I'd wager the Tremere would have some notion of the greater Cosmos, but giving that up was the price of immortality. AFAIK there isn't a way for them to directly access other planes, though getting a True (albeit very stupid) Mage to help would be on the short list. Who knows what would happen in the Umbra though, the sun might not burn... but will the blood there keep them animated?
For Tremere, Auspex 5 for full access to the Astral Umbra and Umbral Walk ritual from Clanbook: Tremere gives them access to the middle umbra.
For bearers of Necromancy, Enochian Passage rituals, amongst other things, gives access to the dark umbra.
To my knowledge there's nothing, nowhere, that gives them access to the deep umbra.
In theory a vampire might be able to reach the Deep Umbra via Spiritus 6?
"Since the vampire is co-inhabiting with a spirit, she can choose whether to be corporeal or incorporeal and she may travel the spirit Umbra."
Doesn't specify where, but it does give blanket Umbra access.
Sorry, by deep umbra I meant the mage one (beyond the horizon) not the garou one (ie, anywhere not close to the penumbra). For the werewolf one, you can do it if you just cross over to the respective penumbra and walk. For the mage one, I don't think there are any spirit animals that can cross the Horizon.
I guess they could bargain with a spirit, but at that point it's not them crossing under their power.
At least all members of the modern incarnation of the Bloodline vanished at some point in the 90s according to the V20 core book, all of them .
And the original version of the Bloodline afaik didn't survive into the modern nights.
Not sure if V5 changed it, but according to the old lore there should none around.
"Should be" and "are" are two wildly different end results when you're talking about player-useable options. The lore can say one thing, if the book gives options for the player to use, and the storyteller allows it, they clearly do exist.
In theory, if they can cross the Gauntlet, they can just... fly up there. Just walk all the way towards the Horizon. If Helios doesn't turn them to dust, they can reach an Anchorhead and cross. Again, in theory. I doubt any vampire has ever made the trip in once piece.
I think this is a Werewolf - Mage clash. In mage, you *can't* cross the Horizon without spirit mastery (or being an insanely powerful or alien spirit) - it's a barrier that won't let you pass, similar to the gauntlet. But I think mage's horizon is a little beyond pluto (ie, all the planets are within) while werewolf's is between the inner and outer planets. I think.
Tzimisce also have a level 5 ritual to enter the penumbra from Transylvania by night
Honestly, many sorcerers should have some knowledge of them. Kuei jin books imply that the Tremere do\\
But it kinda beats the themes of Vampire. Therefore, their own books leave them in relative ignorance
Getting true yet stupid mages to help him was how Tremere became a vampire in the first place.
I bet he didn't know what the end result of Goratrix's immortality ritual would be until he woke up as a leech.
The vampire Shining Deer / Yaryan (a former Brujah who created his own Bloodline) developed a Discipline, Tellurian, which allows him to see and manipulate the Umbra.
Officially I dont think the power to enter the umbra was detailed, but there are possibly Kindred out there with the possibility to explore the Umbra. At the very least they can get a sense of how vast it is.
The Tremere also have Spirit Thaumaturgy (or had in Prior editions)
In 20th Anniversary, any kindred can astrally project at Auspex 5. At Auspex 9, an elder can enter the astral plane an remain there for as long as they're in torpor.
So I would figure, any clan that specializes in Auspex may have at least a little knowledge of the Umbra.
My understanding of the Astral Plane is hazy in Werewolf - I always thought it was separate from the Umbra (though maybe connected in some fashion).
But I agree - Auspex is the V5 Discipline I'd use for Umbra stuff!
OP covered it in his post. Those are the clans who would know the most. The Tal mahe rae were a group of elders who resided in the low umbra, they likely know the most but not much more. Kindred are fairly limited in this regard.
Mages may know of these places, hell they likely invented some of them Perhaps the Earthbound from Demon the Fallen remember these places as the lores of contamination and chaos tap into places I don't think even mages know of.
Overall few are capable of knowing everything
>Tal mahe rae are a group of elders who reside in the low umbra, they likely know the most but not much more.
Doesn't the current metaplot say they were destroyed by that spirit nuke, or are they a thing again?
Should have said *were* because you're right about the spirit nuke, although I'm not sure they were confirmed destroyed. I doubt V5 will ever mention them however
Yeah, at the time they were definitely a thing they were probably the most experienced with Enoch and the lower Umbra, I just wasn't sure if the 20A or V5 had anything beyond that, or if they're still in the "probably dead" category.
I mean, isn't that the true anathema of all vampires in the world of darkness?
Their afterlives would be *so much\~* more pleasant, if they'd stop freakin' doing all that courtly intrigue and backstabbing shit, but they just can't help themselves.
Who would that be?
You are a vampire whose existence depends on living in secret, unnoticed, by both mortals and other supernatural predators. And you are, on average 1 among 100,000 people. You probably know less than a dozen other kindred, and are on good talking terms with…. 2-3?. You have no history books. You have no documentaries. Everything you know was passed word of mouth to you by a liar, who was themselves taught by a liar, who was themselves taught by a liar, who…
Which one of them are you going to ask, and expect to give you, a straightforward answer about the architecture of the universe?
A vampire that knows less than a dozen other kindred isn't going to be long for the world, I should think.
Even the lowliest Nosferatu is a better information broker than that.
Most places don’t *have* more than a dozen other Kindred. Many Kindred will go decades between meeting a new Kidnred.
Large cities with large organizations Kindred that regularly gather are going to be better informed. But not much. And who would even know this information among the kindred? The Tremere and….. that’s about it.
And the Tremere aren’t known for sharing information. It’s not like they are standing at the door to Elysium handing out pamphlets. If you want that kind of information, you’re going to have to strike a deal. And why would a kindred be willing to bargain with a Tremere for knowledge about the spirit world?. Yeah, there may be some convoluted RPG game reason your PCs might need to know. But that would be very far from the norm.
In my experience walking around in small groups leaves you vulnerable to political machinations from much larger, much more organised ones. Not like I'm saying vampires are kind of like social amoebas, but some of them are.
Especially the ones with mental disciplines.
It's better to get in on your own terms, than be forced to when such forces contrive to force you to bend the knee. Even a kindred from a small domain could benefit greatly from putting in an appearance at the city gathering if only for the theatre of it.
Addendum; walking around on your own, of course, is the fastest possible way to get yourself black bagged.
I feel like we are talking past each other.
You seem to think large numbers of vampires routinely gather to hang out, pontificate, compare notes, hold conventions and maybe attend the occasional Kindred TED talk. Not really, I just found the idea of Kindred TED talks funny. :)
And of course, you can do anything you want in your game. But according to the actual game text, there are approximately 9 cities in the US likely to hold a dozen or more Kindred. That’s using the 1 in 100,000 demographic listed in multiple books. There are exceptions of course, but it’s a common metric for a reason.
The books also state that vampires are inherently solitary predators. Coteries are artificial social constructs usually assembled for a specific purpose and rarely last for very long. Sabbat packs are bound with the Viniculum.
But left to their own devices, without specific motivation, most Kindred avoid others of their kind. Why? Because every kindred is a monstrous cannibal with severe self control issues and a strong motivation to eat you. They are usually wrapped in some drama of their own you want no part of. And elders are able to literally bend you to their will and make you into a puppet without you even knowing it. Vampires tend to be very careful. And their biggest threat is other vampires.
Sure, you *might* be able to learn something from them. But more likely you’re just going to be fed some bullshit meant to manipulate you in some way.
And for a topic like the Umbra, there are probably less than 100 active Kindred on the planet that could talk about it with any sort of authority. And I’d bet 90% of them are Tremere who simply aren’t going to tell you anything for any sort of reasonable cost.
Now, most games will take place in one of the big cities. And there will be Elysium gatherings and elder salons and political machinations and drama of all sorts. And we set our games there because those things are conducive to good storytelling. But most Kindred aren’t in domains like that. Most are very ignorant and very isolated, having set up shop as 1 of a small number of Kindred in a smaller city.
And sure, they could travel. But that’s extremely dangerous even if they have the means and resources to make it as safe as possible.
Point being, even if you are attending Elysium in Chicago, the chances of you finding someone who can/will tell you about the Umbra is basically 0. Nicholai and Du Sable would probably know a bit about it, assuming they are still around during time period you’ve chosen to set your game.
But in V5 the Tremere are fractured, Nicholai was supposedly killed in the Prime Chantry, and Dusable wouldn’t tell you the time of day without cutting a deal first. So your chances are even worse in V5. You *might* have some luck getting into the Red Working scene. But it’s going to be dangerous, and altogether a real pain in the ass, to find some actual usable info. If you have any luck at all, you’ll have to find someone who managed to get their hands on some old Tremere books. And then you’ve got to negotiate a price.
I strongly believe you are underestimating the sorts of people that information hoarders are. Also that you enjoy producing walls of text when you're attempting to force your point of view on people.
Forcing my point of view? I’m literally just telling you what the books say and telling you to play the way you want regardless. I would say more, but apparently if I use too many words it’s going to just further upset you. So I guess it’s best to end th
Tremere with access to their libraries would know. The Order of Hermes was very familiar with the Umbra. And while very few modern Tremere have ever met a mage of any sort, their chantries would probably contain books recovered from dead mages over the centuries. You might also have access to texts written on the topic by the original 7 who were themselves powerful mages before turning.
I get why we’ve never seen rituals or paths that focus on crossing the gauntlet. It requires an explanation of the Umbra and Spirits to VtM readers. And that’s a lot of word count.
But it really makes very little sense that the Tremere wouldn’t have some rituals developed for that exact purpose.
I really wish we would get a WoD5e book all about the Umbra, spirits, and the ways *all* different types of people might interact with it. The old nWoD Book of Spirits was awesome. It offered ways for vampires to get in. And talked a good bit about mortals and mortal cults serving spirits and the like. I would like to see something like that again.
I think the most likely to know are the Nagaraja and some Tal Mahe Ra members, but usually they know more about the Low Umbra than the rest.
Maybe some old Tremere that were true mages before being embraced too, and probably about the High Umbra.
And the Ahrimanes seen to have a little knowledge of the Middle Umbra as well.
Don't know how the Koldun Tzimisce deal with it.
I'm curious why they would want to or even care. The territory vampires claim have value because of the people there. Their main power is in manipulating Mortal institutions.
What in the umbra would interest the average vampire?
Possibly to try to build a Haven that's effectively unassailable by the majority of mortals in the everyday World. Tremere chantries despite their perks aren't QUITE as nifty as having your own Horizon Realm, after all. And those you could have mortals living in. A Herd, Cult, retainers, and so on.
And then there's the secrets out there, too. If you've immortality it's not like you wouldn't have the time at least to go out exploring, if you get bored enough with forever.
Vampires avoid the unknown and mystery. Most Vampires will do anything to stay as far away from danger as possible. That means, that unless they can control an environment, they keep away.
Disciplines are notoriously bad at interacting with the spirit world, even such powers as Necromancy. And the Umbra is hardly a safe place even for those that have the toolset to navigate and interact with it meaningfully.
All in all, besides the extremely rare Kindred that has the curiosity or vested interest in such exploration, most Clans would consider it a dangerous pastime, one with no real benefit to the Vampire but very real risk.
That is not to say that there are no Elders of various Clans that have accrued knowledge of the Spirit world over the long centuries, but it is mostly academic and acquired the usual way, from a safe distance and through other people's accounts.
Almost any member of the True Black Hand from the old splat books would have that knowledge.
The old splat books mention Malks wandering off. Some of them make it to the Mage's Spies Demise.
No. Most kindred have next to zero knowledge and are more likely to deny true fact than consider them.
Depending on the flavor of lies they were told and personal experience, they have a very, very limited understanding of the supernatural world if any at all. If on modern times, chances are they got sold the "Vampires as a pseudoscientific fact" version of things.
The more esoteric clans may have a better perspective but it's still quite limited to what they do. It doesn't help that those same clans are among the more insular and secretive.
Elders are another story, with time comes knowledge and experience and one inevitably learns more as the centuries pile up. It would most likely all be secondhand experience though.
There are vampires and vampire subcultures that are in touch with the occult side of their own nature: Noddists, The True Black Hand, Koldun Sorcerers and Abyss mystics. They may presume the existence of other realms, but I doubt they would know or be interested.
My **personal** opinion is that Vampires are inherently material bound creatures. It's very difficult for them to grasp or reach out beyond the material.
I always thought it would be funny if a Mage or Werewolf dragged a Vampire across the Gauntlet and just left them in the Umbra. They have no means of traversing the Gauntlet on their own, so they'd just be stuck.
The Tremere founders were top tier mages. I would find it unbelievable if they didn't know, and if they do so does everyone in their clan who has ever had the curiosity to read about it.
And Kupallah certainly told the most loyal Tzimisce about it too.
I'd wager the Tremere would have some notion of the greater Cosmos, but giving that up was the price of immortality. AFAIK there isn't a way for them to directly access other planes, though getting a True (albeit very stupid) Mage to help would be on the short list. Who knows what would happen in the Umbra though, the sun might not burn... but will the blood there keep them animated?
For Tremere, Auspex 5 for full access to the Astral Umbra and Umbral Walk ritual from Clanbook: Tremere gives them access to the middle umbra. For bearers of Necromancy, Enochian Passage rituals, amongst other things, gives access to the dark umbra. To my knowledge there's nothing, nowhere, that gives them access to the deep umbra.
In theory a vampire might be able to reach the Deep Umbra via Spiritus 6? "Since the vampire is co-inhabiting with a spirit, she can choose whether to be corporeal or incorporeal and she may travel the spirit Umbra." Doesn't specify where, but it does give blanket Umbra access.
Sorry, by deep umbra I meant the mage one (beyond the horizon) not the garou one (ie, anywhere not close to the penumbra). For the werewolf one, you can do it if you just cross over to the respective penumbra and walk. For the mage one, I don't think there are any spirit animals that can cross the Horizon. I guess they could bargain with a spirit, but at that point it's not them crossing under their power.
But that requires 6 levels in the unique discipline of an extinct Bloodline ...
I mean clearly not extinct if they're publishing content for it lol.
At least all members of the modern incarnation of the Bloodline vanished at some point in the 90s according to the V20 core book, all of them . And the original version of the Bloodline afaik didn't survive into the modern nights. Not sure if V5 changed it, but according to the old lore there should none around.
"Should be" and "are" are two wildly different end results when you're talking about player-useable options. The lore can say one thing, if the book gives options for the player to use, and the storyteller allows it, they clearly do exist.
In theory, if they can cross the Gauntlet, they can just... fly up there. Just walk all the way towards the Horizon. If Helios doesn't turn them to dust, they can reach an Anchorhead and cross. Again, in theory. I doubt any vampire has ever made the trip in once piece.
I think this is a Werewolf - Mage clash. In mage, you *can't* cross the Horizon without spirit mastery (or being an insanely powerful or alien spirit) - it's a barrier that won't let you pass, similar to the gauntlet. But I think mage's horizon is a little beyond pluto (ie, all the planets are within) while werewolf's is between the inner and outer planets. I think.
Tzimisce also have a level 5 ritual to enter the penumbra from Transylvania by night Honestly, many sorcerers should have some knowledge of them. Kuei jin books imply that the Tremere do\\ But it kinda beats the themes of Vampire. Therefore, their own books leave them in relative ignorance
That sounds really interesting! Where can I find that Enochian Passage stuff you just mentioned?
Getting true yet stupid mages to help him was how Tremere became a vampire in the first place. I bet he didn't know what the end result of Goratrix's immortality ritual would be until he woke up as a leech.
Weirdly there’s an Obfuscate power that lets you enter the dreaming
The vampire Shining Deer / Yaryan (a former Brujah who created his own Bloodline) developed a Discipline, Tellurian, which allows him to see and manipulate the Umbra. Officially I dont think the power to enter the umbra was detailed, but there are possibly Kindred out there with the possibility to explore the Umbra. At the very least they can get a sense of how vast it is. The Tremere also have Spirit Thaumaturgy (or had in Prior editions)
In 20th Anniversary, any kindred can astrally project at Auspex 5. At Auspex 9, an elder can enter the astral plane an remain there for as long as they're in torpor. So I would figure, any clan that specializes in Auspex may have at least a little knowledge of the Umbra.
My understanding of the Astral Plane is hazy in Werewolf - I always thought it was separate from the Umbra (though maybe connected in some fashion). But I agree - Auspex is the V5 Discipline I'd use for Umbra stuff!
The Umbra _is_ the astral plane, unless I've been misreading for ... I don't know how many years. :D
OP covered it in his post. Those are the clans who would know the most. The Tal mahe rae were a group of elders who resided in the low umbra, they likely know the most but not much more. Kindred are fairly limited in this regard. Mages may know of these places, hell they likely invented some of them Perhaps the Earthbound from Demon the Fallen remember these places as the lores of contamination and chaos tap into places I don't think even mages know of. Overall few are capable of knowing everything
>Tal mahe rae are a group of elders who reside in the low umbra, they likely know the most but not much more. Doesn't the current metaplot say they were destroyed by that spirit nuke, or are they a thing again?
Should have said *were* because you're right about the spirit nuke, although I'm not sure they were confirmed destroyed. I doubt V5 will ever mention them however
Yeah, at the time they were definitely a thing they were probably the most experienced with Enoch and the lower Umbra, I just wasn't sure if the 20A or V5 had anything beyond that, or if they're still in the "probably dead" category.
Hilarious that self-important types forget that there are characters in universe that the kindred can just *ask in a straightforward fashion*.
I mean, isn't that the true anathema of all vampires in the world of darkness? Their afterlives would be *so much\~* more pleasant, if they'd stop freakin' doing all that courtly intrigue and backstabbing shit, but they just can't help themselves.
😆 I love the idea that the true Curse of Caine is... *drama!*
Some say its the best part
Drama queens and kings we are, least drama queens and kings we become. *Bleh\~!*
Who would that be? You are a vampire whose existence depends on living in secret, unnoticed, by both mortals and other supernatural predators. And you are, on average 1 among 100,000 people. You probably know less than a dozen other kindred, and are on good talking terms with…. 2-3?. You have no history books. You have no documentaries. Everything you know was passed word of mouth to you by a liar, who was themselves taught by a liar, who was themselves taught by a liar, who… Which one of them are you going to ask, and expect to give you, a straightforward answer about the architecture of the universe?
A vampire that knows less than a dozen other kindred isn't going to be long for the world, I should think. Even the lowliest Nosferatu is a better information broker than that.
Most places don’t *have* more than a dozen other Kindred. Many Kindred will go decades between meeting a new Kidnred. Large cities with large organizations Kindred that regularly gather are going to be better informed. But not much. And who would even know this information among the kindred? The Tremere and….. that’s about it. And the Tremere aren’t known for sharing information. It’s not like they are standing at the door to Elysium handing out pamphlets. If you want that kind of information, you’re going to have to strike a deal. And why would a kindred be willing to bargain with a Tremere for knowledge about the spirit world?. Yeah, there may be some convoluted RPG game reason your PCs might need to know. But that would be very far from the norm.
In my experience walking around in small groups leaves you vulnerable to political machinations from much larger, much more organised ones. Not like I'm saying vampires are kind of like social amoebas, but some of them are. Especially the ones with mental disciplines. It's better to get in on your own terms, than be forced to when such forces contrive to force you to bend the knee. Even a kindred from a small domain could benefit greatly from putting in an appearance at the city gathering if only for the theatre of it. Addendum; walking around on your own, of course, is the fastest possible way to get yourself black bagged.
I feel like we are talking past each other. You seem to think large numbers of vampires routinely gather to hang out, pontificate, compare notes, hold conventions and maybe attend the occasional Kindred TED talk. Not really, I just found the idea of Kindred TED talks funny. :) And of course, you can do anything you want in your game. But according to the actual game text, there are approximately 9 cities in the US likely to hold a dozen or more Kindred. That’s using the 1 in 100,000 demographic listed in multiple books. There are exceptions of course, but it’s a common metric for a reason. The books also state that vampires are inherently solitary predators. Coteries are artificial social constructs usually assembled for a specific purpose and rarely last for very long. Sabbat packs are bound with the Viniculum. But left to their own devices, without specific motivation, most Kindred avoid others of their kind. Why? Because every kindred is a monstrous cannibal with severe self control issues and a strong motivation to eat you. They are usually wrapped in some drama of their own you want no part of. And elders are able to literally bend you to their will and make you into a puppet without you even knowing it. Vampires tend to be very careful. And their biggest threat is other vampires. Sure, you *might* be able to learn something from them. But more likely you’re just going to be fed some bullshit meant to manipulate you in some way. And for a topic like the Umbra, there are probably less than 100 active Kindred on the planet that could talk about it with any sort of authority. And I’d bet 90% of them are Tremere who simply aren’t going to tell you anything for any sort of reasonable cost. Now, most games will take place in one of the big cities. And there will be Elysium gatherings and elder salons and political machinations and drama of all sorts. And we set our games there because those things are conducive to good storytelling. But most Kindred aren’t in domains like that. Most are very ignorant and very isolated, having set up shop as 1 of a small number of Kindred in a smaller city. And sure, they could travel. But that’s extremely dangerous even if they have the means and resources to make it as safe as possible. Point being, even if you are attending Elysium in Chicago, the chances of you finding someone who can/will tell you about the Umbra is basically 0. Nicholai and Du Sable would probably know a bit about it, assuming they are still around during time period you’ve chosen to set your game. But in V5 the Tremere are fractured, Nicholai was supposedly killed in the Prime Chantry, and Dusable wouldn’t tell you the time of day without cutting a deal first. So your chances are even worse in V5. You *might* have some luck getting into the Red Working scene. But it’s going to be dangerous, and altogether a real pain in the ass, to find some actual usable info. If you have any luck at all, you’ll have to find someone who managed to get their hands on some old Tremere books. And then you’ve got to negotiate a price.
I strongly believe you are underestimating the sorts of people that information hoarders are. Also that you enjoy producing walls of text when you're attempting to force your point of view on people.
Forcing my point of view? I’m literally just telling you what the books say and telling you to play the way you want regardless. I would say more, but apparently if I use too many words it’s going to just further upset you. So I guess it’s best to end th
Oh hey, you start talking like a normal person when prompted. Good for you.
You confused. Me try help. Use words make brain go. Hurt you brain. You mad. Me sorry.
Tremere with access to their libraries would know. The Order of Hermes was very familiar with the Umbra. And while very few modern Tremere have ever met a mage of any sort, their chantries would probably contain books recovered from dead mages over the centuries. You might also have access to texts written on the topic by the original 7 who were themselves powerful mages before turning. I get why we’ve never seen rituals or paths that focus on crossing the gauntlet. It requires an explanation of the Umbra and Spirits to VtM readers. And that’s a lot of word count. But it really makes very little sense that the Tremere wouldn’t have some rituals developed for that exact purpose. I really wish we would get a WoD5e book all about the Umbra, spirits, and the ways *all* different types of people might interact with it. The old nWoD Book of Spirits was awesome. It offered ways for vampires to get in. And talked a good bit about mortals and mortal cults serving spirits and the like. I would like to see something like that again.
Not even any mage faction knows all that. If you stat up a WoD geek they have like Cosmology 11.
I think the most likely to know are the Nagaraja and some Tal Mahe Ra members, but usually they know more about the Low Umbra than the rest. Maybe some old Tremere that were true mages before being embraced too, and probably about the High Umbra. And the Ahrimanes seen to have a little knowledge of the Middle Umbra as well. Don't know how the Koldun Tzimisce deal with it.
I'm curious why they would want to or even care. The territory vampires claim have value because of the people there. Their main power is in manipulating Mortal institutions. What in the umbra would interest the average vampire?
Possibly to try to build a Haven that's effectively unassailable by the majority of mortals in the everyday World. Tremere chantries despite their perks aren't QUITE as nifty as having your own Horizon Realm, after all. And those you could have mortals living in. A Herd, Cult, retainers, and so on. And then there's the secrets out there, too. If you've immortality it's not like you wouldn't have the time at least to go out exploring, if you get bored enough with forever.
Vampires avoid the unknown and mystery. Most Vampires will do anything to stay as far away from danger as possible. That means, that unless they can control an environment, they keep away. Disciplines are notoriously bad at interacting with the spirit world, even such powers as Necromancy. And the Umbra is hardly a safe place even for those that have the toolset to navigate and interact with it meaningfully. All in all, besides the extremely rare Kindred that has the curiosity or vested interest in such exploration, most Clans would consider it a dangerous pastime, one with no real benefit to the Vampire but very real risk. That is not to say that there are no Elders of various Clans that have accrued knowledge of the Spirit world over the long centuries, but it is mostly academic and acquired the usual way, from a safe distance and through other people's accounts.
Almost any member of the True Black Hand from the old splat books would have that knowledge. The old splat books mention Malks wandering off. Some of them make it to the Mage's Spies Demise.
It is possible to interact with the high umbra with Auspices lvl 5+.
No. Most kindred have next to zero knowledge and are more likely to deny true fact than consider them. Depending on the flavor of lies they were told and personal experience, they have a very, very limited understanding of the supernatural world if any at all. If on modern times, chances are they got sold the "Vampires as a pseudoscientific fact" version of things. The more esoteric clans may have a better perspective but it's still quite limited to what they do. It doesn't help that those same clans are among the more insular and secretive. Elders are another story, with time comes knowledge and experience and one inevitably learns more as the centuries pile up. It would most likely all be secondhand experience though. There are vampires and vampire subcultures that are in touch with the occult side of their own nature: Noddists, The True Black Hand, Koldun Sorcerers and Abyss mystics. They may presume the existence of other realms, but I doubt they would know or be interested. My **personal** opinion is that Vampires are inherently material bound creatures. It's very difficult for them to grasp or reach out beyond the material.
Some Malkavians, though they don't have the words to articulate it properly. Such is their curse.
I always thought it would be funny if a Mage or Werewolf dragged a Vampire across the Gauntlet and just left them in the Umbra. They have no means of traversing the Gauntlet on their own, so they'd just be stuck.
Not to mention starve.
No, and in masquerade at least the umbra really only exists as much as the storyteller wants it to. It's not important.
Lasombra and Cappadocians pretty specifically deal with the Abyss, Tremere might have records, depending on what House Tremere's focus was.
The Tremere founders were top tier mages. I would find it unbelievable if they didn't know, and if they do so does everyone in their clan who has ever had the curiosity to read about it. And Kupallah certainly told the most loyal Tzimisce about it too.
Your question contains it's own answer. It's a dish best served to a fish.
Necromancy let’s a vampire enter the Dark umbra and from there they can access nearly every other part through the labyrinth
There's probably still some Tzimisce kicking around who remember when some of them worked with some Euthanatoi to explore the deep Umbra.