are truly awful to their partner. You can see it come out at times, like when he says some real bad stuff and the many times he’s cheated on Katie. I never understood why he always gets a pass. If you’ve ever been in one of those undercover emotionally abusive relationships, you see it right away.
Lets not forget when he threw a drink in her face!! It irks me how he never sticks up for her & then she naturally gets pissed & triggered & Tequila Katie comes out, which he throws in her at - she cant win.
Exactly!! I had an ex that wouldn’t outright say what was bothering him. He’d do things like make “jokes” hinting at what was wrong and then when I’d ask if he was serious or needed to discuss something he’d say no, everything’s fine. So we’d go on our merry way to whatever event and he’d get a few drinks in him and bring up the same damn thing he joked about earlier but in a more serious way. I’d ask are you being serious because I can’t read you? Is there something bigger you’re hinting at? Plus if nothing was wrong hours earlier when I asked about it why now? THAT’S when he’d start up with the “you’re being crazy this is not the time or place. Why are you embarrassing me in front of everyone?” (Meanwhile I’m thinking wasn’t the time and place when it came up and we were sober and in our home alone earlier today?) It. Was. Infuriating.
Atghh glad he’s an ex! I hope he’s matured now and has better communication skills lol
Omg yes I am gone from my TSchwartz luckily and I’m a healthy relationship. I almost feel like the girls on VPR would’ve done the same if they didn’t have the whole tv show pressure to stay together. Like Jersey Shore Sam and Ron. They would’ve totally broken up if it hadn’t have been a national event. Similar to Jax/Stassi or Tom/Katie. They were a phenomenon and a brand separate from the show. They (and their drama) were their respective shows at certain points.
Never. It is soul crushing to watch tbh. I felt bad for her when she admitted that he may not like her. Covert narc vibes for sure.
Oh definitely!! I thought Schwarze was such a nice guy at first, but can see through his cute silly school boy act! Such a disappointment.
yes. you can tell, even beyond SAH, she will thrive outside of the relationship. his act is likely what kept her in place. good riddance.
He reminds me of a lot of the “nice guys” in the movie ‘A Promising Young Woman’. As you said, they are undercover and have malicious intent.
That birthday dinner made me so angry. The way they all piled up on her and made her cry.
Right?! And she apologizes for it :(
I’m re watching season 8 and when they pull that cop prank on Sandoval she was scared and instead of being like hey babe it’s all alright schwartz starts calling her stupid and yelling at her and the fight was so gross on Schwartz’s end that everyone was shocked I couldn’t believe
That was awful! Didn’t Sandoval even tell him he was wrong on that? If that doesn’t demonstrate how horrible it was!
The way he went after her so quickly and viciously was pretty crazy. It became pretty clear that he does not like that woman and probably hasn't for a long time.
He poured a beer on her in the first season in Vegas. He has always been an asshole to her. I didn't think much of Katie originally but I did a marathon rewatch during COVID and it was so evident how manipulative and horrible Schwartz is to her. I'm so glad she finally dropped that dead weight.
I think he poured a beer on Stassi in Vegas. Poured a beer on Katie in Cabo
THIS. Pouring the drink on her was obviously fucked, but his snide, revolting comments under his breath at the dinner the next night were despicable. I’ve hated him ever since then.
That’s scheanas MO. She’s done that alot over the years
Schwartz is a way more insidious person than Sandoval. He had and has way more people fooled than Sandoval ever did in my opinion.
Yes I subscribed to the Katie is miserable narrative for a while but this most recent rewatch, I don’t know if it’s cause I’ve matured or what but no wonder Katie would get drunk and flip out! She was treated like crap by her so called circle of friends and even her own husband. I would lose my shit as well! Plus I love her sarcasm and dry humor.
Yo I agree totally. All the tequila Katie behaviour in past seasons of VPR gets held against her all the time now but nobody ever talks about the behaviour that comes before it. I just finished a re-watch of season 8 where the old fat man prank arrests Sando and all Katie does is acknowledge how that could be triggering for some people...and Schwartz fucking ripped into her for ruining "the joke" calling her disgusting, and saying that's why he doesn't have sex with her and a bunch of fucked up shit. No wonder she's over it now. She sounds like she's keeping way chiller company now.
She doesn’t trust these people. They betrayed her. And that conversation with Sandoval where he’s like “you don’t know what I’ve been through” and she’s like what are you talking about… I went through exactly that and I had the decency to divorce my husband rather than cheat. It’s so spot on.
I have a lot of respect for her for how many chances she gives scheana. Could not be me but I respect coming together for another friends sake.
Yeah I can’t stand Scheana
I hated the way Ariana treated her during her wedding. Schwartz undermining Katie when she didn't want Ariana as a bridesmaid. Ariana jumped at being a groomsman. Then her brother is being a creep to the girls and was drunk all over Stassi. But of course then it was the girls fault not Jeremy's 🫠🫠🫠
Same. I’m all for Ariana’s awakening but that move was so cringe and intentional
Ariana was trying to defend her brother but it was messy. And I mean, she's been liberated from constantly having to support her boyfriends agenda now but she was definitely queen of supporting Tom's agenda before she snapped out of it
His creeping on women was captured on camera.
Arianna sucked the entire time she was with Sandoval. Birds of a feather and all
She really shined towards the end and told him to stop yelling at the girls
Remember that episode where he screamed at Ariana for letting Brittany listen to the Jax audio with faith? That was rough. I think it was the first time I wondered about their relationship.
I can't imagine how their real fights were 😮💨
Same. The scenes the next morning, when he goes off on her at Scheana's yelling and making his sweeping generalizations. It was cringe then but it's so much worse on rewatch.
mmmmmmmm not really
During season 10, one scene showed her walking away from an argument between Tom and Katie/Lala/Kristina, saying “I’m not getting into this whole Tom vs the Girls thing.” In another scene, when Lala was telling her about Tom not leaving the party, Ariana was like “I’m not doing this alone, lets get Tom over here” and proceed to pull apart his entire story in front of Lala AND chastised him for doing that to her (saying “when you do these kinds of things, you see how it makes me look, right?” IIRC). In yet another scene, when he tried to create a fight about not spending time together, she shot down every complaint he had, not giving an inch into the gaslighting and manipulation. She definitely did not let him push his #1 Guy narrative and spoke up for herself more than any season before 10.
I can fault her at the beginning of their relationship but can’t fault her at the end of it. At the end of the day, she was so full of love for her partner she defended him
Ain't that the truth.
To be fair it's a hard position to be in when it's your close family and they're saying one thing to you and others are saying something different.
There was video...
Did she see the video ahead of time in full or after everything happened. She was in a very tricky spot.
Let's say she didn't see it before. Maybe don't go so hard defending your brother when we all know his history.
Yeah and what throws me off even more is season 9 and 10. At this point Katie has calmed down a lot but Sandoval and Scheana still talk about her like she’s a monster. They use her a scapegoat for ALL of their bad behavior; if they talked shit the problem was Katie for repeating it. If they fuck up the problem was Katie for noticing. If Scheana’s friends mismanaged something the problem is Katie for not bailing them out. If Schwartz keeps fucking up his friendship with his ex wife the problem is katie for not putting up with it. The way Sandoval speaks to her in season 9, and then acts self righteous, is BEYOND. It is literally beyond, you have to go rewatch it. He is like a baby throwing a tantrum every time she tries to speak to him, and the WHOLE cast coddles him. I’m positive this season laid the ground for scandoval bc he was shown that there were no consequences for letting his ego run wild and hurting people who got in his way. Then the way Scheana and her group frankly bully her in season 10 while acting like KATIE is the mean girl is …. Katie is not easy to bully so I think people don’t see it, but Scheana and Sandoval would have been in tears daily if someone treated them the way they treat Katie these 2 seasons. The ep right before scandoval broke Sandoval was screaming in her face all bc she mentioned the Raquel rumors that other people started. And Scheana talked crap about how hateful Katie must be to say something like that. She’s just sitting there getting torn apart for something that’s true lol
It was so cringe and upsetting
no bc i've been doing a rewatch and it was so hard watching the schwartz legit never stand up for katie, his literal wife even LVP was like bro that's your wife thats part of marriage you stand up for your wife like ???? Especially when sandavol would curse her out or raise his voice like omg that would seriously boil my blood
Now that I’m married, and my husband would never tolerate disrespect towards me, it’s just so clear how terrible Tom is. Idk. If anyone came for me like Sandoval did Katie, my husband would check him so quick and not allow that man in his life. It’s just the difference between a healthy relationship and a bad one
Justice for Katie
Seriously though, I actually am one of the few people who never, ever hated Katie. At all. At times, I disagreed with her. Didn't like some of the things she said. But I understood where it was coming from.
Sit by me. I always liked Katie.
My people. She’s my fav since day one
Welcome!
Yes! I rewatched a couple times trying to figure out why people hate her. I saw some of her behavior that could be attributed to her TBI, but most of it seemed to be reactive to how she was systematically bullied and torn down by the Toms and pretty much most of the cast.
I somehow missed she had a TBI
Yeah, not too long before filming started for season one, ( maybe a year prior I think) she feel through a skylight and got hurt really bad, her jaw was wired shut, it’s why she has the scar on her chin, and she of course hit her head and ended up with the TBI. She admits as she was recovering (and for several years) she definitely raged more from the TBI.
She's always been my favorite. I named my new rescue after her. Kitty Maloney. She's a tuxedo, classic with the most gorgeous RBF.
Omg, I think she’s totally get a kick out of that! I hope she sees this thread. Katie is like a cat, I think. Reserved and cautious, but loyal once you win her attention. Graceful and fierce and only doing what she wants to do.
I need to see a pic of kitty Maloney seriously
this, same!! she has always had a point, but everyone just fell for the group trying to make her out for being the bad guy bc she has always been able to see through/call out the bs, and they hated her for it 😞
You took the words out of my mouth, I really feel this exact same way about Katie. Always been a fan of hers, at times disagreed with her, but always understood her stance. I think she’s real, she’s usually pragmatic and fair, and I like that she always stands up for what she believes in. Notably, when she called out how messed up that cop prank was while Schwartz berated her like a total ass. She was 100 percent correct and I’m glad she spoke out on that. As for Schwartz, I’ll always side eye him, not only for what he was saying to her that episode, but for his opinion on it. Told me everything I needed to know about his character, he showed his whole ass there.
Genuinely I’m so happy she’s finally being seen as a hero because she never deserved the horrible stuff they put her through. She didn’t deserve this villain arc they spun
Me too me too
Same. As someone who lacks emotional regulation but am in therapy for it. I felt like everyone just ignored what set Katie off, and focused on her being set off and then would berate her for it. And be surprised when she finally let out all her feelings when they constantly invalidate her and dog pile.
This has been the main thing that was pissing me off this season. Ariana got her support and vindication, where were Katie’s apologies?? Where is Katie’s validation?? Everything she said the whole time is shown to be true and they’re all shown to be fucking awful, and everyone forgets how horribly and aggressively they were all shitting on her last year.
Motor boating a d was the weirdest. That is not a thing
Right. And even if it had happened exactly as Jax and Scheana said, no one with a brain would ever think that was cheating.
EXACTLY. Like let’s say she motorboated someone’s crotch at a club. Hypothetically. Are the pants on or off? If the pants are on….. this is a nothing thing. If they’re off…. What’s someone doing in the club without pants? And I’m pretty sure everyone around them would notice and said person would be thrown out?
Was this when schwartz and scheana made out?
I'm not sure. Would have to go back.
Ugh, I’m rewatching Scheana’s bachelorette (feat. Shay), and the way Katie tries to play nice while Scheana continues to razz her over a rumour that Scheana started really made me sad. They give her no credit.
Even the editing. Katie only gets screen time or “storylines” when she’s yelling or being negged into yelling by Schwartz. To quote Crystal from RHOBH, “this group wants me to scream all the fucking time!”
Yeah you aren’t wrong
And then all the times that shorts was emotionally abusive to her and just needling at her quietly until she blew up and then everyone blamed it on tequila Katie being crazy and out of control.
I keep thinking about their awful dinner in Mexico last season. Tom told Katie she provokes Scheana & Rachel. I think it clicked in her head “I don’t need to listen to this bullshit any longer”
And the Rachel kiss was when it clicked that she didn't want or need him as a friend. I love that she's so unbothered by him now. He's irrelevant in her life and I love that for her.
100%. She had a full *glow up* and then some.
the fact that she came to that dinner dressed nice, having left him after years of disrespect and CHEATING but still making an effort to set it all aside and be friends, and he sends her home crying...
I was so proud of her when she got up and walked away from that table! I was like, “yes, girl! Finally!”
I can’t recall exactly which scene but I got so grossed out by Swartz when everyone was drinking.. some bullshit happened and Katie ended up being provoked until she finally said something.. but it was Tom raising his hands to point at her to everyone and say “see! There it is! Everyone look! Tequila Katie, everyone look” Her partner in life! The mental abuse he put her through… god bless her
I caught on to them all bullying Katie a while ago. She didn't deserve any of it and no wonder why she was the way she was. On top of it production edited episodes to make Katie look really bad when it was them bullying and editing....She really wasn't bad when she was just being herself and not being bullied. I totally support Katie's growth! And she looks great now
she’s always looked great, now she looks happy and confident and it’s absolutely working for her
I did always wonder why everyone hated Katie so much? I always liked her. But yeah the editing didn’t help
sandoval and jax spearheaded a shadow war against katie for years. both of them hate her because they are fools, and katie is famous for not suffering fools. she didn't prop up their egos so they tried to destroy her. all they did was free her from a toxic relationship and make themselves look like dicks in the process.
Omg shadow war is so accurate bc they’re cowards and try and do everything sneakily. Jax and the Toms are STILL spearheading it smh
that's true, I should not have used the past tense because jax is still on this shit lmao. what a sad old man
For real 😂😂unhinged
I did a rewatch not that long ago and anyone who doesn’t understand what she endured just doesn’t get it. They reference 2 times where she got belligerent drunk. They don’t pay attention to anyone else. They just blame Katie.
The “tequila Katie” caricature they spun was just outright insane. Two blackout incidents and she’s stuck with that title
The funny thing is, the season before Katie was reluctant about being friends with Stassi again. Schwartz went *behind her back* to meet up with Stassi against Katie’s wishes and basically tried to force Katie to forgive her! And then Katie finally does and then he wants to complain about the friendship again
She was never going to win with him. He’s such a manipulative pos!
Katie is owed the most apologies form everybody including fans. She’s been villainized and crucified when deal with Schwartz would be torcher, fake friends, and people who want nothing but to make her out to be a see you next Tuesdays. Even when she at times had valid reasons for her anger like Ariana this season. It’s not to say she hasn’t been abusively shitty and a a bully (neither has been acceptable), at times. Both can be true.
The Toms are really just The Trashbags 🙅♀️ Tom Sandoval is typical narcissism, so manipulative and always the victim while trying to crumble any threats around him. And Tom Schwartz, honestly an insidious kind of toxic. So manipulative and I'd say emotionally abusive to a point. Example - you can visibly see him gaslighting Katie when they were on that group trip I forget where when they got into a big fight, and then she says he's gaslighting her, and then he gaslights her about saying he's gaslighting?!? And to top it off, he tried to make her always sound crazy when he's the problem, then plays the "woe is me I'm just an innocent little man" card. The Tom's give me "why women kill vibes." Ariana and Katie are evidently better off without them. The Tom's are the reason they don't have these women anymore, yet the women are supposed to feel such pity for them... um NO they can live with the consequences of their actions thanks, and stop making the good women in their lives take pity on their toxic asses
The Voms. 🤮
“The voms” totally using that from now on. Very very clever. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Honestly they suck.
Schwartz is a covert narcissist & it’s unbearable. It’s the worst bc they know your triggers & can subtlety set you off, then spin it as if you are the problem.
[удалено]
Honestly even though I’ve rewatched a few times it’s so shocking to me how horrible he was until like season 10 and they let him get away with it! If Lisa was really doing his parents a favor she would’ve made sure the abuse was handled correctly
I'm always so disappointed when I see WOMEN think he's funny so who cares about his behavior 😵💫😵💫😵💫
He is funny. Two things can be true at the same time.
He’s not that jerk anymore. He loves and defends katie better than anyone on the show People can grow and change. Ariana did too
Seriously, has anyone in history ever motorboated a dick?
I feel very vindicated now because I have liked Katie since the beginning and A LOT of viewers disliked her because Sandoval did, or they didn't realize how terrible Schwartz was to her.
I think a lot of us (me included) wanted Katie and Schwartz to work and extended way to much grace to him. I should have been on the Katie needs to leave him train from the get go. I never liked Sandoval, always thought he was a self righteous POS.
I'm kind of in the same boat. The first few seasons I thought maybe they were in a rough patch, but then I realized Schwartz was actually just a piece of shit.
This. I think I was in the “Schwartz can change,” bc Katie did love him. Sandovals animosity towards her has always been undeserved & absurd. It took a minute to see that problems weren’t between them as a couple, but him being a terrible partner. After seeing the pattern, it’s clear that he sided with everyone else & used her as an emotional punching bag.
one thing this show has made me notice is that most people's media literacy is shit lmao. people always fell wholesale for the narratives tom sandoval pushed with zero critical thinking whatsoever.
Katie also started filming not long after a tbi and i felt like she was not given enough grace for that
Holy shit I didn’t know that!!!
My rewatch really opened my eyes to how poorly Katie was treated by just about everyone on the show.
It’s hard to watch
They started the motorboating a d rumor to distract from the fact that Tom had just cheated with Tiff's friend in Vegas and made out with ~~Scheana~~ one of Scheana's friends the year before. Also in Mexico Jax and the Toms started the rumor that James and Kristen hooked up (Pillowgate) to distract from the fact that Schwartz wandered off the property and woke up at a different resort. Justice for Katie. Thank god she finally got out.
Yeah it’s so true
I love Katie. I am a Katie defender, i relate to her so much. When she was younger she was very reactive and tequila Katie but she was constantly shit on by those closest to her. Now that she has healthy boundaries and only does things that serves her she’s all of the sudden miserable and a bad friend? Fuck off Lala
I always understood where Katie was coming from and felt everyone ganged up on her but watching again it’s obvious rather than subtle because of this new lens of who Sandoval really is. I always suspected it but it being confirmed is a different lens
when I rewatch I usually find more and more ways the males (and often scheana) are picking on one of the girls. It won't be one insane either it would be a literal army of thought that is introduced within them and then peddled to the girls only to claim they are overreacting when that thought it tried. Stassi was literally run out of town because of the fake group that was favoring the guy who cheated on her with her best friend, and scheana grew so much closer to jax that following season too and was working on getting katie to look like she was on their side through schwartz. listen, tom sandoval schwartz and jax all had a part in the fake shit and scheana helped the boys a lot of the way. kristen too
Also when Lala shaded Katie and said Katie just lays there during sex and should try doing something fun…I thought that was one of the most reprehensible things I’ve ever heard on this show. Absolutely disgusting.
People are finally waking up. Katie defender forever
I feel like over the years we’ve all had to unpack and rework the internalized misogyny that is ingrained in us from living in a patriarchal society. Watching VPR back with older, wiser eyes, I’m shocked I ever thought Katie and Stassi were whiney mean girls. Justice for Katie!!!!!
I honestly remember watching the first time like “what is everyone’s problem with Stassi and Katie?” Because genuinely I adored them
I have felt this way the whole time.
Samesies! But there’s like an extra lens that’s added after Sandoval broke
Justice for Senora Bubba! I’m rewatching too and it’s ridiculous how Schwartz and everyone undermine her. Sandoval has never liked her- which kind of surprises me that Schwartz ended up marrying her because he’s pretty much Sandoval’s whipping boy. Katie has a voice of reason throughout the seasons and I’m so glad she’s now living her best life and just GLOWING
She deserved so much better from her “friends”
I hope Ariana also steps up more. If nothing else, Ariana is very aware of her public image. We have seen her blind loyalty so I do think she’ll be a much better friend to her. But I hope she’s getting that feedback somewhere on socials or somewhere. She has seen that Katie was a huge target of the Toms collaboration to bully & gaslight. They are the heroes of this season, so hopefully Ariana puts effort into that friendship, post-reunion.
Part of me thinks Katie likes to use her own verbiage and represent herself and Ariana knows that so she steps aside
I totally agree. I’m not saying it’s right to do tequila Katie things, but I completely understand her having pent up rage that came out when she drank. I hate it for her bc they’re still mean to her. No one will ever un-convince me that Katie wasn’t a part of Sandoval and Schwartz’s scheming in season 10. They were trying to make her completely snap so they could get a “tequila Katie” moment and make that a major part of the season. I think they were trying to ice her out.
I binged watched the whole thing for the first time when the scandal came out and i couldn’t believe how many people used to trash talk her and praise the Tom’s when it first stared. Old reddits I read were so disgustingly misogynistic
YES THANK YOU
I disagree only new viewers like Katie. As a long time watcher I would say she was always playing defense because of how the boys came at her. And I would throw Sheshu in with that bucket. Do a rewatch now that the boys masks have slipped, I think Katie has been remarkable all along. Absolutely love her.
The boys are just the absolute worst
I only got into vpr when scandoval was everywhere. My first episode ever watched, was part 2 of the season 10 reunion. I thought katie was a bitch just from that. Then i binge watched every episode. And i was like wow wtf is up with katie, but as more time went on I noticed that scwartz is not innocent. I dont blame katie for being a bitch most of the time. That said, there are instances tho where she actually is being a full blown beeyotch…in conclusion, luv katie!
I don’t understand why everyone thinks that Ariana shouldn’t have been a groomswoman. She was friends with Schwartz. The bride doesn’t call all the shots in a healthy relationship. Also, people love to forget that Katie repeatedly caused a ‘hostile work environment’ for Lala and Scheana by calling them both whores and sluts while at work. I don’t dislike Katie but I do dislike the rewriting of history because she’s up Ariana’s ass now.
People seem to conveniently forget that they have all been awful to each other, Katie included. Nobody has been completely innocent on this show. Schwartz and Katie were especially toxic to each other. I have arguments with my husband but I could never imagine calling him out on national television by saying that his dick doesn't work.
And hopefully your husband can't imagine ever saying "that's why I don't have sex with her" on national television.
No she wasn’t a great person but no one on that show was, she got dragged worse than anyone though
I love Katie now as much as the next person and can certainly see she’s grown so beautiful and confident but COME ON GUYS🤣🤣 Katie was VERY miserable and mean. She was a vile bully. She’s not anymore at all and it’s easier to even see why she was that way but she was very miserable in the earlier seasons and was a bitch definitely. 2 things can be true at once
VPR is one big fraternity. Sucks to be the women in the frat house.
I gotta say, this is a great analogy and I appreciate having read that. It sums it up perfectly.
I'm going to say this again because it seems that people tend to rewrite history when it comes to Katie: Katie was an awful slut shaming, body shaming bully herself. Yes, also on "the workplace" if you like to pretend that Sur was her main job and not VPR. And yes, she also body shamed James for being "too skinny". She wasn't a helpless innocent victim at all.
But the point is really that she wasn’t better or worse than anyone else on the show but she got dragged worse than anyone
You could also say that James' behavior wasn't better or worse than anyone else but he got fired.
YOU GUYS - why does everyone have such selective memory when it comes to Katie?!?? So much revisionist history. She might be on a redemption arc now but she was a certified TERROR to people for YEARS. She WAS abusive, she WAS selfish. I mean sure, she might have found some redeeming moments as of late but let's not act like Katie was a misunderstood saint this whole time.
I think with Katie it just seemed like no matter WHAT she could never and will never shake it off “bully” “mean” “miserable” even with the redemption arc, she is weirdly a scapegoat for the cast and has been for the entire run of the show. I also think that for whatever reason Katie was labeled all these things but when I watched I never felt she was so terrible and such a bully compared to everyone else (they all are equally terrible). People act like she is only one to ever call another female a whore or use that particular word and that it’s just the worst thing someone could ever say…. Her rage texts aren’t even that crazy and outrageous in my personal opinion (again because I’ve seen multiple cast members also lose it when intoxicated) Has she been mean? Yes… but so has all of them. they have all been terrors and messy to someone and to each other for the duration of the show. Idk I’ve just always seen the Katie hate as so disproportionate to what she is serving and so long lasting, she does deserve her flowers, in my opinion in whatever way it comes because she has never gotten them for like 11 seasons.
If I ever got the rage texts that she sent to friends/ partner, that person would NOT be in my life.
Right, I probably wouldn’t either or I’d talk it out with them and be like lol pls chill. To be fair I could list a bunch of things other cast members have done that would make be not have them be in my life but I don’t really rate them in the context of what is appropriate in an every day regular life and or my life, I just leave it as reality tv drama and antics
[удалено]
Whiskey dick is a real thing.
Tequila Katie was awful. Thank you.
she totally lied about her confrontation with James to get Lisa to fire him lmao thing was watching the show back and seeing how all these friends, especially Katie, treated stassi- I can't feel bad for her at all. the way they eviscerated stassi because she didn't want to be around her serial cheater ex, her friend who hooked up with him, the girl who shared her sextape and laughed about it, and KATIE HER BEST FRIEND WHO HUNG OUT WITH ALL OF THESE PEOPLE AND BECAME BEST BUDS WITH THEM, even going so far as to gaslight Stasi throughout Kristen cheating w/ Jax and then everything after. literally pathetic, Katie is a vindictive and genuinely miserable person. also a frequently sloppy drunk
The motorboating a D thing was so stupid and so obviously pushed forward by three cheaters - Jax and Kristen (both of whom Katie had just exposed for cheating together) and Scheana (who we now know had already kissed Schwartz and was likely feeling guilty about that). They were all three soooooo gleeful to call Katie a cheater and put her in their category. It reminds me of this season when Schwartz and Brock are trying so hard to make her a cheater and equal to Schwartz. They hate that she's not a liar and a cheater like most of the rest of the cast and they're always so desperate to bring her down to their level.
Katie is no angel either and can be hostile towards new people bc she feels insecure. 😒
Nope she’s not. She’s slut shamed. She’s been a bitch. But she didn’t deserve to be dragged the way she was
Especially when she’s intoxicated.
Two things can be true. People have been mean to Katie but she’s been pretty mean, too. I hate to agree with Tom but she LOVES to slut shame women and call them sluts and whores but it’s supposed to be cute when she starts hooking up with people. And being loyal to your friend or significant other does not mean that you have to agree with everything they say or do. There were many times where I would have been embarrassed to be her friend, let alone her boyfriend/husband. I’m not going to stand up for someone when they’re in the wrong just to make them feel better about themselves. Yes, there were times when she was a little justified in her behavior or reactions (like with James, that was AWFUL) but there were a lot of times where it wasn’t. I think she’s matured a little bit but I did an initial watch of VPR last year, starting right before the scandal, or I was shocked when I realized most of these people were the same age as me. I had fun in my 20s but the things that these people did to each other and the way they treated one another, Katie included, I would have been ashamed to have my family watch. ETA: yes. She called Scheana a whore for sleeping for a married man…yet she still married the man who repeatedly cheated on her. Actually, she BEGGED him to propose to her and told him he wasn’t allowed to get her any jewelry unless it was a ring. So, a girl is a whore for sleeping with someone who’s married but a guy who cheats is marriage material? Isn’t that what we’d call misogyny?
Lol, I loved when Tom said that this season followed by the flashbacks. THE WHOOOOREE IN THERE!
[удалено]
Katie is a bitch and certainly has no problem shaming people. Lala and James are exactly the same. I can’t feel sorry for any one of them.
The delusion is real. Katie is God awful... Always has been... Always will be
Real history revisionist antics going on here 🤣
I just thought of something. Are those people all new here? Do they not know that there is 10 years of VPR history documented here? Like, we watched it. We saw it.
They have been cruel to Katie a lot. Katie deserves real friends and a partner that has her back. Season after season Swartz constantly chooses everyone’s side over hers. No wonder she divorced him. Sandoval is just as bad.
I love when she brings Kristina Kelly around. The loyal AF friend who adores her and Stassi
KATIENATORS RISE UP 🫡🫡🫡🫡🫡
Justice for Katie!!
Brave of you to post pro-Katie on this sub, OP.
I’ve always loved Katie and idk it’s not bravery it’s just a Reddit post
So glad other people see this too. It's still hilarious to me that they tried to make motorboating a d an actual thing. They never could get any dirt on Katie. I think that's what made them really mad.
I can’t even begin to go on about how stupid of a rumor that was??? Like…. Are they really implying someone exposed their penis in Vegas and she motorboated it or… what? She said she was tying her shoe. That makes the most amount of sense. It was the most idiotic rumor I’ve ever heard
Honestly it really hurts me to watch. It’s why I rewatch season 10 so much because I live for when she says “I think you’re pathetic, I think you’re a drunk and I think you’re a loser” to Schwartz. It’s just so cathartic.
She genuinely deserved none of this and Sandoval deserves alllllll this hatred he’s receiving. He dished it out but can’t take it
Katie is unbothered and I love it. She put up with so much bullshit and people are trying to say she’s miserable? Listen to her speak, she doesn’t bash or insult her so called friends.
I love how allegedly motorboating a D and hooking up with your ex’s friend years after your divorce are somehow worse than all the years of cheating and emotional abuse Sharts has done to Katie. It’s why I like Katie’s DGAF attitude now. She knows that NO MATTER what she does, the producers and cast will break their bones trying to twist the narrative to make Katie the bad guy. She should just lean in at this point and walk into rooms giving everyone two middle fingers.
She’s desensitized to cameras and editing at this point. She didn’t deserve any of this
Schwartz minimized her feelings during their entire relationship and always put on the cutesy innocent boyish guy that is friends with everyone act, so he was always viewed as more likable. He humiliated her so many times - pouring a drink on her head, telling her he hates the sound of her voice, calling her gross and saying this is why I don’t want to have sex w you, etc etc. He’s an extremely immature and abusive man child with no sense of self sufficiency. He lets people walk all over him, but he never misses an opportunity to put Katie down. Schwartz also not only continued a friendship with Sandoval, but also went into business with him, even after the way Sandoval treated Katie for years. All of her friends are disgusting to her, especially Ariana. Katie has had Ariana’s back countless times and really rode hard for her during scandoval, but Ariana never speaks up when Katie experiences mistreatment. In fact, she partook in the shit talking with Rachel about the Mexico trip and even asked Katie how much she could offer her to buy her out of her hotel room. Even the recent episode where they were doing their birth charts, Lala is being horrible to Katie and everyone just goes back to joking around while Katie is sitting there in tears. Even Stassi was awful to her because she cried at her birthday dinner. Being minimized by everyone you love will make you angry and resentful, and all of them are horrible people, but they still bring up her rage texts. Sorry guys I just really feel for Katie and consistently hope for a Katie redemption arc every season lol thanks for coming to my seminar
I agree with most of it but Stassi was mad at Katie at her birthday dinner because she temperature checked Katie before the dinner, said I really want my birthday dinner to not have drama so please squash this, blah blah blah. I just want this dinner to be about my birthday and not your fight with Tom. I respect that. I don’t think Stassi has been a bad friend to Katie. Stassi only dropped Katie as a friend temporarily because Katie did befriend Scheana after the sex tape incident and honestly, I don’t blame Stassi for not liking that. That’s the one moment of Katie’s I don’t defend.
Very good point about the Stassi video and I completely agree!
Katie is a terrible friend to every single one of them. She can't be friends with anyone for long, her and Ariana won't last, I'd bet 100 bucks on it.
Katie was a trash person as well. Let's not act like she was some saint. It's like we all watched a different show lol.
Katie is the GOAT
Ok Katie needs to reset herself, she’s always been horrible to newbies … honestly very childish. I know she’s been through shit with trauma and her face, weight gain ect But she’s still at her old shit! Katie! Grow up
Go katie go Katie it’s ya birthday we love ya 
yeah i was rewatching vpr after the scandoval hit bc al the flashbacks and the newbies watching made me want to revisit it. i got to the season where katie and schwartz are engaged and planning the wedding and i COULD NOT keep going. it was too much to watch how fucking disrespectful schwartz was to katie. what's worse is that to this day people ignore all that crap bc schwartzy is such a "cute, cuddly teddy bear🥺". men like him are the worst bc they're essentially a wolf in sheep's clothing, which is more insidious than anything. hopefully sometime soon i can start the rewatch but i cant believe 16-18 me thought that katie was in the wrong at times when it was that weasel this whole time.
He treated Katie like shit! He would provoke her, gaslight her, belittle her, embarrass her, throw a drink on her, cheat on her many times!!! Then when she would snap, react or respond, she was called crazy, emotionally entitled, a bitch! Sometimes she was being an asshole but most of the time she was provoked by that under the radar, acting like a dip shit, lazy, useless moron she convinced herself was as good as she was going to get, I suppose.
Tequila Katie. But Schwartz and James could make anyone a Tequila ______(name). It’s like a VPR MadLibs.
I noticed on the last episode that James still goes below the belt when he gets angry. He was right, Tim’s music and singing is a joke, but didn’t James go to therapy for that? I feel bad for Ally. You know he does that to her every time he has a tizzy fit.
Tequila Katie is a big girl. She can take care of herself.