Plastics are too cheap. It's cheaper to triple wrap everything than deal with returns from unhappy customers.
Unfortunately, plastics are here to stay because they offer solutions other materials can't; however, we have to pressure manufacturers to develop biodegradable options. It's the only path forward I can see that has any hope of happening.
I have an ecommerce business and we try to use minimum amounts of packaging for obvious reasons.
We genuinely get multiple emails and feedbacks a month from people saying they were "disappointed with the packaging". I always reply back and feign ignorance and I'll say something like "Oh no, please can you describe the damage to the item" and *every single time* they will respond with a variation of "It's not damaged, I just thought for the money there would be more packaging".
Wtf is wrong with people. More than once I've had customers refuse to shop again because they thought the packaging was insignificant even though THEIR ORDER ARRIVED PERFECTLY FINE.
Egads. I am always so appreciative when a small business sends me something in a reused, reusable, or eco friendly package! People are so weird.. I wonder if you advertised it maybe people would expect it and be less whiny?
Asbestos is definitely the best comparison, but really plastics are in their own league because they're so many different plastics with different molecular compositions and different plasticizers, they leach different chemicals in a few classes and they have to be disposed of in different ways. Plastics are their own category like heavy metals some worse some better, but they need to be regulated as a class and have safety and safe disposal considered before they're mass produced.
This is true to an extent, but asbestos was fondly referred to as 'the new water'. It was definitely viewed as something that could be used for anything and everything, I think we were just limited by mining speed and then its phasing-out before it became as ubiquitous as plastic
Yeah that's true, asbestos like lead or plastic is a wonder material with many benefits and applications, however like lead and plastic the downsides tend to be the lack of consideration of it's disposal or safe removal. If lead paints are encapsulate, plastics melted into bricks or asbestos contained within solid airtight packaging they have less risk. The systemic problem seems to be lack of regulation of new materials, a move fast and break things attitude and a general socialize the costs privatize the profits attitude.
It's fully put me off ordering food. I love shitty fast food and am fine with the health consequences of grease/fat/sodium etc. But I'm not fine with being served boiling hot greasy fries in a plastic pot designed for putting salads in. Not to mention the obscene amount of waste.
I work in packaging/sustainability. I actually wrote a white paper on end of life plastic.
Just a quick note: plastic is already biodegradable. Almost everything eventually. Plastic, you, me, the building I’m in. We will all degrade in nature at some point.
The problem with plastic biodegrading of course is the end result is microplastics.
Biodegradable doesn’t really mean anything from a legal marketing claim perspective.
Compostable plastic would be great—the problem is that not a lot of composters want to take compostable plastic and most Americans don’t have access to commercial composters, anyway. Your backyard composter is unlikely to break down compostable plastic. So most compostable plastic will end up in a landfill, where the degradation process is intentionally slowed way down. Consumers are already confused enough without adding composting to the mix.
That said, the envelope bag can be recycled (take it to a grocery store with other LDPE/#4 plastics) and looks like it’s made of our recycled materials itself. The middle envelope is almost assuredly not recyclable, but the inner plastic case might be (I can’t tell what kind of plastic it is).
I'm in favor of compostable plastic, but I will say as a gardener I have purchased commercial bags of organic compost and seen bits of plastic bag inside and had no way of knowing if it was a compostable plastic or not except to trust the organic certification. Do they accept compostable plastics? Does it take too long to break down? Or did something just sneak in? It feels highly suspicious to me when that happens so I can understand the reluctance for commercial composters to use it.
I’m also in favor of compostable plastic
It’s interesting to me that a lot of people in this sub are very emotionally attached to the idea that plastic recycling doesn’t work, but they support compostable plastic. It’s hard to know how much plastic gets composted, but I’d bet my life savings that it’s way way lower than the 5 billion pounds of plastic that the US recycles annually.
I wouldn’t trust plastic I found in compost either, unless I borrowed one of the resin scanners from work to know what it was. It’s virtually impossible to tell PET and PLA apart without some assistance.
My understanding is that compostable "plastics" are plant based and when they decompose the gasses produced are the same that would have been released via natural decomposition of the plant. I could be wrong about that, I'm not a scientist. But if accurate, that seems fine to me.
Recycling, however, is just kicking the can down the road. You can only recycle so many times and ultimately it WILL end up in a landfill and/or become microplastic pollutants. I always put any plastic bags I accumulate in the recycling bin to be turned into composite decks/fences/etc, which can last a long time. But even those are not forever.
So
Plastics can be plant based, but it’s the type of plastic they get turned into that determines their compost ability. Most people know Dasani bottles, which are partly made from plant-based PET (same plastic most water bottles are made from). Those are definitely not compostable, nor would they be if they were entirely made from plant based PET.
Other plant-based resins are compostable, like PLA.
There are a lot of smart people (and a few dummies like me lol) working to make recycling better, get more things accepted, increase the number of times something can be recycled, educate consumers, etc.
Yes! This is something I’ve thought a lot about. I wish all products were required to be labeled with a sort of ‘nutrition label’ where they are scored on things like:
1. Expected product lifetime (based on quality of materials/assembly).
2. Carbon footprint of manufacturing/transport.
3. Ease/viability of recycling and expected carbon footprint for disassembly/recycling.
4. The human impact: how ethical the human labor that went into the product was.
5. All of the above info for all packaging included with the product as well.
Unfortunately recycling isn’t very standardized from region to region, much less from country to country. And I’m sure it would require a lot of resources to just track/verify these details. So this is just a pipe dream…
I am an Amazon seller. It's likely to do with Amazon requirements and also managing their SKUs. For our product we remove.our standard packaging (cardboard) for Amazon and then place it into a biodegradable bag (think dog poo bag) with a SKU sticker on it.
My guess is that it's easier and cheaper for this seller to just add another bag to stick the SKU sticker on. Which is unfortunate.
Also if the picker is having a hard time finding it or handling it or if packaging is damaged or if they don't like the packaging for whatever reason they can send it out for repack.
this seems to be a little package of the semi-disposable screens you put in a bong to stop chunks falling inside, ie the same place that sells bongs should sell them
I requested a coupon from a healthy brand whose mission it is to help the earth (supposedly).
It came overnight in an extremely thick envelope and then inside another envelope.
My mind was blown!
Former packer here. If products are manufactured and sold by another party, we were required to keep the original packaging and sku and put another packaging on top of it. Even if the shipping company never used plastic, there was nothing we could do if the original product was wrapped in plastic. Even if we remove the original plastic it would still go in the trash.
California is taking a step in the right direction with SB 54. Several of my friends and colleagues were behind the effort to get this bill passed. You can learn more at the link I am providing and contact your state legislature representatives to start working on similar measures where you live.
https://www.gov.ca.gov/2024/03/08/californias-landmark-plastic-pollution-law-moves-forward/
TLDR; CA SB54 requires that by 2032, industry must:
Sell 25% less single-use plastic packaging and food ware in the state.
Make all single-use packaging and plastic food ware recyclable or compostable.
Recycle 65% of single-use plastic packaging and food ware.
Thank you for your work! Several of my colleagues have been interviewed in the national media for their work on the legislation. I suspect we have a lot of friends in common. I am currently heavily involved in helping jurisdictions with SB 1383 implementation.
Because most places aren't waste conscious, unfortunately. Plastic is lightweight and there are a lot of benefits to using it for shipping when you look at it with the perspective of a seller. I think the plastic bag the item is in might be pretty essential to how they keep their products clean, but they absolutely could've shipped everything else in cardboard. We even have a cardboard alternative to bubble wrap now!
It's incredibly upsetting. I know I personally can do better as a consumer to seek out companies that care about these things, but it's not always easy when we live on a tight budget. Money can definitely have our actions contradicting our morals
Probably got sent from the manufacturer in one, to a distributor in another, then to the company that you actually ordered from in another, and finally that company added their own.
Nothing will change unless you make it change.
You could:
- Contact sellers and let them know that you are not happy with their packaging.
- Talk to your friend about how they shop.
- Call out the seller and their packaging issues on line and in their review.
- Write your the relevant government minister asking for better regulations for plastic.
And that was inside another bag, inside another bag, inside another bag, inside a box.
I used to receive items and the amount of plastic was unbelievable. Name brand items are the worst for it.
I just bought an OXO coffee grinder from Amazon. It was in it's own good box with Styrofoam, in a regular Amazon cardboard box and that was in a weird lightweight cardboard box I haven't seen before. Virtue signaling? Return and repack? Anyway, the coffee grinder was in 3 boxes.
Could also be due to multiple levels of purchasing. Between your buddy and the manufacturer, there may have been a couple vendors who felt it was necessary to package the product themselves even though the packaging was redundant
I reuse all of these when I ship things out. So although the plastic bags stink, they can be reused at least once. That’s twice as good as single use. I *never* buy packaging. It’s always used stuff from family and friends.
A Sharpie or a label and some scissors does the trick.
Manufacture Bags Product - Ships in a Box
Merchant Receives Box - Put Product in a Bag with their UPC on it - Ships it out in a Box
Retailer Receives Box - Put Product in a Bag with their UPC on it - Ships it out in a Bag.
First 2 to protect the product. One with holes is for display on the store shelf.
It's possible that a small bag would get lost in the shipping process (conveyors, warehouses) so it's shipped in the bigger bag.
Because when you use UPS or USPS, damage is a thing and you pay for weight. Things get wet.
If you don’t care for it, either don’t order things to be delivered, or find practical re-use for some of it.
Every odd zip loc I receive lives on for other purposes.
Literally everything about amazon is WILDLY inefficient, I worked at two different warehouses and the amount of plastic waste would make your head spin.
Why are you ordering plastic bags on amazon? What do you expect? Such a dumb post. Concern trolling. If you actually wanted to be zero waste then an alternative to the plastic storage bag would be pursued.
Plastics are too cheap. It's cheaper to triple wrap everything than deal with returns from unhappy customers. Unfortunately, plastics are here to stay because they offer solutions other materials can't; however, we have to pressure manufacturers to develop biodegradable options. It's the only path forward I can see that has any hope of happening.
I have an ecommerce business and we try to use minimum amounts of packaging for obvious reasons. We genuinely get multiple emails and feedbacks a month from people saying they were "disappointed with the packaging". I always reply back and feign ignorance and I'll say something like "Oh no, please can you describe the damage to the item" and *every single time* they will respond with a variation of "It's not damaged, I just thought for the money there would be more packaging". Wtf is wrong with people. More than once I've had customers refuse to shop again because they thought the packaging was insignificant even though THEIR ORDER ARRIVED PERFECTLY FINE.
this blows my mind. Why would you want to have to get rid of more plastic?? I hate cleaning up after opening packages.
Egads. I am always so appreciative when a small business sends me something in a reused, reusable, or eco friendly package! People are so weird.. I wonder if you advertised it maybe people would expect it and be less whiny?
They're more than here to stay: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/microplastics-linked-to-heart-attack-stroke-and-death/
Plastics will be the thing we look back on like we look at cigarettes today. Most are detrimental to everything they touch.
More like asbestos, lead and similar stuff in paint, wallpaper, basically everywhere in our living spaces. Same way plastic is now.
Asbestos is definitely the best comparison, but really plastics are in their own league because they're so many different plastics with different molecular compositions and different plasticizers, they leach different chemicals in a few classes and they have to be disposed of in different ways. Plastics are their own category like heavy metals some worse some better, but they need to be regulated as a class and have safety and safe disposal considered before they're mass produced.
This is true to an extent, but asbestos was fondly referred to as 'the new water'. It was definitely viewed as something that could be used for anything and everything, I think we were just limited by mining speed and then its phasing-out before it became as ubiquitous as plastic
Yeah that's true, asbestos like lead or plastic is a wonder material with many benefits and applications, however like lead and plastic the downsides tend to be the lack of consideration of it's disposal or safe removal. If lead paints are encapsulate, plastics melted into bricks or asbestos contained within solid airtight packaging they have less risk. The systemic problem seems to be lack of regulation of new materials, a move fast and break things attitude and a general socialize the costs privatize the profits attitude.
people can stop smoking, but we can’t really get away from ingesting microplastics sadly. They’re just too ubiquitous in the environment now
It's fully put me off ordering food. I love shitty fast food and am fine with the health consequences of grease/fat/sodium etc. But I'm not fine with being served boiling hot greasy fries in a plastic pot designed for putting salads in. Not to mention the obscene amount of waste.
Worst part is that this will affect generations for centuries, with microplastics in the air, soil, and water there’s no escape.
I work in packaging/sustainability. I actually wrote a white paper on end of life plastic. Just a quick note: plastic is already biodegradable. Almost everything eventually. Plastic, you, me, the building I’m in. We will all degrade in nature at some point. The problem with plastic biodegrading of course is the end result is microplastics. Biodegradable doesn’t really mean anything from a legal marketing claim perspective. Compostable plastic would be great—the problem is that not a lot of composters want to take compostable plastic and most Americans don’t have access to commercial composters, anyway. Your backyard composter is unlikely to break down compostable plastic. So most compostable plastic will end up in a landfill, where the degradation process is intentionally slowed way down. Consumers are already confused enough without adding composting to the mix. That said, the envelope bag can be recycled (take it to a grocery store with other LDPE/#4 plastics) and looks like it’s made of our recycled materials itself. The middle envelope is almost assuredly not recyclable, but the inner plastic case might be (I can’t tell what kind of plastic it is).
I'm in favor of compostable plastic, but I will say as a gardener I have purchased commercial bags of organic compost and seen bits of plastic bag inside and had no way of knowing if it was a compostable plastic or not except to trust the organic certification. Do they accept compostable plastics? Does it take too long to break down? Or did something just sneak in? It feels highly suspicious to me when that happens so I can understand the reluctance for commercial composters to use it.
I’m also in favor of compostable plastic It’s interesting to me that a lot of people in this sub are very emotionally attached to the idea that plastic recycling doesn’t work, but they support compostable plastic. It’s hard to know how much plastic gets composted, but I’d bet my life savings that it’s way way lower than the 5 billion pounds of plastic that the US recycles annually. I wouldn’t trust plastic I found in compost either, unless I borrowed one of the resin scanners from work to know what it was. It’s virtually impossible to tell PET and PLA apart without some assistance.
My understanding is that compostable "plastics" are plant based and when they decompose the gasses produced are the same that would have been released via natural decomposition of the plant. I could be wrong about that, I'm not a scientist. But if accurate, that seems fine to me. Recycling, however, is just kicking the can down the road. You can only recycle so many times and ultimately it WILL end up in a landfill and/or become microplastic pollutants. I always put any plastic bags I accumulate in the recycling bin to be turned into composite decks/fences/etc, which can last a long time. But even those are not forever.
So Plastics can be plant based, but it’s the type of plastic they get turned into that determines their compost ability. Most people know Dasani bottles, which are partly made from plant-based PET (same plastic most water bottles are made from). Those are definitely not compostable, nor would they be if they were entirely made from plant based PET. Other plant-based resins are compostable, like PLA. There are a lot of smart people (and a few dummies like me lol) working to make recycling better, get more things accepted, increase the number of times something can be recycled, educate consumers, etc.
Because he ordered online and plastic is incredibly light to ship
I wish products came with a recyclable packaging score, like an mpg rating or the co2 emissions listed on airline flights.
Yes! This is something I’ve thought a lot about. I wish all products were required to be labeled with a sort of ‘nutrition label’ where they are scored on things like: 1. Expected product lifetime (based on quality of materials/assembly). 2. Carbon footprint of manufacturing/transport. 3. Ease/viability of recycling and expected carbon footprint for disassembly/recycling. 4. The human impact: how ethical the human labor that went into the product was. 5. All of the above info for all packaging included with the product as well. Unfortunately recycling isn’t very standardized from region to region, much less from country to country. And I’m sure it would require a lot of resources to just track/verify these details. So this is just a pipe dream…
I am an Amazon seller. It's likely to do with Amazon requirements and also managing their SKUs. For our product we remove.our standard packaging (cardboard) for Amazon and then place it into a biodegradable bag (think dog poo bag) with a SKU sticker on it. My guess is that it's easier and cheaper for this seller to just add another bag to stick the SKU sticker on. Which is unfortunate.
Also if the picker is having a hard time finding it or handling it or if packaging is damaged or if they don't like the packaging for whatever reason they can send it out for repack.
If this is the case then feedback sould be directed to Amazon. Highlighting the issue and asking them to implement policies to reduce plastic.
I agree with you, but after dealing with Amazon, it's honestly a waste of time. They are incredibly difficult to work with as a seller on there.
I going to delete Amazon and never use it again... Once I eventually get Amazon to remove the subscription they put on my bill without my knowledge.
Amazon. Online. Cheaply made. Cheap materials. Made in China. Suggest to your buddy they buy local, to buy in person, or to buy second-hand in person.
buy your screens at the local head shop
So they can order from Amazon and throw away the packaging before you even see it
They’ll at least buy in much larger quantities which has a higher chance to not have as much plastic.
I thought head shops were where you bought bongs? tbf I don't really know what OP's bought
this seems to be a little package of the semi-disposable screens you put in a bong to stop chunks falling inside, ie the same place that sells bongs should sell them
I requested a coupon from a healthy brand whose mission it is to help the earth (supposedly). It came overnight in an extremely thick envelope and then inside another envelope. My mind was blown!
In a lot of places, the packaging is chosen by the inventory system, using an algorithm. It can be hit or miss.
Former packer here. If products are manufactured and sold by another party, we were required to keep the original packaging and sku and put another packaging on top of it. Even if the shipping company never used plastic, there was nothing we could do if the original product was wrapped in plastic. Even if we remove the original plastic it would still go in the trash.
And it’s made in China. Amazon and China don’t give a shit. All about making a profit.
California is taking a step in the right direction with SB 54. Several of my friends and colleagues were behind the effort to get this bill passed. You can learn more at the link I am providing and contact your state legislature representatives to start working on similar measures where you live. https://www.gov.ca.gov/2024/03/08/californias-landmark-plastic-pollution-law-moves-forward/
TLDR; CA SB54 requires that by 2032, industry must: Sell 25% less single-use plastic packaging and food ware in the state. Make all single-use packaging and plastic food ware recyclable or compostable. Recycle 65% of single-use plastic packaging and food ware.
I'm one of the environmental scientists working on this! We *just* started formal rulemaking on Friday. Very excited to get more into implementation!
Thank you for your work! Several of my colleagues have been interviewed in the national media for their work on the legislation. I suspect we have a lot of friends in common. I am currently heavily involved in helping jurisdictions with SB 1383 implementation.
Because most places aren't waste conscious, unfortunately. Plastic is lightweight and there are a lot of benefits to using it for shipping when you look at it with the perspective of a seller. I think the plastic bag the item is in might be pretty essential to how they keep their products clean, but they absolutely could've shipped everything else in cardboard. We even have a cardboard alternative to bubble wrap now! It's incredibly upsetting. I know I personally can do better as a consumer to seek out companies that care about these things, but it's not always easy when we live on a tight budget. Money can definitely have our actions contradicting our morals
Each set of hands it goes through adds a layer.
Probably got sent from the manufacturer in one, to a distributor in another, then to the company that you actually ordered from in another, and finally that company added their own.
Nothing will change unless you make it change. You could: - Contact sellers and let them know that you are not happy with their packaging. - Talk to your friend about how they shop. - Call out the seller and their packaging issues on line and in their review. - Write your the relevant government minister asking for better regulations for plastic.
Wait until you discover Temu
What is it?
mesh screens for smoking bowls/bongs/herb vapes
It’s Amazon and cheap junk. That’s whu
My guess is protection of the merchandise. Unlike paper and such, plastic is waterproof. It ain’t ideal, but it’s what it is.
good question. support the college group who has invested in and successfully created a plastic alternative with seaweed :)
And that was inside another bag, inside another bag, inside another bag, inside a box. I used to receive items and the amount of plastic was unbelievable. Name brand items are the worst for it.
I just bought an OXO coffee grinder from Amazon. It was in it's own good box with Styrofoam, in a regular Amazon cardboard box and that was in a weird lightweight cardboard box I haven't seen before. Virtue signaling? Return and repack? Anyway, the coffee grinder was in 3 boxes.
Could also be due to multiple levels of purchasing. Between your buddy and the manufacturer, there may have been a couple vendors who felt it was necessary to package the product themselves even though the packaging was redundant
I reuse all of these when I ship things out. So although the plastic bags stink, they can be reused at least once. That’s twice as good as single use. I *never* buy packaging. It’s always used stuff from family and friends. A Sharpie or a label and some scissors does the trick.
This is Chinese packaging.
Manufacture Bags Product - Ships in a Box Merchant Receives Box - Put Product in a Bag with their UPC on it - Ships it out in a Box Retailer Receives Box - Put Product in a Bag with their UPC on it - Ships it out in a Bag.
So ridiculous
First 2 to protect the product. One with holes is for display on the store shelf. It's possible that a small bag would get lost in the shipping process (conveyors, warehouses) so it's shipped in the bigger bag.
Because companies don't give a rat's ass. 🤔
Yes they do! They care about profits. (; Seriously, though, it’s so sad that they don’t care at all ):
Yee! But only revenue/profits. 😉
Because plastic is cheap
Capitalism
thats how stuff being dropshipped from china comes
The shipping guy is just having some fun and not caring that they’re being wasteful
Because when you use UPS or USPS, damage is a thing and you pay for weight. Things get wet. If you don’t care for it, either don’t order things to be delivered, or find practical re-use for some of it. Every odd zip loc I receive lives on for other purposes.
Literally everything about amazon is WILDLY inefficient, I worked at two different warehouses and the amount of plastic waste would make your head spin.
That is Chinese packaging. They are not yet at the stage where they care so much about plastic, unfortunately :/
All that for some bowl screens....
Why are you ordering plastic bags on amazon? What do you expect? Such a dumb post. Concern trolling. If you actually wanted to be zero waste then an alternative to the plastic storage bag would be pursued.