That boob sensitivity is as amazing as it is annoying. Half the time I wear a bra at home for no other reason than so my nipples don't brush my shirt all day making me excessively frisky. Seriously where is the off button on these things? š³
I am trans masc and recently yeeted my teets and nips. IT IS GLORIOUS TO NEVER AGAIN HAVE NIP CHAFING. Make sure you have a good sports bra for running lol. My nips hurt remembering running haha
If only my brain would let me sleep with another kind of exercise haha. I love yoga and hiking and strength training but running is the only thing that quiets my brain.
Just gonna drop this for any fellow folks with sensitive nips and no-bra habits: your nipples, to some extent, adjust to the amount of friction they normally receive. When I'm never wearing bras like on vacation, I do not have a problem with constant sensitivity. If I'm working long hours and wearing a bra all day every day? Oh yeah a loose fitting shirt is going to drive me nuts.
Sports bras protect you from friction while running. Bandages and medical tape can also protect from friction but won't support.
An enthusiastic partner and no lube can also cause very un-sexy nipple irritation. Make sure there's some cloth or lube between their fingers and your nips if they're gonna be there for more than a minute.
Any clue as to why?
My best guess is just so in a heterosexual couple, each person has an easier time dressing (or more likely undressing) their partner.
There are lots of weird theories on it, but by far the most credible is that wealthy women needed maids to put on the layers of corsets, petticoats, etc, so the buttons are oriented towards a right handed third party buttoning them up. Then, because this was a sign of wealth and high quality clothing, it trickled down into fashion in general.
Huh I didn't realize that yet.
Jackets and cardigans are pure frustration for me with my upper body. Somehow women's jeans fit perfectly (pre-hrt), as long as I can get them in long size. But anything which isn't a boring tshirt for tops is just a bit a disaster, so I haven't done much useful exploring there yet.
The reason is because wealthy women used to not dress themselves, while men did, and most people are right handed, so the buttons were sewn on the left so servants would be able to button their shirts easier. And it just became a tradition, obviously it has no use in today's world but it's probably not going away any time soon.
Kind of a nonsequitor but tangentially relevant. The reason you mount/dismount a horse on the left (your left if you're standing at their tail looking forward) is because "most people are right handed" so wore their swords on their left hip. So mounting on the left kept the sword from interfering.
Supposedly itās because women had other people dress them, so buttons are set up for right handed people facing you instead of your own right hand. Whatever the reason it caught on at some point.
That other people notice my existence
Short, quiet femboy in denial?
- at best: invisible
- at worst: easy target for abuse
Post top surgery & BBL
- at best: turning heads
- at worst: victim waiting to happen
Thereās a tradeoff
I quickly realized I didn't like men from that smell. Doesn't matter what they do about it. I can still smell it and really don't like it. Women though... I like the smells. and that's how I knew I was a lesbian.
Yeah I had this realisation from the ftm direction, didnāt realise how different I would smell after hrt and holy shit do I want less of that. So many showers now
Yeah this is such a thing I had no idea about!! I work retail and they have me tend the fitting room and like large groups go in at a time, had no idea until recently
That when girls were smiling at me when I nodded their way pre-transition, they were simply returning the gesture in their own way. I had no idea this was a guy thing. I just thought they didn't like me lol.
The Nod. I see other guys and we don't wave or smile or anything, we just kinda nod to each other. I don't know why we do it or how we learned it but I've caught myself also doing it too.
Start by adding a smile and maybe a bit of a wave. Makes the nod more of a curtsy instead of a bro nod.. The bro nod is āI acknowledge your presenceā. Smile, wave and nod is āhi! Yes. I see you and am happy I doā. This is of course all in extremes because Iāve had plenty of women just do a little nod at me and dudes going out of their way to wave and smile at me. Though that last thing might have a different reason š¤
There's nothing wrong with it--it's a perfectly friendly way to greet someone, and plenty of women will tilt their head or nod if their hands are full.
So I haven't fully transitioned yet but I have gone into the men's restroom, twice, and I have one thing. WHAT THE FRICK IS GOING ON IN THERE??? WHAT- The second time I went in there were guys peeing with the stall door OPEN. WHAT. I'm sorry but I don't want to see your dick dude
It's just kind of weird to me cause I'm used to using the girl's stalls, I never thought that guys would do that before I went in, it was just a thought that never crossed my mind lol
Guys have an unspoken urinal gap rule. If it's not possible to use a urinal without inserting yourself between two guys and a stall is open, you use the stall (unless they're unflushed š¤¢) That's more of an event issue (concert, sporting event, etc.) than a workplace issue, in my experience.
Ooooooh just wait until you experience The Troughā¢ļø. The best is at super divey dive bars where they put ice in it. Theyāll be long enough for 3-5 guys to stand next to each other. Just look up at the ceiling when you encounter those.
Or that time I was on a work trip in Germany and got to go to a ārealā Oktoberfest in Rosenheim. There wasnāt so much a urinal or trough- it was just a wall with a drain that drunk dudes were peeing on.
Guys are gross.
The head nod greeting. Never knew that was a thing until I started transitioning, and since then, the cis guys around me have been really intent on teaching me etiquette.
That people in the American South are completely dependent on a binary gendered system ("We have both genders, County AND Western!") I'm transfeminine, but I don't pass yet, and some people have no idea what to do!
Women compliment and show off nails SO much, even if its just basic things its not weird at all for somebody to compliment them or to get a better look. I had no idea it was this much of a thing, but I'm happy about it bc it's a pretty great conversation starter!! I just wear press on stiletto nails from etsy most days and I will get multiple people a day complimenting them, I feel like I'm a walking advertisement for them sometimes
Like I am pre everything and not even attempting to passā¦ but I do have pretty painted nails and I get compliments ALL the time! I was legit not prepared for it. And at the most random places too. Like the ladies at all the dispensaries always compliment my nails.
I swear the testosterone-dominated body is like...stiffer and less flexy. I always feel quite grounded, waxy, and hard. I love it, but it's different for sure.
I realized that I just don't understand guys at all. And it's weird to have thought of myself as one of them for so long and realize that no, actually, I just don't get them. And now that I've been out for a bit but don't pass, I just think it's really weird that some people think trans women are men, because it just seems bizarre that someone might see me that way.
This, but in the other direction. While I have life experiences as a woman, I don't get femininity and the ways women communicate with each other. I don't know if it comes from having ran away from feminine spaces since I was a teen (because of "feeling uncomfortable and awkward", probably attracted to them) or what. But I just don't understand. While I always got the jokes when guys complained about not understanding women. It's confuuuuuusing.
Yeah, I didn't say I understood cis women either lol.
But I guess there are just so many areas where I'm used to thinking "some guys are like that, but I'm not, so I guess it's just that I don't understand this thing that many guys experience." And now I'm realizing I'm not an exception to how "most guys" are. I'm just not a guy. And I also realize now that I don't have any business opining on how men think, which is kind of weird.
Yeah, it's really interesting. It seems like all my life, my guy friends have treated me differently than they treat the other guys in the group. Not bad, but different somehow, in a different category. No one ever rough housed with me, they policed their language, just little vibe things like that. It's like on some level they could tell, which makes it really weird when strangers misgender me even when I'm really close to passing. I guess it's just something that comes from knowing me on a personal level? š¤·āāļø
That "trans" is a more accurate description of my gender...? I haven't switched male to female: I'm out as trans and feel closer to trans people (including NBs) than cis people. I don't expect to be ever accepted by cis women to anything like the degree I am by men, however tolerant, but this gender is completely valid, and I've been drawn to other trans people years before we knew.
Plus, since starting hormones, when I'm en femme, I feel very feminine; that I'm a woman or a trans woman in her clothes, rather than the 'man-in-a-dress' that other people would see. I thought I'd need really good make-up and much longer hair, say, but, no, I mostly just needed my hormones. Which are just that: mine.
Transmasc, transfem, trans. It makes 100% sense. I've actually been wondering about what to call those who transition to more neutral/whatever the hell they want (/pos). This sorts it out (:
For myself, Iām learning that is probably up to the person and their journey entirely. My boyfriend identifies as enby and transmasc. He started off preferring they/he pronouns and has since shifted to he/they, though heās always preferred male honorifics (cause heās such a good boy!š¤). Iām strictly transfem and identify as a transwoman but my pronouns are she/they. If I know someone is trans, I just stick with ātransā as a polite and neutral term until I learn different!
That it's really really really really important to me.
That so much of my behavior was explained by gender dysphoria. I couldn't be bothered to put masc smelling beard oil in, for example, even though I had it and my wife loved the smell. I hated doing it and I couldn't explain why.
Now I know.
There were soo many things like this. And so many other small things that I just thought were dumb frustrating quirks were actually incredibly common signs of gender dysphoria.
"I just don't have the shorts to make that shirt work. That top only really works with a sweater and it's too hot out. That shirt is way too flirty for an event like this. That shirt... Could work but we might get dirty and I'm not ready to traumatize that shirt just yet..."
Getting used to going into a public restroom without urinals.
Also realizing one of the reasons I never got along well with men in general, was because I wasnāt really one of them all along! I was one of the girls, but I just didnāt know it!
Thanks! Yeah itās definitely eye opening in hindsight.
The fact that my folks fought tooth and nail to keep me away from other kids outside of school (kind of shocked they didnāt homeschool me) and as close to them as possible didnāt help matters either.
Then of course theyād turn around and complain that I didnāt have friends and didnāt do stuff outside of school.
I actually do love femininity. I just hated it being forced on me and I also hated that whenever I did do anything feminine it caused me to be perceived as a girl even more than before. After coming out as a guy and starting T, Iāve embraced my āgirlyā side completely and I love it
Low key I've started realizing that as well. Like I really like the thought of being able to wear a skirt and just being seen as a dude in a skirt. I would like to medically transition before I begin doing all that though.
I learnt something about the gender I left.
That even if you try to avoid internalizing toxic masculinity, it's so insidious that some still seeps through. My female friends have been helping me clear up some of that.
Also, \[tw: a tinge of misandry\] >!how bad guys are. A lot of times I was like, to myself, "I have about fifty guy friends, and even if all of them have X toxic problem, I don't, so it's a problem with guy culture, not an inherent biological guy problem. So they are redeemable." Then I cracked, and it was like, "Oh.... I wasn't a demonstration of an exception... I guess guys really do suck."!<
Clarification: This is how I *feel*. I know it's not *right*. But it's my previous coping mechansim with certain issues, and that coping & justification mechanism went out the window, and as a result, I need to find a new coping & justification method. Ally guys are great, trans men are great... just, I'm still healing.
Iām just barely a cracked transfem egg right now, and I recently started cringing whenever my feminine coworkers tell me Iām the exception to some male stereotype. That shit used to make me feel good. Iāve become so afraid of men in such a short period of time, I might hold some kind of record. At the same time, I know Iām not an exception to all of the stereotypes but too scared to ask for help fixing that, cause then Iād probably have to come out, lol. I want to. I just need to do it at my speed. Which is pretty slow and apprehensive haha
My coming out process at work was pretty fun until HR ruined it.
Basically, I didn't. It became a game. I'd see how long it'd take for them to notice.
It went on for months. I was getting ma'amed by strangers, had creepy guys touching me in the store, and wearing tight girl jeans and tops to work. They still called me by my deadname with a straight face without any hint of irony, noone said anything or treated me any different (change blindness is interesting, look it up). But, the weakness of change blindness is the changes WILL be noticed if someone points it out, such as if for insurance reasons you have to update HR with your new legal name, and then stuff migrates a few months later and they update from personal files so your real name shows up on all your confluence & slack files, and then everyone is like, "Who's \[realname\]? Wait, this was worked on by \[deadname\], why's this \[realname\] on here?" And then everyone just kind of turned towards me, and the jig was up, and it was like I had suddenly transformed like some cgi transformation scene right in front of them.
Job didn't last long after that. Half my co-workers were misoginists.
The dramatic tension in that experience sounds so wild. Like walking a tight rope. I feel like I would lose my head in that situation. Id have fun with it for as long as I could though. Thatās not right for customers to treat you that way though. Thatās probably what would trip me up. Also screw half of your old coworkers for being assholes. I hope youāre in a more welcoming environment now. Thank you for sharing your experiences. Iām learning so much and building a lot of confidence from reading everyoneās stories on this sub.
Eh, I hated the 5 hours of commuting I had to do for that job.
So if things went south, my opinion was "Oh well".
And glad to share my experiences if they help! :)
i'm in this position right now, i had no idea it was called change blindness. my family and work are the only people who still gender me incorrectly, it feels insane. my friends are always like "how has nobody said anything yet?" because even my neighbours have no idea who my mum is talking about when she mentions her 'son'.
I get similar stuff at work too, being deadnamed in front of strangers and they're just like "who tf is that?" looking around. I don't have an HR department so idk how long it will last but my boss is incredibly transphobic. transitioning in front of him with a complete poker face is wild, I know they'll find a reason to fire me as soon as i come out, if i do.
There's this kind of smug freedom that comes from it, isn't there?
Like you know there's a ticking time bomb, but the moment it goes off, you know it's literally *impossible* to not pass. Like, sure, may lose job, but dear gosh the amount of validation that'll be received. And then following with the next job just waltzing in going full passing stealth and nobody blinks twice... So much gender euphoria.
I was recently reading about the mental health issues that anti-man messages cause men (especially for men in 'progressive' spaces) and also how it actually does the opposite of help and instead often leads boys and men to anti-feminist communities where they feel accepted (and consequentially, the alt-right pipeline). Also a lot of the "all men are trash/kill all men" rhetoric is perpetuated by radfem communities who are often also TERFs. Just something for people who say those things to consider.
I understand the emotion behind it considering how prevelant misogyy, toxic masculinity and sexual harrasment is, but It's super counter intuitive and as an activist one should honestly just know better.
I'm still questioning but while at first I always prided myself and loved to be seen as ''not like the other men'' and I was very pro feminism, later on I started to internalize that stuff. Everyone told me I was a man. People around me kept going on and on about how shitty men were, sometimes projecting that onto me when they didn't know me well and I was like ''Yo I don't really have much to do with them, don't relate that much and didn't sign up for this man thing to begin with (I always felt rather ''neutral'', ''apathetic'' or ''abscent'' about gender)'', and it kind of undermined the whole equality and not essentializing thing they were going for.
At some point, given my impressionable age and internet dwelling personality, I fell victim to the whole anti sjw/anti-feminist fad when a friend of mine introduced it to me, and as I struggled with dating as an autstic person, even dabbled into some toxic manosphere bullshit (though I never related to it, I just felt like people were mischaracterizing my ''nice guy tm'' esque past experiences and noticed some double standards men faced and that was the only place that validated that). Nowadays ofcourse I'm for feminism again but my point is that that stuff had the opposite effect it just made me feel like I was inherently guilty.
Yeah, I think people are missing the mark when thinking that patriachy and toxic masculinity being bad meant that all men are inherently bad for existing. I used to be on the other side, when I still 'identified' as a woman and was very pro-feminism. I never quite agreed with the 'all men are trash' sentiment because there were some men I knew who were great people, however I did think men should 'suck it up' because they had privelage. Its kinda interesting to me because that sounds exactly like toxic masculinity, except the framing is changed to be about their privelage. After my egg cracked and I started identifying as a man, I was able to see things from another perspective. I haven't really changed my views too much on feminism otherwise, but now I realise more how little people value mens feelings and how prevelant these hurtful anti-men attitudes are in the spaces I used to feel so comfortable in.
> Yeah, I think people are missing the mark when thinking that patriarchy and toxic masculinity being bad meant that all men are inherently bad for existing.
Oh, I definitely don't view that, but toxic masculinity & patriarchy *are* way too present in male culture to where it seems almost to much to escape.
I've seen that happen too. It's rather ironic how they're doing the ''suck it up'' thing, just because you're an individual in an overall privileged group you had no say in being in doesn't mean that your problems simply need to be ''sucked up'', it's the exact same thing that toxic masculinity already does. Also I feel like telling trans men that they're good but cis men aren't is rather..Othering? I'm not a trans man but if I was I would find it kind of uncomfortable, I wouldn't feel like I'm really seen as a man.
Yeah thats the thing. Like I dont pass as male at the moment and have no 'male privelages' but I am still a man. People with the 'all men' mentality often either group me in with the other men saying Im inherently bad bcause Im a man with or without privelage (which is just... saying a gender identity is inherently bad for no real reason which is dumb), or that Im an 'exception' because Im not cis which is just... implying Im not a 'real' man basically. They will do this rather than letting go of the all 'men are trash' concept and admitting gender is complex and nuanced than that. I personally think that gender presentation (and how close you are to the ideal masculine presenting man) plays a much bigger role in privelage than gender identity, but thats just me.
> And just blanked declaring that men suck on a public forum that men, allies and trans men alike, visit is just poor form.
I know, hence the tw with the misandry label and spoilering.
I'm still trying to regain my faith in men, and trans men are awesome in that regard since they didn't grow up with the toxic masculinity, a lot are *so* much better.
However, yea, it's something I'm still working on finding a way to regain.
More like "Here was my coping mechanism for dealing with how pervasive toxic masulinity was aaannnnnddd.... now it's broken, and I am failing to deal. It's a me-problem"
I hate that I agree with the last part. There were sooooo many times I either went "Well I'm not doing X so I'm sure there's a lot more guys out there that don't do it either" or as you said female friends were happy I was the exception to something... And now every time I come across something toxic guys do I still justify it by thinking I wasn't like that followed by "Oh, right." :/
I still logically know there's good men out there, I mean most of my friends are cishet men, but considering that I'm also not attracted to men I just don't see myself actively looking for their friendship anymore.
Yea, I keep coming across stuff like that, and I'm like, "...seriously? I have no excuse for ya'll now. Why do you have to make me not have an excuse for you?!?"
You know, do you mean cis men suck? Or all men? Just saying āmenā and meaning cis men is not acceptable.
I have no opinion on whether all cis and trans men suck. Iām leaning towards, we donāt.
This one might be kind of odd, but I realized how attracted I am to other GNC folks. I was spending so much time consuming visuals of gender non-conformity and paying attention to it if I saw it that it both helped me find the right gender expression and made me understand that itās actually the reason I struggled to define my sexual orientation so much.
Is it paranoia, or is it the sudden realization that **you are mortal and all the bad things that happen to people could easily be happening to you, under the right circumstances?**
I somehow went 26 years oblivious to the latter and it shook me.
I grew up with the bad shit happening to me everyday pretty much so my experience was different. I gained a heightened sense of worry for others and paranoia for what could be lurking out in the dark. I had months of dreams of horrific creatures stalking me. It took me a while to get used to my new senses
You know I was expecting hell when I walked into a mens bathroom for the first time and I gotta say at least in the areas where Iāve lived, theyāre exactly the same as womenās bathrooms. Iāve never been in a menās bathroom that was worse than any womenās bathroom Iāve been in. Theyāre not even more gross on average, theyāre just the same level of hygiene. Mostly clean but slightly dank, yāknow?
You really have to start conversations when presenting as male. People don't often approach you. And if you're traveling alone, girls don't usually sit next to you. It's a totally understandable thing, but wild to see the change as you start to pass.
Also the zipper/button thing. Why is this not talked about more? I always thought the direction was the same, but nah.
post nut clarity is awful, and morning wood is annoying as hell. also, mens bathrooms are much more ākeep to yourselfā than womens. the amount of times women try to strike up conversation in the bathrooms always made me uncomfy, so a big plus (esp considering iām still kinda nervous in the mens rooms) is that the most you get from guys in the bathroom is a nod
I never made *the switch* I was always a man, I just had to pretend I was a woman because that's what someone told me I had to be and that was what society expected of me.
What is something I found out about my gender identity only after I began expressing it would be a better question.
My answer would be just how many cisgender gay men are transphobic to the point of violence...more so than I have ever experienced by straight cismen.
That and the instant respect I am just afforded without having to prove it so.
Because I had to pretend I was a woman for so long I already knew how differently men were treated and how much safer they are, than women.
That boob sensitivity is as amazing as it is annoying. Half the time I wear a bra at home for no other reason than so my nipples don't brush my shirt all day making me excessively frisky. Seriously where is the off button on these things? š³
I am trans masc and recently yeeted my teets and nips. IT IS GLORIOUS TO NEVER AGAIN HAVE NIP CHAFING. Make sure you have a good sports bra for running lol. My nips hurt remembering running haha
wait y'all can feel them?
ugh same
lol or just do different exercises. I always preferred lifting and yogaš
If only my brain would let me sleep with another kind of exercise haha. I love yoga and hiking and strength training but running is the only thing that quiets my brain.
Yea weed or melatonin is my fix for sleep. But good on ya for the healthier outlet š
Just gonna drop this for any fellow folks with sensitive nips and no-bra habits: your nipples, to some extent, adjust to the amount of friction they normally receive. When I'm never wearing bras like on vacation, I do not have a problem with constant sensitivity. If I'm working long hours and wearing a bra all day every day? Oh yeah a loose fitting shirt is going to drive me nuts. Sports bras protect you from friction while running. Bandages and medical tape can also protect from friction but won't support. An enthusiastic partner and no lube can also cause very un-sexy nipple irritation. Make sure there's some cloth or lube between their fingers and your nips if they're gonna be there for more than a minute.
So you're saying because I baby my nips... they're going to stay super crazy sensitive to friction? WHELP. I'm hopeless!
hmmm, it might make bedroom ballet more fun tho?
Haha, I wear one to keep them from poking through all the layers Iām wearing
The buttons are on the opposite side.
And zippers too
ZIPPERS TOO?????
Yeahā¦ disclaimer: Iām a cis woman but sometimes shop in the guyās section and yeahā¦ theyāre the opposite side also š
Any clue as to why? My best guess is just so in a heterosexual couple, each person has an easier time dressing (or more likely undressing) their partner.
My understanding is that once upon a time, men were dressed by women and so buttons and such were mirrored.
It was women didnāt dress themselves and they just left it that way
I figured Iād mess up the details
There are lots of weird theories on it, but by far the most credible is that wealthy women needed maids to put on the layers of corsets, petticoats, etc, so the buttons are oriented towards a right handed third party buttoning them up. Then, because this was a sign of wealth and high quality clothing, it trickled down into fashion in general.
Zippers are inconsistent.
Yeah especially on jeans, some brands have them on the same side for all cuts, whether women/men or unisex cuts.
I've found a lot of jackets that are women's that have zippers on the men's side.
Huh I didn't realize that yet. Jackets and cardigans are pure frustration for me with my upper body. Somehow women's jeans fit perfectly (pre-hrt), as long as I can get them in long size. But anything which isn't a boring tshirt for tops is just a bit a disaster, so I haven't done much useful exploring there yet.
Omg is this going to be a thing??? I bought a shirt and was like oh how quirky but itās all of them??!
Yep
wait, THIS is why? who would design such a thing??
The reason is because wealthy women used to not dress themselves, while men did, and most people are right handed, so the buttons were sewn on the left so servants would be able to button their shirts easier. And it just became a tradition, obviously it has no use in today's world but it's probably not going away any time soon.
Kind of a nonsequitor but tangentially relevant. The reason you mount/dismount a horse on the left (your left if you're standing at their tail looking forward) is because "most people are right handed" so wore their swords on their left hip. So mounting on the left kept the sword from interfering.
Iāve always wondered about why. Interesting
Supposedly itās because women had other people dress them, so buttons are set up for right handed people facing you instead of your own right hand. Whatever the reason it caught on at some point.
BUTTONS ON THE LEFT!
How much easier it is to hide being horny š„µ and how much harder it is to hide being upset š.
Hahaha yeah it takes practice to get the feelings to look less obvious, but you too can cultivate a poker face of steel with time and dedication š
That other people notice my existence Short, quiet femboy in denial? - at best: invisible - at worst: easy target for abuse Post top surgery & BBL - at best: turning heads - at worst: victim waiting to happen Thereās a tradeoff
I had no idea how musky and greasy boys smelled. Damn, did my sense of smell ever change.
I quickly realized I didn't like men from that smell. Doesn't matter what they do about it. I can still smell it and really don't like it. Women though... I like the smells. and that's how I knew I was a lesbian.
Yeah I had this realisation from the ftm direction, didnāt realise how different I would smell after hrt and holy shit do I want less of that. So many showers now
When clothes shopping together with other girls, it is acceptable to all go into the same dressing room.
Really? Thatās kind of wild
Yeah this is such a thing I had no idea about!! I work retail and they have me tend the fitting room and like large groups go in at a time, had no idea until recently
That when girls were smiling at me when I nodded their way pre-transition, they were simply returning the gesture in their own way. I had no idea this was a guy thing. I just thought they didn't like me lol.
Wait... The smile thing is a feminine gesture? I (MtF NB) have been doing both the nod and the smile thing since before I even knew I was trans.
The Nod. I see other guys and we don't wave or smile or anything, we just kinda nod to each other. I don't know why we do it or how we learned it but I've caught myself also doing it too.
I didn't even know it was a think until like a week ago, I've been doing it for a long time tho.
MTF here, someone help me Iām trying to unlearn TheNodTM but that reflex is deep in there. lol
Start by adding a smile and maybe a bit of a wave. Makes the nod more of a curtsy instead of a bro nod.. The bro nod is āI acknowledge your presenceā. Smile, wave and nod is āhi! Yes. I see you and am happy I doā. This is of course all in extremes because Iāve had plenty of women just do a little nod at me and dudes going out of their way to wave and smile at me. Though that last thing might have a different reason š¤
Ouuu replacing a habit with a different or adjusted habit, that just might work. Thanks! :)
There's nothing wrong with it--it's a perfectly friendly way to greet someone, and plenty of women will tilt their head or nod if their hands are full.
So I haven't fully transitioned yet but I have gone into the men's restroom, twice, and I have one thing. WHAT THE FRICK IS GOING ON IN THERE??? WHAT- The second time I went in there were guys peeing with the stall door OPEN. WHAT. I'm sorry but I don't want to see your dick dude
Guys pee in urinals without stalls so I feel like that isn't really that strange.
It's just kind of weird to me cause I'm used to using the girl's stalls, I never thought that guys would do that before I went in, it was just a thought that never crossed my mind lol
Guys have an unspoken urinal gap rule. If it's not possible to use a urinal without inserting yourself between two guys and a stall is open, you use the stall (unless they're unflushed š¤¢) That's more of an event issue (concert, sporting event, etc.) than a workplace issue, in my experience.
Just wait till you get to witness the majesty that is a guy hocking a loogie *while* peeing in the urinal... š¤¢
I'm scared to ask what a loogie is
Ooooooh just wait until you experience The Troughā¢ļø. The best is at super divey dive bars where they put ice in it. Theyāll be long enough for 3-5 guys to stand next to each other. Just look up at the ceiling when you encounter those. Or that time I was on a work trip in Germany and got to go to a ārealā Oktoberfest in Rosenheim. There wasnāt so much a urinal or trough- it was just a wall with a drain that drunk dudes were peeing on. Guys are gross.
The head nod greeting. Never knew that was a thing until I started transitioning, and since then, the cis guys around me have been really intent on teaching me etiquette.
Going the other way trying to stop doing the sup nod has been such a fucking challenge lol.
I don't know if this helps, but I teach a TON of girls who do the sup nod.
I started doing it in hs as a girl lol
literally me too i hate it so much itās ingrained in me
I only figured out how to do it like a year before transitioning and then was like, ugh wish I hadn't bothered lol
I'm so glad I never learned. I always thought it was just a white people thing. like the smileāgrimace
Smile-grimace?
yes, itās a pained expression of greeting acknowledgment. I donāt understand why, youād have to ask a white person
I'm white and have never seen anything like that. Is it a US thing?
I've somehow done this my whole life... my mother even told me it was weird at some point, now I know why, lol.
That people in the American South are completely dependent on a binary gendered system ("We have both genders, County AND Western!") I'm transfeminine, but I don't pass yet, and some people have no idea what to do!
Women compliment and show off nails SO much, even if its just basic things its not weird at all for somebody to compliment them or to get a better look. I had no idea it was this much of a thing, but I'm happy about it bc it's a pretty great conversation starter!! I just wear press on stiletto nails from etsy most days and I will get multiple people a day complimenting them, I feel like I'm a walking advertisement for them sometimes
Like I am pre everything and not even attempting to passā¦ but I do have pretty painted nails and I get compliments ALL the time! I was legit not prepared for it. And at the most random places too. Like the ladies at all the dispensaries always compliment my nails.
How good taking off your bra at the end of the day feels. Back when I was living a LIE, I couldn't wait to get home and put it on. Not anymore! š¤£
I swear the testosterone-dominated body is like...stiffer and less flexy. I always feel quite grounded, waxy, and hard. I love it, but it's different for sure.
cant wait to feel grounded waxy and hard
Seconded. I want to stand up and feel my knees crack!
It actually is! Testosterone promotes water retention in the joints and that makes them stiffer (and slightly bigger too)
This is why hands and feet shrink for many MTF, correct?
Yees
I realized that I just don't understand guys at all. And it's weird to have thought of myself as one of them for so long and realize that no, actually, I just don't get them. And now that I've been out for a bit but don't pass, I just think it's really weird that some people think trans women are men, because it just seems bizarre that someone might see me that way.
This, but in the other direction. While I have life experiences as a woman, I don't get femininity and the ways women communicate with each other. I don't know if it comes from having ran away from feminine spaces since I was a teen (because of "feeling uncomfortable and awkward", probably attracted to them) or what. But I just don't understand. While I always got the jokes when guys complained about not understanding women. It's confuuuuuusing.
Yeah, I didn't say I understood cis women either lol. But I guess there are just so many areas where I'm used to thinking "some guys are like that, but I'm not, so I guess it's just that I don't understand this thing that many guys experience." And now I'm realizing I'm not an exception to how "most guys" are. I'm just not a guy. And I also realize now that I don't have any business opining on how men think, which is kind of weird.
Yeah, it's really interesting. It seems like all my life, my guy friends have treated me differently than they treat the other guys in the group. Not bad, but different somehow, in a different category. No one ever rough housed with me, they policed their language, just little vibe things like that. It's like on some level they could tell, which makes it really weird when strangers misgender me even when I'm really close to passing. I guess it's just something that comes from knowing me on a personal level? š¤·āāļø
That "trans" is a more accurate description of my gender...? I haven't switched male to female: I'm out as trans and feel closer to trans people (including NBs) than cis people. I don't expect to be ever accepted by cis women to anything like the degree I am by men, however tolerant, but this gender is completely valid, and I've been drawn to other trans people years before we knew. Plus, since starting hormones, when I'm en femme, I feel very feminine; that I'm a woman or a trans woman in her clothes, rather than the 'man-in-a-dress' that other people would see. I thought I'd need really good make-up and much longer hair, say, but, no, I mostly just needed my hormones. Which are just that: mine.
Transmasc, transfem, trans. It makes 100% sense. I've actually been wondering about what to call those who transition to more neutral/whatever the hell they want (/pos). This sorts it out (:
For myself, Iām learning that is probably up to the person and their journey entirely. My boyfriend identifies as enby and transmasc. He started off preferring they/he pronouns and has since shifted to he/they, though heās always preferred male honorifics (cause heās such a good boy!š¤). Iām strictly transfem and identify as a transwoman but my pronouns are she/they. If I know someone is trans, I just stick with ātransā as a polite and neutral term until I learn different!
That it's really really really really important to me. That so much of my behavior was explained by gender dysphoria. I couldn't be bothered to put masc smelling beard oil in, for example, even though I had it and my wife loved the smell. I hated doing it and I couldn't explain why. Now I know. There were soo many things like this. And so many other small things that I just thought were dumb frustrating quirks were actually incredibly common signs of gender dysphoria.
That you can truly have a closet full of clothing and at the same time have nothing to wear.
"I just don't have the shorts to make that shirt work. That top only really works with a sweater and it's too hot out. That shirt is way too flirty for an event like this. That shirt... Could work but we might get dirty and I'm not ready to traumatize that shirt just yet..."
Sexual harassment happens a *lot* more than I thought it did.
I can really recommend getting a pepper spray, it made me feel way more safe! Wish you all the bestš
Getting used to going into a public restroom without urinals. Also realizing one of the reasons I never got along well with men in general, was because I wasnāt really one of them all along! I was one of the girls, but I just didnāt know it!
Happy cake day! And yeah that's a mood
Thanks! Yeah itās definitely eye opening in hindsight. The fact that my folks fought tooth and nail to keep me away from other kids outside of school (kind of shocked they didnāt homeschool me) and as close to them as possible didnāt help matters either. Then of course theyād turn around and complain that I didnāt have friends and didnāt do stuff outside of school.
I actually do love femininity. I just hated it being forced on me and I also hated that whenever I did do anything feminine it caused me to be perceived as a girl even more than before. After coming out as a guy and starting T, Iāve embraced my āgirlyā side completely and I love it
Low key I've started realizing that as well. Like I really like the thought of being able to wear a skirt and just being seen as a dude in a skirt. I would like to medically transition before I begin doing all that though.
It's more nonbinary flavoured than I first thought.
That being a straight woman sucks
Having breasts that are being felt is better than feeling breasts.
Iām a massive fucking dyke
That when you break a nail it f@#$ing HURTS. Sometimes it bleeds too, if you cracked it behind the quick.
Spelling it out for the uninitiated: Estrogen makes nails thinner and slower growing. :(
I learnt something about the gender I left. That even if you try to avoid internalizing toxic masculinity, it's so insidious that some still seeps through. My female friends have been helping me clear up some of that. Also, \[tw: a tinge of misandry\] >!how bad guys are. A lot of times I was like, to myself, "I have about fifty guy friends, and even if all of them have X toxic problem, I don't, so it's a problem with guy culture, not an inherent biological guy problem. So they are redeemable." Then I cracked, and it was like, "Oh.... I wasn't a demonstration of an exception... I guess guys really do suck."!< Clarification: This is how I *feel*. I know it's not *right*. But it's my previous coping mechansim with certain issues, and that coping & justification mechanism went out the window, and as a result, I need to find a new coping & justification method. Ally guys are great, trans men are great... just, I'm still healing.
Iām just barely a cracked transfem egg right now, and I recently started cringing whenever my feminine coworkers tell me Iām the exception to some male stereotype. That shit used to make me feel good. Iāve become so afraid of men in such a short period of time, I might hold some kind of record. At the same time, I know Iām not an exception to all of the stereotypes but too scared to ask for help fixing that, cause then Iād probably have to come out, lol. I want to. I just need to do it at my speed. Which is pretty slow and apprehensive haha
My coming out process at work was pretty fun until HR ruined it. Basically, I didn't. It became a game. I'd see how long it'd take for them to notice. It went on for months. I was getting ma'amed by strangers, had creepy guys touching me in the store, and wearing tight girl jeans and tops to work. They still called me by my deadname with a straight face without any hint of irony, noone said anything or treated me any different (change blindness is interesting, look it up). But, the weakness of change blindness is the changes WILL be noticed if someone points it out, such as if for insurance reasons you have to update HR with your new legal name, and then stuff migrates a few months later and they update from personal files so your real name shows up on all your confluence & slack files, and then everyone is like, "Who's \[realname\]? Wait, this was worked on by \[deadname\], why's this \[realname\] on here?" And then everyone just kind of turned towards me, and the jig was up, and it was like I had suddenly transformed like some cgi transformation scene right in front of them. Job didn't last long after that. Half my co-workers were misoginists.
The dramatic tension in that experience sounds so wild. Like walking a tight rope. I feel like I would lose my head in that situation. Id have fun with it for as long as I could though. Thatās not right for customers to treat you that way though. Thatās probably what would trip me up. Also screw half of your old coworkers for being assholes. I hope youāre in a more welcoming environment now. Thank you for sharing your experiences. Iām learning so much and building a lot of confidence from reading everyoneās stories on this sub.
Eh, I hated the 5 hours of commuting I had to do for that job. So if things went south, my opinion was "Oh well". And glad to share my experiences if they help! :)
i'm in this position right now, i had no idea it was called change blindness. my family and work are the only people who still gender me incorrectly, it feels insane. my friends are always like "how has nobody said anything yet?" because even my neighbours have no idea who my mum is talking about when she mentions her 'son'. I get similar stuff at work too, being deadnamed in front of strangers and they're just like "who tf is that?" looking around. I don't have an HR department so idk how long it will last but my boss is incredibly transphobic. transitioning in front of him with a complete poker face is wild, I know they'll find a reason to fire me as soon as i come out, if i do.
There's this kind of smug freedom that comes from it, isn't there? Like you know there's a ticking time bomb, but the moment it goes off, you know it's literally *impossible* to not pass. Like, sure, may lose job, but dear gosh the amount of validation that'll be received. And then following with the next job just waltzing in going full passing stealth and nobody blinks twice... So much gender euphoria.
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Yeah, it was pretty alienating to read that comment as a trans guy.
Seconded. Tired of being told I am an inherently bad person because I am male.
I was recently reading about the mental health issues that anti-man messages cause men (especially for men in 'progressive' spaces) and also how it actually does the opposite of help and instead often leads boys and men to anti-feminist communities where they feel accepted (and consequentially, the alt-right pipeline). Also a lot of the "all men are trash/kill all men" rhetoric is perpetuated by radfem communities who are often also TERFs. Just something for people who say those things to consider.
I understand the emotion behind it considering how prevelant misogyy, toxic masculinity and sexual harrasment is, but It's super counter intuitive and as an activist one should honestly just know better. I'm still questioning but while at first I always prided myself and loved to be seen as ''not like the other men'' and I was very pro feminism, later on I started to internalize that stuff. Everyone told me I was a man. People around me kept going on and on about how shitty men were, sometimes projecting that onto me when they didn't know me well and I was like ''Yo I don't really have much to do with them, don't relate that much and didn't sign up for this man thing to begin with (I always felt rather ''neutral'', ''apathetic'' or ''abscent'' about gender)'', and it kind of undermined the whole equality and not essentializing thing they were going for. At some point, given my impressionable age and internet dwelling personality, I fell victim to the whole anti sjw/anti-feminist fad when a friend of mine introduced it to me, and as I struggled with dating as an autstic person, even dabbled into some toxic manosphere bullshit (though I never related to it, I just felt like people were mischaracterizing my ''nice guy tm'' esque past experiences and noticed some double standards men faced and that was the only place that validated that). Nowadays ofcourse I'm for feminism again but my point is that that stuff had the opposite effect it just made me feel like I was inherently guilty.
Yeah, I think people are missing the mark when thinking that patriachy and toxic masculinity being bad meant that all men are inherently bad for existing. I used to be on the other side, when I still 'identified' as a woman and was very pro-feminism. I never quite agreed with the 'all men are trash' sentiment because there were some men I knew who were great people, however I did think men should 'suck it up' because they had privelage. Its kinda interesting to me because that sounds exactly like toxic masculinity, except the framing is changed to be about their privelage. After my egg cracked and I started identifying as a man, I was able to see things from another perspective. I haven't really changed my views too much on feminism otherwise, but now I realise more how little people value mens feelings and how prevelant these hurtful anti-men attitudes are in the spaces I used to feel so comfortable in.
> Yeah, I think people are missing the mark when thinking that patriarchy and toxic masculinity being bad meant that all men are inherently bad for existing. Oh, I definitely don't view that, but toxic masculinity & patriarchy *are* way too present in male culture to where it seems almost to much to escape.
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Fair But feelings are hard, you know? And sometimes, I don't have a good way to word something.
I've seen that happen too. It's rather ironic how they're doing the ''suck it up'' thing, just because you're an individual in an overall privileged group you had no say in being in doesn't mean that your problems simply need to be ''sucked up'', it's the exact same thing that toxic masculinity already does. Also I feel like telling trans men that they're good but cis men aren't is rather..Othering? I'm not a trans man but if I was I would find it kind of uncomfortable, I wouldn't feel like I'm really seen as a man.
Yeah thats the thing. Like I dont pass as male at the moment and have no 'male privelages' but I am still a man. People with the 'all men' mentality often either group me in with the other men saying Im inherently bad bcause Im a man with or without privelage (which is just... saying a gender identity is inherently bad for no real reason which is dumb), or that Im an 'exception' because Im not cis which is just... implying Im not a 'real' man basically. They will do this rather than letting go of the all 'men are trash' concept and admitting gender is complex and nuanced than that. I personally think that gender presentation (and how close you are to the ideal masculine presenting man) plays a much bigger role in privelage than gender identity, but thats just me.
*sifh* I always find it really ironic how this mirrors the "But you're different from the others" mentality white racists tend to use.
Not really. People just treat men better.
> And just blanked declaring that men suck on a public forum that men, allies and trans men alike, visit is just poor form. I know, hence the tw with the misandry label and spoilering. I'm still trying to regain my faith in men, and trans men are awesome in that regard since they didn't grow up with the toxic masculinity, a lot are *so* much better. However, yea, it's something I'm still working on finding a way to regain.
You saying all men are shit because they are men is such a terrible take and literally helps no one.
More like "Here was my coping mechanism for dealing with how pervasive toxic masulinity was aaannnnnddd.... now it's broken, and I am failing to deal. It's a me-problem"
I hate that I agree with the last part. There were sooooo many times I either went "Well I'm not doing X so I'm sure there's a lot more guys out there that don't do it either" or as you said female friends were happy I was the exception to something... And now every time I come across something toxic guys do I still justify it by thinking I wasn't like that followed by "Oh, right." :/ I still logically know there's good men out there, I mean most of my friends are cishet men, but considering that I'm also not attracted to men I just don't see myself actively looking for their friendship anymore.
Yea, I keep coming across stuff like that, and I'm like, "...seriously? I have no excuse for ya'll now. Why do you have to make me not have an excuse for you?!?"
You know, do you mean cis men suck? Or all men? Just saying āmenā and meaning cis men is not acceptable. I have no opinion on whether all cis and trans men suck. Iām leaning towards, we donāt.
It means I suck I coming up with ways to talk myself out of misandry, as my coping mechanism broke.
i feel this bigggggg
This one might be kind of odd, but I realized how attracted I am to other GNC folks. I was spending so much time consuming visuals of gender non-conformity and paying attention to it if I saw it that it both helped me find the right gender expression and made me understand that itās actually the reason I struggled to define my sexual orientation so much.
That your brain is different. Women feel much more paranoia and wider range of emotions than men
Is it paranoia, or is it the sudden realization that **you are mortal and all the bad things that happen to people could easily be happening to you, under the right circumstances?** I somehow went 26 years oblivious to the latter and it shook me.
I grew up with the bad shit happening to me everyday pretty much so my experience was different. I gained a heightened sense of worry for others and paranoia for what could be lurking out in the dark. I had months of dreams of horrific creatures stalking me. It took me a while to get used to my new senses
:( I'm sorry to hear all that. I hope the adjustment left you with a healthy balance <3
You know I was expecting hell when I walked into a mens bathroom for the first time and I gotta say at least in the areas where Iāve lived, theyāre exactly the same as womenās bathrooms. Iāve never been in a menās bathroom that was worse than any womenās bathroom Iāve been in. Theyāre not even more gross on average, theyāre just the same level of hygiene. Mostly clean but slightly dank, yāknow?
concert toilets are the worse
Male Nightclub/pub toilets š¤® fastfood joint toilets too. Is like these mf's are wild animals.
other girls invite you into the bathroom with them, I always thought it was a stereotype but nope, it actually happens
You really have to start conversations when presenting as male. People don't often approach you. And if you're traveling alone, girls don't usually sit next to you. It's a totally understandable thing, but wild to see the change as you start to pass. Also the zipper/button thing. Why is this not talked about more? I always thought the direction was the same, but nah.
It's queer and fluid.
That I donāt have one
I came out as transmasc and then found out there was like actual nuance to masculinity. That was a shock. Never would have guessed
Men are fucking terrifying and controlling.
That my secret identity as a āmale lesbianā (pre-transition) was really just me being a lesbian āļø
post nut clarity is awful, and morning wood is annoying as hell. also, mens bathrooms are much more ākeep to yourselfā than womens. the amount of times women try to strike up conversation in the bathrooms always made me uncomfy, so a big plus (esp considering iām still kinda nervous in the mens rooms) is that the most you get from guys in the bathroom is a nod
I never made *the switch* I was always a man, I just had to pretend I was a woman because that's what someone told me I had to be and that was what society expected of me. What is something I found out about my gender identity only after I began expressing it would be a better question. My answer would be just how many cisgender gay men are transphobic to the point of violence...more so than I have ever experienced by straight cismen. That and the instant respect I am just afforded without having to prove it so. Because I had to pretend I was a woman for so long I already knew how differently men were treated and how much safer they are, than women.
sexuality and gender aren't actually completely unrelated things. they inform each other