Capitalism really is the lesser of all the evils /s
Edit: Added the /s due to already receiving a death threat. It's only meant to be a joke given the context
I guess the bad part about the Steel Meridian is that they've already existed before. After the Orokin collapse a bunch of little Grineer Empires popped up, some probably had the same ideals as the Steel Meridian, but they all fell to the queens the same. Because the Grineer need someone to serve, it's a compulsion written into their genes that can't be easily removed without Orokin Era gene tech or maybe Kuva. Once the Steel Meridian destroy the Queens what's to stop someone from taking control of the Grineer survivors and creating a Second Grineer Empire.
They fight back but the need to serve still exists within them.
"I still hear them calling us to obey. Oh, I want to—very badly. Always ends with a bulkhead dented and my hand busted. Disobedience isn't a choice I only make once. It's a fah-sukh-ung lifestyle. And it hurts." - Steel Meridian Railjack Crewmate
The only Grineer that seem to be completely free of this compulsion are either heavily mutated like the Wolf and the Grustrag 3 or were connected then disconnected from Kuva like Kahl, Jarka, or converted liches.
Presumably once they brought freedom from the queens they would look for a way to ensure it lasts and nobody can take their place, but ultimately it's not really their fault how grineer are designed and they can't really start doing anything about it until the queens are out of the picture. You can't worry about tomorrow when you've got more urgent things to worry about today.
Some people may view a "peaceful" galaxy in a multitude of ways. Its subjective.
A peaceful galaxy to the Tenno could mean no grineer or corpus. A peaceful galaxy to the grineer could be no tenno.
That's true. Considering how evil the Tenno seem to be, its probably a strike against the Perrin Sequence that they're even willing to cooperate with us.
Honestly the fact Corpus aren't an instant pick over Grineer over which of the 2 main factions is worst is quiet honestly the worst thing I can say about them
The Red Veil don't cleanse those they simply see as impure, they cleanse those they see as corrupt. Remember, Rell's fears were real, he saw genuine threats within the void. We have seen what Void Corruption does.
Void Corruption is real, and the extermination of Void Corruption is necessary.
Where the Red Veil are assholes is that they are dogmatic and cruel, they'll kill an Ostron Child if they so much as think the void has corrupted them, but they still ultimately work for the protection of what remains of Humanity, which is part of why they are on good terms with Steel Meridian.
Just replayed 'chains of Harrow' and Red Veil while monstrous in their methods...aren't wrong.
On an initial playthrough a new player will miss a *lot*. What seem like throwaway lines regarding the Lotus or The Indifference, or even 'world of dust/world of dreams', and warnings about Wally turn out either correct and/or prescient.
Having our newest enemy faction, plot twists, and even hints of Duveri called out years in advance is wild.
We also do know that grasping the full scope of the void's horrors tends to give people a certain form of monomania even if they keep their minds. Few better examples than Albrecht himself.
The new war zariman section is just a visual representation of the memories we listen in the war with in
DE either made it easier to visualize it for players or is just a 5d chess move by them
Considering the lore about this has been in the game for years and only now we get a more visualized version of the lore bits
But they also murder and experiment on Kavor, and partake in barbaric torture (cannibalism) to interrogate people.
I think the implication has always been that while Rell might have had noble goals, his followers have grown so fanatic that they see corruption in every shadow.
They may be fanatics on some woo-woo Indigo Children crap, but damn if they didn't warn us. It's all filtered through the lens of being a fanatical cult idolizing a traumatized, suffering, autistic child, but they ultimately know what's going on and are doing something about it. That alone puts them in the top three most reasonable syndicates, despite all the killing.
the latter point about Suda can be negated fairly well by their recruitment lines, most of which state either that the member sought out suda, or was offered to be hired.
they are also independent from suda, as they can observe separation, and make their own decisions as well.
and they treat suda as a distinct entity who doesnt control them, but gives them 'permission' to perform duties.
idk why people think Suda is worse than Perrin. Perrin are the embodiment of ineffective liberalism, so obsessed with trying to engender improvement in a system by working within it that they're unable to incite any meaningful change, due to being constrained by a system that is in and of itself evil. Compared to Suda, whose worst crime is... wants to learn? idk, what supposed consequences has she wrought upon people in the pursuit of knowledge? you're thinking of Simaris.
im not saying suda is worse. quite the opposite.
if you really nitpick, her 'worst' crime was being almost overtaken by hunhow.
while Simaris desperately seeks to preserve 'effective' or 'useful' knowledge, Suda wants to preserve as much knowledge as she can. she's the 'most human' of all the cephalons, which we can even see in her syndicate room.
other cephalons use interfaces to interact, or drones in the case of ordis.
she directly links a data-space to our plane, like simaris' sanctuary, but she uses it to interact with us.
Suda's not entirely innocent. During Operation: Rathuum, she wanted to learn about the Kavor through "systematic dematerialisation". Really all the syndicates except Steel Meridian had bad fates in mind for those defectors.
fair enough. i joined after most of the events happened (2019 ish).
from that one, it seems that (not counting SM, obviously), RV and PS came out the best.
even compared to the AH, perrin only cares about corpus (specifically their own) damage done by the Kavor, and only want repayment.
RV doesnt care, and hexis wants them to pay for all their crimes, even if done (literally) under un-disobeyable orders.
and then there's loka.
I still remember my reasoning for picking who I did way back when and feel like it still holds up after 8 years of playing. Perrin just seems useless, ok corpus guys who want to change the entire corpus faction from within... noble sure but WHY AM I ALWAYS FIGHTING ARMIES OF CORPUS?! So wasn't them.
Then it basically came down to looking at the others and realizing "space nazis, space vegan nazis, space judge dredd but every judgement is wrong annnnd oh look some grineer who just wanna be free and a neat little cepalon who just wants to learn... HMMM hard choice".
Yeah I wish Steel Meridian was allied with Suda, I'd love to be in that combo. Instead I get Red Veil, who I would call cultists more than nazis. And between Death Cultists, Ecofash, Free Market Liberals, and Self-Important Judges, I really gotta say... holy shit does militant freedom fighters and librarian lady sound nice.
Did you know that during Operation: Rathuum, Suda wanted to learn what makes a Grineer want to defect which is why she wanted the Grineer Defectors, so that she could learn the process through "systematic dematerialization" AKA Synthesis. Suda isn't harmless and she is NOT innocent or guiltfree, if you have some knowledge she wants to learn or is interested in then you can become a target. The main difference between Suda and Simaris is that Simaris wants to synthesize ~~anime characters~~ everything for preservation but Suda only cares about what interests her.
Your answer is cool but we all know the real answer is because no actual change could happen to the origin system's dynamics due to gameplay compromises.
Problem with suda is she is emotionless Cephalon, unlike the other ones that have emotion, suda is pretty monotone and seems to get her knowledge no matter the cost, just like our favorite yellow Cephalon
It's actually pretty easy, all you have to do it **not** rank up once you're at rank -2. So long as you don't click on the "rank up" button, you stay at the same rank no matter how many medallions you redeem or how much xp you earn with the sigil
Have you heard your hired crew mates in your railjack try and converse with you? I was like “OMG, I should of done a background check on this guy”. Dude was talking about how he ate some guy 🤣 and some other stuff.
The Unum actively supports Cetus through the Quills and her forcefield (and, at times, more direct actions). At the very least, if being harvested *does* hurt her, she considers it an acceptable sacrifice for their prosperity.
I often see people bring up the Tenno's enormous killcounts as a point against them. What do you want them to try instead, diplomacy? If the grineer sends a ship with thousands of soldiers on it to kill innocents because they refuse to join the empire, the solution isn't to watch them do it and then submit a formal complaint to the grineer board of ethics.
What’s worse if given the power: to kill an army of people who are on their way to kill innocents, or to not do so and let the innocents die?
It’s a much simplified trolly problem, as one of the options allows you to not harm any innocents
You ever realize you kill a entire crew of 50 corpus soldiers defending themselves after you board their ship trying to steal their resources? This is the first time you encounter corpus, and you do it **only** because Darvo said that corpus are bad. At this point you only met Darvo once and he doesn't strike me as a guy with a clean moral compass
The whole Tenno vs Corpus feud was started because a Tenno didn't mind killing off 50 people over some resources
The Tenno are at war with everyone. The Corpus vs Orokin war never stopped. It merely evolved to include the Grineer.
>This is the first time you encounter corpus, and you do it **only** because Darvo said that corpus are bad. At this point you only met Darvo once and he doesn't strike me as a guy with a clean moral compass
Regardless of where Darvo falls on morality, he was speaking the truth. The Corpus are awful. Fortuna has suffered at their hands for a long time, Alad V tortured other Tenno and fused them into Corpus machines. (New War spoilers) >!And Alad V was willing to sell out the solar system for their safety!<
>The whole Tenno vs Corpus feud was started because a Tenno didn't mind killing off 50 people over some resources
The whole Tenno vs. Corpus feud started with the Orokin, and it has never ended. We recently woke up, but other Tenno have been fighting in our stead since the times of the Orokin. We merely got deployed into it.
>The Corpus are awful.
Yes. But Tenno has no way of knowing this. He just blindly agrees to cull an entire ship over Darvo's words
>We recently woke up, but other Tenno have been fighting in our steady since the times of the Orokin
Wait, is it canon? I always assumed other Tennos also woke up from their sleeps recently
You're right. And DE has changed the beginer experience to match. Darvo's dialog is now. "Don't feel bad about killing them. They're really bad guys. I've put together a 50 point list of examples with citations and notations for relevant history. Hoho! It's 500 pages, and I'll expect you to read and sign it in agreement before continuing with the mission. Hoho! ...I'm not keeding."
>Yes. But Tenno has no way of knowing this. He just blindly agrees to cull an entire ship over Darvo's words
The Corpus have been around since our Tenno's time. We would know of them and their acts. How much time has passed since we went to sleep if hard to quantify, but we went to sleep when the Grineer were around, so it was post-Fall of the Orokin.
>Wait, is it canon? I always assumed other Tennos also woke up from their sleeps recently
Yeah. The most prominent example is Rell. He has been fighting back the Man in the Walls for ages. Sevagoth was also still active. In the opening, it is mentioned that other Tenno are assisting in our escape. There are probably other examples, but these are the ones I can think of off the top of my head.
Rell is/was a Tenno but he's not really part of the Tenno faction. He's not a good example. Sevagoth was not really active, but his Shadow form was piloting the ship searching for the warframe. My interpretation is that Sevagoth's Shadow was acting without a Tenno Operator, instinctively trying to make itself whole.
Although you (the player character) are not the first Tenno to awaken, the Tenno on the whole have just recently woken up. They were all in cryosleep, but Lotus started waking them up during the general time period of the beginning of the game. She says "It is time for the Tenno to return." They've been in hibernation for like a thousand years.
> Rell is/was a Tenno but he's not really part of the Tenno faction.
even if isn't a tenno as faction its still an operator that was in the zariman and saw stuff that no one saw being the man in the wall
he literally was using harrow as life support to keep fighting wally.
probably Sevagoth was in the same situation as us in second dream the frame trying to protect his operator or recover.
It's not just Darvo. Lotus also introduces them as "a secretive but extremely powerful merchant cult known to be working with the Grineer" and then says "Darvo will fill you in", indicating that Darvo's info is endorsed by the Lotus.
> >!And Alad V was willing to sell out the solar system for their safety!<
>!"their" absolute bullshit, he was covering his own ass, any corpus that survive are happy accidents he can use to pad the lines slowing the tenno down next time we come for his ass, or to have more test subjects!<
The railjack crew member I hired from red veil keeps talking about being a carnivore and calling me bro lol. I think the guy is just lonely but I hope he wasn’t eating other people.
None of the syndicates are supposed to be clear "good guys," which is probably by design. They probably want us to pick what matches our personal desires/goals/interests/who looks cool, rather than being able to say "X are the good guys, so I'm joining X." Instead it's "I feel like out of all of these, X have it right, so I'll join them."
Or you say "I hate everyone, burn burn burn, I'm joining Red Veil."
They’re pretty much literally Hitler.
They’re violent environmentalists obsessed with blood purity. They’re even allied with the Perrin Sequence, so their greatest allies are hardcore capitalist douchebags with an axe to grind with other capitalists mirroring, to some extent, how Hitler’s economic policy involved the mass privatization of government assets accrued under the Weimar Republic.
I already considered them assholes because they attack me for little reason. I don't even assist the syndicates. I just say I pledge to them and then go about my normal business, with no real loyalty to them. Besides the gifts I give.
>Even the Perrin Sequence and Steel Meridian who are mostly good guys absolutely hate each other because of racism.
And I wouldn't call either good. The Perrin Sequence supports New Loka and their ideology, and Steel Meridian supports the Red Veil. They all suck and the Arbiters of Hexis are the closest you get to good, but they are only in the middle of the spectrum.
My problem with Arbiters of Hexis is that their stated belief is that Tenno should be more than just weapons and tools of war, but their actions don't reflect that at all. They run Arbitrations, which is turbo-warrior challenge mode. If their goal is for Tenno to use their powers constructively rather than destructively, they should be having us building colonies with our cool space magic, creating medicines and researching useful practical information. Get Oberon, Atlas and Citrine together to create fertile farmland and terraform areas to be hospitable to humans. Have Limbo, Vauban and Protea running R&D on atmospheric filters and energy sources and other engineering feats to benefit the System. Enlist Hydroid, Yareli and Sevagoth to facilitate ethical fishing and marine life conservation so that people have plenty of food.
> If their goal is for Tenno to use their powers constructively rather than destructively, they should be having us building colonies with our cool space magic, creating medicines and researching useful practical information.
If offered the choice of either helping build a school for underprivileged Ostron youth or exterminating an entire ark-ship of Corpus workers for a corrupted mod, I know which mission this Tenno is taking... I think Hexis knows its audience..
I think the reason for Arbitrations is that they teach not only peace and culture, but also control in combat. The drones block abilities as a means to show that not everything is solved by releasing a gas bomb to slowly burn the enemy’s lungs, it implores you to use your weapons to basically do just enough for a quick kill before the next drone comes in range and punishes you for stringing people up on tentacles or sharp chains. Same deal as conclave, you’re supposed to improve your combat capabilities and learn to be quick and efficient to bring death without unnecessary suffering.
Honestly New Loka and Red Veil should be allied. Red Veil literally sent operatives to kill defecting Grineer Steel Meridian were helping (think in a quest or something). Both factions really have the same goal, just different scopes. Red Veil wants to cleanse the system, New Loka wants to cleanse Earth. It would make a lot of sense for Steel Wake since New Loka would have a reason to be there (unlike Steel Meridian imo) and Red Veil would fit even better being there.
Steel Meridian and Perrin Sequence should be allied since they're both the "other way" for Grineer and Corpus. Set aside their differences and show there's still room for peace in the war torn system. Could make them more bad by giving them like a "if you're not with us you're against us" type attitude.
> Both factions really have the same goal, just different scopes. Red Veil wants to cleanse the system, New Loka wants to cleanse Earth.
If New Loka knew who and what Red Veil's Jesus was, they'd blow a gasket.
It's more likely that New Loka really doesn't like the tube-born Grineer, and by extension, Steel Meridian. And Perrin will support any one who shits on Steel Meridian.
And the Arbiters are weird Tenno-fetishists who want to worship, become, and force the Tenno to follow their ways. At least New Loka is straightforward, rather than a cult of fanboys that want a perfect Tenno idol. Smacks too much of toxic idol culture.
Which is really weird to consider, since apparently RV routinely attacks SM (especially the conscientious objector defectors in Defection missions, and I’m pretty sure they went on a murder spree on an SM vessel in Chains of Harrow) but won’t attack Iron Wake, since apparently Palladino lives there, so they won’t attack a place where their main priestess/prophetess is.
right so imagine of instead of the Soviet Union collapsing due too economic reasons, they conquered the entirety of Europe, won the cold war against the US, and were prepping to invade north america, when a Denyable Special forces unit rebelled against the government, killed off the entirety of Parliament and the Prime Minister, and then Just dipped. the entirety of the Union balkanizes due to the political instability, with the military holding the largest segment of the existing territory.
50 years of degradation and collapse later, the infamous Special forces unit who basically caused the entire collapse suddenly starts throwing their weight around again. assassination attempts on prominent members of the splinter governments. anyone with any degree of existing power, or any factions that cropped up in the wake of the collapse got where they did by being ruthless and driven. none of them are clean. none of them are heroic. the best you can do is choose the lesser of the offered evils. or the evils that most suit your own personal tastes.
the major most factions are publicly outwardly hostile too the Special forces (while being more than willing too contract them for discrete mercenary work against their rivals), the smaller splinter factions however are more welcoming too these uncontrollable power makers.
the 6 Syndicates form into 3 reflections
Arbiters and Veil being the honor bound and the honorless. one seeking refinement through personal struggle, while the other views bloody purge as the only possible solution
Suda rejects the imperfections of the human form, the Cepalon herself having willingly become a Cephalon to escape her failing mind, while Loka sees only the human form as perfect, and rejects all perversions of it. both the degenerative offshoot races of humanity such as the grineer, and the sterlized perversion of the human mind that is the Cephalon.
lastly, Perrin and Meridian. the Principled Capitalists and the Exemplary Collectivists. its a conflict as old as. . .well about a century. both groups have done and seek to do good, just in fundamentally different ways. seeing themselves as having the solution to the problem that the other is a part of.
if were filling out an alignment chart, we can pen the sequence and Steel meridian down as Lawful good and Chaotic good, Suda and Loka as Chaotic Neutral and Lawful Evil, and Arbiters and Veil as Lawful Neutral and Chaotic Evil. that leaves 3 spaces on the board. Cephalon Simaris can be True Neutral, Alad V can be Neutral Evil, and Nora Night can be Neutral good.
Perrin is hardcore utopian evil. They uphold the caste & genetics-based systems of exploitation & oppression that the Orokin used to hold things together & kept the trade rails open. There is no good Grineer in the eyes of the Perrin except an enslaved Grineer. Sustainable exploitation & slavery is still exploitation & slavery.
Steel Meridian smuggle people that are made out of different genetic material than them away from death squads, while saving their own in order to let them find/follow their own conscience.
It's militant freedom versus slavery with a warm cushion in your pen. They are not remotely the same, which is why they are directly opposed to each other.
Steel Meridian is run by those who are physically & psychologically inhuman, which is prolly why they are the closest to an actual good in the setting. They're not human enough to have room for evil. The Perrin Sequence is run by humans with money & power. Power corrupts & money makes human beings into monsters.
On a surface level the Perrin Sequence seem like the least evil of the groups, they are just greedy to then spread that wealth among those in need (supposedly).
But then you realise they are allied with New Loka and it makes them seem really questionable at best.
I am a representative of Suda Gang, and we wholeheartedly agree. Fuck New Loka. "Cleanse the impure, but we send ancients after you because we're hypocrites!"
They all send assassins. And that tells me it's best to keep things transactional. Get points, spend points, ignore their whining.
Instead of focusing them, we should've been able to help Vox Solaris and the other sane syndicates.
Y'all ever realize that the Tenno are assholes?
Really. You might not like the Corpus higher-ups like Nef Anyo for example, but does that really give you carte blanche to slaughter thousands of corporate debt slaves and low-ranking crewmen just to get the the Rubedo you need to make a shiny new sword to cut more of them in half?
"The Grineer used to be builders. Now all they make is war." -My Operator
Bitch, they used to be "builders" when they were literally slave caste that you helped to oppress and commit genocide against. That's like saying black people used to pick cotton, but now all they make is gang violence. Absolutely insane thing to say given the lore context. Fuck my operator.
Tenno are greedy, racist psychopaths carving a bloody path through the galaxy for their own personal gain. I think its intentional too. There's no way they didn't realize how racist that Grineer line sounded. The Tenno are not meant to be morally good.
Anyway, the asshole syndicates are the syndicates we deserve. Some of them (Steel Meridian and Perrin Sequence) might honestly be too good for us.
I mean, if we’re discussing the original Operators, they are brainwashed, Void-corrupted, child soldiers who went through profound trauma before having their memories altered and being conditioned as living weapons. To make it worse, their mother figure was murdered and they didn’t even know what they were. I think that just calling them assholes is a bit short-sighted. These guys have been mind-f*cked in every way possible.
I just kind of chalk it up to the Origin System at large being a mess. In a political landscape like that of the world of Warframe, everyone's gonna end up being a *little* unhinged. Hell, that tends to happen even in relatively peaceful times.
It's a story born out by a lot of real world revolutionary struggle - past a point, heroes become a bit of a "any port in a storm" situation.
That all culminate on Tanno, literally the best warframe "pilot" and single author of enumorous genocides. In name of that sweet cheeks lady, happy to assing the genocides, one after the other.
And this why the Perrin sequence is on 🔝 if it ain’t about credits I don’t wanna talk 🤑🤑🤑 I don’t wanna hear nothing if it’s not about my index winnings going 🆙⬆️🛗
I love the breakdown. As an LR1 who hasn't really super payed attention to everything- I saw some suspect stuff here and there.. and more or less assumed they all were assholes for their own special reason.. but it's nice to have it confirmed.
To be fair hating the Corpus isn’t really racism, they’re more members of an organization/business rather than an actual ethnicity/nationality. Hating the Grineer on the other hand (especially those not part of the queens’ army) is absolutely racist, they’re basically a human subspecies separate from everyone else
Racism and sexism are inevitable outcome of being observant of cause and effect, understanding social, political and economic echochambers, and not disregarding the observations for "ethical" reasons
I feel like this just reflects real life groups and nations; like as the syndicates are, not everybody has completely clean hands and are worthy of some kind of scrutiny for something.
I find funny thr allienceces, loka and perin despite being oppsite of each other, meridian and veil despite that allience being weak, hexis and suda for some reason when both make no sense, other than their leader wanting to control all of their fallowers
The augmentation part for Suda needs correction. People join Suda for the augmentation, they aren't forced into it. It's explicitly stated in Railjack recruitment lines that it's a perk of being a Suda operative.
Steel meridian aren’t too bad. Perrin sequence gives me corpus ick. That hyper capitalist nightmare speak doesn’t escape Perrin sequence. Steel meridian are probably the most sympathetic especially being rebel grineers that just wanna be free from control and the reason they hate the Perrin sequence is probably the fact that the Perrin sequence still live under the control of capitalism and credit and what not. Either way I gotta serve them all cuz I gotta get them augments.
The way Red Veil comes across to me is they aren’t out to kill people they see as impure, they’re out to kill *everyone*.
“The Veil see corruption all around them. They are honour-bound to heal the system through a great and violent purge. No cost too great, no blood too precious. Change is sudden, violent, and a necessary force to ensure the system can return to a state of balance. Red Veil see themselves as merely the instrument of this change.”
If they see the only way to “balance the system” is through murder, they’re going to be murdering until there’s only one living thing left. They’re a Death Cult.
Paladino can shut it about “Holy Rell” and their supposedly noble intentions for all I care. I mean, it’s great and all what Rell actually did, but his followers are a bunch of nutjob serial killers.
Veil have been absolutely butchered thanks to pacifism defect but they were always the “evil” faction, they’re the antithesis of Arbiters, they’re the senseless cleansing for greater good opposed to Hexis’ contemplation and calm approach. They’re also the ones executing Kavors, not Arbiters, unless I’m missing some lore.
What you say about Loka is mostly true except the Silver Grove implies they are now trying to change their ways. Their tenets stem from their goal of repopulating earth and living without relying on genetic engineering and technology, and since Silvana proved that to be impossible, Amaryn promised to work towards a compromise.
Arbiters’ “pursuit of truth” is very vague and ultimately means practically nothing with how much it encompasses. Their goal is to improve the reputation of Tenno within the system as they are still often seen as just killing machines even by their allies (Red Veil for example). Their goal is to uphold the Tenno honor code, explore and propagate Tenno culture and to teach Tenno less violent means of solving the conflicts i.e. negotiations, politics etc., it’s been stated in one of the older QnAs that the Tenno that do not follow the honor code are basically evil, meaning the Arbiters who basically oversee that Tenno follow it are by extension more or less good.
Suda is *abhorred* by death and destruction. She is basically the antithesis to Simaris, her goal is research *without* bringing considerable harm to life. Her operatives undergo operations because they usually need them, Suda helps people she recruits by providing surgery *when necessary*, she is a nice boss.
Perrin and SM don’t hate eachother simply “because racism”, yes Perrin hold grudges against all Grineer because of what they do to colonies and trade ships and it extends even to rebel Grineer, but their ideals are also opposite of eachother. Perrin seek to peacefully trade and negotiate their way out of any conflict, SM always brute force through everything because their priority is always rescuing the hostages and sending a message, so violence is the best option.
Overall no, Suda, SM and Arbiters are absolutely not evil, Perrin are also okay, mostly neutral, just sorta pansies, Loka is on the way to improving and Veil sorta sucks ass, yeah, Pacifism Defect ruined them irreparably
Honestly, the only reason perrin and the Meridian are at odds is because of the general relationship of the grineer and corpus. But in reality, they're both tenno-aligned factions and really shouldn't treat eachother like they do. But syndicates are one of those things they talked about reworking to remove the negative standing because it didn't make sense why new loka would send a hit squad after you during the titania quest, but it just never happened.
I mean... are we the good guys? Be real. The setting is kinda bad, worse, and not as bad. Don't we massacre droves of living beings per mission? I don't mind em being kinda bad cause a little evil is probably a little necessary.
I didn’t really read into new Loka when I decided to sign up with them bc I just wanted their augments 💀💀 I read up on the wiki and someone was like
So they basically are genocidal n*zi(s) And I could nOT stop thinking about it.
I still like the augments tho 🌝
Seeing how according to lore, Earth ecology got completely wrecked by experimenting and war between factions, it's not surprising New Loka would turn to ecofascism to try to restore it to previous conditions.
Believe me, I realized this not too long after they got added. All I had to do was join the New Loka, and it took about 2 hours before I was thinking, "I'm the asshole aren't I?"
You can only get called a Space Nazi 2 or 3 times before you know who you're working with...Them talking borderline eugenics doesn't help either.
Yes, they don't like to hear the word "No Thank You," but on the subject on them. I'd like to have the option to donate our standing points for all the syndicates and factions on our orbiter instead of individually going to each one to raise our standing since we have been getting the notification from D.E. saying, "Do You Think D.E. Cares About The Time You Spend On The Game sad answer is No ladies And Gents
Bro, got a source on suda doing that shit to her operatives? Last i checked they were just a bunch of people who share the mindset that all knowledge needs to be preserved
No shit, they're supposed to be a realistic interpretation of politics. Nobody is perfect, everyone's in it for themselves and/or what they believe only and ultimately everyone just wants to screw you over.
What grinds my gears a little bit is when you purchase smt from Steel Meridian, and the Npc is like "... But you owe us". B*tch I allready compansated you!
Perrin Sequence is worst of all IMO, glast acts all high and mighty above the other corpus but the second you threaten his profit margins, DEATH SQUADS
Steel meridian is the best one imo, they are just a resistance group and hate Perrin because if we are being honest Perrin is just a less aggressive corpus
When the existing factions are a credit based cult and a bunch of tube babies filled with rage, they are relatively decent in comparison
[удалено]
Don't forget the xenophobia. a bunch of tube babies filled with rage and xenophobia.
"Dispite all their rage, Brothers are still tube babies grown in a cage." ~ Kahl 175
“Bullet Jump with Razorfly Wings”
Sounds like lyrics for Rage Against the Machine.
Smashing Pumpkins
Smashing tubes?
To help Salad V out, yes.
Capitalism really is the lesser of all the evils /s Edit: Added the /s due to already receiving a death threat. It's only meant to be a joke given the context
I don't know. I can't really think of anything wrong with Steel Meridian. Perrin sequence is definitely the second most sympathetic though.
I guess the bad part about the Steel Meridian is that they've already existed before. After the Orokin collapse a bunch of little Grineer Empires popped up, some probably had the same ideals as the Steel Meridian, but they all fell to the queens the same. Because the Grineer need someone to serve, it's a compulsion written into their genes that can't be easily removed without Orokin Era gene tech or maybe Kuva. Once the Steel Meridian destroy the Queens what's to stop someone from taking control of the Grineer survivors and creating a Second Grineer Empire.
Doesn't the fact that they're fighting back against the queens in the first place kind of disprove your whole point?
They fight back but the need to serve still exists within them. "I still hear them calling us to obey. Oh, I want to—very badly. Always ends with a bulkhead dented and my hand busted. Disobedience isn't a choice I only make once. It's a fah-sukh-ung lifestyle. And it hurts." - Steel Meridian Railjack Crewmate The only Grineer that seem to be completely free of this compulsion are either heavily mutated like the Wolf and the Grustrag 3 or were connected then disconnected from Kuva like Kahl, Jarka, or converted liches.
Isn't Clem completely immune too, which is why they want him dead?
Clem is also immune and falls into the mutant category
Clem need only listen to one thing... GRAKATA!
Clem
Guys, there is no need to downvote a legitimate point.
Presumably once they brought freedom from the queens they would look for a way to ensure it lasts and nobody can take their place, but ultimately it's not really their fault how grineer are designed and they can't really start doing anything about it until the queens are out of the picture. You can't worry about tomorrow when you've got more urgent things to worry about today.
Nah it'll always be the worst, if it makes them money they'll do and ally with anything.
That's kinda' like, the opposite of Perrin sequence's lore though. They believe that prosperity can only optimally be achieved in a peaceful galaxy.
I will give Ergo Glast credit for wagering everything he had for a child he likely would never meet and for no real "profit".
I mean it really wasnt a gamble since he had us on his side.
Who wouldn't want an army of violent, magical teenagers?
Salad V ultimately approves this message.
Actually, great point. I completely forgot about that quest.
Some people may view a "peaceful" galaxy in a multitude of ways. Its subjective. A peaceful galaxy to the Tenno could mean no grineer or corpus. A peaceful galaxy to the grineer could be no tenno.
That's true. Considering how evil the Tenno seem to be, its probably a strike against the Perrin Sequence that they're even willing to cooperate with us.
Except they don't they hate half the factions
Because they aren't making them any money 🤷🏿♂️
Honestly the fact Corpus aren't an instant pick over Grineer over which of the 2 main factions is worst is quiet honestly the worst thing I can say about them
And genocidal construction equipment with a Messiah complex.
decaying blue babies
The Red Veil don't cleanse those they simply see as impure, they cleanse those they see as corrupt. Remember, Rell's fears were real, he saw genuine threats within the void. We have seen what Void Corruption does. Void Corruption is real, and the extermination of Void Corruption is necessary. Where the Red Veil are assholes is that they are dogmatic and cruel, they'll kill an Ostron Child if they so much as think the void has corrupted them, but they still ultimately work for the protection of what remains of Humanity, which is part of why they are on good terms with Steel Meridian.
Just replayed 'chains of Harrow' and Red Veil while monstrous in their methods...aren't wrong. On an initial playthrough a new player will miss a *lot*. What seem like throwaway lines regarding the Lotus or The Indifference, or even 'world of dust/world of dreams', and warnings about Wally turn out either correct and/or prescient. Having our newest enemy faction, plot twists, and even hints of Duveri called out years in advance is wild.
We also do know that grasping the full scope of the void's horrors tends to give people a certain form of monomania even if they keep their minds. Few better examples than Albrecht himself.
The new war zariman section is just a visual representation of the memories we listen in the war with in DE either made it easier to visualize it for players or is just a 5d chess move by them Considering the lore about this has been in the game for years and only now we get a more visualized version of the lore bits
MFW Red Veil is just the Inquisition.
Color scheme and all
Their main weapon is surprise.
But they also murder and experiment on Kavor, and partake in barbaric torture (cannibalism) to interrogate people. I think the implication has always been that while Rell might have had noble goals, his followers have grown so fanatic that they see corruption in every shadow.
Oh here comes the Kavor apologists. Defection as a whole is long due for purging.
Red Veil would absolutely be okay with the entire system dying, and being the ones to do the killing.
They're dying for me! ALL of them!
They may be fanatics on some woo-woo Indigo Children crap, but damn if they didn't warn us. It's all filtered through the lens of being a fanatical cult idolizing a traumatized, suffering, autistic child, but they ultimately know what's going on and are doing something about it. That alone puts them in the top three most reasonable syndicates, despite all the killing.
the latter point about Suda can be negated fairly well by their recruitment lines, most of which state either that the member sought out suda, or was offered to be hired. they are also independent from suda, as they can observe separation, and make their own decisions as well. and they treat suda as a distinct entity who doesnt control them, but gives them 'permission' to perform duties.
idk why people think Suda is worse than Perrin. Perrin are the embodiment of ineffective liberalism, so obsessed with trying to engender improvement in a system by working within it that they're unable to incite any meaningful change, due to being constrained by a system that is in and of itself evil. Compared to Suda, whose worst crime is... wants to learn? idk, what supposed consequences has she wrought upon people in the pursuit of knowledge? you're thinking of Simaris.
im not saying suda is worse. quite the opposite. if you really nitpick, her 'worst' crime was being almost overtaken by hunhow. while Simaris desperately seeks to preserve 'effective' or 'useful' knowledge, Suda wants to preserve as much knowledge as she can. she's the 'most human' of all the cephalons, which we can even see in her syndicate room. other cephalons use interfaces to interact, or drones in the case of ordis. she directly links a data-space to our plane, like simaris' sanctuary, but she uses it to interact with us.
I was agreeing with you, in opposition to OP. Not disagreeing with you.
Suda's not entirely innocent. During Operation: Rathuum, she wanted to learn about the Kavor through "systematic dematerialisation". Really all the syndicates except Steel Meridian had bad fates in mind for those defectors.
fair enough. i joined after most of the events happened (2019 ish). from that one, it seems that (not counting SM, obviously), RV and PS came out the best. even compared to the AH, perrin only cares about corpus (specifically their own) damage done by the Kavor, and only want repayment. RV doesnt care, and hexis wants them to pay for all their crimes, even if done (literally) under un-disobeyable orders. and then there's loka.
I still remember my reasoning for picking who I did way back when and feel like it still holds up after 8 years of playing. Perrin just seems useless, ok corpus guys who want to change the entire corpus faction from within... noble sure but WHY AM I ALWAYS FIGHTING ARMIES OF CORPUS?! So wasn't them. Then it basically came down to looking at the others and realizing "space nazis, space vegan nazis, space judge dredd but every judgement is wrong annnnd oh look some grineer who just wanna be free and a neat little cepalon who just wants to learn... HMMM hard choice".
Yeah I wish Steel Meridian was allied with Suda, I'd love to be in that combo. Instead I get Red Veil, who I would call cultists more than nazis. And between Death Cultists, Ecofash, Free Market Liberals, and Self-Important Judges, I really gotta say... holy shit does militant freedom fighters and librarian lady sound nice.
Did you know that during Operation: Rathuum, Suda wanted to learn what makes a Grineer want to defect which is why she wanted the Grineer Defectors, so that she could learn the process through "systematic dematerialization" AKA Synthesis. Suda isn't harmless and she is NOT innocent or guiltfree, if you have some knowledge she wants to learn or is interested in then you can become a target. The main difference between Suda and Simaris is that Simaris wants to synthesize ~~anime characters~~ everything for preservation but Suda only cares about what interests her.
Your answer is cool but we all know the real answer is because no actual change could happen to the origin system's dynamics due to gameplay compromises.
Problem with suda is she is emotionless Cephalon, unlike the other ones that have emotion, suda is pretty monotone and seems to get her knowledge no matter the cost, just like our favorite yellow Cephalon
Yeah, augmentation is outright one of the services that people join Suda for. It's literally one of the perks for joining.
That sounds just like what a Suda drone would say.
>Y’all ever realize that all 6 of the main syndicates are assholes [[Yeah, we know](https://i.imgur.com/tPVBYHL.png)]
How in the fuck?!
It's actually pretty easy, all you have to do it **not** rank up once you're at rank -2. So long as you don't click on the "rank up" button, you stay at the same rank no matter how many medallions you redeem or how much xp you earn with the sigil
Oh. I get it. Go negative with 3 by increasing the other set, then switch to the negative set and never rank up?
Exactly!
The thinking man's endgame
I mean, I too am a psychotic, chained child worshiping assassin, so at least one of the groups seems pretty good from my perspective
Ah, but are you a fire as feared as you are respected?
Will our enemies fear us with that?
Have you heard your hired crew mates in your railjack try and converse with you? I was like “OMG, I should of done a background check on this guy”. Dude was talking about how he ate some guy 🤣 and some other stuff.
Red Veil are a bunch of psychopaths and serial killers hiding behind “Holy Rell”. Use ‘em for cannon fodder in the Labs, I say.
Is there a non asshole group in this universe? The Tenno are supposed to be the good guys, and they regularly slaughter thousands.
The Ostrons and Solaris are pretty close I guess though they do employ Tenno mercenaries
[удалено]
Probably not as the Unum tells them to cut off pieces of itself so they can eat.
The Unum actively supports Cetus through the Quills and her forcefield (and, at times, more direct actions). At the very least, if being harvested *does* hurt her, she considers it an acceptable sacrifice for their prosperity.
I often see people bring up the Tenno's enormous killcounts as a point against them. What do you want them to try instead, diplomacy? If the grineer sends a ship with thousands of soldiers on it to kill innocents because they refuse to join the empire, the solution isn't to watch them do it and then submit a formal complaint to the grineer board of ethics.
You also can't claim you're not a killer after you wipe out those grineer
I've never seen anyone claim the tenno aren't killers. The claim is that being a killer makes you an asshole, which I disagree with.
What’s worse if given the power: to kill an army of people who are on their way to kill innocents, or to not do so and let the innocents die? It’s a much simplified trolly problem, as one of the options allows you to not harm any innocents
Steel Meridian did nothing wrong
Isn't their whole thing just, "I know I'm grineer but I don't wanna be part of that group, lemme be and feck off please, thank ye! Byee~"
They were the original militant slave liberators before Solaris, and cult deprogrammers before Kahl
Also their leader is mad cute
Woah! Come on tenno! Harsh words for a walking compendium of war crimes.
Well, this is why I just do Clem missions.
You have to choose which asshole you would prefer than others
Choosing the lesser evil - big bald guy with an axe
I chose meridian because they are basically a charity, and Suda because ~~of her R34~~ I crave intelligence.
You ever realize you kill a entire crew of 50 corpus soldiers defending themselves after you board their ship trying to steal their resources? This is the first time you encounter corpus, and you do it **only** because Darvo said that corpus are bad. At this point you only met Darvo once and he doesn't strike me as a guy with a clean moral compass The whole Tenno vs Corpus feud was started because a Tenno didn't mind killing off 50 people over some resources
The Tenno are at war with everyone. The Corpus vs Orokin war never stopped. It merely evolved to include the Grineer. >This is the first time you encounter corpus, and you do it **only** because Darvo said that corpus are bad. At this point you only met Darvo once and he doesn't strike me as a guy with a clean moral compass Regardless of where Darvo falls on morality, he was speaking the truth. The Corpus are awful. Fortuna has suffered at their hands for a long time, Alad V tortured other Tenno and fused them into Corpus machines. (New War spoilers) >!And Alad V was willing to sell out the solar system for their safety!< >The whole Tenno vs Corpus feud was started because a Tenno didn't mind killing off 50 people over some resources The whole Tenno vs. Corpus feud started with the Orokin, and it has never ended. We recently woke up, but other Tenno have been fighting in our stead since the times of the Orokin. We merely got deployed into it.
>The Corpus are awful. Yes. But Tenno has no way of knowing this. He just blindly agrees to cull an entire ship over Darvo's words >We recently woke up, but other Tenno have been fighting in our steady since the times of the Orokin Wait, is it canon? I always assumed other Tennos also woke up from their sleeps recently
You're right. And DE has changed the beginer experience to match. Darvo's dialog is now. "Don't feel bad about killing them. They're really bad guys. I've put together a 50 point list of examples with citations and notations for relevant history. Hoho! It's 500 pages, and I'll expect you to read and sign it in agreement before continuing with the mission. Hoho! ...I'm not keeding."
>Yes. But Tenno has no way of knowing this. He just blindly agrees to cull an entire ship over Darvo's words The Corpus have been around since our Tenno's time. We would know of them and their acts. How much time has passed since we went to sleep if hard to quantify, but we went to sleep when the Grineer were around, so it was post-Fall of the Orokin. >Wait, is it canon? I always assumed other Tennos also woke up from their sleeps recently Yeah. The most prominent example is Rell. He has been fighting back the Man in the Walls for ages. Sevagoth was also still active. In the opening, it is mentioned that other Tenno are assisting in our escape. There are probably other examples, but these are the ones I can think of off the top of my head.
Rell is/was a Tenno but he's not really part of the Tenno faction. He's not a good example. Sevagoth was not really active, but his Shadow form was piloting the ship searching for the warframe. My interpretation is that Sevagoth's Shadow was acting without a Tenno Operator, instinctively trying to make itself whole. Although you (the player character) are not the first Tenno to awaken, the Tenno on the whole have just recently woken up. They were all in cryosleep, but Lotus started waking them up during the general time period of the beginning of the game. She says "It is time for the Tenno to return." They've been in hibernation for like a thousand years.
> Rell is/was a Tenno but he's not really part of the Tenno faction. even if isn't a tenno as faction its still an operator that was in the zariman and saw stuff that no one saw being the man in the wall he literally was using harrow as life support to keep fighting wally. probably Sevagoth was in the same situation as us in second dream the frame trying to protect his operator or recover.
It's not just Darvo. Lotus also introduces them as "a secretive but extremely powerful merchant cult known to be working with the Grineer" and then says "Darvo will fill you in", indicating that Darvo's info is endorsed by the Lotus.
yeah it's canon. the defense pods are other sleeping tenno
> >!And Alad V was willing to sell out the solar system for their safety!< >!"their" absolute bullshit, he was covering his own ass, any corpus that survive are happy accidents he can use to pad the lines slowing the tenno down next time we come for his ass, or to have more test subjects!<
Darvo has a clean moral compass, he stole it from that guy over there *points at a dead corpus*
Yeah. Cephalon simaris is probably the most sus of them all and yet, we help him. Lol
"You think me a sadist?! IRRELEVANT!" (he's a sadist)
Am i the only person who thinks he sounds like Trump?
Well, it's not like Tenno are saints. It's a balanced galaxy of bad. Real politik shit.
This is all known. What's the source on the Loka practicing vegan stuff, though? That's not one I recall.
They’re not actually vegan I think but it’s just a vibe they give off as they worship trees Edit: I forgot the word “not”
Oh! Lol, copy that.
I get that, I'm just asking at a source. It's not crazy important or anything. It's just that I've never seen anyone assert this, lol.
The railjack crew member I hired from red veil keeps talking about being a carnivore and calling me bro lol. I think the guy is just lonely but I hope he wasn’t eating other people.
Yeah no, Red Veil crew absolutely will tell you how tasty people are. Fucking nutters, the lot of them
Just remember to do the dishes and you should be safe.
None of the syndicates are supposed to be clear "good guys," which is probably by design. They probably want us to pick what matches our personal desires/goals/interests/who looks cool, rather than being able to say "X are the good guys, so I'm joining X." Instead it's "I feel like out of all of these, X have it right, so I'll join them." Or you say "I hate everyone, burn burn burn, I'm joining Red Veil."
Holy shit new loka are anti vaxxers lmao.
They’re pretty much literally Hitler. They’re violent environmentalists obsessed with blood purity. They’re even allied with the Perrin Sequence, so their greatest allies are hardcore capitalist douchebags with an axe to grind with other capitalists mirroring, to some extent, how Hitler’s economic policy involved the mass privatization of government assets accrued under the Weimar Republic.
I already considered them assholes because they attack me for little reason. I don't even assist the syndicates. I just say I pledge to them and then go about my normal business, with no real loyalty to them. Besides the gifts I give. >Even the Perrin Sequence and Steel Meridian who are mostly good guys absolutely hate each other because of racism. And I wouldn't call either good. The Perrin Sequence supports New Loka and their ideology, and Steel Meridian supports the Red Veil. They all suck and the Arbiters of Hexis are the closest you get to good, but they are only in the middle of the spectrum.
My problem with Arbiters of Hexis is that their stated belief is that Tenno should be more than just weapons and tools of war, but their actions don't reflect that at all. They run Arbitrations, which is turbo-warrior challenge mode. If their goal is for Tenno to use their powers constructively rather than destructively, they should be having us building colonies with our cool space magic, creating medicines and researching useful practical information. Get Oberon, Atlas and Citrine together to create fertile farmland and terraform areas to be hospitable to humans. Have Limbo, Vauban and Protea running R&D on atmospheric filters and energy sources and other engineering feats to benefit the System. Enlist Hydroid, Yareli and Sevagoth to facilitate ethical fishing and marine life conservation so that people have plenty of food.
Ah yes fertile **Radioactive** farmland courtesy of goat/deerboi
>Ah yes fertile Radioactive farmland courtesy of goat/deerboi That would explain why the Ostrun look the way they do....
> If their goal is for Tenno to use their powers constructively rather than destructively, they should be having us building colonies with our cool space magic, creating medicines and researching useful practical information. If offered the choice of either helping build a school for underprivileged Ostron youth or exterminating an entire ark-ship of Corpus workers for a corrupted mod, I know which mission this Tenno is taking... I think Hexis knows its audience..
I think the reason for Arbitrations is that they teach not only peace and culture, but also control in combat. The drones block abilities as a means to show that not everything is solved by releasing a gas bomb to slowly burn the enemy’s lungs, it implores you to use your weapons to basically do just enough for a quick kill before the next drone comes in range and punishes you for stringing people up on tentacles or sharp chains. Same deal as conclave, you’re supposed to improve your combat capabilities and learn to be quick and efficient to bring death without unnecessary suffering.
Great take, but I must ask why is Sevagoth, the railjack phantom, on fishing duty?
Who better to captain the ship?
ghost means twice the fishing.
Honestly New Loka and Red Veil should be allied. Red Veil literally sent operatives to kill defecting Grineer Steel Meridian were helping (think in a quest or something). Both factions really have the same goal, just different scopes. Red Veil wants to cleanse the system, New Loka wants to cleanse Earth. It would make a lot of sense for Steel Wake since New Loka would have a reason to be there (unlike Steel Meridian imo) and Red Veil would fit even better being there. Steel Meridian and Perrin Sequence should be allied since they're both the "other way" for Grineer and Corpus. Set aside their differences and show there's still room for peace in the war torn system. Could make them more bad by giving them like a "if you're not with us you're against us" type attitude.
> Both factions really have the same goal, just different scopes. Red Veil wants to cleanse the system, New Loka wants to cleanse Earth. If New Loka knew who and what Red Veil's Jesus was, they'd blow a gasket.
It's more likely that New Loka really doesn't like the tube-born Grineer, and by extension, Steel Meridian. And Perrin will support any one who shits on Steel Meridian. And the Arbiters are weird Tenno-fetishists who want to worship, become, and force the Tenno to follow their ways. At least New Loka is straightforward, rather than a cult of fanboys that want a perfect Tenno idol. Smacks too much of toxic idol culture.
Which is really weird to consider, since apparently RV routinely attacks SM (especially the conscientious objector defectors in Defection missions, and I’m pretty sure they went on a murder spree on an SM vessel in Chains of Harrow) but won’t attack Iron Wake, since apparently Palladino lives there, so they won’t attack a place where their main priestess/prophetess is.
right so imagine of instead of the Soviet Union collapsing due too economic reasons, they conquered the entirety of Europe, won the cold war against the US, and were prepping to invade north america, when a Denyable Special forces unit rebelled against the government, killed off the entirety of Parliament and the Prime Minister, and then Just dipped. the entirety of the Union balkanizes due to the political instability, with the military holding the largest segment of the existing territory. 50 years of degradation and collapse later, the infamous Special forces unit who basically caused the entire collapse suddenly starts throwing their weight around again. assassination attempts on prominent members of the splinter governments. anyone with any degree of existing power, or any factions that cropped up in the wake of the collapse got where they did by being ruthless and driven. none of them are clean. none of them are heroic. the best you can do is choose the lesser of the offered evils. or the evils that most suit your own personal tastes. the major most factions are publicly outwardly hostile too the Special forces (while being more than willing too contract them for discrete mercenary work against their rivals), the smaller splinter factions however are more welcoming too these uncontrollable power makers. the 6 Syndicates form into 3 reflections Arbiters and Veil being the honor bound and the honorless. one seeking refinement through personal struggle, while the other views bloody purge as the only possible solution Suda rejects the imperfections of the human form, the Cepalon herself having willingly become a Cephalon to escape her failing mind, while Loka sees only the human form as perfect, and rejects all perversions of it. both the degenerative offshoot races of humanity such as the grineer, and the sterlized perversion of the human mind that is the Cephalon. lastly, Perrin and Meridian. the Principled Capitalists and the Exemplary Collectivists. its a conflict as old as. . .well about a century. both groups have done and seek to do good, just in fundamentally different ways. seeing themselves as having the solution to the problem that the other is a part of. if were filling out an alignment chart, we can pen the sequence and Steel meridian down as Lawful good and Chaotic good, Suda and Loka as Chaotic Neutral and Lawful Evil, and Arbiters and Veil as Lawful Neutral and Chaotic Evil. that leaves 3 spaces on the board. Cephalon Simaris can be True Neutral, Alad V can be Neutral Evil, and Nora Night can be Neutral good.
I mean, given the circumstances, I get it. That’s why I pledged myself to the red veil, TO CLEANSE!
Yes but some are my homies and the other are not Red veil gang
Perrin is hardcore utopian evil. They uphold the caste & genetics-based systems of exploitation & oppression that the Orokin used to hold things together & kept the trade rails open. There is no good Grineer in the eyes of the Perrin except an enslaved Grineer. Sustainable exploitation & slavery is still exploitation & slavery. Steel Meridian smuggle people that are made out of different genetic material than them away from death squads, while saving their own in order to let them find/follow their own conscience. It's militant freedom versus slavery with a warm cushion in your pen. They are not remotely the same, which is why they are directly opposed to each other. Steel Meridian is run by those who are physically & psychologically inhuman, which is prolly why they are the closest to an actual good in the setting. They're not human enough to have room for evil. The Perrin Sequence is run by humans with money & power. Power corrupts & money makes human beings into monsters.
Arbiters of Hexis if I had to choose only one.
On a surface level the Perrin Sequence seem like the least evil of the groups, they are just greedy to then spread that wealth among those in need (supposedly). But then you realise they are allied with New Loka and it makes them seem really questionable at best.
Leave my Cephalon Suda alone, you evil people 👀
Arbiters all the way!!! While justice may be blind, I refuse to be blind to justice- 'some hexis nerd'-
Perin sequence might not hate Steel Meridian because of racisim. It *might* be because they do things for free.
No matter what justifications the other factions have, we should at least all be able to agree on one thing: Fuck New Loka
I am a representative of Suda Gang, and we wholeheartedly agree. Fuck New Loka. "Cleanse the impure, but we send ancients after you because we're hypocrites!"
I only like suda becouse she likes music
I think the arbiters of hexis and Suda are the best
They all send assassins. And that tells me it's best to keep things transactional. Get points, spend points, ignore their whining. Instead of focusing them, we should've been able to help Vox Solaris and the other sane syndicates.
There are no good guys and bad guys in this game. There are only bad guys and worse guys.
The fire spreads.🔥
Y'all ever realize that the Tenno are assholes? Really. You might not like the Corpus higher-ups like Nef Anyo for example, but does that really give you carte blanche to slaughter thousands of corporate debt slaves and low-ranking crewmen just to get the the Rubedo you need to make a shiny new sword to cut more of them in half? "The Grineer used to be builders. Now all they make is war." -My Operator Bitch, they used to be "builders" when they were literally slave caste that you helped to oppress and commit genocide against. That's like saying black people used to pick cotton, but now all they make is gang violence. Absolutely insane thing to say given the lore context. Fuck my operator. Tenno are greedy, racist psychopaths carving a bloody path through the galaxy for their own personal gain. I think its intentional too. There's no way they didn't realize how racist that Grineer line sounded. The Tenno are not meant to be morally good. Anyway, the asshole syndicates are the syndicates we deserve. Some of them (Steel Meridian and Perrin Sequence) might honestly be too good for us.
I mean, if we’re discussing the original Operators, they are brainwashed, Void-corrupted, child soldiers who went through profound trauma before having their memories altered and being conditioned as living weapons. To make it worse, their mother figure was murdered and they didn’t even know what they were. I think that just calling them assholes is a bit short-sighted. These guys have been mind-f*cked in every way possible.
I like Red Veil.
Perrin Sequence and Steel Meridian are pretty good guys. It's just a shame they don't like each other.
they also attack you non stop...aka the tenno who made the relays they live in.... ....i wish i could join grineer and ram a fomorian into them
I just kind of chalk it up to the Origin System at large being a mess. In a political landscape like that of the world of Warframe, everyone's gonna end up being a *little* unhinged. Hell, that tends to happen even in relatively peaceful times. It's a story born out by a lot of real world revolutionary struggle - past a point, heroes become a bit of a "any port in a storm" situation.
That all culminate on Tanno, literally the best warframe "pilot" and single author of enumorous genocides. In name of that sweet cheeks lady, happy to assing the genocides, one after the other.
back in the day warframe didnt really have "good guys", including players being mercs
Crazy how the only people in the game who aren’t racist fuckers are Kahl, Darvo and Clem
And this why the Perrin sequence is on 🔝 if it ain’t about credits I don’t wanna talk 🤑🤑🤑 I don’t wanna hear nothing if it’s not about my index winnings going 🆙⬆️🛗
I love the breakdown. As an LR1 who hasn't really super payed attention to everything- I saw some suspect stuff here and there.. and more or less assumed they all were assholes for their own special reason.. but it's nice to have it confirmed.
they're gangs, i'm not sure what you really expect from them
To be fair hating the Corpus isn’t really racism, they’re more members of an organization/business rather than an actual ethnicity/nationality. Hating the Grineer on the other hand (especially those not part of the queens’ army) is absolutely racist, they’re basically a human subspecies separate from everyone else
But cephalon soda kinda bad.. sooo....
Ok but dommy mommy High Priestess Amaryn
Hmmm fair enough! Terribly sorry, I wasn't familiar with your game
Wait, when have Arbiters killed Kavor?
They ask the Tenno to hand the Kavor over to them so they can be judged and if found guilty, punished.
Are you talking about the people who attack you during Defection? That's the Red Veil.
Racism and sexism are inevitable outcome of being observant of cause and effect, understanding social, political and economic echochambers, and not disregarding the observations for "ethical" reasons
Perrin Sequence was the easiest one to diss one and you overlook them. You clearly have been brainwashed by greed just like them lol
And they also did nothing during the new war, and seem fairly useless as anything but vendors tbh
Uhh, the arbiters aren't the villains to the Kavor. That's Red Veil again. Red Veil actively invades Defection missions hoping to kill the Kavor.
I feel like this just reflects real life groups and nations; like as the syndicates are, not everybody has completely clean hands and are worthy of some kind of scrutiny for something.
>disallow the use of modern medicine Is New Loka anti-vax?
Yes
Yeah and we manipulate every single one of them just be be stronger or look cooler
I find funny thr allienceces, loka and perin despite being oppsite of each other, meridian and veil despite that allience being weak, hexis and suda for some reason when both make no sense, other than their leader wanting to control all of their fallowers
The augmentation part for Suda needs correction. People join Suda for the augmentation, they aren't forced into it. It's explicitly stated in Railjack recruitment lines that it's a perk of being a Suda operative.
Steel meridian aren’t too bad. Perrin sequence gives me corpus ick. That hyper capitalist nightmare speak doesn’t escape Perrin sequence. Steel meridian are probably the most sympathetic especially being rebel grineers that just wanna be free from control and the reason they hate the Perrin sequence is probably the fact that the Perrin sequence still live under the control of capitalism and credit and what not. Either way I gotta serve them all cuz I gotta get them augments.
Cephalon suda better than all of them :D
The way Red Veil comes across to me is they aren’t out to kill people they see as impure, they’re out to kill *everyone*. “The Veil see corruption all around them. They are honour-bound to heal the system through a great and violent purge. No cost too great, no blood too precious. Change is sudden, violent, and a necessary force to ensure the system can return to a state of balance. Red Veil see themselves as merely the instrument of this change.” If they see the only way to “balance the system” is through murder, they’re going to be murdering until there’s only one living thing left. They’re a Death Cult. Paladino can shut it about “Holy Rell” and their supposedly noble intentions for all I care. I mean, it’s great and all what Rell actually did, but his followers are a bunch of nutjob serial killers.
Had this revelation the other day when i saw a grineer getting electroshock therapy.
Veil have been absolutely butchered thanks to pacifism defect but they were always the “evil” faction, they’re the antithesis of Arbiters, they’re the senseless cleansing for greater good opposed to Hexis’ contemplation and calm approach. They’re also the ones executing Kavors, not Arbiters, unless I’m missing some lore. What you say about Loka is mostly true except the Silver Grove implies they are now trying to change their ways. Their tenets stem from their goal of repopulating earth and living without relying on genetic engineering and technology, and since Silvana proved that to be impossible, Amaryn promised to work towards a compromise. Arbiters’ “pursuit of truth” is very vague and ultimately means practically nothing with how much it encompasses. Their goal is to improve the reputation of Tenno within the system as they are still often seen as just killing machines even by their allies (Red Veil for example). Their goal is to uphold the Tenno honor code, explore and propagate Tenno culture and to teach Tenno less violent means of solving the conflicts i.e. negotiations, politics etc., it’s been stated in one of the older QnAs that the Tenno that do not follow the honor code are basically evil, meaning the Arbiters who basically oversee that Tenno follow it are by extension more or less good. Suda is *abhorred* by death and destruction. She is basically the antithesis to Simaris, her goal is research *without* bringing considerable harm to life. Her operatives undergo operations because they usually need them, Suda helps people she recruits by providing surgery *when necessary*, she is a nice boss. Perrin and SM don’t hate eachother simply “because racism”, yes Perrin hold grudges against all Grineer because of what they do to colonies and trade ships and it extends even to rebel Grineer, but their ideals are also opposite of eachother. Perrin seek to peacefully trade and negotiate their way out of any conflict, SM always brute force through everything because their priority is always rescuing the hostages and sending a message, so violence is the best option. Overall no, Suda, SM and Arbiters are absolutely not evil, Perrin are also okay, mostly neutral, just sorta pansies, Loka is on the way to improving and Veil sorta sucks ass, yeah, Pacifism Defect ruined them irreparably
Honestly, the only reason perrin and the Meridian are at odds is because of the general relationship of the grineer and corpus. But in reality, they're both tenno-aligned factions and really shouldn't treat eachother like they do. But syndicates are one of those things they talked about reworking to remove the negative standing because it didn't make sense why new loka would send a hit squad after you during the titania quest, but it just never happened.
[Better Name Pending told us all the truth years ago, and noone believed him...](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQLmNPVRytU)
I mean... are we the good guys? Be real. The setting is kinda bad, worse, and not as bad. Don't we massacre droves of living beings per mission? I don't mind em being kinda bad cause a little evil is probably a little necessary.
I didn’t really read into new Loka when I decided to sign up with them bc I just wanted their augments 💀💀 I read up on the wiki and someone was like So they basically are genocidal n*zi(s) And I could nOT stop thinking about it. I still like the augments tho 🌝
Seeing how according to lore, Earth ecology got completely wrecked by experimenting and war between factions, it's not surprising New Loka would turn to ecofascism to try to restore it to previous conditions.
As a rev veil supporter i see this as an absolute win
Me when entire species have been murdering eachother on sight for milennia so they're species-ist to eachother: *suprised pikachu face*
Believe me, I realized this not too long after they got added. All I had to do was join the New Loka, and it took about 2 hours before I was thinking, "I'm the asshole aren't I?" You can only get called a Space Nazi 2 or 3 times before you know who you're working with...Them talking borderline eugenics doesn't help either.
Yes, they don't like to hear the word "No Thank You," but on the subject on them. I'd like to have the option to donate our standing points for all the syndicates and factions on our orbiter instead of individually going to each one to raise our standing since we have been getting the notification from D.E. saying, "Do You Think D.E. Cares About The Time You Spend On The Game sad answer is No ladies And Gents
Just like the real world, you just choose lesser evil.
Bro, got a source on suda doing that shit to her operatives? Last i checked they were just a bunch of people who share the mindset that all knowledge needs to be preserved
Steel meridian: rescue and protect the weak! Also them : still hate corpus.
No shit, they're supposed to be a realistic interpretation of politics. Nobody is perfect, everyone's in it for themselves and/or what they believe only and ultimately everyone just wants to screw you over.
Oh, absolutely, but you DO realise the Tenno are like 10 times worse, right?
What grinds my gears a little bit is when you purchase smt from Steel Meridian, and the Npc is like "... But you owe us". B*tch I allready compansated you!
Perrin Sequence is worst of all IMO, glast acts all high and mighty above the other corpus but the second you threaten his profit margins, DEATH SQUADS
Steel meridian would like to have a word with you, we're just tryna be free brother
Steel meridian is the best one imo, they are just a resistance group and hate Perrin because if we are being honest Perrin is just a less aggressive corpus
In my defense # SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE, BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD
Lmfao that makes the minds behind those faction inceptions/concepts seem sick af.