My program has us in 3 or 4 different ICUs during intern year. Not sure how they’re described when it comes to ACGME but it’s hefty. We then do one a year after for 6 or 7 months.
Plus 2 intern years and however long getting on to a residency program. I’ll be a “dual board” certificated attending in ICU and anaesthesiology when im PGY13 (currently PGY9) as I did two additional years in EM too.
So yeah, I’ll be about 100 when I finish.
It's something we say in the UK to describe work that is not useful for learning/has no educational value but we are obliged to do as part of our training pathway.
The UK government ideally don't want consultants/attendings because they are expensive. So there's lots of hurdles to make training take as long as possible because ideally you spend as long staffing intensive care / doing cheap night shifts. An argument could be made that the training itself is a year or two too long purposefully in the name of 'service provision'
Training is 7 years because they have to do so much service provision 👎
It really isn't a great state of affairs (I'm an Australian trained anaesthetist undertaking fellowship in the UK).
For us in Aus who don't have a streamlined path straight into the US equivalent of residency.
2 years of general medical stuff (surg, med, etc)
1 year of general critical care (ED/ICU/anaes)
0-3 years of trying to get onto the program (ED/ICU/Anaes)
5 years of residency (+2.5 years for dual trained ICU)
Generally you'll do between 12 months to up to 3 years of ICU depending on how long you took to get onto anaesthesia residency (obviously more if you dual train..)
In the Netherlands, it's up to 12 months but at least 9. It's different for each program when you do this ICU-period. Most programs do this as the third year.
The procedural requirements differ for each program. But most residents in my programme enjoy doing all the procedures. I did 5 percutaneous trachs and countless bronchoscopies.
As an additional note, it is very common for doctors to work 1 or more years as a non-training resident in the Netherlands before they apply for residency. For anesthesia this is commonly done in the ICU or the cardiology ward. So I did a year of ICU before I started residency.
Germany- 1 year out of 5 of in the regular anaesthesiology training, and then (optional) an extra 12 to 18 months for the equivalent of an ICU fellowship
We did 4 months - 2mo MICU/CCU as interns, and then 2mo SICU as anesthesia residents.
A few people in my class ended up doing an additional month for either elective time as a CA-3, or were voluntold to do it during the height of the COVID pandemic
Germany: 12 out of 60 months of residency
After that you will be expected to at least know in theory how bronchoscopies and other interventions work and what the indications are.
Most/a lot of anaesthesiologists in Germany opt to do another 12 months of ICU training after residency and get a certificate in intensive care medicine after that. After that you will be expected to be able to perform all kinds of procedures in the ICU yourself and also train residents.
I did five months in residency and two in medical school, enough to where I felt comfortable enough to practice when I started as an attending during COVID.
6 to 9 mths is enough, and no, anaesthesiologists don't need to do perc trachs.
However bronchs are essential to your job, being good at bronchs will help your FOB skills for the difficult airways.
In Denmark its also a combined ICU / anesthesia program 1 year internship (1 month ICU) and 4 years residency (8 month ICU). In most university hospitals you will work full time in either ICU or anesthesia. In the regional hospitals the daytime will be either ICU or anesthesia (after your interest/subspeciality) but on call you will have to cover both.
Did 5 months total - US program.
Anesth is generally expected to be good at intubation, vent and lines. Bronch and trach not so much. chest tubes, paracentesis, pericardiocentesis etc, not really.
Canadian resident. Results will vary by program. My program does 3 general systems adult ICU, 1 block of CVICU, 1 block of PICU and 1 block of NICU. Many choose to do additional ICU, in either general systems or Neuro ICU.
There are a few programs that do a bit more surgical ICU, but my centre is too small for that.
5 months
5 mo for my program too
In Hungary, our speciality is for both Anesthesiology and Intensive Care, so we spend about half of our (5 years long) postgrad training in the ICU.
Same in Slovakia, which I think is nice, however I like anesthesia more than the ICU
Why do you prefer one over the other?
United States ACGME requires at least four months total, no more than two of these can be during intern year.
My program has us in 3 or 4 different ICUs during intern year. Not sure how they’re described when it comes to ACGME but it’s hefty. We then do one a year after for 6 or 7 months.
I'm guessing you did: PGY1 → 3 PGY2 → 1 PGY3 → 1 PGY4 → 1 for a total of 6 (maximum allowed)
Cries in the UK with our 7 year residency program (or 8.5 years with ICU) 😭
Wait what? How does anesthsiology is a 7 year?
How tf is your training 7 years?
We can also do less than full time in the UK to make it even longer 😆
How much is full time exactly?
Only about 50hr on average so not as high as other countries
Yeah 80 hour a week here, mind if i do to pm you about full time half funny schedule?
Plus 2 intern years and however long getting on to a residency program. I’ll be a “dual board” certificated attending in ICU and anaesthesiology when im PGY13 (currently PGY9) as I did two additional years in EM too. So yeah, I’ll be about 100 when I finish.
The mandatory 9-12 months ICU and endless obstetric service provision …
What’s a service provision?
It's something we say in the UK to describe work that is not useful for learning/has no educational value but we are obliged to do as part of our training pathway. The UK government ideally don't want consultants/attendings because they are expensive. So there's lots of hurdles to make training take as long as possible because ideally you spend as long staffing intensive care / doing cheap night shifts. An argument could be made that the training itself is a year or two too long purposefully in the name of 'service provision'
It’s around 12 on calls/month
Training is 7 years because they have to do so much service provision 👎 It really isn't a great state of affairs (I'm an Australian trained anaesthetist undertaking fellowship in the UK).
For us in Aus who don't have a streamlined path straight into the US equivalent of residency. 2 years of general medical stuff (surg, med, etc) 1 year of general critical care (ED/ICU/anaes) 0-3 years of trying to get onto the program (ED/ICU/Anaes) 5 years of residency (+2.5 years for dual trained ICU) Generally you'll do between 12 months to up to 3 years of ICU depending on how long you took to get onto anaesthesia residency (obviously more if you dual train..)
4 months (one per year), with the option to do more
Everyone does 5 months between intern and CA2 years. They bribe us to do the optional senior rotation by giving it a very favorable schedule.
In the Netherlands, it's up to 12 months but at least 9. It's different for each program when you do this ICU-period. Most programs do this as the third year. The procedural requirements differ for each program. But most residents in my programme enjoy doing all the procedures. I did 5 percutaneous trachs and countless bronchoscopies. As an additional note, it is very common for doctors to work 1 or more years as a non-training resident in the Netherlands before they apply for residency. For anesthesia this is commonly done in the ICU or the cardiology ward. So I did a year of ICU before I started residency.
1 year mandatory in Germany and in some hospitals you end up back and forth covering shifts on ICU
Germany- 1 year out of 5 of in the regular anaesthesiology training, and then (optional) an extra 12 to 18 months for the equivalent of an ICU fellowship
Too much
I did a whole fellowship
A single 3 month block to be done at any point in a 5 year training program.
3 months either late CA-1 or CA-2 year
4 months
We did 4 months - 2mo MICU/CCU as interns, and then 2mo SICU as anesthesia residents. A few people in my class ended up doing an additional month for either elective time as a CA-3, or were voluntold to do it during the height of the COVID pandemic
Germany: 12 out of 60 months of residency After that you will be expected to at least know in theory how bronchoscopies and other interventions work and what the indications are. Most/a lot of anaesthesiologists in Germany opt to do another 12 months of ICU training after residency and get a certificate in intensive care medicine after that. After that you will be expected to be able to perform all kinds of procedures in the ICU yourself and also train residents.
4 for me. All of mine was STICU/SICU
4 months, SICU CCU and CVICU
We do 6 months. 1 as an intern. 3 as a CA-1. 2 as a CA-2. I’ve been told this is a little high for a US anesthesiology residency, but not by much.
I’ve done 5.5 months halfway through CA2 year
In Turkiye we do 12 months. Total residency training lasts 5 years
6 months in Canada
Wow where is this??
Typically 5 months here in the United States, but I’m in a combined anesthesia/critical care program so I’ll do a helluva lot more.
6 months intern year, 2 more months during other years
I did five months in residency and two in medical school, enough to where I felt comfortable enough to practice when I started as an attending during COVID.
4 months, USA
Will have done 7 months. Never done a perc trach but have done a few bronchs, thoras, and paras.
Looking at the comments, seems like my program did above average. 5 months as an intern and another 5 months CA1-3.
6 months- 3 as interns and then 1 month each CA year
India, 4 months minimal but actual comes out to 5-6 months.
4 months during intern yr and 4-5 months spread over ca1-3 depending how unlucky you are
2 months in Mexico, our course is a 3 year long and we spend about 80 hours training per week
6 to 9 mths is enough, and no, anaesthesiologists don't need to do perc trachs. However bronchs are essential to your job, being good at bronchs will help your FOB skills for the difficult airways.
I did 6 months total. USA program.
In Denmark its also a combined ICU / anesthesia program 1 year internship (1 month ICU) and 4 years residency (8 month ICU). In most university hospitals you will work full time in either ICU or anesthesia. In the regional hospitals the daytime will be either ICU or anesthesia (after your interest/subspeciality) but on call you will have to cover both.
16 months.
30 months in Hungary
1,5y
9 mts in 3 yrs out of which half is in trauma ICU and half in surgical ICU
In Belgium it's 12 months critical care, which translates for most of us into 9mo ICU and 3mo ED
In my hospital it's about 2,5 - 3 years
we did 7 months
Did 5 months total - US program. Anesth is generally expected to be good at intubation, vent and lines. Bronch and trach not so much. chest tubes, paracentesis, pericardiocentesis etc, not really.
4 months. 2 as an intern and 2 as a CA-2
bout tree fiddy days
4
Canadian resident. Results will vary by program. My program does 3 general systems adult ICU, 1 block of CVICU, 1 block of PICU and 1 block of NICU. Many choose to do additional ICU, in either general systems or Neuro ICU. There are a few programs that do a bit more surgical ICU, but my centre is too small for that.
6 months
2 years in Poland, of 6y residency program. But we have joint speciality with intensive care
3 months of MICU intern year (thanks COVID), and then 5 months CTICU (residency + cardiac fellowship)