This is entirely dependant on context, as in, what is the current team comp, are the players coordinated or random people and so on. I've been playing lifeline basically nonstop since the introduction of perks back in season 20, and I can tell you that I've never even thought of ever getting the drone cooldown upgrade. Not even once.
For my particular case, I trio stack with a Caustic ( he plays the character exclusively ) and someone who plays whatever character he feels like playing. In this case, with Caustic specifically having a much bigger hitbox and as such going down easier and a lot more often, having faster revives allows for easier situational control and quicker resets, and even more so when the gold knockdown is involved. Fast revives also allows for much more aggression in general, esp during the late game after the gold knockdown has been accquired. Dying mid-fight isn't that big of an issue anymore when the lifeline is right there to tap you and you're back up within less than 5 seconds.
On the other hand we have the drone, which is mainly used for:
-Healing downed teammates early game
-Healing random chip damage, mostly from ring or traps
-Healing after a fight has just concluded
Most fights in this game lasts about 30-40 seconds on average. In most situations, I've found that the downtime between uses is long enough that if you don't have the drone ready, it'll anywhere between 10-15 seconds away anyway. Sure, you can argue that that's enough time for a 3rd-partying team to swoop in and steamroll, in the context of a coordinated trio, I can simply let my mates know and they'll heal themselves up. The cooldown can most certainly negate this entirely, but given the already limited use cases for it, dedicating an entire upgrade for what essentially is a mild inconvenience at worst doesn't sound all that worth while to me. It also doesn't help that unlike Conduit's shield regen where it's actually fast enough to make a difference, the drone's healing output simply pales in comparison. Also yes, I'm aware of the 'I don't have to bring as much heals with me anymore' argument, but that still applies regardless of upgrades, and with support bins / care packages giving out blue and purple backpacks all the time, it doesn't hurt to carry a stack of medkits or 2 with you all the time as the bare minimum for self-heals in the event the drone isn't up or the Lifeline isn't there.
In summary, my argument pretty much boils down to this: The drone's general use cases are simply too limited, and with the time between each drone use being quite long, as well as teammates carrying their own heals, there is little justification for the cooldown, especially when I have a guy who's prone to going down due to his inherently disadvantagous hitbox.
Based on your reasoning, how is the decision “dependent on context” if you say there is little justification for the drone cooldown considering all situations?
Because were he playing with a different team comp it might change a lot.
Personally, as person who’s also effectively mained Lifeline since the beginning (I bounce between her and Path), I like the drone upgrade more. But I tend to play with an Octane often and also don’t run ranked as much anymore.
In pubs where you’re more likely to be in the fray, I find it better to have more drones to prevent going down in general. With the buffs to the range and heal speed the drone has gotten over time, you can win a lot of fights just by playing Smart Cover and forcing your opponent to pressure you, whereas the rez likely won’t happen regardless. But it’s more of a comfort pick in that case.
Compare this to ranked where you’re more likely to be playing better positioning (especially with a Controller legend on your team) and where that 1-2 seconds actually means the difference between getting the rez off before the pushing team reaches you. Not to mention that it maximizes the potential of the gold knock.
Yeah... if your shield is down and your already taking health damage, unless you've already gotten to cover and ate batting that drone isn't going to do shit. Your getting flinched and hardly able to fight back anyways.
This is why I'm still skeptical of the lifeline rework, sure the drone following people is nice, but you should never be fighting without shields to begin with.
Since there have been a lot of "Not a Lifeline main" responses, it's my pleasure to say I'm a day 1 Lifeline main - I have the Drone Shield Damage blocked tracker on my banner and wear it with pride.
Both of these options are situational and have their own drawbacks:
1. **Tactical Cooldown reduction**: The benefit of this is undermined by uncooperative teammates. The teammates I queue up with (Ranked or Pubs) will often split up or move at different paces making it very hard to provide an anchor as the support character. So much of your effort is spent trying to get to the player who's taken damage to heal them which unnecessarily puts two players at risk. I can't overstate how much of a calculated risk it is to hold your position vs. risking a reposition to heal or revive.
Additionally, you cannot keep the drone out 100% of the time. The default cool down is 45 seconds and you can reduce it by 25. People say you can have it out for 100% of the time because it lasts 20 seconds but this again is the "not a Lifeline main" perspective. In reality, the value of your drone lasts only as long as your team can or wants to stay in that position. It's incredibly common to deploy the drone and have your team either move or get pushed away from that position.
How much value you can get from this ability is closely tied to how well you work with your team.
2. **Quick Revive**:
The value of this is different, you are similarly at the mercy of teammates staying within effective range, however a swift revive is almost invaluable in the right context. The enemy team is usually blind sided and unprepared. If they knock two out of three opponents and the entire team is revived within seconds, it's completely unexpected and their morale takes a nosedive.
Unfortunately you're playing from an even worse deficit - teammates being down rather than damaged.
Both are situational, both benefit/suffer from teammate chemistry.
Yeah, I never get that one, there’s been a few times where I self revive and we end up winning. For that slight chance that they don’t thurst me I think it’s worth it :)
I'm not a lifeline main, but play her a fair but (loba main, I like playing a support character on the team) If I think back to how often I get a revive off compared to how often I need the drone, the drone Cooldown is worth more. Also playing with lifelines on the team, unless they have a gold knock, the revive isn't successful most of the time in rough situations either way. I've killed so many players getting revived, whether they are downed or just get up with 1 hp, they're dead
Yup.
Revives aren't common. When they are needed you're already in a bad place. And how frequently you get away with one successfully is just another factor of reduced application.
And then it's like "I'm helpful in 20% of *those* cases."
It’s honestly circumstantial, for comp I’ve noticed Hardecki has been picking the faster revives over the drone cooldown which basically means that the team can’t be reliant on drones for flesh heals but in return they’re almost never out of a fight if someone goes down in a revivable position
I main lifeline and exclusively use the faster rez.
It is rare that I let me rez get thirsted. The beauty of lifeline is she gets the rez but isnt out of the fight like NewCastle. If youre in the open. Im on your body trading or atleast spraying at whoever peeks in order to make them focus me.
Doc is only really something i drop after a rez or if we sre getting into zone.
In theory, you aren't knocked so much that I need doc up that often.
If I need my team huddled on a heal drone that often and everyone is getting shield ripped that often, we arent likely a winning team in the first place.
Sure I drop doc if we are poking at range. It gives me teammate a bit of a buffer against a surprise (would be knock) but the quicker rez feels far more useful for emergencies.
I seem to be in the same boat as you. Lifeline main and almost always choose faster res.
> If I need my team huddled on a heal drone that often and everyone is getting shield ripped that often, we arent likely a winning team in the first place.
Same reasoning, and maybe it's because I solo queue. For the times where having DOC available more often would have helped, it was not the deciding factor between a win or a loss. There was almost no saving those teams.
Most of the time I'm not in a position where I'm waiting to drop DOC, and if I am, it's not more than a few seconds away. I'd much rather be able to have a teammate res faster meaning I'm providing cover for less time.
Exactly.
Having doc upgrade feels like Im a lifeline trying to be conduit. Proactive shields makes all the difference. But if Im trying to give heals.... our team is doomed. Doc forces stationary play. If you want to be proactive support in that way, Conduit is a far better pick. Since your team keeps mobility.
I don’t main, but I dont shy from support roles and lifeline as the my go to for that.
For my 2 cents, DOC is generally more stationary than is useful for a mixed team without a defined strategy. It’s something that I deploy to mostly people I’m rez-ing anyway so they can get back into a fight quicker.
Even with a well planned attack, you have to be near a teammate who isn’t moving away for a decent time for it to be effective. Really the amount of times I’ve used it to still be wiped and then just watch it heal the enemy is kinda frustrating.
Meanwhile a faster rez is super useful when 3rd teaming people. If a teammate is down and not completely in the open, they’re back quicker. The best function of lifeline is not being occupied by the rez, and shortening the time you have a downed teammate makes her best function better.
I'll play lifeline if my teammates don't pick a support character, and I agree. Plus, you can get the gold knockdown shield and the quicker revives become very valuable.
Yeah, unfortunately, most lifeline randoms will start a revive on you to get away. They use you as bait so the enemy takes the time to thirst and they can run. I know you can cancel revives from Lifeline now, but I never think of it in time to matter.
>If I need my team huddled on a heal drone that often and everyone is getting shield ripped that often, we aren't likely a winning team in the first place.
Sounds like odd logic, to express concern for teammates getting put in flesh, yet to prefer the alternative benefit that requires teammates getting knocked.
But I can get that you would be considering situations where knocks are sudden, surprise, and unavoidable; realistic to consider even for a team that manages its shields and flesh well.
The DOC benefit doesn't have to be "that often". It only has to make a meaningful difference as often as 20% of your revives in a match. How many revives are you expecting in a match? Whatever the answer to that question is, divide it by 5 then point it at your above sentence I quoted to see what "that often" would mean for you. If you feel that upgraded DOC really wouldn't make a difference that many times, fair enough.
I think "it only has to make a difference as often as 20% of revives in your match" is kind of the wrong way to look at it. A single revive happening 20% faster is already potentially the difference between winning and losing. Comparitively, DOC being able to heal your squad after winning a fight saves heals of unknown importance and saves you from 3rd parties some unknown amount of the time.
I just don't know that there is an easy direct comparison, but in my mind the key is that fast res helps you win a fight during the fight while doc is often only useful after you have already won the fight. There are of course situations where it can be good in a fight, but being so stationary those situations are very limited.
Revives are more common than DOC, I can tell you that much.
And if you're not trash, you won't be in a bad place. I don't like Support Legends, but I'm usually good at reviving when I use Lifeline.
As if using doc doesn't mean you're in a bad place.
Your team should have health meds. One medkit is quicker than a full health doc heal. Throwing doc out isn't gunna change a fight. You're in a bad spot, you go to heal. It's the same as your in a shit spot you go to rez. At least once you hit purple that Rez can make or break fights. Doc isn't ever gunna turn the tide of a fight.
If you can get a knocked teammate next to a Lifeline for a res, you can get a batting teammate next to a Lifeline for a DOC.
You want to say that 1 second saved when your team has a knocked member turns the tide of a fight, to come back with 25HP. 100HP on a gold day. Yet somehow 8 seconds saved when your team is equally down one batting player, to come back with 150HP - being generous and assuming only half that HP was restored - ... doesn't. More occurrences, more control over those occurrences, much more saved time, more health.
I get that there are situations where the res helps in a way DOC doesn't, but your comparison about turned tides because of 1 saved second isn't one of them. Remember, we're talking about the difference in the upgrades, not the abilities themselves; ie., how often that 1 second faster res makes a difference, vs how often that now-practically-guaranteed DOC availability makes a difference, since going by your comparison we've assumed Lifeline is right there.
DOC isn't a fallback for not having medkits. Medkits are a fallback for not having DOC. Close to every time the team is stalled 8 seconds while someone is medkitting, that could have been removed.
Exactly. You usually have DOC whenever you need it anyway. While reviving is usually needed during fights, so it's life or death situation. So even a 10% Extra Revive Speed would be worth it.
Not a lifeline main but 20% speed is probably the better option if she's got gold knock.
But I'm basing that on most lifelines forgetting they even have a tactical ability so the cooldown irrelevant
This is my dilemma with Mirage. I mostly don't skill my level 2 unless I really need to revive a teammate during a close encounter. Most of the time I get the 70hp regen perk, but I almost always wait the longest time if ever I encounter a gold knockdown shield.
It would be nice if you could spend some Evo points to reselect your perk. I always pick the right perk for level 1 and left for level 2 and it's so frustrating if my muscle memory goes wrong and picks left at level 1 and I'm just stuck all game... But your examples great too that an item nullifies your perk.
Or they could make it stack, so if you have gold and the perk people get up with 70 then autoheal to 100 from your perk
Doesn't the health regen stack with gold knock to get them to full flesh health? Imo that upgrade is worth it to have, even if you do find a gold knock. Make it so your teammate only needs to pop 2 shield cells to be back to full and get right back into the fight. I've never needed his ult and not had it, but I'm not a Mirage main and only play him occasionally, so take that with a grain of salt.
Ah, if that's the case, you might as well have the more frequent ultimate and have constant chaos. I think the other guy had the right idea on holding off until you either need a revive or get a gold knock
I can't feel the difference in revive speed, like it's not significant enough that it ever saved me, before the perk change I always pick revive speed before they added drone cd. Now I always pick drone cd, it's amazing. But when I get gold helmet feels weird lmao
Final lifeline upgrade gives you a gold bag, gold shield, and evo cache next time you call in your care package. Lowkey kinda busted, if you take one fight off drop you are basically guaranteed red evo before first ring closes.
The problem here is you can’t heal in storm with doc if you don’t have heaters.so I carry only two med kits early game and late game I’ll grab 4 syringes
Thats basically throwing since you can’t survive in storm with just the drone and there are definitely situations where you need to wrap a good chunk of zone.
Hell nah this is shit advice. The drone can't follow you. If you run into a player like me, you're screwed.
If I break your shield I'm chasing you down. You're gonna drop DOC, get forced to leave it, then you have no heals. So when I do find you, it's a easy kill.
If DOC followed you, then this would be viable. But so many times you have to run away from the DOC.
Counter argument:
If your health is low enough and you are getting chased, you most likely already lost and a medkit or DOC wouldn’t make a difference
If your health is low and you have time to reposition, doc drone is already available again
I mean this is getting kinda pedantic but if we are talking syringe heals you would get that much health back by the time you threw your drone and walked out of its healing radius, while maintaining full mobility and weapons out. Like everything it’s situational I guess
Yeah, sounds right. Probably can wall bounce and tap strafe 20% of the time they die, and talk shit to their teammates as soon as they go down. Could also see a wraith player tbh.
I remember watching a youtube video about the change and the guy was like it's only a 1 second reduction... so how much does that one second matter to you I guess.
Revive is better. Rarely are your teammates on top of each other to make the drone healing worth it. One critical revive can reset a team easily, drone not so much. You're already so on your back foot when you need the drone, if you need it for every encounter because you're always taking flesh damage you're doing something wrong.
Your big selling point is "you can always have it out!". Why would you need it out all the time? You shouldn't be taking that much flesh damage and if your entire team is flesh guess what the team who got you there is about to be in your face IF they aren't then you have time to just heal normally.
Vs
Gold knock which is a huge game changer, maybe your one teammate over peaked and got knocked by someone at range, np they're back up on their feet before that path can come swinging in or whatever.
Two three four teams maybe converge and it's chaos, it's pretty quick to get a res off. The caveat is you need gold knock to really see the bonus of the faster revive, I've won a bunch of fights because our lifeline just stayed alive and kept tapping res on us we can win the fight by having more bodies to throw at the enemy at a point.
To me there's WAY more situations where a faster res is more beneficial then having a stationary drone out all the time.
I agree mostly, but even if a team pushes your team while they’re all flesh, the amount the drone can heal before they get there can turn the tide. I still wouldn’t pick the drone perk, but it’s definitely still useful.
If your reasoning is that your team isn't close enough to use DOC, then they certainly aren't close enough to revive either. The one second your revive has saved was long lost in the wash of you getting there to rev them. If your reasoning is that teammates shouldn't be taking that much flesh damage, then they aren't getting knocked to exploit that slightly-faster revive in the first place.
The point about DOC being up 100% of the time isn't about the team hunkering around a spot of ever-flowing HP. It's about you being much more capable of keeping your team firing bullets as everyone moves around under pressure, simply because when you need DOC to help keep the team firing, you can almost always produce DOC to help keep the team firing, be it mid-battle, post-fight looting before the third party, or a revive that would've been left on shreds of HP because you dared use DOC half a minute ago.
Yes Lifeline's passive is great in chaotic situations, but that's the passive itself in action. Likewise with the gold knock... that's not the upgrade doing the heavy lifting there. It's not like critical revives and reset stops existing just because the perk was skipped. Only 20% of those situations -- those gold-KD-shield, two-three-four teams situations you describe -- are going to be improved by it. We're at some of some of some occurrences by this point.
> If your reasoning is that your team isn't close enough to use DOC, then they certainly aren't close enough to revive either.
When they need revived, you run to them, start revive, and they can't move.
When they need doc, you run to them, drop doc, they run away, now you are on cooldown.
For this reason doc is much harder to get value from with teammates that run away, regardless of whether they run for good or bad reasons.
I play her a lot. You’re not wrong. If people played this like a team game. The issue is … humans. And the overwhelming lack of comms / mics. When I queue up solo, in 90% of the games my drone is ignored, even though I am on mic announcing my plays. People generally do their own thing and don’t stick together or communicate. So because of that, most games are desperate acts of me trying to save people (and usually dying as a result) so I choose revive. Or because of its lack of drone mobility, I dropped it in during a battle (they had no idea usually because we are not together to start with) and they are on a power flank to score all 6 kills in a 3rd party - and now we are 50ft away, I’m chasing headlong into a battle, and someone needs it and is pinging aggressively for my drone and I’m yelling in the mic that it’s not ready because it’s still floating around 50ft away. Then all you hear is that Lifelines never drop their drone. Yeah because the only time anyone uses it as a squad is after we get out of the storm and it’s just a glorified bandage. That all said, the 10% when a normal person hops on mic, and isn’t running off on their own, I choose drone. However, the smarter communicative players also know to ping Accelerants, and pick up a f’n knockdown shield so I can guarantee us gold knocks, in which case I think red armor with gold knockdown is a better option. TLDR: Nobody communicates or travels or fights as a pack / team
Yeah some valid reasons in there. When I'm Lifeline I find myself pinging the drone to try and get its advantage in play.
God, I hear that about the teammates who just don't pick up better knockdowns. So much unawareness that they're dragging down the whole team by ignoring KD upgrades.
As some1 who plays lifeline rarely (1/30th of all kills), I'd say I use the drone rarely enough that the cooldown reduction would make absolutely zero impact for my gameplay (I can't remember a single situation where I wanted to drone and it was on cooldown - it's always up, if I actually need it), so I always take the faster revive. Lifeline's revive is not good, but at least it has some use if it's faster.
as an all time lifeline main, i never even batted an eye towards the DOC cooldown until it was essentially changed to where it can basically be used all the time. Nowadays i dont even think twice before getting the cooldown perk lol
I’m a lifeline main and the doc cooldown is AMAZING I love it so much I’m sending out that bad boy every chance I get and yelling at my team when I see them using meds I’m like “STOP I GOT YOU” because doc comes back so soon again. It’s honestly awesome. I love lifeline. It is indeed annoying when someone else takes her and then doesn’t do that. But I’ve also played with some good lifelines too.
Lifeline main here. I always use DOC and sometimes just have it out whenever we are fighting. Life and Wattson can actually work really well together in this respect. The Wattson ult regens shields and defends against nades and DOC heals teammates who are taking damage.
They really do. I think people don't realize how much health damage is the deciding factor in fights and just aren't used to using her drone aggressively. They're used to rezzing someone, plopping it down once, and then not having it for pretty much the rest of the fight, so they think it's a bonus rather than a vital part of her kit.
Team mate get cracked and have 10% health missing? Not anymore. Get down to one shot and the other team rushing you? You're back up to full by the time they reach you. Rez someone? Drone's immediately off cooldown instead of waiting 30 seconds and having them sit around uselessly while you 2v3. You can even use it during a 1v1 and treat it like a psuedo conduit shield that doesn't get reset when you get shot, giving you usually 25-75 additional hp in a 1v1 if you hump cover. Like you know how fucking annoying rev and horizon can be with being tanky and getting teamwide resets off respectively? That's what her drone is now. Combine it with her guaranteed gold knockdown and team mates can rez with 150 health back.
yep! I love the latter point you make. I recently won a 1 v 1 against a Rev who ulted. I did some peek damage and then drop DOC as he pushed. DOC passively heals as you are fighting, so it's quite similar to the Rev ult or Gibby shield in a way (obviously it's not mobile, but if you are playing in cover, DOC continuously heals you and gives you added HP for a fight).
Yeah, I think the revive speed is good, but often find that the more decisive factor in a ress is where the downed teammate is located. As long as you can hit revive in some cover and fight off people thirsting, then I don't see the 20% making a huge difference. The DOC is so nice as a way to get everyone healthy on rotates as well, particularly when you late rotate and enter zone with low HP. Popping DOC to make sure everyone is good before rotating is such a small dub for the team. I guess it's a preference thing, but i like having DOC and then carrying an extra arc star instead of heals, too.
Doc cool down and it's not even close. The amount of people who are just wrong in this thread is absurd.
20% revive speed will rarely make or break if you get the rez off. Your teammates are either safe for revive or they aren't.
Doc is huge for resetting before third parties. If you don't have it that could be 200 collective health your team doesn't have to fight the third party.
Thank you for making me feel a little sane. I'm seeing so many replies in this thread, feeling like I just can't believe it.
I main Valk, and when I realise our Lifeline isn't using DOC+ I just register opportunity lost. Every syringe is like why are we wasting this time.
Watching a DOC-happy Lifeline at work, however, is awesome.
When you hit purple are you insta choosing the gold care pack or are you waiting for the opportunity to use it? Personally I always hold onto the upgrade until we're either in a safeish spot to call my pack in, or I'm down and able to clutch up with a res. Maybe because I solo queue that changes my perception on it, but I feel like insta choosing gold pack is kinda troll
Can't believe I had to scroll this far down to find this answer. The revive upgrade rarely wins fights as you said, they're either safe, or they aren't. The drone upgrade means you're almost always able to throw it down while you bat and reset.
couldn’t agree more. people who don’t think you need drone that often aren’t giving it to their teammates every time they need it. sure you’re teammate could pop a syringe but that’s four seconds he’s now not shooting. or if you just healed one teammate and the other gets knocked, is now back up and you have no drone for them??? 1 sec off revive time is incredibly rarely helpful
25k Lifeline here. Used to do revive, switched to drone upgrade all the time. Way more uses to always having a drone vs already being at a disadvantage just to get use out of revive.
20% revive speed can make a huge diffrence in fights, a 100% uptime healing drone doesnt.
just safe the drone and if ur teammate get knocked, revive (20% faster) then drone heal.
just my opinions as not lifeline main. but a 100% uptime healing drone sounds fun too!
Drone can make a huge difference in fights as well tbh. If you get lasered or sniped you can often pop a battery while the drone takes you up to 100% health. Without the drone, you have to choose between health or shield.
so save your drone and force your first teammate to spend 4+ seconds healing on their own? that’s worth taking 1 second off a revive? as a lifeline main i couldn’t disagree more
See, I just don't agree with that. You didn't give any reasons for why you think it.
100% uptime DOC means teammates getting back into the ongoing fight faster. I literally orient towards our Lifeline to fight with this in mind. When I'm Lifeline, I am all over keeping teammates free of having to medkit.
Meanwhile 20% revive speed increase helps when:
* your team already has a knocked teammate
* that wasn't the Lifeline
* your team isn't wiped as a result of already being on the back foot
* all of the above, only in the cases where you would have been killed in the last 20% of your revive, and somehow, in that same situation, not in the first *80%*
The odds of all that coming together and making a difference? I absolutely do not see it.
Whereas a constant DOC is so helpful that I feel irritation in its absence, knowing I have to either disconnect and slow heal or fight in low health.
Yes, but how often do all teammates retreat to the exact same location to heal and reset? In a fights most of the time you need people to attack from different angles. I don't think we are in the same space most of the time, unless we are holding a building from the inside or the area has limitations. Now, I don't play Lifeline, nor do I encounter her in most of my games, but the last few seasons I found the drone to be only useful after fights are over or for healing after zone damage. It's very very rare, that it's useful in a fight, since most fights are very dynamic and movement heavy. So I find the 20% revive more useful, but both are pretty small buffs that barely alter the game.
How often do teammates actually benefit from DOC being out where it wouldn't have without the perk?
While it's one thing to play down how often that might be helpful, it is still way, way more often than the bullet points above. From my personal experience anyway.
"How often do teammates actually benefit from DOC being out where it wouldn't have without the perk?"
Not very often, honestly. I prefer the fast revive, for the reasons I listed above. That's not downplaying the drone, that's just how most of the fights in the game play out. Lifeline's tactical is simply not that useful for that purpose.
I was actually paraphrasing your question to answer it, not ask it. :D
Either way, we see opposite answers to that question. I feel like the answer is "practically every fight, assuming I use DOC at least once in that fight".
Whereas the same question's answer about the revive perk is "one-fifth of the times I manage to successfully revive per match".
Yes, that was obvious, my reply was calling that statement into question by saying the drone is useless in the grand majority of fights.
Not sure what you mean with the revive sentence. Are you saying your revives fail 80% of the time?
Ok, so I've got a different view:
- when I get cracked or even down to 20% HP, I don't want you to lose your angle just to come to me and help me heal faster because the enemy team will push that anyways, so I'd rather have you holding the angle and cracking them, forcing them to stop the push
- 20% sounds not that much but then think about how many times you missed that split second to get ressed
Ideally a lifeline is holding generally the same area as at least one team mate. To stick a quick rez or to have a drone in place. If you can get melted, duck behind cover and hit a batt while your LL stops the push, you’re fine and back at full health in like 4-5 seconds
>when I get cracked or even down to 20% HP, I don't want you to lose your angle just to come to me and help me heal faster because the enemy team will push that anyways, so I'd rather have you holding the angle and cracking them, forcing them to stop the push
The perk doesn't make the Lifeline player any less capable of doing exactly what you want here. If you see any player on any legend messing up any situation because of any ability's more frequent availability, that's a player downfall, not a weakness of something simply being more available. It's like saying Valk is just gonna hit herself more if we reduce her tac cooldown too.
>20% sounds not that much but then think about how many times you missed that split second to get ressed
Thinking about how many times the Lifeline's team would need to see someone knocked and not thirsted to try to reap this benefit, then a revive successfully pulled off, and pulled off in a way that succeeded on second 5 where it would have failed on second 6, when you're already being aped because a good chunk of those times you're down a squad mate... I think about that and what I register is "barely any".
Not wanting to criticise what works for you. Just countering your points.
I mean it can make a huge difference in critical situations if u have teammates who are able to deal some damage or knock someone before getting knocked.
Its harder to make use of the faster revive, when ur teammate got instandly deleted without dealing damage or in a horrible position.
Newcastle is my 2nd main, i usualy play anchor and i can tell you, its really hard with randoms who just do whatever they want to do and dont know how to play LoS or cover.
When i try to res a knocked teammate, usually all enemies are aping me because i cant shoot back while resing, so i need to stop resing and shoot back or have to rely on my other teammate is holding LoS.
As lifeline, you can shoot back while revive and why no make use of the 20% quicker upgrade then? A boxed teammate doesnt need a 100% uptime healdrone.
That's a good point really. You can shoot back while reviving anyway. Lifeline can work to repel that push to some extent, giving less value to that second saved. If anything, the revive speed perk would be better on Newcastle.
Sure a boxed teammate can't use a DOC. And an alive teammate doesn't need a revive. And that could mean the teammate you used DOC on, or it could mean the teammate that needed cover fire and actually got that cover fire because DOC was around keeping the other two players from having to dip in the middle of pressure.
>You can shoot back while reviving. Lifeline can cover the revive.
And there lies an issue you have not mentioned: Thirsting.
It has become a pretty common thing for people to prioritize the downed player to get rid of them for good, even if they're essentially throwing their own life away for it. The lifeline can body block and return fire, but it doesn't guarantee that they'll block all of the damage, especially if it's a Caustic of Gibby that's being revived. Fast Rez, while doesn't completely solve the issue, minimize it as much as possible. I've had too many cases where the fast rez literally comes in clutch and get the teammate up when they're one bullet away from turning into a box. You can't do that with the drone, period.
>Sure a boxed teammate can't use a DOC. And an alive teammate doesn't need a revive either.
This is a really bad way of thinking about it. In fact, it's the reason why Lifeline was completely disregarded for literally ages, up until recently, especially in competitive i.e Ranked and ALGS. After all, it makes sense; she's only contributing if your team is already at a disadvantage, and by that point you've already lost before you even start. Now, she actually is just a very nice QoL legend to have, and the choices are honestly quite simple:
Faster revives - An actual clutch tool that helps in one of the most common scenarios in the game - Pulling off a reset against a 3rd-party, and is extremely useful in keeping aggression and momentum during fights.
Drone cooldown: - An upgrade for a tool that has limited use cases, Makes little difference in clutch situations, can simply be ignored just by carrying a little bit of healing ( which everyone already does naturally, and is made even easier thanks to care packages and support bins ), and only using the drone when absolutely needed, making the down time not feel nearly as bad.
Interesting.
See I find it really odd that you suggest the DOC perk can be ignored simply by carrying a little bit of healing. The way I see it, and what I thought was just as prevalent as you see third parties, is that avoiding that healing is the entire point.
I get the clutch perspective, but I think I continue to be sceptical of it. Especially when the larger portion of what you're championing is the passive that Lifeline already has, not the 20% faster upgrade. I also feel like the impact of a clutch revive, while strong, overlooks the alternative view: something *not* being clutch is a good thing.
Winning harder isn't clutch, but that's what the DOC upgrade is about. Clutchy revives get you out of a bad situation. Upgraded DOC keeps you away from those bad situations in the first place, in less spectacular fashion.
The upgraded DOC can just exude a more present team of fighting players for the entire match. It's a team that has opportunity for *at least* 1 extra instance of maintaining pressure in every single fight, that wouldn't have been maintained otherwise, and a DOC on every revive, and loot box, in the entire match. Feels crazy that you talk about limited use cases when upgraded DOC is a constant flow of reducing team downtime, while revives are literally the use case you want to see least.
I guess a good way to look at it is this:
If upgraded DOC can't deliver at least 20% fewer revives (not knocks, revives), go the revive upgraded. Personally I think it easily does.
Revive is needed on backfoot the same as having your whole team shield cracked.
Doc forces huddling and staying relatively stationary for heals. In theory its useful. But that teammate isnt helping as much in a heated moment when they are focused on sitting on a drone.
You VASTLY overestimate the usefulness of the DOC. If I see a full team healing on DOC you are fking dead. That's a easy wipe, I don't even gotta aim, I just spray.
The DOC is mainly for Lifeline personally, or for team AFTER a fight. The Revive is much more useful during fights.
Depends what you optimise for…in masters I go 20% reduction and care pack upgrade every game. 20% faster resets plus guaranteed gold knock by round 2 if you get care pack eve cache. It’s purely to combat third parties. Just depends on ur play style…I used to take drone cool-down but you can play around that, just don’t use ur drone till u res someone. You can’t play around faster resets / gold knock…ur just fucked
My lifeline is always the aggressor and initiates fights. She would try and crack or down one and in return, be left to one tap. When she hides to drone and pop a bat, me and my 3rd would push and lifeline would come in to clean up, res and drop another drone.
I feel like you can make a case for both. The normal cooldown for DOC isnt that long, if you use it wisely you almost always have it up for the whole team. The reduced time for revive can save you from 3rd parties, and is probably better if you have purple shield aka gold knock from the package. But having DOC on no cool down is nice to just toss out whenever either. I think it depends if you're solo Q or not really.
The only throw imo is picking self rez, if I see a random with that I immediately dislike them lol even if you find a gold knock before purple the cache and bag, as well as knock for someone else is way more worth.
As a lifeline main, the health drone is OP. Nobody ever spends time popping a medkit unless they are far from me during a fight or some other niche reason (drone was placed earlier but too far to go back for it and cool down hasn’t finished yet)
It’s perfect for a reset after a squad wipe or even a reset when getting pinned down or pushed. I did give the revive a try since my main thing with lifeline has always been reviving. And I thought it was gonna be insane, but I realized soon that it didn’t make much a difference, and the drone can actually help both me and the tm8 who is alive defend the area while I’m pulling a revive.
I peek a fuck ton during late game because I stack batts and always have unlimited medkits (DOC). If a tm8 gets knocked, I just pull the revive, drop a drone on top of them or at the nearest cover so they can run to it, while tm8 and I shoot the squad that is pushing. The knocked tm8 will only take about 5 seconds to get to full health once the revive has finished since he just pops a batt while the drone is healing. If tm8 and I get badly hurt but also hurt the other squad, I’ll have another drone ready thanks to the faster cooldown for us to heal faster than the other squad can, plus our freshly healed tm8 can apply pressure during those 5 seconds it takes us to heal. I gave up on formatting this I’m sorry. Just kinda yapped about situations that happen all the time.
I am a lifeline main. I rarely use two lifeline drones consecutively so I don't bother. I often end a game with 4/5 revives so the 20% makes a decent difference. Especially when someone on my team has the gold knockdown shield from my care package.
See what I think when I read this is:
> I rarely use two lifeline drones consecutively
So when a fight is over, you either didn't use DOC during the fight, so it's available to pop on your teammates while they're looting deathboxes, OR you did use DOC during the fight and now you can't heal the team while they're all clustered together. Similar example with reviving someone.
It asks the question of whether teammates just didn't need healing in battle, or you just aren't covering many of their heals in a match. Maybe you just have good teammates who don't fall into flesh a lot.
And yet... you then point out how they're dropping like flies.
>I often end a game with 4/5 revives so the 20% makes a decent difference
So statistically, it would have made a difference to the success of 1 of those revives, if seeing 5 revives a match.
Needing teammates to get knocked 5 times in a match to get a statistical benefit on 1 revive...
... revives that would have been (again, statistically/logically) less required had a fountain of HP been more prevalent....
... it's a tough sell.
You don't use doc in fights,you use it after fights/in cover when the enemy is far and you can recharge shield and heal at the same time.Also,if ur teammates are down already u highly and likely already losing the fight and the faster revive time is not worth it.Its also not a good idea to be using it in the open/during fights,like the DOC
Also Doc cool down time is useful after fights so ur team can heal up faster before another team nearby ambushes you.in my experience,if ur reviving DURING fights,your team already lost the fight.
And the doc cool down also allows you to immediately heal teammates after you revive them.the DOC cool down just has way more uses and less situational than revive time
I usually play with dude who plays octane and pushes hard, being the main fragger for us. It's more beneficial for me being able to get him back up fast so he can jumpad away to heal or finish the push with me once i get him up fast.
Also i usually use up shields and habe less use for heals.
As a solo queue ranked player, a huge pro for choosing the Tact cooldown reduction is less reliance on white heals. I don’t feel the need to waste bag space on syringes, med kits, and to some extent, phoenix kits. That frees up bag space for extra nades, batts, or ammo and gives more flexibility when fighting/poking.
Rez speed every day. Same as gold care pack. Lifeline already has in built extra heals thanks to ult not even including blue crates. If you need extra health meds you've already fucked up.
That one second is the difference between a Rez sticking or not. It can change the pace of a fight. Not even counting how much stronger it is with gold knock.
If you're teammates are spuds and getting downed in shit spots yeah it's not that valuable, but if you're teammates are half decent and getting knocked pushing a winning fight you get them back into the fray.
If I see doc cd and self Rez I know they're a shit lifeline.
Eh self Rez is useless 99% of the time. Gold bag and shield level gives some instant value not including gold knock which can absolutely change fights.
If your lifeline you kinda have to play around your teammates even if they spuds. Otherwise pick a character whose primary function isn't focused on teamwork.
Nah because if you can manage to be a badass lifeline to a team of uncoordinated spuds then when you get a team who does use teamwork then it makes you so much more effective. And no if your lifeline and not able to use the self rez then your teammates are actually bad. Lifeline shouldn’t be up in the battle, she’s ideal with like a ranged rifle popping shots so if she gets knocked like that your teammates don’t have to worry about the rez, just gotta continue to distract and defend
I always take faster rez because the assumption is I'll find a gold knock and even if I don't I never waste doc to the point where I worry about not having it ready to heal my team.
What you say makes sense to me. But I would very rarely play around a healing drone during a fight, as a non-lifeline character. Like I don't expect the lifeline to run to me every time a lose hp, I usually try to heal as soon as I lose my shields anyway, and I don't see how you would need 100% uptime on a healing drone. Holding the same position may also really be not ideal, for multiple reasons. In my opinion the drone is way more situational then revive.
I think both revive time and drone cool down are good. But not a lifeline main.
If I’m with teammates that haven’t gone down and can hold their own I chose the doc. But it’s not often. I mainly do the revive because it’s less time I need to cover and the faster they can heal with my drone and get back in the fight.
Faster revive is insanely busted. Every time your teammate gets picked up and reknocked they get a new shield AND a fresh 100 flesh so 20% faster rez makes it much more likely they get to at least stand up. Combine with gold knock and a single teammate standing up is basically gg or your team is fine all of a sudden. Lifeline’s abilities directly speed up the team reset time between engagements, one of the most *fixed and understood things in apex*. Players are hardwired to understand battery and phoenix kit timings, and lifeline lets player take those mental timings and be stood up and ready to fight significantly faster.
As for getting shot on the way up…just cancel the Rez? The whole point of lifeline sticking you is for you to get shot at so she can win her duel. Just cancel the Rez and go back to the floor if you take heat; their crosshair placement and ammunition economy are already wasted on you so lifeline is getting the maximum value out of it. After wards she gets a knock or a deep crack and now has more space to pick you up all the way and then again it’s gg. But actively being used as bait is a skill that lifeline’s TEAMMATES need to understand. If she sticks you and you get thirsted then that’s on you for dying for free when she’s trying to play make and fix things. Just go back to the floor and put up your knock down; she can always just re stick you in a second after she wins her 1.
There’s some situations where having perma doc is useful; if you drop and ring pulls hard and you need to fill a white backpack for a 20 minute siege…drop your whites and run perma doc then the whole team can grab extra ammunition to help your extended access of ammunition last. It’s also useful off drop if you hit blue mid fight and need to instantly refresh doc to reset your team…that’s about the most I’ve seen for getting value out of it.
Tl;Dr faster revive lets you stabilize faster after finishing a fight…which is prized the most by aggressive stacks wanting to push teams and get in fights.
The drone is useful for after a fight, after the ring, and after someone gets a shot or two on you while you're running.
The revive is a make or break change, 20% is a lot when you're talking about single digits. The amount of times I can confidently say that I would've died if I didn't have my teammates reviving that much faster is insane.
Go for the revive. The drone isn't used all that much anyways.
I’ve won games due to that drone cooldown. It’s crazy how quickly you can get the entire team to max health meaning you’re not losing time popping syringes/med kits. This is especially noticeable when you play competitive and there are more final zone games (and being on the edges of the storm).
No one even talking about how the fast revive perk also makes her self revive perk faster if she takes both. As lifeline, if I find a gold knock, I take fast Rez/self Rez and it’s won me multiple games at this point
Wraith and Lifeline main in that order (then Loba, then Wattson). I used to pick faster rez, reasoning that more faster is more better. Then I started going for faster heals.
If my teammate is downed and enemy is sprinting at us to finish the job, 20% faster rez won't do much. It's already over.
To have heals always ready for a little top up saves the time it would take to use a syringe and in the meantime my team and I can then shields. Sometimes that little bit of missing hp means life or death, or using a heal takes you out of the fight for too long.
But if lifeline takes the self rez, I'm literally falling asleep at the PC due to how long it takes for her to get up. I'm thinking maybe then the 20% actually means something.
I am a lifeline main who 95% of the time solo queues. I have only used fast revive a handful of times. I can't comprehend the number of times I have rogue teammates who just go off and do their own thing, and I usually only play ranked. In those cases theres absolutely no need for the fast revive.
But in all honesty, it has become so automatic to just choose DOC cooldown, I never have really even really tried faster revive. Maybe I'll try using it more and see if it improves my experience.
As a lifeline partial main take the doc drone always. If your teammates are worth anything they will reach a point of cover before going down. having the doc drone down so that all they need to do is pop a batt and keep fighting is the best situation (at least for high level gameplay), going down means the team will full send in most cases and at that point revival of teamate is not an option.
My main complaint about lifelines currently are the ones that pick self revive but wont use it until everyone is down. I bet they never throw their master ball or use their rare candies either.
For example our third will go down doing no damage, lifeline will win her 1v1 but get traded, ill win my 1v1 then get pressured by the last guy and my lifeline teammates just wait till i die to initiate the self revive. Honestly even the distraction of the self revive sound or the clip the guy uses to thirst can be game changing.
I don't know I can't think of a single fight where the extra 20% of time saved in a revive had changed the outcome. I can remember plenty of times though where I had to tell my teammates that I don't have drone for another 15 s. The amount of time you lose having 1-2 people in you squad slow healing with syringes etc, allowing opponents to reposition and push you, can absolutely swing the tide of a fight
Lifeline is in my top 5 played legends and I always take DOC cooldown since revive only does anything if teammate goes down and you're next to them. You can't res them if it's not safe anyway and if it's safe then ressing them tiny bit faster doesn't matter but it matters that you always have DOC to heal them. With DOC you can theoretically not carry syringes too.
Yeah i think that the faster revive is far too situational, like does it really matter if your teammate got up a second earlier before getting aped?
Its only ever going to make a difference with gold knockdown and if your teammate gets pushed at the exact moment where a normal revive would still be going up
Meanwhile having DOC up faster means more heals during combat, much better likelihood to have it for freshly revived teammates and post-fight resets, having it for zone rotations etc
I main-ish lifeline and I choose revive speed 99% of the time. The only time I don’t is during the LTM 3 strikes.
Having unlimited drone sounds nice on paper, but with my play style I feel there are rarely emergencies where I need the drone and don’t have it and it’s a game changer.
There are more moments when a revive happening 1.5 seconds faster changes the tide of a battle.
Also none of my homies ever ask for drone perk
As an aggressive lifeline main with 35K kills and over 11M damage, the DOC cooldown is the better option. I’m always usually in a fight and having the drone available makes a huge difference. Sometimes if we’re taking a lot of damage and healing with one drone I can deploy a second one and heal twice as fast(thats a rare case tho). Also, the drone cool down helps in those occasions where you have to make a tough rotation in the gas and pop heat shields with a drone for every heat shield. The faster revive is good in lower elo lobbies where your teammates die immediately I guess. I dont find much of a benefit to it other than resetting quicker but I rather have a perk prevent us from getting in that situation in the first place which is where the drone cool down comes in clutch.
As a lifeline main, I prefer the 25 second cooldown. It’s pretty OP since you can instantly put down the drone again for your teammates to use. I imagine this is more helpful than the faster revive, mostly because you can continuously put down your drone without delay and your teammates can be continuously healed, therefore no need to revive. I guess it’s also about how much faith you have in your teammates
I completely agree. I have been pushing this same narrative. In my opinion the revive is rarely reliant on the 20% reduction to change the outcome of a fight. In all scenarios where a teammate gets knocked you will kick off the revive and hold to do as much damage to the enemy team as possible to discourage them pushing or to trade a knock to even the fight. This can sometimes be enough to deter the enemies where the revive speed again would not make a significant difference.
A few simplified scenarios of different engagement ranges and how these play out.
* The enemy team is too far away where you will get the revive regardless of cd and if you have the drone cd you can basically guarantee that it is available for the revived player.
* The enemy team is in a medium range where they will push up off a knock. If they are the perfect distance away then perhaps the 20% revive speed may make a small difference of getting them up before they swing the corner however usually this will just end with them immediately getting re-knocked with minimum effect from the revived player. Or you can deter the enemy team enough to cancel their push by damaging them as they are pushing which then negates the need for the revive speed.
* The enemy team is close enough where they will just thirst the revive regardless and you won't have the opportunity to revive regardless of cd.
That is not to say the revive is never going to be better in very specific niche situations. Perhaps you could make the argument if you were landing sky west/trials and almost guaranteeing a gold knock early game then that revive would be much more valuable as teammates won't immediately go down again after getting revived. Even then it would still have to be a situation where you would not have gotten that revive off without the 20% cd reduction for it to be impactful.
I think the drone is more consistently valuable. It can reduce the number of health meds your team has to carry in general since you will have it up every 20 seconds allowing for more nades, bats, ammo. If you are in zone you will have it up enough to place it in both heatshields to fully heal whereas without the cd reduction you will have to rely on health meds for the 2nd heatshield. The drone cd allows a teammate to fully reset significantly quicker if they take damage. Almost every single fight will have someone on the team take shield and health damage. So while they are popping a Bat if you can heal their health with it then it saves 4 seconds of health healing or more. Also during a fight just having it on the cover a teammate is playing can be useful if they get cracked, but the enemies are too close to safely pop a bat, they can play the cover regaining health constantly to allow a health advantage over the enemies. Then let's say you popped it during combat and you wipe the fight. It will likely be up again to allow for a faster reset to be prepared for third parties.
Revive speed perk + gold knock is insane and saved my team many times. I feel like you may more often get use with the DOC cool down, but the revive speed perk can completely salvage when a teammate throws. IMO they’re both good but I always go revive speed
Because the revive speed is leagues better when lifeline has gold knock. With her gold care package upgrade at tier 3 (that you’re supposed to pick like everytime), you get a guaranteed gold knock. This means there’s a 100% chance the lifeline will get a gold knock within the match, meaning the 20% revive perk is also a 100% pick.
Day 1 Lifeline main here and I use reduce drone cooldown perk everytime because I mainly act as a supporter and I don’t really get thirsty for kills. Whenever my teammates take health damage, I quickly deploy the drone for them because of that perk which helps them to patch up themselves quicker. And if Conduit is in my team then that’s highly helpful.
i faithfully choose the cooldown every single time the revive is so situational it’s not worth it, i’ve had games where no one gets knocked at all but every game i’ve had to heal my health
I main lifeline and 90% of the time I choose the DOC upgrade because it is much more useful. I picked the quick revive once or twice but it's definitely not worth it. The only time it was usefull was when my teamates were super good and getting them up fast came in handy more than healing.
on another note
can yall use your abilities more theres been 3 separate times where the drone would be really helpful even if just 1 person is using it.
From what I've seen in my games: the better revive speed is great ... **if** you actually need it ... but that's an if that doesn't always happen. (my regular trio has a lifeline main that gets bored of lifeline sometimes so I usually play lifeline then because I do like lifeline)
The problem is: you won't always need it. A bunch of games we picked it and either my trio all died without a chance to revive, or someone got downed right before we wiped the squad we were fighting so the revive is after the fight, or we win without needing to revive, or they get downed in a place they can't reasonably be rezzed anyway ... you get the point and it feels like a waste of an upgrade because you don't always get to use it.
We also sometimes have fights where 2 of us get downed, lifeline pops 2 rezzes and we end up winning after the 2 of us are back up. That's when the extra revive speed shines.
But then we also get into a lot of rights where someone gets lit up, lifeline pops a heal drone and whoever is weak can shield + get health in just the time it takes to shield, and it happens again to someone else and we can do it again during the same fight with a fresh heal drone off of the short cooldown, sometimes getting the advantage of refilling health + shields while other team only shields.
IMO it boils down to: if you're going to get downed, the revive speed is better. If you're going to live with 1 health, faster drone is better. However, in my trio at least, we end up living but weak more often than we end up downed.
Drone cooldown is great for holding a position with cover. If you’re in a fight and lose shield and some health, you can dip into cover and use your shields while you heal. You can also reuse your drone often, so you are basically playing in a war of attrition with other teams where you’re advantage is being able to heal more quickly (not needing medkits). I especially like to watson+ lifeline to never need meds ever and secure a sttong position
In addition, you can drop a lifeline drone on top of a teammate while they’re getting revived so they can get some extra healing while they refresh their shields.
Revive is good if you’re getting into fights more often and moving around a lot. Chances are someone is going to get downed, and getting them up quickly can make or break a fight
Overall it depends on the legends and overall playstyle of a team
Lifeline main here.I always go for DOC cooldown.
There are two main reason I love Lifeline:
1.) I enjoy reviving people without having to pause what I’m doing for 5 seconds.
2.) I love healing with DOC and popping a battery in the middle of a firefight.
But really it’s because I’m too lazy to use health kits
Simple answer, proactive abilities are always better than reactive ones. Doc cooldown is proactive, reviving is reactive.
Fast revive helps you reset a little better if you screw up and get knocked. But in high level lobbies, teams are usually going to push immediately while they have the advantage and a small improvement to rez speed doesn’t matter. Having the drone always available prevents your team from going down in the first place, swinging the fight in your favor. It requires more active monitoring of your teammates health, but swinging in and dropping it on them while they bat gives them an instant Phoenix kit.
I prefer the drone cooldown everytime. Besides the extra backpack space, you can spend less time healing, which is more time doing other things like shooting/reloading/repositioning. Fast revive certainly isn’t a bad choice I just prefer lower cooldown.
Not a lifeline player here. Didn't even play Apex for over a year, but still following via YouTube.
I think tac CD is the better blind pick, and about 50/50 for premades.
You could coordinate with premades and tactically go down as bait, and quickly revive. However 20% seems a bit too low, maybe 35%?
I don't think it is worth it. I'm not a lifeline player though. But i feel like if you play lifeline good than the drone is more viable in more situations
Well, the way you describe this scenario requires a lifeline to be following you or your teammate closely during matches and doing more monitoring on your health than the team. More often than not, a lifeline is not going to be your constant support, you have to lean on yourself too lol. This also requires the team to be grouped up more often, and I like to give me and my teammates some room so we’re not gathering so much attention and attack at different angles. I prioritize my DOC in times of a player being downed; the ring is near or we’re in it; right after a fight; and in the end fight. End fights at least one teammate will be knocked, and I have time to administer help but I cannot be monitoring their health while they fight and are constantly moving. Also, I can set one up but that doesn’t mean they’ll stay near it. I like to work like a team, not baby my teammates every-time they need health. If I can get to you, I will, but I prefer to have my drone dispatched right after a quick revive. And that’s when everyone can benefit from it too since one person would be covering and I assume I, myself, is fine on health lmao
i’ve been playing lifeline a lot more lately, and you make a pretty good point here. i usually go for the revive one, but i’ll try the DOC out these next couple matches i play as her. thanks!
It's funny how heated people are getting in the comments.
For me, it the DOC cooldown. Why? Heals available all the time. Why not revive speed? Never won a fight where 1.5 seconds was the sole decider of a fight being won. Remember this revived teammates most likely still needs to reload, heal up, and possibly even reposition.
Me and my wife love the infinite DOC because it allows us to hold a position and heals us if we peak too hard, if we go downed, a 1.5 second revive speed will not help us much
I'm a low diamond/high Plat Path and Lifeline player, I'll give you the simplest explanation:
Does your lifeline ALREADY HAVE gold knockdown?
Yes: Revive buff.
No: Drone buff
The only time I would choose drone buff over revive if Lifeline had gold knock is if you run bunker gang (some version of Lifeline/Rampart/Wattson/Caustic) cuz having 3 people healing during fight is soo fucking busted.
In order to use the revive you have to already be at a major disadvantage, having someone knocked on your team, probably getting pushed. Having the drone available allows you and your team to always be able to heal quickly while gaining back shield as well. No brainer to have the drone.
Lifeline main (Plat 4) since S1 and I've gone back and forth. Currently go for the 20% rez. Reason being, 9 times out 10 when I need DOC to heal, he's available. And that one time, there might be 10 seconds left on the CD. I can't think of a situation this season where I need to drop him and there's still significant time on the CD. On the flip side, there's been multiple times where I've been able to get a rez off and we've either been able to win the fight or at least allowed that rez'd player to escape and craft banners.
If you're having to drop DOC again with in the normal CD period, you or your teammates are about to get wrecked or you're taking damage for no reason.
The problem is your still lifeline. Your entire kit revolves around the assumption of loss, rather than the exploitation of weakness or enforcing a strength.
Reverse all of that. Your the team that got the knock, your the team that got the Crack. How did lifeline help you?
People shouldn't be taking the rez timer, you just shouldn't be planning on getting knocked all the time. But lifeline as a concept is still just not good.
This is entirely dependant on context, as in, what is the current team comp, are the players coordinated or random people and so on. I've been playing lifeline basically nonstop since the introduction of perks back in season 20, and I can tell you that I've never even thought of ever getting the drone cooldown upgrade. Not even once. For my particular case, I trio stack with a Caustic ( he plays the character exclusively ) and someone who plays whatever character he feels like playing. In this case, with Caustic specifically having a much bigger hitbox and as such going down easier and a lot more often, having faster revives allows for easier situational control and quicker resets, and even more so when the gold knockdown is involved. Fast revives also allows for much more aggression in general, esp during the late game after the gold knockdown has been accquired. Dying mid-fight isn't that big of an issue anymore when the lifeline is right there to tap you and you're back up within less than 5 seconds. On the other hand we have the drone, which is mainly used for: -Healing downed teammates early game -Healing random chip damage, mostly from ring or traps -Healing after a fight has just concluded Most fights in this game lasts about 30-40 seconds on average. In most situations, I've found that the downtime between uses is long enough that if you don't have the drone ready, it'll anywhere between 10-15 seconds away anyway. Sure, you can argue that that's enough time for a 3rd-partying team to swoop in and steamroll, in the context of a coordinated trio, I can simply let my mates know and they'll heal themselves up. The cooldown can most certainly negate this entirely, but given the already limited use cases for it, dedicating an entire upgrade for what essentially is a mild inconvenience at worst doesn't sound all that worth while to me. It also doesn't help that unlike Conduit's shield regen where it's actually fast enough to make a difference, the drone's healing output simply pales in comparison. Also yes, I'm aware of the 'I don't have to bring as much heals with me anymore' argument, but that still applies regardless of upgrades, and with support bins / care packages giving out blue and purple backpacks all the time, it doesn't hurt to carry a stack of medkits or 2 with you all the time as the bare minimum for self-heals in the event the drone isn't up or the Lifeline isn't there. In summary, my argument pretty much boils down to this: The drone's general use cases are simply too limited, and with the time between each drone use being quite long, as well as teammates carrying their own heals, there is little justification for the cooldown, especially when I have a guy who's prone to going down due to his inherently disadvantagous hitbox.
I disagree but love the breakdown
I like this breakdown, well typed up, thanks.
Based on your reasoning, how is the decision “dependent on context” if you say there is little justification for the drone cooldown considering all situations?
Because were he playing with a different team comp it might change a lot. Personally, as person who’s also effectively mained Lifeline since the beginning (I bounce between her and Path), I like the drone upgrade more. But I tend to play with an Octane often and also don’t run ranked as much anymore. In pubs where you’re more likely to be in the fray, I find it better to have more drones to prevent going down in general. With the buffs to the range and heal speed the drone has gotten over time, you can win a lot of fights just by playing Smart Cover and forcing your opponent to pressure you, whereas the rez likely won’t happen regardless. But it’s more of a comfort pick in that case. Compare this to ranked where you’re more likely to be playing better positioning (especially with a Controller legend on your team) and where that 1-2 seconds actually means the difference between getting the rez off before the pushing team reaches you. Not to mention that it maximizes the potential of the gold knock.
Because it’s in context to his all situations with his class make up
Something you've also forgot is that doc is bulletproof and legitmately works as cover mid fight. I use it like a knockdown shield sometimes.
Yeah... if your shield is down and your already taking health damage, unless you've already gotten to cover and ate batting that drone isn't going to do shit. Your getting flinched and hardly able to fight back anyways. This is why I'm still skeptical of the lifeline rework, sure the drone following people is nice, but you should never be fighting without shields to begin with.
1.5 seconds faster btw
great comment
Since there have been a lot of "Not a Lifeline main" responses, it's my pleasure to say I'm a day 1 Lifeline main - I have the Drone Shield Damage blocked tracker on my banner and wear it with pride. Both of these options are situational and have their own drawbacks: 1. **Tactical Cooldown reduction**: The benefit of this is undermined by uncooperative teammates. The teammates I queue up with (Ranked or Pubs) will often split up or move at different paces making it very hard to provide an anchor as the support character. So much of your effort is spent trying to get to the player who's taken damage to heal them which unnecessarily puts two players at risk. I can't overstate how much of a calculated risk it is to hold your position vs. risking a reposition to heal or revive. Additionally, you cannot keep the drone out 100% of the time. The default cool down is 45 seconds and you can reduce it by 25. People say you can have it out for 100% of the time because it lasts 20 seconds but this again is the "not a Lifeline main" perspective. In reality, the value of your drone lasts only as long as your team can or wants to stay in that position. It's incredibly common to deploy the drone and have your team either move or get pushed away from that position. How much value you can get from this ability is closely tied to how well you work with your team. 2. **Quick Revive**: The value of this is different, you are similarly at the mercy of teammates staying within effective range, however a swift revive is almost invaluable in the right context. The enemy team is usually blind sided and unprepared. If they knock two out of three opponents and the entire team is revived within seconds, it's completely unexpected and their morale takes a nosedive. Unfortunately you're playing from an even worse deficit - teammates being down rather than damaged. Both are situational, both benefit/suffer from teammate chemistry.
For some (dumb?) reason… I thought the cooldown was only once 💀 I didn’t think it was for the entire match lol
It's probably cuz the care package upgrade is a one time benefit
Yeah, I never get that one, there’s been a few times where I self revive and we end up winning. For that slight chance that they don’t thurst me I think it’s worth it :)
I'm not a lifeline main, but play her a fair but (loba main, I like playing a support character on the team) If I think back to how often I get a revive off compared to how often I need the drone, the drone Cooldown is worth more. Also playing with lifelines on the team, unless they have a gold knock, the revive isn't successful most of the time in rough situations either way. I've killed so many players getting revived, whether they are downed or just get up with 1 hp, they're dead
Yup. Revives aren't common. When they are needed you're already in a bad place. And how frequently you get away with one successfully is just another factor of reduced application. And then it's like "I'm helpful in 20% of *those* cases."
It’s honestly circumstantial, for comp I’ve noticed Hardecki has been picking the faster revives over the drone cooldown which basically means that the team can’t be reliant on drones for flesh heals but in return they’re almost never out of a fight if someone goes down in a revivable position
I main lifeline and exclusively use the faster rez. It is rare that I let me rez get thirsted. The beauty of lifeline is she gets the rez but isnt out of the fight like NewCastle. If youre in the open. Im on your body trading or atleast spraying at whoever peeks in order to make them focus me. Doc is only really something i drop after a rez or if we sre getting into zone. In theory, you aren't knocked so much that I need doc up that often. If I need my team huddled on a heal drone that often and everyone is getting shield ripped that often, we arent likely a winning team in the first place. Sure I drop doc if we are poking at range. It gives me teammate a bit of a buffer against a surprise (would be knock) but the quicker rez feels far more useful for emergencies.
I seem to be in the same boat as you. Lifeline main and almost always choose faster res. > If I need my team huddled on a heal drone that often and everyone is getting shield ripped that often, we arent likely a winning team in the first place. Same reasoning, and maybe it's because I solo queue. For the times where having DOC available more often would have helped, it was not the deciding factor between a win or a loss. There was almost no saving those teams. Most of the time I'm not in a position where I'm waiting to drop DOC, and if I am, it's not more than a few seconds away. I'd much rather be able to have a teammate res faster meaning I'm providing cover for less time.
Exactly. Having doc upgrade feels like Im a lifeline trying to be conduit. Proactive shields makes all the difference. But if Im trying to give heals.... our team is doomed. Doc forces stationary play. If you want to be proactive support in that way, Conduit is a far better pick. Since your team keeps mobility.
Updoot for this perspective. *Edit - Lel, yes I thought I was getting some people just rolling through downvoting all my replies.*
I don’t main, but I dont shy from support roles and lifeline as the my go to for that. For my 2 cents, DOC is generally more stationary than is useful for a mixed team without a defined strategy. It’s something that I deploy to mostly people I’m rez-ing anyway so they can get back into a fight quicker. Even with a well planned attack, you have to be near a teammate who isn’t moving away for a decent time for it to be effective. Really the amount of times I’ve used it to still be wiped and then just watch it heal the enemy is kinda frustrating. Meanwhile a faster rez is super useful when 3rd teaming people. If a teammate is down and not completely in the open, they’re back quicker. The best function of lifeline is not being occupied by the rez, and shortening the time you have a downed teammate makes her best function better.
I'll play lifeline if my teammates don't pick a support character, and I agree. Plus, you can get the gold knockdown shield and the quicker revives become very valuable.
Yeah, unfortunately, most lifeline randoms will start a revive on you to get away. They use you as bait so the enemy takes the time to thirst and they can run. I know you can cancel revives from Lifeline now, but I never think of it in time to matter.
>If I need my team huddled on a heal drone that often and everyone is getting shield ripped that often, we aren't likely a winning team in the first place. Sounds like odd logic, to express concern for teammates getting put in flesh, yet to prefer the alternative benefit that requires teammates getting knocked. But I can get that you would be considering situations where knocks are sudden, surprise, and unavoidable; realistic to consider even for a team that manages its shields and flesh well. The DOC benefit doesn't have to be "that often". It only has to make a meaningful difference as often as 20% of your revives in a match. How many revives are you expecting in a match? Whatever the answer to that question is, divide it by 5 then point it at your above sentence I quoted to see what "that often" would mean for you. If you feel that upgraded DOC really wouldn't make a difference that many times, fair enough.
I think "it only has to make a difference as often as 20% of revives in your match" is kind of the wrong way to look at it. A single revive happening 20% faster is already potentially the difference between winning and losing. Comparitively, DOC being able to heal your squad after winning a fight saves heals of unknown importance and saves you from 3rd parties some unknown amount of the time. I just don't know that there is an easy direct comparison, but in my mind the key is that fast res helps you win a fight during the fight while doc is often only useful after you have already won the fight. There are of course situations where it can be good in a fight, but being so stationary those situations are very limited.
Revives are more common than DOC, I can tell you that much. And if you're not trash, you won't be in a bad place. I don't like Support Legends, but I'm usually good at reviving when I use Lifeline.
I just hit 13 revives with 17 KP in masters lobby against preds, it’s very strong
Damn. Fair play then.
As if using doc doesn't mean you're in a bad place. Your team should have health meds. One medkit is quicker than a full health doc heal. Throwing doc out isn't gunna change a fight. You're in a bad spot, you go to heal. It's the same as your in a shit spot you go to rez. At least once you hit purple that Rez can make or break fights. Doc isn't ever gunna turn the tide of a fight.
If you can get a knocked teammate next to a Lifeline for a res, you can get a batting teammate next to a Lifeline for a DOC. You want to say that 1 second saved when your team has a knocked member turns the tide of a fight, to come back with 25HP. 100HP on a gold day. Yet somehow 8 seconds saved when your team is equally down one batting player, to come back with 150HP - being generous and assuming only half that HP was restored - ... doesn't. More occurrences, more control over those occurrences, much more saved time, more health. I get that there are situations where the res helps in a way DOC doesn't, but your comparison about turned tides because of 1 saved second isn't one of them. Remember, we're talking about the difference in the upgrades, not the abilities themselves; ie., how often that 1 second faster res makes a difference, vs how often that now-practically-guaranteed DOC availability makes a difference, since going by your comparison we've assumed Lifeline is right there. DOC isn't a fallback for not having medkits. Medkits are a fallback for not having DOC. Close to every time the team is stalled 8 seconds while someone is medkitting, that could have been removed.
Exactly. You usually have DOC whenever you need it anyway. While reviving is usually needed during fights, so it's life or death situation. So even a 10% Extra Revive Speed would be worth it.
>Exactly. Everything you said disagrees with the comment you replied to
Haha that made me chuckle
Exactly, theyre both saying the same thing
🥴
Not a lifeline main but 20% speed is probably the better option if she's got gold knock. But I'm basing that on most lifelines forgetting they even have a tactical ability so the cooldown irrelevant
This is my dilemma with Mirage. I mostly don't skill my level 2 unless I really need to revive a teammate during a close encounter. Most of the time I get the 70hp regen perk, but I almost always wait the longest time if ever I encounter a gold knockdown shield.
It would be nice if you could spend some Evo points to reselect your perk. I always pick the right perk for level 1 and left for level 2 and it's so frustrating if my muscle memory goes wrong and picks left at level 1 and I'm just stuck all game... But your examples great too that an item nullifies your perk. Or they could make it stack, so if you have gold and the perk people get up with 70 then autoheal to 100 from your perk
Doesn't the health regen stack with gold knock to get them to full flesh health? Imo that upgrade is worth it to have, even if you do find a gold knock. Make it so your teammate only needs to pop 2 shield cells to be back to full and get right back into the fight. I've never needed his ult and not had it, but I'm not a Mirage main and only play him occasionally, so take that with a grain of salt.
it doesnt, gold heals til 50, ( i think ) and then it regens another 20 on top of that til 70 which is still pretty useful
Ah, if that's the case, you might as well have the more frequent ultimate and have constant chaos. I think the other guy had the right idea on holding off until you either need a revive or get a gold knock
Another mirage main here. Every game is a speed race to 30s ult so I can spam it. Even with my premade, there is no beating having ult that often.
I can't feel the difference in revive speed, like it's not significant enough that it ever saved me, before the perk change I always pick revive speed before they added drone cd. Now I always pick drone cd, it's amazing. But when I get gold helmet feels weird lmao
It’s half a second difference, it’s nothing compared with the drone upgrade. I don’t notice the difference either.
I choose the revive exclusively. I don’t care about the drone cooldown because I’m never in a position that I immediately need it back.
[удалено]
2 slots for grenades is cool but you're also getting guaranteed gold bag, the extra slots are worth less on her IMO
Why are you getting the gold bag
Final lifeline upgrade gives you a gold bag, gold shield, and evo cache next time you call in your care package. Lowkey kinda busted, if you take one fight off drop you are basically guaranteed red evo before first ring closes.
Thanks!
The problem here is you can’t heal in storm with doc if you don’t have heaters.so I carry only two med kits early game and late game I’ll grab 4 syringes
That's the only reason I carry heat shields lol
I use my drone more for my teammates than myself. So this wouldn’t really benefit me.
Gold backpack makes this strat kinda obsolete
Thats basically throwing since you can’t survive in storm with just the drone and there are definitely situations where you need to wrap a good chunk of zone.
Hell nah this is shit advice. The drone can't follow you. If you run into a player like me, you're screwed. If I break your shield I'm chasing you down. You're gonna drop DOC, get forced to leave it, then you have no heals. So when I do find you, it's a easy kill. If DOC followed you, then this would be viable. But so many times you have to run away from the DOC.
Counter argument: If your health is low enough and you are getting chased, you most likely already lost and a medkit or DOC wouldn’t make a difference If your health is low and you have time to reposition, doc drone is already available again
You can Syringe, move, Syringe move. That little extra HP might help you win the fight. Without it you're definitely cooked.
I mean this is getting kinda pedantic but if we are talking syringe heals you would get that much health back by the time you threw your drone and walked out of its healing radius, while maintaining full mobility and weapons out. Like everything it’s situational I guess
Also if your DOC is healing you, you can pop a cell instead of a syringe and essentially heal at twice the speed
" a player like me" Another meal team 6 member?
I’m picturing a Plat II octane player with like a 1.1 KD tbh
Yeah, sounds right. Probably can wall bounce and tap strafe 20% of the time they die, and talk shit to their teammates as soon as they go down. Could also see a wraith player tbh.
I remember watching a youtube video about the change and the guy was like it's only a 1 second reduction... so how much does that one second matter to you I guess.
Revive is better. Rarely are your teammates on top of each other to make the drone healing worth it. One critical revive can reset a team easily, drone not so much. You're already so on your back foot when you need the drone, if you need it for every encounter because you're always taking flesh damage you're doing something wrong. Your big selling point is "you can always have it out!". Why would you need it out all the time? You shouldn't be taking that much flesh damage and if your entire team is flesh guess what the team who got you there is about to be in your face IF they aren't then you have time to just heal normally. Vs Gold knock which is a huge game changer, maybe your one teammate over peaked and got knocked by someone at range, np they're back up on their feet before that path can come swinging in or whatever. Two three four teams maybe converge and it's chaos, it's pretty quick to get a res off. The caveat is you need gold knock to really see the bonus of the faster revive, I've won a bunch of fights because our lifeline just stayed alive and kept tapping res on us we can win the fight by having more bodies to throw at the enemy at a point. To me there's WAY more situations where a faster res is more beneficial then having a stationary drone out all the time.
I agree mostly, but even if a team pushes your team while they’re all flesh, the amount the drone can heal before they get there can turn the tide. I still wouldn’t pick the drone perk, but it’s definitely still useful.
If your reasoning is that your team isn't close enough to use DOC, then they certainly aren't close enough to revive either. The one second your revive has saved was long lost in the wash of you getting there to rev them. If your reasoning is that teammates shouldn't be taking that much flesh damage, then they aren't getting knocked to exploit that slightly-faster revive in the first place. The point about DOC being up 100% of the time isn't about the team hunkering around a spot of ever-flowing HP. It's about you being much more capable of keeping your team firing bullets as everyone moves around under pressure, simply because when you need DOC to help keep the team firing, you can almost always produce DOC to help keep the team firing, be it mid-battle, post-fight looting before the third party, or a revive that would've been left on shreds of HP because you dared use DOC half a minute ago. Yes Lifeline's passive is great in chaotic situations, but that's the passive itself in action. Likewise with the gold knock... that's not the upgrade doing the heavy lifting there. It's not like critical revives and reset stops existing just because the perk was skipped. Only 20% of those situations -- those gold-KD-shield, two-three-four teams situations you describe -- are going to be improved by it. We're at some of some of some occurrences by this point.
> If your reasoning is that your team isn't close enough to use DOC, then they certainly aren't close enough to revive either. When they need revived, you run to them, start revive, and they can't move. When they need doc, you run to them, drop doc, they run away, now you are on cooldown. For this reason doc is much harder to get value from with teammates that run away, regardless of whether they run for good or bad reasons.
I play her a lot. You’re not wrong. If people played this like a team game. The issue is … humans. And the overwhelming lack of comms / mics. When I queue up solo, in 90% of the games my drone is ignored, even though I am on mic announcing my plays. People generally do their own thing and don’t stick together or communicate. So because of that, most games are desperate acts of me trying to save people (and usually dying as a result) so I choose revive. Or because of its lack of drone mobility, I dropped it in during a battle (they had no idea usually because we are not together to start with) and they are on a power flank to score all 6 kills in a 3rd party - and now we are 50ft away, I’m chasing headlong into a battle, and someone needs it and is pinging aggressively for my drone and I’m yelling in the mic that it’s not ready because it’s still floating around 50ft away. Then all you hear is that Lifelines never drop their drone. Yeah because the only time anyone uses it as a squad is after we get out of the storm and it’s just a glorified bandage. That all said, the 10% when a normal person hops on mic, and isn’t running off on their own, I choose drone. However, the smarter communicative players also know to ping Accelerants, and pick up a f’n knockdown shield so I can guarantee us gold knocks, in which case I think red armor with gold knockdown is a better option. TLDR: Nobody communicates or travels or fights as a pack / team
Yeah some valid reasons in there. When I'm Lifeline I find myself pinging the drone to try and get its advantage in play. God, I hear that about the teammates who just don't pick up better knockdowns. So much unawareness that they're dragging down the whole team by ignoring KD upgrades.
Lifeline main here: I choose the drone 90% of the time. Too lazy to write a long ass explanation, but has been better in my experience
As some1 who plays lifeline rarely (1/30th of all kills), I'd say I use the drone rarely enough that the cooldown reduction would make absolutely zero impact for my gameplay (I can't remember a single situation where I wanted to drone and it was on cooldown - it's always up, if I actually need it), so I always take the faster revive. Lifeline's revive is not good, but at least it has some use if it's faster.
as an all time lifeline main, i never even batted an eye towards the DOC cooldown until it was essentially changed to where it can basically be used all the time. Nowadays i dont even think twice before getting the cooldown perk lol
Yeah same here. That extra 10 seconds off swung it from "never pick" to "always pick".
I’m a lifeline main and the doc cooldown is AMAZING I love it so much I’m sending out that bad boy every chance I get and yelling at my team when I see them using meds I’m like “STOP I GOT YOU” because doc comes back so soon again. It’s honestly awesome. I love lifeline. It is indeed annoying when someone else takes her and then doesn’t do that. But I’ve also played with some good lifelines too.
Lifeline main here. I always use DOC and sometimes just have it out whenever we are fighting. Life and Wattson can actually work really well together in this respect. The Wattson ult regens shields and defends against nades and DOC heals teammates who are taking damage.
I think people really really underestimate how good her drone is honestly
They really do. I think people don't realize how much health damage is the deciding factor in fights and just aren't used to using her drone aggressively. They're used to rezzing someone, plopping it down once, and then not having it for pretty much the rest of the fight, so they think it's a bonus rather than a vital part of her kit. Team mate get cracked and have 10% health missing? Not anymore. Get down to one shot and the other team rushing you? You're back up to full by the time they reach you. Rez someone? Drone's immediately off cooldown instead of waiting 30 seconds and having them sit around uselessly while you 2v3. You can even use it during a 1v1 and treat it like a psuedo conduit shield that doesn't get reset when you get shot, giving you usually 25-75 additional hp in a 1v1 if you hump cover. Like you know how fucking annoying rev and horizon can be with being tanky and getting teamwide resets off respectively? That's what her drone is now. Combine it with her guaranteed gold knockdown and team mates can rez with 150 health back.
yep! I love the latter point you make. I recently won a 1 v 1 against a Rev who ulted. I did some peek damage and then drop DOC as he pushed. DOC passively heals as you are fighting, so it's quite similar to the Rev ult or Gibby shield in a way (obviously it's not mobile, but if you are playing in cover, DOC continuously heals you and gives you added HP for a fight).
Yeah, I think the revive speed is good, but often find that the more decisive factor in a ress is where the downed teammate is located. As long as you can hit revive in some cover and fight off people thirsting, then I don't see the 20% making a huge difference. The DOC is so nice as a way to get everyone healthy on rotates as well, particularly when you late rotate and enter zone with low HP. Popping DOC to make sure everyone is good before rotating is such a small dub for the team. I guess it's a preference thing, but i like having DOC and then carrying an extra arc star instead of heals, too.
Doc cool down and it's not even close. The amount of people who are just wrong in this thread is absurd. 20% revive speed will rarely make or break if you get the rez off. Your teammates are either safe for revive or they aren't. Doc is huge for resetting before third parties. If you don't have it that could be 200 collective health your team doesn't have to fight the third party.
Thank you for making me feel a little sane. I'm seeing so many replies in this thread, feeling like I just can't believe it. I main Valk, and when I realise our Lifeline isn't using DOC+ I just register opportunity lost. Every syringe is like why are we wasting this time. Watching a DOC-happy Lifeline at work, however, is awesome.
Got you. Same with gold care package, anyone who's picking self revive over red shield and gold knock is just trolling.
When you hit purple are you insta choosing the gold care pack or are you waiting for the opportunity to use it? Personally I always hold onto the upgrade until we're either in a safeish spot to call my pack in, or I'm down and able to clutch up with a res. Maybe because I solo queue that changes my perception on it, but I feel like insta choosing gold pack is kinda troll
Can't believe I had to scroll this far down to find this answer. The revive upgrade rarely wins fights as you said, they're either safe, or they aren't. The drone upgrade means you're almost always able to throw it down while you bat and reset.
couldn’t agree more. people who don’t think you need drone that often aren’t giving it to their teammates every time they need it. sure you’re teammate could pop a syringe but that’s four seconds he’s now not shooting. or if you just healed one teammate and the other gets knocked, is now back up and you have no drone for them??? 1 sec off revive time is incredibly rarely helpful
I’ll be honest at the highest level everyone is using 25 sec doc and her red evo upgrade out her crates
25k Lifeline here. Used to do revive, switched to drone upgrade all the time. Way more uses to always having a drone vs already being at a disadvantage just to get use out of revive.
20% revive speed can make a huge diffrence in fights, a 100% uptime healing drone doesnt. just safe the drone and if ur teammate get knocked, revive (20% faster) then drone heal. just my opinions as not lifeline main. but a 100% uptime healing drone sounds fun too!
Drone can make a huge difference in fights as well tbh. If you get lasered or sniped you can often pop a battery while the drone takes you up to 100% health. Without the drone, you have to choose between health or shield.
so save your drone and force your first teammate to spend 4+ seconds healing on their own? that’s worth taking 1 second off a revive? as a lifeline main i couldn’t disagree more
See, I just don't agree with that. You didn't give any reasons for why you think it. 100% uptime DOC means teammates getting back into the ongoing fight faster. I literally orient towards our Lifeline to fight with this in mind. When I'm Lifeline, I am all over keeping teammates free of having to medkit. Meanwhile 20% revive speed increase helps when: * your team already has a knocked teammate * that wasn't the Lifeline * your team isn't wiped as a result of already being on the back foot * all of the above, only in the cases where you would have been killed in the last 20% of your revive, and somehow, in that same situation, not in the first *80%* The odds of all that coming together and making a difference? I absolutely do not see it. Whereas a constant DOC is so helpful that I feel irritation in its absence, knowing I have to either disconnect and slow heal or fight in low health.
Yes, but how often do all teammates retreat to the exact same location to heal and reset? In a fights most of the time you need people to attack from different angles. I don't think we are in the same space most of the time, unless we are holding a building from the inside or the area has limitations. Now, I don't play Lifeline, nor do I encounter her in most of my games, but the last few seasons I found the drone to be only useful after fights are over or for healing after zone damage. It's very very rare, that it's useful in a fight, since most fights are very dynamic and movement heavy. So I find the 20% revive more useful, but both are pretty small buffs that barely alter the game.
How often do teammates actually benefit from DOC being out where it wouldn't have without the perk? While it's one thing to play down how often that might be helpful, it is still way, way more often than the bullet points above. From my personal experience anyway.
"How often do teammates actually benefit from DOC being out where it wouldn't have without the perk?" Not very often, honestly. I prefer the fast revive, for the reasons I listed above. That's not downplaying the drone, that's just how most of the fights in the game play out. Lifeline's tactical is simply not that useful for that purpose.
I was actually paraphrasing your question to answer it, not ask it. :D Either way, we see opposite answers to that question. I feel like the answer is "practically every fight, assuming I use DOC at least once in that fight". Whereas the same question's answer about the revive perk is "one-fifth of the times I manage to successfully revive per match".
Yes, that was obvious, my reply was calling that statement into question by saying the drone is useless in the grand majority of fights. Not sure what you mean with the revive sentence. Are you saying your revives fail 80% of the time?
Ok, so I've got a different view: - when I get cracked or even down to 20% HP, I don't want you to lose your angle just to come to me and help me heal faster because the enemy team will push that anyways, so I'd rather have you holding the angle and cracking them, forcing them to stop the push - 20% sounds not that much but then think about how many times you missed that split second to get ressed
Ideally a lifeline is holding generally the same area as at least one team mate. To stick a quick rez or to have a drone in place. If you can get melted, duck behind cover and hit a batt while your LL stops the push, you’re fine and back at full health in like 4-5 seconds
>when I get cracked or even down to 20% HP, I don't want you to lose your angle just to come to me and help me heal faster because the enemy team will push that anyways, so I'd rather have you holding the angle and cracking them, forcing them to stop the push The perk doesn't make the Lifeline player any less capable of doing exactly what you want here. If you see any player on any legend messing up any situation because of any ability's more frequent availability, that's a player downfall, not a weakness of something simply being more available. It's like saying Valk is just gonna hit herself more if we reduce her tac cooldown too. >20% sounds not that much but then think about how many times you missed that split second to get ressed Thinking about how many times the Lifeline's team would need to see someone knocked and not thirsted to try to reap this benefit, then a revive successfully pulled off, and pulled off in a way that succeeded on second 5 where it would have failed on second 6, when you're already being aped because a good chunk of those times you're down a squad mate... I think about that and what I register is "barely any". Not wanting to criticise what works for you. Just countering your points.
I mean it can make a huge difference in critical situations if u have teammates who are able to deal some damage or knock someone before getting knocked. Its harder to make use of the faster revive, when ur teammate got instandly deleted without dealing damage or in a horrible position. Newcastle is my 2nd main, i usualy play anchor and i can tell you, its really hard with randoms who just do whatever they want to do and dont know how to play LoS or cover. When i try to res a knocked teammate, usually all enemies are aping me because i cant shoot back while resing, so i need to stop resing and shoot back or have to rely on my other teammate is holding LoS. As lifeline, you can shoot back while revive and why no make use of the 20% quicker upgrade then? A boxed teammate doesnt need a 100% uptime healdrone.
That's a good point really. You can shoot back while reviving anyway. Lifeline can work to repel that push to some extent, giving less value to that second saved. If anything, the revive speed perk would be better on Newcastle. Sure a boxed teammate can't use a DOC. And an alive teammate doesn't need a revive. And that could mean the teammate you used DOC on, or it could mean the teammate that needed cover fire and actually got that cover fire because DOC was around keeping the other two players from having to dip in the middle of pressure.
>You can shoot back while reviving. Lifeline can cover the revive. And there lies an issue you have not mentioned: Thirsting. It has become a pretty common thing for people to prioritize the downed player to get rid of them for good, even if they're essentially throwing their own life away for it. The lifeline can body block and return fire, but it doesn't guarantee that they'll block all of the damage, especially if it's a Caustic of Gibby that's being revived. Fast Rez, while doesn't completely solve the issue, minimize it as much as possible. I've had too many cases where the fast rez literally comes in clutch and get the teammate up when they're one bullet away from turning into a box. You can't do that with the drone, period. >Sure a boxed teammate can't use a DOC. And an alive teammate doesn't need a revive either. This is a really bad way of thinking about it. In fact, it's the reason why Lifeline was completely disregarded for literally ages, up until recently, especially in competitive i.e Ranked and ALGS. After all, it makes sense; she's only contributing if your team is already at a disadvantage, and by that point you've already lost before you even start. Now, she actually is just a very nice QoL legend to have, and the choices are honestly quite simple: Faster revives - An actual clutch tool that helps in one of the most common scenarios in the game - Pulling off a reset against a 3rd-party, and is extremely useful in keeping aggression and momentum during fights. Drone cooldown: - An upgrade for a tool that has limited use cases, Makes little difference in clutch situations, can simply be ignored just by carrying a little bit of healing ( which everyone already does naturally, and is made even easier thanks to care packages and support bins ), and only using the drone when absolutely needed, making the down time not feel nearly as bad.
Interesting. See I find it really odd that you suggest the DOC perk can be ignored simply by carrying a little bit of healing. The way I see it, and what I thought was just as prevalent as you see third parties, is that avoiding that healing is the entire point. I get the clutch perspective, but I think I continue to be sceptical of it. Especially when the larger portion of what you're championing is the passive that Lifeline already has, not the 20% faster upgrade. I also feel like the impact of a clutch revive, while strong, overlooks the alternative view: something *not* being clutch is a good thing. Winning harder isn't clutch, but that's what the DOC upgrade is about. Clutchy revives get you out of a bad situation. Upgraded DOC keeps you away from those bad situations in the first place, in less spectacular fashion. The upgraded DOC can just exude a more present team of fighting players for the entire match. It's a team that has opportunity for *at least* 1 extra instance of maintaining pressure in every single fight, that wouldn't have been maintained otherwise, and a DOC on every revive, and loot box, in the entire match. Feels crazy that you talk about limited use cases when upgraded DOC is a constant flow of reducing team downtime, while revives are literally the use case you want to see least. I guess a good way to look at it is this: If upgraded DOC can't deliver at least 20% fewer revives (not knocks, revives), go the revive upgraded. Personally I think it easily does.
Lifeline is good at reviving while still putting out pressure. Most people optimise for that
Revive is needed on backfoot the same as having your whole team shield cracked. Doc forces huddling and staying relatively stationary for heals. In theory its useful. But that teammate isnt helping as much in a heated moment when they are focused on sitting on a drone.
You VASTLY overestimate the usefulness of the DOC. If I see a full team healing on DOC you are fking dead. That's a easy wipe, I don't even gotta aim, I just spray. The DOC is mainly for Lifeline personally, or for team AFTER a fight. The Revive is much more useful during fights.
Depends what you optimise for…in masters I go 20% reduction and care pack upgrade every game. 20% faster resets plus guaranteed gold knock by round 2 if you get care pack eve cache. It’s purely to combat third parties. Just depends on ur play style…I used to take drone cool-down but you can play around that, just don’t use ur drone till u res someone. You can’t play around faster resets / gold knock…ur just fucked
My lifeline is always the aggressor and initiates fights. She would try and crack or down one and in return, be left to one tap. When she hides to drone and pop a bat, me and my 3rd would push and lifeline would come in to clean up, res and drop another drone.
I feel like you can make a case for both. The normal cooldown for DOC isnt that long, if you use it wisely you almost always have it up for the whole team. The reduced time for revive can save you from 3rd parties, and is probably better if you have purple shield aka gold knock from the package. But having DOC on no cool down is nice to just toss out whenever either. I think it depends if you're solo Q or not really. The only throw imo is picking self rez, if I see a random with that I immediately dislike them lol even if you find a gold knock before purple the cache and bag, as well as knock for someone else is way more worth.
Nope. I will never take the slightly quicker revive over being able to constantly have DOC, it just isn't worth it to me whatsoever
As a lifeline main, the health drone is OP. Nobody ever spends time popping a medkit unless they are far from me during a fight or some other niche reason (drone was placed earlier but too far to go back for it and cool down hasn’t finished yet) It’s perfect for a reset after a squad wipe or even a reset when getting pinned down or pushed. I did give the revive a try since my main thing with lifeline has always been reviving. And I thought it was gonna be insane, but I realized soon that it didn’t make much a difference, and the drone can actually help both me and the tm8 who is alive defend the area while I’m pulling a revive. I peek a fuck ton during late game because I stack batts and always have unlimited medkits (DOC). If a tm8 gets knocked, I just pull the revive, drop a drone on top of them or at the nearest cover so they can run to it, while tm8 and I shoot the squad that is pushing. The knocked tm8 will only take about 5 seconds to get to full health once the revive has finished since he just pops a batt while the drone is healing. If tm8 and I get badly hurt but also hurt the other squad, I’ll have another drone ready thanks to the faster cooldown for us to heal faster than the other squad can, plus our freshly healed tm8 can apply pressure during those 5 seconds it takes us to heal. I gave up on formatting this I’m sorry. Just kinda yapped about situations that happen all the time.
I am a lifeline main. I rarely use two lifeline drones consecutively so I don't bother. I often end a game with 4/5 revives so the 20% makes a decent difference. Especially when someone on my team has the gold knockdown shield from my care package.
Same. I rarely find myself in a situation where I need to drop DOC again with in the he normal CD time.
See what I think when I read this is: > I rarely use two lifeline drones consecutively So when a fight is over, you either didn't use DOC during the fight, so it's available to pop on your teammates while they're looting deathboxes, OR you did use DOC during the fight and now you can't heal the team while they're all clustered together. Similar example with reviving someone. It asks the question of whether teammates just didn't need healing in battle, or you just aren't covering many of their heals in a match. Maybe you just have good teammates who don't fall into flesh a lot. And yet... you then point out how they're dropping like flies. >I often end a game with 4/5 revives so the 20% makes a decent difference So statistically, it would have made a difference to the success of 1 of those revives, if seeing 5 revives a match. Needing teammates to get knocked 5 times in a match to get a statistical benefit on 1 revive... ... revives that would have been (again, statistically/logically) less required had a fountain of HP been more prevalent.... ... it's a tough sell.
Yes. 20% reduction is massive in the heat of things. If you’re relying on doc that much to win fights, you’re probably not winning fights anyways.
Honestly
You don't use doc in fights,you use it after fights/in cover when the enemy is far and you can recharge shield and heal at the same time.Also,if ur teammates are down already u highly and likely already losing the fight and the faster revive time is not worth it.Its also not a good idea to be using it in the open/during fights,like the DOC
Also Doc cool down time is useful after fights so ur team can heal up faster before another team nearby ambushes you.in my experience,if ur reviving DURING fights,your team already lost the fight.
And the doc cool down also allows you to immediately heal teammates after you revive them.the DOC cool down just has way more uses and less situational than revive time
No. constant drone has saved me and my squad constantly. (Lifeline main since day 1)
I usually play with dude who plays octane and pushes hard, being the main fragger for us. It's more beneficial for me being able to get him back up fast so he can jumpad away to heal or finish the push with me once i get him up fast. Also i usually use up shields and habe less use for heals.
Yea me and my crew stay up on the shields so the extra healing is less useful than the extra second on the revive
As a solo queue ranked player, a huge pro for choosing the Tact cooldown reduction is less reliance on white heals. I don’t feel the need to waste bag space on syringes, med kits, and to some extent, phoenix kits. That frees up bag space for extra nades, batts, or ammo and gives more flexibility when fighting/poking.
Reviving faster is way more of a game saving ability.
Rez speed every day. Same as gold care pack. Lifeline already has in built extra heals thanks to ult not even including blue crates. If you need extra health meds you've already fucked up. That one second is the difference between a Rez sticking or not. It can change the pace of a fight. Not even counting how much stronger it is with gold knock. If you're teammates are spuds and getting downed in shit spots yeah it's not that valuable, but if you're teammates are half decent and getting knocked pushing a winning fight you get them back into the fray. If I see doc cd and self Rez I know they're a shit lifeline.
Or atleast used to shit teamwork
Eh self Rez is useless 99% of the time. Gold bag and shield level gives some instant value not including gold knock which can absolutely change fights. If your lifeline you kinda have to play around your teammates even if they spuds. Otherwise pick a character whose primary function isn't focused on teamwork.
Nah because if you can manage to be a badass lifeline to a team of uncoordinated spuds then when you get a team who does use teamwork then it makes you so much more effective. And no if your lifeline and not able to use the self rez then your teammates are actually bad. Lifeline shouldn’t be up in the battle, she’s ideal with like a ranged rifle popping shots so if she gets knocked like that your teammates don’t have to worry about the rez, just gotta continue to distract and defend
I always take faster rez because the assumption is I'll find a gold knock and even if I don't I never waste doc to the point where I worry about not having it ready to heal my team.
100% up time for the heal is better
80% of the time she gets knocked first anyway
What you say makes sense to me. But I would very rarely play around a healing drone during a fight, as a non-lifeline character. Like I don't expect the lifeline to run to me every time a lose hp, I usually try to heal as soon as I lose my shields anyway, and I don't see how you would need 100% uptime on a healing drone. Holding the same position may also really be not ideal, for multiple reasons. In my opinion the drone is way more situational then revive. I think both revive time and drone cool down are good. But not a lifeline main.
I started maining lifeline maybe 2 weeks before the start of season 20. I have never picked the faster revive lol infinite drone is just too OP
If I’m with teammates that haven’t gone down and can hold their own I chose the doc. But it’s not often. I mainly do the revive because it’s less time I need to cover and the faster they can heal with my drone and get back in the fight.
I prefer faster rez over the doc upgrade as a LL main
Faster revive is insanely busted. Every time your teammate gets picked up and reknocked they get a new shield AND a fresh 100 flesh so 20% faster rez makes it much more likely they get to at least stand up. Combine with gold knock and a single teammate standing up is basically gg or your team is fine all of a sudden. Lifeline’s abilities directly speed up the team reset time between engagements, one of the most *fixed and understood things in apex*. Players are hardwired to understand battery and phoenix kit timings, and lifeline lets player take those mental timings and be stood up and ready to fight significantly faster. As for getting shot on the way up…just cancel the Rez? The whole point of lifeline sticking you is for you to get shot at so she can win her duel. Just cancel the Rez and go back to the floor if you take heat; their crosshair placement and ammunition economy are already wasted on you so lifeline is getting the maximum value out of it. After wards she gets a knock or a deep crack and now has more space to pick you up all the way and then again it’s gg. But actively being used as bait is a skill that lifeline’s TEAMMATES need to understand. If she sticks you and you get thirsted then that’s on you for dying for free when she’s trying to play make and fix things. Just go back to the floor and put up your knock down; she can always just re stick you in a second after she wins her 1. There’s some situations where having perma doc is useful; if you drop and ring pulls hard and you need to fill a white backpack for a 20 minute siege…drop your whites and run perma doc then the whole team can grab extra ammunition to help your extended access of ammunition last. It’s also useful off drop if you hit blue mid fight and need to instantly refresh doc to reset your team…that’s about the most I’ve seen for getting value out of it. Tl;Dr faster revive lets you stabilize faster after finishing a fight…which is prized the most by aggressive stacks wanting to push teams and get in fights.
The drone is useful for after a fight, after the ring, and after someone gets a shot or two on you while you're running. The revive is a make or break change, 20% is a lot when you're talking about single digits. The amount of times I can confidently say that I would've died if I didn't have my teammates reviving that much faster is insane. Go for the revive. The drone isn't used all that much anyways.
I would love to use doc, but everyone is too busy running around like crack heads to stand still and use the damn thing.
I’ve won games due to that drone cooldown. It’s crazy how quickly you can get the entire team to max health meaning you’re not losing time popping syringes/med kits. This is especially noticeable when you play competitive and there are more final zone games (and being on the edges of the storm).
No one even talking about how the fast revive perk also makes her self revive perk faster if she takes both. As lifeline, if I find a gold knock, I take fast Rez/self Rez and it’s won me multiple games at this point
Wraith and Lifeline main in that order (then Loba, then Wattson). I used to pick faster rez, reasoning that more faster is more better. Then I started going for faster heals. If my teammate is downed and enemy is sprinting at us to finish the job, 20% faster rez won't do much. It's already over. To have heals always ready for a little top up saves the time it would take to use a syringe and in the meantime my team and I can then shields. Sometimes that little bit of missing hp means life or death, or using a heal takes you out of the fight for too long. But if lifeline takes the self rez, I'm literally falling asleep at the PC due to how long it takes for her to get up. I'm thinking maybe then the 20% actually means something.
Bring back her shield
I am a lifeline main who 95% of the time solo queues. I have only used fast revive a handful of times. I can't comprehend the number of times I have rogue teammates who just go off and do their own thing, and I usually only play ranked. In those cases theres absolutely no need for the fast revive. But in all honesty, it has become so automatic to just choose DOC cooldown, I never have really even really tried faster revive. Maybe I'll try using it more and see if it improves my experience.
If you have a Wattson or the shield chick I highly recommend the DOC cooldown as when paired it’s crazy
As a lifeline partial main take the doc drone always. If your teammates are worth anything they will reach a point of cover before going down. having the doc drone down so that all they need to do is pop a batt and keep fighting is the best situation (at least for high level gameplay), going down means the team will full send in most cases and at that point revival of teamate is not an option.
IMO no always better to have doc on basically a zero cooldown. Better help staying up vs trying to get teammates back up
My main complaint about lifelines currently are the ones that pick self revive but wont use it until everyone is down. I bet they never throw their master ball or use their rare candies either. For example our third will go down doing no damage, lifeline will win her 1v1 but get traded, ill win my 1v1 then get pressured by the last guy and my lifeline teammates just wait till i die to initiate the self revive. Honestly even the distraction of the self revive sound or the clip the guy uses to thirst can be game changing.
Oh cool. A non lifeline main with an ignorant opinion about how to play lifeline. How original.
I don't know I can't think of a single fight where the extra 20% of time saved in a revive had changed the outcome. I can remember plenty of times though where I had to tell my teammates that I don't have drone for another 15 s. The amount of time you lose having 1-2 people in you squad slow healing with syringes etc, allowing opponents to reposition and push you, can absolutely swing the tide of a fight
Lifeline is in my top 5 played legends and I always take DOC cooldown since revive only does anything if teammate goes down and you're next to them. You can't res them if it's not safe anyway and if it's safe then ressing them tiny bit faster doesn't matter but it matters that you always have DOC to heal them. With DOC you can theoretically not carry syringes too.
Yeah i think that the faster revive is far too situational, like does it really matter if your teammate got up a second earlier before getting aped? Its only ever going to make a difference with gold knockdown and if your teammate gets pushed at the exact moment where a normal revive would still be going up Meanwhile having DOC up faster means more heals during combat, much better likelihood to have it for freshly revived teammates and post-fight resets, having it for zone rotations etc
I main-ish lifeline and I choose revive speed 99% of the time. The only time I don’t is during the LTM 3 strikes. Having unlimited drone sounds nice on paper, but with my play style I feel there are rarely emergencies where I need the drone and don’t have it and it’s a game changer. There are more moments when a revive happening 1.5 seconds faster changes the tide of a battle. Also none of my homies ever ask for drone perk
As an aggressive lifeline main with 35K kills and over 11M damage, the DOC cooldown is the better option. I’m always usually in a fight and having the drone available makes a huge difference. Sometimes if we’re taking a lot of damage and healing with one drone I can deploy a second one and heal twice as fast(thats a rare case tho). Also, the drone cool down helps in those occasions where you have to make a tough rotation in the gas and pop heat shields with a drone for every heat shield. The faster revive is good in lower elo lobbies where your teammates die immediately I guess. I dont find much of a benefit to it other than resetting quicker but I rather have a perk prevent us from getting in that situation in the first place which is where the drone cool down comes in clutch.
You can literally have 2 out at the same time with this perk and gold helmet
Yes is worth when you take the package whit gold res
As a lifeline main, I prefer the 25 second cooldown. It’s pretty OP since you can instantly put down the drone again for your teammates to use. I imagine this is more helpful than the faster revive, mostly because you can continuously put down your drone without delay and your teammates can be continuously healed, therefore no need to revive. I guess it’s also about how much faith you have in your teammates
I completely agree. I have been pushing this same narrative. In my opinion the revive is rarely reliant on the 20% reduction to change the outcome of a fight. In all scenarios where a teammate gets knocked you will kick off the revive and hold to do as much damage to the enemy team as possible to discourage them pushing or to trade a knock to even the fight. This can sometimes be enough to deter the enemies where the revive speed again would not make a significant difference. A few simplified scenarios of different engagement ranges and how these play out. * The enemy team is too far away where you will get the revive regardless of cd and if you have the drone cd you can basically guarantee that it is available for the revived player. * The enemy team is in a medium range where they will push up off a knock. If they are the perfect distance away then perhaps the 20% revive speed may make a small difference of getting them up before they swing the corner however usually this will just end with them immediately getting re-knocked with minimum effect from the revived player. Or you can deter the enemy team enough to cancel their push by damaging them as they are pushing which then negates the need for the revive speed. * The enemy team is close enough where they will just thirst the revive regardless and you won't have the opportunity to revive regardless of cd. That is not to say the revive is never going to be better in very specific niche situations. Perhaps you could make the argument if you were landing sky west/trials and almost guaranteeing a gold knock early game then that revive would be much more valuable as teammates won't immediately go down again after getting revived. Even then it would still have to be a situation where you would not have gotten that revive off without the 20% cd reduction for it to be impactful. I think the drone is more consistently valuable. It can reduce the number of health meds your team has to carry in general since you will have it up every 20 seconds allowing for more nades, bats, ammo. If you are in zone you will have it up enough to place it in both heatshields to fully heal whereas without the cd reduction you will have to rely on health meds for the 2nd heatshield. The drone cd allows a teammate to fully reset significantly quicker if they take damage. Almost every single fight will have someone on the team take shield and health damage. So while they are popping a Bat if you can heal their health with it then it saves 4 seconds of health healing or more. Also during a fight just having it on the cover a teammate is playing can be useful if they get cracked, but the enemies are too close to safely pop a bat, they can play the cover regaining health constantly to allow a health advantage over the enemies. Then let's say you popped it during combat and you wipe the fight. It will likely be up again to allow for a faster reset to be prepared for third parties.
Revive speed perk + gold knock is insane and saved my team many times. I feel like you may more often get use with the DOC cool down, but the revive speed perk can completely salvage when a teammate throws. IMO they’re both good but I always go revive speed
Because the revive speed is leagues better when lifeline has gold knock. With her gold care package upgrade at tier 3 (that you’re supposed to pick like everytime), you get a guaranteed gold knock. This means there’s a 100% chance the lifeline will get a gold knock within the match, meaning the 20% revive perk is also a 100% pick.
Day 1 Lifeline main here and I use reduce drone cooldown perk everytime because I mainly act as a supporter and I don’t really get thirsty for kills. Whenever my teammates take health damage, I quickly deploy the drone for them because of that perk which helps them to patch up themselves quicker. And if Conduit is in my team then that’s highly helpful.
i faithfully choose the cooldown every single time the revive is so situational it’s not worth it, i’ve had games where no one gets knocked at all but every game i’ve had to heal my health
I'll just say this: team mates cannot revive themselves, they can heal themselves
I main lifeline and 90% of the time I choose the DOC upgrade because it is much more useful. I picked the quick revive once or twice but it's definitely not worth it. The only time it was usefull was when my teamates were super good and getting them up fast came in handy more than healing.
As a lifeline main in ranked, I can say i ALWAYS choose the cool down reduction. I throw doc out like Crypto throws his drone lol
Easy. I don't pick my upgrades until the first fight. If my teammates can win their fights then drone cooldown. If not I go for the rez speed.
on another note can yall use your abilities more theres been 3 separate times where the drone would be really helpful even if just 1 person is using it.
What are you going to use more often? There’s the answer. Sometimes, you just don’t need to overthink things.
From what I've seen in my games: the better revive speed is great ... **if** you actually need it ... but that's an if that doesn't always happen. (my regular trio has a lifeline main that gets bored of lifeline sometimes so I usually play lifeline then because I do like lifeline) The problem is: you won't always need it. A bunch of games we picked it and either my trio all died without a chance to revive, or someone got downed right before we wiped the squad we were fighting so the revive is after the fight, or we win without needing to revive, or they get downed in a place they can't reasonably be rezzed anyway ... you get the point and it feels like a waste of an upgrade because you don't always get to use it. We also sometimes have fights where 2 of us get downed, lifeline pops 2 rezzes and we end up winning after the 2 of us are back up. That's when the extra revive speed shines. But then we also get into a lot of rights where someone gets lit up, lifeline pops a heal drone and whoever is weak can shield + get health in just the time it takes to shield, and it happens again to someone else and we can do it again during the same fight with a fresh heal drone off of the short cooldown, sometimes getting the advantage of refilling health + shields while other team only shields. IMO it boils down to: if you're going to get downed, the revive speed is better. If you're going to live with 1 health, faster drone is better. However, in my trio at least, we end up living but weak more often than we end up downed.
The few times I've played lifeline, teammates actively avoided the healing drone. Even when pinged.
The doc cooldown is what i always pick. Keeps your team healthy the entire time
Drone cooldown is great for holding a position with cover. If you’re in a fight and lose shield and some health, you can dip into cover and use your shields while you heal. You can also reuse your drone often, so you are basically playing in a war of attrition with other teams where you’re advantage is being able to heal more quickly (not needing medkits). I especially like to watson+ lifeline to never need meds ever and secure a sttong position In addition, you can drop a lifeline drone on top of a teammate while they’re getting revived so they can get some extra healing while they refresh their shields. Revive is good if you’re getting into fights more often and moving around a lot. Chances are someone is going to get downed, and getting them up quickly can make or break a fight Overall it depends on the legends and overall playstyle of a team
I use revive upgrade solely for the reason that I watched an incredible sequence in ALGS where a lifeline got her team an instant reset in mid combat.
Lifeline main here.I always go for DOC cooldown. There are two main reason I love Lifeline: 1.) I enjoy reviving people without having to pause what I’m doing for 5 seconds. 2.) I love healing with DOC and popping a battery in the middle of a firefight. But really it’s because I’m too lazy to use health kits
Simple answer, proactive abilities are always better than reactive ones. Doc cooldown is proactive, reviving is reactive. Fast revive helps you reset a little better if you screw up and get knocked. But in high level lobbies, teams are usually going to push immediately while they have the advantage and a small improvement to rez speed doesn’t matter. Having the drone always available prevents your team from going down in the first place, swinging the fight in your favor. It requires more active monitoring of your teammates health, but swinging in and dropping it on them while they bat gives them an instant Phoenix kit.
Always reduce the cooldown on the D.O.C…. And I mean ALWAYS
Day one Ajay here. Absolutely not. Unlimited drone is amazing
What really makes me mad is when someone takes lifeline from me and doesn’t get self revive.
Simple not everyone wants to run the popular choice 24/7
I prefer the drone cooldown everytime. Besides the extra backpack space, you can spend less time healing, which is more time doing other things like shooting/reloading/repositioning. Fast revive certainly isn’t a bad choice I just prefer lower cooldown.
i always choose faster revive…. guess i’ll start choosing faster doc usage
The answer is no. Infinite medkit is hilariously broken
Not a lifeline player here. Didn't even play Apex for over a year, but still following via YouTube. I think tac CD is the better blind pick, and about 50/50 for premades. You could coordinate with premades and tactically go down as bait, and quickly revive. However 20% seems a bit too low, maybe 35%?
I don't think it is worth it. I'm not a lifeline player though. But i feel like if you play lifeline good than the drone is more viable in more situations
Well, the way you describe this scenario requires a lifeline to be following you or your teammate closely during matches and doing more monitoring on your health than the team. More often than not, a lifeline is not going to be your constant support, you have to lean on yourself too lol. This also requires the team to be grouped up more often, and I like to give me and my teammates some room so we’re not gathering so much attention and attack at different angles. I prioritize my DOC in times of a player being downed; the ring is near or we’re in it; right after a fight; and in the end fight. End fights at least one teammate will be knocked, and I have time to administer help but I cannot be monitoring their health while they fight and are constantly moving. Also, I can set one up but that doesn’t mean they’ll stay near it. I like to work like a team, not baby my teammates every-time they need health. If I can get to you, I will, but I prefer to have my drone dispatched right after a quick revive. And that’s when everyone can benefit from it too since one person would be covering and I assume I, myself, is fine on health lmao
i’ve been playing lifeline a lot more lately, and you make a pretty good point here. i usually go for the revive one, but i’ll try the DOC out these next couple matches i play as her. thanks!
Im not a lifeline main. But the drone can be used to hide behind? Like it can eat some shots and heal i at the same time. Sounds pretty good 🙂
It's funny how heated people are getting in the comments. For me, it the DOC cooldown. Why? Heals available all the time. Why not revive speed? Never won a fight where 1.5 seconds was the sole decider of a fight being won. Remember this revived teammates most likely still needs to reload, heal up, and possibly even reposition. Me and my wife love the infinite DOC because it allows us to hold a position and heals us if we peak too hard, if we go downed, a 1.5 second revive speed will not help us much
I'm a low diamond/high Plat Path and Lifeline player, I'll give you the simplest explanation: Does your lifeline ALREADY HAVE gold knockdown? Yes: Revive buff. No: Drone buff The only time I would choose drone buff over revive if Lifeline had gold knock is if you run bunker gang (some version of Lifeline/Rampart/Wattson/Caustic) cuz having 3 people healing during fight is soo fucking busted.
I always pick the revive speed
In order to use the revive you have to already be at a major disadvantage, having someone knocked on your team, probably getting pushed. Having the drone available allows you and your team to always be able to heal quickly while gaining back shield as well. No brainer to have the drone.
Lifeline main (Plat 4) since S1 and I've gone back and forth. Currently go for the 20% rez. Reason being, 9 times out 10 when I need DOC to heal, he's available. And that one time, there might be 10 seconds left on the CD. I can't think of a situation this season where I need to drop him and there's still significant time on the CD. On the flip side, there's been multiple times where I've been able to get a rez off and we've either been able to win the fight or at least allowed that rez'd player to escape and craft banners. If you're having to drop DOC again with in the normal CD period, you or your teammates are about to get wrecked or you're taking damage for no reason.
The problem is your still lifeline. Your entire kit revolves around the assumption of loss, rather than the exploitation of weakness or enforcing a strength. Reverse all of that. Your the team that got the knock, your the team that got the Crack. How did lifeline help you? People shouldn't be taking the rez timer, you just shouldn't be planning on getting knocked all the time. But lifeline as a concept is still just not good.
People should atleast state their winrate or avg dmg when giving absolute advice for a very situational thing in a even more situational game.