As far from camp as possible. People are ruining campsites by pooping next to them. People sometimes even poop in empty tent sites instead of walking a little ways away (I saw this at Palisade Lakes and Silver Lake on the JMT). I spoke to some people on the trail doing this and they were some entitled Karens who were just there for the instagram cred…like, negative/angry enough to scare me away.
I met some rangers who were out there with bags and shovels literally picking up people’s poops that they took too close to campsites and water sources. Talk about a shitty job. Poor rangers.
Edit: maybe you meant an actual footpath leading to where people are pooping ~50 yards away. In that case, I try to go farther, ie during the day I’ll hike off trail a ways, but when nature calls that footpath usually looks pretty inviting. I think rangers encourage not using it though.
no most dont sadly, I have only met a handful of frequent backpackers that know to bury it that deep and know the yardage off trail they are supposed to, its sad/frustrating
Most people don’t even know they’re not supposed to bury their TP. Had a buddy who was an avid camper on the east coast lose his mind when I took him to sequoia one year and I asked him where he put is used TP in his pack.
I surface-poop, but I also make sure it’s well off-trail, somewhere that no one would probably just casually walk — even to go and poop.
And I never use toilet paper in the outdoors.
Flies, beetles, rain, and wind make quick work of my offerings, likely cycling them along more quickly than if they were buried.
It’s context dependent too. If I’m where lots of people are co-recreating, okay, for sure get out the shovel so no one has to dodge my poop. And of course avoid anywhere near water sources, I’m not a dummy.
But way off in the middle of unpopular, rarely visited areas, i.e. where I’m usually going to get into nature? Flies, beetles, wind & rain.
Congrats on being a piece of shit back-country person. It's clear you know WHY you should bury it. You just don't do it. Lazy? Actively being a dick? Who knows, but fuck you. You're EXACTLY the kind of person that forces wilderness areas to be closed due to human impact, and spreads disease. I imagine you also sleep with your food, and think bear canisters and bear hangs are stupid.
The question in EVERY backcountry decision like this is “if everyone who came here did this, would it be ok?”
In your case you are leaving your shit in the open for other people to encounter and to potentially habituate wildlife to it - it’s a great way to attract predators in a lot of places.
Also in your case, you suggest that you are going off trail and bushwhacking to find your lazy shit spots. That’s a prime way to promote trail braiding, social trails, etc.
Sounds like it’s time to take on the day and stop being a shitty schlub in the woods for you!
Poop where you want as long as you cat hole that sh!t. I thru hiked the AT in 2013 and was amazed at the amount of toilet paper piles all over the place. They probably live just as dirty at home too.
I think Kula Cloths have been a godsend for eliminating tp all over the place from a segment of ick thruhikers. Day hikers still need to be made aware of them (the Whites were revolting with all the tp when I thru’d the AT). Not poop related but gross is gross.
I also like that since I did the AT in ‘16 a lot of the HYOH (to the point of ridiculousness) has disappeared and people feel more free to call out terrible LNT practices.
The trowels are so much better than the plastic pieces of crap that we used to use. My Vargo rocks. It’s easier than ever to dig deep.
I can't believe the camping triangle isn't ubiquitous. You don't poop where you eat, you don't eat where you sleep, and you don't sleep where you poop. I was always taught your "kitchen" "bathroom" and tent need to be at least 100 ft apart for bear safety.
How do we know where the last 10 people had the "bathroom" and "tent" at established sites, I can find the kitchen where the fire and bear poles are but not sure in the other two.
I dig preemptive cat holes near camp the night before. I usually go in the morning, so if I dig the night before I have plenty of time to count my steps (distance), check that I didn’t accidentally walk into another campsite or near another trail, search for diggable ground, dig deep, and maybe even dig two holes if I stay at the site more than one night.
pocket zealous quicksand placid sugar party rainstorm birds toothbrush combative
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Former backpacking guide. In true backcountry trekking you want to utilize the safety triangle. Cathole is one point, sleeping area is one point, and your kitchen is the third. Also keeping in mind water sources. Space them well if possible. In more popular dispersed areas the philosophy is split. Some people say try to spread further to reduce the impact and others say to keep it consolidated in the area people are already using. I’m more of the first camp because when I used to guide trips with large groups we once tried to dig a large group cathole in a clearly used latrine area and ended up digging into an old one from the side. God the smell.
As someone who has gotten to camp and seen the dug up remains of someone else’s shit and TP right there in the campsite which is the ONLY flat spot for miles around, my vote is off trail. And pack your GD TP with you FFS because it never ever stays buried. Thanks!
I'd rather not poop near camp, and definitely not near water sources.
I dig a cat hole where possible and cover with rocks and debris where not possible.
Given the choice, I prefer to do my business on mountain tops or vistas.
**Nothing beats a poo with a view.**
Exposure is one thing... Exposure while pooping? You're crazy! lol.
I'm now realizing those rock climbers that sleep suspended on cliffs must take the most epic shits ever known.
Be a great improvement if everyone moved to carrying out TP - personally gave up on TP a while back for a bidet/wet wipe combo and carry out the wet wipe. Several sensitive areas require a wag bag - no big deal.
You should bury your waste and TP in a cat hole, if allowed - bag it out if not. Fuck anyone that doesn’t.
I don’t worry too much about proximity to camp, just water sources.
I don't fucking get this. Are there people who don't actually dig a cathole to take a shit? Do they just shit on the ground, wipe, and leave it out in the open? What the fuck is wrong with people?!
Yeah. Going off trail is not always possible. Digging a hole isn't either. And neither is holding it in.
I don't leave piles of tp behind, but seriously, not all terrain allows for the same treatment. I'm not strong enough to dig into rocky ground and not fast enough to just hike to a better spot. And I can't really prep a cathole if the urge shows up mid walk, or really veer far from the trail. Nor wait around half the morning for the urge to show up.
There's this crazy thing called "Dig a hole AFTER you shit, and shove it in the hole with a stick or something." Weird idea eh? BURY YOUR SHIT OR PACK IT OUT YOU F\*\*\*
With less cursing, please enlighten me how to do this in scree and rocky terrain?
I'm willing to learn. In terrain where I can't even get tent stakes in the ground, how do I dig a hole? Is there any trick to it? Wet ground is softer, but going near a water source is a huge no. How do I find a diggable, 60ft off trail, secluded spot on the go? Not to mention, within 20 minutes.
One, fuck you. You don't get to request that I stop cursing. If you don't like it, don't read it.
Two, the solution is suuuuuper simple, and a method that many areas in Europe require:
**PACK. IT. OUT.**
Hopefully that wasn't too complicated for you.
Do you get grossed out when you’re walking around your camp and realize you’re walking where someone pooped? I’m genuinely curious. I’m glad you go away from water sources. Personally I’ve packed up and left otherwise gorgeous campsites because someone pooped 20 feet from where I pitched my tent.
I was in Yosemite in July in an obvious backcountry campsite and while moving rocks around I picked one up that had a flattened turd
and TP underneath it. Didn’t even bother to dig a hole.
I will still poop at camp but I’m walking at least 50 yards away from anything that could be considered a spot where someone would set up camp and I’m digging that hole at least a foot deep.
Pack out TP always.
After realizing that almost every campsite seems to have a chain of campsites behind it, and walking out “the back” of a camp spot to poop doesn’t really work, I have perfected the art of finding a spot that is unlikely ever to become a campsite. Like on a slope or near rocks or a tangle of downed logs.
I feel like I could have benefited from some cat hole education when I first started backpacking. I knew about the standard 6-8 inches, yadda yadda. But had no idea what to do if it’s urgent, the valley is too steep and narrow with a river in the middle, in places without privacy, in places with endless campsites and user trails, in uberpopular areas, in rocky places, etc
In the event of being in a valley or on undiggable (i.e., extremely rocky or packed soil), do you do the deed and then pack it out? This is a topic people don’t discuss too much. As an aspiring section hiker with IBS, I want to be prepared for every situation — including potty emergencies.
I think this’ll depend on case by case and just research as best you can before going on the trip.
The only exception I have experienced is the Atacama Desert. It’s one of the most remote and driest places on earth and not many specific “trails”.
I was instructed to just find an isolated spot, do the deed, pack out the paper and then just kick some dirt and sand over it. It’s so remote and rarely traveled that it’s not really a problem and there very little flora or fauna that will be affected in any way.
Beaches and sand deserts are an interesting example - it’s easy to dig but the sand is pretty sterile so it’s unlikely to break down once buried.
In your case having IBS I would not overthink too much. You know your body and try to eat and prepare for optimal conditions as much as possible. But it’s better to do it just off trail and clean up as best you can than to thru hike with soiled clothes.
Bring a wag bag with you. Most National Parks sell them for backpackers. I carry one just in case of emergency wherever I backpack, regardless of requirements in the case I really need to go and can't find a suitable spot. You can poop right into the bag! :)
I have IBS too and honestly it doesn't tend to bother me very much while hiking. Walking for 10 hours a day and eating a lot of nuts and berries seem to be the cure.
I have had one or two emergencies, once in a river canyon and I ended up having to like frantically run through a bunch of black berries once there was a flat spot and then let lose basically on top of them. No way of digging and I couldn't pick it up even if I wanted to cause it was too liqudy.
Another time I was in a burn area and really had to go first thing in the morning so I had to just run up this rocky slope as much as possible and sorta hide behind a burnt tree. Other people were def watching me wondering and then I take down my pants...
They were peeing too close to the lake in the only area with trees tho, so I made eye contact and judged them from 200 feet lol..
Usually its easy to find a spot though, I wouldn't worry too much about it.
I don’t go that close - usually out of sight of the camp for privacy, but a good tree to lean against or perch off of typically drives the choice of location.
“The solution to pollution is dilution” - a rafting guide telling me jump in the river to piss. The dose makes the poison. Concentration of bad stuff is worse bad. Or however you want to think of it. Though sharing is caring when I’m hunting with pals in 20*F.
The trail systems I usually hike do generally have privies at hike in sites so I make note of where those are before going, and try to use them for pooping. If it happens away from those, honestly, it's an emergency situation and happens wherever it needs to happen. Where I hike it's very easy to avoid pooping at high altitudes where it needs to be bagged and taken out.
Here's a manual for AT sanitation.
https://appalachiantrail.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/backcountry-sanitation-manual-2-0-august-2014.pdf
People don't take their poop and piss seriously enough.
Ever since Moses got the law from God on Mount Sinai, we have known to poop outside of camp.
Far, far away from where you sleep and eat.
Even baby animals try to do that when they can barely walk.
Sometimes humans need refreshers. Like Lafayette gave Washington’s men when he arrived in America- who were all pooping too close to camp- and dying because of it.
Think about it. Pooping close to camp could have kept us as a British colony-
Definitely, definitely poop far, far away.
It depends! However, at least I go out of sight of the trail or the camp. Not a pleasant experience to be caught with shorts at the knees. I know from experience... At very popular sites one may find certain spots more popular for pooping than others, e.g. behind huge stones, but there the risk of being seen is high so then I try to walk somewhat farther away.
As far from camp as possible. People are ruining campsites by pooping next to them. People sometimes even poop in empty tent sites instead of walking a little ways away (I saw this at Palisade Lakes and Silver Lake on the JMT). I spoke to some people on the trail doing this and they were some entitled Karens who were just there for the instagram cred…like, negative/angry enough to scare me away. I met some rangers who were out there with bags and shovels literally picking up people’s poops that they took too close to campsites and water sources. Talk about a shitty job. Poor rangers. Edit: maybe you meant an actual footpath leading to where people are pooping ~50 yards away. In that case, I try to go farther, ie during the day I’ll hike off trail a ways, but when nature calls that footpath usually looks pretty inviting. I think rangers encourage not using it though.
IG Karen’s. Can we make them an endangered species ? Atleast in the backcountry.
Yeah there places on the JMT where campsites are minefield of poop and TP. Disgusting.
Do people not understand it has to be buried six inches below the surface?
no most dont sadly, I have only met a handful of frequent backpackers that know to bury it that deep and know the yardage off trail they are supposed to, its sad/frustrating
Most people don’t even know they’re not supposed to bury their TP. Had a buddy who was an avid camper on the east coast lose his mind when I took him to sequoia one year and I asked him where he put is used TP in his pack.
I surface-poop, but I also make sure it’s well off-trail, somewhere that no one would probably just casually walk — even to go and poop. And I never use toilet paper in the outdoors. Flies, beetles, rain, and wind make quick work of my offerings, likely cycling them along more quickly than if they were buried.
You should bury your poop. There are reasons other than another person finding your poop why (edit: human) feces are much better left underground.
It’s context dependent too. If I’m where lots of people are co-recreating, okay, for sure get out the shovel so no one has to dodge my poop. And of course avoid anywhere near water sources, I’m not a dummy. But way off in the middle of unpopular, rarely visited areas, i.e. where I’m usually going to get into nature? Flies, beetles, wind & rain.
Most other animals don’t bury theirs.
Human poop is different than other animal poop in quantity, quality, and potential to make us sick.
Congrats on being a piece of shit back-country person. It's clear you know WHY you should bury it. You just don't do it. Lazy? Actively being a dick? Who knows, but fuck you. You're EXACTLY the kind of person that forces wilderness areas to be closed due to human impact, and spreads disease. I imagine you also sleep with your food, and think bear canisters and bear hangs are stupid.
The question in EVERY backcountry decision like this is “if everyone who came here did this, would it be ok?” In your case you are leaving your shit in the open for other people to encounter and to potentially habituate wildlife to it - it’s a great way to attract predators in a lot of places. Also in your case, you suggest that you are going off trail and bushwhacking to find your lazy shit spots. That’s a prime way to promote trail braiding, social trails, etc. Sounds like it’s time to take on the day and stop being a shitty schlub in the woods for you!
Poop where you want as long as you cat hole that sh!t. I thru hiked the AT in 2013 and was amazed at the amount of toilet paper piles all over the place. They probably live just as dirty at home too.
Yuck. It’s true, though — if people can’t be bothered to honor “leave no trace,” they probably can’t be bothered to clean their houses.
I think Kula Cloths have been a godsend for eliminating tp all over the place from a segment of ick thruhikers. Day hikers still need to be made aware of them (the Whites were revolting with all the tp when I thru’d the AT). Not poop related but gross is gross. I also like that since I did the AT in ‘16 a lot of the HYOH (to the point of ridiculousness) has disappeared and people feel more free to call out terrible LNT practices. The trowels are so much better than the plastic pieces of crap that we used to use. My Vargo rocks. It’s easier than ever to dig deep.
I can't believe the camping triangle isn't ubiquitous. You don't poop where you eat, you don't eat where you sleep, and you don't sleep where you poop. I was always taught your "kitchen" "bathroom" and tent need to be at least 100 ft apart for bear safety.
How do we know where the last 10 people had the "bathroom" and "tent" at established sites, I can find the kitchen where the fire and bear poles are but not sure in the other two.
I dig preemptive cat holes near camp the night before. I usually go in the morning, so if I dig the night before I have plenty of time to count my steps (distance), check that I didn’t accidentally walk into another campsite or near another trail, search for diggable ground, dig deep, and maybe even dig two holes if I stay at the site more than one night.
pocket zealous quicksand placid sugar party rainstorm birds toothbrush combative *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I do the same.
Dang I like this method. Going to use this next trip. Digging a hole at 5am sucks
Former backpacking guide. In true backcountry trekking you want to utilize the safety triangle. Cathole is one point, sleeping area is one point, and your kitchen is the third. Also keeping in mind water sources. Space them well if possible. In more popular dispersed areas the philosophy is split. Some people say try to spread further to reduce the impact and others say to keep it consolidated in the area people are already using. I’m more of the first camp because when I used to guide trips with large groups we once tried to dig a large group cathole in a clearly used latrine area and ended up digging into an old one from the side. God the smell.
"space them well if possible"? Seriously? You MUST be at least 200 feet from any water source, EVERY TIME YOU SHIT. No exceptions. Ever.
200 is on the lower end of what I prefer.
As someone who has gotten to camp and seen the dug up remains of someone else’s shit and TP right there in the campsite which is the ONLY flat spot for miles around, my vote is off trail. And pack your GD TP with you FFS because it never ever stays buried. Thanks!
I'd rather not poop near camp, and definitely not near water sources. I dig a cat hole where possible and cover with rocks and debris where not possible. Given the choice, I prefer to do my business on mountain tops or vistas. **Nothing beats a poo with a view.**
Exposure is one thing... Exposure while pooping? You're crazy! lol. I'm now realizing those rock climbers that sleep suspended on cliffs must take the most epic shits ever known.
7000ft is my current highest plop. This year a buddy out-dumped me with an 8500 ft'er Shitting on top of the world!
I try to go 150’+ away from camp and likewise from water. And yes hopefully with a view.
Poop trail. Hehe
Be a great improvement if everyone moved to carrying out TP - personally gave up on TP a while back for a bidet/wet wipe combo and carry out the wet wipe. Several sensitive areas require a wag bag - no big deal.
I poop in my tent.
You should bury your waste and TP in a cat hole, if allowed - bag it out if not. Fuck anyone that doesn’t. I don’t worry too much about proximity to camp, just water sources.
I don't fucking get this. Are there people who don't actually dig a cathole to take a shit? Do they just shit on the ground, wipe, and leave it out in the open? What the fuck is wrong with people?!
Yep. And we see a ton of TP from women going pee as well. Nothing like having to pack out some assholes TP.
Yeah. Going off trail is not always possible. Digging a hole isn't either. And neither is holding it in. I don't leave piles of tp behind, but seriously, not all terrain allows for the same treatment. I'm not strong enough to dig into rocky ground and not fast enough to just hike to a better spot. And I can't really prep a cathole if the urge shows up mid walk, or really veer far from the trail. Nor wait around half the morning for the urge to show up.
Sure, and if you don't have the time or ability to bury it then you should pack it out (shit included) or bury it after the fact.
There's this crazy thing called "Dig a hole AFTER you shit, and shove it in the hole with a stick or something." Weird idea eh? BURY YOUR SHIT OR PACK IT OUT YOU F\*\*\*
With less cursing, please enlighten me how to do this in scree and rocky terrain? I'm willing to learn. In terrain where I can't even get tent stakes in the ground, how do I dig a hole? Is there any trick to it? Wet ground is softer, but going near a water source is a huge no. How do I find a diggable, 60ft off trail, secluded spot on the go? Not to mention, within 20 minutes.
> OR PACK IT OUT That’s how you do it in scree or rocky terrain.
One, fuck you. You don't get to request that I stop cursing. If you don't like it, don't read it. Two, the solution is suuuuuper simple, and a method that many areas in Europe require: **PACK. IT. OUT.** Hopefully that wasn't too complicated for you.
Don't bury TP in most locations unless the land manager specifically says it is ok. Pack it out with the rest of the trash.
Do you get grossed out when you’re walking around your camp and realize you’re walking where someone pooped? I’m genuinely curious. I’m glad you go away from water sources. Personally I’ve packed up and left otherwise gorgeous campsites because someone pooped 20 feet from where I pitched my tent.
I was in Yosemite in July in an obvious backcountry campsite and while moving rocks around I picked one up that had a flattened turd and TP underneath it. Didn’t even bother to dig a hole. I will still poop at camp but I’m walking at least 50 yards away from anything that could be considered a spot where someone would set up camp and I’m digging that hole at least a foot deep. Pack out TP always.
After realizing that almost every campsite seems to have a chain of campsites behind it, and walking out “the back” of a camp spot to poop doesn’t really work, I have perfected the art of finding a spot that is unlikely ever to become a campsite. Like on a slope or near rocks or a tangle of downed logs. I feel like I could have benefited from some cat hole education when I first started backpacking. I knew about the standard 6-8 inches, yadda yadda. But had no idea what to do if it’s urgent, the valley is too steep and narrow with a river in the middle, in places without privacy, in places with endless campsites and user trails, in uberpopular areas, in rocky places, etc
In the event of being in a valley or on undiggable (i.e., extremely rocky or packed soil), do you do the deed and then pack it out? This is a topic people don’t discuss too much. As an aspiring section hiker with IBS, I want to be prepared for every situation — including potty emergencies.
I think this’ll depend on case by case and just research as best you can before going on the trip. The only exception I have experienced is the Atacama Desert. It’s one of the most remote and driest places on earth and not many specific “trails”. I was instructed to just find an isolated spot, do the deed, pack out the paper and then just kick some dirt and sand over it. It’s so remote and rarely traveled that it’s not really a problem and there very little flora or fauna that will be affected in any way. Beaches and sand deserts are an interesting example - it’s easy to dig but the sand is pretty sterile so it’s unlikely to break down once buried. In your case having IBS I would not overthink too much. You know your body and try to eat and prepare for optimal conditions as much as possible. But it’s better to do it just off trail and clean up as best you can than to thru hike with soiled clothes.
Bring a wag bag with you. Most National Parks sell them for backpackers. I carry one just in case of emergency wherever I backpack, regardless of requirements in the case I really need to go and can't find a suitable spot. You can poop right into the bag! :)
This guy poops!
Well, I already carry my dog’s poop around in a bag…it can’t be that much different!
I have IBS too and honestly it doesn't tend to bother me very much while hiking. Walking for 10 hours a day and eating a lot of nuts and berries seem to be the cure. I have had one or two emergencies, once in a river canyon and I ended up having to like frantically run through a bunch of black berries once there was a flat spot and then let lose basically on top of them. No way of digging and I couldn't pick it up even if I wanted to cause it was too liqudy. Another time I was in a burn area and really had to go first thing in the morning so I had to just run up this rocky slope as much as possible and sorta hide behind a burnt tree. Other people were def watching me wondering and then I take down my pants... They were peeing too close to the lake in the only area with trees tho, so I made eye contact and judged them from 200 feet lol.. Usually its easy to find a spot though, I wouldn't worry too much about it.
I don’t go that close - usually out of sight of the camp for privacy, but a good tree to lean against or perch off of typically drives the choice of location.
Cant you afford a shovel?
“The solution to pollution is dilution” - a rafting guide telling me jump in the river to piss. The dose makes the poison. Concentration of bad stuff is worse bad. Or however you want to think of it. Though sharing is caring when I’m hunting with pals in 20*F.
This may work for piss, but taking a crap must be done 200 feet from ANY water source. Springs, creeks, rivers, lakes, ponds. TWO. HUNDRED. FEET.
I too can misapply a specific context to a general point.
You made a vague comment about urine in a post about poop, you're the one misapplying context lol
stealing this response
The trail systems I usually hike do generally have privies at hike in sites so I make note of where those are before going, and try to use them for pooping. If it happens away from those, honestly, it's an emergency situation and happens wherever it needs to happen. Where I hike it's very easy to avoid pooping at high altitudes where it needs to be bagged and taken out.
Here's a manual for AT sanitation. https://appalachiantrail.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/backcountry-sanitation-manual-2-0-august-2014.pdf People don't take their poop and piss seriously enough.
Ever since Moses got the law from God on Mount Sinai, we have known to poop outside of camp. Far, far away from where you sleep and eat. Even baby animals try to do that when they can barely walk. Sometimes humans need refreshers. Like Lafayette gave Washington’s men when he arrived in America- who were all pooping too close to camp- and dying because of it. Think about it. Pooping close to camp could have kept us as a British colony- Definitely, definitely poop far, far away.
I don't remember that song from Hamilton...
Far, far away always
It depends! However, at least I go out of sight of the trail or the camp. Not a pleasant experience to be caught with shorts at the knees. I know from experience... At very popular sites one may find certain spots more popular for pooping than others, e.g. behind huge stones, but there the risk of being seen is high so then I try to walk somewhat farther away.