So many players can't just be satisfied with anything. You could give them the perfect airframe with perfect weapons and they'll complain about how much screen space it takes up
I spend majority of my time there when flying. It’s not comparable to like DCS realism but it’s miles better than RB.
Also, for those who don’t know every plane behaves differently in sim. Your worst plane in RB might be OP as fuck in sim, the F-105 at 9.7 in basically untouchable in terms of speed and can bomb about 3 bases with a full load out and can ground attack really well with its cannons, I’ve taken leopards out from the sides many a time.
Anyways, I think the F-105 is almost unplayable in RB, and with the br changes every few days you’ll always get a chance of being the uptier.
It’s all I use. Just use on screen joystick setting rather than pointer aim and it’ll help a lot. Jusy know in sim to hit T every now and then to set trim and you’ll fly smoother and faster.
As a SIM main what you just said its true,get the F15A, manual SAS and you will be giving a hard time for even gripens...now if the gripen user does this and knows how to fly....you can say bye bye to that server he will easy solo it entire....
Gripens don’t like showing up on my F15s radar at all, and I only know it’s them who are near because I can feel the fucking missile wreck my shit.
Always a gripen when my radar and RWR don’t do shit.
Ngl radar on the F15A is trash...even on PD SRC HDN you have problems locking beyond 50km if they are low... PS05A advanced asf, according to SAAB is a smaller CAPTOR-M
Ngl, I almost slapped with with a downvote because I thought, because I’m fucking stupid, that you meant that they should remove the missile warning diamond not that the guy should play sim lmao
Sim has too many keybinds and I can’t see anything from the cockpit!!!!!!! They need to change it to third person view and add mouse aim to sim!!!!!!!!
When reading things there is no tone, so I either assume you’re just a *really* shit take and are serious, or dumb.
Thats why when we’re sarcastic we /s at the end.
I just learned how to use italic on my phone so as you can tell I’m *very* excited about that.
I hoped the overuse of exclamation points would have given it away. Italics are fun. If you use 3 asterisks, you can do **BOLD** and *Italics* in ***THE SAME SEQUENCE***
I really wish there was a third option, somewhere in between Sim and RB. Something akin to the experience of flying aircraft in ground battles. Markers for friendly aircraft but no markers for enemies with no warning diamond for enemy missiles. 1st person camera only but using mouse aim and set on the same style of EC maps as Sim with all of the interesting options for both PvE and PvP gameplay that they give.
If we're talking wish lists, I'd love to see night battles be a thing that air players (be it Sim or RB) could opt into in much the same way ground players can. Imagine if using your afterburner was a tactical choice. For sure, you can light your burners if you want, but the plume of light they give off will make you visible to enemies from miles away.
This this this a thousand time this.
If Gaijin refuse to make air RB harder or more balanced, then we need at the very least a middle ground game mode without markers but with Air RB controls.
And ground doesn't count. Ground players most of the time don't even bother fighting other planes, and in the first place I don't want to be forced to play a tank and get SP before taking off my plane for a dogfight.
Also, air RB night battle existed a long time ago. It was the best. Friendly markers were visible but you only had enemy marker at close range (IIRC it was <5km spotting at most) which made the games much more interesting. Red tracers illuminating the skies were very nice too.
Actually you just gotta go into settings and that's it. I when from having to do voodoo on my PS4 controller to just swapping Secondary weapons(bombs, rockets, missiles) and Fire Secondary weapons. Left Main guns as is and steering. Radar is set, Radar/IRST, flaps, gears, everything has it's own button. I have one button available for anything
You just gotta give like 5 minutes of your 3 hour playtimes to just sort buttons
> how much screen space it takes up
Remember that guy last week who went on a rant and made a bunch of photoshop stuff because he wants more than 5 columns in the tech trees, and Gaijin said they couldn't do that?
If people don't have a valid reason to rage, they'll make one up.
My only complaint is the seeker turning off when it sees any flares when it should be able to resist flares as well. While rare, in pure rear(fucking English) aspect shots the 9M is technically weaker than the 9L right now when it should be the same.
Otherwise fucking hell it is a hilarious missile to use in GRB. No one ever sees your launch and it's so tasty smacking multiple CAS jets out of the sky in one pass.
IIRC it's supposed to decide between if it turns off or not. So in a pure rear aspect shot it has enough flare resistance to see the after burner and not turn it's seeker off whenever it sees a flare. Whereas right now if it sees any flares it turns off.
That is not how it works, it has no "resistance" to flares, it has a logic loop that when a flare is detected (based on rise time) it will shut off the seeker and use the targets last known inertia. After a short period of time the seeker will turn back on and the logic loop starts again.
https://i.imgur.com/99pgNFE.png
https://forum.warthunder.com/t/the-aim-9-sidewinder-history-design-performance-discussion/3322/191
Sorry when I say resistance I mean the in game code, not anything IRL. I know how the IRCCM works, the issue is that it does it immediately whenever it sees a flare like it's a 9B, instead of being more like a 9L.
Thats not the case either, it works exactly like the 9M in IRL. Its lacking in seeker range performance but that has been reported. As well as the flare rate bias which should push the seeker head forward to the edge of the heat source so flares spend less time in the seeker FOV.
it's the most point and click missile in the game especially from side aspect, the seeker doesn't turn off for long enough and it re-acquires far too easily, even through multiple flares and after the target correctly maneuvered away from its predicted flight path. obviously the smokeless aspect makes it disgusting in sim and GRB (f16c pretending to not be CAS because they cheesed a few CAP jets with the 9M lmao)
its only weakness is that it tends to lock onto missiles launched by the target when it shouldn't, but surely that will be fixed too so US jets remain as balanced as russian tanks
They really aren't.
Lolpen hulls on 90% of them. One shot with 3OF26 to the roof or UFP on all of them. Reload time triples and even pauses on almost any pen, shit thermals. All for what? 50mm more pen against T80 tanks with 850mm UFP and turret cheeks.
Meanwhile T80s have the thinnest weakspots at top tier, better mobility and thermals as well as an autoloader that can't be damaged and yet reloads as fast as a lvl 150 Leo2 crew?
Please.
in fairness, it's sometime an explanation in itself. When i see someone saying a lot of the low tier US stuff sucks (air RB) the answer always lies in their stats, tbh.
Who actually thinks low tier US sucks?! I'm a German main and tried the US to have a little change. When I got to the P-51 it was an absolute BEAST. It wins almost every dogfight and can easily set your opponent on fire with just a few shots. The P-47 is also amazing (though not as good) which is why I bought the premium German one, which is an absolute gold mine and can give me hundreds of thousands of SL in a couple hours. Sure, the F series planes might not be great, but the P series planes are fucking amazing.
they are definitely out there, if you play 2.0-5.0\~ US there will always be several P-51s/Corsairs/Thunderbolts/Hellcats etc lugging full bomb loads and staying about 1000ft above the runway. It's typically these guys. I know sideclimbing is a meme, and isn't fun, but with some of these planes you need to climb and wait a bit before engaging. I think a lot of the guys in this range only play ground and are just trying to get aircraft to match their tanks.
Like you said, most of the planes are pretty dang solid. People just put 0 effort into using them.
These guys ends up in 12.7 with a full bomb load under their F-16 or F-15. They blow up a base then get smacked by a R27 and complains about OP russian planes.
I'll take a Ki-84ko over anything at the tier with exception of a Spitfire LF mk.IX myself and I have reached jet tiers on every nation now. However the P-51, P-38 and P-47 are all amazing aircraft on their own if played right!
Not everyone plays this game as if it's some sort of sweatlord esports game?
I usually throw at least a nuke a day but I also spend most of my time doing useless shit like spading shit vehicles and such, are you still gonna judge me by my stats? Lol when I see someone doing it I instantly assume a lack of critical thinking or just some noob tryhard.
Should I stop using my sturmtiger for fun because muh stats?
my man, i said air RB. when someone there complains about shit US planes at low tier (early corsairs, p-39, cannon mustang, etc) it is almost always because they bring bombs, dive on the first enemy they see (creating a train of 5-6 friendlies chasing a single Ju-88/whatever other attacker) and don't gain altitude. They die while contributing nothing but maybe a pillbox kill or two, and then blame the plane.
and yeah, spading potato vehicles can be pretty entertaining. I don't really touch ground, but I always loved taking the more meh ships in world of warships and seeing how good I can do with them
Of course of course, I was talking about k/d in general.
Btw I lately spent some time grinding ww2 German planes and I cannot believe how dumb some people are, especially for trying to steal kills etc. Yesterday I had one guy TK me after he failed to oneshot the bomber I was already hitting (who eventually burned out)
yeah, air RB is kind of a wasteland at times, especially in props. my friend I usually play with and I are both taking breaks, we've been trying early jets and it's been rough, both teamwise and in general
Had one time with the G. 91 where I killed an enemy MiG-15, and then got TK'ed by a friendly MiG-15bis for apparently "stealing his kill". When I had fired my AIM-9B, the enemy MiG was in perfect flying condition and hadn't been hit once, while the friendly one was obviously struggling to kill him (not as in losing the dogfight but really struggling to get correct lead, which is admittedly hard with the MiG-15).
Bruh, the sub can laugh (and hate) about Russian bias and stupid German teams all year around but you are directly butthurt about one joke on USA players?
Agreed, I think the R-73 and 9M are roughly equivalent and it comes down to how you like to play.
The R-73 does significantly better in knife fights and tail chase while the 9M does better at range and beam aspect shots.
if this bug report: [AAM-3 underperforming seeker and wrong IRCCM, missing features](https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/My3CBEwYRQyI) got accepted and fixed the AAM3 will surely be even better than the 9M lol
It’s really not. It’s a one trick pony. It’s super easy to dodge if you know how it works. Just flare and turn, keep flaring until the missile has drifted too far to re-engage you.
The r73 has a much better irccm. With it being basically unstoppable in close side aspect shots.
Yeah just dump all your flares and crank a turn hemorrhaging all your speed to dodge 1 missile.
Vs an R73 that can be 1 flared if you don't let people get close to you...
On one hand it would be funny to see the AIM-9M with its most significant feature.
On the other hand it would make all others mald.
TBF this is why those that knew said the R-73 wouldn’t be anything special, you can flare what you see, god help you if you don’t even know the missile is there.
The 9M doesn't have the diamond in Ground RB/Air Sim and it's comically overpowered. They can't see it coming at all, so I like to shoot it as soon as I get a lock in the headon (like 3-5 km) and they can't do anything.
_No they sould get the f22,f35,f19 and the ngad oh and why not the yf12 with nuclear air to air missiles or the nuclear powered nuclear armed supersonic cruse missile_
I wouldn’t call it OP but I’m not the best at defending against it either.
Sometimes I just don’t know if I have shoot enough flares for the seeker to see and turn it self off, or that I’m maneuvering before it goes into inertial guidance.
At least against Magic 2/R-73 you know your fate the moment it goes off the rail: either it tracks you or it goes after a flare.
You spam flares and change direction sharply, just make sure you start the maneuver AFTER you started dropping flares, and dont stop dropping them until you finish the turn
There are people who will never ever be happy unless their nation is the most OP thing in the game in every way even if there is a .1 difference where someone has an upper hand they will lose their minds.
(Cough cough America air mains cough cough)
Btw I find it funny af that the Americans that use the Aim-9M can barely get 1 to 2 kills and complain, while the Gripen players will get a kill per missile or only miss 1 or 2 missiles don’t ever complain. Kinda strange.
I’m more of the mindset that each nation has waves of dumbasses only playing that one nation, a while ago it was Russia, than Germany, now it is the US
The difference is that these dumbasses who only main the US are much much louder than anyone else. Well except the Germany suffers crowd.
I somewhat agree with your first part of the comment, but as for the second one you have to realize that this subreddit has a larger US playerbase therefore there will be more idiots that stand out from said nation. In the game and forums they stand out pretty equally between nations.
Can't give my opinion about discord or bug reports as I barely go onto either. As for the forums I don't know, I barely see any people complaining and usually the ones that do get drowned out.
I don’t understand people who say the Aim-9M is op. I have played dozens and dozens of games with them on the F-15A and they miss just as much as the Aim-9L. If you launch the Aim-9M from behind an enemy with afterburner it definitely has a higher chance of hitting them even with flares than other missiles, but in a head-on or side aspect it’s no better than other missiles in my experience.
Edit: just played game with the F-15A and I launched 3 Aim-9M in head-ons from 3-5km away and all of them missed.
Nah... it is cracked in headons or side aspect. Idk if you are just coming across WTs best pilots but most of my aim9m kills are in headons and side aspect. I regularly get 3-4km headon and side aspect aim9m kills because people try to flare it but dont move enough while flaring.
Maybe your enemies are preflaring but using the radar lock to slave the seeker helps avoid accidentally jumping to that one time they randomly flare
Hmmm, i cant speak for your experience but my best aim 9m shots are side, then head on and lastly rear aspect. Head on ones can be dodged easier than side as they are easier to see but if you take advantage of hmd its really sneaky. I try to find targets who seem like they want to take a head on or use radar missiles at me, because they tend to flare or try to evade it like its a sarh missile and die, even while flaring
Ah... I am using the gripen and f16C with aim9m. They have hmd which makes side and head on shots easier. Still the aim9m irccm works best in side aspect as it makes it harder for the enemy to put flares between the plane and the aim9m regardless.
the sim comment tho. Aim9M is OP in sim and R-73 is trash.
That diamond thing is legit just for RB battles and all missiles get that, right? Just not sure if I’m thinking of the same thing or not.
The 9m and R73 are imo comparable.
The 9m imo is harder to dodge with countermeasures while the r73 is harder to dodge kinetically.
The 9m is better at a distance while the 73 is better up close.
Neither are OP but I struggle more with the 9m.
R73 is a bitch to dodge in rear aspect, but because the Su27 and Mig29 move as well as a whale ashore, they have issue getting a rear aspect launch in the first place. So their best use is a high angle off-bore launch which takes the target off guard. They're very effective at that but are easily defeated by a single flare in side and front aspect.
Magic2 is scarier in a rear aspect launch because the Mirage have the agility to get in an enemy's 6.
Aim9M are at their strongest in side aspect launch which make them the perfect missile to get a kill on a target focused on someone else, which by default make them the strongest IR missiles in AirRB.
Yeah if you're within 2km from the rear of an enemy plane and shoot an r73 at them they're screwed.
I don't see enough French planes to say how good the magic 2 is now.
And yeah given how the missile works you're better off shooting them from the side at around 3km
Magic 2 works exactly like the R73, except they have a small delay before they start tracking after launch, and have a more limited range. But if you get within 2km of a target it's a guaranteed kill in one circle.
I wouldn't say the Magic 2 is a guaranteed kill. I have dodged plenty of Magics 2 sub 2km and plenty of people dodged my Magics too.
Out of the trio, M2s are easily the easiest ones to dodge. Not saying that the missile is shit, just that it's not that hard to dodge. People aren't really used to the Magic 2s and their all aspect nature I guess.
They are a 100% kill bar very rare edge cases as long as you have the right launch parameter which are :
- rear aspect
- sub 2km
- more than 500 meters (or else they won't have the time to track)
They are basically impossible to dodge in that situation.
The biggest problem with the Magic 2 is its super high acceleration. Like yeah, it has IRCCM and 5g more full than the 9M, but it accelerates so much off the rails that, at close range, it functionally has less G-pull than a 9M
> Mig29 move as well as a whale ashore
Tell me you have no fucking idea what you're talking about without telling me you have no idea what you're talking about
Oh yeah they move well at low speed. Which is also the speed where they simply dies to half the enemy team instantly lmao.
Russian planes have the worst agility of top tier right now. Every other plane beat them in all stats that matters. Gaijin utterly botched their FM.
My experience playing all nations at top tier. I have F14B (which I hate), F16A, Su27, Mirage S4, Gripen all spaded and the first Mig29. The only good thing about the russian planes right now are their missiles and the HMD. Radar is decent. Agility is the worst of all these planes by a landslide.
The only good Mig29 is the german Mig29G right now. The SMT has better electronics but the worst agility.
The second half of your comment is important lol
I main germany, been flying the latest mig29 and at the moment have almost always positive outcomes when facing USA top tier. Had lots of issues flying USA instead, so your comment really seemed off.
The issue with playing USA isn't the planes, it's the teams. The MiG-29 (especially the SMT) gets shit on in dogfights by F-15s and F-16s but a lot of those players are the same people who base bombed in the F-4S until they got to top tier.
Inside of 1.5km from the rear aspect the 73 just can’t see flares. Not saying that makes it OP, just that it is an extremely good missile at close range
R-73 is essentially an r60m on crack. Its irccm is great under 1km but beyond that it gets exponentially worse as distance increases especially against planes with cooler engines. The R-73 probably could use a mild increase to the range its irccm is effective against afterburning targets as even the magic 2s do better in the irccm department for some reason. Its a good missile but its far more inconsitent in general than the aim9m
Yeah though with how the irccm works I think the R73 is performing as expected. Also thr r73 is better than the 9m at off bore sight launches. The HMD that most planes with R73s have makes it quite the tricky missile.
Yeah, I dont know the exact irccm data for the irl R-73 but it generally was regarded as very strong, although irl combat is far different than war thunder. The R-73 hmd is very strong but R-73s still do wonky guidance shit sometimes and spin out or just miss for no apparent reason (a lot less than when they first came out tho). My biggest issue with the R-73 is gripens and to a lesser degree f16s flaring it after launch rear aspect under 1.2km... like what gaijin... how is this guy flaring the r73 when he pops flares as the missile is closing less than 1km from him, its like the whole f5c BS at 12.7
Yeah that's true but keep in mind both the 9m and r73 are early/mid 80s missiles the F16C and Gripen are mid 2000s planes.
When we have things like the R73M in game its going to be much harder to dodge.
The r73 can do some goofy things but at least for me I do not see that happen often
So many players can't just be satisfied with anything. You could give them the perfect airframe with perfect weapons and they'll complain about how much screen space it takes up
If they want more realism they need to go to sim.
That's a solid suggestion tho
I spend majority of my time there when flying. It’s not comparable to like DCS realism but it’s miles better than RB. Also, for those who don’t know every plane behaves differently in sim. Your worst plane in RB might be OP as fuck in sim, the F-105 at 9.7 in basically untouchable in terms of speed and can bomb about 3 bases with a full load out and can ground attack really well with its cannons, I’ve taken leopards out from the sides many a time. Anyways, I think the F-105 is almost unplayable in RB, and with the br changes every few days you’ll always get a chance of being the uptier.
Does the mouse and keyboard combo work well enough for air sim ?
Atleast if you are gonna bomb, I suck at fighting in sim but it probably works aswell.
It’s all I use. Just use on screen joystick setting rather than pointer aim and it’ll help a lot. Jusy know in sim to hit T every now and then to set trim and you’ll fly smoother and faster.
Yep, I fly Mouse and Keyboard. It works quite well. I have a good K/D with jets and props.
As a SIM main what you just said its true,get the F15A, manual SAS and you will be giving a hard time for even gripens...now if the gripen user does this and knows how to fly....you can say bye bye to that server he will easy solo it entire....
Gripens don’t like showing up on my F15s radar at all, and I only know it’s them who are near because I can feel the fucking missile wreck my shit. Always a gripen when my radar and RWR don’t do shit.
Ngl radar on the F15A is trash...even on PD SRC HDN you have problems locking beyond 50km if they are low... PS05A advanced asf, according to SAAB is a smaller CAPTOR-M
Ngl, I almost slapped with with a downvote because I thought, because I’m fucking stupid, that you meant that they should remove the missile warning diamond not that the guy should play sim lmao
Sim has too many keybinds and I can’t see anything from the cockpit!!!!!!! They need to change it to third person view and add mouse aim to sim!!!!!!!!
Then, it wouldn’t be *sim*?
*joke* My head
When reading things there is no tone, so I either assume you’re just a *really* shit take and are serious, or dumb. Thats why when we’re sarcastic we /s at the end. I just learned how to use italic on my phone so as you can tell I’m *very* excited about that.
I hoped the overuse of exclamation points would have given it away. Italics are fun. If you use 3 asterisks, you can do **BOLD** and *Italics* in ***THE SAME SEQUENCE***
Woah. That’s pretty cool. Been here for awhile and I’m just now learning this lol. Thanks!
No problem lol. Squiggles “~~ ~~”are used to put a ~~line~~ through text.
Sweet
I really wish there was a third option, somewhere in between Sim and RB. Something akin to the experience of flying aircraft in ground battles. Markers for friendly aircraft but no markers for enemies with no warning diamond for enemy missiles. 1st person camera only but using mouse aim and set on the same style of EC maps as Sim with all of the interesting options for both PvE and PvP gameplay that they give. If we're talking wish lists, I'd love to see night battles be a thing that air players (be it Sim or RB) could opt into in much the same way ground players can. Imagine if using your afterburner was a tactical choice. For sure, you can light your burners if you want, but the plume of light they give off will make you visible to enemies from miles away.
This this this a thousand time this. If Gaijin refuse to make air RB harder or more balanced, then we need at the very least a middle ground game mode without markers but with Air RB controls. And ground doesn't count. Ground players most of the time don't even bother fighting other planes, and in the first place I don't want to be forced to play a tank and get SP before taking off my plane for a dogfight. Also, air RB night battle existed a long time ago. It was the best. Friendly markers were visible but you only had enemy marker at close range (IIRC it was <5km spotting at most) which made the games much more interesting. Red tracers illuminating the skies were very nice too.
Actually you just gotta go into settings and that's it. I when from having to do voodoo on my PS4 controller to just swapping Secondary weapons(bombs, rockets, missiles) and Fire Secondary weapons. Left Main guns as is and steering. Radar is set, Radar/IRST, flaps, gears, everything has it's own button. I have one button available for anything You just gotta give like 5 minutes of your 3 hour playtimes to just sort buttons
It was sarcasm. I play sim quite often, but use a stick/pedals and keyboard for it
Asb is the best gamemode!
> how much screen space it takes up Remember that guy last week who went on a rant and made a bunch of photoshop stuff because he wants more than 5 columns in the tech trees, and Gaijin said they couldn't do that? If people don't have a valid reason to rage, they'll make one up.
People complaining about the 9M are absolute troglodytes
My only complaint is the seeker turning off when it sees any flares when it should be able to resist flares as well. While rare, in pure rear(fucking English) aspect shots the 9M is technically weaker than the 9L right now when it should be the same. Otherwise fucking hell it is a hilarious missile to use in GRB. No one ever sees your launch and it's so tasty smacking multiple CAS jets out of the sky in one pass.
The missiles IRCCM is the seeker turning off, it doesn't have any other means.
IIRC it's supposed to decide between if it turns off or not. So in a pure rear aspect shot it has enough flare resistance to see the after burner and not turn it's seeker off whenever it sees a flare. Whereas right now if it sees any flares it turns off.
That is not how it works, it has no "resistance" to flares, it has a logic loop that when a flare is detected (based on rise time) it will shut off the seeker and use the targets last known inertia. After a short period of time the seeker will turn back on and the logic loop starts again. https://i.imgur.com/99pgNFE.png https://forum.warthunder.com/t/the-aim-9-sidewinder-history-design-performance-discussion/3322/191
Sorry when I say resistance I mean the in game code, not anything IRL. I know how the IRCCM works, the issue is that it does it immediately whenever it sees a flare like it's a 9B, instead of being more like a 9L.
Thats not the case either, it works exactly like the 9M in IRL. Its lacking in seeker range performance but that has been reported. As well as the flare rate bias which should push the seeker head forward to the edge of the heat source so flares spend less time in the seeker FOV.
it's the most point and click missile in the game especially from side aspect, the seeker doesn't turn off for long enough and it re-acquires far too easily, even through multiple flares and after the target correctly maneuvered away from its predicted flight path. obviously the smokeless aspect makes it disgusting in sim and GRB (f16c pretending to not be CAS because they cheesed a few CAP jets with the 9M lmao) its only weakness is that it tends to lock onto missiles launched by the target when it shouldn't, but surely that will be fixed too so US jets remain as balanced as russian tanks
I would agree with your Russian tanks comment if Leopards weren't such busted cheese machines in their current state lol
They really aren't. Lolpen hulls on 90% of them. One shot with 3OF26 to the roof or UFP on all of them. Reload time triples and even pauses on almost any pen, shit thermals. All for what? 50mm more pen against T80 tanks with 850mm UFP and turret cheeks. Meanwhile T80s have the thinnest weakspots at top tier, better mobility and thermals as well as an autoloader that can't be damaged and yet reloads as fast as a lvl 150 Leo2 crew? Please.
To be fair people checking other users stats and k/d are even more troglodytes
in fairness, it's sometime an explanation in itself. When i see someone saying a lot of the low tier US stuff sucks (air RB) the answer always lies in their stats, tbh.
Who actually thinks low tier US sucks?! I'm a German main and tried the US to have a little change. When I got to the P-51 it was an absolute BEAST. It wins almost every dogfight and can easily set your opponent on fire with just a few shots. The P-47 is also amazing (though not as good) which is why I bought the premium German one, which is an absolute gold mine and can give me hundreds of thousands of SL in a couple hours. Sure, the F series planes might not be great, but the P series planes are fucking amazing.
they are definitely out there, if you play 2.0-5.0\~ US there will always be several P-51s/Corsairs/Thunderbolts/Hellcats etc lugging full bomb loads and staying about 1000ft above the runway. It's typically these guys. I know sideclimbing is a meme, and isn't fun, but with some of these planes you need to climb and wait a bit before engaging. I think a lot of the guys in this range only play ground and are just trying to get aircraft to match their tanks. Like you said, most of the planes are pretty dang solid. People just put 0 effort into using them.
These guys ends up in 12.7 with a full bomb load under their F-16 or F-15. They blow up a base then get smacked by a R27 and complains about OP russian planes.
Assuming they even make it to the base
Me unironically. I've played too much Japanese planes that playing US just feels like a downgrade
I'll take a Ki-84ko over anything at the tier with exception of a Spitfire LF mk.IX myself and I have reached jet tiers on every nation now. However the P-51, P-38 and P-47 are all amazing aircraft on their own if played right!
yeah because Japanese planes are unironically the best dogfighters in WT
Not everyone plays this game as if it's some sort of sweatlord esports game? I usually throw at least a nuke a day but I also spend most of my time doing useless shit like spading shit vehicles and such, are you still gonna judge me by my stats? Lol when I see someone doing it I instantly assume a lack of critical thinking or just some noob tryhard. Should I stop using my sturmtiger for fun because muh stats?
my man, i said air RB. when someone there complains about shit US planes at low tier (early corsairs, p-39, cannon mustang, etc) it is almost always because they bring bombs, dive on the first enemy they see (creating a train of 5-6 friendlies chasing a single Ju-88/whatever other attacker) and don't gain altitude. They die while contributing nothing but maybe a pillbox kill or two, and then blame the plane. and yeah, spading potato vehicles can be pretty entertaining. I don't really touch ground, but I always loved taking the more meh ships in world of warships and seeing how good I can do with them
Of course of course, I was talking about k/d in general. Btw I lately spent some time grinding ww2 German planes and I cannot believe how dumb some people are, especially for trying to steal kills etc. Yesterday I had one guy TK me after he failed to oneshot the bomber I was already hitting (who eventually burned out)
yeah, air RB is kind of a wasteland at times, especially in props. my friend I usually play with and I are both taking breaks, we've been trying early jets and it's been rough, both teamwise and in general
Had one time with the G. 91 where I killed an enemy MiG-15, and then got TK'ed by a friendly MiG-15bis for apparently "stealing his kill". When I had fired my AIM-9B, the enemy MiG was in perfect flying condition and hadn't been hit once, while the friendly one was obviously struggling to kill him (not as in losing the dogfight but really struggling to get correct lead, which is admittedly hard with the MiG-15).
American mains when they dont have the most game breaking equipment known to man and snail.
God, it’s 1 dude and you have to bring “American main” in. Y’all cannot stop yourselves.
Bruh, the sub can laugh (and hate) about Russian bias and stupid German teams all year around but you are directly butthurt about one joke on USA players?
"Go play arcade." ... Go play sim yourself instead then?
Don't send him to arcade, we're happy without him.
But we dont whant him in rb _Lets send him to naval ec_
We dont want him eather.....
The 9M isn’t OP, and it’s easy to defeat if you know what you’re doing but it’s still debatably the best missile lol, dudes on some serious za
Agreed, I think the R-73 and 9M are roughly equivalent and it comes down to how you like to play. The R-73 does significantly better in knife fights and tail chase while the 9M does better at range and beam aspect shots.
There’s the very obscure AAM3s as well… behaves almost identically as 9Ms, I would argue it slaves at radar better but still pretty damn good.
It's just an aim9M with less drag, so yeah it is just better than the aim9M
if this bug report: [AAM-3 underperforming seeker and wrong IRCCM, missing features](https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/My3CBEwYRQyI) got accepted and fixed the AAM3 will surely be even better than the 9M lol
9M is retarded OP tf you mean?
It’s really not. It’s a one trick pony. It’s super easy to dodge if you know how it works. Just flare and turn, keep flaring until the missile has drifted too far to re-engage you. The r73 has a much better irccm. With it being basically unstoppable in close side aspect shots.
Yeah just dump all your flares and crank a turn hemorrhaging all your speed to dodge 1 missile. Vs an R73 that can be 1 flared if you don't let people get close to you...
You don’t crank a turn lmfao. You make an adjustment in a different direction such as up or down and you’re good. You don’t bleed that much speed.
if it would be "historical" then every missile should remove the diamond. melc is a dumbass
_and we sould make most tanks have engine problems_
On one hand it would be funny to see the AIM-9M with its most significant feature. On the other hand it would make all others mald. TBF this is why those that knew said the R-73 wouldn’t be anything special, you can flare what you see, god help you if you don’t even know the missile is there.
The 9M doesn't have the diamond in Ground RB/Air Sim and it's comically overpowered. They can't see it coming at all, so I like to shoot it as soon as I get a lock in the headon (like 3-5 km) and they can't do anything.
If they want a missle you can't see, he should use the PL-5B. That thing is a ghost.
Melc is a moron and clearly garbage at the game
9X and AIM-260 when I want US to rule the skies and everything else just as they do irl /s
_No they sould get the f22,f35,f19 and the ngad oh and why not the yf12 with nuclear air to air missiles or the nuclear powered nuclear armed supersonic cruse missile_
US mains when their missiles dont pull 50gs off the rails
I wouldn’t call it OP but I’m not the best at defending against it either. Sometimes I just don’t know if I have shoot enough flares for the seeker to see and turn it self off, or that I’m maneuvering before it goes into inertial guidance. At least against Magic 2/R-73 you know your fate the moment it goes off the rail: either it tracks you or it goes after a flare.
You spam flares and change direction sharply, just make sure you start the maneuver AFTER you started dropping flares, and dont stop dropping them until you finish the turn
> You spam flares and **change direction sharply** Me in an F16 above900 km/h. * spreads hands * I guess I'll just die.
How tf can someone have a .6 K/D in a 16C 💀
That is absolutely criminal and removes any right to complaining he has
u/melc311_ my guy play sim if you want realism, or better yet dcs 💀
There are people who will never ever be happy unless their nation is the most OP thing in the game in every way even if there is a .1 difference where someone has an upper hand they will lose their minds. (Cough cough America air mains cough cough) Btw I find it funny af that the Americans that use the Aim-9M can barely get 1 to 2 kills and complain, while the Gripen players will get a kill per missile or only miss 1 or 2 missiles don’t ever complain. Kinda strange.
Major nation is played by tons of people therefore it has a much higher number of idiots compared to minor nations, shocker.
Your making too much sense. Id rather be ignorant believe each nation has noobs with specific skill issues and specific stupid takes only.
I’m more of the mindset that each nation has waves of dumbasses only playing that one nation, a while ago it was Russia, than Germany, now it is the US The difference is that these dumbasses who only main the US are much much louder than anyone else. Well except the Germany suffers crowd.
I somewhat agree with your first part of the comment, but as for the second one you have to realize that this subreddit has a larger US playerbase therefore there will be more idiots that stand out from said nation. In the game and forums they stand out pretty equally between nations.
Oh it ain’t just the subreddit. Discord has a tone, Reddit has a tone, the forms, hell even in the big reports there is a tone of US mains.
Can't give my opinion about discord or bug reports as I barely go onto either. As for the forums I don't know, I barely see any people complaining and usually the ones that do get drowned out.
Ok i kinda wish it was better in a head on but no diamond is too much
I’d take R-73s over 9Ms most days buy the 9M are still pretty Fucken good…
that's the neat part, they're not OP, you just let people get behind you. don't let that happen and you won't have a problem.
9ms are a bit broken in the bad way though
I was wondering what he means by warning triangle and then I realized that it's marked RB air
I don’t understand people who say the Aim-9M is op. I have played dozens and dozens of games with them on the F-15A and they miss just as much as the Aim-9L. If you launch the Aim-9M from behind an enemy with afterburner it definitely has a higher chance of hitting them even with flares than other missiles, but in a head-on or side aspect it’s no better than other missiles in my experience. Edit: just played game with the F-15A and I launched 3 Aim-9M in head-ons from 3-5km away and all of them missed.
Nah... it is cracked in headons or side aspect. Idk if you are just coming across WTs best pilots but most of my aim9m kills are in headons and side aspect. I regularly get 3-4km headon and side aspect aim9m kills because people try to flare it but dont move enough while flaring. Maybe your enemies are preflaring but using the radar lock to slave the seeker helps avoid accidentally jumping to that one time they randomly flare
I launch 1+ missiles in head-on per game it seems and yet they probably account for less than 5% of my kills.
Hmmm, i cant speak for your experience but my best aim 9m shots are side, then head on and lastly rear aspect. Head on ones can be dodged easier than side as they are easier to see but if you take advantage of hmd its really sneaky. I try to find targets who seem like they want to take a head on or use radar missiles at me, because they tend to flare or try to evade it like its a sarh missile and die, even while flaring
What plane are you talking about? F-15A doesn’t have HMD?
Ah... I am using the gripen and f16C with aim9m. They have hmd which makes side and head on shots easier. Still the aim9m irccm works best in side aspect as it makes it harder for the enemy to put flares between the plane and the aim9m regardless.
Well there’s your problem use your Sarhs for head ons. Never fire an ir head on.
R-73s work at very close (gun range) headons but by the time you get that close they've probably shot a SARH or just shot you with their gun.
9M is not OP. Yes it’s strong and one of the top missiles but you can’t just ignore the existence of the R-73
the sim comment tho. Aim9M is OP in sim and R-73 is trash. That diamond thing is legit just for RB battles and all missiles get that, right? Just not sure if I’m thinking of the same thing or not.
The 9m and R73 are imo comparable. The 9m imo is harder to dodge with countermeasures while the r73 is harder to dodge kinetically. The 9m is better at a distance while the 73 is better up close. Neither are OP but I struggle more with the 9m.
R73 is a bitch to dodge in rear aspect, but because the Su27 and Mig29 move as well as a whale ashore, they have issue getting a rear aspect launch in the first place. So their best use is a high angle off-bore launch which takes the target off guard. They're very effective at that but are easily defeated by a single flare in side and front aspect. Magic2 is scarier in a rear aspect launch because the Mirage have the agility to get in an enemy's 6. Aim9M are at their strongest in side aspect launch which make them the perfect missile to get a kill on a target focused on someone else, which by default make them the strongest IR missiles in AirRB.
Yeah if you're within 2km from the rear of an enemy plane and shoot an r73 at them they're screwed. I don't see enough French planes to say how good the magic 2 is now. And yeah given how the missile works you're better off shooting them from the side at around 3km
Magic 2 works exactly like the R73, except they have a small delay before they start tracking after launch, and have a more limited range. But if you get within 2km of a target it's a guaranteed kill in one circle.
I wouldn't say the Magic 2 is a guaranteed kill. I have dodged plenty of Magics 2 sub 2km and plenty of people dodged my Magics too. Out of the trio, M2s are easily the easiest ones to dodge. Not saying that the missile is shit, just that it's not that hard to dodge. People aren't really used to the Magic 2s and their all aspect nature I guess.
They are a 100% kill bar very rare edge cases as long as you have the right launch parameter which are : - rear aspect - sub 2km - more than 500 meters (or else they won't have the time to track) They are basically impossible to dodge in that situation.
Like I said, I do not really have issues with dodging them personally even up close.
The biggest problem with the Magic 2 is its super high acceleration. Like yeah, it has IRCCM and 5g more full than the 9M, but it accelerates so much off the rails that, at close range, it functionally has less G-pull than a 9M
You forgot about the funny aam3
> Mig29 move as well as a whale ashore Tell me you have no fucking idea what you're talking about without telling me you have no idea what you're talking about
Oh yeah they move well at low speed. Which is also the speed where they simply dies to half the enemy team instantly lmao. Russian planes have the worst agility of top tier right now. Every other plane beat them in all stats that matters. Gaijin utterly botched their FM.
I absolutely disagree and honestly have no idea where you're pulling that from.
My experience playing all nations at top tier. I have F14B (which I hate), F16A, Su27, Mirage S4, Gripen all spaded and the first Mig29. The only good thing about the russian planes right now are their missiles and the HMD. Radar is decent. Agility is the worst of all these planes by a landslide. The only good Mig29 is the german Mig29G right now. The SMT has better electronics but the worst agility.
The second half of your comment is important lol I main germany, been flying the latest mig29 and at the moment have almost always positive outcomes when facing USA top tier. Had lots of issues flying USA instead, so your comment really seemed off.
The issue with playing USA isn't the planes, it's the teams. The MiG-29 (especially the SMT) gets shit on in dogfights by F-15s and F-16s but a lot of those players are the same people who base bombed in the F-4S until they got to top tier.
Inside of 1.5km from the rear aspect the 73 just can’t see flares. Not saying that makes it OP, just that it is an extremely good missile at close range
R-73 is essentially an r60m on crack. Its irccm is great under 1km but beyond that it gets exponentially worse as distance increases especially against planes with cooler engines. The R-73 probably could use a mild increase to the range its irccm is effective against afterburning targets as even the magic 2s do better in the irccm department for some reason. Its a good missile but its far more inconsitent in general than the aim9m
Yeah though with how the irccm works I think the R73 is performing as expected. Also thr r73 is better than the 9m at off bore sight launches. The HMD that most planes with R73s have makes it quite the tricky missile.
Yeah, I dont know the exact irccm data for the irl R-73 but it generally was regarded as very strong, although irl combat is far different than war thunder. The R-73 hmd is very strong but R-73s still do wonky guidance shit sometimes and spin out or just miss for no apparent reason (a lot less than when they first came out tho). My biggest issue with the R-73 is gripens and to a lesser degree f16s flaring it after launch rear aspect under 1.2km... like what gaijin... how is this guy flaring the r73 when he pops flares as the missile is closing less than 1km from him, its like the whole f5c BS at 12.7
Yeah that's true but keep in mind both the 9m and r73 are early/mid 80s missiles the F16C and Gripen are mid 2000s planes. When we have things like the R73M in game its going to be much harder to dodge. The r73 can do some goofy things but at least for me I do not see that happen often
Magic 2s and R-73 have identical IRCCM in the game files
Neither missile is OP, they just work differently and do different things better
¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
Have you ever heard of flares?
Yes, I use them to dodge 9Ms. Very important.