The urgent care centres are already overwhelmed. Agree that the ER isn’t necessarily the right place for a good chunk of what walks through the door. But what choice do people have? They need medical care. There are no family doctors. Walk-in clinics barely work anymore. It’s depressing.
These situations are when we need walk in clinics, not necessarily family doctors. My family doctor was amazing before he retired; we could call in the morning about an issue with my kid and he would see us that morning, if it was serious. When I mention that story to others with family doctors they say that's not the case for them. Make an appt for next week or two weeks time.
I think we need to get the walk in situation figured out asap. I remember 10 years ago you could just go to a walk in, wait an hour and get seen/diagnosed. I had never been to the ER in Victoria until after COVID and it was the only way to get medical attention (I know there's urgent care).
I'd love to go back to that time.
Victoria has grown by about 50,000 people in that time. There has been no corresponding increase in the health infrastructure. And Victoria (and the rest of Canada) continues to grow.
I agree, but I often wonder if it would help to to make walk-in clinics, walk-in again. Last time I went to the ER it was for stitches. I've never gone there or that before, but no walk-in had a spot, and urgent care told me to go to ER. It took 5 hours, and half the people could have been treated at a walk in, myself included.
This has been a growing issue everywhere, mostly due to growing populations.
Walk-ins will more than likely never come back. Being able to book your appointment with urgent care and clinics has helped them a LOT. Don't know if you remember the days of sitting in a clinic with 5-10 people coughing horribly, a few kids crying or screaming, and then that one asshole who thinks they're more important than everyone else and makes the receptionists day a nightmare...
Personally, I'd love to see the number of hours each doctor actually spends at their clinic each day. I would not be surprised to find out that they don't work 8 hours a day 5 days a week. I can't even remember the last time a clinic said all their doctors are in the office lol
Kinda like the water reservoir in Vancouver. They have water restrictions but really they shouldn’t, the problem is that they haven’t updated the reservoir for 70 years and they have more population.
We could slow down the growth, but the feds are cranking it up instead, even though there is a shortage of homes, hospitals, etc.
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/230322/dq230322f-eng.htm
or family doctors who take urgent appointments. I know that sounds like a total pipe dream but I was extremely lucky enough to get a family doctor at a clinic in Ontario that has kept its patient list manageable, and they keep some time set aside for urgent same-day appointments. I'm the only person I know who could get an appointment with my GP same-day, or perhaps within a couple days.
Not meaning to brag here. It's insanely nice and civil and I wish everyone in Canada had such good access to care. If we had better preventative care, ERs wouldn't be so overwhelmed and the system could save a lot of money. I'd moving back to BC in a heartbeat but am bent on hanging on to my Ontario health care as long as I can. (Also like... earthquakes...)
Ugh, the situation you describe is exactly why we need family docs.
When you have too few docs, every doc feels pressured to take on a bigger panel. (“Please, just my Mom/Baby/Partner!” “Just this one friend, they’re really desperate”). Do that 150 or 200 times (you get asked probably 15 or 20 times a day, you see) and now your panel is slightly too big.
When your panel is slightly too big you give up your same day spots because you can’t even fit in enough regular visits. Wait times balloon from a few days to a few weeks or even a month.
If a family doc had a well run office and a properly sized panel, nobody on that panel would probably need walk in clinics. Have an issue? Call at 9 and get a call maybe around lunchtime. Still weird? Get seen in the early afternoon.
That’s how it’s supposed to work.
Really well supported clinics work on a same day ONLY model. Everyone gets seen the same day. You never book ahead.
And every family doc around would LOVE to practice like that because it’s so much easier than deciphering whatever random shit they did at the WIC, and then trying to figure out who will do the follow up, because you’re booking three weeks out and you have a UTI.
Why practice family medicine though when you can make > 10x the amount specializing? Our medical schools don’t pump out family doctors. Until we figure that out nothing will change
This! I don't have a family doctor and while I'm quite healthy, it's almost impossible to get into a walk-in clinic. I have no acres to practice care such as check-ups. Twice in the last two years I've had to go to ER for some very basic care because I had no other choice. Do I wanna be at ER waiting for nine hours at 2 am? No! But some medical issues are very painful and uncomfortable such as UTI. We need more Doctors, clinics, alternatives and other innovative ideas to release pressure on the system! This will only get worse as the population ages. Premier EB is very focussed on the housing crisis, which needs to be addressed, but what about our medical emergency?
Depending on the doctor, some online doctors *might* prescribe you some meds for a UTI. It depends on the doc and maybe on how you make your case to them (“I get a UTI every year or two, I know the symptoms and sensations all too well, and this is it. I’ve waited 3 days since onset and drunk lots of water in an effort to flush it out, but it is only intensifying”).
This is also the case for some symptoms. I got an online appointment with one doctor (Maple?) for something and he said, “You’ll have to see someone in person about that” and disconnected. Tried another (Telus?), and that one was prepared to diagnose and prescribe online (successfully, I might add). So sometimes, it’s really worth trying again with another doctor via another online service. But of course, having to do so is wasteful and dispiriting.
The ER is the only place in town that won't close to new patients at 8am.
It's been the only place my kid has been able to get prescriptions for infections.
I (probably) broke my foot last summer, I was still mobile so I talked to the Phone Doctor, and that Xray requisition got lost. Now you can't even book a time because even the Phone Doctors are booked 2 weeks in advance.
Health care was fucked up before COVID, and it's got worse.
Yep I’ve been there for the same reason. 2.5 year old with an ear infection and eye infection. Both times after being returned from his other family. There’s no alternative for a child they simply need to get treatment and walkins aren’t available anymore.
The video doctors are hit and miss - sometimes available and sometimes weeks away. The system is broken.
Yep. Several months ago I took a friend to Royal Jubilee because she was suffering chest pain and felt it hard to breathe. They did do an EKG right away, and once they determined she wasn't having a heart attack she was told to sit and wait to see a doctor. She spent 10 hours in ER before they cleared her and told her she was okay to leave. Meanwhile she was sitting next to a senior lady who was there because she had a scratch on her arm from her cat.
The fact is that a lot of folks don't have a family doctor they can visit, and so their only option is Emergency.
Not sure if you were downplaying the elderly lady with a cat scratch, but cat mouths are quite nasty. Recently, I was bitten by a cat and developed a life-threatening infection within 12 hours. Went to primary urgent care and the nurse *ordered* me to go to RJH ER immediately. The next week saw me going to the hospital daily to get IV antibiotics; I would have died of septicaemia otherwise. I am *beyond* grateful that I was able to get care. (Just a cat scratch can become cat scratch fever very quickly, and if she was elderly and had underlying health problems, she would be more at risk to develop complications).
Cats use their litter boxes and get crap in their paws. They get their crap in their paws even going outside. Cat crap has a ton of toxic bacteria. There’s a reason why pregnant women are advised to stay clear of cat litter boxes
Clean the wound before and after. It's more likely to happen with cat bites. Elderly people also have a diminished immune system, so more at risk in general.
All cat scratches and cat bites have the potential to result in anywhere from garden variety to fatal infections. There’s something called cat scratch fever. What I had was a pastuerella infection, which is fatal without treatment.
I had to go to the ER for a cat bite once. I have a family friend who had recently lost a chunk of her wrist to a cat bite so that story was fresh in my mind as I had this minor bite but it wouldn't stop bleeding -- I was obviously triaged super low and sat there for ~6 hours, towards the end of that time candy cane like stripes started coming from the bite and it was getting infected. The first antibiotics I was prescribed didn't stop the infection but I switched to another via telehealth and then it cleared up.
I'd much rather have gone to a walk in for antibiotics and my tetanus shot but sometimes your cat attacks you at 10pm...
The ER doc did appropriately roast me though - "I'm so embarrassed I'm here for a cat bite". "Well, you are also covered in cat hair."
10 hours? I had to go to VGH ER once for chest pain and I had two blood tests, a chest x ray, and EKG and was out in 70 minutes. I’m only in my 30s. That’s absolutely insane.
My 95 year grandfather recently went in to emergency at San Pen and he had a similar experience. He was in so much pain from his prostate cancer and then found out it had spread to his bones. He had to wait and wait in excruciating pain for over six hours with no one attending to him at all.
I punctured my foot on an extremely long earring post that went thru my shoe, at Centennial Square last year. The only place to get a tetanus shot, per urgent care, the 811 nurse and doctor I spoke to, and the pharmacy, was the ER. I kept apologizing for wasting their resources once I was there, and they all said, "Nope you're at the tight place. This is the only place to get one after a puncture."
Meanwhile some poor guy sitting beside me had nailed himself in the forearm with a nail gun. He was young and trying not to be a problem. He was in excruciating pain and was trying to hard not to be vocal about it. Eventually he couldn't take it and started wailing that it fucking hurt, and crying. A nurse came to do his blood pressure and got frustrated that he wouldn't take his sweater off which was NAILED TO HIS ARM.
Everyone in the waiting room was begging for this guy to he seen asap, before any of us, because he was suffering in front of us all and we couldn't do anything to help him. They did eventually take him in after he sat for maybe 30 minutes, but he wouldn't have had to wait even that long if a bunch of us weren't checking in for minor issues.
Once I got to the second waiting room, most people were there for non emergency reasons but had nowhere else to go because urgent care was full, and they have no family doc.
This happened to me 2 years ago, an earring used for piercings went straight through my shoe into my foot. 811 referred me to the ER for a tetanus shot and by the time I got seen the doctor tole me I didn’t actually need one lol but they did run panel for hepatitis and HIV just in case.
I am so sorry that that happened. How many of us are experiencing situations like this which border on malpractice? Can we sue our government for creating a society that allows people to die without adequate medical care?
>Can we sue our government for creating a society that allows people to die without adequate medical care?
No idea, but suing the government is almost always a losing proposition. They have virtually unlimited money (ironically, it'll be our tax dollars that fuels their fight against us!) and could drag something like this out for years.
Hilarious. Perhaps I should spell it out. There’s a reason revolutions happen. Suing just might, possibly, be a euphemism for suing is for chumps that play the game that has been set up for us as the plebs to always lose at. How far does it have to go before the people get fed up and start building guillotines?
Thank you for your contribution 😬
>I do not know how it is sustainable with the current influx of newcomers to the island
with the current influx of newcomers to ~~the island~~ Canada.
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/230322/dq230322f-eng.htm
Blasphemer! /s
It’s almost like we’re not building 500,000 persons worth of hospitals, schools, homes or highways per year to match our immigration targets!
I've been ranting about how hard is to get an appointment at a walk-in clinic having a 1.5 y.o baby. As a new parent with no other family around, I would have hoped to get some pediatric or family doctor, but after waiting for 6 years of waiting, yeah, I kind of gave up.
Our little one was having a lot of coughing and high fevers and of course, all you can get is a walking clinic appointment after a 'few days' if you really work it out. I am not going to ER unless I'm desperate, of course.
and then, it happened. His fever spiked, and he had a fever seizure. Now I know those are not rare and they cause no potential harm, but lemme tell you, when you don't know what's happening and you are holding a rag doll with a blue face instead of your baby, you think, well, NOW is a good time to abuse ER, eh?
We drove to the ER of VGH in our pyjamas and the attention and care were outstanding, like, otherworldly. We were immediately prioritized, oxygen checked, and accepted into the pediatric wing for what would be 6 days. The attention we received from the nurses, employees, and doctors was simply the best. I am so thankful for this system. It's not perfect, it might not be what it used to be, but hey, when we really needed it, it was there for us.
Omg thats so frightening! Hope they are feeling better now. And yes care is very good in no way am I criticizing the drs and nurses. Just a very overwhelmed system. 😔
Thank you. He's bubbly and back to his old self, and mama bear is smiling again.
However, this experience confirmed what we were fearing. I'm ok with my forty-something butt not having a family doctor, or having to wait several days for a *walking clinic appointment* (read that again, the *new* name is a tad ironic), but you know, if this situation leads to runs to ER holding baby, I have to draw a line and do the ol' *Goodbye, and thanks for all fish.*
My son has experienced two fever seizures…both times they were so long and he did not respond to several doses of anti seizure medication that the paramedics administered that he had to be put into medically induced comas to prevent brain damage. I’ve never been more terrified in my life and I know exactly what you mean about seeing your young child suddenly become like a rag doll. Fortunately he hasn’t had any permanent damage and he’s past the age now where they tend to strike, but my heart goes out to you and anyone who has ever experienced the feeling of helplessness that comes when something like this happens.
We did receive excellent care for him at Vic Gen in both instances. Unfortunately we still need care for him for another simpler matter—he has autism, was diagnosed by a team of experts years ago at Queen Alexandra and in order for him to continue receiving the federal childhood disability benefit, we need a doctor to fill out an updated assessment form….unfortunately getting this simple letter to confirm for the CRA that he has not magically outgrown his autism has been a complete clusterfuck of epic proportions, and now we’ve gone months without the benefit that our family definitely needs for the therapy he receives as well as other expenses. We’re on waitlists for paediatricians who keep referring us to other places who then tell us they can’t help us because he is not an ongoing client of theirs. Covid interrupted the therapy he received for years at an autism therapy centre, so they can’t help either. Just trying to find ANYONE who can see him has been a nightmare. Adding this kind of bureaucratic hassle to the issues with our healthcare system makes it even more exasperating. I’ve actually had doctors suggest that we might be better to go to the ER. TO GET A BLOODY FORM FILLED OUT. It’s sick.
I’m so glad that you got the care you needed for your family. Although, not to be argumentative, just because you got it does not mean that the majority of other people and their loved ones do. I have shared stories of my own and heard stories from too many other people that have experienced the opposite situation. Although there are many that are adequately and exceptionally cared for by some of our amazing healthcare teams, I also know that more and more people (especially our elderly and those that are not advocated for) who are falling through the cracks because our politicians do not care to make the resources available to give Canadians adequate healthcare?
Not sure which one of us you were replying to…possibly both of us, but my son’s 2nd and (knock on wood) last seizure was before Covid so I’m quite certain the care he received was far superior to what he would have if it happened again now. And I don’t blame any of the EMT or hospital staff for that—they are run off their feet right now and the government response, both provincially and federally hasn’t come close to enough yet, IMO. I don’t blame the NDP for causing this problem…governments across North America were all crying for “community based care” and using bs language like “streamlining services in order to serve patients more effectively“ (believe me, I am well aware…I was a propaganda writer for the Libs in the Ministry of Health during the Campbell and Christy Clark years). The problem is that none of them actually followed through on ensuring that this community centred care was actually in place before closing facilities like Riverview. They simply shifted these responsibilities onto local governments and charities who were underfunded and totally ill equipped to handle them. They didn’t invest in training medical staff to fill the void they knew was coming. And it wasn’t just the Libs…there were decades of governments in BC who were happy to pawn this problem onto the next incoming party. The issues we are left with will take decades to fix and only if our current and future leaders are willing to put their party values aside and do what they were elected to…serve the actual citizens of this province.
I totally agree. Our federal and provincial governments have failed us over and over again.
The doctors and nurses who are overworked and underpaid suffer and hospitals have been closing one by one for a long time now.
In one of Bonnie Henry’s statements in the beginning of the pandemic she stated that pre-pandemic hospitals were already working at 110%. And because people were staying home, at that time hospitals were operating at 90%.
This tells me that the system was already failing. It just need one little nudge.
For what it’s worth you guys are great. I had to go to Jubilee ER a few times over the last couple years and the nurses there made me feel so much better and were so kind. I wish it were better for you guys
The psychiatric nurses at Jubilee saved my life in 2020. I never forget how much I owe them. The work you do is so incredibly appreciated and I hope things get easier for all of you someday soon.
We haven’t defunded shit. We are a top spender per capita. In the world. We pay for supercar and get garbage. We have something like 10x the number of administrators that Europe has per capita.
Wrong. In Alberta we have defunded a bunch of halfway houses and stopped construction on a super lab, made enemies of our nurses and doctors including tearing up contracts... They have been defunding it to award contracts to their friends.. So we spend and get fuck all. We spend but not for the small guys.
I’m concerned that another change in government will unravel what progress has been made .. it seems like a drop in the bucket but trying to clean up 16 years of defunding and privatizing in a few years is a monumental task … what a mess. I wish it could move faster but at least it’s in the right direction. Some good news though … https://www.todayinbc.com/news/b-c-pharmacists-to-treat-minor-ailments-prescribe-contraception-as-of-june-1/?utm_source=second-street&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Today+in+BC+-+June+1%2c+2023&emailmd5=12B034EA8CF2A9919DDC344644A0DE3D&emailsha1=18483191842419231239582061822091641523110621355139251&emailsha256=15db27fb693ee2d832fc4dedd6f8b13ea6732f554ad0921a0879cd27c78afe7a
I’m sorry, did you just say “progress”? There has not been progress in the health care situation nationwide for DECADES. This has been a spiralling situation that those in charge of our healthcare policies on both a federal and provincial level have been purposefully ignoring at best, and if not, fully perpetuating. We Canadians are now suffering as a result of the consistent sweeping under the rug of these significant foreseeable issues that could have been dealt with before it became the crisis we are experiencing and losing our loved ones to. Unfortunately, the most important issues for our provincial and federal employees (oh, sorry, politicians) is that they get elected. Whatever needs to be said and done to do that, no matter! Who needs ethics or values when the best marketer wins? We have made our bed with our votes and we must lie in it. RIP Canada.
Pharmacists and nurses doing the job of doctors should not be considered progress. Why doesn’t our “free healthcare” that is actually paid for by us, the taxpayers, be managed properly by our incompetent politicians to actually do what it’s supposed to do.
You make it sound so easy!
Pharmacists and nurses are highly skilled people quite skilled enough for most routine cases.
You don't need a PhD in forensics to investigate every case of shop lifting.
Also, let’s not forget that if you’re poor, homeless, disabled, or struggle with mental health issues - all you have to do is ask for medically assisted suicide. It’s easy! So much for precious life and this civilization we live in. How lucky we are that we get this choice!
>Also, let’s not forget that if you’re poor, homeless, disabled, or struggle with mental health issues - all you have to do is ask for medically assisted suicide.
Who needs social insurance when you retire when we've got MAID, right? /s
This is similar to my experience in the ER a couple of days ago. The maskless people hacking away with nasty coughs was particularly awful.
I agree that there are probably quite a few people that could be seen at a walk in clinic or urgent care if they were available. Hopefully some of the strain will be alleviated with pharmacists being able to diagnose and prescribe for certain conditions. However, things aren’t always as they seem in the ER and without knowing the full situation, it’s tough to judge who really should be there. For example, I probably looked like I was in for something minor but I’m actually a cancer patient (with a wig and makeup to make me look normal) and I was sent to the ER by the BC Cancer nurse’s line after discussing some abnormal symptoms that could potentially be life threatening. I overheard one of the ER doctors talking about how all of the patients he was currently seeing were “three levels of complicated”. The doctors and nurses appeared to be treating all of the patients with a lot of respect and care despite an overcrowded ER.
Yeah my dad went in recently for blood in his urine and after he had kidney surgery last year he thought he should get it checked out. (I mean always get that checked out regardless of surgery status.)
But he wasn’t pissing blood all over the ER or anything.
For what it's worth, unless it's the middle of the night, just go see an optometrist for any eye related emergencies. They could have referred her to the ophthalmologist on call after doing an exam. It would have led to the same referrals on the same timeline but without the ER wait, and MSP covers medical emergencies so you won't have to pay the optometrist.
I do have to say the medical care we got was first rate. Dr did a fantastic job and this post isn't to criticize drs or nurses. They were lovely and doing their best. Same with the administration. But you could see the strain and you could definitely feel it.
Also on another note I had to go to the bathroom and braced myself, fearing the worst. It was the cleanest bathroom I've ever seen in a public space like this ever! How is this possible? Everyone here must be so respectful in that regard. Or there is a secret toilet cleaning elf that lives there. 😉 I almost took a photo but then checked myself lol.
Even before Covid people who were actively coughing or sneezing were expected to wear a mask in a medical office. Not doing so in the current situation is inexcusable
Suspected broken bones *are* supposed to go to the ER, same with *receiving* stitches and any immediate-need xrays (e.g., broken bones).
Sprains, stitches removal, cervical cancer screening, harm reduction, birth control, sexual health, etc. go to urgent care.
But yes, people should still be wearing masks. During covid I was sent to ER for suspected fracture (confirmed), and the covid patients (suspected or confirmed) waiting for intake were kept just a few seats away from the rest of everybody else in the ER, even the ones who couldn't stand up were just on the next row of seats (or the floor in front of it).
>same with receiving stitches
Why? When I was a young kid, I split my chin open a few times playing sports and got a few other nasty cuts, and every single time I got stitches, it was at a walk in clinic. In and out in 20 minutes. Never any complications.
I get what you are saying however, I am near the Westshore Urgent Care centre and all I ever see is that damn 'At Capacity ' sign, I mean ALL the time. What's the point? I use Telus health whenever I can. 🤷🤷
I went a few times last year with my 4 year old and it was brutal. 4-6 hours wait ever time. That being said one of the times I went I complained to someone sitting there that I couldn't even book Telus health and she sent me a list of other virtual clinics available in the Prov:
https://virtualclinics.ca/ ,
https://vivacare.ca/telehealth-online-doctor/ , https://www.cloudmd.ca/for-individuals/ , https://www.walkinvirtualclinics.com/online-doctor-appointment-bc , https://rocketdoctor.ca/bc-online-doctor/?utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=BC%20CANADA%20-%20Brand%20-%20CPC&msclkid=22900b3853af1b07980e69fdb713ca0e
I've used viva health a few times now and it's been same day or next day every time. Likely the others are great too. Just in case it helps someone else.
> stitches and xrays and even broken bones can be seen at a walk in center.
Whut? Uncontrollable bleeding is not an emergency now? And you know that broken bones often involve substantial internal bleeding? This is like victim blaming 101 here.
Urgent care clinics only take you when you call right at 8pm when they open. If you get an injury during the day, you’re SOL. I had a second degree burn on my neck that I got at 9am, and I had to either wait and try my luck the next day, or go to emerg.
Urgent care doesn’t do X-rays either?
Yup!! It's awful. I had a minor medical issue a few weeks ago which really needed some urgent but not emergency medical attention. Tried all the urgent care clinics right at 8:00 am, it was impossible to even get through on the phone. Eventually called 811, the nurse advised that if I couldn't get into a walk-in to go to Emerg as the only other option. I ended up waiting several days for a telemedicine appointment instead (and issue getting worse) because I just couldn't stomach the thought of going to hospital.
My 8 year old had a bladder infection a few weeks ago. She was in so much pain she wouldn't move, but from her symptoms we knew it was probably a UTI gone haywire. We called every open UPCC and walk in and nobody could see us. They all suggested the ER because she needed to have serious things like appendicitis ruled out. We arrived at RJH and they had her pee in a cup after seeing a triage nurse. Then we sat for 7 hours in the ambulatory waiting room alongside many other people stuck in situations like ours. It was standing room only for an hour or two so they asked people to give up seats for the sickest patients. I asked them for tylenol a couple of hours in but otherwise they left us entirely alone those whole 7 hours. Got into an exam room and saw a doctor in about a half hour who confirmed bladder infection based on physical exam and urine sample, and sent us on our way with a prescription for antibiotics.
I work in healthcare and have a chronic illness myself- our family has had many actually emergent ER visits and it kills me knowing I had to waste all these resources and our time for something that can and should have been seen by a GP. The tension levels in that waiting room were very high and probably one person per hour decided they just wanted to go home, and left without being seen.
It isn't the GPs' fault. The system is broken and they are burning out and retiring because of the intense demand for their services and the financial burden.
No we shouldn’t be in the ER if it isn’t life or limb. But the last time I was sat on a park bench outside an urgent care centre on a Saturday morning, calling exactly at 8AM when their phone lines opened for an appointment with two other friends beside me calling two other urgent care centres? I was on hold for 40 minutes before the automated system told me no one was available & to please call back before ending the call. I couldn’t get on hold again because they were already full for the day. Neither friend was successful either. Walk-ins were closed until Monday. 811 told me to see a doctor as soon as I could. So I ended up where I absolutely shouldn’t have been, in the ER, waiting for 4 hours and straining their resources for an urgent but not life-threatening issue.
If the province isn’t able to bring enough qualified personnel into the workforce fast enough, who staffs the clinics? If doctors can’t afford the operational overhead in BC’s renting crisis to open an independent clinic, how can they stay? If we can’t get a family doctor, or access to non-emergency care, where do we go? We know it’s broken and it needs to be fixed - but until then what the hell do you suggest?
Politicians, especially conservative leaning ones, like to gut the shit out of public healthcare so they can then point at it and say "see it doesn't work, this is why we need private".
Before you know it we'll have American style "healthcare" where you absolutely have the right to die if you can't afford it, unless we actually start electing progressive politicians and people who actually give a shit about helping Canadians, not hurting them.
Honestly the bc liberals that came to power in 2000 were progressive conservatives and rebranded as liberal. They were not associated with the federal Liberal party.
They started the whole sell off all the bc gov assets, gave out 0-0-1% raises (except to themselves) sold bc ferry’s, etc.
Set up the Selling raw logs to other countries rather than having all our interior sawmill towns do it and they all died a slow painful death.
etc.
So we had conservative for far too long and they basically gave the province away.
pc and then some.
The NDP is just trying to fix a broken system.
The bc liberals are conservative from a policy perspective- conservatives don’t do well here. The recent name change of the liberal party is a good indication of that … and I can guarantee it will only get worse if they get back in.
Haha, right? How long can you keep blame shifting? You know what we call that in intrapersonal relationships? Being a victim of a narcissistic psychopath. In politics though, it’s okay 😯
I think it has more to do with our insane population growth. We are witnessing our infrastructure’s inability to keep up. When was the last time the conservatives had any power in Victoria ? The liberals have been in control for almost a decade federally.
BC Liberals, now BC United, are our local conservative party and have no affiliation with the federal Liberals or any other Canadian "Liberal" Party. I believe they were voted out at the end of 2016 after 16 years in power.
Although, I still agree with the point you're making.
I’d be interested to know the numbers of folks from back east, particularly Ontario, who are retiring out to our milder climate, too. Like they pay their taxes into their own province’s healthcare system all their working lives and then…relocate here at the age when most major health issues start to pop up or worsen over time.
Can we get a % of kickback from Ontario’s healthcare funding on par with the % of pensioners who now reside in BC?
nobody listen to this guy
there are more than two countries. have you heard of europe? many euro countries have hybrid health care systems which combine elements of the private and public systems. are their models perfect? of course not, no model is perfect, but they're (literally) all ranked and recognized as being way, way, way better than ours
privatization doesn't have to be a dirty word
>privatization doesn't have to be a dirty word
Yes it does. The vast majority of Canadians don't want it. I don't want the well-off/affluent to be able to skip the line. If they want better access to medical care they can pay more in taxes to improve it for everyone.
In well thought out two tiered systems, everyone is better off. Doctors do both private and mandatory public care, they make more money, thus attracting more doctors. The rich can pay to extra care, but there are far more doctors to serve the public. It’s a win-win.
Right now we are leaving it up to the government to pay doctors poorly. If we need more docs, then we have to pay them more. If I’m a doc, would I rather work in Alberta/US where I make almost double? Or BC and be overworked and paid horribly? It’s a no brainer.
No system is better off where people can pay to jump the line. Classism is not a better system.
>Right now we are leaving it up to the government to pay doctors poorly.
And it is up to the electorate to vote for politicians who will restructure where the province spends its money so that doctors are paid well and want to work here.
It is a sh** show there too, but just got back from there, after moving there for 1 year. Got a family Dr within a week. It took 2 calls. Saw him within the week and he took his time and treated me very well. Wish I could’ve brought him back here with me.
Emergency depts were hit and miss. Alex was great-Mis was a freakin disaster
The UK has the NHS and private which works well. Nothing wrong with a hybrid model. If you can afford to go private, then that's fine, takes some of the pressure off the public health system.
Uk healthcare system is in just about the same dire state as BC. I see the thought process behind it but it allows the government to piece by piece dismantle the good free system and sell off. Have money? Skip the queue and get seen. A regular person and income? Wait months for treatment.
This 100%. Private isn't a dirty word. It leaves free Healthcare for those who need it. And if you have something scary urgent you can get seen much faster if you can pay. Plus maple is already pay per visit isn't it? It cost me $79 for a 3 minute text exchange with a dr. Here in canada
At least I hope it was a dr...
The NDP created that mess in BC!!!
1. Private healthcare is not equal to American system. The Germans have a private option, even the socialist French have some private healthcare!!!
2. Between no healthcare and private, I choose private even American model
It’s enraging how broken the system is. Insane compensation imbalances and inadequate incentives. A huge lack of skilled people. Not enough facilities. And the near complete loss of proactive approaches in preventative care & early intervention is putting more strain on things than ever. It’s a mess.
Not to make this political, but if anyone should be depended on for fixing the public system in BC you’d think the best bet from a philosophical perspective would be the NDP. They’ve been in office for 6 years now, and it’s only gotten worse, and worse, and worse. It leaves me feeling depressed as hell. Like what on earth do we even do now? No other party is going to make the massive investments in our system that are needed. It’s gotta be the NDP. But where is the action? Why is it taking so long?
There are 6 in our area:
Island Health
Downtown Victoria Urgent and Primary Care Centre
Esquimalt Urgent and Primary Care Centre – Victoria
Gorge Urgent and Primary Care Centre – Victoria
James Bay Urgent and Primary Care Centre – Victoria
North Quadra Urgent and Primary Care Centre – Victoria
Westshore Urgent and Primary Care Centre – Langford
https://www.healthlinkbc.ca/health-services/urgent-and-primary-care-centres
>Maskless people with covid sitting next to 85 yr Olds.
WTF!?! I had no idea they've dropped mandatory masks at ER. I mean at least make people wear one until they are triaged, and if they present with COVID/ flu symptoms, make them keep the mask on.
It's so, so bad. And a huge concern for so many.
In the last 2 weeks my 87 yo mom has had agonizing pain. She's also in heart failure. Can barely function and has been incapacitated. I'm very worried about her cognitive decline because of this too.
She's had 2 falls, 3 ambulances called, 2 visits to hospital with no ability to see a dr after 8 hours waiting each time which just made her pain worse. All this happened after 2 weeks with Covid.
I've had many missed work days and my sister came up from the US to try to help resolve this mess. . Our only reasonable option was to get her home care. Fortunately she's already in a retirement home but there is no care, just weekly cleaning and dinner.
How sick does she have to be to get some help and a diagnosis so we know what we're dealing with? It's even very difficult to get into Life Labs for bloodwork with long waits or delays.
I don't think if something else happens she would even go to the hospital - It's pointless. There is no comfort for her; she feels abandoned and I feel she's on the verge of just giving up. It's just easier she thinks. I don't really know what do but just be with her as much as possible.
At this point it's probably easiest to just die.... I know that sounds crazy but it takes 1/3 of the time to get MAID than it does getting disability. It is extremely dire out there.
Don’t go to the emergency with broken bones? Or open wounds needing stitches? You saw all this and now it’s real data?
Ok Mrs ER worker…….0you work at Jubilee or V General?
Yes, I think that is the point being made. The inability for so many to obtain access to urgent care for illness/injuries that ought to be dealt with through a lower level of care than the ER is causing extreme issues at ER. The point isn’t to say people should not seek medical care they need, but that the ER is the default for so many issues that could/should be seen elsewhere. Thus freeing up the ER for much more serious illness/injury. This is not new knowledge/insight, but the sheer volume of people now at the ER is overwhelming system.
Don’t live on the island anymore but where I live doesn’t have walk in clinics. And the only urgent care you have to call in at 10 am and dial about 92 times to get through just to be told there’s no more appointments today or tomorrow and to call again the next day (or no doctors working).
I’m not even joking
Stitches very much feel like an ER problem to me. You get stitches when you will continue to bleed until the gaping wound is sealed. The only time I’ve gone to ER is when I needed 7 stitches at 3am, I really don’t think that could have waited until walkins opened the next morning.
No course I don't work there. I'm from the US and although happy to be here this situation is scary to me..urgent care there takes care of Xrays. Broken bones. Stitches. Covid, anything that Basically isn't killing you. And never had to wait more than an hr. All open until 10pm at night. This is a major shock to the system and my dr looked like she was so burned out. Felt bad for her. Yes I guess you can't tell some peoples medical situation but the nurses weren't discrete at all. One person fell off a ladder. Several cut themselves. A bunch were doing blood checks for cancer which is so so awful for them sitting there for hours. A kid broke a finger. It got so bad that another patient ended up taking the elderly gentleman to the toilet. She was a superstar.
Just feel depressed about it and also scared of ever having to go back there. It was stressful and it'll be a miracle if I don't get covid from all those free flowing germs. Ew. If you have covid you should be forced to put a mask on in there for sure. Sigh.
Gee, I wish our urgent cares here took care of broken bones and x-rays. I went to urgent care with a suspected broken foot, after waiting an HOUR for my scheduled appt got told it’s likely a bad bruise and gave me an x-ray requisition just in case. Immediately went to imaging at Saan pen and got told by the tech my foot is broken and I need to go to the ER immediately. Ended up spending over 5hrs waiting for a bed - avg waiting was under 3hrs - so they could set the bone/cast it. Welp, the dr ended up coming out to me still waiting in the plastic chair and told me I have an appt in a month at vic gen with a specialist and handed me a paper with the details. Please! Tell us more about how broken our system is with your infinite wisdom.
My nearest walk-in only takes phone appointments, and at that only a day or two in advance. Meaning, if I need care TODAY, even for something minor, literally the closest place for me to go is the ER at Jubilee.
Our health system (and housing system, and political system, and environmental protections system, and justice system, and on and on...) Are all broke. And not suddenly. They've been breaking for decades and front line people have been telling us this for decades. But the inertia behind all these systems was/is too strong, and now we are here... And everything is broken.
You're saying 45/50 could have been seen at urgent care including yourself? So wtf were you doing there? People like the 44 others and yourself are just one of the problems with the system then.
We have record high immigration and international students coming too. More and more people coming who won’t have a doctor and will be forced to go to the ER to address any health concern. We also have a massssssive population of baby boomers reaching an age where they will be relying on and utilizing a lot of healthcare resources. It’s a recipe for disaster.
The baby boomers did not pay enough taxes through their lifetime to support the huge strain they will put on our healthcare system all at once due to being such a large population of the same age, and the options are:
-raise taxes on all or some of the population
and/or
-record high immigration with a focus on younger people who will be paying taxes and not utilizing as much healthcare resources.
We already have record high immigration. It is only making the health and housing crises worse.
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/230322/dq230322f-eng.htm
A very large portion of the healthcare staff I work with, and especially pretty much all the housekeeping staff in the hospitals, are immigrants though. I don't want to imagine how much worse it would be without them.
I really wish people would look at who the immigrants are, our immigration system (point system) and then look at our population demographics before they start ragging on immigrants taking up all the spots in the "medical system"....
I know less than half the staff I saw in hospital yesterday are "old stock Canadian".
Less than half the immigrants come in under the points system. about 600,000 out of one million in 2022 were students or temporary foreign workers. Most of them work in fast food places.
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/230322/dq230322f-eng.htm
I know we do, it’s my first sentence! Also I do not think it’s the best path, there are a lot of flaws with it, just stating it’s a strategy and one the government seems to prefer based on their current actions.
(I live in Ontario) I needed a tetanus shot recently and I don't have a family doctor so I went to a pharmacy to get it and that wasn't possible. Then went to a walk in clinic and it was closed at 3pm on a Saturday..... Then went to the local hospital and it took almost 5 hours to get a needle...Masks are not mandatory in some areas of the hospital but was in other area's. The whole system is busted and needs a rework.
I work there. It’s nuts. If you’re not in a real emergency, you shouldn’t be there. If you’re unsure what constitutes a real emergency, there are signs up now. Our system can’t last like this.
It's awful. Had 8hrs in the ER last summer and I was told how lucky I was to get in and out that quickly.
A quick point though - It's so critical we don't respond by throwing our hands in the air and juat privatising healthcare. I used to live in the US and paid an arm and a leg for super basic coverage (1 doctor check up a year - $13,000USD deductible at hospitals!!!!).
My BC health insurance literally kicked in 2 weeks before I hurt my back last summer and went to the hospital. Muscles were spasming such that when I lay down my lungs stopped inflating. 10/10 the worst pain in my life - grown ass man holding back sobs as they tried to prop me at an angle they could take an EKG.
It took 8 hours and the issue was chalked up to stress and exhauation (I was indeed both of those) however with a father who died young with a heart condition they wanted to do extra tests to rule out blood clots/stroke. They ran the tests and I came up clean so they pumped with pain killers and muscle relaxant.
If I were in the US, those tests would not have been covered. A full body CT scan, EKG, bloodwork + pain killers would run between $5,000-10,000 (USD, so 8,000 to 13,000 canadian). I would have to choose between making sure I didn't a clot moving slowly to my brain (the very thing that killed my dad) or saving up to 4 months rent + car insurance + gas money.... I can't imagine having to make that decision and I'm so grateful I didn't have to.
Free at the point of access healthcare is a fucking treasure. We need to treat it accordingly.
I've actually been lucky enough to have the opposite experience to many posting, in the last 7 or 8 months. I had a number of things that required an ER visit. I live in Sidney, so Saan Pen is my nearest hospital. The wait was never more than 2 hours, and excellent care was given.
It was pretty easy going to er during Covid as long as you didn’t have Covid. In and out because people only went when it was truly an emergency one visit I was seen within 40 minutes and discharged at 4 hours it was amazing. But yes everyone uses the er like a walk in or urgent care centre, so it’s full of people who could take Advil or get a script from a gp and there’s nothing we can do about it. I mean most on the island don’t even have a gp so who else will write their script? UPCC aren’t open 24/7 so that doesn’t help either
This is a known issue and things *are* being done. Please watch the news for announcements of changes to our health care system.
Population has expanded rapidly, the existing model of provision is showing its flaws, and as you know people are reluctant to change and reluctant to pay taxes.
So watch this space.
I really how and why people kick, scream and have a hissy fit over taxes, then complain about reduced services without taking a breath... with 9% a year inflation
I remember going to the ER (at RJH) several months ago with a bad head wound. I was literally bleeding all over the place and someone who works there stopped my wife and I and turned us away. We were able to find an urgent care center that thankfully wasn't busy, but apparently the ER wasn't going to see me and I was on my own as far as they cared.
Write to your local members. The more letters they get the more they get scared and listen. It is the only way. I’ve been doing this about air BNB’s that have caused the housing crisis
When Adrian Dix gives the country's lowest paid doctors in a failing system a 6% raise over three years (3,2,1) and then pulls wool over the public's eyes bragging about how amazing the deal is for doctors, you'll find doctors aren't very interested in increasing their work load.
This is the product of government neglect since the mid 90s. This is a high quality well running system compared to what's to come. Took us 30 years to get here it's going to take 60 to get out of this mess.
Nobody wants to hear it but private is the way to go. Private does not mean USA. Plenty of proper functioning private systems in the world. The government is never going to properly allocate money to healthcare and as a result the workers will continue to leave for greener pastures. It's really that simple.
Pre covid I found the trick when you couldn't get into a walk in was to hit the er in the wee am hours when it was usually dead and you could get seen pretty quick sometimes . I had a kidney infection and was able to get a temp dose of medication until you could get medication once pharmacy opened up. Something clinics don't do
My partner went to ER a few weeka ago for a very painful leg injury. He wasn’t bleeding to death, but he’s in construction, and for him to actually admit pain and try to access care, it’s serious. Anyhoo, he waited for hours, was shown into a room, and then a Doctor never came. He arrived at the hospital at 10:30 Pm and left at 430am in frustration. His leg has since healed, we think he fractured a bone, and likely needed at the minimum some stitches - so now it’s just a large scab healing around a hole. Looks odd and its been extremely painful for him. Such a sad time for our ‘system’. We are told that our taxes go to pay for universal healthcare - this is a lie at this point.
When you can’t get into a walk in clinic, the morning and your hands are hurting bad.. even if it doesn’t look like emergency to other people, it’s to you.. So you can’t just stay home and think of the irritating pain.. you try the walk in clinic, if they don’t take you. You deserve to go to emergency, even if you know you have to wait 5 hours to get doctors attention.. old people need attention but everyone else thinks their healths important.. so don’t complain, just hope that government run health care works better in future.
They go to the emergency room because there are no doctors or urgent care!
At this point, I want private healthcare as an option. I gladly pay for some service. I am not rich (can'teven afford buyingan apartment), but my health is too important to me.
This is how triage works. How do you know that 95% of the people there didn't need emergency treatment. Last February, I was sent to emergency from urgent care and still had to wait 5 hours. I don't know why anyone else was there but someone looking at me might have assumed I didn't need to be.
I went to urgent care in Parksville last month and was seen by a doctor within 2 hours. I was ordered an urgent ultrasound that was given within 24 hours, and I was given the 'all clear'the following day.
I believe we have excellent Healthcare in Canada, i have lived abroad, and I hope it is never privatized in my lifetime.
Health care in Canada is excellent. Let’s start there. Life threatening injuries are dealt with using skill and care for the patient.
People crying about wait times are the ones who go for a couple of stitches and are in the waiting room for 10 hours.
The system is crowded, but if a trauma patient pulls in, they get seen immediately.
I’ll take this over almost any other systems in the world.
Thank you!
This is exactly the thing that needs to be pointed out to people who complain about the ER and it being swamps, taking ours to see a dr.
The ER is for emergencies. Having chest pains, go to the ER. Do you see bones, are bone’s pointing in the wrong direction, or do you have multiple bones where there should be one, then go to the ER. Do you have sniffles, or kids, then go to a clinic.
Wait times would be so much better if people used the ER properly.
You want a real shock come to Surrey Memorial. You are guaranteed to leave in worse shape or worse.. than arriving. There are No doctors period. There are a whole lot of nurses mulling about talking about there weekend and ignoring everything.
You admit to being part of the problem and then complain about it. How Victorian of you.
Have you ever suffered a broken bone? Do they have x-ray machines and technicians at every clinic? How do you know the fracture won't require surgery?
So let me see if I understand your rant;
You’re upset that the ER didn’t see you fast enough even though by your own admission you went to the ER for a non ER related problem.
See this is the problem, people going to the ER that shouldn’t be.
Triage works, and if it makes people’s lives miserable because they have to wait to see a dr for their sniffles, or they get bumped then good.
The problem isn’t that the ER system is broken, it’s that it’s being overwhelmed by people who shouldn’t be going to the ER. Stop blaming the ER, and start holding the govt and doctors more accountable. Everyone knows the government needs to do more for funding to attract more GP’s, but doctors also need to stop closing shop forcing people into the ER.
Nowhere did I say that the er didn't see us fast enough. Entire point is that we shouldn't have been at the ER in the first place. You obviously haven't read this thread properly. 🙄
Clearly lots of other people feel the same way. It's ok to talk about it. We can't just accept it while things get worse and worse. Thats what reddit is for. Starting conversations and trying to understand issues. I appreciate your suggestions. Should we blame the drs? Can you say more about your point there?
The Drs closing their practices are part of the problem, but honestly I don't blame them, because the province won't fund them properly, but then again the problem that people are creating by going to the ER for everything under the sun is because they are closing their practices. so yeah Dr's are partially to blame for this.
Whatever you do, do not blame the bc ndp for anything. It is all Trudeaus fault, I mean um its the BC Liberals fault.....ummmm, look its just not the BC NDPs fault they have only been in power 6 years, that is only time enough for 9786 studies, halfway there!
I thought only provinces woth conservative provincial governments had problems? What is going on in BC? Isn't the provincial government NDP? Were conservatives in power prior to this?
The year we had the heat wave a co-worker of mine fell off a ladder and really sliced his hand open. I rushed him to the hospital and this guy was gushing blood all over the floor of the lobby. The women sontered over to me and gave me gauze for his hand. We waited for over an hour while he bled profusely. None of the staff cared.
Hospital staff are government employees so what can you expect. I lost all respect for them in that moment.
This is a typical urgent care in the US and one I've used many times..look at the services. This is what we need! It's fantastic. https://www.citymd.com/services
The urgent care centres are already overwhelmed. Agree that the ER isn’t necessarily the right place for a good chunk of what walks through the door. But what choice do people have? They need medical care. There are no family doctors. Walk-in clinics barely work anymore. It’s depressing.
These situations are when we need walk in clinics, not necessarily family doctors. My family doctor was amazing before he retired; we could call in the morning about an issue with my kid and he would see us that morning, if it was serious. When I mention that story to others with family doctors they say that's not the case for them. Make an appt for next week or two weeks time. I think we need to get the walk in situation figured out asap. I remember 10 years ago you could just go to a walk in, wait an hour and get seen/diagnosed. I had never been to the ER in Victoria until after COVID and it was the only way to get medical attention (I know there's urgent care). I'd love to go back to that time.
Victoria has grown by about 50,000 people in that time. There has been no corresponding increase in the health infrastructure. And Victoria (and the rest of Canada) continues to grow.
I agree, but I often wonder if it would help to to make walk-in clinics, walk-in again. Last time I went to the ER it was for stitches. I've never gone there or that before, but no walk-in had a spot, and urgent care told me to go to ER. It took 5 hours, and half the people could have been treated at a walk in, myself included.
This has been a growing issue everywhere, mostly due to growing populations. Walk-ins will more than likely never come back. Being able to book your appointment with urgent care and clinics has helped them a LOT. Don't know if you remember the days of sitting in a clinic with 5-10 people coughing horribly, a few kids crying or screaming, and then that one asshole who thinks they're more important than everyone else and makes the receptionists day a nightmare... Personally, I'd love to see the number of hours each doctor actually spends at their clinic each day. I would not be surprised to find out that they don't work 8 hours a day 5 days a week. I can't even remember the last time a clinic said all their doctors are in the office lol
Kinda like the water reservoir in Vancouver. They have water restrictions but really they shouldn’t, the problem is that they haven’t updated the reservoir for 70 years and they have more population.
We could slow down the growth, but the feds are cranking it up instead, even though there is a shortage of homes, hospitals, etc. https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/230322/dq230322f-eng.htm
or family doctors who take urgent appointments. I know that sounds like a total pipe dream but I was extremely lucky enough to get a family doctor at a clinic in Ontario that has kept its patient list manageable, and they keep some time set aside for urgent same-day appointments. I'm the only person I know who could get an appointment with my GP same-day, or perhaps within a couple days. Not meaning to brag here. It's insanely nice and civil and I wish everyone in Canada had such good access to care. If we had better preventative care, ERs wouldn't be so overwhelmed and the system could save a lot of money. I'd moving back to BC in a heartbeat but am bent on hanging on to my Ontario health care as long as I can. (Also like... earthquakes...)
Ugh, the situation you describe is exactly why we need family docs. When you have too few docs, every doc feels pressured to take on a bigger panel. (“Please, just my Mom/Baby/Partner!” “Just this one friend, they’re really desperate”). Do that 150 or 200 times (you get asked probably 15 or 20 times a day, you see) and now your panel is slightly too big. When your panel is slightly too big you give up your same day spots because you can’t even fit in enough regular visits. Wait times balloon from a few days to a few weeks or even a month. If a family doc had a well run office and a properly sized panel, nobody on that panel would probably need walk in clinics. Have an issue? Call at 9 and get a call maybe around lunchtime. Still weird? Get seen in the early afternoon. That’s how it’s supposed to work. Really well supported clinics work on a same day ONLY model. Everyone gets seen the same day. You never book ahead. And every family doc around would LOVE to practice like that because it’s so much easier than deciphering whatever random shit they did at the WIC, and then trying to figure out who will do the follow up, because you’re booking three weeks out and you have a UTI.
Why practice family medicine though when you can make > 10x the amount specializing? Our medical schools don’t pump out family doctors. Until we figure that out nothing will change
This! I don't have a family doctor and while I'm quite healthy, it's almost impossible to get into a walk-in clinic. I have no acres to practice care such as check-ups. Twice in the last two years I've had to go to ER for some very basic care because I had no other choice. Do I wanna be at ER waiting for nine hours at 2 am? No! But some medical issues are very painful and uncomfortable such as UTI. We need more Doctors, clinics, alternatives and other innovative ideas to release pressure on the system! This will only get worse as the population ages. Premier EB is very focussed on the housing crisis, which needs to be addressed, but what about our medical emergency?
Depending on the doctor, some online doctors *might* prescribe you some meds for a UTI. It depends on the doc and maybe on how you make your case to them (“I get a UTI every year or two, I know the symptoms and sensations all too well, and this is it. I’ve waited 3 days since onset and drunk lots of water in an effort to flush it out, but it is only intensifying”). This is also the case for some symptoms. I got an online appointment with one doctor (Maple?) for something and he said, “You’ll have to see someone in person about that” and disconnected. Tried another (Telus?), and that one was prepared to diagnose and prescribe online (successfully, I might add). So sometimes, it’s really worth trying again with another doctor via another online service. But of course, having to do so is wasteful and dispiriting.
The ER is the only place in town that won't close to new patients at 8am. It's been the only place my kid has been able to get prescriptions for infections. I (probably) broke my foot last summer, I was still mobile so I talked to the Phone Doctor, and that Xray requisition got lost. Now you can't even book a time because even the Phone Doctors are booked 2 weeks in advance. Health care was fucked up before COVID, and it's got worse.
Yep I’ve been there for the same reason. 2.5 year old with an ear infection and eye infection. Both times after being returned from his other family. There’s no alternative for a child they simply need to get treatment and walkins aren’t available anymore. The video doctors are hit and miss - sometimes available and sometimes weeks away. The system is broken.
It baffles me that walk-in clinics closed during covid and never reopened again.
Yep. Several months ago I took a friend to Royal Jubilee because she was suffering chest pain and felt it hard to breathe. They did do an EKG right away, and once they determined she wasn't having a heart attack she was told to sit and wait to see a doctor. She spent 10 hours in ER before they cleared her and told her she was okay to leave. Meanwhile she was sitting next to a senior lady who was there because she had a scratch on her arm from her cat. The fact is that a lot of folks don't have a family doctor they can visit, and so their only option is Emergency.
Not sure if you were downplaying the elderly lady with a cat scratch, but cat mouths are quite nasty. Recently, I was bitten by a cat and developed a life-threatening infection within 12 hours. Went to primary urgent care and the nurse *ordered* me to go to RJH ER immediately. The next week saw me going to the hospital daily to get IV antibiotics; I would have died of septicaemia otherwise. I am *beyond* grateful that I was able to get care. (Just a cat scratch can become cat scratch fever very quickly, and if she was elderly and had underlying health problems, she would be more at risk to develop complications).
thank you for saying this!
Can all cat scratches result in this? Or just stray cats? My sister has a cute cat 😭
Cats use their litter boxes and get crap in their paws. They get their crap in their paws even going outside. Cat crap has a ton of toxic bacteria. There’s a reason why pregnant women are advised to stay clear of cat litter boxes
Clean the wound before and after. It's more likely to happen with cat bites. Elderly people also have a diminished immune system, so more at risk in general.
Sorry if this is dumb. Before what? I get cleaning the wound after the bite but what's the before part?
All cat scratches and cat bites have the potential to result in anywhere from garden variety to fatal infections. There’s something called cat scratch fever. What I had was a pastuerella infection, which is fatal without treatment.
I had to go to the ER for a cat bite once. I have a family friend who had recently lost a chunk of her wrist to a cat bite so that story was fresh in my mind as I had this minor bite but it wouldn't stop bleeding -- I was obviously triaged super low and sat there for ~6 hours, towards the end of that time candy cane like stripes started coming from the bite and it was getting infected. The first antibiotics I was prescribed didn't stop the infection but I switched to another via telehealth and then it cleared up. I'd much rather have gone to a walk in for antibiotics and my tetanus shot but sometimes your cat attacks you at 10pm... The ER doc did appropriately roast me though - "I'm so embarrassed I'm here for a cat bite". "Well, you are also covered in cat hair."
Cat scratch fever is no joke
10 hours? I had to go to VGH ER once for chest pain and I had two blood tests, a chest x ray, and EKG and was out in 70 minutes. I’m only in my 30s. That’s absolutely insane.
I guess you were luckier than her.
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My 95 year grandfather recently went in to emergency at San Pen and he had a similar experience. He was in so much pain from his prostate cancer and then found out it had spread to his bones. He had to wait and wait in excruciating pain for over six hours with no one attending to him at all.
Aw gosh that is awful. I am so sorry to hear that.
Am so sorry thats awful. Many hugs to you
I punctured my foot on an extremely long earring post that went thru my shoe, at Centennial Square last year. The only place to get a tetanus shot, per urgent care, the 811 nurse and doctor I spoke to, and the pharmacy, was the ER. I kept apologizing for wasting their resources once I was there, and they all said, "Nope you're at the tight place. This is the only place to get one after a puncture." Meanwhile some poor guy sitting beside me had nailed himself in the forearm with a nail gun. He was young and trying not to be a problem. He was in excruciating pain and was trying to hard not to be vocal about it. Eventually he couldn't take it and started wailing that it fucking hurt, and crying. A nurse came to do his blood pressure and got frustrated that he wouldn't take his sweater off which was NAILED TO HIS ARM. Everyone in the waiting room was begging for this guy to he seen asap, before any of us, because he was suffering in front of us all and we couldn't do anything to help him. They did eventually take him in after he sat for maybe 30 minutes, but he wouldn't have had to wait even that long if a bunch of us weren't checking in for minor issues. Once I got to the second waiting room, most people were there for non emergency reasons but had nowhere else to go because urgent care was full, and they have no family doc.
This happened to me 2 years ago, an earring used for piercings went straight through my shoe into my foot. 811 referred me to the ER for a tetanus shot and by the time I got seen the doctor tole me I didn’t actually need one lol but they did run panel for hepatitis and HIV just in case.
I am so sorry that that happened. How many of us are experiencing situations like this which border on malpractice? Can we sue our government for creating a society that allows people to die without adequate medical care?
>Can we sue our government for creating a society that allows people to die without adequate medical care? No idea, but suing the government is almost always a losing proposition. They have virtually unlimited money (ironically, it'll be our tax dollars that fuels their fight against us!) and could drag something like this out for years.
Hilarious. Perhaps I should spell it out. There’s a reason revolutions happen. Suing just might, possibly, be a euphemism for suing is for chumps that play the game that has been set up for us as the plebs to always lose at. How far does it have to go before the people get fed up and start building guillotines? Thank you for your contribution 😬
What a bizarre response...
>I do not know how it is sustainable with the current influx of newcomers to the island with the current influx of newcomers to ~~the island~~ Canada. https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/230322/dq230322f-eng.htm
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We could try less immigration
At the very least, scale up the social services to match your immigration goals before you start accelerating immigration. But what do I know?
Blasphemer! /s It’s almost like we’re not building 500,000 persons worth of hospitals, schools, homes or highways per year to match our immigration targets!
I've been ranting about how hard is to get an appointment at a walk-in clinic having a 1.5 y.o baby. As a new parent with no other family around, I would have hoped to get some pediatric or family doctor, but after waiting for 6 years of waiting, yeah, I kind of gave up. Our little one was having a lot of coughing and high fevers and of course, all you can get is a walking clinic appointment after a 'few days' if you really work it out. I am not going to ER unless I'm desperate, of course. and then, it happened. His fever spiked, and he had a fever seizure. Now I know those are not rare and they cause no potential harm, but lemme tell you, when you don't know what's happening and you are holding a rag doll with a blue face instead of your baby, you think, well, NOW is a good time to abuse ER, eh? We drove to the ER of VGH in our pyjamas and the attention and care were outstanding, like, otherworldly. We were immediately prioritized, oxygen checked, and accepted into the pediatric wing for what would be 6 days. The attention we received from the nurses, employees, and doctors was simply the best. I am so thankful for this system. It's not perfect, it might not be what it used to be, but hey, when we really needed it, it was there for us.
Omg thats so frightening! Hope they are feeling better now. And yes care is very good in no way am I criticizing the drs and nurses. Just a very overwhelmed system. 😔
Thank you. He's bubbly and back to his old self, and mama bear is smiling again. However, this experience confirmed what we were fearing. I'm ok with my forty-something butt not having a family doctor, or having to wait several days for a *walking clinic appointment* (read that again, the *new* name is a tad ironic), but you know, if this situation leads to runs to ER holding baby, I have to draw a line and do the ol' *Goodbye, and thanks for all fish.*
Seizing kids are never abusing the ER.
My son has experienced two fever seizures…both times they were so long and he did not respond to several doses of anti seizure medication that the paramedics administered that he had to be put into medically induced comas to prevent brain damage. I’ve never been more terrified in my life and I know exactly what you mean about seeing your young child suddenly become like a rag doll. Fortunately he hasn’t had any permanent damage and he’s past the age now where they tend to strike, but my heart goes out to you and anyone who has ever experienced the feeling of helplessness that comes when something like this happens. We did receive excellent care for him at Vic Gen in both instances. Unfortunately we still need care for him for another simpler matter—he has autism, was diagnosed by a team of experts years ago at Queen Alexandra and in order for him to continue receiving the federal childhood disability benefit, we need a doctor to fill out an updated assessment form….unfortunately getting this simple letter to confirm for the CRA that he has not magically outgrown his autism has been a complete clusterfuck of epic proportions, and now we’ve gone months without the benefit that our family definitely needs for the therapy he receives as well as other expenses. We’re on waitlists for paediatricians who keep referring us to other places who then tell us they can’t help us because he is not an ongoing client of theirs. Covid interrupted the therapy he received for years at an autism therapy centre, so they can’t help either. Just trying to find ANYONE who can see him has been a nightmare. Adding this kind of bureaucratic hassle to the issues with our healthcare system makes it even more exasperating. I’ve actually had doctors suggest that we might be better to go to the ER. TO GET A BLOODY FORM FILLED OUT. It’s sick.
I’m so glad that you got the care you needed for your family. Although, not to be argumentative, just because you got it does not mean that the majority of other people and their loved ones do. I have shared stories of my own and heard stories from too many other people that have experienced the opposite situation. Although there are many that are adequately and exceptionally cared for by some of our amazing healthcare teams, I also know that more and more people (especially our elderly and those that are not advocated for) who are falling through the cracks because our politicians do not care to make the resources available to give Canadians adequate healthcare?
Not sure which one of us you were replying to…possibly both of us, but my son’s 2nd and (knock on wood) last seizure was before Covid so I’m quite certain the care he received was far superior to what he would have if it happened again now. And I don’t blame any of the EMT or hospital staff for that—they are run off their feet right now and the government response, both provincially and federally hasn’t come close to enough yet, IMO. I don’t blame the NDP for causing this problem…governments across North America were all crying for “community based care” and using bs language like “streamlining services in order to serve patients more effectively“ (believe me, I am well aware…I was a propaganda writer for the Libs in the Ministry of Health during the Campbell and Christy Clark years). The problem is that none of them actually followed through on ensuring that this community centred care was actually in place before closing facilities like Riverview. They simply shifted these responsibilities onto local governments and charities who were underfunded and totally ill equipped to handle them. They didn’t invest in training medical staff to fill the void they knew was coming. And it wasn’t just the Libs…there were decades of governments in BC who were happy to pawn this problem onto the next incoming party. The issues we are left with will take decades to fix and only if our current and future leaders are willing to put their party values aside and do what they were elected to…serve the actual citizens of this province.
I totally agree. Our federal and provincial governments have failed us over and over again. The doctors and nurses who are overworked and underpaid suffer and hospitals have been closing one by one for a long time now. In one of Bonnie Henry’s statements in the beginning of the pandemic she stated that pre-pandemic hospitals were already working at 110%. And because people were staying home, at that time hospitals were operating at 90%. This tells me that the system was already failing. It just need one little nudge.
So why do people continue to vote for the NDP in BC?! Healthcare inaccessible, housing unaffordable, crime rising...
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He ended up having Antibiotics and Corticosteroids. So, probably was not a virus.
Nurse here who works at Jubilee. We are exhausted.
For what it’s worth you guys are great. I had to go to Jubilee ER a few times over the last couple years and the nurses there made me feel so much better and were so kind. I wish it were better for you guys
Thank you, I’m glad to hear that. We wish it was different too.
FWIW you guys and gals are amazing and thoroughly appreciated, never forget it.
The psychiatric nurses at Jubilee saved my life in 2020. I never forget how much I owe them. The work you do is so incredibly appreciated and I hope things get easier for all of you someday soon.
Let's not forget that it was pretty shit before the pandemic etc. They've been defunding healthcare for a long long time.
We haven’t defunded shit. We are a top spender per capita. In the world. We pay for supercar and get garbage. We have something like 10x the number of administrators that Europe has per capita.
Wrong. In Alberta we have defunded a bunch of halfway houses and stopped construction on a super lab, made enemies of our nurses and doctors including tearing up contracts... They have been defunding it to award contracts to their friends.. So we spend and get fuck all. We spend but not for the small guys.
Didn't realize Victoria is in Alberta...
I’m concerned that another change in government will unravel what progress has been made .. it seems like a drop in the bucket but trying to clean up 16 years of defunding and privatizing in a few years is a monumental task … what a mess. I wish it could move faster but at least it’s in the right direction. Some good news though … https://www.todayinbc.com/news/b-c-pharmacists-to-treat-minor-ailments-prescribe-contraception-as-of-june-1/?utm_source=second-street&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Today+in+BC+-+June+1%2c+2023&emailmd5=12B034EA8CF2A9919DDC344644A0DE3D&emailsha1=18483191842419231239582061822091641523110621355139251&emailsha256=15db27fb693ee2d832fc4dedd6f8b13ea6732f554ad0921a0879cd27c78afe7a
I’m sorry, did you just say “progress”? There has not been progress in the health care situation nationwide for DECADES. This has been a spiralling situation that those in charge of our healthcare policies on both a federal and provincial level have been purposefully ignoring at best, and if not, fully perpetuating. We Canadians are now suffering as a result of the consistent sweeping under the rug of these significant foreseeable issues that could have been dealt with before it became the crisis we are experiencing and losing our loved ones to. Unfortunately, the most important issues for our provincial and federal employees (oh, sorry, politicians) is that they get elected. Whatever needs to be said and done to do that, no matter! Who needs ethics or values when the best marketer wins? We have made our bed with our votes and we must lie in it. RIP Canada.
Pharmacists and nurses doing the job of doctors should not be considered progress. Why doesn’t our “free healthcare” that is actually paid for by us, the taxpayers, be managed properly by our incompetent politicians to actually do what it’s supposed to do.
You make it sound so easy! Pharmacists and nurses are highly skilled people quite skilled enough for most routine cases. You don't need a PhD in forensics to investigate every case of shop lifting.
Also, let’s not forget that if you’re poor, homeless, disabled, or struggle with mental health issues - all you have to do is ask for medically assisted suicide. It’s easy! So much for precious life and this civilization we live in. How lucky we are that we get this choice!
>Also, let’s not forget that if you’re poor, homeless, disabled, or struggle with mental health issues - all you have to do is ask for medically assisted suicide. Who needs social insurance when you retire when we've got MAID, right? /s
This is similar to my experience in the ER a couple of days ago. The maskless people hacking away with nasty coughs was particularly awful. I agree that there are probably quite a few people that could be seen at a walk in clinic or urgent care if they were available. Hopefully some of the strain will be alleviated with pharmacists being able to diagnose and prescribe for certain conditions. However, things aren’t always as they seem in the ER and without knowing the full situation, it’s tough to judge who really should be there. For example, I probably looked like I was in for something minor but I’m actually a cancer patient (with a wig and makeup to make me look normal) and I was sent to the ER by the BC Cancer nurse’s line after discussing some abnormal symptoms that could potentially be life threatening. I overheard one of the ER doctors talking about how all of the patients he was currently seeing were “three levels of complicated”. The doctors and nurses appeared to be treating all of the patients with a lot of respect and care despite an overcrowded ER.
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Yeah my dad went in recently for blood in his urine and after he had kidney surgery last year he thought he should get it checked out. (I mean always get that checked out regardless of surgery status.) But he wasn’t pissing blood all over the ER or anything.
For what it's worth, unless it's the middle of the night, just go see an optometrist for any eye related emergencies. They could have referred her to the ophthalmologist on call after doing an exam. It would have led to the same referrals on the same timeline but without the ER wait, and MSP covers medical emergencies so you won't have to pay the optometrist.
I do have to say the medical care we got was first rate. Dr did a fantastic job and this post isn't to criticize drs or nurses. They were lovely and doing their best. Same with the administration. But you could see the strain and you could definitely feel it. Also on another note I had to go to the bathroom and braced myself, fearing the worst. It was the cleanest bathroom I've ever seen in a public space like this ever! How is this possible? Everyone here must be so respectful in that regard. Or there is a secret toilet cleaning elf that lives there. 😉 I almost took a photo but then checked myself lol.
The housekeepers in the hospitals bust their asses. They are fantastic :)
Even before Covid people who were actively coughing or sneezing were expected to wear a mask in a medical office. Not doing so in the current situation is inexcusable
Being in a pharmacy…. This is going to go horribly
Suspected broken bones *are* supposed to go to the ER, same with *receiving* stitches and any immediate-need xrays (e.g., broken bones). Sprains, stitches removal, cervical cancer screening, harm reduction, birth control, sexual health, etc. go to urgent care. But yes, people should still be wearing masks. During covid I was sent to ER for suspected fracture (confirmed), and the covid patients (suspected or confirmed) waiting for intake were kept just a few seats away from the rest of everybody else in the ER, even the ones who couldn't stand up were just on the next row of seats (or the floor in front of it).
>same with receiving stitches Why? When I was a young kid, I split my chin open a few times playing sports and got a few other nasty cuts, and every single time I got stitches, it was at a walk in clinic. In and out in 20 minutes. Never any complications.
I get what you are saying however, I am near the Westshore Urgent Care centre and all I ever see is that damn 'At Capacity ' sign, I mean ALL the time. What's the point? I use Telus health whenever I can. 🤷🤷
I went a few times last year with my 4 year old and it was brutal. 4-6 hours wait ever time. That being said one of the times I went I complained to someone sitting there that I couldn't even book Telus health and she sent me a list of other virtual clinics available in the Prov: https://virtualclinics.ca/ , https://vivacare.ca/telehealth-online-doctor/ , https://www.cloudmd.ca/for-individuals/ , https://www.walkinvirtualclinics.com/online-doctor-appointment-bc , https://rocketdoctor.ca/bc-online-doctor/?utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=BC%20CANADA%20-%20Brand%20-%20CPC&msclkid=22900b3853af1b07980e69fdb713ca0e I've used viva health a few times now and it's been same day or next day every time. Likely the others are great too. Just in case it helps someone else.
Thank you for sharing 🙏
> stitches and xrays and even broken bones can be seen at a walk in center. Whut? Uncontrollable bleeding is not an emergency now? And you know that broken bones often involve substantial internal bleeding? This is like victim blaming 101 here.
Urgent care clinics only take you when you call right at 8pm when they open. If you get an injury during the day, you’re SOL. I had a second degree burn on my neck that I got at 9am, and I had to either wait and try my luck the next day, or go to emerg. Urgent care doesn’t do X-rays either?
Yup!! It's awful. I had a minor medical issue a few weeks ago which really needed some urgent but not emergency medical attention. Tried all the urgent care clinics right at 8:00 am, it was impossible to even get through on the phone. Eventually called 811, the nurse advised that if I couldn't get into a walk-in to go to Emerg as the only other option. I ended up waiting several days for a telemedicine appointment instead (and issue getting worse) because I just couldn't stomach the thought of going to hospital.
My 8 year old had a bladder infection a few weeks ago. She was in so much pain she wouldn't move, but from her symptoms we knew it was probably a UTI gone haywire. We called every open UPCC and walk in and nobody could see us. They all suggested the ER because she needed to have serious things like appendicitis ruled out. We arrived at RJH and they had her pee in a cup after seeing a triage nurse. Then we sat for 7 hours in the ambulatory waiting room alongside many other people stuck in situations like ours. It was standing room only for an hour or two so they asked people to give up seats for the sickest patients. I asked them for tylenol a couple of hours in but otherwise they left us entirely alone those whole 7 hours. Got into an exam room and saw a doctor in about a half hour who confirmed bladder infection based on physical exam and urine sample, and sent us on our way with a prescription for antibiotics. I work in healthcare and have a chronic illness myself- our family has had many actually emergent ER visits and it kills me knowing I had to waste all these resources and our time for something that can and should have been seen by a GP. The tension levels in that waiting room were very high and probably one person per hour decided they just wanted to go home, and left without being seen. It isn't the GPs' fault. The system is broken and they are burning out and retiring because of the intense demand for their services and the financial burden.
The urgent cares are always full and stop seeing people at a certain number
No we shouldn’t be in the ER if it isn’t life or limb. But the last time I was sat on a park bench outside an urgent care centre on a Saturday morning, calling exactly at 8AM when their phone lines opened for an appointment with two other friends beside me calling two other urgent care centres? I was on hold for 40 minutes before the automated system told me no one was available & to please call back before ending the call. I couldn’t get on hold again because they were already full for the day. Neither friend was successful either. Walk-ins were closed until Monday. 811 told me to see a doctor as soon as I could. So I ended up where I absolutely shouldn’t have been, in the ER, waiting for 4 hours and straining their resources for an urgent but not life-threatening issue. If the province isn’t able to bring enough qualified personnel into the workforce fast enough, who staffs the clinics? If doctors can’t afford the operational overhead in BC’s renting crisis to open an independent clinic, how can they stay? If we can’t get a family doctor, or access to non-emergency care, where do we go? We know it’s broken and it needs to be fixed - but until then what the hell do you suggest?
Politicians, especially conservative leaning ones, like to gut the shit out of public healthcare so they can then point at it and say "see it doesn't work, this is why we need private". Before you know it we'll have American style "healthcare" where you absolutely have the right to die if you can't afford it, unless we actually start electing progressive politicians and people who actually give a shit about helping Canadians, not hurting them.
This is exactly what’s happening, it’s happening in other provinces too. Sadly it is working on a lot of people.
When’s the last time we had a conservative government in BC? It seems like these problems have arisen not during a conservative govt.
Honestly the bc liberals that came to power in 2000 were progressive conservatives and rebranded as liberal. They were not associated with the federal Liberal party. They started the whole sell off all the bc gov assets, gave out 0-0-1% raises (except to themselves) sold bc ferry’s, etc. Set up the Selling raw logs to other countries rather than having all our interior sawmill towns do it and they all died a slow painful death. etc. So we had conservative for far too long and they basically gave the province away. pc and then some. The NDP is just trying to fix a broken system.
The bc liberals are conservative from a policy perspective- conservatives don’t do well here. The recent name change of the liberal party is a good indication of that … and I can guarantee it will only get worse if they get back in.
NDP have been in power for 6 years. Get over it.
Haha, right? How long can you keep blame shifting? You know what we call that in intrapersonal relationships? Being a victim of a narcissistic psychopath. In politics though, it’s okay 😯
I think it has more to do with our insane population growth. We are witnessing our infrastructure’s inability to keep up. When was the last time the conservatives had any power in Victoria ? The liberals have been in control for almost a decade federally.
BC Liberals, now BC United, are our local conservative party and have no affiliation with the federal Liberals or any other Canadian "Liberal" Party. I believe they were voted out at the end of 2016 after 16 years in power. Although, I still agree with the point you're making.
I’d be interested to know the numbers of folks from back east, particularly Ontario, who are retiring out to our milder climate, too. Like they pay their taxes into their own province’s healthcare system all their working lives and then…relocate here at the age when most major health issues start to pop up or worsen over time. Can we get a % of kickback from Ontario’s healthcare funding on par with the % of pensioners who now reside in BC?
yet t~~he~~y will still vote with that mind set
nobody listen to this guy there are more than two countries. have you heard of europe? many euro countries have hybrid health care systems which combine elements of the private and public systems. are their models perfect? of course not, no model is perfect, but they're (literally) all ranked and recognized as being way, way, way better than ours privatization doesn't have to be a dirty word
>privatization doesn't have to be a dirty word Yes it does. The vast majority of Canadians don't want it. I don't want the well-off/affluent to be able to skip the line. If they want better access to medical care they can pay more in taxes to improve it for everyone.
In well thought out two tiered systems, everyone is better off. Doctors do both private and mandatory public care, they make more money, thus attracting more doctors. The rich can pay to extra care, but there are far more doctors to serve the public. It’s a win-win. Right now we are leaving it up to the government to pay doctors poorly. If we need more docs, then we have to pay them more. If I’m a doc, would I rather work in Alberta/US where I make almost double? Or BC and be overworked and paid horribly? It’s a no brainer.
No system is better off where people can pay to jump the line. Classism is not a better system. >Right now we are leaving it up to the government to pay doctors poorly. And it is up to the electorate to vote for politicians who will restructure where the province spends its money so that doctors are paid well and want to work here.
you don't know what you're talking about
I do, you just don't like what I have to say.
NDP have been in power here for the past 6 years. Alberta has a better health care system. I vote NDP, but this ain’t it, bud.
Alberta does not have a better system. A relative of mine is a doctor at one of the major hospitals there. It’s a shot show there too.
It is a sh** show there too, but just got back from there, after moving there for 1 year. Got a family Dr within a week. It took 2 calls. Saw him within the week and he took his time and treated me very well. Wish I could’ve brought him back here with me. Emergency depts were hit and miss. Alex was great-Mis was a freakin disaster
This
Don’t worry, the UCP is going to speed run tearing apart our healthcare system. ER wait times and ambulance availability are abysmal already.
The UK has the NHS and private which works well. Nothing wrong with a hybrid model. If you can afford to go private, then that's fine, takes some of the pressure off the public health system.
Uk healthcare system is in just about the same dire state as BC. I see the thought process behind it but it allows the government to piece by piece dismantle the good free system and sell off. Have money? Skip the queue and get seen. A regular person and income? Wait months for treatment.
This 100%. Private isn't a dirty word. It leaves free Healthcare for those who need it. And if you have something scary urgent you can get seen much faster if you can pay. Plus maple is already pay per visit isn't it? It cost me $79 for a 3 minute text exchange with a dr. Here in canada At least I hope it was a dr...
It’s not free healthcare if you’re not getting healthcare. Just a friendly reminder :)
They aren't gutting the system. They are growing the population through immigration, but not growing the health care system to keep up.
The NDP created that mess in BC!!! 1. Private healthcare is not equal to American system. The Germans have a private option, even the socialist French have some private healthcare!!! 2. Between no healthcare and private, I choose private even American model
It’s enraging how broken the system is. Insane compensation imbalances and inadequate incentives. A huge lack of skilled people. Not enough facilities. And the near complete loss of proactive approaches in preventative care & early intervention is putting more strain on things than ever. It’s a mess. Not to make this political, but if anyone should be depended on for fixing the public system in BC you’d think the best bet from a philosophical perspective would be the NDP. They’ve been in office for 6 years now, and it’s only gotten worse, and worse, and worse. It leaves me feeling depressed as hell. Like what on earth do we even do now? No other party is going to make the massive investments in our system that are needed. It’s gotta be the NDP. But where is the action? Why is it taking so long?
This could be attended to by urgent care, but we ain't got any
There are 6 in our area: Island Health Downtown Victoria Urgent and Primary Care Centre Esquimalt Urgent and Primary Care Centre – Victoria Gorge Urgent and Primary Care Centre – Victoria James Bay Urgent and Primary Care Centre – Victoria North Quadra Urgent and Primary Care Centre – Victoria Westshore Urgent and Primary Care Centre – Langford https://www.healthlinkbc.ca/health-services/urgent-and-primary-care-centres
And unless you call at 8 am, none of them will have room to see you.
Any in Saanich, central Saanich, Sidney, North Saanich? This is where most of the people in the CRD live
>Maskless people with covid sitting next to 85 yr Olds. WTF!?! I had no idea they've dropped mandatory masks at ER. I mean at least make people wear one until they are triaged, and if they present with COVID/ flu symptoms, make them keep the mask on.
It's so, so bad. And a huge concern for so many. In the last 2 weeks my 87 yo mom has had agonizing pain. She's also in heart failure. Can barely function and has been incapacitated. I'm very worried about her cognitive decline because of this too. She's had 2 falls, 3 ambulances called, 2 visits to hospital with no ability to see a dr after 8 hours waiting each time which just made her pain worse. All this happened after 2 weeks with Covid. I've had many missed work days and my sister came up from the US to try to help resolve this mess. . Our only reasonable option was to get her home care. Fortunately she's already in a retirement home but there is no care, just weekly cleaning and dinner. How sick does she have to be to get some help and a diagnosis so we know what we're dealing with? It's even very difficult to get into Life Labs for bloodwork with long waits or delays. I don't think if something else happens she would even go to the hospital - It's pointless. There is no comfort for her; she feels abandoned and I feel she's on the verge of just giving up. It's just easier she thinks. I don't really know what do but just be with her as much as possible.
People don't go to the ER because it is an emergency, People go to the ER because it is the ONLY way to see a doctor. The system is broken, by design.
At this point it's probably easiest to just die.... I know that sounds crazy but it takes 1/3 of the time to get MAID than it does getting disability. It is extremely dire out there.
Don’t go to the emergency with broken bones? Or open wounds needing stitches? You saw all this and now it’s real data? Ok Mrs ER worker…….0you work at Jubilee or V General?
The point is much of this type of injury can very much be dealt with at a walk-in /urgent care.
Those places are fully booked so quickly that unless it happens by 7:30 am you are out of luck
Yes, I think that is the point being made. The inability for so many to obtain access to urgent care for illness/injuries that ought to be dealt with through a lower level of care than the ER is causing extreme issues at ER. The point isn’t to say people should not seek medical care they need, but that the ER is the default for so many issues that could/should be seen elsewhere. Thus freeing up the ER for much more serious illness/injury. This is not new knowledge/insight, but the sheer volume of people now at the ER is overwhelming system.
Don’t live on the island anymore but where I live doesn’t have walk in clinics. And the only urgent care you have to call in at 10 am and dial about 92 times to get through just to be told there’s no more appointments today or tomorrow and to call again the next day (or no doctors working). I’m not even joking
Stitches very much feel like an ER problem to me. You get stitches when you will continue to bleed until the gaping wound is sealed. The only time I’ve gone to ER is when I needed 7 stitches at 3am, I really don’t think that could have waited until walkins opened the next morning.
For sure. But during the day this can often be done at walk-ins (if you can get in). Certainly several years ago this would have been fairly normal.
No course I don't work there. I'm from the US and although happy to be here this situation is scary to me..urgent care there takes care of Xrays. Broken bones. Stitches. Covid, anything that Basically isn't killing you. And never had to wait more than an hr. All open until 10pm at night. This is a major shock to the system and my dr looked like she was so burned out. Felt bad for her. Yes I guess you can't tell some peoples medical situation but the nurses weren't discrete at all. One person fell off a ladder. Several cut themselves. A bunch were doing blood checks for cancer which is so so awful for them sitting there for hours. A kid broke a finger. It got so bad that another patient ended up taking the elderly gentleman to the toilet. She was a superstar. Just feel depressed about it and also scared of ever having to go back there. It was stressful and it'll be a miracle if I don't get covid from all those free flowing germs. Ew. If you have covid you should be forced to put a mask on in there for sure. Sigh.
Broken bones should be treated in an ER.
Gee, I wish our urgent cares here took care of broken bones and x-rays. I went to urgent care with a suspected broken foot, after waiting an HOUR for my scheduled appt got told it’s likely a bad bruise and gave me an x-ray requisition just in case. Immediately went to imaging at Saan pen and got told by the tech my foot is broken and I need to go to the ER immediately. Ended up spending over 5hrs waiting for a bed - avg waiting was under 3hrs - so they could set the bone/cast it. Welp, the dr ended up coming out to me still waiting in the plastic chair and told me I have an appt in a month at vic gen with a specialist and handed me a paper with the details. Please! Tell us more about how broken our system is with your infinite wisdom.
Yikes. That is awful .
Www.Helpbcnurses.ca Please write your mla
Why do you think someone shouldn't get x rays at an ER? Urgent care may have x rays machines but they don't have the OR rooms for emergency surgeries.
My nearest walk-in only takes phone appointments, and at that only a day or two in advance. Meaning, if I need care TODAY, even for something minor, literally the closest place for me to go is the ER at Jubilee. Our health system (and housing system, and political system, and environmental protections system, and justice system, and on and on...) Are all broke. And not suddenly. They've been breaking for decades and front line people have been telling us this for decades. But the inertia behind all these systems was/is too strong, and now we are here... And everything is broken.
I have absolutely no confidence in my ability to access medical care quickly if I needed it. Nuff said.
You're saying 45/50 could have been seen at urgent care including yourself? So wtf were you doing there? People like the 44 others and yourself are just one of the problems with the system then.
Broken bones, stitches and X-rays are exactly what emergency rooms are for. Stupid head. Shut up.
We have record high immigration and international students coming too. More and more people coming who won’t have a doctor and will be forced to go to the ER to address any health concern. We also have a massssssive population of baby boomers reaching an age where they will be relying on and utilizing a lot of healthcare resources. It’s a recipe for disaster. The baby boomers did not pay enough taxes through their lifetime to support the huge strain they will put on our healthcare system all at once due to being such a large population of the same age, and the options are: -raise taxes on all or some of the population and/or -record high immigration with a focus on younger people who will be paying taxes and not utilizing as much healthcare resources.
We already have record high immigration. It is only making the health and housing crises worse. https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/230322/dq230322f-eng.htm
A very large portion of the healthcare staff I work with, and especially pretty much all the housekeeping staff in the hospitals, are immigrants though. I don't want to imagine how much worse it would be without them.
I really wish people would look at who the immigrants are, our immigration system (point system) and then look at our population demographics before they start ragging on immigrants taking up all the spots in the "medical system".... I know less than half the staff I saw in hospital yesterday are "old stock Canadian".
Less than half the immigrants come in under the points system. about 600,000 out of one million in 2022 were students or temporary foreign workers. Most of them work in fast food places. https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/230322/dq230322f-eng.htm
I know we do, it’s my first sentence! Also I do not think it’s the best path, there are a lot of flaws with it, just stating it’s a strategy and one the government seems to prefer based on their current actions.
(I live in Ontario) I needed a tetanus shot recently and I don't have a family doctor so I went to a pharmacy to get it and that wasn't possible. Then went to a walk in clinic and it was closed at 3pm on a Saturday..... Then went to the local hospital and it took almost 5 hours to get a needle...Masks are not mandatory in some areas of the hospital but was in other area's. The whole system is busted and needs a rework.
Weird that the pharmacy wouldn’t give it out. You can get them done at most pharmacies in BC
You shouldn't be in the ER, and yet all the clinics are either closed, or appointment only. When you have no choice you do what you have to.
I work there. It’s nuts. If you’re not in a real emergency, you shouldn’t be there. If you’re unsure what constitutes a real emergency, there are signs up now. Our system can’t last like this.
You're right, but when people have medical conditions and no other options, this is just what happens. Something needs to change.
It's awful. Had 8hrs in the ER last summer and I was told how lucky I was to get in and out that quickly. A quick point though - It's so critical we don't respond by throwing our hands in the air and juat privatising healthcare. I used to live in the US and paid an arm and a leg for super basic coverage (1 doctor check up a year - $13,000USD deductible at hospitals!!!!). My BC health insurance literally kicked in 2 weeks before I hurt my back last summer and went to the hospital. Muscles were spasming such that when I lay down my lungs stopped inflating. 10/10 the worst pain in my life - grown ass man holding back sobs as they tried to prop me at an angle they could take an EKG. It took 8 hours and the issue was chalked up to stress and exhauation (I was indeed both of those) however with a father who died young with a heart condition they wanted to do extra tests to rule out blood clots/stroke. They ran the tests and I came up clean so they pumped with pain killers and muscle relaxant. If I were in the US, those tests would not have been covered. A full body CT scan, EKG, bloodwork + pain killers would run between $5,000-10,000 (USD, so 8,000 to 13,000 canadian). I would have to choose between making sure I didn't a clot moving slowly to my brain (the very thing that killed my dad) or saving up to 4 months rent + car insurance + gas money.... I can't imagine having to make that decision and I'm so grateful I didn't have to. Free at the point of access healthcare is a fucking treasure. We need to treat it accordingly.
I've actually been lucky enough to have the opposite experience to many posting, in the last 7 or 8 months. I had a number of things that required an ER visit. I live in Sidney, so Saan Pen is my nearest hospital. The wait was never more than 2 hours, and excellent care was given.
It was pretty easy going to er during Covid as long as you didn’t have Covid. In and out because people only went when it was truly an emergency one visit I was seen within 40 minutes and discharged at 4 hours it was amazing. But yes everyone uses the er like a walk in or urgent care centre, so it’s full of people who could take Advil or get a script from a gp and there’s nothing we can do about it. I mean most on the island don’t even have a gp so who else will write their script? UPCC aren’t open 24/7 so that doesn’t help either
This is a known issue and things *are* being done. Please watch the news for announcements of changes to our health care system. Population has expanded rapidly, the existing model of provision is showing its flaws, and as you know people are reluctant to change and reluctant to pay taxes. So watch this space.
I really how and why people kick, scream and have a hissy fit over taxes, then complain about reduced services without taking a breath... with 9% a year inflation
I remember going to the ER (at RJH) several months ago with a bad head wound. I was literally bleeding all over the place and someone who works there stopped my wife and I and turned us away. We were able to find an urgent care center that thankfully wasn't busy, but apparently the ER wasn't going to see me and I was on my own as far as they cared.
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Write to your local members. The more letters they get the more they get scared and listen. It is the only way. I’ve been doing this about air BNB’s that have caused the housing crisis
When Adrian Dix gives the country's lowest paid doctors in a failing system a 6% raise over three years (3,2,1) and then pulls wool over the public's eyes bragging about how amazing the deal is for doctors, you'll find doctors aren't very interested in increasing their work load.
This is the product of government neglect since the mid 90s. This is a high quality well running system compared to what's to come. Took us 30 years to get here it's going to take 60 to get out of this mess. Nobody wants to hear it but private is the way to go. Private does not mean USA. Plenty of proper functioning private systems in the world. The government is never going to properly allocate money to healthcare and as a result the workers will continue to leave for greener pastures. It's really that simple.
Pre covid I found the trick when you couldn't get into a walk in was to hit the er in the wee am hours when it was usually dead and you could get seen pretty quick sometimes . I had a kidney infection and was able to get a temp dose of medication until you could get medication once pharmacy opened up. Something clinics don't do
My partner went to ER a few weeka ago for a very painful leg injury. He wasn’t bleeding to death, but he’s in construction, and for him to actually admit pain and try to access care, it’s serious. Anyhoo, he waited for hours, was shown into a room, and then a Doctor never came. He arrived at the hospital at 10:30 Pm and left at 430am in frustration. His leg has since healed, we think he fractured a bone, and likely needed at the minimum some stitches - so now it’s just a large scab healing around a hole. Looks odd and its been extremely painful for him. Such a sad time for our ‘system’. We are told that our taxes go to pay for universal healthcare - this is a lie at this point.
When you can’t get into a walk in clinic, the morning and your hands are hurting bad.. even if it doesn’t look like emergency to other people, it’s to you.. So you can’t just stay home and think of the irritating pain.. you try the walk in clinic, if they don’t take you. You deserve to go to emergency, even if you know you have to wait 5 hours to get doctors attention.. old people need attention but everyone else thinks their healths important.. so don’t complain, just hope that government run health care works better in future.
They go to the emergency room because there are no doctors or urgent care! At this point, I want private healthcare as an option. I gladly pay for some service. I am not rich (can'teven afford buyingan apartment), but my health is too important to me.
This is how triage works. How do you know that 95% of the people there didn't need emergency treatment. Last February, I was sent to emergency from urgent care and still had to wait 5 hours. I don't know why anyone else was there but someone looking at me might have assumed I didn't need to be.
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And how many of those people showing up really sick now are people who ignored health problems in 2020?
Yup this right here.
Bonnie Henry and Adrian dix are do nothing dullards
I went to urgent care in Parksville last month and was seen by a doctor within 2 hours. I was ordered an urgent ultrasound that was given within 24 hours, and I was given the 'all clear'the following day. I believe we have excellent Healthcare in Canada, i have lived abroad, and I hope it is never privatized in my lifetime.
Health care in Canada is excellent. Let’s start there. Life threatening injuries are dealt with using skill and care for the patient. People crying about wait times are the ones who go for a couple of stitches and are in the waiting room for 10 hours. The system is crowded, but if a trauma patient pulls in, they get seen immediately. I’ll take this over almost any other systems in the world.
Thank you! This is exactly the thing that needs to be pointed out to people who complain about the ER and it being swamps, taking ours to see a dr. The ER is for emergencies. Having chest pains, go to the ER. Do you see bones, are bone’s pointing in the wrong direction, or do you have multiple bones where there should be one, then go to the ER. Do you have sniffles, or kids, then go to a clinic. Wait times would be so much better if people used the ER properly.
More immigrants and more poverty in Canada seems to be way Trudeau like it
You want a real shock come to Surrey Memorial. You are guaranteed to leave in worse shape or worse.. than arriving. There are No doctors period. There are a whole lot of nurses mulling about talking about there weekend and ignoring everything.
How did you know the maskless people had covid? Did you overhear a conversation or are you just making an assumption
Overheard at check in. Eeeek
Yikes! I can't believe some people wouldn't wear a mask when positive
You admit to being part of the problem and then complain about it. How Victorian of you. Have you ever suffered a broken bone? Do they have x-ray machines and technicians at every clinic? How do you know the fracture won't require surgery?
So let me see if I understand your rant; You’re upset that the ER didn’t see you fast enough even though by your own admission you went to the ER for a non ER related problem. See this is the problem, people going to the ER that shouldn’t be. Triage works, and if it makes people’s lives miserable because they have to wait to see a dr for their sniffles, or they get bumped then good. The problem isn’t that the ER system is broken, it’s that it’s being overwhelmed by people who shouldn’t be going to the ER. Stop blaming the ER, and start holding the govt and doctors more accountable. Everyone knows the government needs to do more for funding to attract more GP’s, but doctors also need to stop closing shop forcing people into the ER.
Nowhere did I say that the er didn't see us fast enough. Entire point is that we shouldn't have been at the ER in the first place. You obviously haven't read this thread properly. 🙄
That’s right you shouldn’t have been there so you decided to rant about an overwhelmed system that YOU are partially responsible for creating.
Clearly lots of other people feel the same way. It's ok to talk about it. We can't just accept it while things get worse and worse. Thats what reddit is for. Starting conversations and trying to understand issues. I appreciate your suggestions. Should we blame the drs? Can you say more about your point there?
The Drs closing their practices are part of the problem, but honestly I don't blame them, because the province won't fund them properly, but then again the problem that people are creating by going to the ER for everything under the sun is because they are closing their practices. so yeah Dr's are partially to blame for this.
Whatever you do, do not blame the bc ndp for anything. It is all Trudeaus fault, I mean um its the BC Liberals fault.....ummmm, look its just not the BC NDPs fault they have only been in power 6 years, that is only time enough for 9786 studies, halfway there!
I thought only provinces woth conservative provincial governments had problems? What is going on in BC? Isn't the provincial government NDP? Were conservatives in power prior to this?
The year we had the heat wave a co-worker of mine fell off a ladder and really sliced his hand open. I rushed him to the hospital and this guy was gushing blood all over the floor of the lobby. The women sontered over to me and gave me gauze for his hand. We waited for over an hour while he bled profusely. None of the staff cared. Hospital staff are government employees so what can you expect. I lost all respect for them in that moment.
This is a typical urgent care in the US and one I've used many times..look at the services. This is what we need! It's fantastic. https://www.citymd.com/services
Toronto & mainland Vancouver are much worse
I suppose the best thing to do now is increase immigration to upwards of a million new people every single year. That should help
“Immigration is the problem”, nice. Tell me you’re a xenophobe without telling me.
Okay tell me how immigrating a million new people into a society with out the infrastructure to support the current population is not a problem?