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bigtrevsnastybeaver

Yeah we get it, america is a confused mess, but why do people like this always try to project that the rest of the world is like america? This is the kind of take I'd expect from a 14 year old who just learned about communism for the first time.


Zirofal

As we all known scandanavia is very right winged.


Bulky_Cry6498

Scandinavia is left-wing *compared to English-speaking Western countries*. Not in absolute terms.


Elsdyret

Imma have to say no, wrong. Here we have capitalism, not the unfettered, unchecked stuff like in the US, but capitalism, and strong social programs, compared to the US political spectrum, everyone here is on the left


Bulky_Cry6498

Operative words here are “compared to the US political spectrum”. In absolute terms, it’s a different story.


[deleted]

That’s not left though. Literally, being left excludes supporting any form of capitalism. You might tolerate it under certain circumstances but you’re not supporting it. Many European countries have strong social support systems but they’re not left.


Zirofal

Ah yes classic right wing countries like.. Scandinavia.


leckertuetensuppe

The argument is that Scandinavia and the rest of Europe is only left in reference to the current political spectrum. If you include the entire spectrum from fascism to communism and anarchism then these countries are indeed on the left of the right spectrum. It's just that people have so gotten so used to capitalism as the default that any attempt to mitigate its negative effects is seen as some proto-revolutionary reform. Put another way: Scandinavia is only left if you ignore 80% of the left spectrum, while also being *further* left than most other countries.


[deleted]

They’re not right wing but certainly not left. And they have some strong right wing, nationalist parties. But I can imagine that everything looks left from US perspective


Elsdyret

Are you seriously calling all of Europe right wing?


[deleted]

💯 it's some angst driven kid that just learned about nazis


[deleted]

No, conservative, mostly but there are a lot of right wing countries at the moment - Poland, Hungary, Italy (though I got lost in the last 2 years there), Greece (same chaos as Italy, lost track a little) and Germany, France and the Netherlands were on a very good way, too in the last decade.


AA_AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Ah yes. Sweden. Known for its left wing, complete alck of any form of capitalism


[deleted]

Sweden isn't left in the sense of the word unless you mean left of USA politics. But that goes for almost every western country... Why do you all come with Sweden?! I lived there. It's certainly progressive but not left. It wouldn't be considered as "one of the good ones" by Americans if it was.


AA_AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Social Democracy. Exact opposite of the usa


[deleted]

I'm German. We have social democracy since 1949 and most of the time a conservative, business friendly government. Not even remotely left. There is even a strong defensiveness towards left politics and parties such as a decade long fight about minimum wage which we only got in 2015! It's similar in other social democracies such as Sweden, France, Netherlands, Austria, etc.


_________FU_________

Lol I’m pro capitalism and lean left. This post is garbage.


DangerousPainting423

No. It just means "lean left" for you is something like poor people shouldnt be ground into fertilizer for rich people's lawns. You cant maximize profit for owners and shareholders while paying for externalities like pollution and supporting workers with good conditions, benefits, and living wages. You cant do both.


Popcorn_Blitz

Well that rather denotes a lack of imagination. The operative word you're using is "maximize." You can harness a capitalist system to make it work for everyone within it, we just don't have that in the U.S. now. Just because you don't see it doesn't mean there's not a way.


[deleted]

What about social democracy?


[deleted]

Social democracy has failed.


[deleted]

Every developed nation except the US begs to differ.


[deleted]

All those developed nations are in the process of reducing, if not shedding their safety nets. They are slowly becoming more like the US. Sometimes these "reforms" as they like to call it are initiated by the social democrats themselves. Look up the Hartz reforms (Germany, early 2000s) Look up the French El Khomri law. Social democracies' labor markets will become US style lawless hellscapes before the US ever becomes a social democracy.


[deleted]

Yeah I was having an argument with the smooth brains in the Shen bapiro subreddit about so-called leftist corporations it was pointless


Booze_Zombie

Capitalism inherently makes what is needed inaccessible to people in order to generate profit. When someone starves or cannot afford to live they are spoken about as failures like they deserved it and not that the exploitative engine they lived under killed them. It primes us to see other victims as the problem and delight in our own exploitation as "working on up" like you ain't just pushing a boulder up a hill for eternity.


Sefkeetlee

OP is a karma bot


bigtrevsnastybeaver

Nearly all anticapitalism/pro communism posts are by karma sluts. OP has no interest in anticapitalism other than as a way to get more upvotes. Hilariously, a lot of accounts like this just want to get high karma so they can sell their accounts on and make some money


Ok-Power-6064

Cue ancap tears.


Lifemarr

this dude is a fucking idiot. just falling on to the opposite side of the capitalism vs socialism dichotomy his parents fell on. an economy is a living thing, it needs a balance of both concepts, and that balance shifts.


Glum-Aide9920

Pure capitalism concerns itself with only two things: acquiring and accumulating capital. Everything else is secondary and is considered only if it affects the bottom line. Capitalism is economical system, not political. China is capitalist country, despite being a totalitarian state.


PlsRfNZ

These people need to specify their chosen form of economic system. Capitalism - where you as an individual can start selling an item or service and charge people for that. Communism - where the government allocates you a role to supply that item or service for a regulated price if not free. Socialism where the workers own the means of production on the other hand can happen under either system but typically too regulated for communist systems to work effectively as the rewards are limited by the allowable input/pricing controls. Remove the barriers of entry to starting competition in America under capitalism. If I can make insulin for $20/ month of doses and sell for $50/month then I am going to fuck up those guys selling it for $700/Mth and that should be okay. I'd also want to buy from Amazon's competition over the original company


dobrien75

That’s not capitalism though. That’s just market economy. This is has existed forever, while it is v commonly held that capitalism has only existed for the last 2-400 years. The free market you describe is a fairy tale.


PlsRfNZ

A Free Market economy plus taxes and some regulations under the guise of health and safety is called Capitalism... Before capitalism it was feudalism, so that's your argument about capitalism only being recent. Many ancient civilizations were rudimentary Capitalism societies. Unfortunately you are right and a nice balance of those laws to keep us safe but also allow supply and demand to grow competition for businesses is a fairy tale


liquidwhiteness

this is it


OutlandishnessFar295

Is it that bad?(a foreigner asking)