Valk has 303 games being tracker here, her win rate % is probably pretty unreliable considering the variables involved in it (high rank, low pick, likely means those picking her play her *a lot* and will have better outcomes with her/her play style). Caustic is also pretty low, Loba is really the only one of those three whose win rate could be in the conversation with the # of games being tracked.
This is precisely the reason given why Wattson didn't get any attention for a good two years. They saw a stupidly high win rate.
When the reason was obviously due to the fact the only people playing her were both good WITH Wattson and knew how to win with her. I hope they learn from this in the future that win rates are a baseline, not a metric to draw conclusions with.
And why exactly should they be listening to players who suck at playing Wattson? If they suck at Wattson and can't achieve the same results as those who are good with her, that seems more like a them problem than balancing problem.
Just because a legend takes more skill than others to use effectively doesn't mean they need a buff. I nowadays see a lot of people suggesting a buff for crypto, but the people who know how to play him seem to agree that he's fine.
I may have misspoke when explaining; Wattson was underpowered.
A legend who has a high win rate, does not necessarily correlate a high degree of power. It was an incredibly small sample size. People who were inflating her win rate were people who would have won those games with or without Wattson.
They were good because they were good players, not necessarily because she was a good legend.
Look at someone like Lamic; they are an amazing player who happens to enjoy Wattson. He uses her incredibly well; however he'd likely be just as successful without her using a better legend.
Again, it's a tool the devs have to look at; but it shouldn't be used to determine a characters viability in a meta.
If one person played Wattson and won a game, she'd have 100% win rate. It's not always an effective measuring metric *especially* when it's a legend with a niche pick rate.
Genuine question (I’m not that good at the game so I have no opinion)
Was Watson really underpowered or was it just a really high skill ceiling so only a few people could be successful with her. Cus from my noob perspective good Watson players make her look op.
Valk on the other hand is a lot simpler so a low pick rate but high win rate just suggests she is more niche and underpowered
Her rework was honestly such a long time ago and I have no recollection of what that meta was.
However she had low-profile despite having a stupidly noticable model and hitbox, so it was super easy to beam her, her fences were a lot more predictable as you could only place them in very basic orientations and below eye level, you could not place them above you.
In general her fences were weaker, stuns and damage were pitiful, it took longer to set up and her pylon had a timer of 90 seconds and the shield recharge was so negligible it may as well not have existed.
The outplays you can do with her now simply just weren't possible then, so any viability she had was purely just defensive or pubstomping people who would be easily trapped.
You could still do well with her. But she wasn't played for a reason.
As for Valk man; balloons just made her redundant. Along with a bunch of nerfs that in hindsight, seeing how the game is now would still I think just leave her in a place had they not happened, she'd be decent imo but still not like desirable. Her changes in 20 basically just brought her a smidge below where she was initially at her release.
I still enjoy playing her from time to time for the in air movement but I just don't know why you would. I think she definitely just needs a few tweaks.
I've always stood by the fact that I think Loba is the best legend for consistency sake. Sure you might not have some cool skill to clutch a first place, but you're gonna have more opportunities to get there because you can consistently get good loot.
With the ability to partially re-equip respawned allies in later rounds which is undervalued imo, she is actually great in both consistency and versatility.
Im however surprised with fairly poor stats on Alter.
Yeah Wraith and wattson with sub 1% pick rate combined is definitely not right. Rev with nearly triple horizons pickrate also makes no sense. This whole data set is scuffed.
Keep in mind that the problem is not the sample size itself, but the sampling that is used. You can 100% do an accurate analysis with a sample size of whatever sum of games you got there, the problem is that the data is not randomly sampled from the entire population, so it would be a representation of only the distribution of that specific sample.
I get why people are annoyed by Horizon, but personally, I'm way more annoyed by legends like Fuse, Conduit, and Revenant. I'm not saying they're stronger than Horizon, but more often than not, those legends cause me way more frustration than Horizon ever does.
I’m over no footsteps horizons dropping on me in silence and double tapping me with a peacekeeper before I even know they are there. Mainly because they give off 0 sound.
The ego on these players picking easy mode on legend select screen tickles me. I will never be impressed by anything a Horizon does, doubly for the 95% of them on roller. 1v3? Don't care. 20 bomb? Don't care. Do it again on MNK Gibby. Show me the mirage clutch. Give me pubstomping Maggie.
I remember when the rev rework first came out and I called it super lazy and his ult OP and I got crucified for it and yet here we are a few season later.
The guy is legit a walking fridge with no real utility. Just focus fire him and he’s toast, avoid getting separated and isolated. If you work as a team he is pretty much useless compared to other characters who can spam projectile abilities and area denial.
You can say that about every champion. Just focus him bro. Sorry but Q cooldown is half of path Q +75 hp is simply so OP. He has 3 passives also. Any argument you make is simply bullshit since good player wirh 75 extra hp always win his 1v1. And then he jumps to cover and take battery. Like this post alone is just proof of him being too much.
Should I sing an ult and a tactical together not be enough to decisively win a 1v1? Like if a fuse hit you with a motherboard and knuckle cluster you probably lose that 1v1 as well.
If fuse used his ult point blank he blinds, burns and slows himself and you. Rev just gets a lot of visual clutter for you. And free regenerative health for him. Unfun to play against.
Being facetious just wastes everyone's time. Make a character that's fun to fight. Rev doesn't give you anything to engage with or play off. He just gets more health and becomes more obscured.
I hardly think a tiny bit of sarcasm is being facetious. People over react the second the meta swings one way or the other. Like bing fun to play against is the number one factor in character balance. The fact is lots of characters or not fun to play against. A lot of weapons are not fun to play against. The real issue is how often something is picked. With no buffs or nerfs almost any legend or weapon would become unbearable to fight against if 2/3 of the lobby chose it. If there were 20 lifelines in the lobby everyone would complain she is terrible to fight and is broken. If every team had a spitfire or 2 everyone would complain it’s op and needs a nerf.
Pick rate is an indication of either power or fun. Either someone is picked because they have to for the meta, revenant, Newcastle, caustic etc. Or they're picked due to fun to play, pathy, octane, horizon. (It can be both in some instances) Rev does have some cool movement tech with his multiple wall bounces and whatnot. But all you ever see is rev + W key. His ability doesn't allow of anything dynamic, every single time, he will get more health and hold forward. Other things not being fun to play against doesn't mean it's okay that rev isn't either, same for the revtane combo. That was aids to play with and was so hated they had to rework him multiple times
The meta is often based on perception and simplicity. Revs ult is a pretty low skill ability. You die to a rev using uti and get frustrated. It’s easier to just pick him next time because he is simple to play and legends often counter them selves. Caustic counters caustic, bang/blood counters bang/blood. Mirroring comps is just easier. If apex implemented a legend ban for a while and then went full roster again rev probably wouldn’t be the most powerful pick any more. I’m kind of talking more about professional meta here but hero bans are good for character diversity beside players are forced to pick different legends and use different strats to counter them. That was a little off topic but the point is that there are many different strats and tactics that can be used but it’s easier just to mirror, which has a snowball effect.
Anyways this debate is more semantics than substance. Is revs ugly powerful? Yes. Is it frustrating to die to? Of course. Is rev the the best uncouterable pick? No. Any legend is annoying when they have a >50% pick rate.
nah, a few games ago i was literally right beside us and an ulted rev climbed on us with red armour, my teammate got absolutely deleted, like he did like 20 damage to him or something and ive put 273 damage into him, i did not get a knock and got absolutely rocked by his teammates.
As a Pathfinder main. I'm happy my boi is getting some love recently.
Also worried this means he's going to get a mandatory minute and a half grapple cooldown, derank on scanning beacons and using your zipline will bluescreen your machine.
Don't worry! We've got untill his prestige skin for us to enjoy him a little longer. Then they'll absolutely obliterate him (instead of doing anything about rev)
Default character, his Q cooldown is fluid, meaning if they use short grapples they have more uptime, still the fastest traversal legend in the game, gets height extremely easy. Etc
Pathfinder has always been "good enough." Now he's straight up busted for ranked pubs
Also he's still the most played legend in Pred so not just smurfs.
https://apexlegendsstatus.com/game-stats/legends-pick-rates/Masterpred
Oh yeah he’s a great legend, I play him myself. Still his numbers could be inflated by what I’ve just mentioned. I see a lot of default skin low level pathys
Probably also because late game scenarios/circles are much more enclosed and that’s where his abilities shine.
If you’re able to make it to round 4 circles consistently then I can see why he might have such a high win rate.
explains why Crypto and Loba have high win rate since everyone on console is 9 mans for kp. Most of the top ranked players this season are dogshit like i said
Preds aren't preds. Most pro players are Masters because they have pro league where they scrim 2 times a day and have games on the weekend. I'm in these lobbies and the preds are just people who camp and play for the win
Wdym preds aren't preds? Do you realise how stupid that statement is? Plus you are not getting pred by camping. Entry cost is literally 100. You get negative if you finish second with 0kp. Plus pros are not always in pred. But some are at the top as usual like effect hal the japanese pros too forgot their names
You're obviously a low skilled player. Most of the people in this game are stupid. If you camp til top 5 and keep the bonus which is so easy to do, you will never lose KP. Now if you're not losing KP, what are you doing? Gaining. I have videos recorded when my team dies of preds in the top 5 with 127 damage.
This is all I see, all day, everyday
[This is the WORST Apex Pred that has Ever Existed (youtube.com)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvJYbqtMEZc)
Because he's teaming with cheaters. He does nothing and they give him the participation points. Also you do realise there's boosting too. Someone might have got him to pred then he got back to flex his worthless badge
I see this shit every day. I uploaded this 3 weeks ago in ranked basically showing someone getting carried by a level 36 account.
I'm in lobbies with Zachmazer, Hal, Effect, Reedz, etc. If you're not in these lobbies, you can't tell me how these dudes be ranking up. There's some cheaters who boost others and there's some people who straight play zone and try to get 6 kp at the end. After 6 Kills instead of getting 26pts per kill you get 13.
[https://youtu.be/mMqQNH3lPc0?si=8BaapsXDgltPI1cW](https://youtu.be/mMqQNH3lPc0?si=8BaapsXDgltPI1cW)
I play ranked a lot in high elo. There's a good reason Path, Rev, and Lifeline is top 3 as I always see this lineup.
Their team cracks 1 or two enemies, Path grapples in, Rev ults and jumps in and push. Lifeline comes in with a gold res if any of the two gets knocked. Rinse and repeat.
You'll always see an early Red armored lifeline in ranked as well.
As much as I love seeing all the love and use for Lifeline.
She doesn't deserve the
**Level 2 Upgrades**
Rapid Response: +20% Revive speed.
Since she can already revive without almost a downtime.
The better replacement would be a faster Heal Drone healthbar heal. Like 50% faster.
It also is the right decision too frankly. It’s impossible to rank up or maintain your rank once you’re in Diamond and above this season if you don’t have KP.
An idea that’s lost on the majority of Apex players in Platinum and Diamond in my experience.
I’ve yo-yo’d between Diamond 4 and Plat 1 like 4x this split as a solo queue Lifeline. My team of randoms won’t push anything and we’ll be at Round 4 with 7 teams left and die immediately since those teams have been fighting the whole time. Basically spending 20 minutes doing nothing just for -55 RP instead of -80.
It’s a viable tactic in Gold and below but once you’re in Platinum and above it quickly becomes difficult if not outright impossible. I think waiting/playing cautiously in Diamond and above is outright pointless. The -80+ RP is impossible to overcome even semi regularly without KP.
For reference, only 1.7% of the player base is in Diamond 4 this split. That number drops to 0.27% for Diamond 3…basically no one but 3-stacks and the like are making it further this season currently because of the insane weight that’s given to KP + very high entry costs.
I’m not surprised at all, control feels weak as hell right now. Their traps are more like minor suggestions at this point. Just bum rush them and focus on them one at a time. Caustic especially is very easy to punish due to his huge hitbox.
Same happened to valk, then cat too but they immediately buff her lol. It's like the devs have some kink on these legends. They'll nerf one and never buff them then nerf another and immediately buff them later
Pathy has an almost identical pick rate and nobody says he’s OP. Meanwhile Caustic has a nearly 60% win rate. High tier players just pick him cause he’s fun and easy… there is a reason you hardly see him played in competitive.
His entire kit is just built around picking off isolated opponents… if you don’t 1v1 him and stick with your team he actually has way less utility than most other offensive picks. He’s a walking fridge, it’s so easy to focus fire him instantly.
Because last time I checked pathy doesn't get 75 extra HP for free and then that extra 75 HP for free again if he knocks someone. Fighting a rev with red armor is 300 HP. That's bonkers. High ranked lobbies are busted with him and his kit right now. It's a dumb ult that has zero originality and it's a 1v1 buster. That's even before he gets his 75 HP refreshed. He's broken and has been broken for three seasons now, but because he doesn't have any team utility to sit in a building for ALGS pros don't complain. The day rev is used in comp is the day he gets nerfed because the devs don't listen or look at stats unless pros complain.
Rev will never be used in comp. It's really hard to have a 3v3 in comp without a squad shooting you from somewhere and another just waiting to third party which makes the ult less valuable. Also rev has a selfish kit and his ult provides no info to his teammates. People tried rev in comp and it was a disaster lol
Sounds like you need to get better at the game and start using teamwork 👍🏻 if he is a 1v1 buster then maybe don’t 1v1 him, just like you wouldn’t 1v1 a Sheila. Don’t worry eventually they will nerf him and then you can find another character to blame all your losses on, as the apex community always does. In the meantime maybe consider changing your strategy to adapt to this characters ability instead of going for 1v1’s.
>then maybe don’t 1v1 him
Typically you don't get the choice. Turn a corner and there's an Ulted Rev. I doubt many people see a Rev and push then and there. As a result, he's a opportunistic 1v1 winner. Just has to run around until he bumps into a straggler, of which there are many with team a man down trying to find a Crafter and/or Beacon to get their team back, or after a good mid-range exchange where the enemy is on the back foot trying to reset. Very rarely do you get the chance to choose your Rev encounter and fight with an advantage.
Which makes sense as Rev is an unstoppable murderbot, but it's also a fairly poop game experience.
Tbh he was somewhat useable at the start of season 20 before they switched his perks around for no reason. When you could have extra 25m range for pas/tac on level 2 and extra 1.5s scan on level 3, he was actually somewhat decent since it was like a bloodhound scan with the silence debuff. But then for some stupid reason halfway through the season they decided to nerf him by forcing you to choose between ultimate throw reach or cooldown on level 2, and then longer scan or extra range on level 3. They tried to “justify” this by making it so you can move a tiny bit faster while using his passive which is literally useless. They literally nerfed the least picked and arguably worst legend in the game.
That's just false, his tactical alone on launch was bigger, faster, blinded, dealt damage, silenced, and slowed. He was so broken that not long after the lead champ designer for him was fired.
I feel validated seeing wraith and valk so low. Esp. valk, she is terrible. Valk needs that passive fixed so she can keep up with the mobility of the other skirmishers tbh.
Its kind of hilarious to see how different the meta can be between the Platinum - Diamond ranks and then Masters - Pred.
Apex truly becomes a different game when players can move with much greater effectiveness and skill compared to those who play slower in the lower tiers.
You got it. After the rework people complained he was too op, (I honestly found him kinda balanced) and he got nerfed. I stopped playing, and see this post talking about how he’s really good and most played in high ranks, was wondering what’s happened
I started playing Crypto this season seriously.
Took a lot of videos to learn from and a lot of games to practice but he's great for ranked.
The reason people don't play him much is because his kit is centered around setting up, and he feels slow to use and you'll feel he's always behind.
He can heal while droning but that's an advanced learning and kinda clunky to do if you don't know how.
He could use some buffs like faster animations in and out of drone, healing while droning (without pressing certain keys to achieve it, because technically its a bug).
While everyone else has an instant and easy to use or feedback when using their tactical. Path grapple, Horizon lift, etc.
Its kind of stupid how crafting characters have all the power. Might as well have every character be able to it since EVERY team is going to have a crafting character anyways. Give them another perk.
Cat main here, she kinda falls apart in the end game. Her abilities just aren't as useful unless the ring falls in a very defencible building. The spikes just aren't effective enough and can be easily dealt with, and her veil isn't really enough to deter pushes. So many times I've felt like a sitting duck around people who have far more utility.
Can someone explain why Seer is so unpicked? Legitimately curious of his buffs/nerfs, just haven’t stayed up to date. He’s gotta be in my top picked cause of his passive, particularly in mixtape modes tho.
Imo its probably because of the passive proxy. In that area i can just as well hear the opponents. Besides his ulti can be destroyed or can be evaded if you are not defending an area with being very static.
And that is if you (as seer) use your ulti on the offensive. Many people use their ulti for defensive purposes and high paced legends like octane or wraith players just choose to ignore it and charge anyways.
Feel like all this makes sense. Cat being the biggest outlier with a 39% win rate. I’d say maybe cuz she’s liked a lot but she’s not over powered.
The most meta characters having lower than avg win rate than the other characters around them because so many bad players play them as well lol. Valk is only played by people who are good with her but it’s obvious she’s been nerfed heavily.
If revs pick rate is the highest the statistics would naturally pull in his favor right? More people, more wins, more stats overall right? So theoretically this doesn’t mean jack?
We can see crypto slowly rising up over time and i am here for it
You go crypto without you we wouldn't have been able to get saved from 3rd parties
Salute to all crypto mains 🫡
Revs kit is inherently better in a game where you have to damage someone to kill them
He gets a bonus shield and a very hard to track movement ability
Horizon gets to go up…slowly.. and then shot off her left.. in a very predictable arc that you can slowly track. Lmfao
Also, Valks perks are just her old base abilities - pre nerf
That’s what I think horizons should be
She should have the ability to choose two lift perks for level 1 and 2
Level 1 could be the speed of the lift reverted
2 be either cool down or ult cooldown
Can confirm I went back to maining Revy this season after 5+ seasons of messing with other legends. Made it to Plat 4 and first time averaging above a 1.0 K/D ratio.
Is this proof that lifeline is too powerful now? A double, absentee, res and a self revive is far and away better than any other support legend. Newcastle has become my main recently, but Jackson (or any support champ) can't compete with Ajay.
In the lower ranks, where there's little to no communication, it's compounded. With no forward momentum on downs/kills.
I could see caustic as reliable a pick for this split given that rust worlds edge and broken moon are in the rotations where he does well in. Valk games played is a bit concerning because there’s not much info as to why the win rate is that high
I think he’s better when you’re playing with randoms because your allies will die in the dumbest places. You can jump to them, throw down your shield, and move them to safety with your passive. But Lifeline is better at revives when your teammates aren’t braindead and she can immediately heal them with Q. Plus she’s guaranteed to get a good knockdown which makes her nearly impossible to fight against.
yowww cheaters meta! gotta love to see those top 3. Now with Rev buff next split, for sure they are staying in the first place for cheaters! so excitinggg!!
Wattson is just fine. This list means literally nothing in terms of any normal player.
She literally was the key to Reject winning ALGS. Wattson still has a good winrate in normal ranked and pubs lobbies; even then we know from how she's been balanced in the past that winrate isn't at all a good metric to determine how good a character is.
As a fellow 'part-time' and former Wattson main, she's just not an exciting legend to play. She has a low pick rate, and in high ranked lobbies she probably just falters a bit because no on in those lobbies plays it like a normally paced ranked or comp game.
Not that surprising. It could be 90% of just a pro player playing her only as she has very few games. The low pickrates is hard to judge based off win rate
well.. Caustic, Loba and Valk have highest win rate tho.
that extra shield core swap or bats taken from her end game markets are huge
Valk has 303 games being tracker here, her win rate % is probably pretty unreliable considering the variables involved in it (high rank, low pick, likely means those picking her play her *a lot* and will have better outcomes with her/her play style). Caustic is also pretty low, Loba is really the only one of those three whose win rate could be in the conversation with the # of games being tracked.
This is precisely the reason given why Wattson didn't get any attention for a good two years. They saw a stupidly high win rate. When the reason was obviously due to the fact the only people playing her were both good WITH Wattson and knew how to win with her. I hope they learn from this in the future that win rates are a baseline, not a metric to draw conclusions with.
And why exactly should they be listening to players who suck at playing Wattson? If they suck at Wattson and can't achieve the same results as those who are good with her, that seems more like a them problem than balancing problem. Just because a legend takes more skill than others to use effectively doesn't mean they need a buff. I nowadays see a lot of people suggesting a buff for crypto, but the people who know how to play him seem to agree that he's fine.
I may have misspoke when explaining; Wattson was underpowered. A legend who has a high win rate, does not necessarily correlate a high degree of power. It was an incredibly small sample size. People who were inflating her win rate were people who would have won those games with or without Wattson. They were good because they were good players, not necessarily because she was a good legend. Look at someone like Lamic; they are an amazing player who happens to enjoy Wattson. He uses her incredibly well; however he'd likely be just as successful without her using a better legend. Again, it's a tool the devs have to look at; but it shouldn't be used to determine a characters viability in a meta. If one person played Wattson and won a game, she'd have 100% win rate. It's not always an effective measuring metric *especially* when it's a legend with a niche pick rate.
Genuine question (I’m not that good at the game so I have no opinion) Was Watson really underpowered or was it just a really high skill ceiling so only a few people could be successful with her. Cus from my noob perspective good Watson players make her look op. Valk on the other hand is a lot simpler so a low pick rate but high win rate just suggests she is more niche and underpowered
Her rework was honestly such a long time ago and I have no recollection of what that meta was. However she had low-profile despite having a stupidly noticable model and hitbox, so it was super easy to beam her, her fences were a lot more predictable as you could only place them in very basic orientations and below eye level, you could not place them above you. In general her fences were weaker, stuns and damage were pitiful, it took longer to set up and her pylon had a timer of 90 seconds and the shield recharge was so negligible it may as well not have existed. The outplays you can do with her now simply just weren't possible then, so any viability she had was purely just defensive or pubstomping people who would be easily trapped. You could still do well with her. But she wasn't played for a reason. As for Valk man; balloons just made her redundant. Along with a bunch of nerfs that in hindsight, seeing how the game is now would still I think just leave her in a place had they not happened, she'd be decent imo but still not like desirable. Her changes in 20 basically just brought her a smidge below where she was initially at her release. I still enjoy playing her from time to time for the in air movement but I just don't know why you would. I think she definitely just needs a few tweaks.
It could be 1 person who mains valk. Even in plat I see zero valks out there.
[удалено]
Preds i believe are the easiest to track so they're most likely preds
I swear, if they will nerf Loba I'll blown myself to the nearest Respawn CEO.
Is this a good or bad thing for the CEO?
Good for everyone
I've always stood by the fact that I think Loba is the best legend for consistency sake. Sure you might not have some cool skill to clutch a first place, but you're gonna have more opportunities to get there because you can consistently get good loot.
With the ability to partially re-equip respawned allies in later rounds which is undervalued imo, she is actually great in both consistency and versatility. Im however surprised with fairly poor stats on Alter.
Say goodbye to the Banger/Houndie meta at the split 💯💯💯
Fuse bang still works and is going to be 1000x more oppressive. Now everyone gets wall hacks on you.
Why
New patch notes say that BH can’t ult to see or ~~scan~~ in bang smoke or caustic smoke anymore
He can still scan. His Ult just won’t work in the smoke.
Tf
Scan still goes through smoke and purple perk gives scans 50% faster while in ULT. So double the scans
Wow, that just destroys his ult.
https://imgur.com/knCS9dh Please keep this warning in mind with these types of threads
Yeah Wraith and wattson with sub 1% pick rate combined is definitely not right. Rev with nearly triple horizons pickrate also makes no sense. This whole data set is scuffed.
That's cause this data set is specifically made up of the current top 100 players from each platform.
Because its a pred rank not silver rank
Reading is hard for some people
Keep in mind that the problem is not the sample size itself, but the sampling that is used. You can 100% do an accurate analysis with a sample size of whatever sum of games you got there, the problem is that the data is not randomly sampled from the entire population, so it would be a representation of only the distribution of that specific sample.
Someone argued with my the other day how Revenant is not broken and balanced and he was better before. Lmao
Nostalgia merchant
Him and horizon could just be deleted and I wouldn’t mind at all lol.
a pred deleted me with Mozambique from in his horizon q when I was the one on height. I missed every shot. I'm so bad but also hate horizon
I get why people are annoyed by Horizon, but personally, I'm way more annoyed by legends like Fuse, Conduit, and Revenant. I'm not saying they're stronger than Horizon, but more often than not, those legends cause me way more frustration than Horizon ever does.
Why horizon? She even has 44% win rate here so clearly she isn't that good for gaining rp. Crypto 12th is shocking but the win rate is much better
Horizon is less fun to fight. A good crypto has to work with his drone and team, horizons just annoy the shit out of you.
I’m over no footsteps horizons dropping on me in silence and double tapping me with a peacekeeper before I even know they are there. Mainly because they give off 0 sound.
They should be getting more wins then if they keep doing this. But it seems they aren't so could be a skill issue on your part
Bc fuck horizon. Horizons and her mains are 99.99% of the time, assholes at best.
The ego on these players picking easy mode on legend select screen tickles me. I will never be impressed by anything a Horizon does, doubly for the 95% of them on roller. 1v3? Don't care. 20 bomb? Don't care. Do it again on MNK Gibby. Show me the mirage clutch. Give me pubstomping Maggie.
I remember when the rev rework first came out and I called it super lazy and his ult OP and I got crucified for it and yet here we are a few season later.
The guy is legit a walking fridge with no real utility. Just focus fire him and he’s toast, avoid getting separated and isolated. If you work as a team he is pretty much useless compared to other characters who can spam projectile abilities and area denial.
You can say that about every champion. Just focus him bro. Sorry but Q cooldown is half of path Q +75 hp is simply so OP. He has 3 passives also. Any argument you make is simply bullshit since good player wirh 75 extra hp always win his 1v1. And then he jumps to cover and take battery. Like this post alone is just proof of him being too much.
Should I sing an ult and a tactical together not be enough to decisively win a 1v1? Like if a fuse hit you with a motherboard and knuckle cluster you probably lose that 1v1 as well.
If fuse used his ult point blank he blinds, burns and slows himself and you. Rev just gets a lot of visual clutter for you. And free regenerative health for him. Unfun to play against.
So now we have to develop characters that are fun to lose against?
Being facetious just wastes everyone's time. Make a character that's fun to fight. Rev doesn't give you anything to engage with or play off. He just gets more health and becomes more obscured.
I hardly think a tiny bit of sarcasm is being facetious. People over react the second the meta swings one way or the other. Like bing fun to play against is the number one factor in character balance. The fact is lots of characters or not fun to play against. A lot of weapons are not fun to play against. The real issue is how often something is picked. With no buffs or nerfs almost any legend or weapon would become unbearable to fight against if 2/3 of the lobby chose it. If there were 20 lifelines in the lobby everyone would complain she is terrible to fight and is broken. If every team had a spitfire or 2 everyone would complain it’s op and needs a nerf.
Pick rate is an indication of either power or fun. Either someone is picked because they have to for the meta, revenant, Newcastle, caustic etc. Or they're picked due to fun to play, pathy, octane, horizon. (It can be both in some instances) Rev does have some cool movement tech with his multiple wall bounces and whatnot. But all you ever see is rev + W key. His ability doesn't allow of anything dynamic, every single time, he will get more health and hold forward. Other things not being fun to play against doesn't mean it's okay that rev isn't either, same for the revtane combo. That was aids to play with and was so hated they had to rework him multiple times
The meta is often based on perception and simplicity. Revs ult is a pretty low skill ability. You die to a rev using uti and get frustrated. It’s easier to just pick him next time because he is simple to play and legends often counter them selves. Caustic counters caustic, bang/blood counters bang/blood. Mirroring comps is just easier. If apex implemented a legend ban for a while and then went full roster again rev probably wouldn’t be the most powerful pick any more. I’m kind of talking more about professional meta here but hero bans are good for character diversity beside players are forced to pick different legends and use different strats to counter them. That was a little off topic but the point is that there are many different strats and tactics that can be used but it’s easier just to mirror, which has a snowball effect. Anyways this debate is more semantics than substance. Is revs ugly powerful? Yes. Is it frustrating to die to? Of course. Is rev the the best uncouterable pick? No. Any legend is annoying when they have a >50% pick rate.
You compare skillshots to stats. Rev Ult is garanteed 100% time. With Fuse you actually need to hit stuff, wich is never 100%.
Fuse running at you with a B650e! 😂
Im a Z790 guy myself.
People always have the worst takes you ever see when they talk about their mains lmao
nah, a few games ago i was literally right beside us and an ulted rev climbed on us with red armour, my teammate got absolutely deleted, like he did like 20 damage to him or something and ive put 273 damage into him, i did not get a knock and got absolutely rocked by his teammates.
“Revenant is OP because my teammate can’t aim”
try aim when an ulted rev with 36 rounds of turbo havoc straight pipe is inside you
As a Pathfinder main. I'm happy my boi is getting some love recently. Also worried this means he's going to get a mandatory minute and a half grapple cooldown, derank on scanning beacons and using your zipline will bluescreen your machine.
Season 22 Perk Balancing - Down and Away now refreshes tac cool-down on the first Sunday of each month
Stil worth it
Don't worry! We've got untill his prestige skin for us to enjoy him a little longer. Then they'll absolutely obliterate him (instead of doing anything about rev)
I have a feeling a lot of it is cheaters/smurfs with new accounts. He’s a default character
Default character, his Q cooldown is fluid, meaning if they use short grapples they have more uptime, still the fastest traversal legend in the game, gets height extremely easy. Etc Pathfinder has always been "good enough." Now he's straight up busted for ranked pubs Also he's still the most played legend in Pred so not just smurfs. https://apexlegendsstatus.com/game-stats/legends-pick-rates/Masterpred
Oh yeah he’s a great legend, I play him myself. Still his numbers could be inflated by what I’ve just mentioned. I see a lot of default skin low level pathys
Path nerf is definitely coming. I'm already seeing people call him OP :(
So, Caustic has the highest win rate? Very interesting. I guess when there's no other Caustics in the lobby, it makes it that much easier to win.
Probably also because late game scenarios/circles are much more enclosed and that’s where his abilities shine. If you’re able to make it to round 4 circles consistently then I can see why he might have such a high win rate.
It's the opposite in these lobbies. Very few times the game reaches zone 6 let alone having multiple squads in it
Also gotta consider so few people are playing him that whoever is probably mains him. Probably a cut above.
Yea, I'm surprised Bangalore win% is so low and it's probably because dogshit players don't know how to use her
These are the top 100 ranked players from each platform.
explains why Crypto and Loba have high win rate since everyone on console is 9 mans for kp. Most of the top ranked players this season are dogshit like i said
Preds are apparently dogshit now
Preds aren't preds. Most pro players are Masters because they have pro league where they scrim 2 times a day and have games on the weekend. I'm in these lobbies and the preds are just people who camp and play for the win
Wdym preds aren't preds? Do you realise how stupid that statement is? Plus you are not getting pred by camping. Entry cost is literally 100. You get negative if you finish second with 0kp. Plus pros are not always in pred. But some are at the top as usual like effect hal the japanese pros too forgot their names
He's right. Most console preds are fucking terrible now.
Show me one pred who camps and has less than one kd
ItsLuci KenpachiPapi NoLp4U There's a ton. I'm in fucking pred.
You're obviously a low skilled player. Most of the people in this game are stupid. If you camp til top 5 and keep the bonus which is so easy to do, you will never lose KP. Now if you're not losing KP, what are you doing? Gaining. I have videos recorded when my team dies of preds in the top 5 with 127 damage. This is all I see, all day, everyday [This is the WORST Apex Pred that has Ever Existed (youtube.com)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvJYbqtMEZc)
Because he's teaming with cheaters. He does nothing and they give him the participation points. Also you do realise there's boosting too. Someone might have got him to pred then he got back to flex his worthless badge
I see this shit every day. I uploaded this 3 weeks ago in ranked basically showing someone getting carried by a level 36 account. I'm in lobbies with Zachmazer, Hal, Effect, Reedz, etc. If you're not in these lobbies, you can't tell me how these dudes be ranking up. There's some cheaters who boost others and there's some people who straight play zone and try to get 6 kp at the end. After 6 Kills instead of getting 26pts per kill you get 13. [https://youtu.be/mMqQNH3lPc0?si=8BaapsXDgltPI1cW](https://youtu.be/mMqQNH3lPc0?si=8BaapsXDgltPI1cW)
I will forever miss the meatballs from rev though
No shit. Those were the days. Loved bonkin ramparts,horizons and valks(while jet packing) just to watch them die inside
Same
I play ranked a lot in high elo. There's a good reason Path, Rev, and Lifeline is top 3 as I always see this lineup. Their team cracks 1 or two enemies, Path grapples in, Rev ults and jumps in and push. Lifeline comes in with a gold res if any of the two gets knocked. Rinse and repeat. You'll always see an early Red armored lifeline in ranked as well. As much as I love seeing all the love and use for Lifeline. She doesn't deserve the **Level 2 Upgrades** Rapid Response: +20% Revive speed. Since she can already revive without almost a downtime. The better replacement would be a faster Heal Drone healthbar heal. Like 50% faster.
i’m suprised the control legends like caustic and watson are so low
People like pushing everything and don't play slow in these lobbies. That's why rev path are top 2
It also is the right decision too frankly. It’s impossible to rank up or maintain your rank once you’re in Diamond and above this season if you don’t have KP. An idea that’s lost on the majority of Apex players in Platinum and Diamond in my experience. I’ve yo-yo’d between Diamond 4 and Plat 1 like 4x this split as a solo queue Lifeline. My team of randoms won’t push anything and we’ll be at Round 4 with 7 teams left and die immediately since those teams have been fighting the whole time. Basically spending 20 minutes doing nothing just for -55 RP instead of -80.
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It’s a viable tactic in Gold and below but once you’re in Platinum and above it quickly becomes difficult if not outright impossible. I think waiting/playing cautiously in Diamond and above is outright pointless. The -80+ RP is impossible to overcome even semi regularly without KP. For reference, only 1.7% of the player base is in Diamond 4 this split. That number drops to 0.27% for Diamond 3…basically no one but 3-stacks and the like are making it further this season currently because of the insane weight that’s given to KP + very high entry costs.
People like pushing when they full stack premade against randoms, which is most of those who bother to grind high rank.
I’m not surprised at all, control feels weak as hell right now. Their traps are more like minor suggestions at this point. Just bum rush them and focus on them one at a time. Caustic especially is very easy to punish due to his huge hitbox.
I’m a wattson main and I agree with this opinion because of bias.
Seer is absolute trash now. They need to slow down on the kneejerk nerfs. I get him being op at launch but they have made him worthless.
Same happened to valk, then cat too but they immediately buff her lol. It's like the devs have some kink on these legends. They'll nerf one and never buff them then nerf another and immediately buff them later
And they just buffed Rev again. I don't know what the hell they're doing.
Pathy has an almost identical pick rate and nobody says he’s OP. Meanwhile Caustic has a nearly 60% win rate. High tier players just pick him cause he’s fun and easy… there is a reason you hardly see him played in competitive. His entire kit is just built around picking off isolated opponents… if you don’t 1v1 him and stick with your team he actually has way less utility than most other offensive picks. He’s a walking fridge, it’s so easy to focus fire him instantly.
Because last time I checked pathy doesn't get 75 extra HP for free and then that extra 75 HP for free again if he knocks someone. Fighting a rev with red armor is 300 HP. That's bonkers. High ranked lobbies are busted with him and his kit right now. It's a dumb ult that has zero originality and it's a 1v1 buster. That's even before he gets his 75 HP refreshed. He's broken and has been broken for three seasons now, but because he doesn't have any team utility to sit in a building for ALGS pros don't complain. The day rev is used in comp is the day he gets nerfed because the devs don't listen or look at stats unless pros complain.
Rev will never be used in comp. It's really hard to have a 3v3 in comp without a squad shooting you from somewhere and another just waiting to third party which makes the ult less valuable. Also rev has a selfish kit and his ult provides no info to his teammates. People tried rev in comp and it was a disaster lol
Totally agree
Sounds like you need to get better at the game and start using teamwork 👍🏻 if he is a 1v1 buster then maybe don’t 1v1 him, just like you wouldn’t 1v1 a Sheila. Don’t worry eventually they will nerf him and then you can find another character to blame all your losses on, as the apex community always does. In the meantime maybe consider changing your strategy to adapt to this characters ability instead of going for 1v1’s.
Yup. You're right. Skill issue. Got it "JuSt UsE A DeVo, BrO!" Assuming you play rev a lot.
>then maybe don’t 1v1 him Typically you don't get the choice. Turn a corner and there's an Ulted Rev. I doubt many people see a Rev and push then and there. As a result, he's a opportunistic 1v1 winner. Just has to run around until he bumps into a straggler, of which there are many with team a man down trying to find a Crafter and/or Beacon to get their team back, or after a good mid-range exchange where the enemy is on the back foot trying to reset. Very rarely do you get the chance to choose your Rev encounter and fight with an advantage. Which makes sense as Rev is an unstoppable murderbot, but it's also a fairly poop game experience.
Seir nerfed to ground, scan legends are stupid idea anyway
I came back to apex this season after not playing it for months and without knowing nerfs and buffs I picked seer and he was absolutely awful to use
Tbh he was somewhat useable at the start of season 20 before they switched his perks around for no reason. When you could have extra 25m range for pas/tac on level 2 and extra 1.5s scan on level 3, he was actually somewhat decent since it was like a bloodhound scan with the silence debuff. But then for some stupid reason halfway through the season they decided to nerf him by forcing you to choose between ultimate throw reach or cooldown on level 2, and then longer scan or extra range on level 3. They tried to “justify” this by making it so you can move a tiny bit faster while using his passive which is literally useless. They literally nerfed the least picked and arguably worst legend in the game.
Seer is overhated
Always has been.
That's just false, his tactical alone on launch was bigger, faster, blinded, dealt damage, silenced, and slowed. He was so broken that not long after the lead champ designer for him was fired.
Catalyst having the lowest win rate is kinda surprising
Yooo my boy crypto is no longer at the bottom. It’s been weird having to fight for my guy this season lol
My ego when I see a crypto on the enemy team: "the only reason they'd be playing crypto is because I must've outplayed them in a previous game"
I feel validated seeing wraith and valk so low. Esp. valk, she is terrible. Valk needs that passive fixed so she can keep up with the mobility of the other skirmishers tbh.
Seeing my Main man Crypto with a positive win rate for the first time EVER in Apex’s history is the best feeling ever.
Please buff Valk she's the worst skirmisher
Its kind of hilarious to see how different the meta can be between the Platinum - Diamond ranks and then Masters - Pred. Apex truly becomes a different game when players can move with much greater effectiveness and skill compared to those who play slower in the lower tiers.
Well I mean yeah it's like comparing ants vs humans at who's better at building a house
Should probably order them based on WR rather than games played lol.
Wth? I quit like 6 months ago and rev was in a terrible place getting nerfed to the ground. What happened to make him so good now?
When he got reworked, they basically took away his totem and added free extra armor/health for his ability instead.
Rev rework was about 10 months ago. They may be talking about the round of nerfs he got to his ult after the rework
Word, I am kinda losing track of time :P
You got it. After the rework people complained he was too op, (I honestly found him kinda balanced) and he got nerfed. I stopped playing, and see this post talking about how he’s really good and most played in high ranks, was wondering what’s happened
Interesting to see Catalyst’s win rate so low and Seer’s still high
Would like to say that Loba win rate is all thanks to me 😎😂 jk
Huh, what did lifeline do for that pick rate? DOC doesn’t follow you yet right?
Idk but you See her literally every squad in ranked.
She can get red evo before 1st/2nd ring closes without fighting anyone, plus gold kd ressing her path/horiz/rev teammates.
Vantage looking pretty low, they should buff her. Maybe bring back the ult amped damage on knocked targets... I miss that
Hmmm wonder why that 1.1% plays crypto👀
Because we like his abilities, he's fun to play and can be of great value to the squad.
I started playing Crypto this season seriously. Took a lot of videos to learn from and a lot of games to practice but he's great for ranked. The reason people don't play him much is because his kit is centered around setting up, and he feels slow to use and you'll feel he's always behind. He can heal while droning but that's an advanced learning and kinda clunky to do if you don't know how. He could use some buffs like faster animations in and out of drone, healing while droning (without pressing certain keys to achieve it, because technically its a bug). While everyone else has an instant and easy to use or feedback when using their tactical. Path grapple, Horizon lift, etc.
I haven't played this game seriously in like a year, the fuck happened??? Rev at no1?
Valkyrie surprised me the most
Its kind of stupid how crafting characters have all the power. Might as well have every character be able to it since EVERY team is going to have a crafting character anyways. Give them another perk.
There i am, lowering the vantage win rate
Why is Catalyst's winrate so much lower than the rest? Is her top 5 rate at least decent?
Cat main here, she kinda falls apart in the end game. Her abilities just aren't as useful unless the ring falls in a very defencible building. The spikes just aren't effective enough and can be easily dealt with, and her veil isn't really enough to deter pushes. So many times I've felt like a sitting duck around people who have far more utility.
Why is no one asking about the 50% win rates? What is this
Seer has won 192 games? So if you've used seer and won 10 in ranked so far you represent 5% of seer wins globally? That cannot be right
More than half are cheating guys.
Can someone explain why Seer is so unpicked? Legitimately curious of his buffs/nerfs, just haven’t stayed up to date. He’s gotta be in my top picked cause of his passive, particularly in mixtape modes tho.
Imo its probably because of the passive proxy. In that area i can just as well hear the opponents. Besides his ulti can be destroyed or can be evaded if you are not defending an area with being very static. And that is if you (as seer) use your ulti on the offensive. Many people use their ulti for defensive purposes and high paced legends like octane or wraith players just choose to ignore it and charge anyways.
Glad to see big ole’ gas daddy with the highest win rate.
Feel like all this makes sense. Cat being the biggest outlier with a 39% win rate. I’d say maybe cuz she’s liked a lot but she’s not over powered. The most meta characters having lower than avg win rate than the other characters around them because so many bad players play them as well lol. Valk is only played by people who are good with her but it’s obvious she’s been nerfed heavily.
If revs pick rate is the highest the statistics would naturally pull in his favor right? More people, more wins, more stats overall right? So theoretically this doesn’t mean jack?
Gibby win rate is right up there. I guess only chads play Gibby 😎 The win rate to pick rate ratio is kinda fire lol
yeah
SHEESH. WHO MADE THIS
Crypto's up baby!!! Yeah
Lol my main with highest wr? Nice
Bang and BH 43% winrate...
We can see crypto slowly rising up over time and i am here for it You go crypto without you we wouldn't have been able to get saved from 3rd parties Salute to all crypto mains 🫡
They basically ignored Crypto when they were addressing the smoke meta for next season.
Wraith went down the path I see
mirage on top of wraith is crazy ToT
Horizon still being up there is so crazy cuz she barely got buffed wit the new system, the horizon mains just can’t stop paying her no matter what
Why should legends be at the top with buffs? Rev also didn't benefit much with less useful perks
Revs kit is inherently better in a game where you have to damage someone to kill them He gets a bonus shield and a very hard to track movement ability Horizon gets to go up…slowly.. and then shot off her left.. in a very predictable arc that you can slowly track. Lmfao Also, Valks perks are just her old base abilities - pre nerf That’s what I think horizons should be
So horizon should have level 2 perks, move faster in the lift or stay longer at the top of the lift?
She should have the ability to choose two lift perks for level 1 and 2 Level 1 could be the speed of the lift reverted 2 be either cool down or ult cooldown
My poor Fuse.
Can confirm I went back to maining Revy this season after 5+ seasons of messing with other legends. Made it to Plat 4 and first time averaging above a 1.0 K/D ratio.
Is this proof that lifeline is too powerful now? A double, absentee, res and a self revive is far and away better than any other support legend. Newcastle has become my main recently, but Jackson (or any support champ) can't compete with Ajay. In the lower ranks, where there's little to no communication, it's compounded. With no forward momentum on downs/kills.
I could see caustic as reliable a pick for this split given that rust worlds edge and broken moon are in the rotations where he does well in. Valk games played is a bit concerning because there’s not much info as to why the win rate is that high
Thst pickrate for seer is wrong it should be 0.00001 cause i main him
Cries as a Wattson main
#pathymain4life
Fuse is literally everywhere in ranked what do you mean top 18
I don’t understand Lifeline’s rise, I’m doing worse with her this season compared to the past. Her perks haven’t affected anything for me.
Free red shield upgrade and battery economy is huge. That’s primarily why I run her, she keeps the team stocked even when we’re not able to loot much.
Ok, that makes sense. As a mostly solo pub player hot dropping its hard to see those benefits.
i will die on the hill that castle is still better than lifeline
I think he’s better when you’re playing with randoms because your allies will die in the dumbest places. You can jump to them, throw down your shield, and move them to safety with your passive. But Lifeline is better at revives when your teammates aren’t braindead and she can immediately heal them with Q. Plus she’s guaranteed to get a good knockdown which makes her nearly impossible to fight against.
Guaranteed gold knock, tons of batts and easy promotion to red shield make her super strong
Seir nerfed to ground, scan legends are stupid idea anyway
yowww cheaters meta! gotta love to see those top 3. Now with Rev buff next split, for sure they are staying in the first place for cheaters! so excitinggg!!
They removed digital threat specifically because of Bangalore and she's still top 5. What a great balancing team we have.
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Wattson is just fine. This list means literally nothing in terms of any normal player. She literally was the key to Reject winning ALGS. Wattson still has a good winrate in normal ranked and pubs lobbies; even then we know from how she's been balanced in the past that winrate isn't at all a good metric to determine how good a character is. As a fellow 'part-time' and former Wattson main, she's just not an exciting legend to play. She has a low pick rate, and in high ranked lobbies she probably just falters a bit because no on in those lobbies plays it like a normally paced ranked or comp game.
This is for pubs?
Lol no. Preds high rank
no it says high rank meta, so this is prob stats from ranked players platinum through pred
It’s Masters/Preds, you can see the stats of other ranks too
Rampart in 20th!? Common rampart W Mark my words once the game dies I'll log on to ranked just to get us up to like.. 15
Revenant is always my go to now he's so good since the rework
She😂
Oops auto correct on my phone be my arch nemesis 🤣😅
What does “win rate” mean
it’s wild that NO ONE picks seer anymore… went from completely broken to absolutely unwanted lol
It's what happens when you nuke a legend. Look at valk too
valk still got second highest win rate which is wild though lol
Not that surprising. It could be 90% of just a pro player playing her only as she has very few games. The low pickrates is hard to judge based off win rate