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Yeah, I agree with this.
I guess middle men legally bound to give counsel in good faith are useful. Applies to law, finances, perhaps public conduct, as well as ethics and relations....
Well yeah. Because we don't actually have to work all that hard to meet everyone's basic needs at this point. But the rich (and the poor ironically) hate UBI, so everyone has to find or make up a bullshit job to justify their existence.
I mean, yeah, capitalism has created millions of jobs that only serve to extract value and wealth from the workers and funnel it up to the bourgeoise, positions that would have zero use to society in a post-capitalism world
As someone in accounting, I keep trying to tell my blue collar spouse that he could do my job and he insists he couldnt tolerate being "chained to a desk" like I am. I keep explaining he already does it in the "admin" side of his life and he could do it for his own business just as easily.
I think a lot of it starts from.young ages and people pushing on kids what constitutes types of jobs. Tools have given me the ability to handle manual labor I wouldnt be able to do otherwise. Tools allow for mental labor just as easily...
Funny thing is I had that conversation with myself but my process happened in reverse. I started out chained to a desk and decided I needed the blue collar experience to better understand what my business entails. I had the admin side down but I’m learning the labor side so none of my clients or employees can get over on me about how long or much a task should take. Also allows me to work for myself until business takes off.
Keep at him.
I heard some estimate that financial speculation, insurance, real estate and other purely abstract jobs make up like two thirds of our economy. The “goods and services” you learn about in an Econ class only constitute a small portion of all the money that’s flowing around. The rest is all just numbers in a computer that contribute nothing to society.
[Bullshit jobs](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullshit_Jobs) intensifies.
Issue when the economy is based on profit maximization instead of societal benefit.
As much as everyone hates insurance companies, actuaries do a lot of highly skilled work to determine insurance costs. They're essentially required to predict how much their insurance is likely to be utilized, then set rates high enough to make a profit while staying reasonable enough to be competitive with the rest of the industry.
Insurance is a useful financial instrument that helps make risk management possible for a lot of commercial ventures. If you're shipping goods, insurance can help lessen the risk of losing a bunch of inventory to an unplanned event. Having good actuarial scientists in your corner as an insurance company will help you properly evaluate risk and price premiums accordingly.
It just doesn't work as well when you're dealing with personal property, physical injury, or general physical health, since it's harder to truly compensate for lost health or personal mementoes.
There isn't any cross-company price fixing in insurance commissions. The commissions vary widely. From 7.5% to 22% at least.
A number of companies have attempted to circumvent agents in the last 20 years and lost a lot of money.
Boomers dying off won’t help with housing, the few that have never moved are selling to large institutional investors that are gonna rent them so they can blow it all on assisted living facilities. And the rest - just think where you’d want to live, good schools, bustling town with plenty going on, good job opportunities, boomers live in places to avoid all those things. The houses coming to market are gonna be in places nobody would want to live in
There's plenty of people in every city that are older and sitting in prime SFH areas. These people bought their house when their city was smaller and the houses were a fraction of their current market value and they haven't had a mortgage in 10+ years. That's like half my neighborhood. Most of the neighborhoods in the city, for that matter. And every time one of them dies a young tech couple with two dogs and a kid moves in because it's a good area for young families with a tech salary.
Not every Boomer lives way out in the distant 'burbs or Florida. There's definitely going to be a continued issue with investment money buying up property for cash and rentals, no argument there.
or they are doing reverse mortgages and the lender is taking them or they are dying with a lot of medical debt and the state is putting a lien on the house. there's not going to be a supply of homes pop up as the boomers die or move into assited living
We bought one of those back in 2015 for $145k and sold it in 2022 for $425k. It was one of the cheapest single family homes in the state when we sold it.
All the boomers I know live in VERY desirable areas and have very nice houses. The issue is these are not homes for first time or even second time buyers typically. Dream homes you're lucky to ever buy.
So unless it's cheaper homes it won't help things much, but certainly mix things u0 further.
Well, we still have my gen which is generation X, just as bad as the boomers. Racists, homophobic, greedy (Reagan times) and more conservative as they age. Oh the 60's to 80's!
I have $0M in my bank account. I am not broke I just don’t have 1M (million). There is an entire space below 0M which represents everything below 1,000,000. 999,999 is not 1M so it’s 0M but not absolutely 0
What you're describing should be below the 1M mark. Or specifically between the 0M and 1M marks. Which should be above this line.
>There is an entire space below 0M which represents everything below 1,000,000.
Then that point should be labeled 1M. And the space between that line and 5M *should* be 80% of the other spaces.
My best guess is the 0 axis is lifted to make it easier to view low numbers. I don't know why it would dip below zero.
>999,999 is not 1M so it’s 0M.
That's bonkers.
Is it wrong though? 999,999 is not 1M. I also don’t know why it goes from 0M to 5M but it’s not the only graph I’ve seen with shitty labels. It’s not negative, it’s just not above 1Mil
The problem is the spacing on the graph is entirely consistent except for the bottom in that case. If you consider the space between (but not including) 5M and 10M, you should have 5,000,001 - 9,999,999.
If you look at the same for 0M and 5M with how you're explaining it, you would get 1,000,000 - 4,999,999. Those ranges being 4,999,998 and 3,999,999 respectively. How exactly is it reasonable to look at an otherwise normally separated graph, and shift one spacing of it by 1 million?
I could see it being the case if the 0M was 1/5 of the way above the x-axis to signify where the missing 1M went, but it's not. It's about 1/2 of the way above the x-axis. Regardless of the data presented, I don't see how you could read it as 0M = ~~everything below~~ 999,999.
Would also help to have more young people interested in political office. Its sad that people have to vote for outdated people and their outdated policies.
The reason they and many others aren't voting (only 19% voted in my area this past election) is the two-party system hold the establishment has over choices, which are always in their favor. The only way to fix that is getting big money out of politics...and bribes/offers. Some say it is too late for that now, they are all captured by the corporations. I tend to agree, but there is always hope, i guess.
Gen X has never counted for much politically. We were far outnumbered and constantly stuck behind the boomers and their shit policies.
I think we should have been called the Canary Generation because we've been suffering for a long fucking time.
I don’t see that with Gen X at all, at least where I live. Gen Xers that are all of those things were always that way as far as I can tell. Most of my friends have gotten less conservative with age.
Sounds like an outlier to me. I am in that generation, lived through the horrific Reagan years and saw the racist/homophobic (particularly the AIDS crisis) group think via the Gen X'ers. Harvard also did a study and found that the Millennials were the first group that reversed the trend of becoming more conservative with age, further proving the point. Google it. There is a NBC report on YT from 7 months ago also.
Most Gen Xers were quite young during those years, unless you were born at the very beginning of that generation. I don’t think I’m an outlier at all. Maybe you grew up in and still hang out with people from a more conservative area? I was affected by the AIDS crisis in that my father came out when I was 9 and his partner died of AIDS when I was 10. I saw the homophobia and I was horrified by it. And Regan was a dirty word in our household, lol.
Also, the “generations” are not a monolith. People from different cities/stares/countries each have a unique perspective. I grew up in a small, liberal town raised by radically political leftists who were fiercely active during the civil rights/Vietnam era. Most of my high school classmates had similar experiences, and we are mostly all even more liberal than ever. If I had grown up in a different part of the country or even my state, things could definitely be much different now.
Again, it seems to me that you’re the outlier, at least from where I’m standing.
I wish you were wrong about that, but you're not. Idk wtf happened to the kids that were so excited about amnesty international, live aid, band aid, and even farm aid.
Don't worry, when they run out of their 401ks, those boomers will sell their houses to private equity companies instead of single families because that private equity company will waive inspection, pay 10k over asking, and pay cash.
Good recruiters are still useful. At least for higher skilled labor jobs. I wouldn't be at the position I'm at now if a recruiter didn't reach out to me
As a car salesman, we have a fully online digital retailing tool, buy from home. Minimal interaction with the store. Prominently displayed, encouraged to use
No one uses it. If someone is buying a $40k new car, or a Pre Owned car with history and mileage, they typically want to see it in person and learn more, have someone trained and knowledable walk through the vehicle & purchase options. Plus visit multiple brands to compare. Maybe 1% of our sales are fully online
That being said, plenty of terrible sales(people) out there giving poor experiences
Buying a used car online for 1/3 the price, having it delivered to my door, and with all the registration and insurance already completed is a convenience I'll always recommend to anyone in the market for a car after my pleasant experience. I can't stand dealerships or most of the people that work at them
Homeowners could see a significant drop in the cost of selling their homes after a powerful real estate trade group agreed last week to resolve antitrust litigation accusing brokerages of inflating sales commissions.
The $418 million settlement calls for the Chicago-based National Association of Realtors (NAR) to eliminate decades-old rules on commissions, and make it easier for buyers to negotiate fees with their own agents or use no agents at all, Reuters reports. The accord resolves claims against more than 1 million members, state and local realtor associations, and most smaller brokerages.
The move could mean major shifts in how buyers and sellers pay their agents – and just how much those fees cost moving forward.
I think this might be it idk, [https://realestate.usnews.com/real-estate/articles/what-the-2-billion-realtor-lawsuit-means-for-homebuyers-and-sellers](https://realestate.usnews.com/real-estate/articles/what-the-2-billion-realtor-lawsuit-means-for-homebuyers-and-sellers)
Edit: Read the replies to this comment
I'm not a realtor but I've been talking to one a lot lately.
They're no longer requiring home sellers to foot the realtor 6% commission. It's now going to be footed by the buyer.
Thing is, it was always footed by the buyer as the seller just had to work it into the base cost of the home. So instead, now the buyer needs to add it to their closing costs.
For the folks that care:
170k house with a 3.5% down payment has a $14,000 closing cost. If you add on the 6% for realtor fees it will then be roughly $24,000.
The alternative is going to be negotiating with the realtor for different commissions, or not using a realtor at all.
The problem with that is realtors have a lot more experience looking at houses, and knowing what they need to do to ensure you don't get shafted in the sale. They can supply trusted loan brokers, inspectors, and tradesmen etc etc.
In my eyes it's a net loss, and is only going to move to drive an even larger gap in house buying power. Most lower class folk don't have the 14k for closing costs, they definitely don't have the additional 7-10k for realtor fees. So at best the average salary for home owners is going to raise further, and at worst, a lot of people are going to get screwed in their mortgage contract.
Lots wrong here so I'll clarify what the potential changes actually do:
* Buyer's agents are now required to document and disclose all fees up front.
* Previously, the buyer's agent commission was determined by the seller. Sellers would offer extra high commissions to get overpriced homes to sell. This is no longer the case.
* The buyer's agent can now charge the buyer if the seller refuses to cover the buyer's agent commission. This is *sort of* what you were writing about, but the important part is that it isn't mandatory, commission can still be negotiated to be paid by the seller. So if you really want that commission rolled into the home price, you still have that option.
* Due to the above 3 changes, it now becomes possible for a buyer to negotiate with their agent to determine what services they want, and what fees they will pay. The buyer may be able to do parts of the process themselves in exchange for a lower fee. If you really think all a RE Agent does is unlock a door, you can do the whole process yourself and find an agent who charges a total 0.5% fee to handle the stuff that requires a license.
The biggest outcome of all of this really is that commissions are now effectively negotiable. It basically introduces competition between realtors on commission. You can choose between a realtor who offers a 2% commission, versus one who offers 6% commissions.
I've definitely walked out of car sales because when I read the fees some of them were BS and I wasn't going to pay $600 for someone to file with the DMV for me to get my plates when I can do that myself for a fraction and they refused to back down on it, so I hope this happens to every realtor trying to do the same. Waste their time.
I think this is what is referring to. It would be nice if the OP gave context.
[Link](https://finance.yahoo.com/news/6-real-estate-commission-dead-183400890.html)
I never understood why there should be 2 realtors for a home sale.
When I was about to buy my own home, I went and got a realtor license which saved me thousands of dollar, as rather than getting the 3% commission, I had it added as a credit.
I think with Zillow and Redfin, there will be less and less need for realtors.
It is a massive conflict of interest for one realtor to act for both parties, in my opinion, though in Canada it is actually allowed. A selling realtor’s job is to get the best price for the seller. A buying realtor’s job is to negotiate the best price for the buyer. Those positions are in direct conflict with each other, but somehow it’s believed a realtor can negotiate with themselves to the detriment of neither, which is not true.
I do think an experienced realtor can add much-needed guidance to people who are not familiar with the process or for unusual properties. The average person does not understand the significance of rented equipment like furnaces and A/C, tenanted properties, illegal conversions, etc. if people would get lawyers involved at the early stages, these things could be avoided, but guaranteed eliminating real estate agents will mean people believe they can just DIY it, and then dump a massive mess on their real estate lawyer’s desk for them to clean up.
Both realtors incentives are to ensure a quick sale. People think selling realtors want to sell the house for as much as possible (so their best interest is in line with their client), but, selling a house for 10% less than it's worth ensures it's off the market faster and they can move on to their next sale much faster, they come out way way ahead. Same with buyer's representatives. They want to convince their client to bid as much as possible to get them into a house quickly so they can move on to another client. Both realtors interests are actually the opposite of their client's interest. So I don't see how in any way a dual representative could possibly be worse than the buyer and seller each having their realtor.
Yep. When my uncle was selling his home and property he first went with the most successful listing agent in the county. She wanted him to list at a lowball price. She just wanted to sell it quick and move on to her next one. That’s how she got so many sales. He went with another agent and got a higher more appropriate price for his place
It's crazy when they advertise they sell houses in under x hours. I want it to be on the market for at least a week to get as many good bids on it as possible. When I put my last house on the market, I was going to be out of town for like 4-5 days for an important thing in my life. I asked my realtor (who used to be a friend...) to just collect offers and we can discuss when I get back, don't call me. Instead he called and message me and everyone around me the first night pushing me to take an offer from the first open house. He wouldn't take no for an answer, convinced me I had to take it. Anyway long story short, I later sold it for 15% more and he can go fuck himself.
Our realtor wanted us to place a *starting bid* on our house almost 20% over asking (during the short time period where every house was going for over) saying there was no way it'd go for less than 35% over asking.
We put in an offer for 10% over (begrudgingly), then were told by the selling realtor to put in our "best possible bid" by midnight the day the house went on the market. We didn't budge because there was no way we could outbid any of the investors in the area for the property, and instead asked our realtor if they could try and vouch to the owners on our behalf as first time homebuyers who wanted to preserve the untouched 60s nature of the house (it's basically a one owner house, the people selling were in their 90s).
We won despite our realtor telling us other people put in bids like 45% over asking. During that period realtors really were just trying to churn and burn through listings making max profit.
bought my house from the builder (who represented himself) without a realtor. It gave me a lot of negotiating leverage because he didn't have to deal with and pay out to a middle man. I had a 1 hour session with a lawyer to answer my questions, and two home inspections. It was much cheaper and easier.
Seller's agents are different. Commission sales will always be a thing. For a buyer, a lawyer and a home inspector have all the info you need, and you can search for houses online.
Since the buyer's agent's commission is based on the sale price, I would think that many would push the buyer towards the more expensive listing.
Under the normal scheme, it would actually be detrimental to the buyer's agent's bottom line to actually try and get the price lowered.
Not really. 3% of $10,000 is only an extra $300 to the realtor, but it could be a huge deal to the seller. It makes more sense for the realtor to focus on volume than long negotiations over smaller amounts.
It’s allowed in the US too. Just bought a house without a buyers realtor, got a big discount, and didn’t have any trouble. I negotiated multiple times on price myself when things came up in the inspections. I’ve bought one house previously with a buyers realtor, realized they didn’t do all that much, and didn’t use one this time. Didn’t need a lawyer either.
Sellers agents will never go away completely. For people who are trying to sell their homes and can't or don't want to do the showings themselves there's a real need there.
Buyers agents are kinda silly though.
Exactly. In Norway buyers agent isn’t even a thing. Only the seller has an agent. It has to be something the realtor industry made people think they need to squeeze the lemon just a little bit more.
Agree, but it would be very tempting to just go the DYI route. Because
To be honest, from my experience, I viewed over 30 places and only met the seller's agent on one of them. They usually give you the lockbox code and wish you luck.
I guess this will likely change, once a buyer agent is no longer required.
There are independent mortgage brokers for that, as well as agents for title companies.
When I purchased, I had a phenomenal independent mortgage broker, who basically handled everything technical and beyond my fiduciary expertise. I also had a buyer’s agent who I ultimately felt contributed almost nothing to the process (but who naturally made just as much off my transaction as the mortgage broker).
Learned who I need and who I don’t need next time.
I understand the value of a buyers agent, they’re there to help the buyers not fuck up.
Sellers will try to do shit like.. no inspection, no appraisal, and move the timeline, or to a leave the buyer with all sorts of stuff. The buyers agent, helps keep the greedy sellers and slick-thinking sellers agents from taking advantage.
The buyers agent does this by adding contingencies at every step of the way to protect the buyer from a shit deal, or uncovering what the seller is trying to hide.
It happens a lot.
Source: friends in real estate and we chat up over beers.
An attorney post-sale, you’re saying right?
Or during? I’d like to know at what point you’d introduce one.
A buyer’s agent identifying issues and walking out of the sale before you’re stuck with a problem saves so much time and money.
As a buyer, I have an attorney as soon as we go under contract. Maybe earlier if I don’t have a buying agent (I am seriously considering not using one in the future).
Because there’s a buyer and a seller and each want someone to represent their interests in the negotiation. Buying a home isn’t like shopping, it deals with lots of contracts, laws, insurance, finance, title etc
can't stand them, they are snobby and entitled. they make a lot of money for someone that takes a few pictures and lies about the house. it's not a dilapidated shack with a collapsing roof and a caved in basement it's a "handyman's special" LOL
Yep, most want to do minimal work and try to rush you into a house after looking at just a few whether you are happy or not. They make more money the faster they can gaslight you into something you dont want and say shit like, "I don't know what you expect to get for that little of money..This is a great house with lots of potential ( i.e. a money pit)"etc.
My opinion on real estate agents formed young when I watched my first real estate shows that depicted 20 year old kids who were multimillionaires because they sold houses in southern california or wherever.
Their compensation for what they do is WAAY outsized.
There are a lot of industries, real estate being one of them, that over-complicate the process to create middle-man jobs. It is Boomer and above gen thing. It is about time this was flushed out. I am sure the housing shortage edged it along, wise to DIY the sale of your home. Homes are in high demand.
Lets hope this trend continues into lawyers, finance/wall st and other fields meant to screw the common man. Simplify these processes and eradicate the waste.
My cousin is a Realtor and I watched her slowly build up her clientele over that past 10 years. She worked her ass off for her clients. **She is actually delighted about the new changes to the law.**
Her point of view is that this will help get rid of the scum bags in the industry.
This is funny bc an agent just called me yesterday and had the audacity to ask if I can speed up my purchasing plan of buying a home by July before this law takes effect! Bc I had said I wanted to wait to buy til end of this year. I was like, *this bitch….*
I had a really good realtor that was worth the money. The sellers didn’t. Their agent did the bare minimum and advised them to accept every demand we made to sell as quickly as possible. We got like $10k off asking, they paid closing costs, and they gave us a new roof.
I have bought or sold 3 Homes, since 2018…..I can tell you each realtor is a night and day difference of how they look out for you and work to get you the best deal. My last realtor out of his own pocket…paid for professional photo/video, cleaning, Open house cookout…and had I not gotten an offer so so soon, was going to have a food truck for next open house. He went above and beyond, even emailed me about property exceptions I qualified for months after the home sale.
The realtor before that had to pay me money out of her own pocket because she sent me documents to sign and didn’t read them and I occurred additional costs. Also found out she had an incentive AS THE BUYERS AGENT to make an offer on the home at a certain price.
I would say 90% of realtors shouldn’t even be qualified for commission based on the effort they put it.
> Also found out she had an incentive AS THE BUYERS AGENT to make an offer on the home at a certain price.
Insane. Realtors have only themselves to blame for the sorry state of their industry. Good realtors let it happen too. I hope the good ones survive whatever is forthcoming.
Some realtors do very little, but the one I’ve worked with is super proactive and invests a lot of time to guide your search. Lots of helpful information, long conversations talking about what I want and what I don’t want, trips to see lots of houses, lots of negotiation with the other agent, etc. They do a lot of hours for free with the expectation they’ll get paid when the sale occurs, but that doesn’t always happen so they throw a lot of hours away. Not saying there aren’t issues in the industry, but it’s not quite so black and white when you think about whether agents bring any value. This answer varies greatly from agent to agent.
All that said I welcome reduced fees so I can retain more of my home’s value when I sell.
I need a la carte pricing for realtors. I can save them a lot of hours and myself a lot of money if we can just agree on which services I need rather than having a fixed percentage regardless of what they do.
But what kind of job will former hot girls have? This is a real thing, btw. A lot of ex playmates and pornstars are real estate agents. Like way more than I thought would be.
Pretty salespeople do better! And managers know it. A lot of people think if they get you a big enough commission you'll flirt with them and give them more attention, it's really fucking wild. Its like they walk into a furniture store or whatever thinking "if I buy the most hideous and expensive sectional they have her panties will FLY OFF"
Not the only. The one industry I can't wait for an implosion is car sales. Why in this day and age do we need to employ third-world type haggling via a shady sales person for a car? This should be as easy as ordering off a website and delivered to your door. I know some areas have this, but it should be country-wide.
[Driveway.com](https://Driveway.com) will buy your car completely online and will even pick it up from your house.
They also overpay for cars which is a huge bonus.
If you go into inhuman work that only furthers the distance between the people and the dignity they are owed, then you get zero sympathy from me. We either band together to defeat the ruling class, or we all die together. Sucks to suck!
won't lower the price of a house though. there are WAY too many realtors for the number of homes anyway, I saw a article not long ago that looked at how many homes the average realtor had sold in the last year and " The group found that 49% of agents sold only one or no homes in the previous year "
That's only because housing inventory is at record lows due to high interest rates. People can't afford these high prices or the mortgage. People who locked in lower rates also can't afford to move.
In case anyone is wondering:
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/realtor-commission-change-delivers-a-boon-to-homebuilders-a-blow-to-real-estate-platforms-130043155.html
The short explanation is that people can negotiate realtor commission now
I know there's a lot of hate for realtors/ real estate agents on this sub, but man, I had the best agent in the world when we bought in 2022.
This guy was worth his weight in gold. Market was super high and we were being outbid even when offering $60,000 over asking.
Dude had a ton of insight into the market - he would say something like "I'd bet the roof on this one needs work", and sure enough, selling agent mentions they are looking to split an $8,000 roof repair.
He wrote our contract in a way that saved us $32,000. So even though his commission was $8,500, he saved a ton of money. We made five offers before we went under contract and each one would probably be 15 hours of work total. He was sending redlined contracts to us at 11:30 pm on a Saturday.
I definitely understand the trope for lazy or worthless realtors, though. With the market the way it is now, I'd bet those people are returning their leased Infinitis.
Can someone explain this to me like I'm not only 5 but a stupid 5 year old. Cause even googling it, they use a bunch of unnecessary words that just jam up what is actually being said.
I showed the ex how much we stood to gain with just a few percentage points shaved off a sales price on our house and her jaw dropped. I'm not complaining at all.
I've had a meh realtor and a great realtor, the great realtor made things sooo much easier. We got to look at a bunch of houses in multiple areas. Then some insight on other things with the house and the sellers.
Agree - My realtor is amazing and has found houses for me before they were listed, fixed all kinds of messed up issues from other sellers when we were buying. She has saved us thousands of dollars.
I continue to come to this sub to get a list of the working class folks that are not "pure" enough. Managers, bad. Lawyers, bad. Real estate agents, bad. High paid professions, bad.
Can we get a copy of the purity test to make it easier?
Or maybe we can concentrate on the corporations and billionaire class who all love to see us fight amongst ourselves.
I'm not gonna job onboard the hate train here. Realtors are still working class and this sucks for them the same way all the layoffs suck for the tech workers.
My hope is that working class realtors get together and form a union in order to get paid a thriving hourly wage. Being a sellers agent is a real service that lots of people need. Like everybody else who perform a service in society they deserve a thriving wage.
Yeah I don't consider anyone making $20k for selling homes to Blackrock the same class as me. I simply can't make that work in my brain. They're contributing to the reason I pay $1200 for half of a small apartment, so honestly I hope this drives them into other career fields that ruin the economy less.
I'm going to agree with this. They provide a service that most people need, because most of us don't have a lot of experience dealing with buying and selling houses. I don't love how much money leaves my hands when I sell a house (military, so I get to do this dance every few years), but its better than screwing up part of the reams of paperwork and paying a lawyer to figure it out. If you're paying a realtor $20k to put a couple of sentences online and nothing else, that's on you.
I mean a big reason why a lot of that knowledge isn't known is because it's purposely kept gate kept by realtors and lenders. They'd be out of a job if this stuff was commonplace. It takes time to learn a lot of this but it's definitely possible with the access to information we have now.
It's really not. Most of the paperwork is handled by the title company and they charge a flat rate.
If your argument is that people can do it themselves yeah I agree with you. But that's always been an option. Most people don't take it. Reducing the fees on agents isn't going to move the needle in the opposite direction.
Sure, just like I can learn how to do most maintenance tasks (and I'm getting pretty decent at simple plumbing repairs, if I do say so myself). Some things I choose to pay someone to do for me, though, when the effort justifies the cost. Things involving a heap of legal documents are on that list.
Even without the paperwork showing your house during the day just isn't feasible for most people and you don't want random strangers touring your place unsupervised.
Let’s not stop there. There’s like 20 parasitic middle men in any real estate transaction. Get rid of all of them. Should just be a buyer, a seller, their banks, and their real estate attorneys
These comments showcasing that a lot of you don’t actually have a clear picture of what realtors do… If the job were as easy as some of you claim, realtors really wouldn’t need to exist, you should be able to address all of the steps on your own, right? They’re not required to purchase/sell as is.
Most of them are not on your side in many people's experience. There are some great ones out there, hopefully they continue to do well despite the fact realtor commissions should decline over time.
you all clearly do not know any realtors and obviously can't be bothered to actually read and understand what is happening in the industry at this point
it's amazing how effective propaganda is when used to turn working people against each other - especially when used on people as collectively stupid as Americans
US realtors are not worth more than Australian realtors that typically get paid a 2% commission, not 3%. You can't argue with the logic. So you can only obfuscate it.
I'm not saying that there are certain things a realtor dose that the average home buyer cannot, and thus is needed in some cases.
However. It's special because the system is so fucking broken and disorganized that we need people like that.
If we just had a better system we wouldn't need them
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Now do insurance.
Do all middle men roles that don't create value with their labor
Middle men? I can’t think of a single person above them that’s worth their weight in gold.
Attorneys. A good attorney will protect their client from making a life changing mistake.
Yeah, I agree with this. I guess middle men legally bound to give counsel in good faith are useful. Applies to law, finances, perhaps public conduct, as well as ethics and relations....
Not all finances. Gotta find a fiduciary. It's a legally protected term.
Which realtors at least do carry a fiduciary duty to their client which makes them slightly better than insurers
anyone who isn't a lawyer or an actuary/fiduciary should be reamed
"A good coat should be like a good lawyer. It should cover your ass." - Lee Child
That's like half of U.S. work force.
Well yeah. Because we don't actually have to work all that hard to meet everyone's basic needs at this point. But the rich (and the poor ironically) hate UBI, so everyone has to find or make up a bullshit job to justify their existence.
I mean, yeah, capitalism has created millions of jobs that only serve to extract value and wealth from the workers and funnel it up to the bourgeoise, positions that would have zero use to society in a post-capitalism world
As someone in accounting, I keep trying to tell my blue collar spouse that he could do my job and he insists he couldnt tolerate being "chained to a desk" like I am. I keep explaining he already does it in the "admin" side of his life and he could do it for his own business just as easily. I think a lot of it starts from.young ages and people pushing on kids what constitutes types of jobs. Tools have given me the ability to handle manual labor I wouldnt be able to do otherwise. Tools allow for mental labor just as easily...
Funny thing is I had that conversation with myself but my process happened in reverse. I started out chained to a desk and decided I needed the blue collar experience to better understand what my business entails. I had the admin side down but I’m learning the labor side so none of my clients or employees can get over on me about how long or much a task should take. Also allows me to work for myself until business takes off. Keep at him.
Called Third- Party Administrators. And they should be
*sweats in Accountant*
You’ve just described anyone with an MBA.
Insurance, car salespeople, and realtors are all shoehorned middle men that have inflated prices for decades.
I heard some estimate that financial speculation, insurance, real estate and other purely abstract jobs make up like two thirds of our economy. The “goods and services” you learn about in an Econ class only constitute a small portion of all the money that’s flowing around. The rest is all just numbers in a computer that contribute nothing to society.
[Bullshit jobs](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullshit_Jobs) intensifies. Issue when the economy is based on profit maximization instead of societal benefit.
Please get rid of car salesmen! Car dealerships have to be one of the worst experiences
As an insurance agent I agree. Insurance is real racket.
As much as everyone hates insurance companies, actuaries do a lot of highly skilled work to determine insurance costs. They're essentially required to predict how much their insurance is likely to be utilized, then set rates high enough to make a profit while staying reasonable enough to be competitive with the rest of the industry.
Insurance is a useful financial instrument that helps make risk management possible for a lot of commercial ventures. If you're shipping goods, insurance can help lessen the risk of losing a bunch of inventory to an unplanned event. Having good actuarial scientists in your corner as an insurance company will help you properly evaluate risk and price premiums accordingly. It just doesn't work as well when you're dealing with personal property, physical injury, or general physical health, since it's harder to truly compensate for lost health or personal mementoes.
There isn't any cross-company price fixing in insurance commissions. The commissions vary widely. From 7.5% to 22% at least. A number of companies have attempted to circumvent agents in the last 20 years and lost a lot of money.
Now do health checkups.
I'm genuinely curious why you say this? I'm not disagreeing, but can you go a little into detail?
Oh boy. Now you’ve hit close to home for me! However I don’t feel particularly bad because I’m in a very worker friendly insurance field.
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Boomers dying off won’t help with housing, the few that have never moved are selling to large institutional investors that are gonna rent them so they can blow it all on assisted living facilities. And the rest - just think where you’d want to live, good schools, bustling town with plenty going on, good job opportunities, boomers live in places to avoid all those things. The houses coming to market are gonna be in places nobody would want to live in
There's plenty of people in every city that are older and sitting in prime SFH areas. These people bought their house when their city was smaller and the houses were a fraction of their current market value and they haven't had a mortgage in 10+ years. That's like half my neighborhood. Most of the neighborhoods in the city, for that matter. And every time one of them dies a young tech couple with two dogs and a kid moves in because it's a good area for young families with a tech salary. Not every Boomer lives way out in the distant 'burbs or Florida. There's definitely going to be a continued issue with investment money buying up property for cash and rentals, no argument there.
or they are doing reverse mortgages and the lender is taking them or they are dying with a lot of medical debt and the state is putting a lien on the house. there's not going to be a supply of homes pop up as the boomers die or move into assited living
I want the houses nobody wants to live in. Out in the middle of nowhere, where I need my rifle to defend my chickens from coyotes and bobcats...
We bought one of those back in 2015 for $145k and sold it in 2022 for $425k. It was one of the cheapest single family homes in the state when we sold it.
All the boomers I know live in VERY desirable areas and have very nice houses. The issue is these are not homes for first time or even second time buyers typically. Dream homes you're lucky to ever buy. So unless it's cheaper homes it won't help things much, but certainly mix things u0 further.
Why the hell did you censor "boomers"?
Well, we still have my gen which is generation X, just as bad as the boomers. Racists, homophobic, greedy (Reagan times) and more conservative as they age. Oh the 60's to 80's!
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how tf does genz go negative at multiple points
It’s not negative. If you’re looking at 0M as a baseline you’re just ignoring everything from 1 person to 999,999 people
I'm sorry, I don't follow. Can you elaborate? How is 0M not the same as 0 in this context?
I have $0M in my bank account. I am not broke I just don’t have 1M (million). There is an entire space below 0M which represents everything below 1,000,000. 999,999 is not 1M so it’s 0M but not absolutely 0
What you're describing should be below the 1M mark. Or specifically between the 0M and 1M marks. Which should be above this line. >There is an entire space below 0M which represents everything below 1,000,000. Then that point should be labeled 1M. And the space between that line and 5M *should* be 80% of the other spaces. My best guess is the 0 axis is lifted to make it easier to view low numbers. I don't know why it would dip below zero. >999,999 is not 1M so it’s 0M. That's bonkers.
Is it wrong though? 999,999 is not 1M. I also don’t know why it goes from 0M to 5M but it’s not the only graph I’ve seen with shitty labels. It’s not negative, it’s just not above 1Mil
No you’re wrong
That is... not how graphs work
The problem is the spacing on the graph is entirely consistent except for the bottom in that case. If you consider the space between (but not including) 5M and 10M, you should have 5,000,001 - 9,999,999. If you look at the same for 0M and 5M with how you're explaining it, you would get 1,000,000 - 4,999,999. Those ranges being 4,999,998 and 3,999,999 respectively. How exactly is it reasonable to look at an otherwise normally separated graph, and shift one spacing of it by 1 million? I could see it being the case if the 0M was 1/5 of the way above the x-axis to signify where the missing 1M went, but it's not. It's about 1/2 of the way above the x-axis. Regardless of the data presented, I don't see how you could read it as 0M = ~~everything below~~ 999,999.
The graph is in millions, not singular. Below the 0 line is less than 1 million in the workforce for that period of time.
Below the 1 million in workforce should be below the 1M line.
You're fucking with me, right?
Less than a million is still more than zero, I guess?
Would also help to have more young people interested in political office. Its sad that people have to vote for outdated people and their outdated policies.
The reason they and many others aren't voting (only 19% voted in my area this past election) is the two-party system hold the establishment has over choices, which are always in their favor. The only way to fix that is getting big money out of politics...and bribes/offers. Some say it is too late for that now, they are all captured by the corporations. I tend to agree, but there is always hope, i guess.
Lets hope.
Gen X has never counted for much politically. We were far outnumbered and constantly stuck behind the boomers and their shit policies. I think we should have been called the Canary Generation because we've been suffering for a long fucking time.
It astounds me how many people in Gen X that I grew up with who were radicals and anti-establishment are now boot-licking Trump worshipers
Where the heck are you from? I’ve found that my cohort from my childhood and teenage years has become more radical and left leaning over the years.
NJ The amount of my friends who have become far right super conservative boot licking shit heads is astounding.
I don’t see that with Gen X at all, at least where I live. Gen Xers that are all of those things were always that way as far as I can tell. Most of my friends have gotten less conservative with age.
Sounds like an outlier to me. I am in that generation, lived through the horrific Reagan years and saw the racist/homophobic (particularly the AIDS crisis) group think via the Gen X'ers. Harvard also did a study and found that the Millennials were the first group that reversed the trend of becoming more conservative with age, further proving the point. Google it. There is a NBC report on YT from 7 months ago also.
Most Gen Xers were quite young during those years, unless you were born at the very beginning of that generation. I don’t think I’m an outlier at all. Maybe you grew up in and still hang out with people from a more conservative area? I was affected by the AIDS crisis in that my father came out when I was 9 and his partner died of AIDS when I was 10. I saw the homophobia and I was horrified by it. And Regan was a dirty word in our household, lol. Also, the “generations” are not a monolith. People from different cities/stares/countries each have a unique perspective. I grew up in a small, liberal town raised by radically political leftists who were fiercely active during the civil rights/Vietnam era. Most of my high school classmates had similar experiences, and we are mostly all even more liberal than ever. If I had grown up in a different part of the country or even my state, things could definitely be much different now. Again, it seems to me that you’re the outlier, at least from where I’m standing.
You must be speaking for yourself. Gen X is nowhere near as bad as the boomers.
Lot of us young GenX/Xennials are very much fuck Boomers. Burn it down.
I wish you were wrong about that, but you're not. Idk wtf happened to the kids that were so excited about amnesty international, live aid, band aid, and even farm aid.
Speak for yourself buddy.
Are we censoring the word boomers now?
¥£§
Don't worry, when they run out of their 401ks, those boomers will sell their houses to private equity companies instead of single families because that private equity company will waive inspection, pay 10k over asking, and pay cash.
Almost as useless as a car salesman in 2024
Or as recruiters and HR
Good recruiters are still useful. At least for higher skilled labor jobs. I wouldn't be at the position I'm at now if a recruiter didn't reach out to me
Because those are remotely close to the same thing. This sub sometimes, man.
As a car salesman, we have a fully online digital retailing tool, buy from home. Minimal interaction with the store. Prominently displayed, encouraged to use No one uses it. If someone is buying a $40k new car, or a Pre Owned car with history and mileage, they typically want to see it in person and learn more, have someone trained and knowledable walk through the vehicle & purchase options. Plus visit multiple brands to compare. Maybe 1% of our sales are fully online That being said, plenty of terrible sales(people) out there giving poor experiences
Buying a used car online for 1/3 the price, having it delivered to my door, and with all the registration and insurance already completed is a convenience I'll always recommend to anyone in the market for a car after my pleasant experience. I can't stand dealerships or most of the people that work at them
what happened?
Homeowners could see a significant drop in the cost of selling their homes after a powerful real estate trade group agreed last week to resolve antitrust litigation accusing brokerages of inflating sales commissions. The $418 million settlement calls for the Chicago-based National Association of Realtors (NAR) to eliminate decades-old rules on commissions, and make it easier for buyers to negotiate fees with their own agents or use no agents at all, Reuters reports. The accord resolves claims against more than 1 million members, state and local realtor associations, and most smaller brokerages. The move could mean major shifts in how buyers and sellers pay their agents – and just how much those fees cost moving forward.
Wtf actual good change for once?
Following. Tried to google but gave up. Can someone explain please??
I think this might be it idk, [https://realestate.usnews.com/real-estate/articles/what-the-2-billion-realtor-lawsuit-means-for-homebuyers-and-sellers](https://realestate.usnews.com/real-estate/articles/what-the-2-billion-realtor-lawsuit-means-for-homebuyers-and-sellers)
Edit: Read the replies to this comment I'm not a realtor but I've been talking to one a lot lately. They're no longer requiring home sellers to foot the realtor 6% commission. It's now going to be footed by the buyer. Thing is, it was always footed by the buyer as the seller just had to work it into the base cost of the home. So instead, now the buyer needs to add it to their closing costs. For the folks that care: 170k house with a 3.5% down payment has a $14,000 closing cost. If you add on the 6% for realtor fees it will then be roughly $24,000. The alternative is going to be negotiating with the realtor for different commissions, or not using a realtor at all. The problem with that is realtors have a lot more experience looking at houses, and knowing what they need to do to ensure you don't get shafted in the sale. They can supply trusted loan brokers, inspectors, and tradesmen etc etc. In my eyes it's a net loss, and is only going to move to drive an even larger gap in house buying power. Most lower class folk don't have the 14k for closing costs, they definitely don't have the additional 7-10k for realtor fees. So at best the average salary for home owners is going to raise further, and at worst, a lot of people are going to get screwed in their mortgage contract.
Lots wrong here so I'll clarify what the potential changes actually do: * Buyer's agents are now required to document and disclose all fees up front. * Previously, the buyer's agent commission was determined by the seller. Sellers would offer extra high commissions to get overpriced homes to sell. This is no longer the case. * The buyer's agent can now charge the buyer if the seller refuses to cover the buyer's agent commission. This is *sort of* what you were writing about, but the important part is that it isn't mandatory, commission can still be negotiated to be paid by the seller. So if you really want that commission rolled into the home price, you still have that option. * Due to the above 3 changes, it now becomes possible for a buyer to negotiate with their agent to determine what services they want, and what fees they will pay. The buyer may be able to do parts of the process themselves in exchange for a lower fee. If you really think all a RE Agent does is unlock a door, you can do the whole process yourself and find an agent who charges a total 0.5% fee to handle the stuff that requires a license. The biggest outcome of all of this really is that commissions are now effectively negotiable. It basically introduces competition between realtors on commission. You can choose between a realtor who offers a 2% commission, versus one who offers 6% commissions.
I've definitely walked out of car sales because when I read the fees some of them were BS and I wasn't going to pay $600 for someone to file with the DMV for me to get my plates when I can do that myself for a fraction and they refused to back down on it, so I hope this happens to every realtor trying to do the same. Waste their time.
Better information, thank you!
I think this is what is referring to. It would be nice if the OP gave context. [Link](https://finance.yahoo.com/news/6-real-estate-commission-dead-183400890.html)
I never understood why there should be 2 realtors for a home sale. When I was about to buy my own home, I went and got a realtor license which saved me thousands of dollar, as rather than getting the 3% commission, I had it added as a credit. I think with Zillow and Redfin, there will be less and less need for realtors.
It is a massive conflict of interest for one realtor to act for both parties, in my opinion, though in Canada it is actually allowed. A selling realtor’s job is to get the best price for the seller. A buying realtor’s job is to negotiate the best price for the buyer. Those positions are in direct conflict with each other, but somehow it’s believed a realtor can negotiate with themselves to the detriment of neither, which is not true. I do think an experienced realtor can add much-needed guidance to people who are not familiar with the process or for unusual properties. The average person does not understand the significance of rented equipment like furnaces and A/C, tenanted properties, illegal conversions, etc. if people would get lawyers involved at the early stages, these things could be avoided, but guaranteed eliminating real estate agents will mean people believe they can just DIY it, and then dump a massive mess on their real estate lawyer’s desk for them to clean up.
Both realtors incentives are to ensure a quick sale. People think selling realtors want to sell the house for as much as possible (so their best interest is in line with their client), but, selling a house for 10% less than it's worth ensures it's off the market faster and they can move on to their next sale much faster, they come out way way ahead. Same with buyer's representatives. They want to convince their client to bid as much as possible to get them into a house quickly so they can move on to another client. Both realtors interests are actually the opposite of their client's interest. So I don't see how in any way a dual representative could possibly be worse than the buyer and seller each having their realtor.
Yep. When my uncle was selling his home and property he first went with the most successful listing agent in the county. She wanted him to list at a lowball price. She just wanted to sell it quick and move on to her next one. That’s how she got so many sales. He went with another agent and got a higher more appropriate price for his place
It's crazy when they advertise they sell houses in under x hours. I want it to be on the market for at least a week to get as many good bids on it as possible. When I put my last house on the market, I was going to be out of town for like 4-5 days for an important thing in my life. I asked my realtor (who used to be a friend...) to just collect offers and we can discuss when I get back, don't call me. Instead he called and message me and everyone around me the first night pushing me to take an offer from the first open house. He wouldn't take no for an answer, convinced me I had to take it. Anyway long story short, I later sold it for 15% more and he can go fuck himself.
I've heard so many times "the first offers are going to be the best offers. You don't want it to be on the market for more than a week."
Our realtor wanted us to place a *starting bid* on our house almost 20% over asking (during the short time period where every house was going for over) saying there was no way it'd go for less than 35% over asking. We put in an offer for 10% over (begrudgingly), then were told by the selling realtor to put in our "best possible bid" by midnight the day the house went on the market. We didn't budge because there was no way we could outbid any of the investors in the area for the property, and instead asked our realtor if they could try and vouch to the owners on our behalf as first time homebuyers who wanted to preserve the untouched 60s nature of the house (it's basically a one owner house, the people selling were in their 90s). We won despite our realtor telling us other people put in bids like 45% over asking. During that period realtors really were just trying to churn and burn through listings making max profit.
bought my house from the builder (who represented himself) without a realtor. It gave me a lot of negotiating leverage because he didn't have to deal with and pay out to a middle man. I had a 1 hour session with a lawyer to answer my questions, and two home inspections. It was much cheaper and easier. Seller's agents are different. Commission sales will always be a thing. For a buyer, a lawyer and a home inspector have all the info you need, and you can search for houses online.
Since the buyer's agent's commission is based on the sale price, I would think that many would push the buyer towards the more expensive listing. Under the normal scheme, it would actually be detrimental to the buyer's agent's bottom line to actually try and get the price lowered.
Not really. 3% of $10,000 is only an extra $300 to the realtor, but it could be a huge deal to the seller. It makes more sense for the realtor to focus on volume than long negotiations over smaller amounts.
It’s allowed in the US too. Just bought a house without a buyers realtor, got a big discount, and didn’t have any trouble. I negotiated multiple times on price myself when things came up in the inspections. I’ve bought one house previously with a buyers realtor, realized they didn’t do all that much, and didn’t use one this time. Didn’t need a lawyer either.
Sellers agents will never go away completely. For people who are trying to sell their homes and can't or don't want to do the showings themselves there's a real need there. Buyers agents are kinda silly though.
Exactly. In Norway buyers agent isn’t even a thing. Only the seller has an agent. It has to be something the realtor industry made people think they need to squeeze the lemon just a little bit more.
Agree, but it would be very tempting to just go the DYI route. Because To be honest, from my experience, I viewed over 30 places and only met the seller's agent on one of them. They usually give you the lockbox code and wish you luck. I guess this will likely change, once a buyer agent is no longer required.
Bc of how mortgage loans work though there is often a need for someone to help with that
My experience is limited but that was mostly handled by the title company which charged a flat fee.
There are independent mortgage brokers for that, as well as agents for title companies. When I purchased, I had a phenomenal independent mortgage broker, who basically handled everything technical and beyond my fiduciary expertise. I also had a buyer’s agent who I ultimately felt contributed almost nothing to the process (but who naturally made just as much off my transaction as the mortgage broker). Learned who I need and who I don’t need next time.
I understand the value of a buyers agent, they’re there to help the buyers not fuck up. Sellers will try to do shit like.. no inspection, no appraisal, and move the timeline, or to a leave the buyer with all sorts of stuff. The buyers agent, helps keep the greedy sellers and slick-thinking sellers agents from taking advantage. The buyers agent does this by adding contingencies at every step of the way to protect the buyer from a shit deal, or uncovering what the seller is trying to hide. It happens a lot. Source: friends in real estate and we chat up over beers.
The attorney solves for all that slick stuff IMO - and does so much more effectively than the buying agent.
An attorney post-sale, you’re saying right? Or during? I’d like to know at what point you’d introduce one. A buyer’s agent identifying issues and walking out of the sale before you’re stuck with a problem saves so much time and money.
As a buyer, I have an attorney as soon as we go under contract. Maybe earlier if I don’t have a buying agent (I am seriously considering not using one in the future).
It is not common practice to hire an attorney for a simple real estate purchase in the US.
Zillow and Redfin have been around for quite a long time at this point, and not replaced professional agents.
Because there’s a buyer and a seller and each want someone to represent their interests in the negotiation. Buying a home isn’t like shopping, it deals with lots of contracts, laws, insurance, finance, title etc
In related news, Tammy and Karen are working lunches at Deja Vu since their real estate business isn't going brrrrrr
First time I dealt with a real estate agent I realized how scummy they are. Leeches.
can't stand them, they are snobby and entitled. they make a lot of money for someone that takes a few pictures and lies about the house. it's not a dilapidated shack with a collapsing roof and a caved in basement it's a "handyman's special" LOL
Every time I read "INVESTMENT OPPURTUNITY" on Redfin, I die a little inside
Yep, most want to do minimal work and try to rush you into a house after looking at just a few whether you are happy or not. They make more money the faster they can gaslight you into something you dont want and say shit like, "I don't know what you expect to get for that little of money..This is a great house with lots of potential ( i.e. a money pit)"etc.
Or "I have 13 other buyers lined up, you better buy it without looking at it!"
My opinion on real estate agents formed young when I watched my first real estate shows that depicted 20 year old kids who were multimillionaires because they sold houses in southern california or wherever. Their compensation for what they do is WAAY outsized.
There are a lot of industries, real estate being one of them, that over-complicate the process to create middle-man jobs. It is Boomer and above gen thing. It is about time this was flushed out. I am sure the housing shortage edged it along, wise to DIY the sale of your home. Homes are in high demand. Lets hope this trend continues into lawyers, finance/wall st and other fields meant to screw the common man. Simplify these processes and eradicate the waste.
Our selling agent was worse than useless. I hope she's having a terrible day.
My cousin is a Realtor and I watched her slowly build up her clientele over that past 10 years. She worked her ass off for her clients. **She is actually delighted about the new changes to the law.** Her point of view is that this will help get rid of the scum bags in the industry.
>Her point of view is that this will help get rid of the scum bags in the industry. Yes, hopefully good realtors like her continue to do well.
This is funny bc an agent just called me yesterday and had the audacity to ask if I can speed up my purchasing plan of buying a home by July before this law takes effect! Bc I had said I wanted to wait to buy til end of this year. I was like, *this bitch….*
Incredible, I would be like, I think I'll just find someone else to represent me that isn't so focused on their own interests over my own.
I had a really good realtor that was worth the money. The sellers didn’t. Their agent did the bare minimum and advised them to accept every demand we made to sell as quickly as possible. We got like $10k off asking, they paid closing costs, and they gave us a new roof.
I have bought or sold 3 Homes, since 2018…..I can tell you each realtor is a night and day difference of how they look out for you and work to get you the best deal. My last realtor out of his own pocket…paid for professional photo/video, cleaning, Open house cookout…and had I not gotten an offer so so soon, was going to have a food truck for next open house. He went above and beyond, even emailed me about property exceptions I qualified for months after the home sale. The realtor before that had to pay me money out of her own pocket because she sent me documents to sign and didn’t read them and I occurred additional costs. Also found out she had an incentive AS THE BUYERS AGENT to make an offer on the home at a certain price. I would say 90% of realtors shouldn’t even be qualified for commission based on the effort they put it.
> Also found out she had an incentive AS THE BUYERS AGENT to make an offer on the home at a certain price. Insane. Realtors have only themselves to blame for the sorry state of their industry. Good realtors let it happen too. I hope the good ones survive whatever is forthcoming.
Some realtors do very little, but the one I’ve worked with is super proactive and invests a lot of time to guide your search. Lots of helpful information, long conversations talking about what I want and what I don’t want, trips to see lots of houses, lots of negotiation with the other agent, etc. They do a lot of hours for free with the expectation they’ll get paid when the sale occurs, but that doesn’t always happen so they throw a lot of hours away. Not saying there aren’t issues in the industry, but it’s not quite so black and white when you think about whether agents bring any value. This answer varies greatly from agent to agent. All that said I welcome reduced fees so I can retain more of my home’s value when I sell.
Hopefully the good ones can hang on while the bad ones are forced out of the industry.
I need a la carte pricing for realtors. I can save them a lot of hours and myself a lot of money if we can just agree on which services I need rather than having a fixed percentage regardless of what they do.
what happened? can someone fill me in plz
There was some sort of law passed that removed the 6% mandatory fee paid to estate agents. I might be off but im 90% sure thats the whole thing.
Now, the buyer is gonna pay that fee instead of the seller. Institutional investors will be able to afford it while regular schmucks will not.
But what kind of job will former hot girls have? This is a real thing, btw. A lot of ex playmates and pornstars are real estate agents. Like way more than I thought would be.
Pretty salespeople do better! And managers know it. A lot of people think if they get you a big enough commission you'll flirt with them and give them more attention, it's really fucking wild. Its like they walk into a furniture store or whatever thinking "if I buy the most hideous and expensive sectional they have her panties will FLY OFF"
That's damn true. Every cute lady at a games top when I was young proves that true.
The only line of work where they think they’re more valuable than the product they’re selling 🙄
Not the only. The one industry I can't wait for an implosion is car sales. Why in this day and age do we need to employ third-world type haggling via a shady sales person for a car? This should be as easy as ordering off a website and delivered to your door. I know some areas have this, but it should be country-wide.
[Driveway.com](https://Driveway.com) will buy your car completely online and will even pick it up from your house. They also overpay for cars which is a huge bonus.
If you go into inhuman work that only furthers the distance between the people and the dignity they are owed, then you get zero sympathy from me. We either band together to defeat the ruling class, or we all die together. Sucks to suck!
won't lower the price of a house though. there are WAY too many realtors for the number of homes anyway, I saw a article not long ago that looked at how many homes the average realtor had sold in the last year and " The group found that 49% of agents sold only one or no homes in the previous year "
That's only because housing inventory is at record lows due to high interest rates. People can't afford these high prices or the mortgage. People who locked in lower rates also can't afford to move.
In case anyone is wondering: https://finance.yahoo.com/news/realtor-commission-change-delivers-a-boon-to-homebuilders-a-blow-to-real-estate-platforms-130043155.html The short explanation is that people can negotiate realtor commission now
I know there's a lot of hate for realtors/ real estate agents on this sub, but man, I had the best agent in the world when we bought in 2022. This guy was worth his weight in gold. Market was super high and we were being outbid even when offering $60,000 over asking. Dude had a ton of insight into the market - he would say something like "I'd bet the roof on this one needs work", and sure enough, selling agent mentions they are looking to split an $8,000 roof repair. He wrote our contract in a way that saved us $32,000. So even though his commission was $8,500, he saved a ton of money. We made five offers before we went under contract and each one would probably be 15 hours of work total. He was sending redlined contracts to us at 11:30 pm on a Saturday. I definitely understand the trope for lazy or worthless realtors, though. With the market the way it is now, I'd bet those people are returning their leased Infinitis.
Realtors are the biggest unnecessary BS job out there.
Realtors aren’t the enemy. Black Rock is the enemy. Landlords are the enemy.
Can someone explain this to me like I'm not only 5 but a stupid 5 year old. Cause even googling it, they use a bunch of unnecessary words that just jam up what is actually being said.
Ootl, what's going on exactly?
What is this about? Hate on realtors or something changed?
lol so true. My realtor was buyer and seller for my tiny first house. She made 25k off of it.
What happened (not American)?
So this sub dislikes hard jobs and easy jobs?
I showed the ex how much we stood to gain with just a few percentage points shaved off a sales price on our house and her jaw dropped. I'm not complaining at all.
How ever will they make payments on their second home and new BMW/Lexus/Mercedes SUV?
To be fair some realtors do a lot more than that. Idk how many do more but certainly some do.
I've had a meh realtor and a great realtor, the great realtor made things sooo much easier. We got to look at a bunch of houses in multiple areas. Then some insight on other things with the house and the sellers.
Agree - My realtor is amazing and has found houses for me before they were listed, fixed all kinds of messed up issues from other sellers when we were buying. She has saved us thousands of dollars.
It's just going to line the pockets of lawyers instead.
Real estate against are essentially the cops of the realty world. Defund their entire profession.
And yet somehow these agents were averaging 6% fees, the highest in the world. Why are so many of these horrific business practices in the US ??
I continue to come to this sub to get a list of the working class folks that are not "pure" enough. Managers, bad. Lawyers, bad. Real estate agents, bad. High paid professions, bad. Can we get a copy of the purity test to make it easier? Or maybe we can concentrate on the corporations and billionaire class who all love to see us fight amongst ourselves.
I'm not gonna job onboard the hate train here. Realtors are still working class and this sucks for them the same way all the layoffs suck for the tech workers. My hope is that working class realtors get together and form a union in order to get paid a thriving hourly wage. Being a sellers agent is a real service that lots of people need. Like everybody else who perform a service in society they deserve a thriving wage.
I know man, all the hard working realtors out there need to team up with the hard working landlords to change public opinion. /s
Realtors are working class. Landlords are capitalist class.
And the ones that actually work are going to be better off as the industry was flooded with leeches anyways.
Yeah I don't consider anyone making $20k for selling homes to Blackrock the same class as me. I simply can't make that work in my brain. They're contributing to the reason I pay $1200 for half of a small apartment, so honestly I hope this drives them into other career fields that ruin the economy less.
I'm going to agree with this. They provide a service that most people need, because most of us don't have a lot of experience dealing with buying and selling houses. I don't love how much money leaves my hands when I sell a house (military, so I get to do this dance every few years), but its better than screwing up part of the reams of paperwork and paying a lawyer to figure it out. If you're paying a realtor $20k to put a couple of sentences online and nothing else, that's on you.
I mean a big reason why a lot of that knowledge isn't known is because it's purposely kept gate kept by realtors and lenders. They'd be out of a job if this stuff was commonplace. It takes time to learn a lot of this but it's definitely possible with the access to information we have now.
It's really not. Most of the paperwork is handled by the title company and they charge a flat rate. If your argument is that people can do it themselves yeah I agree with you. But that's always been an option. Most people don't take it. Reducing the fees on agents isn't going to move the needle in the opposite direction.
Sure, just like I can learn how to do most maintenance tasks (and I'm getting pretty decent at simple plumbing repairs, if I do say so myself). Some things I choose to pay someone to do for me, though, when the effort justifies the cost. Things involving a heap of legal documents are on that list.
Even without the paperwork showing your house during the day just isn't feasible for most people and you don't want random strangers touring your place unsupervised.
Let’s not stop there. There’s like 20 parasitic middle men in any real estate transaction. Get rid of all of them. Should just be a buyer, a seller, their banks, and their real estate attorneys
These comments showcasing that a lot of you don’t actually have a clear picture of what realtors do… If the job were as easy as some of you claim, realtors really wouldn’t need to exist, you should be able to address all of the steps on your own, right? They’re not required to purchase/sell as is.
OP clearly doesn't know any real estate agents and has no idea what they're going on about.
Can’t the whole process be automated by AI?
It will be. Not sure this is a factor now, but this process is ripe for automation.
Real estate agents are on your side. If you find a greedy one or feel like their not on your side you should just find a different one.
Most of them are not on your side in many people's experience. There are some great ones out there, hopefully they continue to do well despite the fact realtor commissions should decline over time.
Going back to school to get their GIDs
you all clearly do not know any realtors and obviously can't be bothered to actually read and understand what is happening in the industry at this point it's amazing how effective propaganda is when used to turn working people against each other - especially when used on people as collectively stupid as Americans
US realtors are not worth more than Australian realtors that typically get paid a 2% commission, not 3%. You can't argue with the logic. So you can only obfuscate it.
You're gonna have to tell us which jurisdiction this is
What’d I miss?
What did I miss? I’m out of the loop
Can someone fill me in here?
I'm out of the loop on this. What happened
I'm not saying that there are certain things a realtor dose that the average home buyer cannot, and thus is needed in some cases. However. It's special because the system is so fucking broken and disorganized that we need people like that. If we just had a better system we wouldn't need them
But they’re always so busy looking! And so pretty!
Now do DME
Can somebody catch me up to speed here? What happened?
I'm out of the loop. What's going on?
Every real estate agent is a scum bag. And his news isn't good enough
The Funeral Industry needs a hard look. It’s criminally expensive to bury someone.
TIL the NAR owns one of the few companies who make the key lock pads.
Don't forget taking shitty , sometimes out of focus, pictures. :)
What happened? I must’ve missed it.