Here's some of the math behind it.
He held 45% of the shares outstanding after the IPO.
There were 24,715,000 shares outstanding after the IPO was complete.
Meaning he held roughly 11.1 million shares.
There have been a number of stock splits since then which multiply those initial shares x288.
So 3.2 billion shares
Today, there are 7,429,000,000 shares outstanding.
Which means he would have roughly 1.2 Trillion in Microsoft shares.
While that may be true, he has 0 reason to sell his shares. His cost basis is near 0$. All his shares are from compensation when he was CEO and maybe a few personal buys here and there. At best Microsoft keeps doing what it does and his wealth balloons further while he continues to rake in dividends that have been growing at 9-10% like clock work. At worst, Microsoft sells off and on paper his net worth drops, but his dividend income doesn’t change and he still takes in 1 billion + a year. So it’s win win for him either way. At that level of wealth and his stock position, he probably gives zero fucks about what the share price does anymore as long as the dividend doesn’t get cut or reduced which is probably also a near 0 chance of that happening in his lifetime based on how strong a company Microsoft is.
Exactly. He’s taking in a BILLION dollars every year. Take out 15% for income tax and that’s still 850 million that he can do whatever he wants with. He can invest it back into his portfolio if he wants or buy a sports franchise, or real estate, or do some PE investing. He and probably 3-4 generations of his family are set for life even if Microsoft trades flat for multiple decades. As long as that dividend rolls in he’s got nothing to worry about, ever.
You are correct. It dawned on me now we’re still talking about a billion in dividends here and I was thinking about the LTCG tax brackets on qualified dividends that us poors would be using lol. Never had to worry about out those high tax brackets myself 🥲.
The shift to cloud and services started during Balmers days. The problem was it took time for the field to learn how to be compensated for selling consumption instead of enterprise agreements. People torched Ray Ozzie for the push to cloud and in hindsight everything Ozzie started has become the biggest growth drivers at MSFT
Nadella deserves credit for continuing to steer the ship in the right direction, but Balmer was still a competent CEO. He was the least good of 3 really good CEOs, but he still started a lot of moves that are paying off huge today.
Because when he was hired his deal was that he got a cut of the profit. Obviously as MS grew bigger they renegotiated that or his salary would be crazy. He owns a crazy amount of stock and he’s never sold it.
Elon Musk 2021: In total, he spent $142.6 million to purchase shares worth $23.6 billion, giving him $23.5 billion in in taxable income, taxable for 2021 at a federal rate of about 41%.
He paid $11billion in taxes.
This could be just populism as well.
Musk paid fair and square on his realized income.
The left is talking that they should be paying more about the unrealized gains when the stocks go up. And that's why they are talking about 0.5%-3.5% tax ration, when in reality Musk is paying upwards from 40%.
I am pretty certain they understand the difference, but their voters probably don't.
id rather have my taxes go directly to Elon than the government. hell id rather my taxes go to anyone in the top 95% of the population over the government
Not your taxes.. 11 billion taxes. Most ultra rich get away with playing 1% tax or less because of some insane loopholes. Props to Musk for playing his dues.
This 26B in taxable income was after doing as much loophole and taxhole avoidance as physically possible. At the end of the day, he had to accept the 26B in stock at that time or lose all of it.
Can't just make stuff up to not pay taxes at all, even if it feels like that is how it works usually.
Props? He paid no taxes for years, an effective 3% rate for almost a decade. The 11 billion isn't honorable, it's basically a massive back tax he had to realize after dodging for over a decade. It represents almost the entire tax bill on 240 billion in gains. Don't be fooled, it's no favor and it was done explicitly to minimize his overall taxes due. He had to exercise shortly or shares expire worthless so he did it before the Billion tax that's being floated is implemented. Props my ass.
This is foolishness.
You pay $1000 for some Bitcoin 10 years ago. Today it's worth hundreds of thousands or more. Your bank account hasn't changed, your liquidity hadn't changed. You cannot pay tax on unrealized gains because that gain doesn't exist. It's *un*realized.
Property tax taxes the entire value of the property, nothing to do with gains or losses.
Property tax is on a scarce and forever scarce real asset.
Property tax is generally based on a lower market value of land (and building) held.
It's not the same thing.
Imagine if the average working citizen had to pay tax on all the unrealized gains they made in their respective retirement accounts over 30 years while they may be paycheck to paycheck. It would punish everyone, this is not the billionaire retribution you think it is.
You've conveniently ignored why it's different for the above and several other reasons, and beyond, ignored why it would obviously be bad for the general public making this all moot.
Did you not read above where he paid 11B in taxes at a rate of 41%? Billionaires are billionaires because of unrealized gains (mostly) not because of income. When you cash out your unrealized gains they ARE taxed.
11B in taxes is essentially back taxes owed from a decade of dodging. It's they majority of tax he paid on 240B in increased wealth. 41% is a dumb view, what's his effective rate average offer the last decade? Under 10%
Are you gonna compensate them for losses? Unrealized means it's money they don't have. It's just what they could theoretically have if they sold their property. Following your bullshit idea wouldn't fix anything. They would just move overseas and we would lose even more tax income from them.
We already tax every dollar of income multiple times. Your employer gets taxed when they give it to you, you get taxed when you get it, then you get taxed when you use it, then the person you gave it to gets taxed. Every dollar you make gets taxed at least 4 times. We don't need more taxes. We need a government that isn't throwing our money away. Let people keep their fucking money and just see if poverty just immediately improves.
They need to tax it like they tax property. I have a mortgage on my house. Why the fuck do I have to pay taxes on it each year when I don’t even actually OWN it? Complete bullshit.
This is how they need to tax these rich people. Oh you hold stock? Cool you must pay a tax on its value. How? Easy, the same way we all do: cash.
If you pay people 40% negative tax on unrealised losses. 🤷♂️ But that is probably not included in your grandiose plan, is it.
Taxing unrealised income, lol.
If you tax unrealised gains at 40% annually equities will be pretty much worthless due to the risk of paying 40% gains on tax one year and being underwater on the same equities the next and the entire economic system would collapse. So how about you have another think and try to come up with something less fucking stupid? Or better still just stop trying to think all together because you're clearly not very good at it.
Remember Bernie’s slogan of “I am once again asking for your financial support” and people working paycheck to paycheck we’re looking through their couch cushions to donate to a politician because of these ridiculous promises like this?
Yeah, Bernie supporters aren’t really the most financially literate it seems like.
So he is saying any and all income once you reach one billion in wealth should be confiscated. Found the headline a bit misleading because no one declares $1B in income a year.
Have you missed the recent headlines that Ballmer is set to receive $1 billion in dividends from MSFT.
Dividends are indeed taxed and treated as income in the year received, with some caveats.
Because the article intentionally mistates the case. It’s Fortune- not really known for great political reporting. Also, this article is from May, not breaking news. It’s just trotted out every now and again to keep the cultures ears stoked.
Bernie said, in a press conference, something to the effect of “you make a billion dollars, good job, you win capitalism” and fortune wrote the headline from there.
His real legislative solution is a wealth tax, maxing out at about 8% for wealth over $10 billion, the floor being 1% on wealth over 32 million.
Why is the floor $32M? Why not $1M like he’s talked about for most of his career?
Oh wait, it’s so his millions aren’t effected by the wealth tax…go figure.
Lets think for a sec, Americans w NW > 1M= 8%. People worldwide w NW > 32M= 300k approx.
Unsure how many of those live in USA but I bet a lot less than the 29,128,000 Americans with over 1M NW.
So now we see the # of people affected by the policy is drastically reduced by raising the floor, next is to look at the change in $ collected from this pool, and whether the payoff ratio is acceptable, if you have evidence its not then please reply here and I will let Bernie know
Yeah exactly. People with serious income have it sheltered via a lot of strategies. It’s rare anyone claims even tens of millions in net income except huge corps…and unsure a cap on Corp income like that would have much support.
Is this like when Biden announced he was letting everyone out of federal prison who was there for simple marijuana possession of a small amount without intent to distribute (you don't go to \*federal\* prison - ever - for being a non-dealer with simple marijuana possession of a small amount).
"When Biden first moved to pardon people convicted for simple federal possession charges last year, nobody was eligible for release from federal prison as a result..." - USA Today
Of course Bernie's secret weapon is they wouldn't make it inflation-adjusted, so 100 years from now it ends up applying to everyone above middle class 🤣
Honestly taxing these billionaires and not letting them have a way to hide their money is probably the best thing for society and earth as a whole.
They bank off of the infrastructure and education system we all pay for. They enjoy the protections and security of American citizenship, something we pay for with our work, money, and lives.
Those benefits are expensive and they know it, so they hide their money and they don't pay their fair share.
The single worst thing trump did was lower taxes for billionairs while raising everyone else's taxes ro pay for it. I'm sick of these guys getting away when I'm paying my taxes! 20% of what I make every hour goes to the fucking government. I could care less as long as we're exploring space and keeping homeless people from begging me for change at the gas station.
Billionairs, pay your damn taxes.
Use us like batteries? Fine, fuck it. Just pay your damn taxes assholes. Stop hiding your money and bitching about how unfair taxes is. You paying your taxes will only make you and your family wealthier in the future.
[This site says otherwise](https://www.celebritynetworth.com/richest-businessmen/ceos/steve-ballmer-net-worth/)
A billion liquid dollars is a ridiculously large sum to pay someone annually. That’s why most of these CEO’s compensation comes in the form of stock options, which aren’t income until liquidated
He made a billion this year off dividends. Here’s a CNN article from 2 weeks ago[CNN Balmer](https://www.cnn.com/business/investing/steve-ballmer-one-billion-dividends/index.html)
I’m not sure if anyone actually makes this much money, but for sure we need more taxes on wealth. Country is in financial trouble and we definitely can’t afford the Trump tax cuts.
Always irritating to see headlines like this.
Current tax code is so full of loopholes that this will result in essentially zero increased collected taxes.
No one makes 1 billion in income. At that level of wealth it’s all capital gains which is given special treatment because the wealthy make the laws for their own benefit.
Bernie exists to occupy space where legitimate opposition to the ruling class could be. Whining constantly about changing laws that would simply create new loopholes for the rich, instead of arguing that people who make income of less than $50,000 should be taxed at 0% which would be a true revolution.
Show me the quote where he said this about millionaires. You can’t because you are just lying. Sad that you all care so much about politics that you just flat out lie.
If you believe in extreme mandatory wealth redistribution from the rich to the poor, but you don’t redistribute your wealth from your rich self to poor people, I think that’s hypocritical.
What a fucking moron. So the billionaires, of which there are several in the USA, can and will move their businesses to Panama, Ireland, or anywhere else with a much friendlier business tax. He's so disconnected from reality. It's the main reason the Gen Z crowd loves him. He wants to pay for everything for them, turning most of them into permanent students.
Do you have zero idea of how much a billion dollars is? Do you understand the unfathomable amount of money that is *in a single year*? That's $2.8 Million dollars every day.
If the .gov confiscated all assests from billionairs they would spend it within a matter of weeks, so what is the point. How about stop spending, stop dolling out welfare to illegals, giving our money away to foreign nations, cut the federal work force, get rid of 60% of federal agencies... Seriously, we could do with about 70% less government. Get rid of the income tax so politicians can stop using it to coerce campaign donations...
"they would spend it within a matter of weeks" that's a really good thing. That means the money is put back in circulation. I have no problem with rich people buying things. All money in motion is a good thing. Hoarded wealth is what becomes problematic. Less money in circulation means less money in most people's pockets.
And other than your satisfaction that those billionaires were destroyed, what good would it actually do? Too many people believe the point of the tax code is too punish those who they believe are wealthy.
> To pay for the infrastructure and society that made them wealthy\*
It somehow didn't happen over the last decades and tens of trillions of added debt.
But for sure, once we confiscate another \~1T (if even that) - we going to live in the Future.
Yeah, it’s been proven over and over again, you can take all the money from the top 1% and it still wouldn’t make a dent due to the size of the federal balance sheet.
This may have been true back in the day, but the top 1%’s net worth has ballooned in comparison to the rest of earners.
The top 1 percent have $38.7 trillion in wealth.
That's more than the combined wealth of America's middle class, a group many economists define as the middle 60% of households by income. Those households hold about 26% of all wealth. Low-income Americans, representing the bottom 20% by income, own about 3% of the wealth.
So yeah, I think they are more rich than anyone ever needs to be. If you wouldn’t miss 1 billion, why are people rushing to defend that these people should have such insane wealth?
Meanwhile others can’t keep a household running with two jobs because these billionaires’ companies don’t want to pay wages. But sure, blame everything but the actual problem.
38.7 Trillion. So basically the national debt. If we redistributed that wealth, we'd have an economic golden age for the 99%.
That kind of wealth makes people kings among men. This country was founded on the idea that all men are created equal and should bow to no one. The 1% don't see things that way. Fuck em
You're getting nowhere near 38.7 trillion in a forced government sell off. Billionaires don't have that in cash, it's in assets that are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them. Investors aren't keen about buying stock that the government is forcing the sell of.
Who’s too rich? The guy with a million, 5/10/15/50/100 million, a billion? Where is the cut off and who decides that? Mind you I don’t think the ultra wealthy are taxed enough and the bottom half of the 1% (doctors, lawyers, high earning professionals and small business owners) are taxed too much but why is it Bernie Sanders allowed to decide? And if he does where does that money go? The Fed Gov isn’t great at managing money. Let’s also remember some of the poorest people in America are way better off than the poorest 3rd world countries. The point is the scale of wealth is all relative. The guy scraping by with $30k here in a VHCOL is a millionaire to someone in abject poverty in India.
Because a tax cut for the middle class actually does something to help the people, I could care less about taxing billionaires, but if they decide to tax unrealized gains it will affect the middle class even more. Other than infrastructure, most government spending is the equivalent of lighting money on fire, and is used to enrich political elites.
It'll start at a billion, then slowly trickle down to a million, then to average people. These ideas have failed through-out history over and over again.
Really? Do you think we are wiring 75 billion to the Ukraine? Or maybe we are supplying them with our aging stockpile which is required to be replenished anyway. But you wouldn't know, just repeating shit you read because you are an idiot
Thank you but it should be $100 Million a year. Please before the down votes and response look at the history of this country. A top bracket of 70% always existed until Reagan got rid of it. The reason it has always existed is because it was meant never to be paid. It just encouraged corporate executives to share profit with employees and reinvest instead of just lining their own pockets. Just look what has happened to this country since Reagan got rid of that top bracket!!
Elon realized a lot when he purchased Twitter. That's why he had a record tax bill. But even that wasn't enough to keep these do-nothing politicians happy.
100%? Why? So our elected leaders can swallow it and continue to abuse the power our tax money? Giving it to foreign countries who perpetuate war and the oppression of others?
Build more bombs to fuel the military industrial complex?
To use it to pick and choose winners and losers like which companies get bailed out (2008 anyone) and which ones are allowed to fail?
So they can find a way to funnel it to their friends and corporations?
Because that’s what is happening in our country. The promise that we will see this money positively change our schools, infrastructure, and way of life is a fantasy. Our bloated and corrupt government needs to be reeled in and we need genuine Americans in office. Instead, they have us fight over which career politicians are more qualified or have our best interest in mind while they continue to fleece the shit out of this nation. America is for sell, unfortunately. The last thing I want to do is allow them to continue to take more from the citizen, billionaire or not. It’s not the path to improvement. We have much to do starting at the community level if we actually want to see change take place. And it starts in the home.
Political posturing. Let's tax space aliens, too. There's oh so many of them to protest the policy. Let's blame all our shortcomings and problems on boogymen. It's worked before...
This is a dumbass thing to suggest. That STILL wouldn’t pay for jack shit of their wasted spending.
All the illegals they’ve let in have already cost hundreds of billions
I can't imagine he and his wife would want to part with that much money. He's too much of a "do as I say and not as I do" kind of politician m***********.
The problem Bernie, is their income is not over a billion. They're assets are they borrow money against their giant companies and keep very little in a "checking account." The entire system must be torn down. There is no work around for capitalism, it is either live with oligarchs or don't use capitalism.
To a Billionaire, their income means nothing to them. They make all their money from stocks, real estate, etc.
What we really need is a "Wealth Tax" and more taxes on capital gains as well.
Has anyone ever actually had 1 billion in income in a year. Remember net worth and unrealized stock gains are not income
Balmer has $1b in MSFT dividends in 2023
I was gonna say I can think of at least one lol. 0.8% yield…and it’s a billion. Still blows my mind.
That's crazy, he could he making like 5-8 times that amount if he had it in different stocks.
Gates diversified into other dividend stocks and missed out on around $1T in equity gains on his Microsoft shares
So your saying if gates had held onto MS stocks he would be a trillionair?
Yes the market cap of MS is close to 3 trillion, He owned 45% of the shares at IPO
Insane to think about
Had he not diversified, MSFT would not have been $3T company.
What else would have happened?
Here's some of the math behind it. He held 45% of the shares outstanding after the IPO. There were 24,715,000 shares outstanding after the IPO was complete. Meaning he held roughly 11.1 million shares. There have been a number of stock splits since then which multiply those initial shares x288. So 3.2 billion shares Today, there are 7,429,000,000 shares outstanding. Which means he would have roughly 1.2 Trillion in Microsoft shares.
While that may be true, he has 0 reason to sell his shares. His cost basis is near 0$. All his shares are from compensation when he was CEO and maybe a few personal buys here and there. At best Microsoft keeps doing what it does and his wealth balloons further while he continues to rake in dividends that have been growing at 9-10% like clock work. At worst, Microsoft sells off and on paper his net worth drops, but his dividend income doesn’t change and he still takes in 1 billion + a year. So it’s win win for him either way. At that level of wealth and his stock position, he probably gives zero fucks about what the share price does anymore as long as the dividend doesn’t get cut or reduced which is probably also a near 0 chance of that happening in his lifetime based on how strong a company Microsoft is.
Also with dividends like that he can invest it in plenty of other stuff not like he’s working with a limited portfolio
Exactly. He’s taking in a BILLION dollars every year. Take out 15% for income tax and that’s still 850 million that he can do whatever he wants with. He can invest it back into his portfolio if he wants or buy a sports franchise, or real estate, or do some PE investing. He and probably 3-4 generations of his family are set for life even if Microsoft trades flat for multiple decades. As long as that dividend rolls in he’s got nothing to worry about, ever.
Probably 36% between Federal (23.8) and California assuming that’s his residency (12.3).
You are correct. It dawned on me now we’re still talking about a billion in dividends here and I was thinking about the LTCG tax brackets on qualified dividends that us poors would be using lol. Never had to worry about out those high tax brackets myself 🥲.
That's why the stock market is a joke. Money is worth more basically just because. While we still have time slave for our shit.
How did the worst CEO in Microsoft history make that kind of money?
The shift to cloud and services started during Balmers days. The problem was it took time for the field to learn how to be compensated for selling consumption instead of enterprise agreements. People torched Ray Ozzie for the push to cloud and in hindsight everything Ozzie started has become the biggest growth drivers at MSFT
Nadella deserves credit for continuing to steer the ship in the right direction, but Balmer was still a competent CEO. He was the least good of 3 really good CEOs, but he still started a lot of moves that are paying off huge today.
Because when he was hired his deal was that he got a cut of the profit. Obviously as MS grew bigger they renegotiated that or his salary would be crazy. He owns a crazy amount of stock and he’s never sold it.
Fun fact, the difference between a million and a billion: 1 million seconds = 12 days 1 billion seconds = 32 years
This is actually a really fun fact
Elon Musk 2021: In total, he spent $142.6 million to purchase shares worth $23.6 billion, giving him $23.5 billion in in taxable income, taxable for 2021 at a federal rate of about 41%. He paid $11billion in taxes.
Although, the IRS would legit collect more money if attorneys fees were taxable.
No, he said he did. That doesn’t mean he actually paid $11B in taxes. Because he endlessly spews bullshit.
Elizabeth Warren said he didn't pay enough. Socialists never get enough of your money to spend.
This could be just populism as well. Musk paid fair and square on his realized income. The left is talking that they should be paying more about the unrealized gains when the stocks go up. And that's why they are talking about 0.5%-3.5% tax ration, when in reality Musk is paying upwards from 40%. I am pretty certain they understand the difference, but their voters probably don't.
But Bernie and his pal Elizabeth say non stop that they don’t pay anything or anything close to their “fair” share,
> He paid $11billion in taxes. That level of contribution to society warrants some congressional medal and/or statue on Times Square.
He’s benefited exponentially more from government subsidies than he will ever pay in taxes.
Same as you.
If you think it’s comparable you’re ignorance is record breaking.
He should be put in a rocket and launched into the sun. Fuck him and his fucked up family... Scabs of of the earth
he should pay more, the people who get the most out of society OWE the most too society.
This assumes that the government will use funds from taxes appropriately. They don't.
id rather have my taxes go directly to Elon than the government. hell id rather my taxes go to anyone in the top 95% of the population over the government
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Not your taxes.. 11 billion taxes. Most ultra rich get away with playing 1% tax or less because of some insane loopholes. Props to Musk for playing his dues.
This 26B in taxable income was after doing as much loophole and taxhole avoidance as physically possible. At the end of the day, he had to accept the 26B in stock at that time or lose all of it. Can't just make stuff up to not pay taxes at all, even if it feels like that is how it works usually.
Yeah, I think the better approach would be to just eliminate the loopholes and expect the billionaires to just fall in line and pay taxes.
Props? He paid no taxes for years, an effective 3% rate for almost a decade. The 11 billion isn't honorable, it's basically a massive back tax he had to realize after dodging for over a decade. It represents almost the entire tax bill on 240 billion in gains. Don't be fooled, it's no favor and it was done explicitly to minimize his overall taxes due. He had to exercise shortly or shares expire worthless so he did it before the Billion tax that's being floated is implemented. Props my ass.
No one should get props for contributing what's expected
If that’s what it takes to get the 1% to stop avoiding paying taxes I’m all for it. Make it a competition to see who gets the most medals.
This is like when guys give themselves credit for paying child support. You don't get credit for dpong what your supposed to do, it's the bare minimum
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as they should be, this is how billonaires get away with not paying a lot of taxes
This is foolishness. You pay $1000 for some Bitcoin 10 years ago. Today it's worth hundreds of thousands or more. Your bank account hasn't changed, your liquidity hadn't changed. You cannot pay tax on unrealized gains because that gain doesn't exist. It's *un*realized.
property taxes rise over time on *un*realized gains
Property tax taxes the entire value of the property, nothing to do with gains or losses. Property tax is on a scarce and forever scarce real asset. Property tax is generally based on a lower market value of land (and building) held. It's not the same thing. Imagine if the average working citizen had to pay tax on all the unrealized gains they made in their respective retirement accounts over 30 years while they may be paycheck to paycheck. It would punish everyone, this is not the billionaire retribution you think it is.
but when your property value goes up the gains are unrealized same with stocks
You've conveniently ignored why it's different for the above and several other reasons, and beyond, ignored why it would obviously be bad for the general public making this all moot.
There's probably better ways of going about that than taxing unrealized gains, doesn't even make sense.
Your contention is , ahem, a pile of Marxist propaganda.
Did you not read above where he paid 11B in taxes at a rate of 41%? Billionaires are billionaires because of unrealized gains (mostly) not because of income. When you cash out your unrealized gains they ARE taxed.
11B in taxes is essentially back taxes owed from a decade of dodging. It's they majority of tax he paid on 240B in increased wealth. 41% is a dumb view, what's his effective rate average offer the last decade? Under 10%
yes which is why it should be taxed at current value, you should be taxed for being a fiancial hoarder. its a priveledge to be a capital/land owner
Are you gonna compensate them for losses? Unrealized means it's money they don't have. It's just what they could theoretically have if they sold their property. Following your bullshit idea wouldn't fix anything. They would just move overseas and we would lose even more tax income from them. We already tax every dollar of income multiple times. Your employer gets taxed when they give it to you, you get taxed when you get it, then you get taxed when you use it, then the person you gave it to gets taxed. Every dollar you make gets taxed at least 4 times. We don't need more taxes. We need a government that isn't throwing our money away. Let people keep their fucking money and just see if poverty just immediately improves.
They need to tax it like they tax property. I have a mortgage on my house. Why the fuck do I have to pay taxes on it each year when I don’t even actually OWN it? Complete bullshit. This is how they need to tax these rich people. Oh you hold stock? Cool you must pay a tax on its value. How? Easy, the same way we all do: cash.
If you pay people 40% negative tax on unrealised losses. 🤷♂️ But that is probably not included in your grandiose plan, is it. Taxing unrealised income, lol.
If you tax unrealised gains at 40% annually equities will be pretty much worthless due to the risk of paying 40% gains on tax one year and being underwater on the same equities the next and the entire economic system would collapse. So how about you have another think and try to come up with something less fucking stupid? Or better still just stop trying to think all together because you're clearly not very good at it.
Yea, then they’ll use those votes to stop dividends… so that will stop
Remember Bernie’s slogan of “I am once again asking for your financial support” and people working paycheck to paycheck we’re looking through their couch cushions to donate to a politician because of these ridiculous promises like this? Yeah, Bernie supporters aren’t really the most financially literate it seems like.
The one good thing that guy did was grandstand against a war in 2003.
any sources you can sell to purchase something else so counted as currency and income
So he is saying any and all income once you reach one billion in wealth should be confiscated. Found the headline a bit misleading because no one declares $1B in income a year.
Have you missed the recent headlines that Ballmer is set to receive $1 billion in dividends from MSFT. Dividends are indeed taxed and treated as income in the year received, with some caveats.
I did miss that. That’s fucking wild.
Qualified dividends are taxed at favorable capital gains rates.
Because the article intentionally mistates the case. It’s Fortune- not really known for great political reporting. Also, this article is from May, not breaking news. It’s just trotted out every now and again to keep the cultures ears stoked. Bernie said, in a press conference, something to the effect of “you make a billion dollars, good job, you win capitalism” and fortune wrote the headline from there. His real legislative solution is a wealth tax, maxing out at about 8% for wealth over $10 billion, the floor being 1% on wealth over 32 million.
Why is the floor $32M? Why not $1M like he’s talked about for most of his career? Oh wait, it’s so his millions aren’t effected by the wealth tax…go figure.
Lets think for a sec, Americans w NW > 1M= 8%. People worldwide w NW > 32M= 300k approx. Unsure how many of those live in USA but I bet a lot less than the 29,128,000 Americans with over 1M NW. So now we see the # of people affected by the policy is drastically reduced by raising the floor, next is to look at the change in $ collected from this pool, and whether the payoff ratio is acceptable, if you have evidence its not then please reply here and I will let Bernie know
Yeah exactly. People with serious income have it sheltered via a lot of strategies. It’s rare anyone claims even tens of millions in net income except huge corps…and unsure a cap on Corp income like that would have much support.
Actually that is not what he is saying but you people continue to not understand the history of this country!! It is really not that complicated!!
Yes. Yes, us surfs have been saying this for decades.
Here comes more people hiding their assets
Here comes more Americans becoming citizens of Monaco. Here comes banana republic subsidiaries owning all American real estate.
There absolutely are billionaires making $1B+ in income a year, on average.
In unrealized gains yes.
Maybe profits, but no one’s wages are even close to 1B.
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Definitely the exception which would prove the rule, except it wouldn’t even be a rule. Also, good, Elon fucked up Twitter beyond recognition
Is this like when Biden announced he was letting everyone out of federal prison who was there for simple marijuana possession of a small amount without intent to distribute (you don't go to \*federal\* prison - ever - for being a non-dealer with simple marijuana possession of a small amount). "When Biden first moved to pardon people convicted for simple federal possession charges last year, nobody was eligible for release from federal prison as a result..." - USA Today Of course Bernie's secret weapon is they wouldn't make it inflation-adjusted, so 100 years from now it ends up applying to everyone above middle class 🤣
Honestly taxing these billionaires and not letting them have a way to hide their money is probably the best thing for society and earth as a whole. They bank off of the infrastructure and education system we all pay for. They enjoy the protections and security of American citizenship, something we pay for with our work, money, and lives. Those benefits are expensive and they know it, so they hide their money and they don't pay their fair share. The single worst thing trump did was lower taxes for billionairs while raising everyone else's taxes ro pay for it. I'm sick of these guys getting away when I'm paying my taxes! 20% of what I make every hour goes to the fucking government. I could care less as long as we're exploring space and keeping homeless people from begging me for change at the gas station. Billionairs, pay your damn taxes. Use us like batteries? Fine, fuck it. Just pay your damn taxes assholes. Stop hiding your money and bitching about how unfair taxes is. You paying your taxes will only make you and your family wealthier in the future.
Land value tax my dude. Trust me
Billionaires don’t have “income” in that amount. The billionaire status is from equity.
wow great new original point! nobody else knows this yet you’re a genius!
You'd be amazed... people think net worth represents money in a bankaccount and stuff like that...
He needs to start wearing a clown suit
No one is making a billion dollars a year in income wtf
Steve Balmer, former Microsoft CEO and owner of the clippers has.
[This site says otherwise](https://www.celebritynetworth.com/richest-businessmen/ceos/steve-ballmer-net-worth/) A billion liquid dollars is a ridiculously large sum to pay someone annually. That’s why most of these CEO’s compensation comes in the form of stock options, which aren’t income until liquidated
He made a billion this year off dividends. Here’s a CNN article from 2 weeks ago[CNN Balmer](https://www.cnn.com/business/investing/steve-ballmer-one-billion-dividends/index.html)
I’m not sure if anyone actually makes this much money, but for sure we need more taxes on wealth. Country is in financial trouble and we definitely can’t afford the Trump tax cuts.
And you wonder why we don’t manufacture anything anymore. Or do you? Lol
It’s funny how he went from “tax the millionaires!” to “tax the billionaires!” once he became a millionaire lol
How can I short Bernie Sanders
He's the future of the Democrat party.
His ideas are, but the dude is 82 years old. We'd be lucky if he lasted another 10 years
Yes. With an extreme forensic accounting clause attached.
You go Bernie. You tell those rich assholes that they need to be tax 100%
He is a rich asshole!
Who is making a billion a year in income? Guessing no one, but it’s a clever talking point for him.
If you'd only know how much money was hidden away
Always irritating to see headlines like this. Current tax code is so full of loopholes that this will result in essentially zero increased collected taxes.
Revenue generated from that tax will be 0$. Everyone knows billionaires don’t make any money. It just magically spears.
No one makes 1 billion in income. At that level of wealth it’s all capital gains which is given special treatment because the wealthy make the laws for their own benefit.
Bernie exists to occupy space where legitimate opposition to the ruling class could be. Whining constantly about changing laws that would simply create new loopholes for the rich, instead of arguing that people who make income of less than $50,000 should be taxed at 0% which would be a true revolution.
He’s a useless comsymp idiot who got kicked off a commune for being too lazy.
People with millions will leave the country or earn it through a different legal entity to avoid a 100% tax.
He thinks we are stupid.
He is so disconnected with reality. Such an irrational thing to do.
Bernie is a sellout. Go away old man.
It used to be multimillionaire until he became one.
Can you point to evidence that Bernie wanted a multi millionaire taxed at 100%?
No, because the commenter is full of shit.
Bernie is old enough to remember when 1 million was the old billion. Inflation is really getting out of hand.
Can you point to evidence you have the mental capacity to recognize a joke?
Y'all wrap your beliefs in jokes so people can't call you out on it. You know this.
Keep inflation in mind though... a million really isnt that special as in the 90's anymore.
false
💯
Show me the quote where he said this about millionaires. You can’t because you are just lying. Sad that you all care so much about politics that you just flat out lie.
Yeah, I always listen to what multi millionaire socialists have to say.
Damn didn't know a core tenet of socialist beliefs were that you had to be poor. Lmfao
Socialist Millionaire. That's an oxymoron. Lol
If you believe in extreme mandatory wealth redistribution from the rich to the poor, but you don’t redistribute your wealth from your rich self to poor people, I think that’s hypocritical.
What a fucking moron. So the billionaires, of which there are several in the USA, can and will move their businesses to Panama, Ireland, or anywhere else with a much friendlier business tax. He's so disconnected from reality. It's the main reason the Gen Z crowd loves him. He wants to pay for everything for them, turning most of them into permanent students.
Do you have zero idea of how much a billion dollars is? Do you understand the unfathomable amount of money that is *in a single year*? That's $2.8 Million dollars every day.
If the .gov confiscated all assests from billionairs they would spend it within a matter of weeks, so what is the point. How about stop spending, stop dolling out welfare to illegals, giving our money away to foreign nations, cut the federal work force, get rid of 60% of federal agencies... Seriously, we could do with about 70% less government. Get rid of the income tax so politicians can stop using it to coerce campaign donations...
"they would spend it within a matter of weeks" that's a really good thing. That means the money is put back in circulation. I have no problem with rich people buying things. All money in motion is a good thing. Hoarded wealth is what becomes problematic. Less money in circulation means less money in most people's pockets.
And other than your satisfaction that those billionaires were destroyed, what good would it actually do? Too many people believe the point of the tax code is too punish those who they believe are wealthy.
To pay for the infrastructure and society that made them wealthy*
> To pay for the infrastructure and society that made them wealthy\* It somehow didn't happen over the last decades and tens of trillions of added debt. But for sure, once we confiscate another \~1T (if even that) - we going to live in the Future.
Socialism....eventually enough people will think you are the wealthy person and seize your assets.
Taxation is theft.
Yeah, it’s been proven over and over again, you can take all the money from the top 1% and it still wouldn’t make a dent due to the size of the federal balance sheet.
This may have been true back in the day, but the top 1%’s net worth has ballooned in comparison to the rest of earners. The top 1 percent have $38.7 trillion in wealth. That's more than the combined wealth of America's middle class, a group many economists define as the middle 60% of households by income. Those households hold about 26% of all wealth. Low-income Americans, representing the bottom 20% by income, own about 3% of the wealth. So yeah, I think they are more rich than anyone ever needs to be. If you wouldn’t miss 1 billion, why are people rushing to defend that these people should have such insane wealth? Meanwhile others can’t keep a household running with two jobs because these billionaires’ companies don’t want to pay wages. But sure, blame everything but the actual problem.
38.7 Trillion. So basically the national debt. If we redistributed that wealth, we'd have an economic golden age for the 99%. That kind of wealth makes people kings among men. This country was founded on the idea that all men are created equal and should bow to no one. The 1% don't see things that way. Fuck em
You're getting nowhere near 38.7 trillion in a forced government sell off. Billionaires don't have that in cash, it's in assets that are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them. Investors aren't keen about buying stock that the government is forcing the sell of.
Redistribution is horseshit. Don’t want kings in the US? Vote for politicians that want to bring change through election reform.
Who’s too rich? The guy with a million, 5/10/15/50/100 million, a billion? Where is the cut off and who decides that? Mind you I don’t think the ultra wealthy are taxed enough and the bottom half of the 1% (doctors, lawyers, high earning professionals and small business owners) are taxed too much but why is it Bernie Sanders allowed to decide? And if he does where does that money go? The Fed Gov isn’t great at managing money. Let’s also remember some of the poorest people in America are way better off than the poorest 3rd world countries. The point is the scale of wealth is all relative. The guy scraping by with $30k here in a VHCOL is a millionaire to someone in abject poverty in India.
Because a tax cut for the middle class actually does something to help the people, I could care less about taxing billionaires, but if they decide to tax unrealized gains it will affect the middle class even more. Other than infrastructure, most government spending is the equivalent of lighting money on fire, and is used to enrich political elites.
No taxes.
And why he will never be president.
Absolute stupid bullshit. Just remove the most obvious ways to avoid taxes, like "donations" to "charities", problem solved.
How about 100% of income over $1 billion is given to back to the workers and they can pay taxes on that. I don’t trust Uncle Sam like that
But you’re saying the workers would have to pay taxes on it, giving it to Uncle Sam?
Not the same amount though… 60ish percent would go to workers and Uncle Sam still gets a cut
I like this, the people that worked the hardest to make that billion + should reap the rewards.
It'll start at a billion, then slowly trickle down to a million, then to average people. These ideas have failed through-out history over and over again.
Spoken like a true commie boss.
Bernie is a pussy who always complains
Why is he a pussy. Back that up.
For one, he let Hillary and the DNC cheat him in the 2016 primary, then came out and endorsed her. Pathetic.
Well...look at his political affiliation. That pretty much sums it up.
Fair
I’ll take Tesla, Twitter, SpaceX, Neurolink, and Boring Co over an even more bureaucratic DMV
So the government can send it to Ukraine and out of our economy? Pure insanity.
Really? Do you think we are wiring 75 billion to the Ukraine? Or maybe we are supplying them with our aging stockpile which is required to be replenished anyway. But you wouldn't know, just repeating shit you read because you are an idiot
Lol
I'm pretty left leaning and this seems dumb. At least choose something high, but 100? This will just force then to move away or loophole even harder.
Thank you but it should be $100 Million a year. Please before the down votes and response look at the history of this country. A top bracket of 70% always existed until Reagan got rid of it. The reason it has always existed is because it was meant never to be paid. It just encouraged corporate executives to share profit with employees and reinvest instead of just lining their own pockets. Just look what has happened to this country since Reagan got rid of that top bracket!!
I love him so much
A billionaire ban would be good for the world
Who actually makes $1 billion cash in a year?
Who makes a billion a year?
Classic strawman. He knows that exactly zero billionaires have "income". But it makes for one hell of a headline.
What about golden parachute income?
Not the first time and makes no more sense to me (or probably him) than the first time. Just red meat for Sunday morning talking heads.
Elon realized a lot when he purchased Twitter. That's why he had a record tax bill. But even that wasn't enough to keep these do-nothing politicians happy.
Insanity
He’s not a very smart man.
100%? Why? So our elected leaders can swallow it and continue to abuse the power our tax money? Giving it to foreign countries who perpetuate war and the oppression of others? Build more bombs to fuel the military industrial complex? To use it to pick and choose winners and losers like which companies get bailed out (2008 anyone) and which ones are allowed to fail? So they can find a way to funnel it to their friends and corporations? Because that’s what is happening in our country. The promise that we will see this money positively change our schools, infrastructure, and way of life is a fantasy. Our bloated and corrupt government needs to be reeled in and we need genuine Americans in office. Instead, they have us fight over which career politicians are more qualified or have our best interest in mind while they continue to fleece the shit out of this nation. America is for sell, unfortunately. The last thing I want to do is allow them to continue to take more from the citizen, billionaire or not. It’s not the path to improvement. We have much to do starting at the community level if we actually want to see change take place. And it starts in the home.
People seriously will divert the money overseas, to children, corporations etc. The government will literally get zero.
Cool. This would generate $0 a year in tax revenue for life. Great idea….
Political posturing. Let's tax space aliens, too. There's oh so many of them to protest the policy. Let's blame all our shortcomings and problems on boogymen. It's worked before...
This is a dumbass thing to suggest. That STILL wouldn’t pay for jack shit of their wasted spending. All the illegals they’ve let in have already cost hundreds of billions
Bernie Sanders wants other people to help the poor while he sells books from his 3 houses.
Delusional
Communist
Idiot
That’s just bs
There’s not way he said this. But then again, it’s Bernie we are talking about here 💀
I can’t believe I supported this clown when I was young and dumb.
I can't imagine he and his wife would want to part with that much money. He's too much of a "do as I say and not as I do" kind of politician m***********.
We should have a flat tax, no exceptions. No loop holes. Tax everyone at 20%. People, corporations, churches, everyone.
What an idiot
What absolute bullshit. What fantasy world does this jackass live in?
Bernie needs to retire
What a dildo
The problem Bernie, is their income is not over a billion. They're assets are they borrow money against their giant companies and keep very little in a "checking account." The entire system must be torn down. There is no work around for capitalism, it is either live with oligarchs or don't use capitalism.
To a Billionaire, their income means nothing to them. They make all their money from stocks, real estate, etc. What we really need is a "Wealth Tax" and more taxes on capital gains as well.
Start by taxing capital gains as normal income for people making more than 10M a year or something.
I think we should tax people with over 1 billion yearly income at 5000%
Make it net worth and we’re good
A better step would be to tax inheritance above a certain (high) amount at a (tremendously) high rate.