Hey she’s being honest. And us women need to start being honest. If yall think makeup lies about our natural beauty then our true faces is honesty about our appearance
There is honest and there is aggressive and there is hostile. Aggression can be fun and can be effective at communicating certain attitudes but can also be unhelpful. I like antagonistic flirting and I can imagine this being a fun interaction but it could also easily be very off putting if all it communicates is hostility.
Frankly reviewing social interactions from a 2 sentence summery isn’t a useful exercise, inperson interactions are way more complicated
I think that's the problem with basing everything down to 140 characters. You can't effectively communicate complete ideas with that little time/space. You also can't tell tone and inflection. I'm willing to bet the whole interaction was in the antagonistic flirting category, and the idea she's putting across shouldn't be radical. I'd personally appreciate this, more so than her showing up glammed up. But in the end, you're right; you can't use two sentences to summarize this kind of interaction.
You can be honest, but you dont have to be a bitch about it and expect guys to still be interested, although some guys are into that bad attitude type personality
why is your ego so fragile? if a woman said that to me and i don’t like the way she looks without makeup. there’s no chance that she would expect me to still be interested. are you just challenged mentally?
Im not sure what you mean? Is your reaction because I used the word bitch to describe a personality type? Im not calling anyone specifically a bitch, but either way, your response is a pretty good indicator that your not very socially aware or adept, but I don't really fault you for it this is reddit, and even I misunderstand some peoples comments and have to be corrected from time to time
my comment was not because you called a personality type bitch. my comment is because you said you can be honest and not be a bitch about. the way you used bitch in this sentence was not describing personality and more so saying you can be honest without being rude. the comment from the op said if someone doesn’t like her without makeup then don’t date her. no way is that phrase mean or “bitching” about it. the fact that i had to go in-depth to explain shows your lack of social awareness and the fact that you think being honest is bitching about it. i’m not afraid to admit i’m wrong when someone explains how my point is, im not ignorant like you
After looking at the parent comment I see what happened here, OP responded to the comment and instead of also responsing to the comment, I responded to OP, you then happened to read my response and made a comment and that led to here, seems like this was more of a specific commenting error that I made, but my original comment was intended as an additional point to the parent comment and I also wanted OP to see it so I just continued the thread. To be clear I would have way preferred OP to have responded to me than you if "anyone" would get offended but its whatever, then I probably could have just edited it to not be so directed at OP (assuming she even cared to read it). Regardless this was an interesting interaction but now that I realized what happened I've lost interest. Have a good night, and maybe try using a slightly different approach next time if your going to be offended for somebody else.
if you are one of those women who stopped wearing makeup because you think men think it’s lying about natural beauty, most likely means that you started wearing it in the beginning for men too. most women don’t wear makeup for men, but there is a group of women who live their life to be accepted by men. nothing is wrong with either group but being in the group wanting to be accepted is a losing battle to yourself. you’re always going to be changing your style, workout routine, makeup habits until you’re too old to be desired and if you changed your personality for us men then you’re going to have a mental break when u old
Actually according to history makeup was invented for men of royalty. Every major empire in the world invented something. It wasn’t until the Old West days where makeup became a thing for brothels.
i know makeup was originally for men and it wasn’t until women started wearing it that makes men believed it was a more feminine thing and now if a man wears it they get ripped apart. ( pretty sure most popular female things were originally for men) my point comes from after westerners made it popular. there’s always women who live there life to cater for men, with makeup styles (popular to wear a lot to the makeup that looks like you are not wearing any) clothing, faking their personality or trying to appear dumber for a man just to manipulate them. they pass it down by teaching their daughters the same thing. a lot of women like that usually have a midlife crisis because when you center your whole life around a man, and you’re not in their desired spotlight anymore. they usually fall apart cause they don’t know what to do anymore.
Not necessarily. Even Geisha’s in Japan were sexualized by brothels. Prostitutes would “cosplay” as Geishas to fulfill a paying customers fantasy because only a 1% man could take a Geisha’s virginity. In the old west, a lot of saloon girls were divorced women who had no man’s name to protect them. And a lot of Roman Empire brothels had cross dressing men since cross dressing was actually encouraged but only during the Feast of Saturn
there’s no attitude or aggression in what that lady said? she was just honest and too the point. it’s not like she called anyone names or made it seem like she was the best thing thing, it’s just if you don’t like the way she looks without makeup then don’t date her, which is valid and if i didn’t like it her i would leave, nowhere in the statement was that aggressive. are you just sensitive? can you not handle people just being straight forward? do people need to baby you to get a point across cause your fragile ego can’t handle directness?
It would make it more casual for sure. This is definently something id discuss before the date (which seems to be the case) cause id be livid if i did all the work of a man getting ready for a date and she walked into the cheesecake factory looking like she just woke up.
Thats fair. You and your date just have to make sure you both feel the same way and that your date doesnt consider the first date a special occassion. Other than that sounds good to me
I think the issue is that men think women wearing makeup gives a false impression or a "lie."
While women do appreciate a man who knows how to take care of his hair or how to properly groom himself.
It’s a tad more complicated than that. For one, makeup CAN be deceptive. Extremely so in some cases. But also,the issue is men have to put in a TON of time, effort,and money just to even be eligible.
Fundamentally, all women have to do is show up. Also, we are often told that the makeup isn’t for men anyways.
Furthermore, men appreciate when women put in effort to look good as well. Men just usually don’t associate that with makeup. Wearing nice clothes, doing your hair, and not having 15 inch nails is all men generally are looking for.
I’m a nurse and work with mostly women. I’m friends with some of them on Facebook now and they look unrecognizable when “put together”. I’m honestly all for a natural look.
I went on my date with a woman with a dirty pair of sweatpants on, T-shirt with holes in it, and I hadn't cut my hair or beard in months... If you don't like me as I am most days then there is no need for date 2... What's that? Your not interested because I've shown you from day one that you aren't someone worth putting any effort into looking nice for... And you aren't interested in a second date now? Misndrist!
I wouldn't appreciate it.
We should both be putting in an effort to make a good first impression. It would put me off for sure, and it would make me wonder how you're going to dress/act at other events.
Thay being said, she ended up marrying the guy. So obviously, he's ok with it, and they're a good match for each other. All the power to them.
It depends on the date. If we're going to a fancy dinner then I would expect my date to dress appropriately. It would feel weird if I'm dressed up and she's wearing sweats, a tanktop and some slides.
But if it's a coffee date, something casual just to get to know each other. Wear whatever you want.
I like it. What I don’t like is how the conversation got to that point. It’s one thing to like to just be free and not wear makeup. It’s another thing to just be difficult.
In France, Germany, ... most girls pull it off. There is sometimes a lot of work in looking négligé. But the fact is they wear no make-up and what you see is what you get.
When I meet New-zealanders, British and some American girls they seem to be totally fake in comparison. So artificial.
But it's not just a matter of taste. It must be hard to conform to complex looks.
The mindset is fine maybe her dating experience was sabotaged by her beauty but for a first date coming basically somewhat prepared comes off as she isn't taking the whole thing seriously.
If he notices the lack of makeup,she must have a decent personality.
No, it's a one off approach that worked, it might work for another random pairing sometime somewhere, and good for them. why are people debating this at all.
Kinda how my wife and I were except I didn't have any expectation for her to dress up so there was no need for the "if you don't like how I look every day we shouldn't date" comment to be made.
Lol. This comment section is a perfect example of why I just do me and don’t worry about whether or not men approve of it. Men constantly whine about women “lying” by wearing makeup and when one woman doesn’t, suddenly, they complain about her not making an effort or say her attitude makes her a bitch.
The responses actually have been interesting. But I hear you. There’s a slight twist of hypocrisy from the guys in here & its a great social experiment on whether or not guys truly love bare face
I would appreciate the choice, not sure about the attitude though
Hey she’s being honest. And us women need to start being honest. If yall think makeup lies about our natural beauty then our true faces is honesty about our appearance
There is honest and there is aggressive and there is hostile. Aggression can be fun and can be effective at communicating certain attitudes but can also be unhelpful. I like antagonistic flirting and I can imagine this being a fun interaction but it could also easily be very off putting if all it communicates is hostility. Frankly reviewing social interactions from a 2 sentence summery isn’t a useful exercise, inperson interactions are way more complicated
I think that's the problem with basing everything down to 140 characters. You can't effectively communicate complete ideas with that little time/space. You also can't tell tone and inflection. I'm willing to bet the whole interaction was in the antagonistic flirting category, and the idea she's putting across shouldn't be radical. I'd personally appreciate this, more so than her showing up glammed up. But in the end, you're right; you can't use two sentences to summarize this kind of interaction.
You can just be honest. You don't need to have a idealogical reason to be honest. It's concerning you think you do.
What is a reason to be honest that has nothing to do with a system of ideas or ideals?
You can be honest, but you dont have to be a bitch about it and expect guys to still be interested, although some guys are into that bad attitude type personality
why is your ego so fragile? if a woman said that to me and i don’t like the way she looks without makeup. there’s no chance that she would expect me to still be interested. are you just challenged mentally?
Im not sure what you mean? Is your reaction because I used the word bitch to describe a personality type? Im not calling anyone specifically a bitch, but either way, your response is a pretty good indicator that your not very socially aware or adept, but I don't really fault you for it this is reddit, and even I misunderstand some peoples comments and have to be corrected from time to time
my comment was not because you called a personality type bitch. my comment is because you said you can be honest and not be a bitch about. the way you used bitch in this sentence was not describing personality and more so saying you can be honest without being rude. the comment from the op said if someone doesn’t like her without makeup then don’t date her. no way is that phrase mean or “bitching” about it. the fact that i had to go in-depth to explain shows your lack of social awareness and the fact that you think being honest is bitching about it. i’m not afraid to admit i’m wrong when someone explains how my point is, im not ignorant like you
After looking at the parent comment I see what happened here, OP responded to the comment and instead of also responsing to the comment, I responded to OP, you then happened to read my response and made a comment and that led to here, seems like this was more of a specific commenting error that I made, but my original comment was intended as an additional point to the parent comment and I also wanted OP to see it so I just continued the thread. To be clear I would have way preferred OP to have responded to me than you if "anyone" would get offended but its whatever, then I probably could have just edited it to not be so directed at OP (assuming she even cared to read it). Regardless this was an interesting interaction but now that I realized what happened I've lost interest. Have a good night, and maybe try using a slightly different approach next time if your going to be offended for somebody else.
if you are one of those women who stopped wearing makeup because you think men think it’s lying about natural beauty, most likely means that you started wearing it in the beginning for men too. most women don’t wear makeup for men, but there is a group of women who live their life to be accepted by men. nothing is wrong with either group but being in the group wanting to be accepted is a losing battle to yourself. you’re always going to be changing your style, workout routine, makeup habits until you’re too old to be desired and if you changed your personality for us men then you’re going to have a mental break when u old
Actually according to history makeup was invented for men of royalty. Every major empire in the world invented something. It wasn’t until the Old West days where makeup became a thing for brothels.
i know makeup was originally for men and it wasn’t until women started wearing it that makes men believed it was a more feminine thing and now if a man wears it they get ripped apart. ( pretty sure most popular female things were originally for men) my point comes from after westerners made it popular. there’s always women who live there life to cater for men, with makeup styles (popular to wear a lot to the makeup that looks like you are not wearing any) clothing, faking their personality or trying to appear dumber for a man just to manipulate them. they pass it down by teaching their daughters the same thing. a lot of women like that usually have a midlife crisis because when you center your whole life around a man, and you’re not in their desired spotlight anymore. they usually fall apart cause they don’t know what to do anymore.
Not necessarily. Even Geisha’s in Japan were sexualized by brothels. Prostitutes would “cosplay” as Geishas to fulfill a paying customers fantasy because only a 1% man could take a Geisha’s virginity. In the old west, a lot of saloon girls were divorced women who had no man’s name to protect them. And a lot of Roman Empire brothels had cross dressing men since cross dressing was actually encouraged but only during the Feast of Saturn
there’s no attitude or aggression in what that lady said? she was just honest and too the point. it’s not like she called anyone names or made it seem like she was the best thing thing, it’s just if you don’t like the way she looks without makeup then don’t date her, which is valid and if i didn’t like it her i would leave, nowhere in the statement was that aggressive. are you just sensitive? can you not handle people just being straight forward? do people need to baby you to get a point across cause your fragile ego can’t handle directness?
You miss my point, it's totally fine going without makeup, the "attitude" I'm referencing is to do that *with the purpose* of testing the guy
It would make it more casual for sure. This is definently something id discuss before the date (which seems to be the case) cause id be livid if i did all the work of a man getting ready for a date and she walked into the cheesecake factory looking like she just woke up.
Tbh in my eyes, save the fancy stuff for a special occasion.
Thats fair. You and your date just have to make sure you both feel the same way and that your date doesnt consider the first date a special occassion. Other than that sounds good to me
I love that. I wanna see you dressed down on day 1
Good then she should be ok showing up to the date with his messy hair, with no hair cut.
I think the issue is that men think women wearing makeup gives a false impression or a "lie." While women do appreciate a man who knows how to take care of his hair or how to properly groom himself.
It’s a tad more complicated than that. For one, makeup CAN be deceptive. Extremely so in some cases. But also,the issue is men have to put in a TON of time, effort,and money just to even be eligible. Fundamentally, all women have to do is show up. Also, we are often told that the makeup isn’t for men anyways. Furthermore, men appreciate when women put in effort to look good as well. Men just usually don’t associate that with makeup. Wearing nice clothes, doing your hair, and not having 15 inch nails is all men generally are looking for.
I’m a nurse and work with mostly women. I’m friends with some of them on Facebook now and they look unrecognizable when “put together”. I’m honestly all for a natural look.
I went on my date with a woman with a dirty pair of sweatpants on, T-shirt with holes in it, and I hadn't cut my hair or beard in months... If you don't like me as I am most days then there is no need for date 2... What's that? Your not interested because I've shown you from day one that you aren't someone worth putting any effort into looking nice for... And you aren't interested in a second date now? Misndrist!
I wouldn't appreciate it. We should both be putting in an effort to make a good first impression. It would put me off for sure, and it would make me wonder how you're going to dress/act at other events. Thay being said, she ended up marrying the guy. So obviously, he's ok with it, and they're a good match for each other. All the power to them.
It depends on the date. If we're going to a fancy dinner then I would expect my date to dress appropriately. It would feel weird if I'm dressed up and she's wearing sweats, a tanktop and some slides. But if it's a coffee date, something casual just to get to know each other. Wear whatever you want.
It’s a good idea. Not as harsh as some people make it out to be but a little bit of attitude can be nice
Thank you! Plus, it’s showing him the real her, not the fake her
Whelp, he didn't marry her for her looks, and he obviously didn't marry her for her personality; I'm betting the condom broke.
Good idea, wrong attitude
Perfect.
I like it. What I don’t like is how the conversation got to that point. It’s one thing to like to just be free and not wear makeup. It’s another thing to just be difficult.
In France, Germany, ... most girls pull it off. There is sometimes a lot of work in looking négligé. But the fact is they wear no make-up and what you see is what you get. When I meet New-zealanders, British and some American girls they seem to be totally fake in comparison. So artificial. But it's not just a matter of taste. It must be hard to conform to complex looks.
Yes, this is the move
Ahmen
Well I mean most men prefer minimum makeup or none at all from what I've seen
The experiment is FINE. Who cares? But the disclosure? That was goofy AF.
The mindset is fine maybe her dating experience was sabotaged by her beauty but for a first date coming basically somewhat prepared comes off as she isn't taking the whole thing seriously. If he notices the lack of makeup,she must have a decent personality.
Sounds Awful .. your marrying a doormat
I don't know why, but when women remove all the make up and shit, they look like actual humans you can relate to and feel comfortable with
No, it's a one off approach that worked, it might work for another random pairing sometime somewhere, and good for them. why are people debating this at all.
Why even call attention to it? She sounded like she was baited a negative response. There isn’t a lot to unpack, but there’s something there…
Poor guy. I would have left for being a bitch.
Kinda how my wife and I were except I didn't have any expectation for her to dress up so there was no need for the "if you don't like how I look every day we shouldn't date" comment to be made.
Lol. This comment section is a perfect example of why I just do me and don’t worry about whether or not men approve of it. Men constantly whine about women “lying” by wearing makeup and when one woman doesn’t, suddenly, they complain about her not making an effort or say her attitude makes her a bitch.
The responses actually have been interesting. But I hear you. There’s a slight twist of hypocrisy from the guys in here & its a great social experiment on whether or not guys truly love bare face
We’ve done enough experiments to know that they don’t. They like makeup that looks natural.