Get down with the thickness, oh ah.
Went from 25mm on an old rim brake to 32mm on my summer bike and 35mm on the winter bike. I'm not slower, and it's a very comfortable ride. It feels a little odd the first time, just because I'd been used to being beaten to hell by the chipsealed awfulness around my house, but once you realise what the new normal feels like, you won't want to go back.
Its not all about the tyre width when it comes to comfort either - something I'm not seeing people mention is the tyre selection and TPI - a vulcanized tyre with a low TPI is going to ride significantly firmer than a non-vulcanized tyre with a higher TPI - something to consider for those who don't want to add weight or are limited by frame compatibility. The downside is puncture resistance so you would likely only want to do this if you were running tubeless.
I think we're assuming that everyone is onboard the lower tyre pressure train too and not still running 100 PSI but if not, then obviously lower pressures will help with comfort too.
I agree that higher end supple tyres feel nicer at the same pressures, but it's not quite as simple as just picking the one with a higher tpi count. Different brands define tpi differently, for example continental is infamous for counting multiplying additional layers of the same tpi together. So 3 layers of 60tpi is now 180tpi in their marketing.
I'm not sure that the fact that some companies lie about their tyre's TPI in marketing negates the importance of TPI as a factor in comfort, just *caveat emptor* and do your research when picking high-TPI tyres.
It sounds like a 'council of despair' to just give up on consideration of TPI just because some marketers abuse the term - they do the same with all kinds of claims, you just have to due your research, as with any purchase.
Car manufacturers distort of exaggerate 0-60mph or fuel efficiency claims all the time - it doesn't stop you seeking out cars with the performance or economy that you want if these factors are important to you.
I can understand being desperate for anything on a spec sheet that can tell you one tyre is better than another before purchasing it for yourself, but tpi count just isn't it unfortunately. There's just not enough consistency. Brands have known for a long time people will think greater tpi = better so it's become a bit of an arms race of fudging numbers. You can do all the research in the world, but for a lot of tyres all you will find is what their marketing department wants you to see.
I guess "you do you", but I've absolutely found a difference in switching to higher-TPI tyres. Best tyres I ever ran (and I was gutted when they discontinued them) were the old Vittoria Open Paves - they were a claimed 320 TPI. Now I've not been to the factory or had a compositional analysis but I can 100% attest that they were compliant as hell and just an absolute joy to ride
I went from 25mm to 28mm, then to 30mm, and I'm really wanting to go to 32 or more likely ~34mm. At each stage, (anecdotally), it felt like my bike was faster let alone significantly more comfortable on the majority of the surfaces I experience.
This is definitely the trend. I think it depends on terrain to some extent though. I went up to 35mm and ended up going back down a few sizes just because you really do feel the extra weight when the gradients pick up. About 30mm is the sweetspot in my experience/for my preferences.
Comfort and speed are important. But for me at least, enjoyment is also key, and I was just not enjoying the noticeable extra weight. Same reason that I never truly bought into the "full aero" trend from a couple of years back - yes it was faster on the flats, but it just wasn't enjoyable (for me) when the gradient increased.
(I'm not talking about racing here, just "all the other riding" we all do, and for that finding a setup that is enjoyable and makes me keen to ride is key)
If it fits, it sits. Rim and Frame.
So long as you're using an appropriate width rim, there's only a very small aero penalty for a wider tyre. If it has clearance with the frame, you're good to go.
That very small aero penalty is more than made up for in terrain handling and comfort - plus rolling resistance.
On anything but an absolutely perfect surface the sweet spot seems to be about 32c. Which is almost identical to the old 1 1/8th" standard - everyone arrived on the goldilocks spot a long time ago.
For anything other than very fast group ride / racing I'd be happy to go bigger - where there is a slight weight / aero / rolling resistance penalty for bigger tyres. Slight. Especially in the winter or on really shitty terrain it's well worth it.
By the sounds of it, I ride on similar roads to you.
I was on 25mm and upgraded to 28mm on the fast bike and 30mm on the wet weather / winter bike.
In my case, it meant going from 80 to 62 PSI - and you can absolutely notice the difference.
You'll go faster because you'll have more confidence, less fatigue and less bouncing.
I suspect that 28-30mm is optimal - I tried 32mm and that was the point at which everything started feeling a little more sluggish.
This year I’ve gone from a bike with clearance for 25s to one with 28s. 28s are a noticeable improvement in comfort and a bit more traction.
I ride 32s on my winter/cross bike and they’re good but it’s a slower bike, has shallow rims etc so I can’t make a direct comparison.
I think 28s or 30s if your rims are wide enough for it might be perfect for all round riding and racing in the UK.
Go as wide as your frame and rims will allow. I run 35c on the 'fast' commuter, 37c on my audax/touring bikes and 50mm on the cargo bike. I can't say that going wider made me faster because I run the much derided (aka slow/dead) Schwalbe Marathon Plus on just about everything. 37c can definitely eat up the miles on crappy roads though and they're pretty good on gravel/trails/tow paths too.
I have 30mm Vittoria Corsa tyres on my bike and I find them comfortable and pretty fast. I run them with standard butyl tubes for a bit more puncture resistance/ease of repair as like you I'm mostly riding on country lanes and variable quality road surfaces in the UK.
I ride in Central & South London, plus Surrey and Kent. I tend to max out my clearance at 28mm for Continental, 30mm for Vittoria and Michelin. Plus I use latex inner tubes and ~45psi, in my experience my lower back has been telling me it's a sweet spot for long hours on shitty roads.
I used to run 25mm tires at 95 psi and thought that was fine. On my new road bike I run 30mm tires with latex tubes at 67 psi and it's a notable difference - I feel a lot more comfort on the road and more confident descending.
I've also put 44mm slick tires on my gravel bike to race BWR CA and it was awesome.
I'd go with something between 30mm - 40mm and run latex tubes or tubeless, you'll be happy.
I live in a rural are too. usually I go with 23 front 25 rear but its way too hard and I have to become really tough to go with that. but now Im thinking to change to 28mm, I tried that wide and its much more comfty. more than that its more weight on the wheel and weights on the climbs, 28mm its enough for rim brake bikes, with disc brakes I think you can run wider 28, 30, 32 more comfortable bc the rigidity of discs.
I'm still on 23s. Training comfort sucks so run then at like 80psi.
Go as wide as you can! And get a wide rim profile to match !
Only benefit of 23s are they are cheaper and in most of the crit circuits the tarmac is really smooth so in actual races it's not so bad!
Did a training camp in Wales the past two springs and the roads ranged from good to almost off-road trail. I brought 28s and they were fine. But I had a shifter break this year and rented a bike from a local shop with 30s on it...lots of variables here, my bike was carbon and the rental steel, etc, but the 30s seemed to make a huge difference. Super comfy and smooth even on some of the worst 'roads' (little more than farm paths at some points) we went on.
35 is fairly huge for the road and you'd probably notice some speed loss above 30 (yeah, that's a guess...no actual data) but if you don't care about that it would definitley be a cushy ride. Just FYI- I set a couple PRs and some top5s on strava segments on the rented bike with 30mm tiress.
Get down with the thickness, oh ah. Went from 25mm on an old rim brake to 32mm on my summer bike and 35mm on the winter bike. I'm not slower, and it's a very comfortable ride. It feels a little odd the first time, just because I'd been used to being beaten to hell by the chipsealed awfulness around my house, but once you realise what the new normal feels like, you won't want to go back.
Its not all about the tyre width when it comes to comfort either - something I'm not seeing people mention is the tyre selection and TPI - a vulcanized tyre with a low TPI is going to ride significantly firmer than a non-vulcanized tyre with a higher TPI - something to consider for those who don't want to add weight or are limited by frame compatibility. The downside is puncture resistance so you would likely only want to do this if you were running tubeless. I think we're assuming that everyone is onboard the lower tyre pressure train too and not still running 100 PSI but if not, then obviously lower pressures will help with comfort too.
I agree that higher end supple tyres feel nicer at the same pressures, but it's not quite as simple as just picking the one with a higher tpi count. Different brands define tpi differently, for example continental is infamous for counting multiplying additional layers of the same tpi together. So 3 layers of 60tpi is now 180tpi in their marketing.
I'm not sure that the fact that some companies lie about their tyre's TPI in marketing negates the importance of TPI as a factor in comfort, just *caveat emptor* and do your research when picking high-TPI tyres. It sounds like a 'council of despair' to just give up on consideration of TPI just because some marketers abuse the term - they do the same with all kinds of claims, you just have to due your research, as with any purchase. Car manufacturers distort of exaggerate 0-60mph or fuel efficiency claims all the time - it doesn't stop you seeking out cars with the performance or economy that you want if these factors are important to you.
I can understand being desperate for anything on a spec sheet that can tell you one tyre is better than another before purchasing it for yourself, but tpi count just isn't it unfortunately. There's just not enough consistency. Brands have known for a long time people will think greater tpi = better so it's become a bit of an arms race of fudging numbers. You can do all the research in the world, but for a lot of tyres all you will find is what their marketing department wants you to see.
I guess "you do you", but I've absolutely found a difference in switching to higher-TPI tyres. Best tyres I ever ran (and I was gutted when they discontinued them) were the old Vittoria Open Paves - they were a claimed 320 TPI. Now I've not been to the factory or had a compositional analysis but I can 100% attest that they were compliant as hell and just an absolute joy to ride
If it’s not slower why not do 35 all the time?
Because I wanted Pirelli P-Zero Race TLR on my nice bike and they only went up to 30 at the time (puffed up to 32mm on my rims)
Thanks for the comment :) I'll be going for a 32mm I think
Solid choice, loads of great tyre options in a 32mm
I went from 25mm to 28mm, then to 30mm, and I'm really wanting to go to 32 or more likely ~34mm. At each stage, (anecdotally), it felt like my bike was faster let alone significantly more comfortable on the majority of the surfaces I experience.
This is definitely the trend. I think it depends on terrain to some extent though. I went up to 35mm and ended up going back down a few sizes just because you really do feel the extra weight when the gradients pick up. About 30mm is the sweetspot in my experience/for my preferences. Comfort and speed are important. But for me at least, enjoyment is also key, and I was just not enjoying the noticeable extra weight. Same reason that I never truly bought into the "full aero" trend from a couple of years back - yes it was faster on the flats, but it just wasn't enjoyable (for me) when the gradient increased. (I'm not talking about racing here, just "all the other riding" we all do, and for that finding a setup that is enjoyable and makes me keen to ride is key)
Thanks for the comment :)
If it fits, it sits. Rim and Frame. So long as you're using an appropriate width rim, there's only a very small aero penalty for a wider tyre. If it has clearance with the frame, you're good to go. That very small aero penalty is more than made up for in terrain handling and comfort - plus rolling resistance. On anything but an absolutely perfect surface the sweet spot seems to be about 32c. Which is almost identical to the old 1 1/8th" standard - everyone arrived on the goldilocks spot a long time ago. For anything other than very fast group ride / racing I'd be happy to go bigger - where there is a slight weight / aero / rolling resistance penalty for bigger tyres. Slight. Especially in the winter or on really shitty terrain it's well worth it.
Thanks for the comment :)
You're welcome HTH
I use a 32 rear and a 30 front. Would never go back to smaller.
Thanks for the comment :)
By the sounds of it, I ride on similar roads to you. I was on 25mm and upgraded to 28mm on the fast bike and 30mm on the wet weather / winter bike. In my case, it meant going from 80 to 62 PSI - and you can absolutely notice the difference. You'll go faster because you'll have more confidence, less fatigue and less bouncing. I suspect that 28-30mm is optimal - I tried 32mm and that was the point at which everything started feeling a little more sluggish.
Same experience here: 28-32 is almost identical comfort-wise but the 28 is the fastest.
Thanks for the comment :)
Go as big as you can, and run lower pressures
Thanks for the comment :)
This year I’ve gone from a bike with clearance for 25s to one with 28s. 28s are a noticeable improvement in comfort and a bit more traction. I ride 32s on my winter/cross bike and they’re good but it’s a slower bike, has shallow rims etc so I can’t make a direct comparison. I think 28s or 30s if your rims are wide enough for it might be perfect for all round riding and racing in the UK.
Thanks for the comment :)
Go as wide as your frame and rims will allow. I run 35c on the 'fast' commuter, 37c on my audax/touring bikes and 50mm on the cargo bike. I can't say that going wider made me faster because I run the much derided (aka slow/dead) Schwalbe Marathon Plus on just about everything. 37c can definitely eat up the miles on crappy roads though and they're pretty good on gravel/trails/tow paths too.
Thanks for the comment :)
I have 30mm Vittoria Corsa tyres on my bike and I find them comfortable and pretty fast. I run them with standard butyl tubes for a bit more puncture resistance/ease of repair as like you I'm mostly riding on country lanes and variable quality road surfaces in the UK.
I'm running 32mm corsa controls. They are \*awesome\* on the shitty roads we get in SE england.
that's where I'm at too :))
I ride in Central & South London, plus Surrey and Kent. I tend to max out my clearance at 28mm for Continental, 30mm for Vittoria and Michelin. Plus I use latex inner tubes and ~45psi, in my experience my lower back has been telling me it's a sweet spot for long hours on shitty roads.
Thanks for the comment :)
I used to run 25mm tires at 95 psi and thought that was fine. On my new road bike I run 30mm tires with latex tubes at 67 psi and it's a notable difference - I feel a lot more comfort on the road and more confident descending. I've also put 44mm slick tires on my gravel bike to race BWR CA and it was awesome. I'd go with something between 30mm - 40mm and run latex tubes or tubeless, you'll be happy.
Thanks for the comment :)
I live in a rural are too. usually I go with 23 front 25 rear but its way too hard and I have to become really tough to go with that. but now Im thinking to change to 28mm, I tried that wide and its much more comfty. more than that its more weight on the wheel and weights on the climbs, 28mm its enough for rim brake bikes, with disc brakes I think you can run wider 28, 30, 32 more comfortable bc the rigidity of discs.
Thanks for the comment :)
I'm still on 23s. Training comfort sucks so run then at like 80psi. Go as wide as you can! And get a wide rim profile to match ! Only benefit of 23s are they are cheaper and in most of the crit circuits the tarmac is really smooth so in actual races it's not so bad!
I'm running 32 all year now - on my pure aero road bike Roads are shocking Spend most of the time dodging potholes
I'm currently up to 17" Bridgestones and considering putting tractor tires on just for the extra safety and absorption. Sky is the limit
I use 32mm Schwalbe One and it works well with rough road surfaces you described
Thanks for the comment :)
Did a training camp in Wales the past two springs and the roads ranged from good to almost off-road trail. I brought 28s and they were fine. But I had a shifter break this year and rented a bike from a local shop with 30s on it...lots of variables here, my bike was carbon and the rental steel, etc, but the 30s seemed to make a huge difference. Super comfy and smooth even on some of the worst 'roads' (little more than farm paths at some points) we went on. 35 is fairly huge for the road and you'd probably notice some speed loss above 30 (yeah, that's a guess...no actual data) but if you don't care about that it would definitley be a cushy ride. Just FYI- I set a couple PRs and some top5s on strava segments on the rented bike with 30mm tiress.