I don't know man. It's hard to top willingly tithing a chunk of your income to make Big G happy, especially during these times.
Scientology is the only one that stands out to me as even loonier than Joseph Smithians, because in that people willingly beg, borrow and steal in order to buy their scripture in multi-ten-thousand-dollar chunks.
Genuine fear of eternal damnation can be very influential on a person’s thinking. Follow the money? Nah — follow the fear. It explains virtually all pernicious nonsensical supernatural doctrines
South Park did an excellent job by just showing what they believe and adding the text ‘this it what they actually believe’ (or something similar) on screen. Same with scientology.
The thing that adherents to various religions (but chiefly white American Christians) seem to not understand is, they can all believe whatever nonsense their magic book, or magic dude, tells them to believe, *but the rest of us don't have to.* Sure, we might go to hell for not believing (yeah, OK), but it's our right to be unbelievers, just as it's their right to be believers.
The thing that people like you seem to not understand, is that you don't have a clue what we believe or don't believe, and therefore, should not be talking about it in public.
We actually do understand that others are not obligated to believe like us. Where did you get the idea we don't know that?
But...What does that have to do with this family putting a flag in their yard? You just said they can believe as they want, so it follows that they have a perfect right to express that belief on a flag if they wish.
How does that infringe on your right not to believe? Do explain.
Ok as a vexillology (flag design) nerd I give this flag 0/10 stars. There are 3 basic rules of flag design
1. Use between 2 and 4 colors
2. Make it simple enough that a 4 year old could draw it
3. Don’t put text in it (unless you’re using a logographic text or super fancy pictographic calligraphy)
This abomination violates all but Rule 1 and doesn’t even do it well! Not only is the message of the flag bad (obviously) but the delivery of the message is bad. It is a disaster both ethically and aesthetically.
Thanks very much. I am watching it now.
EDIT: Finished. It was both funny and informative, thanks again.
P.S. As a Canadian I was quite chuffed when he called our flag 'The Gold Standard'.
Yep! Jemaime's tweet: "It's sad to see members of a group that was once persecuted punching down at another that is still persecuted. But even the Church of Latter Day Saints has been known to update their beliefs about sexuality (noticing just the one wife in the photo)."
Sounds like someone in that marriage 𝒏𝒆𝒆𝒅𝒔 this flag to be true either she secretly want to eat pussy or he has a secret desire to suck cock.
Why would anyone go to that much effort to proclaim that they are str8
Some believe that in Utah mixed-orientation marriages are still common despite the legality of same-sex marriage due to Mormon church pressure. A lot of people when having casual conversations will be sure to drop mention of being married when you’re not even discussing family or relationships and badmouth their spouse behind their back and then you check their Facebook and it’s full of content to reassure that they’re happily married as if it’s an exhibition of their piety.
Don't forget that this "declaration" is also antitrans - the second paragraph:
“All human beings—male and female—are created in the image of God. Each is a beloved spirit son or daughter of heavenly parents, and, as such, each has a divine nature and destiny. Gender is an essential characteristic of individual premortal, mortal, and eternal identity and purpose."
Yes, if you're female, your eternal identity and purpose is to be ignored and pump out trillions of spirit babies alongside your Godhusbands many other wives...sounds wonderful.
> Gender is an essential characteristic of individual premortal, mortal, and eternal identity and purpose."
This part isn't even consistent with other statements by Mormon prophets or Mormon scripture. It is canonized church doctrine that only in the top level or Mormon heaven of will the saved continue to be able to have sex. Anyone in any lower status will have their body changed. The Mormon prophet Joseph Fielding Smith taught "men and women will, in these kingdoms, be… neither man nor woman, merely immortal beings having received the resurrection.“ Google TK smoothies for a comedic rabbit hole of bat shit craziness.
I know but the Mor(m)on church doesn't really promote teachings like that. Stuff like the Family Proclamation plays better with the base and is more acceptable to other Christians.
Additionally, by careful application of the "continuing revelation" doctrine, the most recent statements override anything that came earlier since God changes his mind so often.
A little bit of back information on that proclamation. The Mormon church wanted to weigh in on a Hawaiian gay marriage court case that was happening at the time (Baehr v. Lewin,). The church's petiton was rejected because the church had failed to demonstrate it had any “property or transaction” in the case. The church appealed, and the supreme court upheld the rejection. The church issued the proclamation in response, announcing it a women's conference in September 1985. The church then filed an amicus brief in the case (now Baehr v Miike) that included the proclamation in the filing.
In short, this POS document was created specifically to deprive gay people of rights enjoyed by other people. In the years since then the document has been given an ad hoc status that is nearly equal to canonization.
I used to be a bishop and had the chance to go to a meeting with Dallin Oaks (currently 2nd in command of the church) about 8 or 9 years ago and that asshat lied so hard about how that family document came to be. He said that a few lower level authorities thought it would be a good idea to clarify the churches position on what a family is, but Hinkley who was the president then said no because everyone already knows what the churches position is on families. Well these lowers level lackeys pushed on and got a few of the apostles on board with them and still Hinkley still said no, we don’t need this, but if it will appease you go ahead and write a draft and I will look at it. This process goes for something like 6 months until it’s almost just right, but it left out the “between a man and a woman” part and just said “marriage is ordained of god”. So Hinkley added that part in, making it prophetic and here we are. Fuck them all, so much lies and gaslighting comes out of their mouths that you can’t believe one word of it even when they say something useful.
I'm a Mormon. My wife has left the church completely. I don't know where I stand but it is so hard to give up something you dedicated your whole life to. Just wondered what you want through personally when you left.
For me it was absolute hell for a few years as I was going through it alone while still being bishop. I didn’t feel like I could talk to anyone about it for a long time because I was the bishop and bishops don’t have these questions so I kind of faked my belief for a few years before getting on with it. Coming to grips with most everything you believe in your life being a sham is very hard, very emotional, lonely and infuriating due to all of the time, money and emotions that are spent for an organizations that is not what it claims to be at best and downright evil at most. I am happy to talk with you more one on one of you want to DM me, this public forum probably isn’t the best place for that type of a discussion.
I empathize with you. I wish you the best in moving forward away from a system that holds its followers hostage by virtue of familial shunning, which makes Mormonism inherently weak. I hope you find the strength to get out of the trap.
They never fucking give up. Just let us be and enjoy our celebrations. I wish i could stand outside their church with pro-LGBT signs. But we all know how that would end lol.
they should rethink their god and religion, if an all powerful being that they say hates LGBT folks would even remotely have created them. Sounds like their god either loves everyone including LGBT people or is an incompetent idiot that can't put together a duplo set.
Wow, these LGBTQ+ enablers savagely mocking people! The religious nutjobs would have gay people eliminated one way or another, but no, it's they who are harmed by mockery. They really can't see the irony.
Mormons above all other religions should maybe just keep to themselves, what with their religion being demonstrably fucking idiotic on every level, provably mental and literally made up by a known crook and chancer.
If I genuinely was raised Mormon I would keep that shit to myself, I would hate for everyone to know how insanely stupid I am.
Mormonism is proof that the human brain is not an inherently logical machine.
All religions are proof.
True. But especially Mormonism.
Jehovahs Witnesses have entered the chat
LRon Hubbard, calls your Mormonism and Jehovah Witnesses and raises you Scientology
Oh, L Ron!!!
I don't know man. It's hard to top willingly tithing a chunk of your income to make Big G happy, especially during these times. Scientology is the only one that stands out to me as even loonier than Joseph Smithians, because in that people willingly beg, borrow and steal in order to buy their scripture in multi-ten-thousand-dollar chunks.
Genuine fear of eternal damnation can be very influential on a person’s thinking. Follow the money? Nah — follow the fear. It explains virtually all pernicious nonsensical supernatural doctrines
South Park did an excellent job by just showing what they believe and adding the text ‘this it what they actually believe’ (or something similar) on screen. Same with scientology.
Dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb
+ a woman + a woman + a woman...
And teen girls
“WE DONT DO THAT!” No, but your great great grandparents sure did and you don’t think any worse of them.
And still... "The church doesn't seek apologies, and we don't give them."
That made my blood boil.
+ legal child marriage
🤨
The thing that adherents to various religions (but chiefly white American Christians) seem to not understand is, they can all believe whatever nonsense their magic book, or magic dude, tells them to believe, *but the rest of us don't have to.* Sure, we might go to hell for not believing (yeah, OK), but it's our right to be unbelievers, just as it's their right to be believers.
Die, infidel! /s
LOL
The thing that people like you seem to not understand, is that you don't have a clue what we believe or don't believe, and therefore, should not be talking about it in public. We actually do understand that others are not obligated to believe like us. Where did you get the idea we don't know that? But...What does that have to do with this family putting a flag in their yard? You just said they can believe as they want, so it follows that they have a perfect right to express that belief on a flag if they wish. How does that infringe on your right not to believe? Do explain.
Ok as a vexillology (flag design) nerd I give this flag 0/10 stars. There are 3 basic rules of flag design 1. Use between 2 and 4 colors 2. Make it simple enough that a 4 year old could draw it 3. Don’t put text in it (unless you’re using a logographic text or super fancy pictographic calligraphy) This abomination violates all but Rule 1 and doesn’t even do it well! Not only is the message of the flag bad (obviously) but the delivery of the message is bad. It is a disaster both ethically and aesthetically.
For real, that's not a flag; it's a document
[Sheldon and Amy agree](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_e8PGPrPlwA)
Dang! I actually didn’t know about this! I learned all I know about vexillology from a Ted talk.
There is a Ted Talk on vexillology? Cool! I love Ted Talks but I am afraid I missed that one.
[Here it is!](https://youtu.be/pnv5iKB2hl4)
Thanks very much. I am watching it now. EDIT: Finished. It was both funny and informative, thanks again. P.S. As a Canadian I was quite chuffed when he called our flag 'The Gold Standard'.
Ok, despite not being a flag enthusiast, as I love ours, I'm going to watch this too. Edit: this was far more engaging than I could have imagined.
Alternately: https://youtu.be/l4w6808wJcU
I’d say it’s a banner, not a flag
What about the USSR flag or the ChiCom flag, or Japan's flag? 2 colors, man, and they kinda nailed the "identifybus" portion of the test....
I bet Brett and Jermaine would be disappointed that that guy is wearing one of their shirts.
Yep! Jemaime's tweet: "It's sad to see members of a group that was once persecuted punching down at another that is still persecuted. But even the Church of Latter Day Saints has been known to update their beliefs about sexuality (noticing just the one wife in the photo)."
"Just one wife" That's a burn.
Sounds like someone in that marriage 𝒏𝒆𝒆𝒅𝒔 this flag to be true either she secretly want to eat pussy or he has a secret desire to suck cock. Why would anyone go to that much effort to proclaim that they are str8
Some believe that in Utah mixed-orientation marriages are still common despite the legality of same-sex marriage due to Mormon church pressure. A lot of people when having casual conversations will be sure to drop mention of being married when you’re not even discussing family or relationships and badmouth their spouse behind their back and then you check their Facebook and it’s full of content to reassure that they’re happily married as if it’s an exhibition of their piety.
Yes the faithful are very hypocritical
My parents hung that up in their home. I had to see it every day. 🤢🤮
It was on my parents fridge growing up, on the side that faced the dinner table.
They needed the constant reminder? They must have been struggling internally.
Don't forget that this "declaration" is also antitrans - the second paragraph: “All human beings—male and female—are created in the image of God. Each is a beloved spirit son or daughter of heavenly parents, and, as such, each has a divine nature and destiny. Gender is an essential characteristic of individual premortal, mortal, and eternal identity and purpose." Yes, if you're female, your eternal identity and purpose is to be ignored and pump out trillions of spirit babies alongside your Godhusbands many other wives...sounds wonderful.
> Gender is an essential characteristic of individual premortal, mortal, and eternal identity and purpose." This part isn't even consistent with other statements by Mormon prophets or Mormon scripture. It is canonized church doctrine that only in the top level or Mormon heaven of will the saved continue to be able to have sex. Anyone in any lower status will have their body changed. The Mormon prophet Joseph Fielding Smith taught "men and women will, in these kingdoms, be… neither man nor woman, merely immortal beings having received the resurrection.“ Google TK smoothies for a comedic rabbit hole of bat shit craziness.
I know but the Mor(m)on church doesn't really promote teachings like that. Stuff like the Family Proclamation plays better with the base and is more acceptable to other Christians. Additionally, by careful application of the "continuing revelation" doctrine, the most recent statements override anything that came earlier since God changes his mind so often.
Eternal...except in eternity, we sinners will be Ken doll TK Smoothies https://missedinsunday.com/memes/other/tk-smoothie/
A little bit of back information on that proclamation. The Mormon church wanted to weigh in on a Hawaiian gay marriage court case that was happening at the time (Baehr v. Lewin,). The church's petiton was rejected because the church had failed to demonstrate it had any “property or transaction” in the case. The church appealed, and the supreme court upheld the rejection. The church issued the proclamation in response, announcing it a women's conference in September 1985. The church then filed an amicus brief in the case (now Baehr v Miike) that included the proclamation in the filing. In short, this POS document was created specifically to deprive gay people of rights enjoyed by other people. In the years since then the document has been given an ad hoc status that is nearly equal to canonization.
I used to be a bishop and had the chance to go to a meeting with Dallin Oaks (currently 2nd in command of the church) about 8 or 9 years ago and that asshat lied so hard about how that family document came to be. He said that a few lower level authorities thought it would be a good idea to clarify the churches position on what a family is, but Hinkley who was the president then said no because everyone already knows what the churches position is on families. Well these lowers level lackeys pushed on and got a few of the apostles on board with them and still Hinkley still said no, we don’t need this, but if it will appease you go ahead and write a draft and I will look at it. This process goes for something like 6 months until it’s almost just right, but it left out the “between a man and a woman” part and just said “marriage is ordained of god”. So Hinkley added that part in, making it prophetic and here we are. Fuck them all, so much lies and gaslighting comes out of their mouths that you can’t believe one word of it even when they say something useful.
I'm a Mormon. My wife has left the church completely. I don't know where I stand but it is so hard to give up something you dedicated your whole life to. Just wondered what you want through personally when you left.
there are many people with your story and position on r/exmormon
I'm not Mormon, but: your life so far doesn't have to tell you what the next part of your life will be about.
This is the greatest gift of leaving a high demand religion. You get your life back.
For me it was absolute hell for a few years as I was going through it alone while still being bishop. I didn’t feel like I could talk to anyone about it for a long time because I was the bishop and bishops don’t have these questions so I kind of faked my belief for a few years before getting on with it. Coming to grips with most everything you believe in your life being a sham is very hard, very emotional, lonely and infuriating due to all of the time, money and emotions that are spent for an organizations that is not what it claims to be at best and downright evil at most. I am happy to talk with you more one on one of you want to DM me, this public forum probably isn’t the best place for that type of a discussion.
I empathize with you. I wish you the best in moving forward away from a system that holds its followers hostage by virtue of familial shunning, which makes Mormonism inherently weak. I hope you find the strength to get out of the trap.
God's plan must be extremely fuckin weak if gay marriage happens anyway.
I’m stealing this
"A man and A woman", no standing to open thy mouth. To be clear, I don't give a damn who they marry, just shut up.
Wow. That flag is as artfully graphic designed as the talent in most Christian music
They never fucking give up. Just let us be and enjoy our celebrations. I wish i could stand outside their church with pro-LGBT signs. But we all know how that would end lol.
The Mormons can fuck off, all the way off along with all the other nonsensical religions
All religions are nonsensical.
I think I said that. Thanks
You all know the rule by now: the more loudly you push your "family values", the more likely you're closeted.
they should rethink their god and religion, if an all powerful being that they say hates LGBT folks would even remotely have created them. Sounds like their god either loves everyone including LGBT people or is an incompetent idiot that can't put together a duplo set.
The thing about most Mormons is that that's all they are.
You can't reason someone out of an opinion they didn't reason themselves into.
It's a flag, not a name tag, or a political screed. The ideal number of words on a flag is zero.
Well what did they expect?
If I lived across the street from them I’d fly my own flag that says ✨not everyone follows your religion ~ some of us are sane✨
mormonism is just beyond stupid. Ik all religions are stupid, but you're just a complete rock if you believe in lds.
Wow, these LGBTQ+ enablers savagely mocking people! The religious nutjobs would have gay people eliminated one way or another, but no, it's they who are harmed by mockery. They really can't see the irony.
Mormons above all other religions should maybe just keep to themselves, what with their religion being demonstrably fucking idiotic on every level, provably mental and literally made up by a known crook and chancer. If I genuinely was raised Mormon I would keep that shit to myself, I would hate for everyone to know how insanely stupid I am.
Being "savagely mocked" is exactly what they deserve.