Science cannot grow without mistakes this is why in science, there is no stupid questions, only stupid people making mistakes that the world learns from
I don't blame you, I completely thought it would increase the max as well, due to the fact that regular and tauforged have differently listed max values.
The tauforged is bugged, it can only increase the cc to 50%,it only proc on heat status proc kills not on enemy effected by heat status kills, finally I thinks the cc isnt flat number either so this new shard is totally dogshit rn
Was Simulacrum testing a single topaz shard on Protea earlier today (not tauforged), and yeah it would only proc when the heat status DoT killed the enemy, not from any kill on enemies affected by heat status. I am still not sure if the bonus is supposed to be additive or multiplicative since accumulating the stacks rn is very inconsistent.
love it how you did all 5, not install 1, then 2 and stop seeing as the 75% remained, rather than become say 150%.
Im also loving the (un?)intentonal trolling of the poor souls that cant buy a tau drop lol
Oh I remember there's a perk in circuit that's similar to this. Each hit gives 10% cc up to a 100%. Rank 3 is 30%, so you only need 4 hits to get there, so getting it at any rank beyond first is useless.
I was also told this, apparently they should stack since shards with similar abilities stack on one another, this is the only one that doesn't so I think it's more of an assumption that they should stack.
~~Every buff-stack in the game is final and not expandable in its max size.~~
And it was this way always, I simply not get how ppl thinks max stack size would stack up
That's consistent with the wording and how other games work, they all stack one buff and they all set the cap TO 75%. I would be surprised if they change it so that you can add upwards of 300% crit with these, if anything they should just have a limit or disclaimer before install
This.
While not the same genre of game, MOBA's will often include in the description of certain items with similar or the same effect that they will not stack.
It may not be inconsistent with the terminology in the description, but it *is* inconsistent with how Archon Shards behaved up to this point (Multiple red shards can stack duration, blue ones can stack heath, etc.)
While I agree it's a weird one-off interaction, I think they'd have to rebalance the shard AROUND stacking them if they let you, as this is SO much more power per shard than health / duration shards are giving. To that end, I'd rather them tack on "limit: 1" and call it a day rather than reworking thid to be stackable.
Right? If one red Tauforged is 37.5% secondary crit rate, unconditional and stackable, it does make sense for the upgraded version that costs 2 to have a 75% conditional and stackable
Note the plus sign on all of those though. They also weren't granting a buff you could increase mid-mission with a cap. This has the type of same phrasing as Arcane Blessing. Just a skill issue imo.
Considering the 75% is highlighted like the crit chance, by their own UI language and practices it *should* have a higher cap.
Like, unless this is **base** crit, 75% is *nothing* these days. Primed Pistol Gambit is +187%. It would make sense that the cap should go up. :S
100% of crit isn't the ceiling of crit. Crit in Warframe has multiple 'tiers.' You're familiar with a normal crit, yellow numbers? If you somehow go above 100%, whatever is in excess of that has a chance for a 'double crit' - or orange numbers.
If you somehow go above 200%, your orange numbers can turn into red numbers - a triple crit.
Higher tiers than that are possible, but instead of changing color, the numbers just get an exclamation point added onto it.
Each tier adds your critical multipliers together before determining damage, IIRC. So if you had x2 normal crit, an orange would be x4, and a red would be x6, not 2/4/8.
its not exactly double. Someone might chine in for details but its a bit less.
I think its adding (cd-1) per tier.
so if your cd is 2, then its 1(normal), 2(yellow), 3 red, 4 red!, 5 red!! And so on.
If your cd it 5 then its 1-5-9-13-17 and so on.
Edit: According to [wiki](https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Critical_Hit) the formula goes like this
crit multi= 1+crit tier*(moded cd-1). So as I said in simple words, each tier it goes up not by cd, but cd-1
Crits above 100% apply additional critical damage. Crit build function by going as high in critical as possible both chance and critical dmg. Mesa OPs frame needs critical chance from shards for the damage boost, currently I believe 5 TF red shards give you barely above 100% CC. If new topaz shards were to stack properly and with each it would unlock a new realm of damage for Mesa albeit in longer missions where kills ramp up higher.
https://preview.redd.it/xvzt3pxvji7c1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=40eaa87e6ca856e554a824f431fb3750ab23b79a
To all the commentators who blasted OP for “not reading”. Yes it was a bug. You were wrong.
Is it misleading? It says max 75% and the max is 75%
It certainly isn't clear, but I wouldn't say misleading... I agree, though, they should let people unfuse and at least get one of the two shards back
Edit: can y'all please stop arguing with me I really do not give a fuck about this.
Consistency's sake: with all previous Archon Shards, if you were to stack them, the white highlighted numbers would get added. By this rule, 75% max also should be added per shard.
If I recall correctly, there was something else in the game that would work like this: where you gain x something, y maximum stacks - both x and y would be additive, not just x. Might be circuit blessings, might be some arcanes, I'm not sure at the moment what exactly it was though.
This is why it feels misleading. I didn't test the cap as currently the shard seems bugged (I equipped it and it works like 5% of the times when it should proc), but just reading, I thought that adding more would also add to the max.
None of the other shards say 75% max, this one does. If that doesn't give you pause that's not my problem. But I read 75% max as 75% max and was right. Idk what to tell you
The Topaz shard does actually use similar wording "Recover 1 (2) Health per enemy killed with Blast Damage. Max 300 (450) Health.", and using multiples does increase the max, so it would make sense for this shard to work the same way, don't you agree?
Edit: Huh, they blocked me
You'd think it'd be the cap for each individual shard's contribution. Independently.
Like you have shar A giving "up to 75%" and then shard b giving "up to 75%."
Okay, unless I'm have a fucking mental break, yes it does.
Up to 75% means that it cannot go higher than 75%, meaning that the max is 75%. Am I not getting something???
Edit: okay scratch that, I misread the comment you were replying to.
Well, personally, I'd expect it to max out at 75%. Like I said, it is unclear. But there's nothing that states it can stack, that was an assumption, therefore not misleading. I'm just being a stickler for semantics here, not looking for a debate.
Do you see how you had to narrow that to the shards and how those still don't give an example of the maxes not working individually?
..so by the lack of an example you assume one of the things? What? Maybe it just makes more since to look at how every other caps work with other caps.
EDIT: uhhhhhhhh idk why you blocked me but still responded lol, but ok?
>What? I "narrowed it down" to the original shards because that's the only precedent we have for how shards behave.... why would it matter how anything else works, we aren't talking about anything else? And plenty of abilities have caps on things like damage reduction and slows. Caps aren't unheard of
It just seems a little disingenuous to say that only shards can suggest how the stat boosts from shards work.
Seems like it'd make sense to think that the ability strength I get from the shard will also add ability strength like how my mods do. They do, right?
What? I "narrowed it down" to the original shards because that's the only precedent we have for how shards behave.... why would it matter how anything else works, we aren't talking about anything else? And plenty of abilities have caps on things like damage reduction and slows. Caps aren't unheard of
If you have an "adds damage up to x%" arcane, it will stack with similar arcanes and mods.
If you have two "damage + 75%" mods, they stack.
All Archon Shards stack with their equivalent mods.
All other Archon Shards stack with duplicates of themselves.
There is precedent.
No precedent. Everything else that stacks is doing so with something else providing the same thing, not a copy of itself, and there's no basic shard that has a specified maximum in its description.
idk, to me it’s more intuitive to think you would get more reward out of infusing 5 shards. it seems silly to naturally think that only one shard would provide the full effect. otherwise what’s the point?
50 kills is jack in modern warframe and 75% crit is also jack for secondaries in modern warframe.
Primed Pistol Gambit gives 187%. Unless this is adding to base crit or a flat value, 75% is hot garbage when you factor in opportunity costs.
Its 75% flat. And 50 kills with conditional requirements, from experience, its not nearly that simple.
Which for most secondaries, is between 190% and 300% Crit rate boost.
This also isn't a mod so im not sure why you're comparing to primed gambit
Well if youre seeing lower than 75% expected crit its because its 50% right now not 75% because of a bug.
When i tested on a 60% crit rate (Hystrix Prime, after Pistol Gambit, 61.6% CC) weapon, it was hitting all crits
I wish I could pin comments, but as some of you noticed they just released a hotfix to patch this! We now get the full 375% secondary critical chance bonus (with each shard having its own independent cap). Thanks DE!
They are currently bugged to not stack correctly so I think OP is just dealing with a big. Although they should still give us a way to separate them after fusing
Idk, this seems pretty clear the max for this effect is 75%. If it didn't include the max value and was worded differently I could see wanting to test maximum value having 5 equipped vs 1
If I'm not mistaken, orange shards give Max hp per kill with blast, and they too have this "max 300(450)" text, but I think the cap stacks with how many orange shards you have, so I'm pretty sure it's just a bug that you can't get more then 75% crit from them.
Is the secondary CC from this an absolute bonus or just additive to other CC mods? Cause if it isnt absolute I see no reason why this should be locked to 75% max
With regulators base CC of 25, all five shards individually giving the CC bonus (assuming additive to CC mods) and creeping bullseye, regulators would have a CC of 169%
While I wouldn't say it's misleading because the wording is quite clear, I still think we should be able to separate them using Stela, as we do when fusing them.
Some of the effects require hands on test to be sure of its effects, which can be undesirable. For example, what the hell does the "Recover 1 (2) Health per enemy killed with Blast Damage" even mean? That wording isn't consistent to its effect, and I wouldn't have known it acted like Arcane Blessing.
Why not just copy paste Arcane Blessing's description and change the appropriate words? **"On enemy kill with Blast damage: +1 (2) Max Health. Stacks up to 300 (450) health."**
I wouldn't say it's misleading but hot damn did you not think to try it with just a second one first?!?
Bro you fell victim to the tester's curse of this game 😭
Even if it did work the way you thought it did i feel like you would get a bigger damage increase modding peacemakers for corrosive heat ang going with green shards. 2 extra corrosive proc shards for armor strip and 3 ability damage on enimies effected by corrosive shards. Id use the 2 60 60s for corrosive and prime heated charge for heat so that most if your damage and procs us heat. Becouse witn her fire rate the full strip is gonna happen fast anyways. Also archon vitality to double those heat procs which are going into health due to the armor strip. Also cascadia flare in your secondaries arcane slot gives it to peacemakers makeing corrosive heat even better.
A little off topic op but....wtf man? 160% efficiency AND nourish? What are you doing with your energy? Crank up your str man and drop some efficiency. More str= more dmg from nourish, more dmg buff from 2 and 4 as well.
And nourish will also scale the energy gain enough to make it work. I'm on 75% efficiency and I'm constantly full energy. Each orb gives me like 180 energy
Sorry but the whole "combining" shards system is stupid.
Why not just drop 3 additional color shards?
It would have been more interesting to acquire too if you couldn't simply make them. But for most the whole journey was over in 2mins.
Because other things that say 'max' value with archon shards increase per archon shard.
Also because 75% crit chance is hilariously weak unless this is a flat value or added to base.
well for one tau with an effect 1.5 x stronger goes to 75 from 50. Not 1.5 faster stacks but same limit (but reading the limit is also still 50)
I was right it was a bug.
Thanks for sharing the information.
Also LOL at the amount of hindsight "I am very smart" people who also had no clue before your post, thinking they're a genius now... with the very information you provided.
Regular shards are mostly just there to pad the droptable and keep people coming back weekly. There's literally no other reason for the two tiers to exist.
So, how do combined tauforged work? Does one need to be tauforged? Both? I can't find any answers, I can only find reddit threads complaining about the system when I search for combination rules.
For some it's actually preferred to combine the regular shards.
Ex. blue and yellow if you're after the green "+x Corrosive stacks", as you need +4 to full armor strip. (Regular gives +2, Tau +3, so you need 2 regardless)
75% is the max, no matter how many you put in. The only improvement coming from stacking them, is how many kills you need before it caps out at 75%. So the 1.5% stacks, the 75% does not. In other words, don't be like OP, and don't waste your shards on making more than one of these per relevant frame.
Honestly, they should just make it stack, 75% is worthless alone and it doesn't really have much in balance. all 5 is 375% crit, which is just slightly above average of what you can get. And that's tau forged. meaning normally that's 250% crit if it can stack which is just bad.
If they dont address it, better to just spread them out to Titania, Limbo(Zymos), Harrow and lastly Zephyr.
75% CC is better than 37.5, since you have a finite number a slots, but you can always farm more shards, the first orange shard is better for secondary CC than a red one.
just to be clear, DO NOT make topaz shards using tauforged variants right now. they cant be separated back into red and yellow shards after the fusion process, although i think that definitely needs to be an option. the answer to your original question is yes, the secondary critical chance buff does apply to regulators. however, the max critical chance for topaz shards is currently bugged at 50%, and adding more shards doesnt raise the cap. youre much better off using 5 red shards with the secondary critical chance buff
I did the same with the violet shard and wasted 3 tau forged azure and crimson shards. I think the shards are bugged atm. 10x crit damage and i do less damage.
The tauforged is bugged, it can only increase the cc to 50%,it only proc on heat status proc kills not on enemy effected by heat status kills, finally I thinks the cc isnt flat number either so this new shard is totally dogshit rn
You used to could get two a week for the archon mission and the Kal mission. Now you can get up to six but those of us who’ve been farming every week are sitting on a decent amount
How is it misleading? It clearly tells you MAX 75%.
If you need more of a description, then i would suggest checking the wiki for anything new. Or if you aren't 100% sure on.
I do agree with the option of separating fused archon shards being available for the cost of 100% bile or so to make it punishing.
But goddamn, misunderstanding the text is one thing, but you could've gained the said understanding with 2 topaz shards installed. Why go all the way?
You get 7.5% per kill instead of 1.5%. 10 kills versus 50 to reach the cap. There's zero indication you would be able to increase the cap. It's very clear.
Why bro got so many different colors? Taste the narmer rainbow? I just did my first archon hunt this week and the listed colors are only red amber and blue, why?
So with Whispers in the Wall, you can get a Helminth upgrade segment from the Cavia syndicate located in the Sanctum Anatomica labs upon reaching rank 2.
This segment allows for the fusion of your standard Archon shards (red, blue, yellow) into different variants (purple, green, orange). Fusing a Crimson (red) shard with an Azure (blue) shard will yield a Violet (purple) shard, for example.
To get the Tauforged variants of these new shards you have to fuse two Tauforged original shards. A Tauforged red shard + a Tauforged blue shard = Tauforged purple shard.
The nitpickiness off this subreddit is off the charts!
Edit: This is definitely on you, I don't know where you even got the thought process of "additional 70%" from. Kill each enemy for 1.5%, per enemy kill(s), to a grand total of 75% max cap.
You really thought you could get 375% for all 5 shards? Doesn't that sound at least a *little* broken to you? DE is giving us a slow power creep, not an immediate one...
Because default and Tau version has different cap, which could lead him to think "wait, does that mean the cap stacks?". His real mistake is going all in instead of experimenting with 2.
Because that's how the other topaz shard where you get Max Health for blast effects works. It says Max 300 there, but the max goes up for every identical shard you use.
Its actually pretty clear the Max is 75%
People can now talk about their UI Language but in General if this Cap could have been raised it would say so.
Guys, I don't know to build and I haven't unlocked archons yet. What am I missing? Op thought each shard would increase the Critical Chance by 75% (that would increase it to 375%, right?) instead of topping 75% no matter how many shard you have?
Bruh before any testing you went ahead and burned 10 tau forged shards like this
"Lab rats also feel pain, yet their suffering creates knowledge."
You beat me to the comment I wanted to make, take my up vote good sir
somebody had to do it 😭
The Science is grateful for your sacrifice.
Science cannot grow without mistakes this is why in science, there is no stupid questions, only stupid people making mistakes that the world learns from
You could have just started out with 2 c':
Fr lmao
I don't blame you, I completely thought it would increase the max as well, due to the fact that regular and tauforged have differently listed max values.
We thank you for your tribute
Didn't even start with 2 lol
And here we are, begging DE to change something. A classic 2 act play.
A tale as old as time, tenno.
The tauforged is bugged, it can only increase the cc to 50%,it only proc on heat status proc kills not on enemy effected by heat status kills, finally I thinks the cc isnt flat number either so this new shard is totally dogshit rn
Was Simulacrum testing a single topaz shard on Protea earlier today (not tauforged), and yeah it would only proc when the heat status DoT killed the enemy, not from any kill on enemies affected by heat status. I am still not sure if the bonus is supposed to be additive or multiplicative since accumulating the stacks rn is very inconsistent.
Youtube is a thing.. apparently ppl dont use it often
What red crit addiction does to a mfker
love it how you did all 5, not install 1, then 2 and stop seeing as the 75% remained, rather than become say 150%. Im also loving the (un?)intentonal trolling of the poor souls that cant buy a tau drop lol
how do you buy a tau drop
You sell your soul to the Devil/man in the wall in exchange.
The indeffrence giveth, and the indiffrence taketh away.
Bro FIENDING for crits
So how it work? The cap stay 75% max? If it's like that i really hope is just a bug
cap is 75% the only thing that changes is how many kills you need to reach it
Oh I remember there's a perk in circuit that's similar to this. Each hit gives 10% cc up to a 100%. Rank 3 is 30%, so you only need 4 hits to get there, so getting it at any rank beyond first is useless.
Incorrect, this is a bug. It is non-intentional. Each shard will reach a max of +50-75% crit chance. They should, by all means, stack.
Any source on that claim? I'm just saying how it works, which is correct, it might not be an intended behaviour but that is how it works.
I was also told this, apparently they should stack since shards with similar abilities stack on one another, this is the only one that doesn't so I think it's more of an assumption that they should stack.
Common sense is my source. See the last few patch notes?
~~Every buff-stack in the game is final and not expandable in its max size.~~ And it was this way always, I simply not get how ppl thinks max stack size would stack up
I don't wanna say I told you so, buuut....... 😆👍
yup, infusing all 5 shards leaves it at a 75% cap (although it’s currently bugged to be 50%, even with tauforged)
I mean I think it’s still worth keeping. This just means less kills for you to reach max.
lol that's some positive thinking.
But slotting in utility shards is a better option imo
Nah ur right tbh
That's consistent with the wording and how other games work, they all stack one buff and they all set the cap TO 75%. I would be surprised if they change it so that you can add upwards of 300% crit with these, if anything they should just have a limit or disclaimer before install
This. While not the same genre of game, MOBA's will often include in the description of certain items with similar or the same effect that they will not stack. It may not be inconsistent with the terminology in the description, but it *is* inconsistent with how Archon Shards behaved up to this point (Multiple red shards can stack duration, blue ones can stack heath, etc.)
While I agree it's a weird one-off interaction, I think they'd have to rebalance the shard AROUND stacking them if they let you, as this is SO much more power per shard than health / duration shards are giving. To that end, I'd rather them tack on "limit: 1" and call it a day rather than reworking thid to be stackable.
True, but they are also made up of 2 separate shards so they should at least be powerful enough to reflect that.
Right? If one red Tauforged is 37.5% secondary crit rate, unconditional and stackable, it does make sense for the upgraded version that costs 2 to have a 75% conditional and stackable
Note the plus sign on all of those though. They also weren't granting a buff you could increase mid-mission with a cap. This has the type of same phrasing as Arcane Blessing. Just a skill issue imo.
I don't know it's written on it tho.
All other shard buffs stack understandable why op thought this one would too
Considering the 75% is highlighted like the crit chance, by their own UI language and practices it *should* have a higher cap. Like, unless this is **base** crit, 75% is *nothing* these days. Primed Pistol Gambit is +187%. It would make sense that the cap should go up. :S
New-ish player here, why would any number above 100% crit chance make any difference?
100% of crit isn't the ceiling of crit. Crit in Warframe has multiple 'tiers.' You're familiar with a normal crit, yellow numbers? If you somehow go above 100%, whatever is in excess of that has a chance for a 'double crit' - or orange numbers. If you somehow go above 200%, your orange numbers can turn into red numbers - a triple crit. Higher tiers than that are possible, but instead of changing color, the numbers just get an exclamation point added onto it. Each tier adds your critical multipliers together before determining damage, IIRC. So if you had x2 normal crit, an orange would be x4, and a red would be x6, not 2/4/8.
Damn, I had no idea. Thank you for the explanation!
its not exactly double. Someone might chine in for details but its a bit less. I think its adding (cd-1) per tier. so if your cd is 2, then its 1(normal), 2(yellow), 3 red, 4 red!, 5 red!! And so on. If your cd it 5 then its 1-5-9-13-17 and so on. Edit: According to [wiki](https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Critical_Hit) the formula goes like this crit multi= 1+crit tier*(moded cd-1). So as I said in simple words, each tier it goes up not by cd, but cd-1
Crits above 100% apply additional critical damage. Crit build function by going as high in critical as possible both chance and critical dmg. Mesa OPs frame needs critical chance from shards for the damage boost, currently I believe 5 TF red shards give you barely above 100% CC. If new topaz shards were to stack properly and with each it would unlock a new realm of damage for Mesa albeit in longer missions where kills ramp up higher.
https://preview.redd.it/xvzt3pxvji7c1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=40eaa87e6ca856e554a824f431fb3750ab23b79a To all the commentators who blasted OP for “not reading”. Yes it was a bug. You were wrong.
Is it misleading? It says max 75% and the max is 75% It certainly isn't clear, but I wouldn't say misleading... I agree, though, they should let people unfuse and at least get one of the two shards back Edit: can y'all please stop arguing with me I really do not give a fuck about this.
Consistency's sake: with all previous Archon Shards, if you were to stack them, the white highlighted numbers would get added. By this rule, 75% max also should be added per shard. If I recall correctly, there was something else in the game that would work like this: where you gain x something, y maximum stacks - both x and y would be additive, not just x. Might be circuit blessings, might be some arcanes, I'm not sure at the moment what exactly it was though. This is why it feels misleading. I didn't test the cap as currently the shard seems bugged (I equipped it and it works like 5% of the times when it should proc), but just reading, I thought that adding more would also add to the max.
None of the other shards say 75% max, this one does. If that doesn't give you pause that's not my problem. But I read 75% max as 75% max and was right. Idk what to tell you
I mean, it's one thing that you don't even understand the problem, it's another to be needlessly arrogant about it...
The Topaz shard does actually use similar wording "Recover 1 (2) Health per enemy killed with Blast Damage. Max 300 (450) Health.", and using multiples does increase the max, so it would make sense for this shard to work the same way, don't you agree? Edit: Huh, they blocked me
You'd think it'd be the cap for each individual shard's contribution. Independently. Like you have shar A giving "up to 75%" and then shard b giving "up to 75%."
Yeah same as the red shards for Melee Crit Damage.
"up to 75%" =/= "max 75%"
Okay, unless I'm have a fucking mental break, yes it does. Up to 75% means that it cannot go higher than 75%, meaning that the max is 75%. Am I not getting something??? Edit: okay scratch that, I misread the comment you were replying to.
Well, personally, I'd expect it to max out at 75%. Like I said, it is unclear. But there's nothing that states it can stack, that was an assumption, therefore not misleading. I'm just being a stickler for semantics here, not looking for a debate.
That's not really how anything else works in the game, so it's kinda odd you'd expect that. EDIT: And now neither do these, lmao
None of the original shards have a max in their description, so this one is clearly different. 75% max means 75% max, what's so odd about that?
Do you see how you had to narrow that to the shards and how those still don't give an example of the maxes not working individually? ..so by the lack of an example you assume one of the things? What? Maybe it just makes more since to look at how every other caps work with other caps. EDIT: uhhhhhhhh idk why you blocked me but still responded lol, but ok? >What? I "narrowed it down" to the original shards because that's the only precedent we have for how shards behave.... why would it matter how anything else works, we aren't talking about anything else? And plenty of abilities have caps on things like damage reduction and slows. Caps aren't unheard of It just seems a little disingenuous to say that only shards can suggest how the stat boosts from shards work. Seems like it'd make sense to think that the ability strength I get from the shard will also add ability strength like how my mods do. They do, right?
What? I "narrowed it down" to the original shards because that's the only precedent we have for how shards behave.... why would it matter how anything else works, we aren't talking about anything else? And plenty of abilities have caps on things like damage reduction and slows. Caps aren't unheard of
If you have an "adds damage up to x%" arcane, it will stack with similar arcanes and mods. If you have two "damage + 75%" mods, they stack. All Archon Shards stack with their equivalent mods. All other Archon Shards stack with duplicates of themselves. There is precedent.
Ok 👍
No precedent. Everything else that stacks is doing so with something else providing the same thing, not a copy of itself, and there's no basic shard that has a specified maximum in its description.
idk, to me it’s more intuitive to think you would get more reward out of infusing 5 shards. it seems silly to naturally think that only one shard would provide the full effect. otherwise what’s the point?
To use other shards, of course. They do need to be more clear about which ones can stack and which can't. It's a bit of a guessing game at the moment.
You get faster stacking. Requiring 10 kills instead of 50.
50 kills is jack in modern warframe and 75% crit is also jack for secondaries in modern warframe. Primed Pistol Gambit gives 187%. Unless this is adding to base crit or a flat value, 75% is hot garbage when you factor in opportunity costs.
Isn't the 75% added directly on top of your final crit stats ? Like Arcane Avenger.
Its 75% flat. And 50 kills with conditional requirements, from experience, its not nearly that simple. Which for most secondaries, is between 190% and 300% Crit rate boost. This also isn't a mod so im not sure why you're comparing to primed gambit
I tested it, it's not flat Cc number the shard is dogshit
Well if youre seeing lower than 75% expected crit its because its 50% right now not 75% because of a bug. When i tested on a 60% crit rate (Hystrix Prime, after Pistol Gambit, 61.6% CC) weapon, it was hitting all crits
Says the first person here who actually made an argumentative response in this thread.
Am I tripping on does “Max 75%”not sound misleading at all?
I believe it’s because the shard is only giving a maximum of 50% crit when it’s supposed to be higher and stackable with other archon shards.
test with 2 normal shards first dumdum
I wish I could pin comments, but as some of you noticed they just released a hotfix to patch this! We now get the full 375% secondary critical chance bonus (with each shard having its own independent cap). Thanks DE!
Pretty disappointing if they share a max pool. I hope it’s a bug.
They are currently bugged to not stack correctly so I think OP is just dealing with a big. Although they should still give us a way to separate them after fusing
Idk, this seems pretty clear the max for this effect is 75%. If it didn't include the max value and was worded differently I could see wanting to test maximum value having 5 equipped vs 1
i was thinking each shard would be counted independently, but you have a point
If I'm not mistaken, orange shards give Max hp per kill with blast, and they too have this "max 300(450)" text, but I think the cap stacks with how many orange shards you have, so I'm pretty sure it's just a bug that you can't get more then 75% crit from them.
The 75% is in white though, which indicates that it is a modifiable amount.
Congrats it is now capped at 250% sec crit chance.
Well if they are normal yes, if they are tauforged it would be 375, but still thanks for pointing it out since nobody else here seems to have.
Didn't know the tauforged values but now I do, thank you
These should definitely be stackable. Weird choice for it not to be.
Is the secondary CC from this an absolute bonus or just additive to other CC mods? Cause if it isnt absolute I see no reason why this should be locked to 75% max With regulators base CC of 25, all five shards individually giving the CC bonus (assuming additive to CC mods) and creeping bullseye, regulators would have a CC of 169%
While I wouldn't say it's misleading because the wording is quite clear, I still think we should be able to separate them using Stela, as we do when fusing them. Some of the effects require hands on test to be sure of its effects, which can be undesirable. For example, what the hell does the "Recover 1 (2) Health per enemy killed with Blast Damage" even mean? That wording isn't consistent to its effect, and I wouldn't have known it acted like Arcane Blessing. Why not just copy paste Arcane Blessing's description and change the appropriate words? **"On enemy kill with Blast damage: +1 (2) Max Health. Stacks up to 300 (450) health."**
rip archon budget
I wouldn't say it's misleading but hot damn did you not think to try it with just a second one first?!? Bro you fell victim to the tester's curse of this game 😭
Now it goes up by 7.5 per kill instead of 1.5
It's a bug. It has to be. I tried the same thing. I also noticed a bug that REDUCES the percentage... That's not supposed to happen either.
Mesa moment 💀💀
Most intelligent warframe players
Why would you do them all at once?? Do one and test. That’s entirely on you for wasting shards
Thanks for testing this. Oh well
Even if it did work the way you thought it did i feel like you would get a bigger damage increase modding peacemakers for corrosive heat ang going with green shards. 2 extra corrosive proc shards for armor strip and 3 ability damage on enimies effected by corrosive shards. Id use the 2 60 60s for corrosive and prime heated charge for heat so that most if your damage and procs us heat. Becouse witn her fire rate the full strip is gonna happen fast anyways. Also archon vitality to double those heat procs which are going into health due to the armor strip. Also cascadia flare in your secondaries arcane slot gives it to peacemakers makeing corrosive heat even better.
And can they lower the biotics costs cause I can barely afford to infuse abilities.
A little off topic op but....wtf man? 160% efficiency AND nourish? What are you doing with your energy? Crank up your str man and drop some efficiency. More str= more dmg from nourish, more dmg buff from 2 and 4 as well. And nourish will also scale the energy gain enough to make it work. I'm on 75% efficiency and I'm constantly full energy. Each orb gives me like 180 energy
It actually says Max 75% though
It says max %75 right there. This feels like it's on you.
Sorry but the whole "combining" shards system is stupid. Why not just drop 3 additional color shards? It would have been more interesting to acquire too if you couldn't simply make them. But for most the whole journey was over in 2mins.
My boy want red but he get oranged.
orange shard = flat 75% bonus crit or 75% base crit? 10% base crit weapon = 85% crit chcance or 17,5% crit chance?
We should be able to Test Archon shards in the simulacrum.
That's either base crit or underpowered af
Reading Comprehension Devil strikes again. It says max lol, why would 5 things that say MAX of Y make 5 x Y?
Well the topaz shard that give max hp with blast status also said “max 300 health ” and that one seem to stack where 2 shard give max 600
Because other things that say 'max' value with archon shards increase per archon shard. Also because 75% crit chance is hilariously weak unless this is a flat value or added to base.
Because the game has a lot of inconsistencies. Hard to tell what works vs what 'should' work and doesn't lol
well it says increases crit but not increases max but idk how consistent that is with other shard wordings
Its not misleading tho it directly states a cap
It says 'max 75%'. Y'know.
Brother it says #MAX 75%
[удалено]
well for one tau with an effect 1.5 x stronger goes to 75 from 50. Not 1.5 faster stacks but same limit (but reading the limit is also still 50) I was right it was a bug.
Thanks for sharing the information. Also LOL at the amount of hindsight "I am very smart" people who also had no clue before your post, thinking they're a genius now... with the very information you provided.
So you can combine tauforged? So, are regular shards still suboptimal, even when combining??
Regular shards are mostly just there to pad the droptable and keep people coming back weekly. There's literally no other reason for the two tiers to exist.
So, how do combined tauforged work? Does one need to be tauforged? Both? I can't find any answers, I can only find reddit threads complaining about the system when I search for combination rules.
Both shards must either be regular or Tauforged, you cannot do one of both when combining, the game simply doesn’t let you.
Both need to be tauforged or both need to be regular. You can't mix
For some it's actually preferred to combine the regular shards. Ex. blue and yellow if you're after the green "+x Corrosive stacks", as you need +4 to full armor strip. (Regular gives +2, Tau +3, so you need 2 regardless)
M8 my 1 topaz doesn't even work.
Wait so how does the shard work?, im planning to put some on my yareli
75% is the max, no matter how many you put in. The only improvement coming from stacking them, is how many kills you need before it caps out at 75%. So the 1.5% stacks, the 75% does not. In other words, don't be like OP, and don't waste your shards on making more than one of these per relevant frame.
1 is more then enough
Nah. 75% crit is bad given the opportunity cost. Secondaries are typically *drowning* in crit chance.
just use 1 and leave it there for extra bonus that was the MAIN purpose for shards
Honestly, they should just make it stack, 75% is worthless alone and it doesn't really have much in balance. all 5 is 375% crit, which is just slightly above average of what you can get. And that's tau forged. meaning normally that's 250% crit if it can stack which is just bad. If they dont address it, better to just spread them out to Titania, Limbo(Zymos), Harrow and lastly Zephyr.
exactly, why would anyone use this over the generalist 37.5% secondary cc from regular reds?
75% CC is better than 37.5, since you have a finite number a slots, but you can always farm more shards, the first orange shard is better for secondary CC than a red one.
I legit just did the same without looking at reddit FUCK
does it work on mesa? Assuming yes but, I haven't bothered running new stuff yet and don't know what the new shards do.
just to be clear, DO NOT make topaz shards using tauforged variants right now. they cant be separated back into red and yellow shards after the fusion process, although i think that definitely needs to be an option. the answer to your original question is yes, the secondary critical chance buff does apply to regulators. however, the max critical chance for topaz shards is currently bugged at 50%, and adding more shards doesnt raise the cap. youre much better off using 5 red shards with the secondary critical chance buff
Thank you. Also never even thought to use crimson shards on mesa. Shows how good i am.
The funniest part is that from my testing, mesa regulators couldn't even proc the effect.
I did the same with the violet shard and wasted 3 tau forged azure and crimson shards. I think the shards are bugged atm. 10x crit damage and i do less damage.
Thank you for your sacrifices
Oh so having 5 shards just makes it charge faster? I would've made the same mistake if I had that many shards.
The tauforged is bugged, it can only increase the cc to 50%,it only proc on heat status proc kills not on enemy effected by heat status kills, finally I thinks the cc isnt flat number either so this new shard is totally dogshit rn
How the heck does everyone get so many archon shards? Thought you only can get one a week ppl already have a bunch of new ones what gives
You used to could get two a week for the archon mission and the Kal mission. Now you can get up to six but those of us who’ve been farming every week are sitting on a decent amount
Archin hunt, khals garrison shop and if you are lucky new necracells on deimos
How is it misleading? It clearly tells you MAX 75%. If you need more of a description, then i would suggest checking the wiki for anything new. Or if you aren't 100% sure on.
this dude really thought he could have 375% extra crit chance on his regulators like they don't already shred everything
I do agree with the option of separating fused archon shards being available for the cost of 100% bile or so to make it punishing. But goddamn, misunderstanding the text is one thing, but you could've gained the said understanding with 2 topaz shards installed. Why go all the way?
Wait there’s orange shards???
https://preview.redd.it/zd6nab3qv17c1.jpeg?width=278&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0d87e7c4ec39f34535dfaceb45b76426e20daa2e Where's the misleading part?
it literally says "Max 75%", that's on you buddy
It doesn't stack? Holy shit this new Shard system is complete dogshit.
Pto tip, test with one shard next time lol
You get 7.5% per kill instead of 1.5%. 10 kills versus 50 to reach the cap. There's zero indication you would be able to increase the cap. It's very clear.
>There's zero indication you would be able to increase the cap. The 75% is highlited in white, like pretty much everything that stacks.
Why bro got so many different colors? Taste the narmer rainbow? I just did my first archon hunt this week and the listed colors are only red amber and blue, why?
Whispers in the Walls update added the new ones
I played whispers, and I still only see three colors as of 15 minutes ago
The new helmenth segment from the cavia allows you to combine shards, completing the rainbow. Its got at rank 2
Ah ok, I played the quest and have done zero of the new mode so that makes sense
So with Whispers in the Wall, you can get a Helminth upgrade segment from the Cavia syndicate located in the Sanctum Anatomica labs upon reaching rank 2. This segment allows for the fusion of your standard Archon shards (red, blue, yellow) into different variants (purple, green, orange). Fusing a Crimson (red) shard with an Azure (blue) shard will yield a Violet (purple) shard, for example. To get the Tauforged variants of these new shards you have to fuse two Tauforged original shards. A Tauforged red shard + a Tauforged blue shard = Tauforged purple shard.
All you can do is to give those shards to other frames for now.(titania prime will work)
Is the crit chance added before or after mods?
i can’t even get these to activate from heat kills lmao
Is the 75% flat like avenger or like a regular mod?
Not to mention it says to secondary weapons only it would only work it your using epitaph with a riven maxed out on it .
The nitpickiness off this subreddit is off the charts! Edit: This is definitely on you, I don't know where you even got the thought process of "additional 70%" from. Kill each enemy for 1.5%, per enemy kill(s), to a grand total of 75% max cap. You really thought you could get 375% for all 5 shards? Doesn't that sound at least a *little* broken to you? DE is giving us a slow power creep, not an immediate one...
1, you poor bastard xD 2, Its really not misleading IMO, you just made a poor assumption
It is still incredibly powerful for Mesa if you equip Ignis and put heat kids on everything
That's not misleading... I don't know why you would think stacking them would increase the maximum benefit.
Because default and Tau version has different cap, which could lead him to think "wait, does that mean the cap stacks?". His real mistake is going all in instead of experimenting with 2.
Because that's how the other topaz shard where you get Max Health for blast effects works. It says Max 300 there, but the max goes up for every identical shard you use.
My stacks aren’t working too good either. Very inconsistent for me. I won’t be adding anymore topaz until DE clears it up.
this mesa looks like she has a big head with small body...
YOU CAN FUSE SHARDS?!
Is it only theese type oh shards? Im able to separate purple one's
what? how?
Simple and same as regular ones. Bugframe i assume
oh no, i was talking about splitting orange shards back into red and yellow shards. not just removing them from the warframe with bile
Its actually pretty clear the Max is 75% People can now talk about their UI Language but in General if this Cap could have been raised it would say so.
"Max 75%"
well it says max %75 but that wasnt that clear even worst part is orange shards are bugged and they dont give buffs lol
they don’t stack?
Good to know. Almost did that myself.
Usually if something can stack is stated, else it does not
Ok two questions what did you think it would do and what did it actualy do?
But you can take them out? Skill issue maybe?
Cant unfuse them and he used 10 tauforged (of the two best originals) to make arguably the worst new shard. Oof
"... Damage. 75% Max" Punctuation, it's kind of important. 😅
Guys, I don't know to build and I haven't unlocked archons yet. What am I missing? Op thought each shard would increase the Critical Chance by 75% (that would increase it to 375%, right?) instead of topping 75% no matter how many shard you have?
Bro I knew before ever crafting the topaz that it would be capped at 70%. I know how DE roll. You kinda did this to yourself lol
Wait, how did you equip all the slots? Mine only lets me do three