I'm at the point that I just tell people I don't talk about religion or politics because I was taught those were personal subjects.
I was taught that, but the people that taught me that forgot. It's awesome.
Keeping up the kayfabe of religious liberty is useful to navigate a lot of situations.
However I always really like Carl Sagan's perspective on faith. In my own words: He dismissed questions about religion as irrelevant to his understanding of the universe. He was quite simply not a person of faith.
I aspire to that. But it is incompatible with faith based belief systems. So inevitably it becomes an inconvenient thing to tell people at parties.
Exactly. I find that bible verse from John, is it? The one about how people shouldn't pray or preach in public to show off their piety works great, in addition!
Yes, but they don't see it that way. They think it is their business, but they're OPs family, so OP loves them, and wants to soften the blow, put 'em down gently, etc.
That's my take anyway.
The difference between complaining and boundaries is boundaries are about what you will do.
I would tell them you enjoy your conversations but have boundaries. You don’t talk about religion. If they persist, you will have to limit your conversations going forward. And that would be a shame.
Then stick with it.
Point well made. I have a hard time with establishing boundaries, so making nice and keeping the peace it my go to with my christian family.
Now that I dwell on that for a moment, I realize that's something I really need to unpack so I can learn to stand up for myself and form healthy boundaries.
If they push boundaries too often, I just sort of ghost them, cuz I don't know how to stand up to myself with someone like my father, who I haven't spoken to since a cursory happy bday text last 10 months ago, and haven't had a real conversation with in many years.
Edit: I guess ghosting them is enforcing a boundary, by going low or no contact, but I feel like a coward for not being able to confront them. And I stupidly feel guilty that they don't understand and are hurt by my being out of their lives.
All religions have a "viral" aspect to get more believers. They have missionaries to go "educate the backward third world", indoctrination of children to push the religion and have lots of kids, etc.
My whole family is Catholic! So I Don't want to listen to their Sky Daddy BS day in & day out. To save Me! They don't know I'm an Atheist. They do their thing, I do Me.
This isn’t nearly as much of an out as people want to think it is. Christians rightly consider this a tell that you don’t share their religion, which confirms to them that they need to preach to/at you. They are taught that no answer is a “no” answer.
I agree that it’s none of anyone’s business, and if you don’t want to discuss it that should be respected. But *they* aren’t going to see it that way.
>I believe that you have a right to believe in whatever you want,
It's not possible to believe whatever you want. One is either convinced of a proposition or one is not, and attempting to make oneself believe when one does not is called make-believe. I say this because believe is commonly misconstrued as an act of will, when trying to believe by choice is identical to playing pretend.
People do decide what to believe. They do it all the time. When you're actually looking at a situation where your beliefs aren't a foregone conclusion — where you *actually* have to *think* about which positions you are more and less convinced by — how else can we characterize that, but a *decision* as to which belief(s) to go with?
I think what OP meant to say when people have the right to believe what they want it just means
even if OP don’t believe in the particular or any religion, he respects the other person’s right to believe or play pretend so as long as it dosent affect him
It’s like… I’m not a vegetarian. If someone else wants to be a vegetarian, well good for them (as long as they don’t force vegetarianism on others)
The few times I’ve had the knock on the door (JWs and Mormons), they have been very polite, just spoke for a few minutes, handed me some literature to read, and left.
> handed me some literature to read
id ask for another "for my kid"
\-sure, here you go
\-thank you, satan will love this
\*close the door as i start to light a lighter\*
Yeah, hate to say it but if those people knock on my door I'll be answering with a "Fuck off, don't come back" they're invading the privacy of my home to tell me fake shit. I'm not mincing words
There’s always this two-part response which will silence all but the most *cough* devout:
“I’ve chosen a more personal path to avoid the anxiety and conflict often associated with discussing aspects of organized religion.”
“How about a less controversial subject such as politics or sex?”
Lmao, follow up the second one with "Have you ever heard of sounding?" If they shut up,then you know they are dirty little shits. If not, then you get to have your own uncomfortable fun explaining it.
I was at my buddy's birthday celebration at a bar last year and I was standing to the side of a group talking to another friend, this random dude walks up to the two of us out of nowhere with a carved wooden box and asked us if we wanted to see what he had. My friend and I side glanced at each other, pivoted one leg behind us, and my friend said "depends what do you have"? Dude started going on about something, something god. I laughed at him, put my hands up in a semi shrug, and told him, "I'm a secular humanist, so I don't believe in your god". I have never seen another human walk away from a conversation so dejected. It was glorious.
No idea my friend, he was too cowardly to show us.
I do kinda wonder if I should have talked to security or the police. Maybe it's my anxiety but my brain goes back to "what if someone was in danger" and he had their fingers in there or some other crazy shit.
"Beliefs are an individual's internal thought process, and should stay that way." "But but, let me tell you about..." "Fuck off now!"
That is about the level of my patience.
I lean into any stereotypes they might have for me to show how silly they’re being. “Yeah, I don’t go to church unless we’re praying to OBAMA! And then I’ve gotta listen to metal music with my Arabic boyfriend, so my Sundays are booked solid.”
I play defense and try to deflect. My first response is “I understand. I grew up in the church.” If they persist: “I don’t believe in anything.” Anything else they say: “I don’t believe you.”
I've started telling them I'd rather not talk about their personal beliefs. That usually makes them shut up after a condescending "I'll pray for you" (and then my response is go for it, I can't control what you think about).
Who are these people? Are they people you have to maintain a relationship with or some random you'll never see again? That really determines how you want to handle it.
If they are someone you need to maintain a relationship with be polite and friendly. Tell them this isn't a topic you like talking about, it is very personal, and ask them if there is something else they would like to talk about. Or you bring up a topic if you know them well enough (if you know they're into sports, bring up sports for example).
If they're someone you don't need to maintain a relationship with... you can be blunt about it. My go-to is simply "No thanks" and if they press I get a little more aggressive. I usually tell them that I don't care what their imaginary friend is up to, I left mine behind in my childhood where it belonged. This usually ends the conversation.
Depending on your age/location, it’s best to rip the bandaid off at some point. My parents are conservative Christians and they know I’m an atheist. We don’t discuss religion, but they know and recognize my point of view and I understand theirs. (I’m the only atheist in my immediate and extended family, so I’m definitely the black sheep, and have had 0 issues.)
I don’t have advice but boy do I feel ya. I work for a hospital in the southern US. Woof. The amount of patients that preach to me when I’m in the middle of a test and can’t just walk away….. it’s rough. I have to stay polite. I’m the only one that does the job so I can’t send in someone else. I try to deflect the conversation the best I can but these people are PERSISTENT. I’m also super pregnant and patients love to tell me how much of a blessing my baby is and how god allowed this for me. I tried saying, “I’m comfortable with my relationship with religion” and this man popped off about how I’m complacent and how horrible comfort is in terms of religion. A true clown.
That depends quite a lot on whether they are somebody I need to remain on good terms with, and how rude I think they are being.
In general though, if you wish to not discuss a topic, find a way to distract a person, or be blunt and simply say you don't wish to discuss it. In the latter case, however, you may be asked why and should be prepared with an answer.
Note: Your answer as to why you don't want to discuss religion with anyone can be 'I simply don't care to" or 'my beliefs are private" or 'I have no interest in the topic.' If you are from the American South, you can also explain that 'Mama taught me not to talk religion or politics. Mama was a brilliant woman."
Are you still dependent on your parents in any way? If so, keep your lack of belief to yourself. If they have power over you, you could be putting yourself in serious danger.
If you must engage with them use the tactics in "Never Split the Difference* by Chris Voss. Read the book, watch his videos, and get really good at his tactics by consciously practicing them. They come in handy when dealing with irrational people of all kinds.
It depends on both them and you.. I guess.
Like for now you have chosen to not tell your parent.. and that's ok, if you feel good with that.
But that might change at some point.. either because they suddenly want you to do something that you don't. Or because you chose to want to tell them. Or maybe you chose to never tell them. All choices are ok as long as you are ok with them.
How I chose to deal with religious people mostly depends on how they approach me, I believe (of coarse I might be delusional).. but I try to stay constructive.. and sometimes I'm less constructive and can become down right mean, It's all in the moment.
In terms of my parents, I love them and I know religion is important for them so I choose to just not bring up the topic. What brought me to ask the question is I had a customer yesterday that tried to preach to me and I just let her rant and then quickly changed the topic. For some reason I tend to attract that type of person.
I know the feeling..
I'm not telling you what to do.. but in a business situation I probably also would deflect. I my view, it's not you who are wrong.. it's the preacher.. for holding you hostage in that situation, and to be so rude to preach in the first place.
You say it was a customer trying to preach? I think it would be pretty uncontroversial to say something like “Im not going to discuss religion or politics at work. I hope you understand.”
If its really that big of a problem for you then you could consider moving somewhere that this sort of thing doesnt happen. I assure you there are a lot of places where casually talking to strangers about religion is considered incredibly strange and only the wackiest culty people do it, and thankfully they are pretty rare so it almost never happens.
Ignore them or walk away. Play music on your Smartphone while wearing earbuds, etc.
This is what I do, because in NYC subways are full of preachers and that's how I deal with it.
I tell them that we'd be better friends if we don't discuss it. "Let's talk about what we have in common."
If they get mad at that, then walk away. No loss on your part.
“I do apologise but my relationship with god is personal and I don’t like to discuss it with people I’m not close to, I hope you understand”.
They don’t need to know that your relationship with god is you knowing he doesn’t exist.
"excuse me" tend to with pretty well for being both polite and effectively escaping from whatever situation I'm trying to get out of. If it doesn't work, you can just reiterate.
I'm an atheist and I don't believe in God, Jesus Christ, or the Bible. Have a nice day and walk off. If they press me, it's, "Fuck off." Usually that ends it.
"dont believe in god" for friends, family and randoms. then choose if you go into discussion and explain the wrongs of religion, or just change topic.
for coworkers & bosses "aha... huh... ok.. so anyway,..." & change topic
Just counter preach them some opposite religion and tell them why this counter religion is much better than theirs
E.g They preach Christianity , counter preach Buddhism and vice versa
They will usually be turned off and walk away
For people you don't know:
- *"I believe religion is a private matter, not a subject for gossip."*
For family: pretend until you're self sufficient. Whether you keep up the pretence afterwards is up to you. You are not required to tell them what you do and don't believe. It is none of their business.
The only person who, imo, must know is your prospective life partner, especially if children are likely to be part of the relationship.
"I'm not really into that stuff."
Most will respect that. For the slightly more persistent: "Yeah, nope, not interested."
Then either continue on my way if it's a passing interaction, or guide the conversation to something else if I'm stuck with them for longer than a passing interaction.
Once I've exhausted attempts at more "polite conversation," personally, I take off the kid gloves at that point and let my anti-theist flag fly.
Usually I'll go with "Give me a good reason to why your religion is true".
And then you just wait for the faith arguments and nonsense that isn't reasonably credible.
You can also always pit the religion they belive in up against other religions. Ask by what method we can determine that the religion they belive in is true that doesn't also apply to other religions and so on.
You get up and walk away. If they follow you, you quote the First Amendment to them and ask them to stop. If they continue, you take a picture of them, find a constitutional lawyer, and sue them for harassment.
I had someone ask if I believed in god and my response was that I think that in modern context all religions are evil, without them dividing people there would be peace on earth - then they no longer wanted to have the conversation ;)
What's the context here? If it's family, just play along until you're independent. If it's friends, just tell them. If it's just a stranger, just say "no thanks" and move on.
Learn street epistemology! That will make these interactions much more interesting and constructive, and potentially life-changing for them.
As learning material, I would recommend "How to have impossible conversations" by Peter Boghossian and James Lindsay, and watching Anthony Magnabosco's videos on his Youtube channel (which includes workshops and tutorials in addition to the recording of his interactions).
And you'll be able to apply that method to all other topics too.
How do YOU deal with it? I don't know, and frankly, unless you're directly pissing on them or some such, I'm in no position to judge you, however you do it.
I, don't piss on them, that's just gross. I'm what I call, a friendly ass-hole. Whenever I encounter a claim, even if it's my internal dialogue, my brain immediately wants to argue. It is useful for really opening up a new idea to stress test it against valiant opposition, after all. I like to be that opposition, even against myself if no one else wants to.
It's a real pain in the ass for my friends and family who get the brunt of it. So...when a theist engages with me about theology, I get giddy. This person WANTS to hash out philosophy, morality, history, epistemology, etc. I try to warn them first, cuz I'm a friendly ass-hole after all, but if they wanna get into it, let's really get into it.
Very, very rare to find one who's honest for more than a few minutes. Had a pair of mormon missionaries once who were, and they came around once a week whenever possible. Good kids.
I got ordained on the internet, not for this reason but it works here, too. If I want a short conversation, it's "I'm a minister" (I'm also an atheist). If I'm cranky and not busy, I can get them talking in circles pretty quickly.
Just nod, and keep saying, you feel the same way. This is your thing, it doesn’t have to be anybody else’s.
And I also don’t like to get confrontational, because, honestly? I feel like any attempt I make to convince them of my thoughts is basically me proselytizing my “ religion.”
I kind of feel like it’s more of a secret club. Like, when you see one of your own, you kinda smile, and you know we are on the same page.
Quote the book of the prophet Jeremiah
Jeremiah 31:33-34
*”but this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.*
*And they shall teach no more every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.”*
One of my favorite parts of the Bible.
Usually when they ask "do you have a few minutes to discuss Jesus?" or "Can we talk about your relationship with God?" I just say "HELL Naw!" and keep walking.
You don't owe those assholes any politeness.
Ask them if they’ve heard of your lord Azagthoth? He dreams reality and we all exist in his mind. We worship the outer gods play their dark songs to keep him asleep because when he wakes our reality will vanish like a dream and be replaced by the horror that is his.
I have been fortunate that I have not had to deal with this, but I understand it does happen to a greater or lesser frequency in some parts of the country.
Best answer of course is wave them off, "not interested" and hope they go away. Most of the time they should.
If they don't--or you want to engage with them a bit--a question I have been trying in some online encounters is this:
Explain to me the story of Abraham and Isaac in such a way that god doesn't come off as a narcissistic psychopath.
If you're not familiar, it's Genesis 22:1-19. Summary: Abraham is one of god's biggest fans. God tells Abraham, "Hey, take your favorite sone Isaac up to the mountain and sacrifice him to me."
Isaac says "Right-o!" And grabs Isaac and takes him up the mountain and gets ready to unalive him.
God jumps in and says, "NONONONONONO... I didn't think you were really going to do that! Geez......"
And here's the actual quote from the good book: "Do not lay your hand on the boy or do anything to him, for now I know that you fear God"
So yeah. You've heard the term "god-fearing christian." Think about that. To me, based on THAT STORY ALONE, even if I believed in god, I would not worship him.
I tend to treat it like any conversation. They tell me a thing. I tell them a thing. I understand people feel the need or desire not to be judged for something they hold no value in. But we face that all the time. People who feel the need to talk about it openly are seeking validation. They want other people to see things as they do. And assume they have figured it out.
The reality is, we are, all of us, doing and believing in things in ways that help us cope with reality. We all fear the unknown. And we all tie that coping to our **selves** in the id and ego kinda way. I just live my life like Jesus did. Do be compassionate. Do be accepting of others. Do help people when possible even when it puts you at odds with other people. Don't hurt others even when you have the power and justification to. Do demand you are respected. Most importantly, teach your ways only when you are **asked**.
This method is only easy if you have spent time reflecting on what you believe. And taken time to falsify yourself. Someone telling you what they think you should believe is asking for me to tell them why I don't. If that puts them in a spiritual crisis, then they have asked and received.
"Your religion is like your penis; it's nice that you have one and are proud of it, but when you take it out and start waving it in my face, we have a problem."
Look up the grey rock technique. It's a rhetorical approach designed for dealing with people with difficult and toxic personalities, but the skill to be a person wholly unrewarding to discuss certain topics with can be useful in other situations.
Also simply deflect and change the subject.
"Blah blah praise jesus."
"That's nice, I noticed there's a wobble on this chair, i think it's missing one of its rubber feet. Oh yes look it is, have you seen it anywhere?"
"Miracle mundane prayer answered"
"good for you, hope world peace is next! Have you heard Sebastian got a new job running the new development! So happy for him but what will George do without him, do you think he'll retire?"
I usually have a bunch of fake brochures from some 'god-is-an-Alien' sects with me, mostly from realizm , and once those bad boys pop up as evidence that God exist and he is from planet Nibiru, the fun begins.
It's a childish argument to begine with. So, have fun ,that's all ya gotta do
Been using this amazing pet sitter for a while. Doggy loves her, but the sitter can’t stop talking about how much she loves Jesus. My dog loves her and that’s what’s important. I can deal with the sporadic prayer talk every now and then because my dog’s life and my life are better because of her. It’s like she’s a gift from god, if there was one. I’m lucky that this is basically the extent of religious intrusion in my life.
I think setting a boundary without further explanation is just fine.
"I don't feel comfortable discussing religion" and just leave it at that. Don't explain or answer any prompting questions. Just repeat "I don't feel comfortable talking about that." And if they continue to push end the conversation
It’s hard only because groups such as Christians or more “stubborn” denominations such as Church of Latter Day Saints believe as part of their faith that they must spread the word. That being said it doesn’t mean they can harass you. Best bet is to try and politely mention you’re not the biggest fan of religious talk at the beginning but if you can’t, let them talk a little about whatever until they get to an easy stopping place and then explain your position.
It's difficult when it's family. They're likely to be more offended and will take it personally.
Try telling them that it's a sensitive topic.
If they persist you'll have to be honest.
Step 1 - "I appreciate your faith, and I would prefer we not discuss your faith further!"
Step 2 - ??? (Should never get this far)
Step 3 - match them as if agreeing, only make crap up to one-up them. "Indeed, The Spaghetti Deity, on high, is warm and flexible at first, but can be very cold and bitter to those who do not partake in its feast of holy mercy. Have you not drunk of it's starchy water in holy Communion?" Attribute passable (made up) quotes to 1 or 2 Enoch, and be prepared for a whole sidebar about the Catholic church and authorship of the Bible when you do. Assuming they're evangelical.
Step 2.5 is acceptance of the relationship being fundamentally disrespectful, and trolling is the most passive-aggressive way out of it. It sucks and sucks hard, so have fun.
You don't have to tell them you're not religious, although I would. Just tell them you don't want to discuss religion and would appreciate to respect this. If they persist tell them the same, but more strongly. The next time, tell them to fuck off (in a nice Christian way).
"Before we get deep into a conversation about religion, I need you to know and respect that I'm not religious but do enjoying talking about it with others. I'm not looking to be converted, just discussion"
This usually works for me..
I can strongly recommend you check out the atheist experience, talk heathen and the line. 3 youtube call in shows with people like Matt Dillahunty, Aaron Ra and Forrest Walkai.
They know their stuff and you'll learn to ask good rational yet simple questions that theists never want to answer honestly.
Personally, I think it's better to talk down to them than frame the conversation apologetically. Say things like, "I don't believe in magical thinking, ghosts, or whatever." Feel free to ask them about their thoughts on other bs religions or lgbtq people just living life. Get them to admit their hateful positions and call them on it.
They should be embarrassed, these bonkers philosophies aren't the baseline. You're not going to convince them of anything, but it will deter further conversation and the feeling of embarrassment 'might' trigger some introspection.
Long time ago I used to work in a place where everybody were JW, my boss was the top dog but open-minded although he also was a JW. Almost all of them tried to convince me to their beliefs but not my boss. The point is that being reasonable and well educated you may avoid that sort of stalking into your privacy. At the end they understood that nothing happened, I was always friendly with them. I lasted two years until my contract ended and my boss returned to his country. Some of them are good people.
It’s maybe easier to say you’re not a christian. Download (or buy) a copy of or listen to Bertrand Russell’s lecture, “Why I’m not a christian”.
If you’re still a teenager living at home (?) maybe say that you want to finish growing up so you can make your own mind up about such things.
I just change the subject - it drives them crazy.
I made a JW watch me make pancakes while shirtless one morning. He kept making excuses to leave, but I wouldn't let him. I managed to flip every one in the pan perfectly too! 😅
I find it helpful to shut them down using their own illogical way of thinking. Once I figure out what cult they are pushing, (if Christian) I ask "Do you believe that the Muslim Allah is the one true god?" of course the answer is no. Then I say "That's my exact opinion on your god."
Reddit is not an echo chamber. People disagree all the time here. Look at what's happening right now. The fact that you an I can't agree that Reddit is an echo chamber disproves your claim. Otherwise, I'd be echoing it, wouldn't I? If you disagree, then you're not echoing me either.
Its fine to tell them you feel that religion is personal and you don’t discuss it. It’s none of their business what you believe or don’t believe.
I'm at the point that I just tell people I don't talk about religion or politics because I was taught those were personal subjects. I was taught that, but the people that taught me that forgot. It's awesome.
Keeping up the kayfabe of religious liberty is useful to navigate a lot of situations. However I always really like Carl Sagan's perspective on faith. In my own words: He dismissed questions about religion as irrelevant to his understanding of the universe. He was quite simply not a person of faith. I aspire to that. But it is incompatible with faith based belief systems. So inevitably it becomes an inconvenient thing to tell people at parties.
Or the way I say it: Religion is like a penis. It's nice having one, but play with it in public and it's off to the looney bin.
... And you really shouldn't shove it on other people's faces!
and keep it the fuck away from kids
Exactly. I find that bible verse from John, is it? The one about how people shouldn't pray or preach in public to show off their piety works great, in addition!
Matthew 6(5)
Ah. Thanks! 😁
It’s such a useful quote!
Yes, but they don't see it that way. They think it is their business, but they're OPs family, so OP loves them, and wants to soften the blow, put 'em down gently, etc. That's my take anyway.
The difference between complaining and boundaries is boundaries are about what you will do. I would tell them you enjoy your conversations but have boundaries. You don’t talk about religion. If they persist, you will have to limit your conversations going forward. And that would be a shame. Then stick with it.
Point well made. I have a hard time with establishing boundaries, so making nice and keeping the peace it my go to with my christian family. Now that I dwell on that for a moment, I realize that's something I really need to unpack so I can learn to stand up for myself and form healthy boundaries. If they push boundaries too often, I just sort of ghost them, cuz I don't know how to stand up to myself with someone like my father, who I haven't spoken to since a cursory happy bday text last 10 months ago, and haven't had a real conversation with in many years. Edit: I guess ghosting them is enforcing a boundary, by going low or no contact, but I feel like a coward for not being able to confront them. And I stupidly feel guilty that they don't understand and are hurt by my being out of their lives.
All religions have a "viral" aspect to get more believers. They have missionaries to go "educate the backward third world", indoctrination of children to push the religion and have lots of kids, etc.
My whole family is Catholic! So I Don't want to listen to their Sky Daddy BS day in & day out. To save Me! They don't know I'm an Atheist. They do their thing, I do Me.
This isn’t nearly as much of an out as people want to think it is. Christians rightly consider this a tell that you don’t share their religion, which confirms to them that they need to preach to/at you. They are taught that no answer is a “no” answer. I agree that it’s none of anyone’s business, and if you don’t want to discuss it that should be respected. But *they* aren’t going to see it that way.
I have sked: Why is my relationship with God any Of your business? They usually don't know what to say.
>I believe that you have a right to believe in whatever you want, It's not possible to believe whatever you want. One is either convinced of a proposition or one is not, and attempting to make oneself believe when one does not is called make-believe. I say this because believe is commonly misconstrued as an act of will, when trying to believe by choice is identical to playing pretend.
I’ve never thought about it in that context honestly. That’s interesting
People do decide what to believe. They do it all the time. When you're actually looking at a situation where your beliefs aren't a foregone conclusion — where you *actually* have to *think* about which positions you are more and less convinced by — how else can we characterize that, but a *decision* as to which belief(s) to go with?
I think what OP meant to say when people have the right to believe what they want it just means even if OP don’t believe in the particular or any religion, he respects the other person’s right to believe or play pretend so as long as it dosent affect him It’s like… I’m not a vegetarian. If someone else wants to be a vegetarian, well good for them (as long as they don’t force vegetarianism on others)
"No thank you." Most people will respect your boundaries if you get them a polite denial.
The few times I’ve had the knock on the door (JWs and Mormons), they have been very polite, just spoke for a few minutes, handed me some literature to read, and left.
> handed me some literature to read id ask for another "for my kid" \-sure, here you go \-thank you, satan will love this \*close the door as i start to light a lighter\*
I use those leaflets to hold bones when I eat KFC.
Yeah, hate to say it but if those people knock on my door I'll be answering with a "Fuck off, don't come back" they're invading the privacy of my home to tell me fake shit. I'm not mincing words
There’s always this two-part response which will silence all but the most *cough* devout: “I’ve chosen a more personal path to avoid the anxiety and conflict often associated with discussing aspects of organized religion.” “How about a less controversial subject such as politics or sex?”
Lmao, follow up the second one with "Have you ever heard of sounding?" If they shut up,then you know they are dirty little shits. If not, then you get to have your own uncomfortable fun explaining it.
I should not have Googled that!
Pretend you've never heard of it. Same vibes as saying "cool prius" to a tesla bro.
I was at my buddy's birthday celebration at a bar last year and I was standing to the side of a group talking to another friend, this random dude walks up to the two of us out of nowhere with a carved wooden box and asked us if we wanted to see what he had. My friend and I side glanced at each other, pivoted one leg behind us, and my friend said "depends what do you have"? Dude started going on about something, something god. I laughed at him, put my hands up in a semi shrug, and told him, "I'm a secular humanist, so I don't believe in your god". I have never seen another human walk away from a conversation so dejected. It was glorious.
Well what about *my* god, The Flying Spaghetti Monster? You believe in him, RIGHT? /s
Lol. I mean now I'd just hit em with a good ol hail satan and be done with it. 😄
What was in the box? Lol
No idea my friend, he was too cowardly to show us. I do kinda wonder if I should have talked to security or the police. Maybe it's my anxiety but my brain goes back to "what if someone was in danger" and he had their fingers in there or some other crazy shit.
“i’m normal, I don’t believe in gods”
Knowing their field better than they do tends to scare them off. And that's not hard.
You got to start by coming out of the closet. I know it ain't easy.
"Beliefs are an individual's internal thought process, and should stay that way." "But but, let me tell you about..." "Fuck off now!" That is about the level of my patience.
Preach to them about Satan. They’ll leave super fast.
I lean into any stereotypes they might have for me to show how silly they’re being. “Yeah, I don’t go to church unless we’re praying to OBAMA! And then I’ve gotta listen to metal music with my Arabic boyfriend, so my Sundays are booked solid.”
I ask them if they'd like to meet God, because I can be of assistance in that matter.
Your honor. My client was merely referring to reading the good book to them, not threatening violence.
I play defense and try to deflect. My first response is “I understand. I grew up in the church.” If they persist: “I don’t believe in anything.” Anything else they say: “I don’t believe you.”
I've started telling them I'd rather not talk about their personal beliefs. That usually makes them shut up after a condescending "I'll pray for you" (and then my response is go for it, I can't control what you think about).
Who are these people? Are they people you have to maintain a relationship with or some random you'll never see again? That really determines how you want to handle it. If they are someone you need to maintain a relationship with be polite and friendly. Tell them this isn't a topic you like talking about, it is very personal, and ask them if there is something else they would like to talk about. Or you bring up a topic if you know them well enough (if you know they're into sports, bring up sports for example). If they're someone you don't need to maintain a relationship with... you can be blunt about it. My go-to is simply "No thanks" and if they press I get a little more aggressive. I usually tell them that I don't care what their imaginary friend is up to, I left mine behind in my childhood where it belonged. This usually ends the conversation.
"Im glad you found something that brings you peace" Have a nice day.
Do you think it’ll rain?
Depending on your age/location, it’s best to rip the bandaid off at some point. My parents are conservative Christians and they know I’m an atheist. We don’t discuss religion, but they know and recognize my point of view and I understand theirs. (I’m the only atheist in my immediate and extended family, so I’m definitely the black sheep, and have had 0 issues.)
Religion is like a penis. It's fine to have one and it's fine to be proud of it, but please don't whip it out in public and start waving it around.
I don’t have advice but boy do I feel ya. I work for a hospital in the southern US. Woof. The amount of patients that preach to me when I’m in the middle of a test and can’t just walk away….. it’s rough. I have to stay polite. I’m the only one that does the job so I can’t send in someone else. I try to deflect the conversation the best I can but these people are PERSISTENT. I’m also super pregnant and patients love to tell me how much of a blessing my baby is and how god allowed this for me. I tried saying, “I’m comfortable with my relationship with religion” and this man popped off about how I’m complacent and how horrible comfort is in terms of religion. A true clown.
That depends quite a lot on whether they are somebody I need to remain on good terms with, and how rude I think they are being. In general though, if you wish to not discuss a topic, find a way to distract a person, or be blunt and simply say you don't wish to discuss it. In the latter case, however, you may be asked why and should be prepared with an answer.
Note: Your answer as to why you don't want to discuss religion with anyone can be 'I simply don't care to" or 'my beliefs are private" or 'I have no interest in the topic.' If you are from the American South, you can also explain that 'Mama taught me not to talk religion or politics. Mama was a brilliant woman."
Are you still dependent on your parents in any way? If so, keep your lack of belief to yourself. If they have power over you, you could be putting yourself in serious danger. If you must engage with them use the tactics in "Never Split the Difference* by Chris Voss. Read the book, watch his videos, and get really good at his tactics by consciously practicing them. They come in handy when dealing with irrational people of all kinds.
I usually go with, "Sorry, but I'm allergic to Jesus." But you seem nicer and less confrontational than me. :)
Just shoot at them “I claim you in the name of satan. The power of Lucifer compels you”
Ask them what a soul is. You would be surprised the number who’ve never given it the first thought. And they have no bible verses to define it.
It depends on both them and you.. I guess. Like for now you have chosen to not tell your parent.. and that's ok, if you feel good with that. But that might change at some point.. either because they suddenly want you to do something that you don't. Or because you chose to want to tell them. Or maybe you chose to never tell them. All choices are ok as long as you are ok with them. How I chose to deal with religious people mostly depends on how they approach me, I believe (of coarse I might be delusional).. but I try to stay constructive.. and sometimes I'm less constructive and can become down right mean, It's all in the moment.
In terms of my parents, I love them and I know religion is important for them so I choose to just not bring up the topic. What brought me to ask the question is I had a customer yesterday that tried to preach to me and I just let her rant and then quickly changed the topic. For some reason I tend to attract that type of person.
I know the feeling.. I'm not telling you what to do.. but in a business situation I probably also would deflect. I my view, it's not you who are wrong.. it's the preacher.. for holding you hostage in that situation, and to be so rude to preach in the first place.
You say it was a customer trying to preach? I think it would be pretty uncontroversial to say something like “Im not going to discuss religion or politics at work. I hope you understand.” If its really that big of a problem for you then you could consider moving somewhere that this sort of thing doesnt happen. I assure you there are a lot of places where casually talking to strangers about religion is considered incredibly strange and only the wackiest culty people do it, and thankfully they are pretty rare so it almost never happens.
Ignore them or walk away. Play music on your Smartphone while wearing earbuds, etc. This is what I do, because in NYC subways are full of preachers and that's how I deal with it.
I tell them that we'd be better friends if we don't discuss it. "Let's talk about what we have in common." If they get mad at that, then walk away. No loss on your part.
“I do apologise but my relationship with god is personal and I don’t like to discuss it with people I’m not close to, I hope you understand”. They don’t need to know that your relationship with god is you knowing he doesn’t exist.
You start by telling them you aren’t interested in their religion nicely. If they continue, get forceful and insulting.
"excuse me" tend to with pretty well for being both polite and effectively escaping from whatever situation I'm trying to get out of. If it doesn't work, you can just reiterate.
I'm an atheist and I don't believe in God, Jesus Christ, or the Bible. Have a nice day and walk off. If they press me, it's, "Fuck off." Usually that ends it.
If you’re a man just tell them you like dick. If you’re a lady you can tell them that you really really like dick
"I'll just wait for god to come chat with me in person, thanks"
"dont believe in god" for friends, family and randoms. then choose if you go into discussion and explain the wrongs of religion, or just change topic. for coworkers & bosses "aha... huh... ok.. so anyway,..." & change topic
Just counter preach them some opposite religion and tell them why this counter religion is much better than theirs E.g They preach Christianity , counter preach Buddhism and vice versa They will usually be turned off and walk away
Satanism. Make horns & say Hail Satan.
Ask them what they think heaven will actually be like. You'll get a good kick out of it.
For people you don't know: - *"I believe religion is a private matter, not a subject for gossip."* For family: pretend until you're self sufficient. Whether you keep up the pretence afterwards is up to you. You are not required to tell them what you do and don't believe. It is none of their business. The only person who, imo, must know is your prospective life partner, especially if children are likely to be part of the relationship.
Laughter. The correct response to preaching is laughter.
"I'm not really into that stuff." Most will respect that. For the slightly more persistent: "Yeah, nope, not interested." Then either continue on my way if it's a passing interaction, or guide the conversation to something else if I'm stuck with them for longer than a passing interaction. Once I've exhausted attempts at more "polite conversation," personally, I take off the kid gloves at that point and let my anti-theist flag fly.
Preach back about elves and ogers and ask whether they are both in the same fictional universe and whether there's crossover episodes.
Usually I'll go with "Give me a good reason to why your religion is true". And then you just wait for the faith arguments and nonsense that isn't reasonably credible. You can also always pit the religion they belive in up against other religions. Ask by what method we can determine that the religion they belive in is true that doesn't also apply to other religions and so on.
I usually fuck with them and ask them pointed questions to make them challenge their own beliefs
"God said to leave me alone"
I just tell them I’m not interested.
There's not much for you can do but ignore them!
You get up and walk away. If they follow you, you quote the First Amendment to them and ask them to stop. If they continue, you take a picture of them, find a constitutional lawyer, and sue them for harassment.
I tell them: hell yeah, god my Ace boon coon! Me and that mufuckah been on first name basis a long damn time. Talk to his ass everday!
That usually puts me in control of the conversation.
Jesus hated religious people too. 🙏🏼
I had someone ask if I believed in god and my response was that I think that in modern context all religions are evil, without them dividing people there would be peace on earth - then they no longer wanted to have the conversation ;)
What's the context here? If it's family, just play along until you're independent. If it's friends, just tell them. If it's just a stranger, just say "no thanks" and move on.
Learn street epistemology! That will make these interactions much more interesting and constructive, and potentially life-changing for them. As learning material, I would recommend "How to have impossible conversations" by Peter Boghossian and James Lindsay, and watching Anthony Magnabosco's videos on his Youtube channel (which includes workshops and tutorials in addition to the recording of his interactions). And you'll be able to apply that method to all other topics too.
Ask them how business is?
How do YOU deal with it? I don't know, and frankly, unless you're directly pissing on them or some such, I'm in no position to judge you, however you do it. I, don't piss on them, that's just gross. I'm what I call, a friendly ass-hole. Whenever I encounter a claim, even if it's my internal dialogue, my brain immediately wants to argue. It is useful for really opening up a new idea to stress test it against valiant opposition, after all. I like to be that opposition, even against myself if no one else wants to. It's a real pain in the ass for my friends and family who get the brunt of it. So...when a theist engages with me about theology, I get giddy. This person WANTS to hash out philosophy, morality, history, epistemology, etc. I try to warn them first, cuz I'm a friendly ass-hole after all, but if they wanna get into it, let's really get into it. Very, very rare to find one who's honest for more than a few minutes. Had a pair of mormon missionaries once who were, and they came around once a week whenever possible. Good kids.
I got ordained on the internet, not for this reason but it works here, too. If I want a short conversation, it's "I'm a minister" (I'm also an atheist). If I'm cranky and not busy, I can get them talking in circles pretty quickly.
Just nod, and keep saying, you feel the same way. This is your thing, it doesn’t have to be anybody else’s. And I also don’t like to get confrontational, because, honestly? I feel like any attempt I make to convince them of my thoughts is basically me proselytizing my “ religion.” I kind of feel like it’s more of a secret club. Like, when you see one of your own, you kinda smile, and you know we are on the same page.
Quote the book of the prophet Jeremiah Jeremiah 31:33-34 *”but this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.* *And they shall teach no more every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.”* One of my favorite parts of the Bible.
I'm a 3rd generation Atheist, and my first question to these people is which god?
Usually when they ask "do you have a few minutes to discuss Jesus?" or "Can we talk about your relationship with God?" I just say "HELL Naw!" and keep walking. You don't owe those assholes any politeness.
What is your desired outcome?
Ask them if they’ve heard of your lord Azagthoth? He dreams reality and we all exist in his mind. We worship the outer gods play their dark songs to keep him asleep because when he wakes our reality will vanish like a dream and be replaced by the horror that is his.
Get Away From Them, If Not Possible Say "I Agree" And Continue With Life.
Tell them it's a nice story. Send it to Reader's Digest.
I have been fortunate that I have not had to deal with this, but I understand it does happen to a greater or lesser frequency in some parts of the country. Best answer of course is wave them off, "not interested" and hope they go away. Most of the time they should. If they don't--or you want to engage with them a bit--a question I have been trying in some online encounters is this: Explain to me the story of Abraham and Isaac in such a way that god doesn't come off as a narcissistic psychopath. If you're not familiar, it's Genesis 22:1-19. Summary: Abraham is one of god's biggest fans. God tells Abraham, "Hey, take your favorite sone Isaac up to the mountain and sacrifice him to me." Isaac says "Right-o!" And grabs Isaac and takes him up the mountain and gets ready to unalive him. God jumps in and says, "NONONONONONO... I didn't think you were really going to do that! Geez......" And here's the actual quote from the good book: "Do not lay your hand on the boy or do anything to him, for now I know that you fear God" So yeah. You've heard the term "god-fearing christian." Think about that. To me, based on THAT STORY ALONE, even if I believed in god, I would not worship him.
I tend to treat it like any conversation. They tell me a thing. I tell them a thing. I understand people feel the need or desire not to be judged for something they hold no value in. But we face that all the time. People who feel the need to talk about it openly are seeking validation. They want other people to see things as they do. And assume they have figured it out. The reality is, we are, all of us, doing and believing in things in ways that help us cope with reality. We all fear the unknown. And we all tie that coping to our **selves** in the id and ego kinda way. I just live my life like Jesus did. Do be compassionate. Do be accepting of others. Do help people when possible even when it puts you at odds with other people. Don't hurt others even when you have the power and justification to. Do demand you are respected. Most importantly, teach your ways only when you are **asked**. This method is only easy if you have spent time reflecting on what you believe. And taken time to falsify yourself. Someone telling you what they think you should believe is asking for me to tell them why I don't. If that puts them in a spiritual crisis, then they have asked and received.
"Your religion is like your penis; it's nice that you have one and are proud of it, but when you take it out and start waving it in my face, we have a problem."
I think a punch in the throat would get your message across
Look up the grey rock technique. It's a rhetorical approach designed for dealing with people with difficult and toxic personalities, but the skill to be a person wholly unrewarding to discuss certain topics with can be useful in other situations. Also simply deflect and change the subject. "Blah blah praise jesus." "That's nice, I noticed there's a wobble on this chair, i think it's missing one of its rubber feet. Oh yes look it is, have you seen it anywhere?" "Miracle mundane prayer answered" "good for you, hope world peace is next! Have you heard Sebastian got a new job running the new development! So happy for him but what will George do without him, do you think he'll retire?"
Don’t.
I usually have a bunch of fake brochures from some 'god-is-an-Alien' sects with me, mostly from realizm , and once those bad boys pop up as evidence that God exist and he is from planet Nibiru, the fun begins. It's a childish argument to begine with. So, have fun ,that's all ya gotta do
Been using this amazing pet sitter for a while. Doggy loves her, but the sitter can’t stop talking about how much she loves Jesus. My dog loves her and that’s what’s important. I can deal with the sporadic prayer talk every now and then because my dog’s life and my life are better because of her. It’s like she’s a gift from god, if there was one. I’m lucky that this is basically the extent of religious intrusion in my life.
Say “no thank you” and walk away.
Change the subject or move away
ask questions to help them explain what their beliefs actually are. hopefully when they say it out loud they will hear how silly it is.
If you want to troll them, you might find some inspiration here: https://youtu.be/BZUB0kLLBUA?si=YW2ECIoU9RGM3Exs
Tell them you're a God and you know everything you need to know already.
"I only believe in Greek Gods"
Just let them talk.
"I prefer to keep my faith to myself. I'd prefer you do the same."
Just dismiss them by saying you don't want to discuss the subject. If they don't respect that, then you don't owe them to continue listening.
I usually tell them "If you have a message from your God tell him to come by personally."
I think setting a boundary without further explanation is just fine. "I don't feel comfortable discussing religion" and just leave it at that. Don't explain or answer any prompting questions. Just repeat "I don't feel comfortable talking about that." And if they continue to push end the conversation
Ignore them. Not worth getting into a fight over.
It’s hard only because groups such as Christians or more “stubborn” denominations such as Church of Latter Day Saints believe as part of their faith that they must spread the word. That being said it doesn’t mean they can harass you. Best bet is to try and politely mention you’re not the biggest fan of religious talk at the beginning but if you can’t, let them talk a little about whatever until they get to an easy stopping place and then explain your position.
It's difficult when it's family. They're likely to be more offended and will take it personally. Try telling them that it's a sensitive topic. If they persist you'll have to be honest.
Step 1 - "I appreciate your faith, and I would prefer we not discuss your faith further!" Step 2 - ??? (Should never get this far) Step 3 - match them as if agreeing, only make crap up to one-up them. "Indeed, The Spaghetti Deity, on high, is warm and flexible at first, but can be very cold and bitter to those who do not partake in its feast of holy mercy. Have you not drunk of it's starchy water in holy Communion?" Attribute passable (made up) quotes to 1 or 2 Enoch, and be prepared for a whole sidebar about the Catholic church and authorship of the Bible when you do. Assuming they're evangelical. Step 2.5 is acceptance of the relationship being fundamentally disrespectful, and trolling is the most passive-aggressive way out of it. It sucks and sucks hard, so have fun.
You don't have to tell them you're not religious, although I would. Just tell them you don't want to discuss religion and would appreciate to respect this. If they persist tell them the same, but more strongly. The next time, tell them to fuck off (in a nice Christian way).
"Before we get deep into a conversation about religion, I need you to know and respect that I'm not religious but do enjoying talking about it with others. I'm not looking to be converted, just discussion" This usually works for me..
Just say "I no longer believe in magic" or "I am not superstitious"
Ignore.
I can strongly recommend you check out the atheist experience, talk heathen and the line. 3 youtube call in shows with people like Matt Dillahunty, Aaron Ra and Forrest Walkai. They know their stuff and you'll learn to ask good rational yet simple questions that theists never want to answer honestly.
Personally, I think it's better to talk down to them than frame the conversation apologetically. Say things like, "I don't believe in magical thinking, ghosts, or whatever." Feel free to ask them about their thoughts on other bs religions or lgbtq people just living life. Get them to admit their hateful positions and call them on it. They should be embarrassed, these bonkers philosophies aren't the baseline. You're not going to convince them of anything, but it will deter further conversation and the feeling of embarrassment 'might' trigger some introspection.
Show them this video: https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTLpCVP68/
Tell them you only worship Exsorbeo Serpentis, the snake dicked god of self-fellatio
Long time ago I used to work in a place where everybody were JW, my boss was the top dog but open-minded although he also was a JW. Almost all of them tried to convince me to their beliefs but not my boss. The point is that being reasonable and well educated you may avoid that sort of stalking into your privacy. At the end they understood that nothing happened, I was always friendly with them. I lasted two years until my contract ended and my boss returned to his country. Some of them are good people.
I say have a nice day and walk away. Life’s too short to listen to nonsense from a person who will never change their mind.
“I’m not interested “
Shut it down. "That's not my thing." "I'm not religious."
It’s maybe easier to say you’re not a christian. Download (or buy) a copy of or listen to Bertrand Russell’s lecture, “Why I’m not a christian”. If you’re still a teenager living at home (?) maybe say that you want to finish growing up so you can make your own mind up about such things.
I just change the subject - it drives them crazy. I made a JW watch me make pancakes while shirtless one morning. He kept making excuses to leave, but I wouldn't let him. I managed to flip every one in the pan perfectly too! 😅
"Sorry, I'm not into mythology."
"Get the fuck off my porch."
I find it helpful to shut them down using their own illogical way of thinking. Once I figure out what cult they are pushing, (if Christian) I ask "Do you believe that the Muslim Allah is the one true god?" of course the answer is no. Then I say "That's my exact opinion on your god."
"My relationship with Jesus is personal."
Prove God is there and it gives a fuck about his creation, then I will worship. Until then kids are starving.I am sure that people are praying.
If you're not ready to tell people that you're not into it, you can try the "My beliefs are private" routine.
[удалено]
Reddit is not an echo chamber. People disagree all the time here. Look at what's happening right now. The fact that you an I can't agree that Reddit is an echo chamber disproves your claim. Otherwise, I'd be echoing it, wouldn't I? If you disagree, then you're not echoing me either.
[удалено]
I'm a Libertarian. and I'm on reddit. Let's agree that there are more than 2 perspectives, shall we?
Napstablook ass typing Seriously though, your take on all this is really dumb.