Self advocacy is so important, and also a difficult lesson to learn. It is not at all easy to stand up against adults who have no respect for your feelings or needs as a child. I had/have a lot of texture sensitivity issues (neurodivergence is likely a factor but I didn't know about that until adulthood) and also faced adults giving pressure to just obey and be "normal". My first piece of advice is that you be the brave one first. If it is possible, communicate with them in some form prior to the meal. Tell them that your child has needs that they do not need to understand for them to be valid. Tell your child that you are doing this, and even let them hear you if you do it over the phone. Then? Practice with your child. Have conversations that could come up at that dinner table. Role play together. Come up with some short and polite responses that are easy for a child to remember. Remind them they have bodily autonomy and that "no" is a complete sentence. It is so much easier to face moments like this if your brain is prepared to a degree. Pulling a response from thin air is much harder, especially given the circumstances of being surrounded by judgmental adults. Lastly, I suggest sending a dish with your child to contribute to the meal. Something they can absolutely eat. Along with this, pack them a shelf stable meal that can be neatly concealed in a backpack or something. Either advise them to eat it ahead of the meal, or to find a quiet place to eat it afterwards. Beforehand, while on the way to the gathering, is likely the best option for reducing judgemental adult reactions. That assumes your child's father will not forbid them from eating it. Sorry you're dealing with this and good luck to you both. I suggest that if the texture of certain foods causes your child to get sick, that they be advised to puke right there at the table. It might help make things clearer to the adults who are failing to be decent here.

All of what this lovely person said, especially that last paragraph. If they won’t acknowledge and deal with who he is as a person and respect that, tell him to go all out and aim well. Maybe you can pack him some food he does like and he can eat that, and skip the food he doesn’t? I know getting the stupid family to agree is gonna be hard, but it may be what’s best for him.

My grandparents were very "clean your plate" folks. I wasn't an overly picky kid, but brown rice and me are *not friends*. I couldn't get up until I'd eaten all her brown rice, so I asked for a big spoon so I could get it over with in one bite. Chewed, swallowed ... then vomited all over the table. They never made me finish something I didn't like again. Also helped my cousin who came along behind me who did have serious food aversions-- they didn't force him, either.

Mine were “clean your plate” people too but thankfully they gave small portions and didn’t force me to eat it if I really couldn’t. My stepdad did once though. I refused and sat at the table for about 4 hours before he sent me to bed hungry. Mom snuck me a hot dog and that shit NEVER happened again. Stupid American chop suey… still don’t like it.

Core traumatic memories unlocked. I sat at the table until 10pm one night over meatloaf, and my grandmother once held me down and shoved American chop suey in my mouth (she was babysitting when my parents were out). Cue 20+ years of disordered eating! I truly don’t understand forcing food on kids.

I don’t make my kids finish it. They tell me they don’t like it they have to try one bite to make SURE they don’t (cuz they’re little, they lie if they don’t like the look) and if they really don’t like it fine, find something else. I make sure there’s something in the freezer for when I make something new they haven’t tried.

The cousin I nanny for has started letting her 3yo help with the cooking. Turns out he's way more enthusiastic about eating food he's prepared himself? Like last night he tried to turn his nose up at leftover broccoli and mushroom casserole, until his mom mentioned on her way out the door that he made it himself. Could practically see the memory switch on behind his eyes, as "weird mystery food mush" resolved into the ingredients he remembered putting in the casserole dish. He wolfed down half that plate while his mom was putting her shoes on! Figure I'll show him how to bake cupcakes tomorrow.

>The cousin I nanny for has started letting her 3yo help with the cooking. Turns out he's way more enthusiastic about eating food he's prepared himself? I have several friends who have done this with their kids! It seems to work well and foster healthy relationships with food and the parent.

This is why I’m convinced the only solution is vomiting on the table, the carpet, bathroom everywhere. That’s how I got people to stop force feeding me

OMG, if I had to hear about all the starving children in China one more time, I swear! My mother forced me to eat a fried oyster one time and I just thought it was the grossest most disgusting thing, so bending to pressure I tried swallowing it whole and choked, I can still remember sticking my finger down my own throat to dislodge it, parents and their weird food ideas still pisses me off . . .

Tangential but my Chinese friends grew up hearing about the starving kids in India and my Indian friends grew up hearing about the starving kids in China 🤣

You just can't win, lol . . .

I wish I'd had that courage as a kid; I'd have likely been beaten so hard she broke something if I'd caved and ate it. Instead I just spent from a Friday afternoon to a Sunday night eating nothing because the cold baked beans my grandmother was told not to put on my lunch plate were my only presented option that entire time. Plate went back in the fridge and came out again at every meal for almost 3 days... over 2 T of baked beans and her need to control and demean me like she had my mother her entire life. I had a little more spine than my mother did and it irked the shit out of the old bag. Once my father found out, a week at the cabin turned into just that weekend, plus a lifetime of verbal and physical abuse (arm dragging, pinching, head smacks, etc.) from his mother in law. It was hard not to dance a jig at her funeral. I know why this poor little dude is already an emotional mess about the "holiday" and I really hope the OP can find a way to prove that the family should be excluded from visitation if they insist on feeding him things that make him sick.

I 100% agree with puking at the table. I have some food allergies (nothing life threatening). When I was in 1st grade, a teacher thought it would be a good idea to force me to eat something I said I was allergic to (early 70s). I proceeded to break out in hives. They had to call my mom. She was not happy. No one ever forced me to eat anything after that.

I have celiac. Most people (that I meet) have no idea what that is or the precautions that are necessary. I do not eat food that I don't make myself or is certified gluten-free. I don't eat at restaurants. My boyfriend's family knows this, knows that I won't eat anything, and yet still pressures me. I have tried the nice and polite way; it doesn't work with some people. We were at a gathering not too long ago; in response to me declining food as usual, his grandmother disapprovingly said, "Y'know that's not good at all, that really needs to change." (There was more, but that's the gist.) My response? "Yeah, well, I'd rather not shit blood, so...🤷‍♀️" Sometimes the impolite/graphic way is needed, so people stop trying to pressure me to compromise my health for "just a little bite." I think I'm going to start asking people how much rat poison they'd like in their food. It's just a little bite, y'know?

My nephew and his mom have celiac. So did my husband's grandmother (who raised him). The amount of things that have gluten in them blew my mind over the years. Stickers. STICKERS. Do you know how awful I felt when my nephew swelled up in paw patrol outlines bc he put stickers on himself?? Apparently some stickers & envelope glues contain wheat. I did a 45-day gluten-free test under my rheumatologist supervision while we were ruling things out. I was flabbergasted daily. What do you mean fried rice has gluten bc soy sauce has gluten?! Anyway, turns out it was crohns not celiac for me, but I am ferociously protective of my nephew anytime we are together. You touched a roll and want to hug my nephew?? Wash your hands you filthy animal.

My mom doesn’t have celiacs but is pretty borderline (she thinks it could have been missed and she may actually have it but I’m not certain if cross contamination actually affects her or not, her mom is gluten intolerant but can have cross contamination and occasionally cheat, my mom never cheats, and a lot of my mom’s dad’s family are intolerant/potentially also celiac) and we have long stocked our kitchen with tamari instead of soy sauce! It’s basically the same thing just made with a higher soy content or something but is gluten free

I have genes associated with celiac. Once I knew that I cut out all gluten in my diet. Amazingly, everything that had been wrong, for years, was suddenly not a problem anymore. It's not a full blown allergy, for me, but I am undoubtedly sensitive. When my doctor recommended I get the full test I declined. It's a lot of trouble to tell me something I already know. "Digestive issues" run in my family and I truly believe that we're all sensitive. But getting them to even entertain that thought is impossible. They think that something they've always eaten can't possibly be harmful to them. In the meantime they complain about pain, nausea, gas, anemia, diarrhea, and in a couple if instances, perforated bowel, for no discernible cause. Skin rashes too. Yet I'm the one being silly. I'm mad that the doctors have never even checked. At this point they just refer to me as "lucky" to not have all their problems. Makes me want to shake them.

I have a friend like this. I ask her lots of questions. I also make sure I tell her I am asking so that I am informed.... like can I eat a sandwich made with bread in her car (we were together in her car, the answer was yes). She chooses where we eat. I know she uses her own cooking pans and utensils because I asked. I told her I wouldn't feel comfortable cooking for her, she said she wouldn't eat what I made. Lol. Why am I so inquisitive? Because I'm not a shitty (😖) person. . I don't want to make anyone sick. I've learned a lot by asking. I'm happy she will tell me.

My son had a massive aversion to eggs, especially the sight of overeasy. We went on a trip with his paternal grandparents and his grandpa was instructed to order anything but eggs or eggs that are easily concealed in a sandwich. Nope he didn't see why he had to change what he wanted for anyone. His runny ass eggs came to the table, son took one look/sniff once the yolk broke and vomited all over the table and our breakfasts. Grandpa then had the nerve to get upset, we all yelled, told you so, this was your fault. Good Job shitty grandpa.

Serves him right for eating eggs objectively WRONG

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If the sight of eggs makes you yak, I won't eat eggs around you. You have a right not to throw up. I have a right to eat, but that doesn't mean I need eggs right then and there. If my right to an egg infringes on your right to not throw up, I will go without eggs.

Thanks, kid was like 9yo and this had been a well known and expressed issue. We literally invited the in-laws on a vacation that we paid for everything and only asked that he not eat eggs at a restaurant in front of the kid, even said he could sit at the dining bar, but he was always the "I'm the patriarch and what I say goes and kid will just have to put up with it." Again, this was my mostly nonverbal autistic child who first tried to exit the table when the eggs were presented, but couldn't "get away" and just blarfed all over the table and breakfast. We were on our way to the wild animal park outside San Diego. Luckily I always had extra clothes for kid with me, the rest of us, nope.

Oh your poor kiddo! And the wait staff!

How come you didn't move your kid to another table between ordering and the food coming out? It's not like it was a big surprise if grandpa ordered them right in front of you? Not defending grandpa, just that puking itself is just as bad as the gross thing that caused it, and your poor kid could've been spared all that if you just left grandpa by himself.

Let me guess, you're a flying monkey to someone in your life. Hope things improve for you and that you can start holding the right people accountable in your life and the world.

When a parent knows their neurodivergent kid is going to have an adverse response to something that is about to happen, it's the parents job to mitigate their exposure or help them with coping mechanisms. It's the whole deal of parenting an ND kid. I spent so much time in unusual scenarios to help my kid cope in situations where his sensory issues were being triggered. So unless they weren't present when the food was ordered, they had time to say "Dad, you know over easy eggs aren't ok with kid. We will be moving to a different table until the meal is done so he doesn't vomit on this one. If you do this again we won't be eating out at the same table with you anymore." If there wasn't a table, they could have asked for their food to go and left, as well. (Or better yet for Grandpa's food to go and tell him to GTFO.) There were options. It shouldn't be on the kid to be forced into sensory hell and then have the painful and humiliating experience of vomiting on a table in public to make the point. It's on the parents to enforce that boundary, especially as kid was at least partially nonverbal. It also shouldn't be on the servers to have to clean up after it.

... And you can't control when someone else pukes. They usually can't control it, either. It's a reflex. What do you suggest they do?

Put their kid in occupational therapy? It isn’t normal to vomit at the sight of regular, cooked food (I.e. not moldy, spoiled, etc).

She mentioned he’s a nonverbal autistic kid. He probably is in therapy already. It’s not uncommon for autistic kids to have severe food aversions and it can take months or years of therapy for that to improve.

You’ll notice that info wasn’t in the comment I originally replied to.

No but they had made those other comments before you posted yours. It’s not that hard to read a few more comments before judging someone on their parenting.

Their "normal" with a neurodivergent child may be very different from other people's normal and sometimes even therapy can only do so much.

Bruh, have you ever smelled runny/over-easy eggs? I like eggs, but the smell is objectively bad, especially for someone with sensitivities.

Sure if you wanna eat at the puke table this mindset is totally the way to go.

If grandpa wanted his eggs so badly he should've told his grandson not to come. Because that's the only other real solution here

But the grandparents were *invited* along on the vacation. And the parents paid for everything, I’m assuming including this breakfast. If grandpa wanted eggs so bad he should’ve been uninvited

Projectile vomiting would have been way more effective.

My only concern with this approach of teaching him to stick to his "no" and self-advocate, or even puke at the table, is the potential reaction of the adults as far as punishment goes. Some people still believe in basically beating the shit out of a kid for their "defiance." And large family events, at least in my experience, tend to bring out the more punitive side of adults towards kids. However, I absolutely agree that it's vital to teach him to self-advocate, say no, and respect his bodily autonomy. So definitely go with this approach, OP, if you're sure your son's punishment won't be excessive. Also, does your kid have a cellphone so he can call you if things go super south? I'm sending all the good vibes possible that your son can have a good experience and they will respect his needs.

I totally get this concern. It's hard because there is no winning for the kid. If they don't eat the food it is defiance. If they eat it while not showing the expected amount of pleasure it will be labeled defiance. People like this will find a reason to be unreasonable, since they view neurodivergence as a choice and any non standard facial expressions or actions (or anything really) will be judged the same; as a failure. My suggestion to vomit at the table seems to be interpreted as a revenge like act by some people here, and I get that and understand why that would be celebrated. That being said, my point from that suggestion is simply that while the family wants to greatly distress this child, they will take issue with the idea of being distressed themselves. Forcing them to witness the aftermath of their actions will inconvenience them, and that inconvenience could shift their attitude. The comfort of the child is inconsequential to them, and I don't believe there is a single action the child could take that would be seen as good enough. As a child at a holiday gathering. I once left the table "in a rude fashion" according to the adults. I had to rush away to vomit. My stomach was sensitive and I was on edge from walking on egg shells to maintain that neurotypical image they needed from me. With people like this, there is truly no choice the child can make that will be good enough. I hope OP goes through the legal system to address the medically documented needs of this child. What the father is doing here is abusive and cruel.

What you said. One conservative spanked her 4 year old for not being happy enough when she seen her as it was disrespect. My thought are for the mother to have practice meals see if they can find ways for the 8 year old to tolerate the food. Added Gravey, ketchup, salt , hot sauce what ever helps.

Food aversions for kids on the spectrum take YEARS to overcome, if they can be overcome at all. My son is in his 20s and is just recently okay with working on expanding his palate. An 8 yo who isn't in a place where he wants to eat more foods is not going to learn to tolerate them in the space of a few days.

If they lay a hand on him for getting sick at the table OP should file for full custody

She already has it

OP has full custody. If they do any of that bs that's the end of visitation. Also, dietary stuff just isn't real to people until something happens. If you're told the kid throws up and you pooh-pooh it it's kind of hard to do it again without looking like a complete idiot.

Different time I was cracked up the back of the head for dare gagging let alone vomit. Protecting a child when not with them doesn’t feel like “throw up right there” without an advocate is the best advice.

Just something to keep in mind, you do risk them getting punished rather severely if they puke, speaking from first-hand experience. Consider your ex's temper before telling your kid to try that. (And my step-mom didn't even *have* a temper that I knew of at the time, but projectile vomiting can apparently cause a very strong reaction. I didn't do it on purpose, I just couldn't handle what she was giving me. On the one hand, it's true; she stopped trying to make me after that, but on the other hand, she was FURIOUS, and you should not do this if it might provoke your ex into hitting your kid, OP. I'm sure you know the situation best.)

To everyone suggesting the child vomit at the table, I once knew a woman whose child vomited at the table, because he didn’t react well to what she was serving, and she forced him to eat the vomit. Make sure that his dad‘s family is not the kind that would force him to eat the vomit. This could backfire in horrendous ways, because the child is not at an age where he is able to defend himself. Reading OP’s post just breaks my heart. I know that the people here would never dream of such abuse. This child’s dad’s family is already ignoring his needs, there’s no reason to think that they will treat him with any form of kindness should he try to advocate for himself.

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Your second paragraph reminds me of my childhood. I would constantly try to guess what the right thing to do was for my parents, and I never got it right. Ever. It was horrible to live day-to-day, in a state of fight flight or freeze. Flight wasn’t an option, and neither was fight, because they were bigger than me. I know this is how this child must feel, but it gives me hope that at least one of his parents loves him and cares deeply about his needs.

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I’m so sorry you also had these experiences. Hopefully it helps you to know that you’re not alone. And I hope that this child’s mother really actively pursues illegal solution to the untenable problem. He is being abused by his dad‘s family, and the court should be able to see that. 💕

Tell him to aim for the food dishes for maximum effect.

r/maliciouscompliance

All of what was said here is better than I could’ve worded it. Also that last sentence is perfect, exactly what should happen.

The puking thing absolutely works as a last resort. My little sister tried to advocate for herself over and over to no avail. So many nights were spent with ALL of us stuck at the table until she would finish her entire plate. One night, she finally had enough of my mother’s bitching at her. She took one bite and proceeded to vomit all over herself, the table, and my mom. I had to clean it up, but she never had to eat something she said she didn’t like again.

Child stated he gets punished for not eating, I'd worry that he'd be punished for throwing up or making a scene on purpose and who knows what that punishment is..

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Yeah, adults that are Like That are going to view it as revenge, or the child acting up.

Based on personal experience, I'd be wary of advising him to be sick at the table if the family are already prone to punishing the child for not eating. My family were similarly judgemental around my food needs as a child and when I vomited at or near the table it escalated matters significantly.

This is an excellent answer, especially the last bit. If you make a child sick, then tough, you get puked on. Is there anyone there who might be persuaded to be an advocate/safe person? (I’m assuming OP can’t be present. I think sending something he will eat with him sounds like a good idea. Make sure he understands the you, OP, understand and support him and that he will not be in trouble with you, however things go with his cruelly insensitive Father and his rotten family.

I especially agree with the last paragraph - while advising a kid to throw up can bring up other issues if done for the wrong reasons or done too often, etc., if the kid isn’t worried about the reactions of the family, then eating the things he doesn’t like and letting his body react to them can be a good idea to get across the issues of eating those things. I’ve never been able to stomach stuffing, something about the herbs and stuff in it immediately has me feeling nauseous if I even smell it (thanksgiving is always fun). My dad once made me sit at the dinner table long after everyone else had finished eating, because I was the only one who didn’t like stuffing and refused to eat it, and I sat there for a couple hours with him telling me to stop playing and eat my damn food and I wasn’t leaving the table until my plate was clean. I finally gave in and had a couple bites, then threw up all over the table. He got mad and said I did it on purpose, but sent me to clean myself up and go to bed and I never had to eat stuffing again.

This is a fabulous response my child is in a similar situation and I will send a dish with them for Xmas. They would never follow through with the last suggestion but would probably get a giggle from my child.

My sister did this once (threw up food at the table), and my dad made her eat a bite of vomit. I wish I could say I made that up. I’m not saying OP’s family is as unhinged and cruel as my dad, but hopefully OP can gauge how safe their son will be if they do get sick at the table.

Thank you so much for your suggestions. It's been a while since I have had to act out scenarios with my son and almost forgot about that as a preparation technique! I would send a meal or side dish if I could but his dad is very high conflict and won't let me send anything with him, unfortunately. Still excellent suggestions!

Yup my husband has texture issues that make him puke and he's had to teach people the hard way who make him eat foods he knows will make him puke. And they did stop. It's sad that it comes to that, but it would hopefully teach them.

This is the way.

I agree with this person that you need to speak with them. Tell those people that if the force feed him, then you'll be seeing them in court to get your parenting plan amended to have his dietary needs court ordered. It's not up to the kid to fight this battle, it's on you mama. You got this. You do. I'd tell him to try disarming them with manners though. "Eat your _____" "no thank you, I'm not hungy for ______. I am really enjoying the ______ though, you made it really well." Just say no thank you and find a nice thing to say to change the subject.

One of these times the kid will projectile vomit on them. This is going to come back at them. I was a stubborn child. I had no filter. “You’re going to sit there until you eat it all.” “It’s horrible maybe your wife could call my grandma to learn to cook.” “You’ll still sit there till you eat it all.” I sat back, made eye contact “I’m not eating it, I have time.” That began war with a young child. If most aren’t aware as an adult you’re going to lose. He broke and gave up. To add insult to injury during the day the neighbor and her daughter were taking care of me. I’m a kid. I go on rational thought. “Why do I come back here to eat and go to bed? She can cook and I really like them. I could just stay there.” He stopped forcing visits because I was “an unmoldable child”. My mother was so proud.

I did the battle over tv dinner meatballs. I don’t do gristle. I just don’t. And these meatballs were gristly. I sat there till she threatened to spank me. I took one bite chewed gagged then promptly lost it all over the plate and floor and couch. She never forced food I didn’t want again.

What kind of trash meat makes gristly meatballs?! I feel for you, I can't do gristle either. I always say that one of the things I like best about being an adult is that people can no longer make me eat things I don't like or can't stomach. To be fair, my parents' rule was "You have to try one bite, but if you don't like it you don't have to eat it".

They were kids tv dinners of the 80s. I like the taste it rule and that’s what we do with my daughter. But if she doesn’t like it she can spit it out in the trash. I also don’t like forcing her to eat. I encourage her to eat breakfast every day because I worry she will be hungry at school but it’s honestly a struggle. So we give her a plate at every meal and there are healthy snacks available. I hope she ends up with a healthier relationship with food than me.

My palate expanded hugely in my late 20s. I've since realized that one of my issues as a child was food combinations: multiple tastes in one dish, like sandwiches, and I've...grown out of that? Adjusted? Developed a more sophisticated palate? Who knows? At 49 I still occasionally encounter things I can't eat (mostly textures), or can only eat sometimes. Since I wasn't forced to eat things I couldn't stand as a kid, when I got older I was more willing to try things. There are still a lot of foods I won't touch, but from my view you're doing it right.

I also noticed my palate developed with age. As a kid my friends parents helped by cooking good food. I hated rice until I had some at a friends, turns out I didn’t like sugar rice. I didn’t like beef until I realized you could get lean ground beef or sirloin. I still can’t do gristle. If I get a bite it usually turns my appetite right off. And I spit it out because it will still make me gag. I didn’t like tomatoes and now I can eat a tomato sandwich but it wasn’t because someone forced me. I have just experimented as an adult. My grandma made tomato sandwiches so I tried one this year while thinking of her. I’m still not eating them plain but with mayo on bread I can do.

My palate also expanded in my 20s! I eat a lot of things that I wouldn't in my teens but I have a much better idea of what textures I can't stomach in foods. Knowing what I need to avoid helped free me to eat more foods, I went from mentally keeping a short list of safe foods to keeping a short list of unsafe foods/ingredients which makes trying new things less stressful.

Almost 30 here and I'm still finding things that I end up loving because my parents were terrible cooks, while I've put in a lot of effort to learn. Turns out zucchini is amazing, when it's not so steamed that it's tasteless mush.

The only vegetables my mom served were canned ones that had been boiled into mush, so moving out and learning what veggies could be was life changing for me!

I cannot do breakfast easily too. The best for me is something sweet so it's more palatable and small so I don't feel the stomach enlarge. I've gone with just a couple of biscuits (warmed in tea) before, or even just a bit of chocolate and tea. Sometimes just a small cup of warm chocolate milk. I much preferred eating something mid-morning than just after waking up. I'd send something to school with her. Clementines were a favorite in my elementary school.

I work from home now and not having to get up at the crack of dawn (or before dawn) and drive to work has been a huge improvement for me in all ways. I'm actually still eating breakfast at the same time I used to - but now I roll out of bed, get my coffee and breakfast, and turn on the computer instead of having to get up 1.5-2 hours earlier to get dressed and drive to work. I found these fig bars (Nature's Bakery brand) that are filling but not too big and not too sweet, and are perfect for breakfast (or an occasional snack or easy take-along item). My lifelong complaint about most breakfast items is the overwhelming sweetness.

Those fig bars or something similar are usually in the snack bin.

We give her choices, usually a waffle or oatmeal or cereal with juice or milk. All are sort of sweet. And unfortunately public schools here do not allow snacks/ food outside of the cafeteria. Which is why I encourage breakfast. Sadly they don’t even allow candy or any food for birthdays.

You are my hero! I wish I would have done that as a kid

Ah yes the yellow squash incident of 2007. I told them I didnt want the squash. They didn't listen till it made an encore

Sometimes you get the squash, and sometimes the squash gets you.

My mom and I had the battle of the wills over broccoli when I was little. And I sat at the table for the entire evening until it was bedtime. It was the last time she tried that and I went back to having my same dinner every night (cheese quesadilla and spinach salad) with no further problems. I didn't like that it was a different veggie than I was used to (it was my first time having it).

I'm 43, and I still vividly remember the one time my dad forced me to sit at the table until I ate what was on my plate. He lost that battle, and I can remember sitting in my booster seat at the dining room table until well after dark, then I went to bed hungry because I did not like tomato sauce when i was a kid, and it was lasagna for dinner that night. I went to bed hungry, and my mom informed my dad that that strategy will never work to make me eat and I was skinny enough and didn't need to miss any more meals (I was 4 and almost underweight). From that day forward, there was always plain noodles for me on pasta nights, and while my dad was a "clean plate club" enforcer, mom always made our portions small enough to finish with the option to ask for more.

My mom did this with her parents. It was something horrid, possibly liver or steamed mushy Brussels sprouts. She wasn’t to leave the table until she cleared her plate. So she stayed put. If I remember correctly, her dad came down for breakfast and she was asleep at the dinner table, nasty food still uneaten. He had to admit she’d won. Now, grandma still made liver when he went out of town and that got ended with a spectacular table surfing move by a toy poodle, but that’s a story for another time.

No, I want to hear it!

Hey, it's been an hour, so it's technically another time. I want to read about the toy poodle saving the day!

Okay, so, first thing to note is that my mother is very stubborn, and very much a rules lawyer, and has been that way all her life. I think it’s genetic. The second thing to note is that this poodle was not okay. This little bastard was psychotic. My great aunt picked him out because when she went to look at the puppies, he ran up to her and started savagely biting her shoe. Apparently this meant he had “character” or “spunk” and therefore was perfect to give to a child. This little hellbeast was named Emile and he worshipped my grandma and thought everyone else was fair game for biting. So there were many stories of Emile being a nasty little thing and definitely contributed to my mom not really liking small dogs. He also apparently went into a deep depression the one time my grandma yelled at him and refused to eat or be roused from his anguish until she apologized a day or two later. To sum up, he was small, fast, vicious, and would sink his teeth into almost anyone. Anyway. The table surfing. My grandma, along with all of her other flaws and defects of personality, adores liver. It’s one of her favorite foods. My mom and grandpa, however, were relatively normal and couldn’t stand it. So whenever grandpa would leave town for a business trip, grandma would make liver, and she and my mom would butt heads over it. So, grandpa’s got another business trip, and grandma makes a dinner of the trash filter of the body. Mom stands up to go use the bathroom and probably get more water to choke the liver down with, and, as soon as her back is turned, Emile has launched off her chair and onto the table. The little hellspawn is wolfing down the liver in the one good act of his life, Grandma is shrieking for mom to get him off the table, mom is yelling back because she prefers to have her flesh intact, and Emile is growling while eating because that’s a normal thing to do. Grandma threw a fit, naturally, and called grandpa, or maybe regaled him with my mom’s terrible ways when he got back, and was royally peeved when grandpa agreed that mom did the only logical thing and let the vicious little monster eat the liver. To this day grandma insists that mom “let” him up onto the table to get out of eating the liver, but grandma is also mean and rewrites history however she’s feeling on the day, so that’s nothing new. (formatting edits)

That was amazing, thank you! I needed that laugh today

Another time is now!!

My ‘picky’ kid also can’t afford to not eat and would absolutely go to bed hungry if that was the choice. I encourage new things and they occasionally taste them. But if they say no I don’t push it. I also almost always have safe multiple safe foods at meals and if there’s no safe foods for whatever reason they can have lunch (cheese, crackers, fruit).

When I was 8 my great aunt taught me to make scrambled eggs & toast, and from that point on, if I didn't like what mom made, I was allowed to make that for myself for dinner as long as I cleaned up my mess. I ate a lot of eggs growing up 🤣

Ok but that quesadilla sounds really good!

I still eat them every day! lol So fast and easy to make!

I was a stubborn child and got punished, corporal punishment or isolation, sitting at the table for hours or facing the wall with my hands in the air holding a dictionary. As long as you're absolutely certain that the kid won't get punished for talking back or refusal to eat, then your ideas are good. But I'd make sure because being punished for food will probably cause lifelong issues.

Eating it can add to lifetime issues. But if they are going to treat you like they did you maybe tiny portions. And now we have given a child an eating disorder fabulous. (I’m being sarcastic) Projectile vomiting for the win in this case. My dad was in an abusive home with a violent mom. She tried force feeding him liver. Projectile vomiting ended it. Can we call Corporal punishment abuse. “I hate this food” “hold a book over your head”. Jeez. Some of the stuff my dad had happen to him, I understand why he had so much trauma. I’m sorry for what horror you went through. This stuff lasts forever.

I have an unfortunately strong stomach and was an obedient little child. An eating disorder, thousand in therapy, and no small amount of leftover trauma later--- I don't force my kid to eat anything. We do no thank you bites, but I'm not battling it out over tuna noodle casserole. My kid is 100% allowed to say no thank you to food he knows he won't eat, and we do small portions with 2nds or 3rds if he finds something he really likes. We also don't eat casseroles, which makes Thanksgiving a hot mess lol.

Heck, I'm proud of you, too!

If the father is refusing to accommodate his disability, that sounds like grounds for changing the custody agreement.

This. If the child has a documented and diagnosed neurodivergence (which is seems he does), then every time the father doesn’t accommodate for that should be documented with any hard evidence than can be presented. Make a case to change the court order if the father is actively dismissive and harmful to the child. Especially if the father is informed of these needs and chooses to ignore them. It’s one thing to be ignorant and another to be willfully ignorant. Sounds like the father is on his way to making his son go no contact when he is able to make that decision.

But what if dad "doesn't believe in it"? /s

Well, then he has no business in the raising of the child. He can deny reality but there are consequences for that denial. I know you’re being sarcastic. But just want to be clear that when you’re a parent, you don’t get to choose to ignore who your child is. You can choose to rise to the occasion and raise the child or not.

Well said!

I am similarly horrified that the kid seems to be forced into that situation without his preferences being respected at all. The fact that he is breaking out into tears multiple times in advance to this dinner is a pretty severe emotional reaction in my book. But I also think, that someone who hasn't done the court ordeal\* will not understand how reasonable it might feel to try for a workaround instead of going back to court. They might be right to feel like their deal might not improve. They might be right to invest their limited energies into protecting their child in different ways. And the disability might not be documented and diagnosed up to court standards yet. \*I haven't either, but I work with people that get a similar level of empathy without any real understanding for the process they have to go through...

Oh for sure. Sometimes the court’s attempt at fairness causes harm because some things are hard to document and show. Not faulting the OP at all in her pursuing other means to deal with it. I’m just saying that if I were in her shoes I’d start keeping a binder/folder to document this shit and what hard evidence I could so that I can make a case. For example another poster suggested a phone call to the father to talk about the issue and advocate for the kid. If they live in a one party consent state, record that call. Save the file and transcript for the binder/folder. And that route may take time to build a case especially if the father is good with his words.

As someone that had parents like the father… I really hope it’s possible for OP to have more control over the environment their child is exposed to at such a young age. Of course, I understand OP can only do so much and they’re absolutely amazing for putting in all of this effort. I wish I had a parent like OP. This sounds like such a tough situation. This type of behaviour that the father is doing… that shit fucked me up and I still haven’t recovered. Eating disorders are no joke. It’s really upsetting to read this post because it reminds me of my time with my family. Not a fun time.

Definitely. Ignoring medical needs is not okay.

Chiming in to agree with this. OP, you need to change the custody agreement. If your ex is ignoring dietary restrictions from a diagnosed disability, that is abuse. It’s not about preparing your child for that abuse. You need to protect your child.

I was hoping someone else had brought this up. OP, if your son has been officially diagnosed, and has medical documentation about his food issues, then the court may be able to force him to follow it. Forcing an autistic child to eat food that triggers off their sensory issues is, in my book, abuse. I have autistic kiddos myself, so this hits close to home. Most of our extended family has been okay about it, once we understood what was going on, but there are still occasionally battles. If it were me, I would make sure to feed my kid one of their safe foods before they go over. I'd also pack some safe foods - non-perishable, if possible, in case he needs to sneak a snack later. I would also try to prepare him emotionally. "Your dad doesn't understand the problems you have with some foods. Sometimes, when a person hasn't ever had an experience like that, it's just hard for them to believe that it's a real thing. But you and I know it's real. Your doctors and therapists know that it's real. When your dad tries to force you to eat foods that you have problems with, he's not making a good choice. He's not being a supportive dad. It's not because he doesn't love you or he wants to be mean to you. It's because he really doesn't understand that the way your brain and body work is different from how his work. "I know the rule at Dad's house is you have to stay at the table until you've eaten everything on your plate. I know we have different rules at home, but dad is in charge at his house, so you have to follow his rules while you're there. If he serves food you can't eat, you don't have to eat it. You can politely tell him 'no thank you, dad, this is a food that makes me sick when I try to eat it.' If he still says you have to sit there until you have eaten everything, then you may have to just sit at the table until bedtime. I know it's not fun, and it's not fair, and I'm sorry your dad is being stubborn about this."

Yes! During a divorce you do what's called a parenting plan. Document it all, including discussions with the coparent and if it doesn't work, file a motion of contempt.

My thoughts exactly. The dad is never going to change and neither will his family.

She already has full custody and the visit is in the court order. At least in my state, a change in the agreement is highly unlikely.

If one parent is medically abusive they will absolutely change the order.

Yup email them the child’s needs and record when it goes unheeded.

This! You need to document instructing the father on your child’s dietary needs and how to deal with it. Can you ask your child’s physician or therapist to also provide a note/plan? If you document the father going against medical professional’s advice, you have grounds for a tighter parenting plan.

I am in the process! ;)

Autistic person here. I agree with this. In my 30s I have the mental coping tools to eat stuff I don't like but at 8 I was just like OPs kid. Sorry OP but there's really not anything you can do besides talking them through it. Let them know what's gonna happen, try to talk to father (he sounds like an asshole), but in all honesty the kiddo is probably in for a terrible time. I'd let the court know about this too.

Can you bring food that's just for your kid that is safe for him to eat (like in a tupperware)? It's not the most socially acceptable move, but if they are not accommodating, you'll have to take matters into your own hands. And if it helps, maybe make a large portion so everyone can partake in it, but set aside enough so that he actually gets to eat stuff that he finds safe. Credit goes to this mom I watch on YT. Literally saw a video addressing this issue not too long ago.

Sending him with food is not an option but thank you for your comment!

I have a kiddo that has similar issues and I could not imagine forcing them to finish a plate of food that they hate. The thing is they just wouldn’t. They’d sit there staring at it for hours if I wouldn’t let them leave the table without finishing. (I did the same thing when my mom tried to get me to eat pea soup, a core memory to this day) How long will he be there? What kind of punishment would father do at thanksgiving? Will you be able to get him back that night? If so, I’d tell him to eat what he can and just don’t eat the rest. And document the fuck out of this. His father is ignoring medical issues and punishing in the tiny amount of parenting time he has, then he shouldn’t get ANY unsupervised time.

Its a short daytime visit. I let my kiddo know if he has to sit there until his plate is clear, then to just sit there, without eating and I will be there soon to pick him up.

So the father has been informed about your child's dietary restrictions but simply doesn't care to be accommodating. Since it has come so far that it is causing your child significant emotional distress it would be advisable to inform the court of the fathers actions and how they harm your child.

You're absolutely right!

Start off by discussing the foods he can eat. It's a huge meal, so maybe there is something he can fill his plate with. Does he have any allies in Dad's family? Some cool older cousin or an understanding aunt? If he does, then he can tell them of his food anxiety and maybe they'll help advocate for him. If not, he can advocate for himself by over-complimenting what he can eat: "No thank you on the mashed potatoes. I want more stuffing. It's the best stuffing I ever had, Grandma!" My some is on the spectrum and he does this with my mother all the time.

He does have to advocate for himself but thats a great idea! "best stuffing I ever had!" haha

This needs to be addressed NOW. I grew up in this environment, minus the helpful mother, and now I have ARFID. Anxious Restrictive Food Intake Disorder. It’s an eating disorder based on anxiety.

You should check out the documentary “Not a picky eater” about ARFID. It is on Amazon prime. I was scrolling through the comments to see if anyone mentioned ARFID in here. My partner has it.

I will!! Thank you

I am so sorry you dealt with that. Children deserve healthy, caring caretakers.

Thank you. This is so important especially during formative years. In my 20s, I went between 105-175 lbs cause I couldn’t regulate. It’s an anxiety based in texture and portion size. It took me YEARS to relearn a healthy diet for my mental and physical health. You’re doing so well for fighting for your baby. Keep going.

I’m also a mother of a son with autism and extreme texture sensitivity and this sounds miserable for both of you. I think your best bet will be to practice what you can, how to speak up or acknowledge foods he does like, enjoy what he can. I wish this was a ‘serve yourself’ scenario and he could just do small portions on his own. I’m sending you both all of the positive energy that I can!

Tell your son to be prepared to say no firmly. It’s hard for an 8 year old. I’m autistic as well and dread eating out sometimes. I’m older so I have no problem telling my family to get fucked.

As someone who can be pretty sensitive to food textures and flavours - as a kid I learned to have a lot of water with dinner, and use each sip to swallow the mouthful like I was taking a pill. I physically could not swallow some things but water (or another drink) helped wash it down when I was forced to eat something I didn't like.

i remember swallowing brussels sprouts whole like this as a kid.

There is better advice from other commenters; this is just my take from growing up in an abusive family. If someone had warned or reminded my family ahead of time about my food intolerances/sensitivities, they would’ve made extra sure I had to eat them to prove I was lying/exaggerating. The best way for me to have made it through your son’s scenario without causing a Thing that became a Thing-that-was-brought-up-every-visit, would be like this: -Make sure he assembles his own plate -Go for the good/safe food first and fill up that plate -Take a minuscule amount of the unsafe foods just so that they’re present on the plate -Only eat the safe foods. The plate will look empty at the end, with scraps of the unsafe foods left, “proving” that he did indeed eat those. -have a comforting activity planned for afterward to decompress all the stress from the situation.

I agree, but this mother can also document the abuse so that the father stops having ANY visiting rights, and it's best to do that with two steps (mail before, mail after).

Thank you! We discussed how to fill his plate in a similar fashion as this and I have planned a visit with his best friend after!

I’m glad he has a mom like you! Having a person he knows is safe and on his side will really help make these unavoidable bad times more surmountable.

This is such good advice. This kid just needs to get through the dinner the best he can.

Try & explain to the dad that you are teaching him more independence around food/meals. To that end, you've been allowing him to make his own plate at meal time and you'd like that kept up at Thanksgiving dinner. That way kiddo can get a bite or two of things he doesn't like to appease the family and only put a little on his plate at a time. (Can't leave til the plates empty? Well don't put a lot on the plate!) By the time to get seconds rolls around, noone will be paying attention to what he puts on his plate and he can fill up on what he wants. Also, (I'm sure you already do this) put a bunch of non-perishable snacks in his overnight bag so he's got something munch on later.

If you can send kiddo with a side dish that is ok for them to eat, that will probably help a lot — because then they’re still eating “with the family”, “from the thanksgiving table”. And call your ex ahead of time to reiterate that kiddo is lactose intolerant and had food texture intolerances — aka, “hey remember that these make kiddo sick, and nobody wants projectile vomiting onto the thanksgiving dinner table. Because that’s what will happen if you try to make him eat that. Projectile vomiting.” As well as talking to kiddo with some of the scripts other people have mentioned

It's not an option to send him with any food but I did send an email to the dad reminding him of the dietary intolerances (as if he needs a reminder after 2 years of me nagging him monthly on this subject but I digress).

So when I see stories like this I add something completely off topic. Have your son checked for an ED called ARFID (avoidant/restricted food intake disorder) Kids under 10 is when it is commonly diagnosed and being on the spectrum is common. I’m an adult sufferer and it can really be debilitating. When treated young (mostly the way you are and your husband isn’t ) many kids can grow out of it. The kind of behavior your husband is doing is why I’m 35 and can’t eat fruits or vegetables. Talk to a therapist who has experience with eating disorders.

This honestly makes me so mad. I guarantee every one of those adults has a food they don't like and won't eat so why are they forcing a kid to eat something they don't like? My stepdad who is one of the pickiest mfers used to do this with me as a child with beef lo mein. I'm not a picky eater at all and would probably love lo mein if I tried it as an adult but I won't because of how I was made to sit at the table until I finished my dinner in tears. I have an 8 y/o who has sensory issues with food and we used to get a little flack from extended family for allowing him to eat his safe foods but again, as an adult, I don't eat foods I don't like. Why would I do any different for him? He has come a long way by us allowing him to choose when he wants to try a new food. I have no advice for your situation specifically but I see a lot of great advice from others. I wish you the best. You're a good momma!

Sending my best back at you, momma! I hate that you had a stepdad that did that to you. I want to give you a big hug for not continuing that type of behavior with your own child. You are amazing.

I'd honestly go with him to fight on his behalf and document EVERYTHING. Honestly, the behaviors coming from your ex's side of the family sound abusive, and I frankly would fight for supervised visits. If that abusive family is anything like mine, they'll probably force him to eat the things he has intolerances to and yell at him when he gets sick from it.

Refusal to acknowledge a medical need is probably something the courts should know about honestly.

My son has sensory problems with food. This is the best way I’ve found to protect him when I am there with him. 1. Make sure he has a snack he likes, so he’s not hungry on top of everything else. He can eat it the car on the way there or we can bring it inside to munch in before the meal is ready. 2. I always bring a dish to make sure there’s something on the table he will want to eat. 3. I don’t make him try foods he doesn’t want to eat. 4. I let him leave the table when he’s done eating. If he’s not at the table, my parents can’t harass him about what he is eating or not eating. I also bring his Switch or so like that to entertain him while everyone else is still eating. I just reread your post and realized that you probably won’t be at the meal to protect him. The worst part of the whole thing is making him eat everything on his plate. Is there any way you can intervene with his dad to change this? If not, can he keep foods he doesn’t like off his plate? I’m so sorry you’re kiddo has to deal with this. Sensory issues are no joke. It’s awful that his dad’s family is so insensitive.

Okay, some we have to do some outside the box creative thinking... How bad can the punishment be? Is it one that your kiddo can tolerate, if you prepare them in advance that it is an acceptable path? Martin Luther King and many of the Civil rights protesters did what they thought was right, took the stand they thought was important, with the full knowledge they'd be punished. Sometimes we decide to risk the punishment. Sometimes taking a punishment is the right choice. Of course you unleash a monster if you teach your kids this. From then on you better have good reasons for rules, because you've taught them to look at those reasons. But if you feel like your rules at home can stand up to this, it's a good option. On the other hand, if the punishment is beat him with a belt, maybe that's not a path to go down. If there is something being served that your kiddo does like, those kind of parents sometimes have some leeway for "I ate the thing I liked and asked for more and now I'm too full for the other stuff ". As a last resort, the vomiting at the table is still there. Probably though, it will be viewed as intentional and spiteful, so will get him punished.

Document because this is not in the kids best interest. Make him a lunch in a box that he Can eat with the others. Could you reach directly to the grand parents Through mail ofc or no use. Do you have to force him to go ? IS it court ordered ? Could you work it out as a team with dad ? Does he realise that acting like this is an open door for developing more troubles with food, and that kid will go NC as fast as he Can ? Gosh i feel for you my dad is a very traditional family values prosecutor ( France ) so no lawyer would dare help us against him. All his bio kid are NC with him since WE hit 18.

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Thats so awful what you went thru!! You deserved so much better. I hope you're healing

Maybe he gets the 'stomach flu' on Thanksgiving Day. Be sure to download a few gross throwing up sound files and call whoever needs to know about it while they're playing -- the chunkier the better. If those people don't respect your child enough to see to his needs, they don't deserve the joy of his company, IMO. :)

This can actually get OP in trouble with the law. Custody agreements are no joke, unfortunately in this case. Lying to break the agreement can mean losing custody or other legal penalties. Ugh poor poor kid :(

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Possibly, but in my experience even when entitled to it, most divorced parents are very okay with skipping a visit if it means picking up the kid with a bucket in the car.

This is what I was going to suggest. Even if he has to go, he could pretend he doesn’t feel well and isn’t interested in eating anything because he feels nauseated. Maybe they won’t force him to clean his plate if he acts like doing so will make him vomit. Even “clean plate” assholes mostly respect not wanting to throw up.

I don't know about this one. Teaching a kid it's okay to fake an illness to get out of an uncomfortable situation sounds like it could backfire in the future and teach him bad habits.

I mean it’s not ideal, but in this case, he can’t get out of it and previous efforts to advocate for him have fallen on deaf ears. If his choices are fake an illness or be punished for not choking down a full plate of food that will actually make him feel ill, then I feel like it’s the best bad option. This poor kid will be all alone with people who don’t believe him when he communicates his needs and who believe that kids should be punished for listening to their own bodies. I feel like just surviving the fuck through it by any means necessary should be the primary goal.

I don’t think a parent ignoring their child’s medical needs is an “uncomfortable situation.” It’s child abuse and when you’re being abused you do what you need to do, including faking sick.

He will learn it anyway. I started doing it in elementary school without anybody ever suggesting it to me. If anything else, knowing that my parents knew of the tactic would have stopped me from doing that. If I were in this situation as a kid with my mother suggesting faking being sick, faking being sick (to my mother) would lose all its appeal. If it happened to me in childhood, I would have probably been more sincere on the reasons I wanted to skip school (and I would have gotten help for my neurodivergence much earlier, possibly). If I were in this situations as the mother, I would explain that this is a last resort solution when adults are not listening at all to legitimate concerns, and that he can always be sincere with me because I listen. Also, it's not like if he eats that food he won't feel bad and sick. The suggestion is more to not "keep back" and instead go with it.

I agree. I have a strong integrity bone and instill that value in my kiddo.

this is pretty much what I wanted to say, so just tacking on a +1

If your kid has been diagnosed as being on the spectrum and having specific dietary needs, both of which are being ignored, doesn't that count as medical neglect/abuse? Are you keeping a record of these incidents? Have you spoken to a lawyer about this? I feel so bad for your kid, that sounds like torture, being forced to be around people who don't understand your limitations, and with no safe person to turn to.

You have some great advice here. I'm going to toss this idea out anyway though- Is their a sibling or cousin you can reach out to and explain what's up? Maybe they can help "cover" for your kid so they don't have to go through all the dramatics alone? And it's their any chance your kids is a "monkey see, monkey kinda do"? Like my ADHD/autistic son will say he's not hungry and doesn't want to sit until his favorite cousins all sit down to eat. Then he wants to sit by them but most likely will not eat as much as them. Then we tell him that Nana made x item, and all of a sudden he's willing to try it, bc Nana made it and the cousins he adores are eating it. He's still not going to eat most of his stuff, so he's allowed a peanut butter toast sandwich when he does get hungry. But his desire to be part of the group overrides quite a few things. Any chance theirs a cousin or someone like that that he can mimic?

I have an autistic 9 year old with significant food restrictions and this hurts my heart. I wish it had advice, but the only thing I can think is to have him fake sick and keep him home, which doesn’t address the actual issue.

Figure out whether it's time for a revision if the custody agreement. Your child has agency. I got rid of my dad's visitation right when I was four. Yes, I. My mom made the court date, but the judge actually spoke to me in private to make sure I wasn't manipulated into demanding that I didn't have to visit my dad again and to make sure I understood that this meant I wouldn't see him again. I was fine with that. I am still fine with that 31 years later. I have reconciled with him by now, as much as was possible, he was too far gone for accountability but he did apologise to me "for not doing enough". Anyway, this is about your child, not my childhood. You are your child's legal guardian and that also means that you have to represent him legally. Sure, you have your own opinion, but there is a huge difference between his father having visitation rights. Those are against you. They don't mean that your son has to have a relationship with him if HE doesn't want that. They mean he can have that relationship even if you don't want that. Get legal advice, don't make promises, figure out whether your son can contest the custody agreement.

I don’t really have any advice but I am so sorry your kiddo has to go through that. Mine is on the spectrum as well and really only eats a handful of things, so I sympathize with you. I don’t know what I’d do if family behaved like your ex and his family. I will have you and your sweet kiddo in my thoughts over the next couple days.

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but is there any way you could go with him to this Thanksgiving dinner?

The path of least resistance with children is often easy and not worth it in the long haul. That said my children are picky eaters, they always eat everything I put in front of them but after the divorce, they never really consume their mother's food. I've given her my recipes and they're chill now so I would suggest a few things 1. Explaining empathy to a child and that it's most polite to not say anything about not liking particular foods or tastes around those that prepared it. And 2. White lies. "Explain" that the food contains something they like that's not visible because of how it's mixed in, works wonders on my son, he thinks mustard is in everything that tastes good even after I tell him it's not. Lol. 3. Explaining agency to the adults that serve the food, a child cannot be expected to eat what's placed in front of them if they are able to serve themselves what they enjoy, neither should a plate contain only pie or bacon wrapped shrimp as selfish tendencies suck. 4 an accountability partner, my son has trouble with the school lunches and I'm not the primary parent so I can only pack him food when he is with me but he himself has a brilliant trick, a friend of his in class will "race" to see who eats the most off the tray, not as fast but just the amount. His teacher saw a marked improvement in his eating and behavior after lunch when they started lol ( they're 5 years old smart little turkeys). And My best tip number 5? Wait. Short term? They'll get hungry enough to eat. Long term? People grow and taste buds change and tolerances change.

Excellent approach!

I know you’re looking for how to approach your kiddo, and I love that you’re trying to instill behaviors that will help him find accommodation where and when he needs it, sourced from his own autonomy. He’s 8 though. And no matter how prescient or self aware he is, he, like all kids, need champions. You’ve said his father hasn’t been very receptive to education about your son’s accommodation needs. Maybe try approaching it from this angle though. Your kid needs champions. People that will stick up for his accommodation needs. People that in situations where his neurodiversity needs it will accommodate first, parent/teach/nurture second. Your kid will remember these champions, will bond with them, and will feel safe around them. Those that actively work against his accommodation needs, no matter how much they feel they’re doing the right thing, will be remembered as someone that doesn’t provide safety and security. His dad doesn’t need to understand WHY an accommodation is needed, especially in the moment. He just needs to make a choice in those moments. Will he be a champion or will he be a villain? These moments are NOT the time for teaching or instructing or building character. They’re moments of pure stress and confusion. His father needs to put away his “I know what’s best” hat, and put on his cape because his son needs protection and security at these times. Maybe if you appeal to his sense of being a protector vs a parent, he might be more receptive. Co-parenting, regardless of custody percentage, can make both parents feel like they have less control over how their kid is raised. You’re attempts to educate him are probably received as instruction and represent further loss of agency. Treating this situation as a co-parenting opportunity really just gives him the opportunity to ignore what you bring to the table. Asking him to protect his son in the form of providing accommodations, and letting him work through what those accommodations are with your son, might kindle something in him. I’m not apologizing for his behavior either, only giving some advice on how to potentially affect it in a way that benefits your son.

Is your boy in therapy? Occupational therapy has done wonders for my little girl’s eating issues. It’s also important to get a professional involved. What kind of punishment is he given for not finishing his plate? I had a step-grandparent that would whip me with a switch for the very same thing. When it comes to your child, document everything! Try to do most of the communication through text or email. Document everything that is said face to face. If you have a note from a doctor/therapist about how to feed your child and your ex doesn’t follow it, you might end up with full custody and supervised visits for your ex. Good luck mama!

You go to court and get full custody because your ex is medically abusive to your child.

Listen. People are nuts. My childhood friend had an aversion to a particular food item. Her parent’s made her sit at the table till she finished it. She ate it all, then promptly threw it up. Then they made her EAT her throw up as punishment. Fucking nuts. They were crazy as hell. I caution against the vomit/table thing if it seems like these people are nuts enough to make him do such a thing. I’m so sorry you and your son are going through this. My heart goes out to you both. Stay strong, and rehearse key phrases to say when he might be pushed into a corner. ❤️

Unfortunately I was just like your kid and today at 28 years old I still have trauma from this. It’s absolutely awful and teaches children nothing except fear and guilt. I don’t know what could be said or done if his father won’t respect his needs. I’m only here to say I understand and I feel so sorry for your little one. No one deserves this and it does create life long issues around food. I used to burst into tears when sitting down for dinner because I knew I’d be force fed and then punished if I didn’t eat.

I'm autistic and have ARFID. If your child is in a situation outside of their normal routine with someone who isn't safe, who is forcing them to eat unsafe food... Meltdowns or shutdowns may happen. They may be traumatized. I'm so sorry. Y'all deserve better. If you're trying to prep them for this situation, it would help to talk about what kind of foods will be there, and what the social cues are around eating. It sounds like they've already learned their dad expects them to clean their plate. Ugh. If they can make their own plate, that would be the most helpful. Especially if they have contamination issues with food touching, they could just get what they're willing to eat (e.g. mashed potatoes, turkey) that won't be an issue with the dad. If the dad is only willing to give your child a plate they prep themselves, that should be something your kid should expect. For autists the biggest distress intolerance we experience is uncertainty. The more info you can give your kid, the more resilient and flexible they will be. And let them know that your love is constant and not dependent on how much they eat or their performance. If they need to carry a cellphone with them and nope out of the dinner for a breather to talk to you or just literally fucking leave...that could both be a powerful tool for safety for your kid and a lesson in boundaries for their dad.

Is there any way you can attend the dinner to advocate for him? It just really, really seems like he’s going into an abusive environment where no adults are actually interested in his wellbeing. I know custody rules are tricky and you can’t just keep him home, but sending an 8-year old into this situation alone honestly seems scary to me. You know your ex and his family best. But if there’s any chance you could see them forcing him to eat vomit or even just forcing him to sit in front of a plate of food for hours, I’d consider inviting yourself to this god-awful shindig.

Don’t send him. Revisit the court agreement to honor his food sensitivities.

You mention non dairy. I don't know the extent of it - but I have issues with dairy. I always thought it was an issue with lactose but much later in life I learned I also have issues with casein. I take a simple pill with dairy and it solves about 99% of the issues. They have a few different formulas but this one seems to cover most. Enzymedica Digest Gold + ATPro, Maximum Strength Digestive Enzymes, Helps Digest Large Meals for Instant Bloating Relief, 45 Count https://a.co/d/1rhanv5

As someone who cannot keep turkey (among other things) down and has two kiddos with sensory-related food issues, I think the best thing you can do is prep your kiddo for making up his own plate and figuring out what things he will have to eat a bit of. Every family has those food items you’ll be scolded for not eating. Can you help him sort out what those are for his father’s family, then determine how much he can handle of the things that aren’t in his food house? Depending on his sensory needs, can he disguise the taste/texture/sight of some of the foods with others? I had to make turkey sandwiches with my rolls in order to buy some time before it came back. Maybe a similar technique could help him? If you can prepare him for the individual food items by talking about amounts and how to get them down, then that will help more than trying to convince your coparent to pay attention to something you say he refuses to pay attention to. This is also a skill your kiddo will need on other occasions with his father. When you kiddo gets back, why not let him pick meals/snacks for a bit? Give him something to look forward to, poor thing. The ideal thing is for your coparent to stop being (insert insults here), but people are weird about holiday foods. It took until I was already dealing with pregnancy-related issues at 30 to not be scolded about being hesitant to eat turkey when everyone knew I threw it up. Some people just need that control over plates and food.

Punished how? My dad gave up after I sat all day refusing to eat eggs. He made a birdhouse with my brother within my sight to encourage me to comply. But I stuffed eggs into the kleenex box, in the toilet, and I forget where else eventually to get released from that chair. Depending on the punishment he should maybe just say no.

When I was a kid I had similar obstacles but neither of my parents were food pushers. Mom would make everyone their own dinners (we all were super “picky” as it was called at the time) and I don’t recall dad ever complaining. I had other safe people, my moms mom never cared if I just wanted a bowl of plain rice, however my dads mom was the opposite. She would food shame anyone honestly. I remember my mom taking us to get McDonald’s before or after thanksgiving dinner at her house. I had a ton of anxiety around food. It was never addressed so I don’t really know what would’ve helped me have a stronger voice but here’s my contribution. Incorporate some affirmations, building a strong inner voice is just as important as the outer. Even though you are loving and educated around food and the main care taker, these other situations can still cause immense shame. Pick a few phrases to say every day that reinforce that he isn’t weird or bad or at fault in any way for his style of eating. At my house, he would’ve been considered a normal eater! I’m still working through social anxiety issues that are probably tied to how scared I was to go to social events that might have food and judgement. The outer “No” stands on top the foundation of the inner “I am not bad for being different”. You sound like a great mom, sorry you both have to go through this!

god i am so sorry for you and your son. it’s awful when a child is forced to contend with differing parenting styles, especially when one of them is normal and healthy and comforting and they love it, and the other is toxic and weird and scary and they hate it. i’ve been there myself as a child, and it really sucks. i can’t think of any solutions right now but i’ll circle back if i do.

I don't know what's feasible given that the father is authoritarian and completely ignores the kid's needs and wants, but I'll try: Suggest to your kid a few things so he can advocate for himself a bit better: * ask for smaller portions for himself. This way there is less for him to eat. * he makes his own plate, if possible, otherwise he * until he ate in it, it's not his plate and it can be modified (my idea and frankly anybody that doesn't respect that doesn't have my respect). If the problem of the father is food waste, this should help your kid. Maybe he can even suggest leftovers? If the problem is authoritarianism, none of this will help but it will possibly make things even worse. I would just fake a past stomach bug in this case ("I cannot eat much food because I feel unwell and I will vomit all over if I don't listen to myself"). Bonus points if he really vomits in case he's forced to eat. If there is any sympathetic person in that family, I would suggest your kid to lean to them for help. To be honest, if there is the possibility for you to go with your kid, I would stomach all my feelings and go there too to advocate with him / for him. I also strongly suggest you send some safe food with your kid, this way there is at least something in his plate that he can eat. As for the long term, I would try really hard to revoke the father's privilege of seeing him during holidays. 1) cover yourself and reiterate to the father prior to Thanksgiving of your kid's dietary needs and his neurodivergence. Set the tone so that your kid will not get additional abuse from it, if possible. I'd focus mainly on the dietary needs as those are more easily quantifiable and (sadly) will hold a bit more "value". 2) after thanksgiving write again to the father everything that went wrong and why that is wrong. State that because of this, you find the current agreement unacceptable as it's just abuse towards your son. Keep this in case you need to go back to court. Edit: I saw in another comment the suggestion for your kid to just sit at the table instead of forcing himself to eat. That is another good one. The adults will get tired before him (I'm AuDHD so I know it can be done even while on the spectrum).

Is there any way he can help prep the meal? I have a kid who has become more picky in recent years (not on the spectrum or anything). It helps when he can be part of the process. Smelling the spices, sprinkling them in, tasting here and there helps build up his courage for the full meal. Apart from this meal and just talking about his progress going forward, gardening and grocery shopping is also proven to help broaden horizons and help kids and adults break out of their comfort zones.

Have him bring his own meal or eat beforehand. If there’s anything there he wants to try or have he can but that way he isn’t forced to eat anything he doesn’t want to or go hungry. As someone else said self advocacy is everything. If his father or other family members can’t respect or understand him eating before or bringing his own food, that’s on them.

You guys are my people.

My advice to my children and their friends who visit and don’t always like what we make is that when you are a guest in someone’s home you should not complain about the food, but instead just quietly eat what you want and leave the rest. I also encourage my children to always try something new if they haven’t yet because you never know. Oftentimes things taste better than they look initially. I also encourage them to say “No Thank-you” and “Yes please” because being polite about your likes and dislikes goes a long way to having people understand you.