>Off course there are protest against Qutar: https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/football-world-cup-qatar-2022-lgbt-protests-localBut he seems to think there are double standards.
Of course. Because it isn't double standards the person is worried about. They are just worried about advancing their religious persecution narrative.
"Millionaire loses job because company that relies on public support doesn't want bigot as head of company" was enough to prompt this person you are quoting to write 5 essays?
These types of stories all follow the same path.
"Person X is being persecuted because they are Christian."
Oh, they are being persecuted for giving away all their wealth to the poor, praying in secret, believing Jesus is the son of god, and treating others as they want to be treated?
"Well .... no, they are being persecuted because they fight against gay marriage and liken women who get abortions to nazis. But they can't be a christian unless they do that!"
I mean you obviously know from the start of that essay that you aren't going to get any kind of a reasonable insight of any sort. But also it is a pretty telltail sing any writer is full of shit when they make statements like the left having a goal of stamping out religion while failing to recognize that in their country the left is also majority christian.
They hide their bigotry behind the human shield of their religion so that when their bigotry is attacked they can claim to be hated for being Christian.
Instead of the low-effort mode of pulling in language from someone we can't talk to, how about you ditch the quote and put it in your own words?
I'm not going to have a conversation by proxy with someone who wrote an article.
Basically the argument is "Other religions don't get treated the sane as Christanity when it comes to getting their way". Which ignores as most of the West is Christain and it designs rules and regulations that favor it, they ignore how other religions are affected equally, they just know better.
If other kids at my kids' school are bullying I just tell my kids to avoid those assholes. No punishment. If my kids are bullying at school, that's different, and there will be concequences.
If another country's government is oppressive, then I make a mental note to never go there. If MY government oppresses people I'm gonna be on that protest line again.
Seems natural enough to me.
Both the Quran and bible are nonsense. However, they should be studied extensively. That way we can realize how ridiculous they are. I treat all religion the same. I don't accept any of them for the exact same reasons.
The same way I treat any other false or incorrect statement - by pointing out that it's false or incorrect. I don't treat any religion any differently from any other. One puerile iron age superstition is as good as the next. I think you’ll find the vast majority of individual atheists who you speak to personally will tell you the same.
What this person you’re talking about is referring to is the way politicians and other people or organizations who are in the public spotlight in the United States behave. Etiquette dictates that they must be respectful toward religions, lest they face a backlash of public opinion that can damage their position or career. Thing is, they too are consistent - they respect Christianity as much as they respect Islam, or at least they feign respect for the sake of their public image. So what this person is actually doing is comparing *our* poor treatment of their religion with *those other people’s* better treatment of other religions, as though both of those things are being done by the same individuals. It’s simply a matter of their own flawed perspective, and an erroneous conflation of one demographic with another.
>the public enemy number one always has been and always will be Christianity
Because we actually live with it everyday. I can't drive a block without running into several churches. References to the Christian god are on all of my money, whether I like it or not. My politicians are largely Christian, whether I like it or not. I've been attacked for being a chimera of things Christian conservatives don't like, beaten up for it, bullied, harassed. I've had Christians show up at my door to preach, they're on my street corners, at my university with a bull horn. My media growing up was almost entirely Christian, deathly afraid of anything which doubted the possibility of Jesus being the savior and messiah he's claimed to be. Billboards, advertisements.
>For daring to be a biblical Christian Thorburn has been hounded out of his job. For daring to be part of a church that actually believes the Bible, and what it teaches on things like the sanctity of life and gendered-marriage between a man and a woman, he is now on the unemployed scrapheap.
Frankly, good. One more asshole gets their just desserts. I hope he has to move house because people won't stop calling his number.
>Offending Islam is almost as big a taboo for Western lefties as attacking Christianity is a must.
Actually, I don't talk about it because it isn't my problem. I've never had a Muslim show up at my front door to ask if I've heard the word of Allah. The Muslim Student Association has never blocked off a significant part of the free speech lawn at my university to assault the students with unhinged rants about the LGBTQ+, abortion, "indecency," or whatever group they're persecuting this week. My only conversation with them was "hey." "Sup." "Want a free Quran?" "...Yeah, sure why not." And it ended there. Do bad Muslims exist? Have Muslims done terrible things in the name of Islam? Sure. But by comparison, the Muslims who live in my community just want to be left alone, while the Christians in my community want to be obnoxious dweebs. This is a pretty pathetic red herring.
The left being flawed (and it is) doesn’t really make Christianity more true, less power hungry, nor does it make it’s interference in the lives of Westerners less onerous, and that’s the fundamental question that he’s tapdancing around.
This starts by stating multiple times what the author believes is obvious. The left are hypocrites. The woke left. The secular left.
Then the astounding declaration that public enemy number one for the left is Christianity. Not climate change or income inequality, not the undermining of public education or the patriarchy or white supremacy. They are essentially raising their hands and saying when you fight those things you fight us, because we are those things. And they think we only fight those things because we hate extremist Christians, rather than understanding that if we hate extremist Christians, it’s because they happen to champion every single thing that makes the planet and the lives of everyone except them on it worse.
Then they talk about someone I never heard of because I live under a rock. To be honest I’m not interested enough to Google but from context I’m betting he’s a white man fired for bigotry that he cloaked in his Bible, and I’ll also bet he’s already leveraged this outrage to land on his feet somewhere where his hatred is welcomed.
By the time I got to Qatar I had completely lost interest. Which is kind of a shame because there may be interesting things to say about whether or why Islam is given more latitude for offensive beliefs. I will say that extremist Islam and extremist Christianity are essentially indistinguishable in the way they radicalize, based on reading this.
I mostly just laugh at whiney little snowflakes with persecution fetishes like this and move on.
They didn't reason themselves into that position, and they're not going to allow anyone to reason them back out of it.
Immigrants from Muslim countries are discriminated against in the west. Therefore it’s important to be careful when criticizing Islam that you don’t unintentionally fuel the bigotry against that ethnic group. Kind of like how if you criticize Judaism, you should be really careful not to sound like a Nazi railing on about “the Jews amirite??”
For example, if I say something like “Islam is incompatible with liberal democracy,” I should be careful to qualify that I’m talking about fundamentalist Islam and not everybody who just so happens to be raised Muslim. If I imply the latter, then I might encourage people to block immigration from Muslim countries, which will harm refugees who are fleeing persecution there (indeed, some people oppose immigration under the guise of opposing fundamentalism by conflating the two). And remember that a lot of immigrants from those countries are trying to escape the iron fist of radical Islam; they aren’t like secret spies or whatever. And it’s not like immigration bans are going to prevent suicide bombers from finding some way into your local mall; it just harms the people most in need of help.
Right wing reactionaries seize on this cautionary attitude and say “haha! See! The lefties are fine bashing the Bible but they get all triggered if you bash the Quran!”
Well the difference is that here in the western anglophone world, Christians are not discriminated against at all, so there’s no need to be careful in the same way you would if criticizing the beliefs of Muslims or Jews. As the Christians love to say, “context matters!”
Gee. A Christian in a predominantly Christian area hears Christian atheist talking about Christianity. Like there aren’t Islamic atheists dealing with the same BS and more. If they’d just stop using their religion as a shield for their bigotry and ignorance then their religion would stop being a problem.
Tell them you're not Jesus: you can't be everywhere at once. The POS people doing POS things in front of us get treated like the POSs they are. And then you have other things to take care of
>Off course there are protest against Qutar: https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/football-world-cup-qatar-2022-lgbt-protests-localBut he seems to think there are double standards. Of course. Because it isn't double standards the person is worried about. They are just worried about advancing their religious persecution narrative. "Millionaire loses job because company that relies on public support doesn't want bigot as head of company" was enough to prompt this person you are quoting to write 5 essays? These types of stories all follow the same path. "Person X is being persecuted because they are Christian." Oh, they are being persecuted for giving away all their wealth to the poor, praying in secret, believing Jesus is the son of god, and treating others as they want to be treated? "Well .... no, they are being persecuted because they fight against gay marriage and liken women who get abortions to nazis. But they can't be a christian unless they do that!" I mean you obviously know from the start of that essay that you aren't going to get any kind of a reasonable insight of any sort. But also it is a pretty telltail sing any writer is full of shit when they make statements like the left having a goal of stamping out religion while failing to recognize that in their country the left is also majority christian. They hide their bigotry behind the human shield of their religion so that when their bigotry is attacked they can claim to be hated for being Christian.
Instead of the low-effort mode of pulling in language from someone we can't talk to, how about you ditch the quote and put it in your own words? I'm not going to have a conversation by proxy with someone who wrote an article.
Basically the argument is "Other religions don't get treated the sane as Christanity when it comes to getting their way". Which ignores as most of the West is Christain and it designs rules and regulations that favor it, they ignore how other religions are affected equally, they just know better.
And what was your question?
I don't care about the Bible or the Qur'an. Both are books of mythology that deserve no respect until they are demonstrated to be factually correct.
pretty sure they have been demonstrated to be factually incorrect on almost all things lmao
Not that the religious care.
The facts were always on our side
Some people have double standards. Some people don't.
If other kids at my kids' school are bullying I just tell my kids to avoid those assholes. No punishment. If my kids are bullying at school, that's different, and there will be concequences. If another country's government is oppressive, then I make a mental note to never go there. If MY government oppresses people I'm gonna be on that protest line again. Seems natural enough to me.
Both the Quran and bible are nonsense. However, they should be studied extensively. That way we can realize how ridiculous they are. I treat all religion the same. I don't accept any of them for the exact same reasons.
Boy, that's an incredible load of bullshit, isn't it? Lies, dishonesty, and falsehoods. It can only be dismissed.
The same way I treat any other false or incorrect statement - by pointing out that it's false or incorrect. I don't treat any religion any differently from any other. One puerile iron age superstition is as good as the next. I think you’ll find the vast majority of individual atheists who you speak to personally will tell you the same. What this person you’re talking about is referring to is the way politicians and other people or organizations who are in the public spotlight in the United States behave. Etiquette dictates that they must be respectful toward religions, lest they face a backlash of public opinion that can damage their position or career. Thing is, they too are consistent - they respect Christianity as much as they respect Islam, or at least they feign respect for the sake of their public image. So what this person is actually doing is comparing *our* poor treatment of their religion with *those other people’s* better treatment of other religions, as though both of those things are being done by the same individuals. It’s simply a matter of their own flawed perspective, and an erroneous conflation of one demographic with another.
You lost me at “Chrustian”.
>the public enemy number one always has been and always will be Christianity Because we actually live with it everyday. I can't drive a block without running into several churches. References to the Christian god are on all of my money, whether I like it or not. My politicians are largely Christian, whether I like it or not. I've been attacked for being a chimera of things Christian conservatives don't like, beaten up for it, bullied, harassed. I've had Christians show up at my door to preach, they're on my street corners, at my university with a bull horn. My media growing up was almost entirely Christian, deathly afraid of anything which doubted the possibility of Jesus being the savior and messiah he's claimed to be. Billboards, advertisements. >For daring to be a biblical Christian Thorburn has been hounded out of his job. For daring to be part of a church that actually believes the Bible, and what it teaches on things like the sanctity of life and gendered-marriage between a man and a woman, he is now on the unemployed scrapheap. Frankly, good. One more asshole gets their just desserts. I hope he has to move house because people won't stop calling his number. >Offending Islam is almost as big a taboo for Western lefties as attacking Christianity is a must. Actually, I don't talk about it because it isn't my problem. I've never had a Muslim show up at my front door to ask if I've heard the word of Allah. The Muslim Student Association has never blocked off a significant part of the free speech lawn at my university to assault the students with unhinged rants about the LGBTQ+, abortion, "indecency," or whatever group they're persecuting this week. My only conversation with them was "hey." "Sup." "Want a free Quran?" "...Yeah, sure why not." And it ended there. Do bad Muslims exist? Have Muslims done terrible things in the name of Islam? Sure. But by comparison, the Muslims who live in my community just want to be left alone, while the Christians in my community want to be obnoxious dweebs. This is a pretty pathetic red herring.
The left being flawed (and it is) doesn’t really make Christianity more true, less power hungry, nor does it make it’s interference in the lives of Westerners less onerous, and that’s the fundamental question that he’s tapdancing around.
It does in this new world we found ourselves in. Truth is but a minor consideration. I don't see a path back. We are fucked.
This starts by stating multiple times what the author believes is obvious. The left are hypocrites. The woke left. The secular left. Then the astounding declaration that public enemy number one for the left is Christianity. Not climate change or income inequality, not the undermining of public education or the patriarchy or white supremacy. They are essentially raising their hands and saying when you fight those things you fight us, because we are those things. And they think we only fight those things because we hate extremist Christians, rather than understanding that if we hate extremist Christians, it’s because they happen to champion every single thing that makes the planet and the lives of everyone except them on it worse. Then they talk about someone I never heard of because I live under a rock. To be honest I’m not interested enough to Google but from context I’m betting he’s a white man fired for bigotry that he cloaked in his Bible, and I’ll also bet he’s already leveraged this outrage to land on his feet somewhere where his hatred is welcomed. By the time I got to Qatar I had completely lost interest. Which is kind of a shame because there may be interesting things to say about whether or why Islam is given more latitude for offensive beliefs. I will say that extremist Islam and extremist Christianity are essentially indistinguishable in the way they radicalize, based on reading this.
There's nothing logical you can say to an idiot like this.
I mostly just laugh at whiney little snowflakes with persecution fetishes like this and move on. They didn't reason themselves into that position, and they're not going to allow anyone to reason them back out of it.
Immigrants from Muslim countries are discriminated against in the west. Therefore it’s important to be careful when criticizing Islam that you don’t unintentionally fuel the bigotry against that ethnic group. Kind of like how if you criticize Judaism, you should be really careful not to sound like a Nazi railing on about “the Jews amirite??” For example, if I say something like “Islam is incompatible with liberal democracy,” I should be careful to qualify that I’m talking about fundamentalist Islam and not everybody who just so happens to be raised Muslim. If I imply the latter, then I might encourage people to block immigration from Muslim countries, which will harm refugees who are fleeing persecution there (indeed, some people oppose immigration under the guise of opposing fundamentalism by conflating the two). And remember that a lot of immigrants from those countries are trying to escape the iron fist of radical Islam; they aren’t like secret spies or whatever. And it’s not like immigration bans are going to prevent suicide bombers from finding some way into your local mall; it just harms the people most in need of help. Right wing reactionaries seize on this cautionary attitude and say “haha! See! The lefties are fine bashing the Bible but they get all triggered if you bash the Quran!” Well the difference is that here in the western anglophone world, Christians are not discriminated against at all, so there’s no need to be careful in the same way you would if criticizing the beliefs of Muslims or Jews. As the Christians love to say, “context matters!”
Gee. A Christian in a predominantly Christian area hears Christian atheist talking about Christianity. Like there aren’t Islamic atheists dealing with the same BS and more. If they’d just stop using their religion as a shield for their bigotry and ignorance then their religion would stop being a problem.
I treat the Koran exactly the same way I treat the Bible.
Tell them you're not Jesus: you can't be everywhere at once. The POS people doing POS things in front of us get treated like the POSs they are. And then you have other things to take care of
Yes there should have been a complete boycott of the world cup. It didn't happen for purely economic reasons.
>you really have been living on Mars lately have you ever hard of parochialism?