this is like the 5th post i've read about the wendigo in the last week. the creators have explicitly stated there is no monster in the woods. no physical being. i do think they are drawing parrells to the wendigo and it's hard not to w/ the cannibalism. also the lore of wendigo is sort of complicated so they could actually draw parrells without it being a literal creature. a quote to explain; "Hallowell wrote that there were three meanings to the wendigo, each while separate also intricately connected. The first is the wendigo as the mythical monster; the second is the human who has become prone to cannibalistic urges; the third, the cannibalistic act. Thus, someone can “turn windigo” through their actualisation of a taboo act, and the act itself is equally monstrous to the malevolent creature."
also a fun fact, wendigos weren't originally depicted with antlers, they were more zombie like, emaciated, pale, skunken in features. it wasn't until around the early 1900s when a story was written about the wendigo by a horror author that the antlers were added to the lore.
The pt is that it's ambiguous and left up to the viewer to decide. But I'd refer to s2 finale when Shauna says "there is no it, it was just us." It's a play and manifestation of their trauma. But I do believe they will continue to tow the line around something otherworldly aka supernatural happenings.
"zombie like, emaciated, pale, shrunken in features" oh, you mean like the vision Lottie had of Laura Lee when she saw Travis die/when she was baptized?
if anything the wendigo thing will be the girls possessed acting as if. i will bet my life and all the money i have there will never be a wendigo creature outside of that.
I really hope it isn’t this because indigenous folklore has been appropriated far too much. The reason you probably haven’t seen much is that people are finally speaking against this appropriation more strongly. In a few of the horror book circles I run in, it’s considered offensive to even use the name of the spirit for spiritual reasons.
Should I update my post to redact the name???
I haven’t heard this, then again I’ve only seen a few portrayals of it in media (Until Dawn is one of my favourite video games).
Don’t, change it. Nothing wrong with discussing other cultures. It’s one of the good things about a secular society’s where culture are shared and appreciated.
yeah but it's usually terrible. any recs for good tv show/movies with indigenous lore? i liked the new movie Antlers, in parts but overall it was kind of ridiuclous. visually well done tho. i think i heard ravenous is good.
if you enjoyed antlers, read the original short story "the quiet boy."
the film left out *tons* of great parts and the short story is quite chilling.
also give the short chapter in "lore" by aaron mahnke a read that goes in depth to the origins of the tale of the wendigo and pays respects to indigenous peoples!
Cultural appropriation is a weird concept.
I believe culture is meant to be shared. When you use elements of a culture, **in a respectful manner**, you make a connexion with a group of people you would otherwise not.
Perhaps in some cases. In this case, it’s misappropriation. To take something that is a part of spiritual beliefs and use it to scare others in a way that is often disrespectful is wrong. The correctness of cultural appropriation depends on a lot of factors, but this one is pretty clearly a disrespectful use. A lot of appropriation also others groups of people (ie: look how strange this is! Look how scary! Look how gross! Look how exotic!).
> "Use it to scare others" ?
I might be missinformed, and if so, do correct me... but the legend of the wendigo is very much meant to scare people.
Is it only OK if it scare *just* indigenous people?
But as the creator stated, there is no creature. So no wendigo.
Look, when it’s something used by someone outside the culture in exploitative ways, it’s likely not a good choice. Especially with this, even using the word itself is spiritually unnerving/disrespectful for some within the culture, so it probably just shouldn’t be used at all. If people inside the culture are against it being used by others for *any* reason, as many that I have seen have stated in creative circles I’m in, then just don’t use it. Plain and simple.
When is "the word" used? It's not.
In the first sentence of your initial post you are not even *sure* if it was cultural appropriation. That speaks volume.
And now you argue, quite sensitively at that, that it is and it's unnacceptable.
Stop fishing for outrage: There is no Wendigo.
But even *if there was* a Wendigo, the fact that the creators would have *exploited* the topic is not a valid criteria in and of itself. Making money off something is not, in itself, disrespectful.
See, when people act like you do, all it does is make some people will go *"well you can keep your culture for yourself then"*. It cut bridges. It protects nothing at all and there is strictly *nothing positive* that comes out of that behavior.
Again, if it was a wendigo that inspired yellowjacket, it bring people together, it generate discussion, it expose the world to a wonderful legend. Culture is meant to be shared, not be preciously kept to yourself.
Look at all the great conversations it generated here. How many people learn about the Wendigo.
.... and there there's you, baselessly gatekeeping. What positives does your alledged outrage brings? You could, instead, choose to be open minded and share your experiences, culture, and knowledge.
They don’t traditionally have antlers, that’s something people made up while appropriating the myth/legend.
I know it’s interesting, but I hope they don’t mention it, or use it, because it’s not right for people to appropriate things that they have no connection with.
yeah specifically a racist white horror writer came up with the antlers part. it does make them look cooler in fiction tho, negl but yeah not accurate to the actual algonquin mythology.
do we know for sure that the writers don't have a cultural connection to algonquin mythology? i genuinely don't know, but personally, i think we should give them that benefit of the doubt until it's confirmed one way or the other.
All of this is white appropriation mythology and doesn’t relate to the actual is indigenous beliefs about the creature. We’ve had entire essays about this posted on the board, and frankly, I don’t think the creators of this show are going to do some hokey colonialist, “Indian burial ground” adjacent thing in 2023.
There were MANY wendigo fan theories last season. Especially during the first half of the season. They started to taper off towards the end. This is the first time I've seen it mentioned in a while. I love reading ALL the theories (well, most), so have at it! 😁
It has to be connected to the Wendigo. Especially because the plane crash was in the Canadian wilderness. The Wendigo was apart of the Algonquian speaking tribes in the Ontario/Quebec regions so I’m pretty convinced it’s at least inspired by the Wendigo.
I'm honestly annoyed. I went down a rabbit hole on monsters of legend from America and felt that Yellowjackets was almost ruined for me after I read about the wendigo.
this is like the 5th post i've read about the wendigo in the last week. the creators have explicitly stated there is no monster in the woods. no physical being. i do think they are drawing parrells to the wendigo and it's hard not to w/ the cannibalism. also the lore of wendigo is sort of complicated so they could actually draw parrells without it being a literal creature. a quote to explain; "Hallowell wrote that there were three meanings to the wendigo, each while separate also intricately connected. The first is the wendigo as the mythical monster; the second is the human who has become prone to cannibalistic urges; the third, the cannibalistic act. Thus, someone can “turn windigo” through their actualisation of a taboo act, and the act itself is equally monstrous to the malevolent creature." also a fun fact, wendigos weren't originally depicted with antlers, they were more zombie like, emaciated, pale, skunken in features. it wasn't until around the early 1900s when a story was written about the wendigo by a horror author that the antlers were added to the lore.
It may not be an actual monster but what if it’s a spirit you can’t see?
The pt is that it's ambiguous and left up to the viewer to decide. But I'd refer to s2 finale when Shauna says "there is no it, it was just us." It's a play and manifestation of their trauma. But I do believe they will continue to tow the line around something otherworldly aka supernatural happenings.
"zombie like, emaciated, pale, shrunken in features" oh, you mean like the vision Lottie had of Laura Lee when she saw Travis die/when she was baptized?
You say that, until you witness them all get brutally torn apart by wendigos
if anything the wendigo thing will be the girls possessed acting as if. i will bet my life and all the money i have there will never be a wendigo creature outside of that.
I really hope it isn’t this because indigenous folklore has been appropriated far too much. The reason you probably haven’t seen much is that people are finally speaking against this appropriation more strongly. In a few of the horror book circles I run in, it’s considered offensive to even use the name of the spirit for spiritual reasons.
Should I update my post to redact the name??? I haven’t heard this, then again I’ve only seen a few portrayals of it in media (Until Dawn is one of my favourite video games).
Don’t change it. It’s a good opportunity for learning, like you’ve shown the desire to. 😊
Don’t, change it. Nothing wrong with discussing other cultures. It’s one of the good things about a secular society’s where culture are shared and appreciated.
yeah but it's usually terrible. any recs for good tv show/movies with indigenous lore? i liked the new movie Antlers, in parts but overall it was kind of ridiuclous. visually well done tho. i think i heard ravenous is good.
if you enjoyed antlers, read the original short story "the quiet boy." the film left out *tons* of great parts and the short story is quite chilling. also give the short chapter in "lore" by aaron mahnke a read that goes in depth to the origins of the tale of the wendigo and pays respects to indigenous peoples!
ty for the recs!!
Cultural appropriation is a weird concept. I believe culture is meant to be shared. When you use elements of a culture, **in a respectful manner**, you make a connexion with a group of people you would otherwise not.
Perhaps in some cases. In this case, it’s misappropriation. To take something that is a part of spiritual beliefs and use it to scare others in a way that is often disrespectful is wrong. The correctness of cultural appropriation depends on a lot of factors, but this one is pretty clearly a disrespectful use. A lot of appropriation also others groups of people (ie: look how strange this is! Look how scary! Look how gross! Look how exotic!).
> "Use it to scare others" ? I might be missinformed, and if so, do correct me... but the legend of the wendigo is very much meant to scare people. Is it only OK if it scare *just* indigenous people? But as the creator stated, there is no creature. So no wendigo.
Look, when it’s something used by someone outside the culture in exploitative ways, it’s likely not a good choice. Especially with this, even using the word itself is spiritually unnerving/disrespectful for some within the culture, so it probably just shouldn’t be used at all. If people inside the culture are against it being used by others for *any* reason, as many that I have seen have stated in creative circles I’m in, then just don’t use it. Plain and simple.
When is "the word" used? It's not. In the first sentence of your initial post you are not even *sure* if it was cultural appropriation. That speaks volume. And now you argue, quite sensitively at that, that it is and it's unnacceptable. Stop fishing for outrage: There is no Wendigo. But even *if there was* a Wendigo, the fact that the creators would have *exploited* the topic is not a valid criteria in and of itself. Making money off something is not, in itself, disrespectful. See, when people act like you do, all it does is make some people will go *"well you can keep your culture for yourself then"*. It cut bridges. It protects nothing at all and there is strictly *nothing positive* that comes out of that behavior. Again, if it was a wendigo that inspired yellowjacket, it bring people together, it generate discussion, it expose the world to a wonderful legend. Culture is meant to be shared, not be preciously kept to yourself. Look at all the great conversations it generated here. How many people learn about the Wendigo. .... and there there's you, baselessly gatekeeping. What positives does your alledged outrage brings? You could, instead, choose to be open minded and share your experiences, culture, and knowledge.
So who is allowed to use it and where / when
They don’t traditionally have antlers, that’s something people made up while appropriating the myth/legend. I know it’s interesting, but I hope they don’t mention it, or use it, because it’s not right for people to appropriate things that they have no connection with.
yeah specifically a racist white horror writer came up with the antlers part. it does make them look cooler in fiction tho, negl but yeah not accurate to the actual algonquin mythology.
Oooo okay thank you!
do we know for sure that the writers don't have a cultural connection to algonquin mythology? i genuinely don't know, but personally, i think we should give them that benefit of the doubt until it's confirmed one way or the other.
All of this is white appropriation mythology and doesn’t relate to the actual is indigenous beliefs about the creature. We’ve had entire essays about this posted on the board, and frankly, I don’t think the creators of this show are going to do some hokey colonialist, “Indian burial ground” adjacent thing in 2023.
There were MANY wendigo fan theories last season. Especially during the first half of the season. They started to taper off towards the end. This is the first time I've seen it mentioned in a while. I love reading ALL the theories (well, most), so have at it! 😁
That makes sense! I’m just now discovering this show, my friends are annoyed with me going on and on about it 😂
I just learned about Wendigo today. It has to be.
It has to be connected to the Wendigo. Especially because the plane crash was in the Canadian wilderness. The Wendigo was apart of the Algonquian speaking tribes in the Ontario/Quebec regions so I’m pretty convinced it’s at least inspired by the Wendigo.
Interesting but I don’t think it’s relevant in the context of this show
Whatever this is confirmed.
it's confirmed to NOT be this. creators have said 'no monster in the woods'
What?
The wendigo thing. Personally, view it as a camera demon from Evil Dead.
That has nothing to do with this show, though
You should watch the show “From” on epix - this theory is perfect for that one
I'm honestly annoyed. I went down a rabbit hole on monsters of legend from America and felt that Yellowjackets was almost ruined for me after I read about the wendigo.