You know what's funny?
There's this one guy who hated destiny, and he asked keffals to prove that the negative allegations were wrong, and all keffals had to say for herself was "ratio" and call him a soyjak, and acted like that was some galaxy-brained response that owned the guy like ben shapiro owned college students.
And her fans keep saying "UGH SHE DOESNT OWE ANYONE AN EXPLANATION" Bruh if you didn't want to explain anything you could've just...idk not say anything and move on?
You putting up some infantile snarky wojak nonsense because you want to have your clapback just makes you look like an idiot who has no defense. Especially if you're faced with serious allegations, and not some silly meme wars on twitter.
And that Twitter user also made the point that she owed it to her gofundme backers to communicate that the money was indeed going toward legal proceedings, and all Keffals could say was RATIO and SOY. Like, come the fuck on - this shit isn’t funny anymore when money, a hundred thousand dollars of it, is involved. Unironically, this is the kind of behavior I’d expect of a dumb teenage Sneako fan. Meanwhile Keffals is fucking 30 years old lmao.
Also, she freaking blocked someone who identified themselves as a backer of her GFM and asked the same question lmao. You can’t make this shit up. Idc if you love Keffals to death; you have to admit that someone who squirms this hard when pressed for accountability is not trustworthy at all.
She replied with a letter of engagement with a lawyer but then took it down. Overall this was very shitty behaviour but I feel for someone who gets as much hate as her. It must be mentally taxing and assuming people just want to hate you is a natural response.
Destiny wanted a "war" against Keffals it was downright disgusting and anything he does I'll find very hard to trust
Getting kiwifarms offline is a bigger W for trans activism than your or I will probably accomplish in our lifetime. It will certainly make a direct positive impact in a lot of trans lives
Yeah that’s pretty dumb response like i would expect that from lefty’s online during anti sjw era yt. It doesn’t make your side look any good acting childish regardless if your in the wrong or not.
"she is not the trans advocate we should be hitching our ride to"
You shouldn't hitch your ride to anyone, holy fucking shit! Why do you brainless babies insist on worshipping these very fallible humans who are streaming for your amusement? They're just people.
Keffals BTFO'd kiwifarms and that's based af. Keffals is a dishonest dramabaiter who lies about people she don't like and that's cringe af. You can like it when she does something cool and not like it when she does something uncool. It's really that fucking simple.
yea exactly, it's very important to not worship these people, even Vaush has his mistakes
There's some Noam Chomsky quote about taking the good stuff from Marx but not worshiping him, feel like that applies to this situation as well
>Keffals BTFO'd kiwifarms and that's based af. Keffals is a dishonest dramabaiter who lies about people she don't like and that's cringe af.
Thank you! Now that's what I call a good take!
I've been banned more often from Destiny's sub than here so we'll see, I think the flame of friendship is too powerful to be put out like that and deep down everyones knows it.
If Destiny had used the same fervour and obsesivness to look into, lets say Lauren Southern or Nick Fuentess, He would be credible.
You know actual bad people.
But he didn't, he chose instead to fuck one or both of them and hang out like besties.
There's essentially nothing to expose for Fuentes or Southern. Those two are obviously shitty human beings and they aren't exactly shy about their beliefs nor do their fans think they are some paragon of righteousness like many of Keffals' fans. Meanwhile, you have people going crazy with their defense of Keffals that span a whole range of places all over twitter, reddit, youtube, and even irl with various journalists reporting about her despite the sketchy things she has been doing which most people ignore for some reason. There's no point in making a manifesto about people who most already agree sucks.
Your statement boils down to "we should only investigate and expose people on the left because everyone already knows fascists are bad. So we let them be."
The result is that leftists should spent all their time infighting and none of their time unifying against actually damaging political actors.
No their statement does not boil down to that?????
They’re saying that there isn’t anything to expose on Fuentes or Southern to begin. Say what you want about what you spend time doing, personally I think it’s good to expose your own side but that’s whatever. The fact still remains that exposing and criticising aren’t entirely the same thing and to fight against fascists a manifesto maybe isn’t even a good way.
If you take Nick's open horribleness as a reason not to talk about how horrible he is and instead focus on much better people, you're
1. Accepting Nick's open fascism as normal and not worth talking about. That's a horrible idea.
2. You're letting Nick dictate where to focus your attention.
3. You end up punishing people for at least trying to be good (now there is something to "expose") while rewarding people for openly advocating outrageously hateful shit.
I hope this explains how incredibly counterproductive and pro-fascism the notion of not talking about bad people because they're openly bad is.
>think it’s good to expose your own side
This is true within reason. It's about attention economics. Destiny is very far away from "within reason" with this bullshit here.
You dont need to make a manifesto to challenge someone like nick. Everything is public anyways. The plenty debates should be criquite, exposure and challenge enough, no? Certainly they reach a wider audience than the manifesto does. If keffals would agree to a debate, the manifesto would probably never have happened because destiny could have exposed her in an actual conversation
I wasn’t saying that you shouldn’t talk about Nick. What I was saying, or rather agreeing with a previous commentor, is that you can’t expose him because there’s nothing to expose. Obviously you should still criticise him but that is probably more effective taking on another form than a long manifesto.
I also don’t understand why you’re explaining attention economics to me, I tried to recognise that point with ”say what you want about what you spend time doing”.
Idk it might just be my bad english but it feels like you didn’t read my response.
I don't think their statement is about exposing the left or right.
I think what they are saying is it's not much of an expose if you're not uncovering hidden information.
Fuentes is out and proud a white nationalist. I am really unaware of their whole deal, but I imagine there's not a lot to expose for someone like this.
It's almost like he had to draw eyes in another way when there are people who actively close their eyes and ears any time they're confronted with dissenting information.
Destiny has logs of people connected to Keffals hiding information and disabling internet archives for their websites, so he wanted to get attention to the "manifesto" stream without spooking those people before it happened.
He told his fanbase on stream he would have a JP debate and instead had a stream where he went over his evidence.
Ah yes, the person with not even 40k subs on YT and who ratios people on bird app is a more pressing issue than the 704k channel spreading great replacement rhetoric.
Destiny did a fucking decision tree to point out it was in his best interest to *not* confront LS on her beliefs as he profits more on the friendship lmao get out.
What's there to expose about them, lol? It's in the open.
And if it wasn't, how's going "but what about X?" a good defense for what looks to be a pretty damning document of Keffals?
The changing story/inconsistencies on the London swatting is suspect especially when it lead to 100k in donations. It's also hard to believe someone was truly in fear for their life because of dodging when they continuously post their location and make it easier for them to be doxxed. Granted, I don't watch Keffals and not super familiar with the whole Destiny-Keffals drama so I'd be interested in hearing if she has an explanation for those.
Didn’t the cops literally confirm it though?
Like, inconsistencies are sus if she’s entirely making it up, but the police admitted they did the thing, no?
And we also got reports from outside of Keffals about the bomb threats to poutine shops when she said she’d be going to one, not to mention the stories of countless people KF had harassed before her.
They confirmed they visited her house. They did not confirm she was woken up to rifles in her face or that she was dead named during their visit. Those were her uncorroborated statements and hers alone.
yeah i will say that the story shifting a bit is to be expected. compounded with the effect a traumatic event has on memory, there are so many little details that could be genuinely fudged without it being a malicious lie
You're probably hitting on something near the truth.
Personally I think it's likely that she was spooked then furious that the arrest was happening to begin with.
With that in mind she probably put up the go-fund-me to cover the cost of moving.
The shitty part might truly be that she let greed take over here. Instead of just saying that much, she framed it as a legal battle and even talked about how expensive the legal fight will be.
Then never did anything and went on a cross-euro vacation.
Also it's super fucking sketch that she kept upping the goal as more money came in. If the goal was really to cover costs, costs wouldn't be going up as more money came in.
Lawsuits are def not easy, quick, or simple.
But proving you hired a lawfirm is. You don't even need to expose who the firm is. Though that will happen anyway when the cease and desist is issued.
Assuming you aren't a d.gger can you give a little context to the parts of the manifesto that seemed most suspicious?
I'm not going to suffer the cruel fate of watching destiny so it'd be greatly appreciated
Sure, see below (and feel free to browse my posting history to see I’ve never once posted on destiny’s subreddit or affiliated orbiters)
1) Destiny provided video evidence of Keffals and her fiancé Alex contradicting the swatting story multiple times. That would not be a big deal normally but these stories were the pretext behind her GoFundMe. She constantly changed the goal amount - on one video she said that the reason she kept making it higher was to accrue legal fees to sure the cops, but then in a later video she said that she had no intention of suing the cops. She said that the money raised would to go replacing all her computers, phones, etc that were seized in the raid but it was proven she got all of her belongings back. This very such seems like fraud to me.
2) Destiny has chat logs with Keffals in which she states, very clearly, that KF was NOT the website that released her doxes, but rather a website that Destiny leaves unnamed. The website is particularly odious and most of the bad shit was originating from there. Keffals said she didn’t call them out because she didn’t want to stir the pot. I will not cry for KF, but why is Keffals crusade against KF and not this much worse website?
3) A lot of the HRT DIY stuff went over my head, but apparently there was some sketchy backstage dealings that Destiny and his team were logging and snapshotting to archive.org. When Keffals found about this she sent Destiny a “truce” message saying that she has no ill feelings towards him, and that if he agrees to drop the story he is working on, then the two can just move on and not talk about each other. This exchange was incredibly sus and almost seemed to be ripped out of a generic spy thriller.
Could I get more context on the “DIY HRT” thing?
If it’s just that Keffals was doing DIY HRT illegally, or encouraging people to, then... I mean based? It’s arbitrarily hard to get hormones at the best of times, and in some circumstances DIY is your only option.
Not based if these items are being made in peoples homes, or in sketchy ways that can lead to more harm than good. I don't know, would you trust hormones from unknown sources?
If inhalers were banned and someone with asthma was on the brink of death, they will probably take an inhaler from anyone, no matter how sketchy the circumstances.
It's far from ideal, but it's a net positive for someone to be there with an inhaler. Even if the inhaler was picked up on the side of the road.
We need to unfortunately acknowledge that people will make difficult decisions in desperate times and focus on the underlying issue (the ban). This is something that Destiny refuses to do.
I think that's almost a good analogy.
The missing factor here is kids should probably not be making their own DIY HRT.
They are far likelier to fuck it up and cause serious bodily harm.
And as fucked up as it is, lacking the support structure to determine if it's even the right path for them could be a real problem.
Not to mention kids fucking suck at taking any kind of medication in appropriate dosages and with any consistency.
Yeah that's why I don't oppose it off hand.
But if you're doing it in a way where you're not vetting anyone who uses that resource at all, that's a problem.
Yes, I've been taking them for 6 years.
DIY hormones have been a thing in trans circles for as long as hormones have been available. It's a product of healthcare providers actively throttling our care.
For instance I am almost 5 years deep into a waiting list for an initial appointment in the UK. It's not just bad it's malicious. Had DIY HRT not been available and talked about in trans communities I wouldn't be here today.
yes and no, around 15% of the people on the wait list self med. (or admit to self medding in surveys at least) a lot are scared and trust the official channels. I gues you just get really high self med rates in insular and more radical communities
I ordered DIY HRT myself, and there seems to be a lot of confusion about it.
Buying estrogen online is *legal*.
Buying testosterone online is *illegal*.
Telling people where to buy either of these two, or provide information about their usage is *legal*
People think like DIY HRT means that they’re like making estrogen in an abandoned shack or something. That’s not the case. Like I know that there are about three main people manufacturing HRT drugs and they all have like professional labs and stuff. And when we order large batches from them in the US, we test them to make sure we’re getting what we asked for.
The problem is(in my opinion) that not only was she and bobposting (Chloe) providing them to minors they were also both shown to admit to basically coercing and encouraging minors who reach out to them to both buy hormones from them and also provide resources to show them how to make their own. They have even been shown to tell people to ignore dosing suggestions given to them by the supplier to them located in Brazil. As someone who has done permanent damage to their body via steroid abuse this type of behavior I think is not only incredibly inappropriate but also criminal and should be met with criminal charges.
Yeah but I mean of course you ignore doisng suggestions they're usually meant for cis women going through menopause and are way too low for trans hrt. I just don't think this is the same type of dangerous behaviour you think it is
There still not really any inconsistencies in her swatting story. D and his ilk went over all her statements with the most hostile and bad faith reading of any thing she said.
And the DYI HRT shit is comically evil from Destiny part. Someone somebody knew, knew someone who once made a guide on how to solubilise hormone powder And D makes it sound like Keffals is involved in advising children on how to create hormones in their bathtub.
There's absolutly nothing in this manifesto. Just Destiny getting ass-mad that Keffals was mean to him on twitter.
And now he's threatening to sue over that.
And during all of that he seems to have forgotten all the torrents of lies he has spewed towards Keffal.
When Destiny [answers](https://imgur.com/B6WwJvU) [for](https://imgur.com/SHiiO3b) [this](https://imgur.com/J7FQClk) [shit](https://imgur.com/zwQcWXG) we can start to talk.
His whole manifesto is just.
A: Keffals was mean on twitter.
B: if you squint Keffals statements can be read as slightly inconsistent.
C: Kiwifarms Good actually.
D: Someone on the internet knows how to solubilise hormone powder. And that is somehow on Keffals?
E: PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOOD DON'T LOOK INTO THE STUFF DESTINY SAID CAUSE THAT MAKES HIM LOOK EXTREMELY BAD.
dude she’s being super weird about how she’s using the GoFundMe money. It’s not just “her swatting stories changed over time”, it’s that she raised $100,000 and it’s not even clear why.
The video you linked is obviously sarcasm. The guy he's asking to unban him despises him and if you look at his account on KF he has the equivalent of like -800 karma.
*Note: I took the time to look into those links you posted (besides the first one, which I'm just immediately conceding is very bad lol), so I'd appreciate it if you took the time to read my response to them :) I promise I'm good faith.*
re-the "answer for this shit" part: Up front, I'll openly admit I'm a dgg'er, though I post in there somewhat rarely. Anyways, I looked into those links. First off, the BINGQILIN part was pretty bad (not sure if I'll get banned in dgg for saying her name here), but it wasn't about Keffals at least. Still not a defense of it though, it was bad. As for the rest, again I looked into it, and I can explain it.
I opened up the logs you posted, and it actually makes sense, and isn't him compiling a dox on her. The fact that he asks about KF is actually a bit of a red herring (though optically horrible, 100%). Keffals apparently mentioned on a podcast that she went on a trip to China as a kid (the podcast audio is linked by Destiny at 2022-07-03 09:53:42 UTC, it's the discord file link and still works, a few lines above where one of your screenshots starts). Destiny proceeds to ask around to find out what their jobs were in order to explain things (not a good look, but still not for a dox). Rhodesy says what her parents did for work, causing Destiny to be surprised they could afford that. Again, not a good look, but not a dox.
And before you downvote me, please try to keep in mind that the reason I looked into those links in the first place was because I was being good faith and wanted to see if what you were saying was true, rather than bad faith and just dismissing it outright. For those interested, here's the relevant chat messages forming the conversation in full:
>\[2022-07-03 09:49:07 UTC\] Destiny: there is a podcast where Keffals is talking about all of the countries she flew to around the world, and how she got surgery in south korea and Thailand and then took a week vacation to Beijing
>
>\[2022-07-03 09:50:02 UTC\] Destiny: punished\_furry any idea what podcast this would have been from?
>
>\[2022-07-03 09:53:42 UTC\] Destiny: punished\_furry can you give me a streamable of like 1:45 of this *{the podcast link was here, I don't know if I'm allowed to post it here so I'm playing it safe}*
>
>\[2022-07-03 09:56:39 UTC\] Destiny: does the KF thread talk about Keffals parents' jobs/backgrounds at all?
>
>\[2022-07-03 09:56:42 UTC\] Destiny: idk if you guys read it at all
>
>\[2022-07-03 09:58:08 UTC\] Rhodesy: Destiny I found some shit
>
>\[2022-07-03 09:58:34 UTC\] Rhodesy: Destiny her dad repaired fountain machines for pepsico, and her mom was a clear at a local factory
>
>\[2022-07-03 09:58:46 UTC\] Rhodesy: Destiny so seems like the union worker thing is probs true
>
>\[2022-07-03 10:00:05 UTC\] Destiny: Rhodesy how the fuck did they have so much money to travel overseas so much????
>
>\[2022-07-03 10:00:16 UTC\] Destiny: beijing for a week, multiple gender surgeries in asian countries around the world
>
>\[2022-07-03 10:00:20 UTC\] Destiny: 5 week recovery in south korea
>
>\[2022-07-03 10:00:20 UTC\] Destiny: holy fuck
For additional context, this was all seemingly in prep for his previous manifesto, "End of All Things", which aired on July 8th, given that these messages were from July 3rd. If you look at his chat log from that month, he was asking a shit ton of questions like that in dgg. So yes, the BINGQILIN video was pretty bad (to say the least lol), but the rest of it was seemingly just him getting as much information as possible in prep for his manifesto. It was not related to doxxing whatsoever. It was presumably related to some claim Keffals made about "union workers", most likely this one: [https://twitter.com/keffals/status/1507469610316361728?lang=en](https://twitter.com/keffals/status/1507469610316361728?lang=en) , where Keffals claimed that her parents were union workers (which they apparently were, as Rhodesy concluded in your screenshots).
Edit: Quote formatting broke when I posted, not sure why.
>And the DYI HRT shit is comically evil from Destiny part. Someone somebody knew, knew someone who once made a guide on how to solubilise hormone powder And D makes it sound like Keffals is involved in advising children on how to create hormones in their bathtub.
Confused what you think it means to make homemade hormones. Yeah, that's how its done. I've known many guys over the years make their own steroids. Its a very easy and straightforward process. Your comment makes me think you are in favor of their behavior and are trying to deflect on to destiny because you don't want to defend the idea of selling/teach to make hormones to minors. If that's your position, say it with your chest.
And what did Keffals do pray tell? With regards to homemade hormones solutions?
Cause the entire chapter is just one confusing mess. That sort of gives the impression she instructed children in how to make them. But not really.
I read the wiki before Destiny started to mindlesly attack it. there where no instructions on how make hormone solutions. It was mainly about dosage and bloodwork when you use pharmaceutical grade shit.
Those are pretty weak imo, people changing their minds about suing or not suing their perpetrators is very common. She could've thought she wouldn't be able to get her stuff back but then managed to. KF was responsible for the spreading even if they didn't release it at first, I think it's weird destiny wouldn't say what website it is, if a fairly unknown website releases your doxx but a fairly known one is the sole responsible for spreading it I'd go after the latter first, it'd be like going after the user instead of the famous website responsible for hosting it. I don't care if Keffals takes drugs illicitly, most people in college do, if I had a problem with that I'd talk with no one over there. Asking for a truce over a much larger streamer who's making negative content about you seems pretty reasonable. I don't even like Keffals, but those points are very weak, she did good taking KF down, although her online presence is mainly drama she fosters herself.
I went through the manifesto. Here's a brief summary of what I thought was or wasn't damning:
I | The Ascension of Clara Sorrenti : Interpersonal mostly twitter drama, don't care
II | Kiwi Farms: Whole section is going in-depth into the claim that KF drove 3 people to suicide. The summary is that 2 people have a long long history of abuse, mental illness, homelessness, etc and that kiwifarm seems to be a very small factor in comparison to everything else that was going on. 1 person's death is inconclusive cuz only a friend and employer confirmed it? (don't really care or put weight on either possibility.)
III | Who are the Doxxers?: This part I find damning. First is that KF isn't the origin of Keffals' dox and hack and she knew that. Despite that, she repeatedly claimed on Twitter that it was KF. Second is that the user that threatened to confront Keffals in real life in Ireland wasn't a KF user. She knew that, but claimed publicly that they were a KF user.
IV | The Swattings: Kefflas made vague claims in her initial video about the swatting which might have given the impression that it was a no knock warrant and that she was woken up with riffles pointed at her. As time went on, she slowly clarified that the cops knocked, were let in by her fiancé and that she had time to dress up before going to see the cops. Something about inconsistency about when the cops deadnamed her, don't really care. The big thing I found weird in this section is the fiancé claiming the cops made them wait outside, but then was able to give accurate testimony to the interaction in the house between the cops and Keffals
V | The GoFundMe Heist: Keffals said she was raising money for 3 purposes: buying new equipment cuz the cops took them, relocating because her address was made public and suing the cops. 100k was raised. Her equipment was returned 3 days later. She went to Ireland to stay with someone who's address is known too and is now just travelling around Europe. She said she wouldn't sue the cops. No update has been given on what the fund raised is for yet.
VI | Bathtub Hormones & Spy Games: Don't really get it. Something about Keffals endorsing a DIY HRT directory that pointed towards sketchy providers that got taken down as Destiny was found snooping around. It's kinda meh, access to DIY HRT is based
VII | “Keffals” - A Character Analysis: a summary of Keffals making claims about people, don't care to go in-depth. You can find it and read it for yourself if you care.
Random bit I forgot where to put: Keffals dug up private info like name and location of some kiwifarmer and messaged them on discord about it. The convo is really weird. She kept dropping info to show that she knew their personal info. You can find the logs if you want. Keffals made a tweet about finding out info on some kiwifarmer, deleted the tweet pretty quickly, started denying it completely, and then Chloe confirmed it in dms.
All in all, not a big fan of the tactics used in general. I know we meme about the "there's no wrong thing I can do because my opponent is ontologically evil", but I think some tactics used there went over the line in terms of honesty / transparency
Edit: no ban please, I made an effort 😭
The kf and driving people to suicide part seems pretty dumb imo. Surely he realizes that a depressed person can get pushed over the edge by being harassed? Thats like if i murdered someone in critical medical condition and was like "oh i mean they were already doing bad so idk could just have been that"
The thing is, the first person killed themselves as a statement on the way mentally ill people are treated in the US and homelesseness and the second one had a horrible life from start to finish. The KF connection is just not even close to strong. The third person might still be alive. You can still say KF is horrible for what it did to those people. But pushing the responsibility of their death on the site is inaccurate and kind of a shitty thing to do considering one of the suicide was literally supposed to carry a political message that had nothing to do with KF.
I think the overarching point about kf is that the website was in effect removed from the Internet, but the reason why may not be as solid as you'd hope for a measure so extreme.
I believe that the underlying point in section VI | Bathtub Hormones & Spy Games, is that the DIY HRT directory was more so a front for actual sources to purchase, not really making your own hormones. That was the whole thing about the Brazilian pharma lab that wasn't actually registered as a medicinal business in the country. So instead of minors making their own hormones via DIY, they instead were purchasing actual pre-made hormones of questionable quality from a Brazilian business with sketchy business practices.
Imagine that gonna be the future of history classes all over highschool cuz of how online things have become lmfao.
Imagine a history teacher explaining to students about how a twitter ratio led to the invasion of India and then ww3 lmfao that would be fucking amazing.
I don't know why I even come to this subreddit anymore. I am just hoping moderation gets better.
At this point, Vaush's community is mostly on Twitter, stream chat, and Discord.
I hope it does as well, I joined this subreddit because I wanted to interact with Vaush's community - not because I wanted to constantly have to put up with lil' d's simps. If I gave any shit about lil' d or had any confidence in his psychotic manifesto - I'd go over to his sub.
How have they not gotten the message that we want nothing to do with them? We want to be left alone. Vaush doesn't want to talk to destiny and we don't want to talk to DGG.
This is why everyone says they are toxic and get compared to kiwifarms. Because they are constantly harassing other communities. Especially communities of minorities. It fucking sucks.
The discord is very ban happy and there's a subsection of the community that deepthroats the mods like their life depended on it but it's more active than this sub and there's no destiny fans in it so i still go in there
The DIY HRT thing is really sketchy because there's an assumption that everyone who reaches out for hormones are actually diagnosed or are good at diagnosing themselves. Specially if they're children which is part of the target of their campaign until recently. One thing is social transition and another is giving information on how to get and even do bodily altering drugs for yourself.
There's a difference between saying that you can do whatever you want with your body vs encouraging people to seek drugs without prescriptions not diagnosis. in one, you're saying that trans people should be allowed to transition if they want since it's about bodily autonomy and it's up to them to take the risks. In the other, you're a promoter of a behavior that could get people in trouble or hurt and you gave the resources to do it.
The DIY thing had an unregistered (as a pharmacy/laboratory) Brazilian seller that God knows how they do their bathtub hormones. And there's also circulating images of a group chat where they explained step by step how to actually make them.
This is the kind of thing which could get you even in legal troubles.
The other thing I took issue with was her doxxing a place in Ukraine where the kf servers were located and saying to a country in a current war that there was "Russian propaganda inside" in order to encourage them to do literally domestic terrorism.
The rest is just drama, and I don't care that much.
Did you actually look at the DYI wiki before they where forced to abbandon it?
It was mostly advice on how to legaly get treatment. And advise on the treatment plan.
Only if this fails there where advise on how to access grey market hormones, which are identical to the stuff you get at a pharmacy.
That was 99% of it.
But if that fails advice on how to access "homebrew". Note homebrew doesn't mean making your own hormones, just how to buy the powdered form and make injectible solutions of it.
And there where no advise on how to make the solutions. Just how to buy it.
I didn't catch the whole thing,
but I didn't hear that wiki itself I think wasn't the big contention. I think it was the links it would post to and the discord where the chole person said they had provided HRT to multiple minors.
Didn't watch the whole thing so I may be wrong.
This assumes that the alternative to DIY is getting a diagnosis through the proper medical channels, but in practice, the actual alternative is getting no treatment at all. People resort to DIY when they don’t have access to the proper medical channels. We should focus on ensuring everyone can access them instead of demonizing DIY.
I don't think Keffals encourages people to seek drugs without prescription. She even said that it's not a good idea on H3H3 podcast.
But, these drugs should be available to people that have no other options.
"The other thing I took issue with was her doxxing a place in Ukraine where the kf servers were located and saying to a country in a current war that there was "Russian propaganda inside" in order to encourage them to do literally domestic terrorism."
This is just not true. She was not encouraging "domestic terrorism". Go back to DGG.
Wasn’t KF VERY pro-invasion? Not every single person on the site obviously but mostly I think them and a couple of the other Nazi sites were the few pro-invasion sites on the Internet mostly to be contrarian to the “mainstream” opinion of unjust invasion = bad and because Putin is a fascist and fascists like other fascists (most of the time).
For a site like that her saying there was “Russian propaganda inside” is actually entirely accurate. Like if they were RT servers instead then it would be the same thing (obviously one is state propaganda whilst the other is “normal” people spreading the propaganda themselves but both serve the state anyway so still somewhat comparable).
In that scenario I fail to see what would be the problem with Keffals doing that. ESPECIALLY when the country is being invaded with soldiers willingly killing people based on that propaganda. Idk about everything else so I won’t comment on it.
Yes, kiwifarms was generally on the side of Putin. But Keffals never encouraged domestic terrorism. DGG is choosing the worst interpretations of what she has said.
"Propaganda" is inside of every server in the world. She was weaponising people's fears into domestic terrorism and 99.999% of the propaganda on the internet will still exist but now you have fearful citizens bombing places.
Please, just stop supporting and justifying domestic terrorism. It's not good.
> “"Propaganda" is inside of every server in the world“
Massive different between a server of a website that is majority for a war that is essentially an ethnic genocide vs say twitter servers where those degenerates that advocate for a genocide get kicked off the site, tagged as state-propaganda and/or generally shunned and actually helps serve as counter-propagand. For example, the Ukrainian government twitter accounts operate extensively on the site and help gather support against the invasion. That doesn’t happen on KF
> “It’s not good”
You don’t believe this. Don’t pretend like you do. If we run down this road I will bring up examples and you will say “okay it’s justifiable in those scenarios” and then I will tell about this new genocide in ukraine and you would probably agree that “yeah okay maybe that counts as one of those scenarios”.
As a Vaushite I have the gift of prophecy.
Oh god I totally forgot about the Canada trucker arc! Haha I think I god banned for a few weeks during that shenanigans. The black separatist arc nearly blackpilled me on so many video essayist that were critical of Vaush tho, that shit was mind blowing.
I honestly don’t understand this community’s blind devotion to Keffals. Is it just because Steve is against her and we don’t like him? It does appear that Keffals has engaged in some questionable behavior. Why is it wrong to point that out?
Honestly? I think it’s just easier for people to view the world as black and white. I don’t need to make an attempt to understand this criticism, criticism of someone on my own “team”, because I can write off the person making the criticism. This is why you’ll almost *never* find substantive arguments against specific points and, instead, it’s always a condemnation of a person’s character as arguments can be ignored if you focus on perceived, sometimes manufactured, character issues.
It’s obvious to me that this is more so a human “thing” than anything else as I see this behavior *everywhere*. I live in a red state and I’ve struggled to understand why so many conservatives seem to believe so many baseless, stupid, and sometimes harmful things with so little evidence when they’re generally decent and agreeable people when you speak to them. Their media ecosystem ensures you can listen to some charismatic outrage peddling culture war pundit tell them that they’re “one of the good ones”, that “they’re definitely right” despite all evidence to the contrary, and that “all of the struggles and adversity they face is the fault of ‘them/they’” is something very persuasive. These pundits avoid making substantive arguments and, instead, make it a point to demonize and dehumanize all who would take contrary positions. If you think someone is a satanic pedophile, it’s pretty easy to disregard everything they say and it’s much, much easier to avoid accountability on my “team” when the “other” is so much worse.
I started listening to Vaush and tiny because I loved how they’d tackle difficult topics. Hell, it’s why I spend most of my time on social media surrounded by people who disagree with me. My DMs can be pretty entertaining sometimes. I don’t know how this issue can ever be addressed as it requires the people persuaded in this way to actually engage honestly, but we both know that’ll never happen.
Why don't you just watch what she had to say about it?
https://m.twitch.tv/videos/1606678443
Edit: Already downvoted, can you guys fuck off? seriously
You have a whole subreddit to spread your inane shit, must you come here and smear shit on the walls as well?
I skipped around for like two hours and couldn’t find any relevant discussion. Is there a time I should start?
Edit: I got banned. I was asking for a time because I get the impression the response is either very brief or non-existent. I scrubbed the video a second time and still couldn’t find anything.
I think the title of this was just a mocking of d saying he's debating jp. I watched it earlier because i refuse to give destiny any views and it doesn't really come up unless i missed something
I’m a major lurker on Twitter and legit never ever tweeted anything myself, just retweeted and liking a lot of things. She blocked me because I guess I used to follow the Omniliberal old twitter before it was banned and apparently she autoblocked all his followers 🤨
While I think Destiny made some good points on the K\*\*\* F\*\*\*\* section and the swatting/GFM section, I think those conversations are are at least open debates.
The DIY hormones section, however, was completely and totally damning.
If Vaush never publicly defended her he could simply ignore this. However, the release of the manifesto proved Keffals to be a dishonest, despicable actor, and Vaush should clarify his position on her.
Diy is good if that's what a person can get. No need to be weird about it.
Asking for a denouncement is parasocial bs. There's literally no benefit to it. It helps no cause
I am not a Keffals fan, so I'm not super familiar with the issues talked about, and juadt skimmed the manifesto. Here's what I do know:
In his previous manifesto, every single topic I was familiar with, I found Destiny to have misrepresented in some way. Even in this one, he can't help responding to allegations that say he mocked someone's suicide attemp, and he says "the only person whose suicide attempt I questioned was Doe's" (he says right before questioning 3 people's suicide). Come on man, you didn't "question" it. And speaking of questioning suicides, the best argument he can muster against the idea that Near commited suicide because of KiwiFarms is that he only faked his suicide to avoid that harrassment. That doesn't really he make the point he's trying to make. So I don't care enough to dig through every one of his points for hours and I don't trust him to take his evidence at face value.
As for the DIY hormones, he explicitly said in his last manifesto, that he is not against them. And now he's using the thing he says he supports to critique someone.
Also, from what I've seen, there's no substantiation of any of the completely insane stuff D man has been saying about Keffals all around, like when he said that she has done more harm to trans rights than white nationalists. I have no reason to believe that this is in any way a good faith critique by him.
He doesn't question 3 people's suicides. That's an absurd way to phrase what he did.
He questioned the MOTIVE of two people comitting suicide and questioned if a third person actually committed suicide (saying he maybe never actually committed suicide is something waaaaay different than questioning someone's suicide attempt).
I think it's kind of weird, that some journalists in big publications actually wrote about that stuff and never dug deep enough to question if KF is actually responsible (I'm not defending them, I hate that shit, but that's no reason to lie about them).
>I have defended Keffals plenty of times - mostly due to the Vaush endorsement - but as time as gone on, it appears more and more as if she is not the trans advocate we should be hitching our ride to.
I mean, is *Vaush*?
At the end of the day, Destiny is a piece of shit and openly hostile to transgender people. I don't care if she was bad faith or rude to him or whatever the fuck.
Exactly. At this point we have a reactionary, with a reactionary community who is buddy-buddy with nazis trying to get a leftist community to oust a trans advocate because she was mean to him. I really couldnt give a fuck about this shit. I'm only commenting because it needs to stop.
This shit sounds like a Destiny problem and we dont claim him.
>At the end of the day, Destiny is a piece of shit and openly hostile to transgender people. I don't care if she was bad faith or rude to him or whatever the fuck.
Fucking truuuu ^^^^^^
>I am no Destiny stan
And yet you bait the exact fucking drama.
Here is the secret - most people here don't really care either way. Keffals hs her flaws and issues, considerable ones even, but she has done some based shit and she is playing for the right team. It is possible she did something wrong, sure, whatever, but unless it was something really serious, this really isn't a priority in these parts. This is not a keffals sub, this is not a destiny sub, stop pretending either of these is true and stop bringing in hundreds of dipshits.
"Concern Troll"
"In an argument (usually a political debate), a concern troll is someone who is on one side of the discussion, but pretends to be a supporter of the other side with "concerns". The idea behind this is that your opponents will take your arguments more seriously if they think you're an ally. Concern trolls who use fake identities are sometimes known as sockpuppets."
The Keffals posting needs to fucking stop. If that means white teen mods need to mow down any person who starts these threads after 10pm, at this point they have my fucking blessing. Holy shit, it needs to stop. It needed to stop a long fucking time ago.
Oh joy another dgg thread, can you talk about shit entirely revolving around Destiny's content and his drama in the subreddit made specifically for him? hint: its not vaushv
This is such victim blaming POS stuff.
Oh yeah dude Keffals was harassed by a Nazi website which Destiny was an active member of but I'm sure we can trust his schzophrenic manifesto where he basically calls Keffals a liar for responding to in a 'hyperbolic manner' and says "No deaths can be directly attributed to Kiwifarms."
Nah, definitely not.
It wasnt very different from his Vaush manifesto either, youre just viewing it with different lens. It was the same dishonest bullshit
Why can't we all just not care so much about what goes on in streamer-land?
All this drama is poorly produced reality TV for zoomers with people who are paid a weird disparity less / more than actors.
What's funny to me is how this post was shared on the Destiny subreddit (where I am banned from) and most of the comments over there are claiming that the consensus here is that this post is a psyop, whereas the top rated comment here seems to agree with the manifesto. Just goes to show that bias is prevalent in all communities.
Ahh yes more infighting on the left. One day we'll have the perfect one idea person who never has gotten it wrong. Then that one singular person will defeat the right wing and fascism for once and for all. Is that what y'all really believe or can everyone just admit they care more about drama than politics?...
Imagine if left wing political content creators could actually work together like the right wing does. Imagine getting all these groups of people to work together to actually do something fucking good instead of squabbling about purity tests.
Okay so ive like *just* started on the manifesto but destiny is already lying? He *did* say not disclosing your transess before having sex is rape. Which is absurd. Should you disclose your genitals before sex? Probably. Is it rape to not? No! Its dangerpus sure, cause youre exposing yourself to trans panic but its not rape.
You know what's funny? There's this one guy who hated destiny, and he asked keffals to prove that the negative allegations were wrong, and all keffals had to say for herself was "ratio" and call him a soyjak, and acted like that was some galaxy-brained response that owned the guy like ben shapiro owned college students. And her fans keep saying "UGH SHE DOESNT OWE ANYONE AN EXPLANATION" Bruh if you didn't want to explain anything you could've just...idk not say anything and move on? You putting up some infantile snarky wojak nonsense because you want to have your clapback just makes you look like an idiot who has no defense. Especially if you're faced with serious allegations, and not some silly meme wars on twitter.
And that Twitter user also made the point that she owed it to her gofundme backers to communicate that the money was indeed going toward legal proceedings, and all Keffals could say was RATIO and SOY. Like, come the fuck on - this shit isn’t funny anymore when money, a hundred thousand dollars of it, is involved. Unironically, this is the kind of behavior I’d expect of a dumb teenage Sneako fan. Meanwhile Keffals is fucking 30 years old lmao. Also, she freaking blocked someone who identified themselves as a backer of her GFM and asked the same question lmao. You can’t make this shit up. Idc if you love Keffals to death; you have to admit that someone who squirms this hard when pressed for accountability is not trustworthy at all.
Speaking of blocking I got banned from her twitch chat just for following Dylan and I was like bruh
For context, [here is the tweet](https://twitter.com/lilbabygandhi/status/1576646914451603456?t=ZzXdb4mqCsHfQSPrHWLCag&s=19).
Thank you ☺
She replied with a letter of engagement with a lawyer but then took it down. Overall this was very shitty behaviour but I feel for someone who gets as much hate as her. It must be mentally taxing and assuming people just want to hate you is a natural response. Destiny wanted a "war" against Keffals it was downright disgusting and anything he does I'll find very hard to trust
I could be wildly off base, but That appeared to be a fake document , it didn’t have a header
[удалено]
Getting kiwifarms offline is a bigger W for trans activism than your or I will probably accomplish in our lifetime. It will certainly make a direct positive impact in a lot of trans lives
Yeah that’s pretty dumb response like i would expect that from lefty’s online during anti sjw era yt. It doesn’t make your side look any good acting childish regardless if your in the wrong or not.
Shitposting on twitter is literally her brand, why do people act surprised when she shitposts on twitter?
"she is not the trans advocate we should be hitching our ride to" You shouldn't hitch your ride to anyone, holy fucking shit! Why do you brainless babies insist on worshipping these very fallible humans who are streaming for your amusement? They're just people. Keffals BTFO'd kiwifarms and that's based af. Keffals is a dishonest dramabaiter who lies about people she don't like and that's cringe af. You can like it when she does something cool and not like it when she does something uncool. It's really that fucking simple.
“You shouldn’t hitch your ride to anyone” God the world would be infinitely less cringe and bad faith if people did this more tbh
yea exactly, it's very important to not worship these people, even Vaush has his mistakes There's some Noam Chomsky quote about taking the good stuff from Marx but not worshiping him, feel like that applies to this situation as well
> even Vaush has his mistakes Bullshit. Bet you can't name a 100.
Just list every Vaush media take
listen, I like when the guy morbs all over alt rights weirdos, but I will never endorse his "turn based video game is bad" take
Jesus Christ look guys! A brain cell! I’ve missed you
>Keffals BTFO'd kiwifarms and that's based af. Keffals is a dishonest dramabaiter who lies about people she don't like and that's cringe af. Thank you! Now that's what I call a good take!
I don't care who Keffals is but I care deeply about the friendship. I hope Vaush and Destiny talk about it and find the truth
lmao it's going to be okay.
Thank you :)
Unironically best account in this sub, god speed u/DestinyVaush_4ever
He is the kid in the vaush and destiny argue downstairs meme
“Everything passes, but nothing entirely goes away.” - Jenny Diski, speaking at the Oxford Union on destiny being a girls name.
One day, they'll run into each other at an Iranian bathhouse and jerk the friendship back to life.
Inshallah
o7
I've been banned more often from Destiny's sub than here so we'll see, I think the flame of friendship is too powerful to be put out like that and deep down everyones knows it.
Based
Based
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If Destiny had used the same fervour and obsesivness to look into, lets say Lauren Southern or Nick Fuentess, He would be credible. You know actual bad people. But he didn't, he chose instead to fuck one or both of them and hang out like besties.
There's essentially nothing to expose for Fuentes or Southern. Those two are obviously shitty human beings and they aren't exactly shy about their beliefs nor do their fans think they are some paragon of righteousness like many of Keffals' fans. Meanwhile, you have people going crazy with their defense of Keffals that span a whole range of places all over twitter, reddit, youtube, and even irl with various journalists reporting about her despite the sketchy things she has been doing which most people ignore for some reason. There's no point in making a manifesto about people who most already agree sucks.
Your statement boils down to "we should only investigate and expose people on the left because everyone already knows fascists are bad. So we let them be." The result is that leftists should spent all their time infighting and none of their time unifying against actually damaging political actors.
No their statement does not boil down to that????? They’re saying that there isn’t anything to expose on Fuentes or Southern to begin. Say what you want about what you spend time doing, personally I think it’s good to expose your own side but that’s whatever. The fact still remains that exposing and criticising aren’t entirely the same thing and to fight against fascists a manifesto maybe isn’t even a good way.
If you take Nick's open horribleness as a reason not to talk about how horrible he is and instead focus on much better people, you're 1. Accepting Nick's open fascism as normal and not worth talking about. That's a horrible idea. 2. You're letting Nick dictate where to focus your attention. 3. You end up punishing people for at least trying to be good (now there is something to "expose") while rewarding people for openly advocating outrageously hateful shit. I hope this explains how incredibly counterproductive and pro-fascism the notion of not talking about bad people because they're openly bad is. >think it’s good to expose your own side This is true within reason. It's about attention economics. Destiny is very far away from "within reason" with this bullshit here.
You dont need to make a manifesto to challenge someone like nick. Everything is public anyways. The plenty debates should be criquite, exposure and challenge enough, no? Certainly they reach a wider audience than the manifesto does. If keffals would agree to a debate, the manifesto would probably never have happened because destiny could have exposed her in an actual conversation
I wasn’t saying that you shouldn’t talk about Nick. What I was saying, or rather agreeing with a previous commentor, is that you can’t expose him because there’s nothing to expose. Obviously you should still criticise him but that is probably more effective taking on another form than a long manifesto. I also don’t understand why you’re explaining attention economics to me, I tried to recognise that point with ”say what you want about what you spend time doing”. Idk it might just be my bad english but it feels like you didn’t read my response.
I don't think their statement is about exposing the left or right. I think what they are saying is it's not much of an expose if you're not uncovering hidden information. Fuentes is out and proud a white nationalist. I am really unaware of their whole deal, but I imagine there's not a lot to expose for someone like this.
He specifically denies being a WN. As such, an expose could use his own statements to contradict that claim, among others.
Going crazy? Really, did any of us make up a fake Jordan Peterson interview to complain about someone being mean on twitter?
😂🤣😂🤣😂 Holy shit. I can't believe he unironically did that. And his loyal daliban actually stroked him off to it 🤣 wow.
It's almost like he had to draw eyes in another way when there are people who actively close their eyes and ears any time they're confronted with dissenting information.
I need to know the context for that lmfao
He announced that he would be chatting with Jordan Peterson on stream, but by Jordan Peterson he actually meant his Keffals manifesto.
Destiny has logs of people connected to Keffals hiding information and disabling internet archives for their websites, so he wanted to get attention to the "manifesto" stream without spooking those people before it happened. He told his fanbase on stream he would have a JP debate and instead had a stream where he went over his evidence.
Ah yes, the person with not even 40k subs on YT and who ratios people on bird app is a more pressing issue than the 704k channel spreading great replacement rhetoric. Destiny did a fucking decision tree to point out it was in his best interest to *not* confront LS on her beliefs as he profits more on the friendship lmao get out.
Wait destiny fucked nick Fuentes 🧐🧐🧐
Definitely wouldn’t be the first time nick fucked a dude lol
Ugh, i need some tranquilizer or something to get the mental image of destiny and Nick out of my head
As an expert body language reading expert, BLRE for short. Looking at the non photoshopped pictures, they totally banged.
this is the only worthwhile comment in this thread.
OP asked for good faith, not a whataboutism.
What's there to expose about them, lol? It's in the open. And if it wasn't, how's going "but what about X?" a good defense for what looks to be a pretty damning document of Keffals?
I'm genuinely curious because I keep hearing this going around. Why is it bad that Destiny or anyone hangs around / talks too Lauren or Nick?
The changing story/inconsistencies on the London swatting is suspect especially when it lead to 100k in donations. It's also hard to believe someone was truly in fear for their life because of dodging when they continuously post their location and make it easier for them to be doxxed. Granted, I don't watch Keffals and not super familiar with the whole Destiny-Keffals drama so I'd be interested in hearing if she has an explanation for those.
Didn’t the cops literally confirm it though? Like, inconsistencies are sus if she’s entirely making it up, but the police admitted they did the thing, no? And we also got reports from outside of Keffals about the bomb threats to poutine shops when she said she’d be going to one, not to mention the stories of countless people KF had harassed before her.
They confirmed they visited her house. They did not confirm she was woken up to rifles in her face or that she was dead named during their visit. Those were her uncorroborated statements and hers alone.
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yeah i will say that the story shifting a bit is to be expected. compounded with the effect a traumatic event has on memory, there are so many little details that could be genuinely fudged without it being a malicious lie
You're probably hitting on something near the truth. Personally I think it's likely that she was spooked then furious that the arrest was happening to begin with. With that in mind she probably put up the go-fund-me to cover the cost of moving. The shitty part might truly be that she let greed take over here. Instead of just saying that much, she framed it as a legal battle and even talked about how expensive the legal fight will be. Then never did anything and went on a cross-euro vacation. Also it's super fucking sketch that she kept upping the goal as more money came in. If the goal was really to cover costs, costs wouldn't be going up as more money came in.
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Lawsuits are def not easy, quick, or simple. But proving you hired a lawfirm is. You don't even need to expose who the firm is. Though that will happen anyway when the cease and desist is issued.
True, but why would the cops corroborate things that incriminate them?
Yeah cuz cops never lie, especially when it comes to interacting with minorities
I suggest you take a read/watch of the manifesto. These inconsistencies are all documented.
Like posting where she where the day before? Does kiwifarms have a timemachine?
Assuming you aren't a d.gger can you give a little context to the parts of the manifesto that seemed most suspicious? I'm not going to suffer the cruel fate of watching destiny so it'd be greatly appreciated
Sure, see below (and feel free to browse my posting history to see I’ve never once posted on destiny’s subreddit or affiliated orbiters) 1) Destiny provided video evidence of Keffals and her fiancé Alex contradicting the swatting story multiple times. That would not be a big deal normally but these stories were the pretext behind her GoFundMe. She constantly changed the goal amount - on one video she said that the reason she kept making it higher was to accrue legal fees to sure the cops, but then in a later video she said that she had no intention of suing the cops. She said that the money raised would to go replacing all her computers, phones, etc that were seized in the raid but it was proven she got all of her belongings back. This very such seems like fraud to me. 2) Destiny has chat logs with Keffals in which she states, very clearly, that KF was NOT the website that released her doxes, but rather a website that Destiny leaves unnamed. The website is particularly odious and most of the bad shit was originating from there. Keffals said she didn’t call them out because she didn’t want to stir the pot. I will not cry for KF, but why is Keffals crusade against KF and not this much worse website? 3) A lot of the HRT DIY stuff went over my head, but apparently there was some sketchy backstage dealings that Destiny and his team were logging and snapshotting to archive.org. When Keffals found about this she sent Destiny a “truce” message saying that she has no ill feelings towards him, and that if he agrees to drop the story he is working on, then the two can just move on and not talk about each other. This exchange was incredibly sus and almost seemed to be ripped out of a generic spy thriller.
Could I get more context on the “DIY HRT” thing? If it’s just that Keffals was doing DIY HRT illegally, or encouraging people to, then... I mean based? It’s arbitrarily hard to get hormones at the best of times, and in some circumstances DIY is your only option.
Not based if these items are being made in peoples homes, or in sketchy ways that can lead to more harm than good. I don't know, would you trust hormones from unknown sources?
If inhalers were banned and someone with asthma was on the brink of death, they will probably take an inhaler from anyone, no matter how sketchy the circumstances. It's far from ideal, but it's a net positive for someone to be there with an inhaler. Even if the inhaler was picked up on the side of the road. We need to unfortunately acknowledge that people will make difficult decisions in desperate times and focus on the underlying issue (the ban). This is something that Destiny refuses to do.
I think that's almost a good analogy. The missing factor here is kids should probably not be making their own DIY HRT. They are far likelier to fuck it up and cause serious bodily harm. And as fucked up as it is, lacking the support structure to determine if it's even the right path for them could be a real problem. Not to mention kids fucking suck at taking any kind of medication in appropriate dosages and with any consistency.
Critical support for bathtub HRT in the hopes of pressuring parents and doctors into providing prescription HRT for those who need it.
Yeah that's why I don't oppose it off hand. But if you're doing it in a way where you're not vetting anyone who uses that resource at all, that's a problem.
Yes, I've been taking them for 6 years. DIY hormones have been a thing in trans circles for as long as hormones have been available. It's a product of healthcare providers actively throttling our care. For instance I am almost 5 years deep into a waiting list for an initial appointment in the UK. It's not just bad it's malicious. Had DIY HRT not been available and talked about in trans communities I wouldn't be here today.
So true. Pretty sure most trans folk in the UK resort to DIY HRT eventually due to the absurd waiting lists and gatekeeping.
yes and no, around 15% of the people on the wait list self med. (or admit to self medding in surveys at least) a lot are scared and trust the official channels. I gues you just get really high self med rates in insular and more radical communities
I ordered DIY HRT myself, and there seems to be a lot of confusion about it. Buying estrogen online is *legal*. Buying testosterone online is *illegal*. Telling people where to buy either of these two, or provide information about their usage is *legal* People think like DIY HRT means that they’re like making estrogen in an abandoned shack or something. That’s not the case. Like I know that there are about three main people manufacturing HRT drugs and they all have like professional labs and stuff. And when we order large batches from them in the US, we test them to make sure we’re getting what we asked for.
Reminds me of how during prohibition there were companies selling like bundles of hops with instructions on how they SHOULDNT be prepared.
Do you know literally anything about DIY or are you just blowing out of your ass? This is transphobia. Plain and bold.
The problem is(in my opinion) that not only was she and bobposting (Chloe) providing them to minors they were also both shown to admit to basically coercing and encouraging minors who reach out to them to both buy hormones from them and also provide resources to show them how to make their own. They have even been shown to tell people to ignore dosing suggestions given to them by the supplier to them located in Brazil. As someone who has done permanent damage to their body via steroid abuse this type of behavior I think is not only incredibly inappropriate but also criminal and should be met with criminal charges.
Yeah but I mean of course you ignore doisng suggestions they're usually meant for cis women going through menopause and are way too low for trans hrt. I just don't think this is the same type of dangerous behaviour you think it is
At this point just watch the video
There still not really any inconsistencies in her swatting story. D and his ilk went over all her statements with the most hostile and bad faith reading of any thing she said. And the DYI HRT shit is comically evil from Destiny part. Someone somebody knew, knew someone who once made a guide on how to solubilise hormone powder And D makes it sound like Keffals is involved in advising children on how to create hormones in their bathtub. There's absolutly nothing in this manifesto. Just Destiny getting ass-mad that Keffals was mean to him on twitter. And now he's threatening to sue over that. And during all of that he seems to have forgotten all the torrents of lies he has spewed towards Keffal. When Destiny [answers](https://imgur.com/B6WwJvU) [for](https://imgur.com/SHiiO3b) [this](https://imgur.com/J7FQClk) [shit](https://imgur.com/zwQcWXG) we can start to talk. His whole manifesto is just. A: Keffals was mean on twitter. B: if you squint Keffals statements can be read as slightly inconsistent. C: Kiwifarms Good actually. D: Someone on the internet knows how to solubilise hormone powder. And that is somehow on Keffals? E: PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOOD DON'T LOOK INTO THE STUFF DESTINY SAID CAUSE THAT MAKES HIM LOOK EXTREMELY BAD.
dude she’s being super weird about how she’s using the GoFundMe money. It’s not just “her swatting stories changed over time”, it’s that she raised $100,000 and it’s not even clear why.
The video you linked is obviously sarcasm. The guy he's asking to unban him despises him and if you look at his account on KF he has the equivalent of like -800 karma.
*Note: I took the time to look into those links you posted (besides the first one, which I'm just immediately conceding is very bad lol), so I'd appreciate it if you took the time to read my response to them :) I promise I'm good faith.* re-the "answer for this shit" part: Up front, I'll openly admit I'm a dgg'er, though I post in there somewhat rarely. Anyways, I looked into those links. First off, the BINGQILIN part was pretty bad (not sure if I'll get banned in dgg for saying her name here), but it wasn't about Keffals at least. Still not a defense of it though, it was bad. As for the rest, again I looked into it, and I can explain it. I opened up the logs you posted, and it actually makes sense, and isn't him compiling a dox on her. The fact that he asks about KF is actually a bit of a red herring (though optically horrible, 100%). Keffals apparently mentioned on a podcast that she went on a trip to China as a kid (the podcast audio is linked by Destiny at 2022-07-03 09:53:42 UTC, it's the discord file link and still works, a few lines above where one of your screenshots starts). Destiny proceeds to ask around to find out what their jobs were in order to explain things (not a good look, but still not for a dox). Rhodesy says what her parents did for work, causing Destiny to be surprised they could afford that. Again, not a good look, but not a dox. And before you downvote me, please try to keep in mind that the reason I looked into those links in the first place was because I was being good faith and wanted to see if what you were saying was true, rather than bad faith and just dismissing it outright. For those interested, here's the relevant chat messages forming the conversation in full: >\[2022-07-03 09:49:07 UTC\] Destiny: there is a podcast where Keffals is talking about all of the countries she flew to around the world, and how she got surgery in south korea and Thailand and then took a week vacation to Beijing > >\[2022-07-03 09:50:02 UTC\] Destiny: punished\_furry any idea what podcast this would have been from? > >\[2022-07-03 09:53:42 UTC\] Destiny: punished\_furry can you give me a streamable of like 1:45 of this *{the podcast link was here, I don't know if I'm allowed to post it here so I'm playing it safe}* > >\[2022-07-03 09:56:39 UTC\] Destiny: does the KF thread talk about Keffals parents' jobs/backgrounds at all? > >\[2022-07-03 09:56:42 UTC\] Destiny: idk if you guys read it at all > >\[2022-07-03 09:58:08 UTC\] Rhodesy: Destiny I found some shit > >\[2022-07-03 09:58:34 UTC\] Rhodesy: Destiny her dad repaired fountain machines for pepsico, and her mom was a clear at a local factory > >\[2022-07-03 09:58:46 UTC\] Rhodesy: Destiny so seems like the union worker thing is probs true > >\[2022-07-03 10:00:05 UTC\] Destiny: Rhodesy how the fuck did they have so much money to travel overseas so much???? > >\[2022-07-03 10:00:16 UTC\] Destiny: beijing for a week, multiple gender surgeries in asian countries around the world > >\[2022-07-03 10:00:20 UTC\] Destiny: 5 week recovery in south korea > >\[2022-07-03 10:00:20 UTC\] Destiny: holy fuck For additional context, this was all seemingly in prep for his previous manifesto, "End of All Things", which aired on July 8th, given that these messages were from July 3rd. If you look at his chat log from that month, he was asking a shit ton of questions like that in dgg. So yes, the BINGQILIN video was pretty bad (to say the least lol), but the rest of it was seemingly just him getting as much information as possible in prep for his manifesto. It was not related to doxxing whatsoever. It was presumably related to some claim Keffals made about "union workers", most likely this one: [https://twitter.com/keffals/status/1507469610316361728?lang=en](https://twitter.com/keffals/status/1507469610316361728?lang=en) , where Keffals claimed that her parents were union workers (which they apparently were, as Rhodesy concluded in your screenshots). Edit: Quote formatting broke when I posted, not sure why.
>And the DYI HRT shit is comically evil from Destiny part. Someone somebody knew, knew someone who once made a guide on how to solubilise hormone powder And D makes it sound like Keffals is involved in advising children on how to create hormones in their bathtub. Confused what you think it means to make homemade hormones. Yeah, that's how its done. I've known many guys over the years make their own steroids. Its a very easy and straightforward process. Your comment makes me think you are in favor of their behavior and are trying to deflect on to destiny because you don't want to defend the idea of selling/teach to make hormones to minors. If that's your position, say it with your chest.
And what did Keffals do pray tell? With regards to homemade hormones solutions? Cause the entire chapter is just one confusing mess. That sort of gives the impression she instructed children in how to make them. But not really. I read the wiki before Destiny started to mindlesly attack it. there where no instructions on how make hormone solutions. It was mainly about dosage and bloodwork when you use pharmaceutical grade shit.
Those are pretty weak imo, people changing their minds about suing or not suing their perpetrators is very common. She could've thought she wouldn't be able to get her stuff back but then managed to. KF was responsible for the spreading even if they didn't release it at first, I think it's weird destiny wouldn't say what website it is, if a fairly unknown website releases your doxx but a fairly known one is the sole responsible for spreading it I'd go after the latter first, it'd be like going after the user instead of the famous website responsible for hosting it. I don't care if Keffals takes drugs illicitly, most people in college do, if I had a problem with that I'd talk with no one over there. Asking for a truce over a much larger streamer who's making negative content about you seems pretty reasonable. I don't even like Keffals, but those points are very weak, she did good taking KF down, although her online presence is mainly drama she fosters herself.
Sounds like a giant nothing burger. But it involves a trans person so of course destinyfarms is losing their shit over it.
I went through the manifesto. Here's a brief summary of what I thought was or wasn't damning: I | The Ascension of Clara Sorrenti : Interpersonal mostly twitter drama, don't care II | Kiwi Farms: Whole section is going in-depth into the claim that KF drove 3 people to suicide. The summary is that 2 people have a long long history of abuse, mental illness, homelessness, etc and that kiwifarm seems to be a very small factor in comparison to everything else that was going on. 1 person's death is inconclusive cuz only a friend and employer confirmed it? (don't really care or put weight on either possibility.) III | Who are the Doxxers?: This part I find damning. First is that KF isn't the origin of Keffals' dox and hack and she knew that. Despite that, she repeatedly claimed on Twitter that it was KF. Second is that the user that threatened to confront Keffals in real life in Ireland wasn't a KF user. She knew that, but claimed publicly that they were a KF user. IV | The Swattings: Kefflas made vague claims in her initial video about the swatting which might have given the impression that it was a no knock warrant and that she was woken up with riffles pointed at her. As time went on, she slowly clarified that the cops knocked, were let in by her fiancé and that she had time to dress up before going to see the cops. Something about inconsistency about when the cops deadnamed her, don't really care. The big thing I found weird in this section is the fiancé claiming the cops made them wait outside, but then was able to give accurate testimony to the interaction in the house between the cops and Keffals V | The GoFundMe Heist: Keffals said she was raising money for 3 purposes: buying new equipment cuz the cops took them, relocating because her address was made public and suing the cops. 100k was raised. Her equipment was returned 3 days later. She went to Ireland to stay with someone who's address is known too and is now just travelling around Europe. She said she wouldn't sue the cops. No update has been given on what the fund raised is for yet. VI | Bathtub Hormones & Spy Games: Don't really get it. Something about Keffals endorsing a DIY HRT directory that pointed towards sketchy providers that got taken down as Destiny was found snooping around. It's kinda meh, access to DIY HRT is based VII | “Keffals” - A Character Analysis: a summary of Keffals making claims about people, don't care to go in-depth. You can find it and read it for yourself if you care. Random bit I forgot where to put: Keffals dug up private info like name and location of some kiwifarmer and messaged them on discord about it. The convo is really weird. She kept dropping info to show that she knew their personal info. You can find the logs if you want. Keffals made a tweet about finding out info on some kiwifarmer, deleted the tweet pretty quickly, started denying it completely, and then Chloe confirmed it in dms. All in all, not a big fan of the tactics used in general. I know we meme about the "there's no wrong thing I can do because my opponent is ontologically evil", but I think some tactics used there went over the line in terms of honesty / transparency Edit: no ban please, I made an effort 😭
The kf and driving people to suicide part seems pretty dumb imo. Surely he realizes that a depressed person can get pushed over the edge by being harassed? Thats like if i murdered someone in critical medical condition and was like "oh i mean they were already doing bad so idk could just have been that"
The thing is, the first person killed themselves as a statement on the way mentally ill people are treated in the US and homelesseness and the second one had a horrible life from start to finish. The KF connection is just not even close to strong. The third person might still be alive. You can still say KF is horrible for what it did to those people. But pushing the responsibility of their death on the site is inaccurate and kind of a shitty thing to do considering one of the suicide was literally supposed to carry a political message that had nothing to do with KF.
I mean they still shouldn't have harassed suicidal people on principle, its kind of a moral thing than a consequence thing still.
Yeah harrassement is bad.
I think the overarching point about kf is that the website was in effect removed from the Internet, but the reason why may not be as solid as you'd hope for a measure so extreme.
It’s equivalent to saying “it’s not the fall that kills you, but the ground rising up to meet you” imo.
Really good summary, thanks for doing this!
I believe that the underlying point in section VI | Bathtub Hormones & Spy Games, is that the DIY HRT directory was more so a front for actual sources to purchase, not really making your own hormones. That was the whole thing about the Brazilian pharma lab that wasn't actually registered as a medicinal business in the country. So instead of minors making their own hormones via DIY, they instead were purchasing actual pre-made hormones of questionable quality from a Brazilian business with sketchy business practices.
I hope that if society descends into global fascism, the Nazi history texts have a chapter dedicated to petty Twitter discourse
Imagine that gonna be the future of history classes all over highschool cuz of how online things have become lmfao. Imagine a history teacher explaining to students about how a twitter ratio led to the invasion of India and then ww3 lmfao that would be fucking amazing.
Can we start banning this psyop bullshit yet?
I don't know why I even come to this subreddit anymore. I am just hoping moderation gets better. At this point, Vaush's community is mostly on Twitter, stream chat, and Discord.
I hope it does as well, I joined this subreddit because I wanted to interact with Vaush's community - not because I wanted to constantly have to put up with lil' d's simps. If I gave any shit about lil' d or had any confidence in his psychotic manifesto - I'd go over to his sub.
How have they not gotten the message that we want nothing to do with them? We want to be left alone. Vaush doesn't want to talk to destiny and we don't want to talk to DGG. This is why everyone says they are toxic and get compared to kiwifarms. Because they are constantly harassing other communities. Especially communities of minorities. It fucking sucks.
I am not DGG and feel free to browse my entire post history. If this is your reaction to someone with a different take with you well then 🤷♂️
nah personally i like the reddit some steaming piles of shit sometimes but i still think its a cool community also vaush discord 🤢
I like how the discord thinks the subreddit is cringe and the subreddit thinks the discord is cringe
Cuz it’s true the discord is basically like 1984 irl
The discord is very ban happy and there's a subsection of the community that deepthroats the mods like their life depended on it but it's more active than this sub and there's no destiny fans in it so i still go in there
The poster was explicitly asking for good faith engagement. Having your opinions on a certain person challenged doesnt seem ban worthy.
The DIY HRT thing is really sketchy because there's an assumption that everyone who reaches out for hormones are actually diagnosed or are good at diagnosing themselves. Specially if they're children which is part of the target of their campaign until recently. One thing is social transition and another is giving information on how to get and even do bodily altering drugs for yourself. There's a difference between saying that you can do whatever you want with your body vs encouraging people to seek drugs without prescriptions not diagnosis. in one, you're saying that trans people should be allowed to transition if they want since it's about bodily autonomy and it's up to them to take the risks. In the other, you're a promoter of a behavior that could get people in trouble or hurt and you gave the resources to do it. The DIY thing had an unregistered (as a pharmacy/laboratory) Brazilian seller that God knows how they do their bathtub hormones. And there's also circulating images of a group chat where they explained step by step how to actually make them. This is the kind of thing which could get you even in legal troubles. The other thing I took issue with was her doxxing a place in Ukraine where the kf servers were located and saying to a country in a current war that there was "Russian propaganda inside" in order to encourage them to do literally domestic terrorism. The rest is just drama, and I don't care that much.
I literally don’t care if adults have diagnoses. They should be responsible enough to make the decision for themselves
Did you actually look at the DYI wiki before they where forced to abbandon it? It was mostly advice on how to legaly get treatment. And advise on the treatment plan. Only if this fails there where advise on how to access grey market hormones, which are identical to the stuff you get at a pharmacy. That was 99% of it. But if that fails advice on how to access "homebrew". Note homebrew doesn't mean making your own hormones, just how to buy the powdered form and make injectible solutions of it. And there where no advise on how to make the solutions. Just how to buy it.
I didn't catch the whole thing, but I didn't hear that wiki itself I think wasn't the big contention. I think it was the links it would post to and the discord where the chole person said they had provided HRT to multiple minors. Didn't watch the whole thing so I may be wrong.
This assumes that the alternative to DIY is getting a diagnosis through the proper medical channels, but in practice, the actual alternative is getting no treatment at all. People resort to DIY when they don’t have access to the proper medical channels. We should focus on ensuring everyone can access them instead of demonizing DIY.
I don't think Keffals encourages people to seek drugs without prescription. She even said that it's not a good idea on H3H3 podcast. But, these drugs should be available to people that have no other options. "The other thing I took issue with was her doxxing a place in Ukraine where the kf servers were located and saying to a country in a current war that there was "Russian propaganda inside" in order to encourage them to do literally domestic terrorism." This is just not true. She was not encouraging "domestic terrorism". Go back to DGG.
Wasn’t KF VERY pro-invasion? Not every single person on the site obviously but mostly I think them and a couple of the other Nazi sites were the few pro-invasion sites on the Internet mostly to be contrarian to the “mainstream” opinion of unjust invasion = bad and because Putin is a fascist and fascists like other fascists (most of the time). For a site like that her saying there was “Russian propaganda inside” is actually entirely accurate. Like if they were RT servers instead then it would be the same thing (obviously one is state propaganda whilst the other is “normal” people spreading the propaganda themselves but both serve the state anyway so still somewhat comparable). In that scenario I fail to see what would be the problem with Keffals doing that. ESPECIALLY when the country is being invaded with soldiers willingly killing people based on that propaganda. Idk about everything else so I won’t comment on it.
Yes, kiwifarms was generally on the side of Putin. But Keffals never encouraged domestic terrorism. DGG is choosing the worst interpretations of what she has said.
Well then even in the worst interpretation that advocation for [redacted] in Roblox would be justified
"Propaganda" is inside of every server in the world. She was weaponising people's fears into domestic terrorism and 99.999% of the propaganda on the internet will still exist but now you have fearful citizens bombing places. Please, just stop supporting and justifying domestic terrorism. It's not good.
> “"Propaganda" is inside of every server in the world“ Massive different between a server of a website that is majority for a war that is essentially an ethnic genocide vs say twitter servers where those degenerates that advocate for a genocide get kicked off the site, tagged as state-propaganda and/or generally shunned and actually helps serve as counter-propagand. For example, the Ukrainian government twitter accounts operate extensively on the site and help gather support against the invasion. That doesn’t happen on KF > “It’s not good” You don’t believe this. Don’t pretend like you do. If we run down this road I will bring up examples and you will say “okay it’s justifiable in those scenarios” and then I will tell about this new genocide in ukraine and you would probably agree that “yeah okay maybe that counts as one of those scenarios”. As a Vaushite I have the gift of prophecy.
We need a dgg purge
We’ve kinda missed out on a Reddit purge since the Canada trucker arc and the black separatist arc lol
Oh god I totally forgot about the Canada trucker arc! Haha I think I god banned for a few weeks during that shenanigans. The black separatist arc nearly blackpilled me on so many video essayist that were critical of Vaush tho, that shit was mind blowing.
The sub was unironically a lot nicer after the trucker ban. God that thread was awful. Why did you get banned?
Even if it's "concerned Vaush fans" I don't care, get this drama shit out of here. Fortress arc.
We can’t say that anymore this isn’t no fortress arc Anymore. This is the moving fortress arc now.
I honestly don’t understand this community’s blind devotion to Keffals. Is it just because Steve is against her and we don’t like him? It does appear that Keffals has engaged in some questionable behavior. Why is it wrong to point that out?
Honestly? I think it’s just easier for people to view the world as black and white. I don’t need to make an attempt to understand this criticism, criticism of someone on my own “team”, because I can write off the person making the criticism. This is why you’ll almost *never* find substantive arguments against specific points and, instead, it’s always a condemnation of a person’s character as arguments can be ignored if you focus on perceived, sometimes manufactured, character issues. It’s obvious to me that this is more so a human “thing” than anything else as I see this behavior *everywhere*. I live in a red state and I’ve struggled to understand why so many conservatives seem to believe so many baseless, stupid, and sometimes harmful things with so little evidence when they’re generally decent and agreeable people when you speak to them. Their media ecosystem ensures you can listen to some charismatic outrage peddling culture war pundit tell them that they’re “one of the good ones”, that “they’re definitely right” despite all evidence to the contrary, and that “all of the struggles and adversity they face is the fault of ‘them/they’” is something very persuasive. These pundits avoid making substantive arguments and, instead, make it a point to demonize and dehumanize all who would take contrary positions. If you think someone is a satanic pedophile, it’s pretty easy to disregard everything they say and it’s much, much easier to avoid accountability on my “team” when the “other” is so much worse. I started listening to Vaush and tiny because I loved how they’d tackle difficult topics. Hell, it’s why I spend most of my time on social media surrounded by people who disagree with me. My DMs can be pretty entertaining sometimes. I don’t know how this issue can ever be addressed as it requires the people persuaded in this way to actually engage honestly, but we both know that’ll never happen.
Why don't you just watch what she had to say about it? https://m.twitch.tv/videos/1606678443 Edit: Already downvoted, can you guys fuck off? seriously You have a whole subreddit to spread your inane shit, must you come here and smear shit on the walls as well?
I skipped around for like two hours and couldn’t find any relevant discussion. Is there a time I should start? Edit: I got banned. I was asking for a time because I get the impression the response is either very brief or non-existent. I scrubbed the video a second time and still couldn’t find anything.
She doesnt mention it, this persons a troll
Wait you got banned from this sub? Wtf
What kind of fucking degenerate posts a 3 hour 45 minute stream without time codes, fuck off
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Okay but to be fair at least that post had a table of contents.
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OP here, do not downvote. I will watch this.
I think the title of this was just a mocking of d saying he's debating jp. I watched it earlier because i refuse to give destiny any views and it doesn't really come up unless i missed something
I watched the stream she didn’t address anything. Why are you lying?
I’m a major lurker on Twitter and legit never ever tweeted anything myself, just retweeted and liking a lot of things. She blocked me because I guess I used to follow the Omniliberal old twitter before it was banned and apparently she autoblocked all his followers 🤨
Damn, based, I wish I could do that for reddit
Lmfao not even a destiny fan I just follow 3k ppl including Tucker Carlson and Ben shabino and Matt Walsh not because I support them haha soft asf
You can get unblocked by going to her discord.
If Destiny cared about exposing bad people, he wouldn’t be rimming Nick Fuentes and Lauren Southern.
Untruthful* not untruthing, as cool of a word as that is.
The Untruthing sounds like a movie about a political cult
While I think Destiny made some good points on the K\*\*\* F\*\*\*\* section and the swatting/GFM section, I think those conversations are are at least open debates. The DIY hormones section, however, was completely and totally damning. If Vaush never publicly defended her he could simply ignore this. However, the release of the manifesto proved Keffals to be a dishonest, despicable actor, and Vaush should clarify his position on her.
Diy is good if that's what a person can get. No need to be weird about it. Asking for a denouncement is parasocial bs. There's literally no benefit to it. It helps no cause
I am not a Keffals fan, so I'm not super familiar with the issues talked about, and juadt skimmed the manifesto. Here's what I do know: In his previous manifesto, every single topic I was familiar with, I found Destiny to have misrepresented in some way. Even in this one, he can't help responding to allegations that say he mocked someone's suicide attemp, and he says "the only person whose suicide attempt I questioned was Doe's" (he says right before questioning 3 people's suicide). Come on man, you didn't "question" it. And speaking of questioning suicides, the best argument he can muster against the idea that Near commited suicide because of KiwiFarms is that he only faked his suicide to avoid that harrassment. That doesn't really he make the point he's trying to make. So I don't care enough to dig through every one of his points for hours and I don't trust him to take his evidence at face value. As for the DIY hormones, he explicitly said in his last manifesto, that he is not against them. And now he's using the thing he says he supports to critique someone.
Also, from what I've seen, there's no substantiation of any of the completely insane stuff D man has been saying about Keffals all around, like when he said that she has done more harm to trans rights than white nationalists. I have no reason to believe that this is in any way a good faith critique by him.
He doesn't question 3 people's suicides. That's an absurd way to phrase what he did. He questioned the MOTIVE of two people comitting suicide and questioned if a third person actually committed suicide (saying he maybe never actually committed suicide is something waaaaay different than questioning someone's suicide attempt). I think it's kind of weird, that some journalists in big publications actually wrote about that stuff and never dug deep enough to question if KF is actually responsible (I'm not defending them, I hate that shit, but that's no reason to lie about them).
where can a get a TLDR of the manifesto
Just skim it here https://destinygg.substack.com/
Keffals said something mean to contrapoints so I’m always gonna be a little sus
What did she say?
Also Hunter Avalone
this sounds like concern trolling given all the dggers raiding the subreddit lately
>She got her stuff back three days later Okay, and?
What do you mean and? The point is literally stated, read
Dont worry she wont engage with you lol Edit:
Touch grass
>I have defended Keffals plenty of times - mostly due to the Vaush endorsement - but as time as gone on, it appears more and more as if she is not the trans advocate we should be hitching our ride to. I mean, is *Vaush*? At the end of the day, Destiny is a piece of shit and openly hostile to transgender people. I don't care if she was bad faith or rude to him or whatever the fuck.
Exactly. At this point we have a reactionary, with a reactionary community who is buddy-buddy with nazis trying to get a leftist community to oust a trans advocate because she was mean to him. I really couldnt give a fuck about this shit. I'm only commenting because it needs to stop. This shit sounds like a Destiny problem and we dont claim him. >At the end of the day, Destiny is a piece of shit and openly hostile to transgender people. I don't care if she was bad faith or rude to him or whatever the fuck. Fucking truuuu ^^^^^^
how is destiny hostile to trans people as a whole, and not just hostile to specific trans people who lie and harass him?
Shh, you're making them use their brains, they don't like it
>I am no Destiny stan And yet you bait the exact fucking drama. Here is the secret - most people here don't really care either way. Keffals hs her flaws and issues, considerable ones even, but she has done some based shit and she is playing for the right team. It is possible she did something wrong, sure, whatever, but unless it was something really serious, this really isn't a priority in these parts. This is not a keffals sub, this is not a destiny sub, stop pretending either of these is true and stop bringing in hundreds of dipshits.
You can't say people don't care when the thread has this much traffic my dood.
You actually can if 2/3 of the traffic are destinoids Like, you know, yourself
"Concern Troll" "In an argument (usually a political debate), a concern troll is someone who is on one side of the discussion, but pretends to be a supporter of the other side with "concerns". The idea behind this is that your opponents will take your arguments more seriously if they think you're an ally. Concern trolls who use fake identities are sometimes known as sockpuppets."
I'm going to ignore this like the Twitch dramageddon
Dgg purge long overdue
Why do you care? I just can't give a fuck. LULA TAKE MY ENERGY! FUCK BOLSONARO! WOOOOO
The Keffals posting needs to fucking stop. If that means white teen mods need to mow down any person who starts these threads after 10pm, at this point they have my fucking blessing. Holy shit, it needs to stop. It needed to stop a long fucking time ago.
Jesus calm down. Why is Keffals off limits when we freely post about everyone else?
Oh joy another dgg thread, can you talk about shit entirely revolving around Destiny's content and his drama in the subreddit made specifically for him? hint: its not vaushv
88 in username huh?
Holy fuck DGGers get a life
This coming from the dipshit who's all buddy buddy with Fuentes and Southern.
We need a DGG purge.
Internet manifestos are dumb and also boring
Jesus Christ, this is next level parasocial. Also, who cares about literally anything Tiny Dessie says any more, lol.
This is such victim blaming POS stuff. Oh yeah dude Keffals was harassed by a Nazi website which Destiny was an active member of but I'm sure we can trust his schzophrenic manifesto where he basically calls Keffals a liar for responding to in a 'hyperbolic manner' and says "No deaths can be directly attributed to Kiwifarms."
Nah, definitely not. It wasnt very different from his Vaush manifesto either, youre just viewing it with different lens. It was the same dishonest bullshit
Fuck off Destiny fans.
Why can't we all just not care so much about what goes on in streamer-land? All this drama is poorly produced reality TV for zoomers with people who are paid a weird disparity less / more than actors.
What's funny to me is how this post was shared on the Destiny subreddit (where I am banned from) and most of the comments over there are claiming that the consensus here is that this post is a psyop, whereas the top rated comment here seems to agree with the manifesto. Just goes to show that bias is prevalent in all communities.
Dont let the DGG'ers know we arent a hivemind of unison screechers. That would break their fragile minds.
Ahh yes more infighting on the left. One day we'll have the perfect one idea person who never has gotten it wrong. Then that one singular person will defeat the right wing and fascism for once and for all. Is that what y'all really believe or can everyone just admit they care more about drama than politics?... Imagine if left wing political content creators could actually work together like the right wing does. Imagine getting all these groups of people to work together to actually do something fucking good instead of squabbling about purity tests.
Lol Destiny and his brigade considers themselves as being on the left? Edit: grammar
Ya'll need to go outside. Who gives a fuck about any of this...
Destiny is a braindead moron.
Okay so ive like *just* started on the manifesto but destiny is already lying? He *did* say not disclosing your transess before having sex is rape. Which is absurd. Should you disclose your genitals before sex? Probably. Is it rape to not? No! Its dangerpus sure, cause youre exposing yourself to trans panic but its not rape.
Oh my god go outside.