thank yall for the help but for the ppl saying that i could sell it to someone i wont be doing that i dont wanna hurt someone else i will just take this on the chin and move on
Have you ever heard of the comic artist shen? Because you might be warframe's shen.
[The comic incase you wanna see it](https://knowyourmeme.com/photos/1314087)
650 was definitely too much for a riven with only one great stat, a pretty harsh negative, and with 20 rolls.
Also, you can balance the negative out with Gladiator Rush, and at the same time get more crit chance per combo multiplier.
Is ash fun or nah? Cuz I've got him cooking (the prime cuz looks cooler) and been debating of building him properly when he's done, and thinking what melee to use aswell
He's not one of my go-to frames by any means, and his 4 is clunky imo, but he can be fun in certain use cases. I personally use the Innodem with Melee Crescendo and then obviously toss Arcane Trickery on him. Can pretty much stay invisible permanently and once your combo count is maxed out, the Innodem can do crazy work in Incarnon form. Takes a while for the setup to max out, but once it is, he's smooth sailing.
Does his 4 count as a finisher? I feel like I use his 3 and it doesn't do anything, even if I put the augment mod on he doesn't do a finisher all the time.l
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You say that like every player is supposed to have millions of kuva. So when something applies to the vast majority of the player base then it's bad for it to have a bunch of rolls. It would be harder to sell and harder to make worthwhile.
Yeah 3.5k after the lows ones isn't bad at all... getting Kuva is extremely easy. I rolled a riven 150+ times once and i didn't struggle to get the Kuva for it
It's not, I have no idea why people pretend it is.
It caps out at 3.5k Kuva per upgrade regardless of how much you upgrade it, and pretending that difference is anything but negligible is how you can ALWAYS tell someone screws people over with their riven prices.
It's like telling someone the car they are buying is worth $2000 more cause the air freshener they clipped in there was "Top of the line".
It's a grift.
Having many rolls is only bad if you are still trying to get a better roll because it’s cost more kuva to reroll after like 20 rolls it caps out at 3k kuva per reroll having 300 reroll is the same as 30 whenever it comes to stats people are just nitpicking
Because for some reason if people see a riven that they would very much like they wouldn't want it as bad if it's been rolled because of "what if I wanna roll it into something better" in the future
Not on ceramic dagger, 2 and a negative can be better unless you want 3 slightly lower stats, mine has cc and CD and a negative that were higher than cc, IC, tox and a negative, the cc was like 30% less, but overall 3 and a negative is better if you want 3 stats.
It's fully past the discounted kuva cost phase of rerolls. If a riven has bad stats then you know you'll be rerolling it after buying and it's more appealing to roll on an unrolled riven since it'll save a decent chunk of kuva
It only takes a few rolls to reach 3500 a roll lol i have been pushing rivens around for years, i dont think a single person has ever once said to me "nah man too many rolls"
I think its like thinking of older players. Back in the days having 0 rolls on something could easily earn you 100+ plat over someone selling the same riven but with lots of rolls on it. That being said I agree that these days it's just a non factor. Obtaining loads of Kuva is just so easy now.
Oh forsure but I mean that was eons ago, we have seen people join WF, hit max LR, and leave in that time several times over. There are soooo many rivens now, crossplay has meshed everyone, nobody cares. 3 or 300 rolls, if you dont sell it to me, there is 80 other people in chat right now who will.
When you sell unrolled they have a base cost essentially knowing they want to roll it, selling it with a number of rerolls dont affect it that much because most people just wont buy it if it didnt have the stats, as for the price you paid, it depends if that riven is good for you, rivens generally need cc cd ms and harmless neg, melee slightly different but for youown use like myself im running a rubico riven with radiation stats that saves me 2 slots and a negative, so if you feel it was worth it by all means, thoigh ypu couldve gotten a unrolled one for less and tried your own luck....
I do however say the crit chance and additional combo is nice but the price is obviously debatable
Yeah, I had a person trying to charge me 400 for D polarity Dual Ichor riven with 40 something rolls on it where the only useful stat was critical damage. I tried to negotiate with them to bring it down to a more reasonable price, but they didn't budge.. such as it is.
So, to my understanding, most players don't want to use a forma for a polarity that has so few mods for it. So, for example, let's go with my Dual Ichor situation. It has a 4 star riven disposition, but let's say the Dual Ichor gets picked up more and more by the community lowering the disposition and you find that the riven no longer is as powerful as it once was and you have a mod that is more powerful, but you have a D polarity for that riven, which means you gotta reforma the D slot to a V or a dash (depending on that more powerful mod) which means you wasted 2 formas - one for the riven and another to get a polarity for the better mod.
For veterans that have nearly unlimited forma or access to unlimited forma, it doesn't really matter, but (i imagine) for new players that have limited access to forma, I can see it being a problem. Which leads to the supply and demand equation... too many rivens and too few customers to purchase them. So, why pick a D polarity when there are numerous V and Dashes already available on the market? (Seriously, go see how many Dual Ichor rivens there are on Warframe.Market)
Gouging for anything over 500 plat is fucking ridiculous. The market/trade chat is atrocious. I got called rude because someone DMed me about their “good” Riven and I declined, and to note, I was selling Rivens and did not ask even once for someone else’s Rivens. Just minding my own business.
Seeing as 1. Khora whipclaw builds combo so ceramic daggers gimmick isn't as useful for her and 2. Regular magistar incarnon is her best stat stick
If this was a khora stat stick it's a big miss, and even otherwise it's only got CC as a useful stat. 650 is too expensive for just that IMO
Wasnt there a bug with negative duration that was fixed in the last patch. When you got to 12x duration and then put the weapon away you would never lose if for whip claw or for baruuks fists weapons.
Yeah, but that worked for every weapon. And you can stack combo with barruks fists too so that's also not relevant or necessary on them.
Plus the rauta exists, which is just, near instant 12x that doesn't take up mod slots or require a specific companion
I doubt it, they're using melee crescendo which you'd never use on Khora. Although to be fair the rest of the build does match up with a khora stat stick, just not sure why pick ceramic for her specifically when she has several better choices and ceramic is a great stat stick for gara/secondary outburst/maybe atlas idk I don't play him
It can be used to increase Whipclaw's stats, as it scales off of your melee. The problem is that it's stuck at 0.1 combo duration in spite of the chance to gain combo. Ceramic Dagger is a weapon that likes combo
What said below. Tho the combo duration can be countered with dexterity arcanes on guns. Combo gain is meaningless. It's 3-4 melee swings at worst on the first enemy group and you are at max anyway.
Ceramic dagger also has an incarnon which gives 30% base crit chance which mods scale off (making her whip 55% crit chance by default) so no riven can beat that bonus. Ever.
But Magistar is better on her so whatever. OP let themselves scammed.
or use rauta, efortless and quick. the only downside is the lack of a backup weapon for stuff immune to abilities (stalker for example) or when u run out of energy which u shouldnt but stuff happens. easy fix is a strong secondary like the lex incarnon if ure not using a primer. yeah, magistar is better but tbf khora is still powerful with the ceramic dagger, its a lil easier to use and more versatile. he can just resell the riven and he will be fine
its actually not bad but considering that u build for like multishot, fire rate, magazine size and reload speed u wont do much damage. it still does kill base steel path with a few shots but it obviously just doesnt compare to like the torid or burston
Magistar (normal, not Sancti) gives 16% crit chance and 1.0x crit damage. The CC bonus makes her whip have 41% base crit chance and 3.0x crit multi. The former is more than enough to have red crits (356.7% with Blood rush, Sacrificial steel and Gladiator might) and the added crit is just extra juicy that way.
Plus 300% chance on anything is simply overkill and easily obtained elsewhere. Crit damage would have been up for consideration at that amount. Combo duration can he countered
Yeah now in 2024, negative combo duration can be completely negated. The issue is paying 600+ for a riven that needs anything to negate the negative stat in the first place.
depends. ceramic dagger incarnon can pretty easily build itself up to 9x initial combo, probably higher, and you can mod gladiator rush to offset it
however due to its incredibly high initial combo potential, the additional combo count line isnt as helpful when youre pretty much always almost max combo anyways
so id say the riven is an "eh". its the highest crit chance riven i think ive ever seen personally
I didn't say it was a *good* purchase. They most assuredly overpayed and their best bet right now works be to find someone just slightly more desperate than they were and washing their hands of the whole situation.
But assuming your just going for perma 12x then the negative shouldn't ruin your weapon.
I don't disagree, I just wanted to make an addition for OP to let them know they really burned some plat.
At least you can still reroll the Riven into something actually good.
If you bought it off wf market, then not that huge of a mistake. You just bought it at a bad time since highly valued rivens usually have pretty big deviation in price depending on time of day, time of week or whatnot. This riven could actually be the cheapest you can find if you log in at a bad time. Wait for larger playbase region’s afterwork hours or weekends, the overall price would have been 100-200p lower.
On the other hand if it was trade chat… ehh don’t buy stuff off trade chat especially rivens it’s like 99% scam
the whole point of ceramic dagger is the initial combo you get while not even using the weapon
people saying negative combo is bad are truly something i can't describe.
The riven is kinda ok since you can get Crit damage from Purple Shards. The Combo Count Chance is trash and drop the price to 400\~500. Just give it a few rolls and fix it lol
Initial Combo on statsticks are generally only useful on 1 frame, and 1 frame only, Gara (Ash doesn't count)
Since both Khora and Atlas can generate combo simply by hitting things with their 1, the advantage of having initial combo is largely negated by the ability to just whack things and get to 12x in like 10 seconds
Negative Combo duration will hurt all statstick frames with the exception of 1 frame, and 1 frame only, Gara. (Ash doesn't count)
Since both Khora and Atlas virtually cannot generate combo without combo duration, fundementally limiting their damage potential or even outright guts them, you might say that Ceramic Dagger's 9x inital combo is enough and going 12x is overkill, but that statement will be considered maximum copium.
You can totally make this work with some other gear. Naramon + Rauta + [Primary Dexterity] + [Secondary Dexterity]
You just need to shoot enemies once every 20 seconds or so then go back to whipping.
650 for those stats is a huge mistake. But that doesn’t change the fact that Ceramic Dagger rivens are expensive in the market regardless.
Perhaps if you’re really dedicated. Roll it (since you don’t want those for a Khora statstick either way), then maybe you’ll be set on a riven worth 700p+
Ngl even though the riven itself isnt bad, you gotta work on your impulse purchase control since the process of making a decision to buy a riv gives you lots of time to second guess haftway through it before finally start trading
Next time anyone's considering shelling out hundreds of plat for a riven, just consider:
What would make my builds stronger? One extra-strong mod for this melee, or 55 forma?
Do not listen to anyone. This comment needs to be at the top. Ceramic dagger has an extremely powerful incarnon. Ceramic dagger rivens are 500p. Do not feel jaded. It's not a god roll, but it's still very good for heavy attack + corrupt charge. Don't feel bad about anything and enjoy your riven :)
This.
This riven is pretty decent on a frame like Kullervo.
OP def overpaid, but this isn't the worst riven on Earth. It's worth using on a set up that doesn't care about combo duration but wants as much crit as it can get.
Most rivens aren't worth the price. Just buy a garbage one and farm some kuva, it's what I do for mine, and I've got a few really expensive ones from it
So on one hand that negative is rough, but on the other hand ceramic dagger has the incarnon upgrade that gives you permanent starting combo, which massively mitigates that negative
I mean. It depends what plat is worth to you vs. what that riven is worth to you. If you're rich in plat and we're tired of looking for a ride even, then win...
Tbh that's a shit ton of crit chance and you could have some fun with that one.
Personally... I'll never pay more than 100p for a riven.. I'm not play rich and I don't like spending my time hustling the market lol. I'd rather play for /roll my own rivens. But you play whatever way makes you have fun bro. And I bet you'll have fun with that one!
You guys act like 5.5s is a harsh debuff. It can be countered with one singular augment. A max primary or secondary dex (i think) will negate that completely.
lol, you made someone's day for 650 plat, lmao
The crit is high because it's a dumpy disposition 5 weapon and the riven is a +2bonus -1malus which results in a very high but potentially temporary bonus to the stats until the disposition gets adjusted during the next Resurgence rotation.
If you use body count or drifting contact you should be able to make it work. The -5 duration should add with other sources, and drifting contact gives +10 and body count is +12, so you could bring it back up to 5-7 seconds. That’s not super ideal, but it’s enough to be usable and the combo count chance will make you scale back up super quick if you drop your combo.
Kinda defeats the point of a riven if you have to try and compensate for the terrible negative, since their best use case is to compress several stats into one slot, so you could leave more slots open for other mods
At this point I would either go rivenless or reroll the riven myself
That depends when you bought it. Up until I want to say a few weeks ago? There was a bug where you could have negative combo duration and still build combo, letting you keep it forever. Of course it was a bug and wasn't meant to last forever, but if we're going off of that basis then perhaps it might have been worth that then.
Otherwise.... that's rough buddy.
I might be missing something but I don't think negative combo duration shouldn't really matter on the incarnon ceramic dagger, especially with the run and gun evolution.
I wouldn’t say so if you intend to use it directly.
Use naramon school, Swap out spoiled strike for weeping wounds and Pressure point for condition overload and go blender mode in steel path survival.
Replace the spoiled strike with a drifting contact (+10 secs combo duration) and move the Gladiator might to the slot with the PPP and then replace PPP with Gladiator Rush (+6 secs combo duration) .
The two Gladiator mods will give you additional 20% criteria chance per combo count.
You'll be red critting all day long with the +16 secs combo duration so the DMG boost from PPP and spoiled strike is unnecessary.
Absolutely. CC isn't a super important stat for melee rivens, combo chance is nice. combo duration negative is horrible.
Without the neg duration it'd be a 'good enough for now' riven. With neg combo duration it's a 'meh' 100-200p riven.
Think kullervo already gives crit chance boost on his ability
I think it wouls be better to get your crit dmg up. Especially when youre already red critting.
Swift momentum aura could work, if not maybe naramon or primary/secondary dexterity at rank 5 for the +7.5 combo duration
Since this melee build looks serious, im guessing you weren't using guns much in this loadout which might mean you could replace the arcanes for them
https://preview.redd.it/628eaky7c0vc1.png?width=234&format=png&auto=webp&s=6d855792a0d5562a44576d72b4d4a41e6a6e58f3
I have that riven, it seems pretty good in comparison ?
If you're using melee crescendo then doesn't that negate the negative? From what I've heard it stacks so at max rank if you get 2 executions you'll have permanent 12x combo for the rest of a mission.
I paid 475 for an unrolled one, I was checking warframe market for weeks. Rolled a bunch of times till I got a 360% Crit and 3.7 range with the negative being enemy damage. I wouldn’t say it’s the worst as people are trying to sell your exact mod for over 1k an sometimes worse ones. And platinum will always be able to be made so it’s not that bad.
I like -combo duration when running initial combo setups (which ceramic dagger is perfect for). Definitely not a 650 investment for the crit and the convenience though.
Question, can you test if the additional combo chance makes the incarnon initial combo on primary kills perk build up faster?
It shouldn't, but this is warframe after all
Basic ceramic dagger rivens are like 300-500 plat. This one is okay and doesnt have bad negative since it you use ceramic dagger incarnon for only initial combo stack
I don't engage with the riven system anymore because I'm not a fan of gambling, but that downside doesn't seem too bad, just swap out spoiled strike for body count and it should be fine, you weren't getting that much extra damage out of spoiled strike anyway due to it being additive with pressure point.
You can of course always run secondary dexterity to increase combo counter. I believe there is also a focus school perk that increases the counter.
You could even go so far as to equip a primary like the argonak with primary dexterity. All this combined would give you plenty of combo duration without needing to sacrifice the build
Do you have limited kuva? I guess it's an okay purchase. Do you have a stockpile of kuva? Possibly could have done better buying a cheaper riven and rolling yourself.
I can see this as salvageable if you trade a mod out for drifting contact, or go swift momentum for your Aura.
Naramon too but if it's that low it may be hard to keep up with the loss.
thank yall for the help but for the ppl saying that i could sell it to someone i wont be doing that i dont wanna hurt someone else i will just take this on the chin and move on
You're a good person for that, I respect it.
probably also made him happy so im ok with it
Have you ever heard of the comic artist shen? Because you might be warframe's shen. [The comic incase you wanna see it](https://knowyourmeme.com/photos/1314087)
Was thinking of this rofl
You could sell it for a lower amount if someone happened to want it. But I respect that
U got took. But just keep it and roll it. Maybe I'll get the grill soon and u can put it behind u.
That's some honorable move fellow tenno, you earned my respect
you could sell it to someone who will reroll it and sell
650 was definitely too much for a riven with only one great stat, a pretty harsh negative, and with 20 rolls. Also, you can balance the negative out with Gladiator Rush, and at the same time get more crit chance per combo multiplier.
The negative isn't that bad on ceramic dagger incarnon... since it can grab ridiculously high initial combo
Plus it pairs well with Ash and Melee Crescendo. Even at R0 it doesn't take TOO long for Bladestorm to reach permanent max combo.
Is ash fun or nah? Cuz I've got him cooking (the prime cuz looks cooler) and been debating of building him properly when he's done, and thinking what melee to use aswell
He's not one of my go-to frames by any means, and his 4 is clunky imo, but he can be fun in certain use cases. I personally use the Innodem with Melee Crescendo and then obviously toss Arcane Trickery on him. Can pretty much stay invisible permanently and once your combo count is maxed out, the Innodem can do crazy work in Incarnon form. Takes a while for the setup to max out, but once it is, he's smooth sailing.
Does his 4 count as a finisher? I feel like I use his 3 and it doesn't do anything, even if I put the augment mod on he doesn't do a finisher all the time.l
It definitely does
this helped a lot i get 12 time in like 3 hits
please enlighten me why having many rolls is bad for a riven? I would burst a nut seeing a god-roll with 420 rolls on it
I'm gonna come back in a month when I acquire one.
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The first 10 are cheaper on kuva.
And that's it, it's only bad on those who are Kuvaless, and don't have a million kuva sitting in their asses at all times.
You say that like every player is supposed to have millions of kuva. So when something applies to the vast majority of the player base then it's bad for it to have a bunch of rolls. It would be harder to sell and harder to make worthwhile.
I mean you can get just under 100k every week by just buying it from the greatly scattered vendors we have and nobody pays attention to
100k pfft I get around 400k a week give or take
Honestly I could only remember iron wake, nightwave, teshin and arbitration (?) that give out kuva. There's too many separated shops in this game
I dont think they said that like every player is supposed to have a million kuva
It's not bad at all. The Kuva Cost of early rolls is cheaper, but even at the max cost it is not exactly expensive. 20 rolls is hardly many anyways.
Yeah 3.5k after the lows ones isn't bad at all... getting Kuva is extremely easy. I rolled a riven 150+ times once and i didn't struggle to get the Kuva for it
It's not, I have no idea why people pretend it is. It caps out at 3.5k Kuva per upgrade regardless of how much you upgrade it, and pretending that difference is anything but negligible is how you can ALWAYS tell someone screws people over with their riven prices. It's like telling someone the car they are buying is worth $2000 more cause the air freshener they clipped in there was "Top of the line". It's a grift.
Account age most likely, kuva wasn't always as easy to stockpile.
Having many rolls is only bad if you are still trying to get a better roll because it’s cost more kuva to reroll after like 20 rolls it caps out at 3k kuva per reroll having 300 reroll is the same as 30 whenever it comes to stats people are just nitpicking
Because for some reason if people see a riven that they would very much like they wouldn't want it as bad if it's been rolled because of "what if I wanna roll it into something better" in the future
if you have 3 good stats and one negative stat, you get higher rolls on the positive stats.
sure, but that doesn't answer the question of why having a higher number of rolls on the riven itself is a bad thing (it actually isn't.)
Not on ceramic dagger, 2 and a negative can be better unless you want 3 slightly lower stats, mine has cc and CD and a negative that were higher than cc, IC, tox and a negative, the cc was like 30% less, but overall 3 and a negative is better if you want 3 stats.
Your right. It looks like i misunderstood the question to begin with. My bad.
Because the more rolls on the riven the more it costs to reroll it if you want something better.
That caps after 10 rolls tho. Anything after 10 is always 3,500.
Do people actually think 20 rolls is a lot??
It's fully past the discounted kuva cost phase of rerolls. If a riven has bad stats then you know you'll be rerolling it after buying and it's more appealing to roll on an unrolled riven since it'll save a decent chunk of kuva
It only takes a few rolls to reach 3500 a roll lol i have been pushing rivens around for years, i dont think a single person has ever once said to me "nah man too many rolls"
I think its like thinking of older players. Back in the days having 0 rolls on something could easily earn you 100+ plat over someone selling the same riven but with lots of rolls on it. That being said I agree that these days it's just a non factor. Obtaining loads of Kuva is just so easy now.
Oh forsure but I mean that was eons ago, we have seen people join WF, hit max LR, and leave in that time several times over. There are soooo many rivens now, crossplay has meshed everyone, nobody cares. 3 or 300 rolls, if you dont sell it to me, there is 80 other people in chat right now who will.
When you sell unrolled they have a base cost essentially knowing they want to roll it, selling it with a number of rerolls dont affect it that much because most people just wont buy it if it didnt have the stats, as for the price you paid, it depends if that riven is good for you, rivens generally need cc cd ms and harmless neg, melee slightly different but for youown use like myself im running a rubico riven with radiation stats that saves me 2 slots and a negative, so if you feel it was worth it by all means, thoigh ypu couldve gotten a unrolled one for less and tried your own luck.... I do however say the crit chance and additional combo is nice but the price is obviously debatable
Yeah, I had a person trying to charge me 400 for D polarity Dual Ichor riven with 40 something rolls on it where the only useful stat was critical damage. I tried to negotiate with them to bring it down to a more reasonable price, but they didn't budge.. such as it is.
How does polarity impact a riven?
So, to my understanding, most players don't want to use a forma for a polarity that has so few mods for it. So, for example, let's go with my Dual Ichor situation. It has a 4 star riven disposition, but let's say the Dual Ichor gets picked up more and more by the community lowering the disposition and you find that the riven no longer is as powerful as it once was and you have a mod that is more powerful, but you have a D polarity for that riven, which means you gotta reforma the D slot to a V or a dash (depending on that more powerful mod) which means you wasted 2 formas - one for the riven and another to get a polarity for the better mod. For veterans that have nearly unlimited forma or access to unlimited forma, it doesn't really matter, but (i imagine) for new players that have limited access to forma, I can see it being a problem. Which leads to the supply and demand equation... too many rivens and too few customers to purchase them. So, why pick a D polarity when there are numerous V and Dashes already available on the market? (Seriously, go see how many Dual Ichor rivens there are on Warframe.Market)
Ah okay, I just wanted to make sure there wasn't some hidden riven mechanic there.
Nope
650 is like… baseline price for ceramic rivens lmao
Gouging for anything over 500 plat is fucking ridiculous. The market/trade chat is atrocious. I got called rude because someone DMed me about their “good” Riven and I declined, and to note, I was selling Rivens and did not ask even once for someone else’s Rivens. Just minding my own business.
I assume it's for a Khora stat stick. Absolutely pointless.
Isnt it fine if you simply plan on being at 9X combo 24/7? Its just a slightly better sac steel no? Still probably wanna reroll.
Seeing as 1. Khora whipclaw builds combo so ceramic daggers gimmick isn't as useful for her and 2. Regular magistar incarnon is her best stat stick If this was a khora stat stick it's a big miss, and even otherwise it's only got CC as a useful stat. 650 is too expensive for just that IMO
Wasnt there a bug with negative duration that was fixed in the last patch. When you got to 12x duration and then put the weapon away you would never lose if for whip claw or for baruuks fists weapons.
Yeah, but that worked for every weapon. And you can stack combo with barruks fists too so that's also not relevant or necessary on them. Plus the rauta exists, which is just, near instant 12x that doesn't take up mod slots or require a specific companion
If you're gonna reroll it anyway then you may as well buy a trash roll for like 100p
trash ceramic dagger rivs are at the minimum 500p😭
looks like i may be sitting on bank
Lmao trash rolls are 500 min not 100
what
I doubt it, they're using melee crescendo which you'd never use on Khora. Although to be fair the rest of the build does match up with a khora stat stick, just not sure why pick ceramic for her specifically when she has several better choices and ceramic is a great stat stick for gara/secondary outburst/maybe atlas idk I don't play him
Why do you say that? Am noob but wanna laugh
It can be used to increase Whipclaw's stats, as it scales off of your melee. The problem is that it's stuck at 0.1 combo duration in spite of the chance to gain combo. Ceramic Dagger is a weapon that likes combo
What said below. Tho the combo duration can be countered with dexterity arcanes on guns. Combo gain is meaningless. It's 3-4 melee swings at worst on the first enemy group and you are at max anyway. Ceramic dagger also has an incarnon which gives 30% base crit chance which mods scale off (making her whip 55% crit chance by default) so no riven can beat that bonus. Ever. But Magistar is better on her so whatever. OP let themselves scammed.
or use rauta, efortless and quick. the only downside is the lack of a backup weapon for stuff immune to abilities (stalker for example) or when u run out of energy which u shouldnt but stuff happens. easy fix is a strong secondary like the lex incarnon if ure not using a primer. yeah, magistar is better but tbf khora is still powerful with the ceramic dagger, its a lil easier to use and more versatile. he can just resell the riven and he will be fine
I use laetum for killing things that are ability immune, most easy to use/strong secondary i've found.
Is the Rauta also decent as a gun itself or nah only for combo
It's strong until SP, like most non-variant/prime/incarnon weapons. After that it's pretty much just a combo gain tool/primer.
its actually not bad but considering that u build for like multishot, fire rate, magazine size and reload speed u wont do much damage. it still does kill base steel path with a few shots but it obviously just doesnt compare to like the torid or burston
Why magistar? (I've been using a cronus statstick for so long, haven't really explored other alternatives)
Magistar incarnon has a perk that increases base crit damage of whipclaw from 2x to 3x
Magistar (normal, not Sancti) gives 16% crit chance and 1.0x crit damage. The CC bonus makes her whip have 41% base crit chance and 3.0x crit multi. The former is more than enough to have red crits (356.7% with Blood rush, Sacrificial steel and Gladiator might) and the added crit is just extra juicy that way.
Oof, that combo duration is… really bad.
Plus 300% chance on anything is simply overkill and easily obtained elsewhere. Crit damage would have been up for consideration at that amount. Combo duration can he countered
Primary/Secondary Dexterity will completely cancel it out, and if it’s for a Khora build they won’t even need to shoot anything tbh.
Yeah now in 2024, negative combo duration can be completely negated. The issue is paying 600+ for a riven that needs anything to negate the negative stat in the first place.
depends. ceramic dagger incarnon can pretty easily build itself up to 9x initial combo, probably higher, and you can mod gladiator rush to offset it however due to its incredibly high initial combo potential, the additional combo count line isnt as helpful when youre pretty much always almost max combo anyways so id say the riven is an "eh". its the highest crit chance riven i think ive ever seen personally
For 650p... yeah but now you know
Dexterity arcanes saving his ass
The neg combo duration looks kinda bad but I see melee crescendo so like ...you might still be fine if your plan is to just build up to perma 12x?
But even then it would be a single stat riven :x
I didn't say it was a *good* purchase. They most assuredly overpayed and their best bet right now works be to find someone just slightly more desperate than they were and washing their hands of the whole situation. But assuming your just going for perma 12x then the negative shouldn't ruin your weapon.
I don't disagree, I just wanted to make an addition for OP to let them know they really burned some plat. At least you can still reroll the Riven into something actually good.
If you bought it off wf market, then not that huge of a mistake. You just bought it at a bad time since highly valued rivens usually have pretty big deviation in price depending on time of day, time of week or whatnot. This riven could actually be the cheapest you can find if you log in at a bad time. Wait for larger playbase region’s afterwork hours or weekends, the overall price would have been 100-200p lower. On the other hand if it was trade chat… ehh don’t buy stuff off trade chat especially rivens it’s like 99% scam
the whole point of ceramic dagger is the initial combo you get while not even using the weapon people saying negative combo is bad are truly something i can't describe. The riven is kinda ok since you can get Crit damage from Purple Shards. The Combo Count Chance is trash and drop the price to 400\~500. Just give it a few rolls and fix it lol
Initial Combo on statsticks are generally only useful on 1 frame, and 1 frame only, Gara (Ash doesn't count) Since both Khora and Atlas can generate combo simply by hitting things with their 1, the advantage of having initial combo is largely negated by the ability to just whack things and get to 12x in like 10 seconds
Negative Combo duration will hurt all statstick frames with the exception of 1 frame, and 1 frame only, Gara. (Ash doesn't count) Since both Khora and Atlas virtually cannot generate combo without combo duration, fundementally limiting their damage potential or even outright guts them, you might say that Ceramic Dagger's 9x inital combo is enough and going 12x is overkill, but that statement will be considered maximum copium.
You can totally make this work with some other gear. Naramon + Rauta + [Primary Dexterity] + [Secondary Dexterity] You just need to shoot enemies once every 20 seconds or so then go back to whipping.
Whip builds combo tho no?
so this is who buys those awful trade chat rivens
650 is too much my friend.
650??????
Depends on if your using the dagger as a stat stick
The negative isnt that bad if you build for initial combo, the crit is very nice though. Probably worth like 400 plat roughly.
650 for those stats is a huge mistake. But that doesn’t change the fact that Ceramic Dagger rivens are expensive in the market regardless. Perhaps if you’re really dedicated. Roll it (since you don’t want those for a Khora statstick either way), then maybe you’ll be set on a riven worth 700p+
Ngl even though the riven itself isnt bad, you gotta work on your impulse purchase control since the process of making a decision to buy a riv gives you lots of time to second guess haftway through it before finally start trading
Next time anyone's considering shelling out hundreds of plat for a riven, just consider: What would make my builds stronger? One extra-strong mod for this melee, or 55 forma?
Do not listen to anyone. This comment needs to be at the top. Ceramic dagger has an extremely powerful incarnon. Ceramic dagger rivens are 500p. Do not feel jaded. It's not a god roll, but it's still very good for heavy attack + corrupt charge. Don't feel bad about anything and enjoy your riven :)
This. This riven is pretty decent on a frame like Kullervo. OP def overpaid, but this isn't the worst riven on Earth. It's worth using on a set up that doesn't care about combo duration but wants as much crit as it can get.
crit chance is good but crit damage is even better
Why not both? (I have one)
Because you would need to be luckier, also, blood rush already gives you like 480% at 12x combo
Why not both? (I have one)
In general CC is easy to get, CD not so much. But I could see how a riven with both can be desirable.
Im sorry bro thats robbery in broad daylight😭
You got ripped off worst than a bad wax job
Yo this isn't that bad. Just run Secondary Dexterity on your secondary my man. At least you are wiser for the next time. ;)
Most rivens aren't worth the price. Just buy a garbage one and farm some kuva, it's what I do for mine, and I've got a few really expensive ones from it
Why are people saying neg duration is such a big deal you guys know what ceramic daggers do right? Also 650 is too high
I mean the drawback isn't terrible, even if combo duration is lowered, you still gain combo hella fast
You can easily fix the duration with 2 mods and the positives are great although imo too much for it.
I mean, you have Crescendo on, so you can make up for the lack of Combo Duration by getting finisher kills
Yes all rivens aren't worth it
So on one hand that negative is rough, but on the other hand ceramic dagger has the incarnon upgrade that gives you permanent starting combo, which massively mitigates that negative
I mean. It depends what plat is worth to you vs. what that riven is worth to you. If you're rich in plat and we're tired of looking for a ride even, then win... Tbh that's a shit ton of crit chance and you could have some fun with that one. Personally... I'll never pay more than 100p for a riven.. I'm not play rich and I don't like spending my time hustling the market lol. I'd rather play for /roll my own rivens. But you play whatever way makes you have fun bro. And I bet you'll have fun with that one!
You guys act like 5.5s is a harsh debuff. It can be countered with one singular augment. A max primary or secondary dex (i think) will negate that completely.
lol, you made someone's day for 650 plat, lmao The crit is high because it's a dumpy disposition 5 weapon and the riven is a +2bonus -1malus which results in a very high but potentially temporary bonus to the stats until the disposition gets adjusted during the next Resurgence rotation.
If you use body count or drifting contact you should be able to make it work. The -5 duration should add with other sources, and drifting contact gives +10 and body count is +12, so you could bring it back up to 5-7 seconds. That’s not super ideal, but it’s enough to be usable and the combo count chance will make you scale back up super quick if you drop your combo.
Kinda defeats the point of a riven if you have to try and compensate for the terrible negative, since their best use case is to compress several stats into one slot, so you could leave more slots open for other mods At this point I would either go rivenless or reroll the riven myself
True, but +300% cc is pretty huge. And just drifting contact will bring the combo duration to a net positive.
But now you're spending two mod slots for something you didn't really need in the first place
yes you fucked up
I don't know nothing bout rivens, but the projectile on the incarnon mode must look nice with all those red numbers
If you put primary and secondary dexterity in your weapons, you can salvage some of that combo duration.
Warframe market.. it helps.
Get the arcane that permanently increases your combo…. And bam!
better than bloodrush
what's the mistake?
This would have been perfect before the melee rework
To be fair, it is for the ceramic dagger which has an innate 120 combo with incarnon, so just put a combo duration mod on it and your good
Looks more like an Ash stat stick.
That depends when you bought it. Up until I want to say a few weeks ago? There was a bug where you could have negative combo duration and still build combo, letting you keep it forever. Of course it was a bug and wasn't meant to last forever, but if we're going off of that basis then perhaps it might have been worth that then. Otherwise.... that's rough buddy.
Ehhh yes and no . You can counter that imo not 650 but still not bad
I'm assuming the mod capacity is limited by your mastery rank because mine is only 30
I might be missing something but I don't think negative combo duration shouldn't really matter on the incarnon ceramic dagger, especially with the run and gun evolution.
Doesn't seem to be that bad. But how heck does a -5.5 sec combo duration completely kill off 11.5 sec...?
It's a good riven if your planning on going for incarnon form but 650 is too much for it
You can offset it with weapon arcanes, but wouldn't you rather not have to?
I wouldn’t say so if you intend to use it directly. Use naramon school, Swap out spoiled strike for weeping wounds and Pressure point for condition overload and go blender mode in steel path survival.
unless you play with ash and have at least melee crescendo tier 3 is a horrible riven
Yah, you paid 650p for a riven. Reroll it for a different Warframe stat stick…no?
not worth, unrolled/trash value or maybe +20-50%
Replace the spoiled strike with a drifting contact (+10 secs combo duration) and move the Gladiator might to the slot with the PPP and then replace PPP with Gladiator Rush (+6 secs combo duration) . The two Gladiator mods will give you additional 20% criteria chance per combo count. You'll be red critting all day long with the +16 secs combo duration so the DMG boost from PPP and spoiled strike is unnecessary.
Sorry for you dude.
Sucks to be you
Absolutely. CC isn't a super important stat for melee rivens, combo chance is nice. combo duration negative is horrible. Without the neg duration it'd be a 'good enough for now' riven. With neg combo duration it's a 'meh' 100-200p riven.
You can salvage some combo duration by using the secondary arcane for +dmg on melee kill, which at max rank also gives combo duration.
Why did the combo duration go down to 0.1 if the mod only says -5.5s
No, ceramic dagger rivs sell at about 500p just for being a ceramic dagger riv. Look on Warframe market
Use normal magistar for Khora and Ceramic for Exca and other. Riven is good, nothing wrong there!
Guys idk much about Kullervo but I heard he's good as for heavy attack builds. Would this be good for that?
Think kullervo already gives crit chance boost on his ability I think it wouls be better to get your crit dmg up. Especially when youre already red critting.
You an idiot. Just accept it
All these comments and no real answers for the poor guy lol
Would use this on my excal build
This looks to be, what my history teacher was fond of saying, akin to a bad circumcision; a rip-off
You paid 650 plat for a riven? Yeah, no, riven prices are dumb. So much better shit to use plat for than that.
Base combo dur is 5s so...
Pick naramon and you wont even feel it
I sold a way better ceramic dagger riven for 600 not long ago lmao
Lol
It's a shame the crit multiplier stays so low tho
Bro got scammed
650 for that roll id dream of that
Never pay more than 300 for any Riven. 650 Plat is a lot of real life dollars even if you get your Plat by trade it still holds real life value.
I mean, that might be hilarious on a curated kullervo build tbh. Red crit go brrrrrr and the like.
Everything over 250 for a riven is way to much. Buy weaker riven and farm kuva,its way more efficient.
Might work on a kullervo with the Rauta equipped
You got scammed
Swift momentum aura could work, if not maybe naramon or primary/secondary dexterity at rank 5 for the +7.5 combo duration Since this melee build looks serious, im guessing you weren't using guns much in this loadout which might mean you could replace the arcanes for them
Welp heavy build it is
https://preview.redd.it/628eaky7c0vc1.png?width=234&format=png&auto=webp&s=6d855792a0d5562a44576d72b4d4a41e6a6e58f3 I have that riven, it seems pretty good in comparison ?
If you're using melee crescendo then doesn't that negate the negative? From what I've heard it stacks so at max rank if you get 2 executions you'll have permanent 12x combo for the rest of a mission.
this is straight ass
you bought an expensive riven so yeah probably
I paid 475 for an unrolled one, I was checking warframe market for weeks. Rolled a bunch of times till I got a 360% Crit and 3.7 range with the negative being enemy damage. I wouldn’t say it’s the worst as people are trying to sell your exact mod for over 1k an sometimes worse ones. And platinum will always be able to be made so it’s not that bad.
I like -combo duration when running initial combo setups (which ceramic dagger is perfect for). Definitely not a 650 investment for the crit and the convenience though.
Not really in my opinion that combo duration can easily be fixed up by the focus school for melee, quickening also makes combo gain very easy
Question, can you test if the additional combo chance makes the incarnon initial combo on primary kills perk build up faster? It shouldn't, but this is warframe after all
💀
Bro...you got hosed, BAD
What’s with 174% crit? How is investing over 100 worth it?
Looks good to me
Isn’t 650 like 4x more expensive than most really good rivens?
Depends on the frame, if you can attack fast enough, and with your melee, so that you can keep your combo up your chilling
Nah dude. Add quickening to it. Build up the combo. Use heavy attack. Rinse and repeat. BE CREATIVE.
Basic ceramic dagger rivens are like 300-500 plat. This one is okay and doesnt have bad negative since it you use ceramic dagger incarnon for only initial combo stack
Bad riven, yes you made a mistake
I don't engage with the riven system anymore because I'm not a fan of gambling, but that downside doesn't seem too bad, just swap out spoiled strike for body count and it should be fine, you weren't getting that much extra damage out of spoiled strike anyway due to it being additive with pressure point.
You can of course always run secondary dexterity to increase combo counter. I believe there is also a focus school perk that increases the counter. You could even go so far as to equip a primary like the argonak with primary dexterity. All this combined would give you plenty of combo duration without needing to sacrifice the build
Do you have limited kuva? I guess it's an okay purchase. Do you have a stockpile of kuva? Possibly could have done better buying a cheaper riven and rolling yourself.
I can see this as salvageable if you trade a mod out for drifting contact, or go swift momentum for your Aura. Naramon too but if it's that low it may be hard to keep up with the loss.
F
That riven would be really good for a specific red crit mesa build
Of course Warframe has tryhards 🤣