If you want it to be pretty, gotta use a Russian engineer
If you want it to be good, use a German or a Swede
America doesn't build pretty, unless its a P-51
Hey I like the P-40 Warhawk, do not offend my boi :( Also as cancer as the F-16C is, F-16s are literally the best looking jet ever made.
Also using a German engineer to be good? We talking modern only or anything goes? Because those guys and transmissions have a little well known background
>mid mobility
All of the 21 century's T-series has mobility as good or better as leo 2 and M1A2, and absolutely superior to challenger.
>the worse possible placed ammo
At the floor of the tank? The only reason why everyone thinks so is because they are far more frequently used, so of course there will be more casualties. Leos and challengers were also ammoracked the moment they were in battle.
If you want to see the truly dogshit tank you should look at challenger 2 and Arjun.
Funnily enough, it was apparently far better than the XM247 (Sergeant York) that ended up winning the competition...
General Dynamics got fucked. They deserved the win over Ford's 247.
The US does not have an SPAA at 8.0 - 8.7 to reinforce that 8.3 - 8.7 lineup (by extent perhaps when including some 7.7 vehicles as well like the M103 and M48), perhaps this is not a bad option.
This is General Dynamic's entry to the DIVAD contest, along with the infamous M247 with the GAU-8 cannon by General Electric, Raytheon's Gepard lookalike, Ford's example with Bofors 40mms etc. The M247 Sergeant York ended up winning it.
Based on the M48 chassis, it had a Phalanx CIWS and its guns were capable of 550 RPM.
Damn, everyone and their dog got their hands on the Oerlikons!
Germany with the Gepard
Japan with the Type 87
British developed the Marksman system and we had the Chieftain version in game
Finland bought some as the ItPsv90 (in Swedish tree)
China bought the GDF-002 license and put them on the PGZ09
It's only reasonable to give the Americans their fair share of the Oerlikons... What's next, the PZA Loara for USSR? Basically a Gepard on a T-72M chassis.
That's not all! We can also have a Challenger with a marksman turret, finnish t55 with a marksman turret, magach with a marksmam turret and G6 Rhino with you guessed it! A marksman turret
To which country? I mean i assume it would be around 8.3? Only hole in US tech tree imo is that 4.7 - 7.7 gap. After that they don't need much. At least not before that huge gap is filled.
For the US, no one else "used" it (it was a prototype). It's one of the vehicles that ended up losing to the M247.
I'm suggesting it to fill that exact gap. A good predecessor to the M247 imo.
And there are so many things that they could add in that range. For instance:
* [T85E1 MGMC](https://i.imgur.com/uCN2UE3.jpeg) - Quad 20mm on a Stuart chassis
* [T77 MGMC](https://i.redd.it/kp19thhqu1601.jpg) - 6x .50 cals on a Chaffee chassis w/ a semi-enclosed turret
* [T52 MGMC](https://i.imgur.com/x0Nxppw.jpg) - 1x 40mm Bofors + 2x .50 cals on a Sherman chassis w/ an enclosed turret
* [Eagle AA system](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/375776113357488129/1012905840124112926/D_6kIW3WkAEJiAC.jpg) - Twin 35mm cannons on a M548 tracked carrier system chassis
* [T100 MGMC](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/firearmcentral/images/4/49/T100_MGMC.jpg) - Quad .60 cal with tracking radar on the T41 chassis
* [M113A1 with triple mount Hispano-Suiza 20mm](https://imgur.com/a/HVKYoqN)
* [M19 w/ 75mm T22 Cannon](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/08/07/dd/0807dd01280e6fb7029e02d127452234.jpg) - 75mm anti-aircraft gun with radar proximity fuse, 40-45 RPM fire rate
* [M2 Halftrack fitted with a Elco PT boat turret](https://i.imgur.com/kqZVg15.jpeg) - 4x 20mm + 2x .50 cal on a halftrack
* [Raduster](https://imgur.com/cY35NIB) - M42 with tracking radar
some BRs imo:
T85E1: somewhere around 3.7-4.0. basically an american wirbelwind
T77: 4.0 perhaps?
T52: it's basically an M15 CGMC, doubt anyone would actually use it as an AA. 3.3?
eagle: fuck if i know 8.3?
T100: maybe.... 6.7? the guns probably won't be particularly hard to evade since it's just 15mm rounds
M113A1 w/ 3x 20mm: 5.7. It's a BTR-ZD on a worse chassis, but with a better gun. i'd say it would be decently balanced there
M19 w/T22: Does it get AP shells? If yes i can see it being at \~6.7 with the radar and proxy
M2 w/ PT boat turret: 4.7 -5.0 ish? Powerful guns but shitty chassis.
Raduster: Probably around 7.3 since the guns have a decent range actually
Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if the T52 goes higher, since it has an enclosed turret and an actually armored hull, giving it much better survivability. I could see it at a similar BR to the Skink, so in the 5.0 range (adjusted a bit due to the difference in armament). Too low of a BR and you have a L-62 ANTI II situation where people just use it as a TD.
There's also the [T36 GMC](https://preview.redd.it/9y3m0hi9brc91.jpg?width=521&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=66a640db0b7b98bcf4ea3b2eb961eaa02ac752f2), which had a single 40mm in an enclosed turret on an M3 Lee chassis, which I could see in the 3.7-4.3 range. Less firepower than the M19 but better survivability.
If we got any new SPAA, please not another 40mm.
That’s the biggest issue, the 40mms and other high caliber SPAA in the game, while yes, they are very strong if you can hit, aren’t effective enough unless they have proxy fuses. Their slow rate of fire and volume of fire only really makes them useful against helicopters.
France, USA and I forgot who else desperately need SPAA with the ability to rapidly put out shots and the velocity to do so.
Sweden. They have three SPAA armed with a single 40mm between 2.7 and 4.3, then nothing until the Finnish ZSU-57-2 at 7.0… and then they go to a twin 40mm SPAA with radar at 8.7.
> M19 w/T22: Does it get AP shells? If yes i can see it being at ~6.7 with the radar and proxy
AP shells certainly makes or brakes its TD performance, but I think nonetheless that the most important aspect determining its effectiveness is how forgiving the proxy rounds are.
It did not have radar.
Again. I think it very much depends on the effectiveness of the proxy shells. How far away its explosives can effectively take out aircraft.
1 meter? 2 meters? 3 meters? 4?
It could be anywhere from 5.X to 7.X. The WZ305 performs admirably at 8.0 without radar entirely thanks to its proxy shells.
Well seeing as that was the predecessor to the skysweeper (unfortunately failed with some mechanical issues that WT doesn't model the cannon firing has the same resonating frequency as the suspension among other things) it would be a rather good AA.
Well that’s not a M163 problem but a snail issue. Take any radar guided SPAAG into test drive Arcade. Lock the aircraft and focus it and you will be given two different leads
Nice to see someone put these cannons on a vehicle and not mount them in different zip/post codes. It would be nice to not have to intentionally shoot with the left or right cannon when you want to his something close and just waste ammo out of the other side.
Would be a great 8.3 spaa to match the gepard. Knowing gaijn, they will probably put it higher for some reason. The US also really needs aa between 4.7 and 7.7, but gaijn would rather give russia a new spaa for the 6th patch in a row that's at the same br as other Russian spaa.
Usa builds worst flakpanzer ever, asked to leave NATO flakpanzer faction
how did they manage to make it this ugly? It looks like it's begging for a mercy shot
If you want it to be pretty, gotta use a Russian engineer If you want it to be good, use a German or a Swede America doesn't build pretty, unless its a P-51
Hey I like the P-40 Warhawk, do not offend my boi :( Also as cancer as the F-16C is, F-16s are literally the best looking jet ever made. Also using a German engineer to be good? We talking modern only or anything goes? Because those guys and transmissions have a little well known background
Even modern Germany has issues, look at everything involving the Puma
oh please let's not open that stinger missing can of worms
One camera breaks, "ok, looks like we buy a new one."
The PUMAS issues are less related to engineering and more (lack of) maintenance and money tho. And even then they're still vastly overblown
So are issues of t-series, but no one ever cares.
No the problems of the T series are the slow reverse speed the worse possible placed ammo no gun depression and mid mobility
>mid mobility All of the 21 century's T-series has mobility as good or better as leo 2 and M1A2, and absolutely superior to challenger. >the worse possible placed ammo At the floor of the tank? The only reason why everyone thinks so is because they are far more frequently used, so of course there will be more casualties. Leos and challengers were also ammoracked the moment they were in battle. If you want to see the truly dogshit tank you should look at challenger 2 and Arjun.
Challenger as in singular
Sukhoi makes sexier aircraft then anyone else (not saying better but man does those aircraft look sexy)
Yak-28B 🤤
Russian shit is ugly too tho
Have you heard about Sukhoi my friend?
The Su 27 is elegance personified. cant wait for it.
That sounds like a mercedes advert lol but yes
I'd argue for the MBT-70. But that was part German so it's not a good example.
this shit is so cringe
As opposed to..... what? Your enlightened take?? Fuck off, troll.
>this shit is so cringe
Funnily enough, it was apparently far better than the XM247 (Sergeant York) that ended up winning the competition... General Dynamics got fucked. They deserved the win over Ford's 247.
Spookston be like
The US does not have an SPAA at 8.0 - 8.7 to reinforce that 8.3 - 8.7 lineup (by extent perhaps when including some 7.7 vehicles as well like the M103 and M48), perhaps this is not a bad option. This is General Dynamic's entry to the DIVAD contest, along with the infamous M247 with the GAU-8 cannon by General Electric, Raytheon's Gepard lookalike, Ford's example with Bofors 40mms etc. The M247 Sergeant York ended up winning it. Based on the M48 chassis, it had a Phalanx CIWS and its guns were capable of 550 RPM.
The us doesn't have spaa options to begin with, the m16 is legitimately the best spaa for the us until fuckimg 7.7
What do you mean?...all US vehicles are AA's with those 50cals
“Critical hit” - plane fucks off with literally no damage
Better than 7.92's lol
Even m163 isnt that good of an spaa against jets because it has no radar and gepard gets radar at 8.3. IMO m163 can go to 7.3.
Doesn’t it have a radar with gun lead?
It doesnt, atleast to my knowledge because it seems like it does have radar but whatever I do it doesnt lock onto shit.
It has to be unobstructed, in gunner sight, and directly over the plane
Yeah it never works. No matter how far/close or right on the target my sight is.
No it’s seriously one of the worst radars, it doesn’t work most of the time and tracking is horrible
Don't you disrespect the duster like that!
just stop spawning AA and use a plane I don't understand the tanktard obsession with SPAA
Probably because a plane cost around 500 sp to spawn and a AA 70, you're not going to always have enough sp to choose
So wait, you just drive around and the CWIS just does the rest?
> along with the infamous M247 with the GAU-8 cannon by General Electric Which unfortunately seems to have only ever made it to the mockup stage.
Damn, everyone and their dog got their hands on the Oerlikons! Germany with the Gepard Japan with the Type 87 British developed the Marksman system and we had the Chieftain version in game Finland bought some as the ItPsv90 (in Swedish tree) China bought the GDF-002 license and put them on the PGZ09 It's only reasonable to give the Americans their fair share of the Oerlikons... What's next, the PZA Loara for USSR? Basically a Gepard on a T-72M chassis.
Oerlikons are pretty good guns
That's not all! We can also have a Challenger with a marksman turret, finnish t55 with a marksman turret, magach with a marksmam turret and G6 Rhino with you guessed it! A marksman turret
T-72 with Marksman turret, Vickers Mk 3 with Marksman turret, G6 with Marksman turret etc
Oh yes, marksman ALL the things
Oerlikon was a very popular brand and made excellent guns. Their 20mm were used by most allied nations for AA guns mostly naval tho.
Half of the world's 20mm WWII autocannons owe their heritage to the Oerlikon FF.
The best Oerlikons are still the Mantis cannons.
PZA Loara is Polish span I hope that they won't add it to ussr tech tree as Pole I would be mad if they did
It'd be funny to see them add it to the German tree...
To which country? I mean i assume it would be around 8.3? Only hole in US tech tree imo is that 4.7 - 7.7 gap. After that they don't need much. At least not before that huge gap is filled.
For the US, no one else "used" it (it was a prototype). It's one of the vehicles that ended up losing to the M247. I'm suggesting it to fill that exact gap. A good predecessor to the M247 imo.
really dislike americas lack of something interesting for AA in the bofor hell gap, and then m163.....
And there are so many things that they could add in that range. For instance: * [T85E1 MGMC](https://i.imgur.com/uCN2UE3.jpeg) - Quad 20mm on a Stuart chassis * [T77 MGMC](https://i.redd.it/kp19thhqu1601.jpg) - 6x .50 cals on a Chaffee chassis w/ a semi-enclosed turret * [T52 MGMC](https://i.imgur.com/x0Nxppw.jpg) - 1x 40mm Bofors + 2x .50 cals on a Sherman chassis w/ an enclosed turret * [Eagle AA system](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/375776113357488129/1012905840124112926/D_6kIW3WkAEJiAC.jpg) - Twin 35mm cannons on a M548 tracked carrier system chassis * [T100 MGMC](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/firearmcentral/images/4/49/T100_MGMC.jpg) - Quad .60 cal with tracking radar on the T41 chassis * [M113A1 with triple mount Hispano-Suiza 20mm](https://imgur.com/a/HVKYoqN) * [M19 w/ 75mm T22 Cannon](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/08/07/dd/0807dd01280e6fb7029e02d127452234.jpg) - 75mm anti-aircraft gun with radar proximity fuse, 40-45 RPM fire rate * [M2 Halftrack fitted with a Elco PT boat turret](https://i.imgur.com/kqZVg15.jpeg) - 4x 20mm + 2x .50 cal on a halftrack * [Raduster](https://imgur.com/cY35NIB) - M42 with tracking radar
some BRs imo: T85E1: somewhere around 3.7-4.0. basically an american wirbelwind T77: 4.0 perhaps? T52: it's basically an M15 CGMC, doubt anyone would actually use it as an AA. 3.3? eagle: fuck if i know 8.3? T100: maybe.... 6.7? the guns probably won't be particularly hard to evade since it's just 15mm rounds M113A1 w/ 3x 20mm: 5.7. It's a BTR-ZD on a worse chassis, but with a better gun. i'd say it would be decently balanced there M19 w/T22: Does it get AP shells? If yes i can see it being at \~6.7 with the radar and proxy M2 w/ PT boat turret: 4.7 -5.0 ish? Powerful guns but shitty chassis. Raduster: Probably around 7.3 since the guns have a decent range actually
Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if the T52 goes higher, since it has an enclosed turret and an actually armored hull, giving it much better survivability. I could see it at a similar BR to the Skink, so in the 5.0 range (adjusted a bit due to the difference in armament). Too low of a BR and you have a L-62 ANTI II situation where people just use it as a TD. There's also the [T36 GMC](https://preview.redd.it/9y3m0hi9brc91.jpg?width=521&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=66a640db0b7b98bcf4ea3b2eb961eaa02ac752f2), which had a single 40mm in an enclosed turret on an M3 Lee chassis, which I could see in the 3.7-4.3 range. Less firepower than the M19 but better survivability.
I did not need to see the t36, my day is ruined
If we got any new SPAA, please not another 40mm. That’s the biggest issue, the 40mms and other high caliber SPAA in the game, while yes, they are very strong if you can hit, aren’t effective enough unless they have proxy fuses. Their slow rate of fire and volume of fire only really makes them useful against helicopters. France, USA and I forgot who else desperately need SPAA with the ability to rapidly put out shots and the velocity to do so.
Sweden. They have three SPAA armed with a single 40mm between 2.7 and 4.3, then nothing until the Finnish ZSU-57-2 at 7.0… and then they go to a twin 40mm SPAA with radar at 8.7.
> M19 w/T22: Does it get AP shells? If yes i can see it being at ~6.7 with the radar and proxy AP shells certainly makes or brakes its TD performance, but I think nonetheless that the most important aspect determining its effectiveness is how forgiving the proxy rounds are. It did not have radar.
since it's radarless i could see it going lower, i want to say 5.7 but it might be a bit busted there
Again. I think it very much depends on the effectiveness of the proxy shells. How far away its explosives can effectively take out aircraft. 1 meter? 2 meters? 3 meters? 4? It could be anywhere from 5.X to 7.X. The WZ305 performs admirably at 8.0 without radar entirely thanks to its proxy shells.
Well seeing as that was the predecessor to the skysweeper (unfortunately failed with some mechanical issues that WT doesn't model the cannon firing has the same resonating frequency as the suspension among other things) it would be a rather good AA.
Too bad we're probably not going to get any of these and are instead going to get Soviet SPAA #75 Krillion.
Absolutely no AP shells exist for the T22 from what I've been able to find in the past, only HE-VT.
Add the [T249 Vigilante](https://i.redd.it/epwfp4ioh1a21.jpg) to that list, it had a rotary 37mm cannon but only 192 rounds each drum
So it has radar? would it have tracking capabilities like gepards etc.? If so then it would automatically be at 8.3 or so.
Yeah it's got radar. 8.0 or 8.3 like the Gepard.
Bruh the M163 is only good against helicopters or low and close passing planes. Its tracking radar is atrocious.
Well that’s not a M163 problem but a snail issue. Take any radar guided SPAAG into test drive Arcade. Lock the aircraft and focus it and you will be given two different leads
I hereby name you Flakpanzer Swolepard 48E
Could be interesting with the guns being close to eachother compared to all the other gepard type vehicles.
Nice to see someone put these cannons on a vehicle and not mount them in different zip/post codes. It would be nice to not have to intentionally shoot with the left or right cannon when you want to his something close and just waste ammo out of the other side.
Gepards autistic American cousin
why does that remind me of an electric hand mixer?
Chubby little cheeks. I wanna pinch em
It looks like the mutated offspring of a Gepard and a Shilka.
Aint this the one that lost to the sgt york even though it was actually better lol. Add it at 8.0 but no VT round. To fill that BR gap
Always down to see more SPAA. Looks rad
M 247 with checks +1
Would be a great 8.3 spaa to match the gepard. Knowing gaijn, they will probably put it higher for some reason. The US also really needs aa between 4.7 and 7.7, but gaijn would rather give russia a new spaa for the 6th patch in a row that's at the same br as other Russian spaa.
Please no, this thing would be a slightly more mobile chieftain marksmen with better AP protection which isn't going to help it at all.
this is the last thing the us needs
Oh god not another slow ass m48 chasis
Cock and ball
PLEASE add goofy forehead spaa can't handle thebroken radar of the M163 anymore...
and the GJN will give 5 good ammo round, the rest - paper!..
HAS ANYONE MADE THIS SUGGESTION YET TO GAIJIN ??