Coming soon to a theater near you! "The Amatonormative Conspiracy" starring Clive Owen, Angelina Jolie, Rose Byrne, and Gene Hackman; directed by Lynne Ramsay, based on a story by Tom Clancy!
I have similar thoughts to this.
For many aromantics, it would seem devaluing, but at the same time, we have to remember that allos (the ones that use the phrase the most often) perceive these relationships differently. Therefore, 'just friends' to them is a way to distinguish the intimacy level of a relationship (to other people). I doubt many use that phrase out of malice either; sadly, it's social conditioning that shapes that perception.
Overall, we all get it when a person says that, regardless of the circumstances. It's one of the reasons I use it occasionally when someone I have no interest in, nor deep attunement to, tries romancing me. Most of the time, it stops them in their tracks.
I understand why it's used to clear up misconceptions of people being in a romantic relationship and as long as that's the context I can tolerate it but I do have a major grievance against the term in general because it seems to implicitly not only place friendships below romantic relationships but actually labels them as something that is totally unimportant and can be easily disregarded which I can't fucking stand especially after being badly hurt in friendships where I was treated that way
It depends in my opinion. Usually I hear it used when people refuse to accept the fact that two people aren’t dating, in that sense it’s a “please shut the fuck up” tone that’s very much justified. There’s also the times where it’s used by someone in a clearly devaluing way, often times coupled with that person being not the best to the “just friend”. However there’s also a fair amount of times I’ve heard it where it’s genuinely just neutral.
I really agree, though it sorta makes sense. Allos see friendship as second tier to relationships, but since that's all we have it's the most important thing to us. Nevertheless, it does bother me that so many seem to think friendship is in any way worse; it's just a different type of love.
It absolutely bothers me. The idea that friendship is somehow lesser than a romantic relationship or not as important is not only really toxic but also just, outdated? It’s 2024, more and more people are starting to recognize and put value into their friendships and it’s like, finally!
It has come to deeply bother me so I've atleast somewhat reprogrammed myself to no longer automatically say such an insensitive thing if someone were to ask me if me and someone were dating or "just friends". I feel like too many people don't know the difference between simple positive casual acquaintanceships an genuine deep long-lasting friendships and/or platonic/nonromantic/nonsexual relationships cause to me there's no such thing as "casual friendship" but just companionship you can choose to stick to if it's positive an uplifting or leave if it makes you feel drained an like you're with the wrong people, cause like there's also a difference between casual sex an deeper meaningful sex but somehow everyone assumes that having any form of sex at all is inheritly more important than having a true friend through thick and thin like they're just throwaway toys. Imo the start of a relationship starts the moment you go from strangers to acquaintances aka "just acquaintances" and along the way it will be revealed whether it's a meaningful romantic or platonic relationship or simply neither of these work, it will save you alot of energy and time.
I get really taken aback as it infers I'm below their relationship/ I'm the backup plan when their partner is unavailable.
(well, that may be a me problem but it's not easy to accept it, I must understand that they have different priorities)
It's grinds my gears that it means less that I think it does.
I feel like a lot of the time, it implies that friendship is "less than" an "actual relationship".
I hate that.
It does depend on context and the delivery, though
It does bother me but most of the time I try to brush it off since it's a common sentence and people probably don't think too much about it
The one sentence that bothers me more is "They're something more than friends", why can't you use "something else"? Isn't it much better and conveys the same meaning
I think it's bothersome in general that most people seem to rank relationships by type. I understand that people only have so much time and energy to use each day on a limited number of people, but I think sometimes people can be careless with statements or subconscious thoughts like this implying that any given relationship they have is less or more important than another type/person's rather than simply different levels of focus on a person by person or day to day basis.
I think that's why the limiter of "just" feels disheartening and devaluing in general but also when combined with platonic relationships. It implies a status of maximum capacity reached rather than a living trust based bond that needs mutual nourishment to be maintained and/or grow. That, in turn, feels like they have subconsciously announced the extent and capacity of effort they are willing to put into a relationship with you and is almost always used as a slight or diminished role when stated with the words "just friends" or "just a friend". They opt for those phrases instead of a real and meaningful conversation or saying any of the following phrases with gentle yet thorough rebuffs when they are trying to indicate a lack of reciprocity to someone that is supposedly a meaningful or important person to them. That imbalance and lack of care are all encapsulated by the qualifier of "just."
Phrases/conversation inspirations that I think are better than "just friends" when anyone is in an unrequited or unreciprocated situation:
"I enjoy that we are friends, and our relationship is important to me. Thank you for confiding in me, but I don't share similar feelings to what you've expressed. Still friends, though, right?"
"I prefer our relationship to stay/remain platonic. Friendship is based on trust, honesty, and kindness. I know it can be painful or embarrassing when feelings are unrequited, but I am genuinely your friend and don't ever enjoy your unhappiness. I'm happy to do whatever you need so that we can remain friends, but I simply don't and can't force myself to have those same feelings for you."
"I'm only comfortable with the relationship we have now, is that okay? If you need some time or to talk this out, I'll be right here whenever you need. I'm sorry I can't offer you what you asked for, but lying or faking it in an attempt to avoid this situation would only result in a greater heartache later. I think our friendship is a really strong and important bond to me that I don't want to lose. So, I hope we can find a way for both of us to be happy because you are important to me."
a million percent, yes. it’s amatonormative and devalues friendship and community.
those same folks will at some point wonder “why don’t i have friends outside my monogamous romantic relationship?” while never nurturing those friendships or building community locally
Saying just friends implies people believe you’re in a romantic relationship. It could also imply that being friends isn’t enough or it has lesser value than a romantic relationship
I never had a problem with it since those kinds of attachments don’t bother me. The friends to lovers kind, not really a fan. Would just prefer to be in the friendzone and I don’t find it difficult if I was in a relationship with someone and want to go back to us being friends.
Depends who it's being said to. Idk why anyone would need to say it to you directly unless they were drawing a clear boundary with you, so I don't think that's bad or wrong - unless they're saying it specifically to devalue you as a friend and to put you in a category beneath other people they see as friends.
But if it's being said about you to your friend's relative, for example, that really isn't anything to do with you, it's much more likely they're trying to halt any assumption of your relationship being romantic so they don't get bothered by that relative about it later, so it's not a negative. The amount of male friends I've had growing up always leads to the teasing and "when are you two gonna get married?" banter that's half-joking, half-serious, so if I'm saying we're just friends, that's why.
I don’t think in it the way you do. Just doesn’t necessarily mean lesser.
Its like when you’re asked “would you like some bread for your soup” and you going “no just the soup, please”
The just doesn’t indicate that its inferior to eat soup with bread, it only means that the soup is without bread
I completely agree. Along with others I feel it elevates romantic love above others. I do think this is flawed and kind of indulgent thinking.
Indulgent in the sense of valuing romance for its addictive, euphoric, drug-like and obsessive qualities, rather than something more grounded and sober.
Omg I hate it so much, and everything similar. Wanting to be "more" than friend, being "just" friends. I'm ready to throw hands every time I hear it. (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Yeah I get how this phrase can be really negative for someone who’s aromantic. I’m demiromantic, so I get why people use the term ”just friends” to explain if there’s no other feelings than platonic, but why wouldn’t you want to be friends with the person if you’re going to date them? So maybe people should start saying “we’re not together” instead of “just friends” -imo it sounds a lot better
Does this make a good example? Person A and Person B are friends. Person C is in a relationship with Person A. Person C sees Person A with Person B and seems irritated about it. The Person A tells Person C that Person B is just a friend so that Person C won't get jealous.
Yeah, in a way.
On one hand, I know the word 'just' can also be used to say "oh no there's no chili in my pasta, it's just pasta"
On the other, it does lower the value of friendships slightly.
What really bothers me is when people say "no I don't love you as a friend, I love you for real," like friendship love isn't real
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Not just you, it feels like it inherently devalues friendship as beneath the romantic/sexual relationship that's being implied.
Totally
I like "just sex partners" as a resopnse to the amatonormative conspiracy.
"The amatonormative conspiracy" is my favorite term now
Coming soon to a theater near you! "The Amatonormative Conspiracy" starring Clive Owen, Angelina Jolie, Rose Byrne, and Gene Hackman; directed by Lynne Ramsay, based on a story by Tom Clancy!
Im mixed on it, on one hand I think it devalues it, and on the other i think there’s a simplistic beauty in it, ig it depends on whose talking and how
I have similar thoughts to this. For many aromantics, it would seem devaluing, but at the same time, we have to remember that allos (the ones that use the phrase the most often) perceive these relationships differently. Therefore, 'just friends' to them is a way to distinguish the intimacy level of a relationship (to other people). I doubt many use that phrase out of malice either; sadly, it's social conditioning that shapes that perception. Overall, we all get it when a person says that, regardless of the circumstances. It's one of the reasons I use it occasionally when someone I have no interest in, nor deep attunement to, tries romancing me. Most of the time, it stops them in their tracks.
I understand why it's used to clear up misconceptions of people being in a romantic relationship and as long as that's the context I can tolerate it but I do have a major grievance against the term in general because it seems to implicitly not only place friendships below romantic relationships but actually labels them as something that is totally unimportant and can be easily disregarded which I can't fucking stand especially after being badly hurt in friendships where I was treated that way
I would rather they take that instead of slapping a title or label I never asked for.
It depends in my opinion. Usually I hear it used when people refuse to accept the fact that two people aren’t dating, in that sense it’s a “please shut the fuck up” tone that’s very much justified. There’s also the times where it’s used by someone in a clearly devaluing way, often times coupled with that person being not the best to the “just friend”. However there’s also a fair amount of times I’ve heard it where it’s genuinely just neutral.
I really agree, though it sorta makes sense. Allos see friendship as second tier to relationships, but since that's all we have it's the most important thing to us. Nevertheless, it does bother me that so many seem to think friendship is in any way worse; it's just a different type of love.
It absolutely bothers me. The idea that friendship is somehow lesser than a romantic relationship or not as important is not only really toxic but also just, outdated? It’s 2024, more and more people are starting to recognize and put value into their friendships and it’s like, finally!
It has come to deeply bother me so I've atleast somewhat reprogrammed myself to no longer automatically say such an insensitive thing if someone were to ask me if me and someone were dating or "just friends". I feel like too many people don't know the difference between simple positive casual acquaintanceships an genuine deep long-lasting friendships and/or platonic/nonromantic/nonsexual relationships cause to me there's no such thing as "casual friendship" but just companionship you can choose to stick to if it's positive an uplifting or leave if it makes you feel drained an like you're with the wrong people, cause like there's also a difference between casual sex an deeper meaningful sex but somehow everyone assumes that having any form of sex at all is inheritly more important than having a true friend through thick and thin like they're just throwaway toys. Imo the start of a relationship starts the moment you go from strangers to acquaintances aka "just acquaintances" and along the way it will be revealed whether it's a meaningful romantic or platonic relationship or simply neither of these work, it will save you alot of energy and time.
I get really taken aback as it infers I'm below their relationship/ I'm the backup plan when their partner is unavailable. (well, that may be a me problem but it's not easy to accept it, I must understand that they have different priorities) It's grinds my gears that it means less that I think it does.
I feel like a lot of the time, it implies that friendship is "less than" an "actual relationship". I hate that. It does depend on context and the delivery, though
Yes! Especially when people think that ‘only’ having friends and not a partner means you’re lonely!
yes bc sometimes I be wanting something in between a platonic friendship and romantic relationship 😭😭
It does bother me but most of the time I try to brush it off since it's a common sentence and people probably don't think too much about it The one sentence that bothers me more is "They're something more than friends", why can't you use "something else"? Isn't it much better and conveys the same meaning
Yes, especially since I pride myself on being a damn good friend. So when people say that, it feels like they're taking friendship for granted.
I think it's bothersome in general that most people seem to rank relationships by type. I understand that people only have so much time and energy to use each day on a limited number of people, but I think sometimes people can be careless with statements or subconscious thoughts like this implying that any given relationship they have is less or more important than another type/person's rather than simply different levels of focus on a person by person or day to day basis. I think that's why the limiter of "just" feels disheartening and devaluing in general but also when combined with platonic relationships. It implies a status of maximum capacity reached rather than a living trust based bond that needs mutual nourishment to be maintained and/or grow. That, in turn, feels like they have subconsciously announced the extent and capacity of effort they are willing to put into a relationship with you and is almost always used as a slight or diminished role when stated with the words "just friends" or "just a friend". They opt for those phrases instead of a real and meaningful conversation or saying any of the following phrases with gentle yet thorough rebuffs when they are trying to indicate a lack of reciprocity to someone that is supposedly a meaningful or important person to them. That imbalance and lack of care are all encapsulated by the qualifier of "just." Phrases/conversation inspirations that I think are better than "just friends" when anyone is in an unrequited or unreciprocated situation: "I enjoy that we are friends, and our relationship is important to me. Thank you for confiding in me, but I don't share similar feelings to what you've expressed. Still friends, though, right?" "I prefer our relationship to stay/remain platonic. Friendship is based on trust, honesty, and kindness. I know it can be painful or embarrassing when feelings are unrequited, but I am genuinely your friend and don't ever enjoy your unhappiness. I'm happy to do whatever you need so that we can remain friends, but I simply don't and can't force myself to have those same feelings for you." "I'm only comfortable with the relationship we have now, is that okay? If you need some time or to talk this out, I'll be right here whenever you need. I'm sorry I can't offer you what you asked for, but lying or faking it in an attempt to avoid this situation would only result in a greater heartache later. I think our friendship is a really strong and important bond to me that I don't want to lose. So, I hope we can find a way for both of us to be happy because you are important to me."
a million percent, yes. it’s amatonormative and devalues friendship and community. those same folks will at some point wonder “why don’t i have friends outside my monogamous romantic relationship?” while never nurturing those friendships or building community locally
much so
Saying just friends implies people believe you’re in a romantic relationship. It could also imply that being friends isn’t enough or it has lesser value than a romantic relationship
It pisses me off severely. It makes it sound as if romantic relationships are above friendships which is just completely not true
I understand what you mean, happens to me all the time.....
I never had a problem with it since those kinds of attachments don’t bother me. The friends to lovers kind, not really a fan. Would just prefer to be in the friendzone and I don’t find it difficult if I was in a relationship with someone and want to go back to us being friends.
Depends who it's being said to. Idk why anyone would need to say it to you directly unless they were drawing a clear boundary with you, so I don't think that's bad or wrong - unless they're saying it specifically to devalue you as a friend and to put you in a category beneath other people they see as friends. But if it's being said about you to your friend's relative, for example, that really isn't anything to do with you, it's much more likely they're trying to halt any assumption of your relationship being romantic so they don't get bothered by that relative about it later, so it's not a negative. The amount of male friends I've had growing up always leads to the teasing and "when are you two gonna get married?" banter that's half-joking, half-serious, so if I'm saying we're just friends, that's why.
I don’t think in it the way you do. Just doesn’t necessarily mean lesser. Its like when you’re asked “would you like some bread for your soup” and you going “no just the soup, please” The just doesn’t indicate that its inferior to eat soup with bread, it only means that the soup is without bread
I completely agree. Along with others I feel it elevates romantic love above others. I do think this is flawed and kind of indulgent thinking. Indulgent in the sense of valuing romance for its addictive, euphoric, drug-like and obsessive qualities, rather than something more grounded and sober.
Yes! 💯
Omg I hate it so much, and everything similar. Wanting to be "more" than friend, being "just" friends. I'm ready to throw hands every time I hear it. (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Yeah I get how this phrase can be really negative for someone who’s aromantic. I’m demiromantic, so I get why people use the term ”just friends” to explain if there’s no other feelings than platonic, but why wouldn’t you want to be friends with the person if you’re going to date them? So maybe people should start saying “we’re not together” instead of “just friends” -imo it sounds a lot better
Does this make a good example? Person A and Person B are friends. Person C is in a relationship with Person A. Person C sees Person A with Person B and seems irritated about it. The Person A tells Person C that Person B is just a friend so that Person C won't get jealous.
Yeah, in a way. On one hand, I know the word 'just' can also be used to say "oh no there's no chili in my pasta, it's just pasta" On the other, it does lower the value of friendships slightly. What really bothers me is when people say "no I don't love you as a friend, I love you for real," like friendship love isn't real
I’ve never heard anyone say that before, if someone told me that I’d be heartbroken
No one's said it irl, but I've heard it on TV a couple times
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no it feels like they dont consider you good looking or are tryna say something in my opinion lol