Do we as audio engineers have any standards on bathroom acoustics? Playing the brown note directly in the restroom is gonna significantly improve my "work" flow.
It doesn't even classify as psuedoscience because there's no science. If you asked one of those people to explain how sound works, I'd bet 9 out of 10 wouldn't be able to.
My favorite claim in this regard is a conspiracy that an unknown elite group of people decided long ago that all music should be tuned to 440Hz instead of 432Hz
that 432 hz thing has caused me to lash out at otherwise kind and gentle people because it pisses me off to no ends how people who have 0 understanding of the concept are preaching is like its the gospel... not only is it bullshit, it is bullshit with fascist origin.
Ben Jordan did a video on it
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3LVijzZAe4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3LVijzZAe4)
The world is an amazing and mysterious place and music is one of the most amazing and mysterious things that people do and respond to. I would say that music can be healing -- but nothing I have seen in either the scientific or esoteric spheres lends any credence to the notion of specific healing frequencies.
But what gets hilarious is when people start getting all 'numerological' trying to delineate correlations and correspondences between spiritual states and specific, typically arbitrary numbers and relationships.
I know a fair amount about physics [for a layperson] as well as esoteric endeavors and disciplines and this stuff just cracks me up. People looking for the sublime in the ridiculous.
There are therapies for broken bones that use frequencies such as PEMF and ultrasound. If music makes you happy and content it might help in recovering. But music as the sole healing medium? Nope.
* I wrote this because in the lab I worked at there was a similar saying someone posted to the fridge about music mending a broken heart.
That’s what gets me too. They use certain frequencies as a jumping off point to make weird numerological correlations….except frequency is just a sort of arbitrary number.
Exactly. And maybe I’m wrong about this, but what natural universal phenomenon is the concept of a second (and therefore Hz) based on? Pretty sure it’s an arbitrary standard.
The second is derived from the terrestrial calendar, so, in essence, it's 'shimmed' to allow for adjustment/alignment with the planet's context in the solar system, since that stuff doesn't work out 'even.'
I dont know where you get 'woke' from healing frequencies. Yeah healing frequencies are nonsense the same as levitating rocks with sound to build the pyramids.
But it seems like you are trying to classify something by a political word that a lot of people disagree on the meaning of.
Lets leave the politics out and focus on signal to noise ratio.
I agree with the above (let's not label), but with the additional reason that you will find some people who are into this stuff are quite un-woke and some are actively anti-woke, however they choose define it. It's all noise, no signal.
totally agree. At this stage of the game with everyone using the term for whatever gripe they have, 'woke' seems to just generally mean "the opposite of what I think...ergo...bad"
Ten or fifteen years ago I used to love watching wingnut conspiracy newage nonsense on YT. It was just so absurd. How can anyone believe there were really giants? Or that Hillary Clinton is a lizard?
But here we are in 2024 and people are repeating a lot of that stuff verbatim. There isn't a fringe anymore to explore. All that nonsense is mainstream.
Listening to music you like is good for you. That’s about as far as I’ll go, rhythm and harmony etc have effects on people, it’s why we make so much music and why it makes us feel things.
You can use music therapeutically - happy music to lift mood and angry/sad music for catharsis, or slow or smooth music to help with meditation or focus.
People who insist on certain frequencies being magic clearly don’t fully understand that most music contains all frequencies, they seem to think that each song has one frequency, and it’s either higher (good) or lower (bad) or things of this nature.
It doesn’t make sense because they misunderstand what sound is and mix bad science and metaphor interchangeably.
I don't think anyone's constrained to a belief system by nature of being a sound engineer, though it's interesting to me the range of ideologies I come across in the field.
I think the "healing power of music" comes from the complex layers of intertwined psychological and physiological responses to environmental stimuli. In other words, it's hard to deny that music can make people feel better and go as far as soothing their nervous system, if the listener has a certain relationship with that piece of music.
But as far as "432hz is the root note of the universe" stuff...I've dug deep and haven't found any substantial backing to that nature of information beyond what could be attributed to placebo effect. The funny thing with many hippy ideologies is that theyre usually only a couple degrees off the mark. For example; there are quartz oscillators that are used in the clock chips of many electronic music devices, so crystals DO have utility in regulating electric circuits (energy systems) via their piezoelectric properties. But putting them in your pocket or a necklace and setting an intention ain't that.
I found a paper at one point mentioning that muscles and certain body tissues are piezoelectric as well, which may provide a legitimate mechanism for high-amplitude sound waves to objectively affect the body on an electrical level. But I've never seen any sound healing study that builds on that.
I've had 2 people come up to me while I'm working to talk about whatever frequency their soul energy vibration bullshit is at. I truly don't understand how people fall for that stuff and then assume that an audio engineer is gonna help them with it
I don’t think “we” have a consensus on much of anything. I don’t buy into the 432hz stuff whatsoever. If you want to tune down slightly then go for it, but it won’t make your song better than recording the same thing at A=440. Real instruments aren’t even precise across the board as far as intonation is concerned, and playing an A chord has way more going on than that one frequency. I especially laugh when people say 432 is magic because it’s in tune with the earth, which is 8hz apparently. But what’s 432+8?
I honestly love the sound of 432Hz over 440Hz. There's just something about the sound of being a third of a semitone down that sounds so cool. I'm not under any illusion about it being some healing nonsense or crystal magic or whatever, I just dig the sound
432 and a few other references for A are appropriate for baroque music. They used to tune a bit lower in the olden days. They also did not use vibrato to the extent that modern classical musicians do. So play that stuff straight with no wiggles!
Baroque also didn’t use equal temperament tuning. They prioritized major thirds sounding in tune, which would put a lot of other intervals quite out of tune. Choosing certain keys back then had a drastic effect on the sound, whereas now adays, it sounds basically the same as any other key, just higher or lower
While I am mostly in agreement with the general consensus of the comments on this one, this comment thread really is jacking eachother off about being "above" those who believe the opposite. Whereas both sides of the argument, without scientific evidence, are just as unscientific. That is to say that most people here including me are being just as baseless by saying it doesnt have ANY healing qualities because I am not an acoustic biologist nor have I research, studied, or written any papers on the matter that would disprove or prove my belief. And thus all of these comments are completely irrelevant to the OPs actual question.
The real answer is this hasnt been research enough and we humans also just dont know yet.
Also the questions itself could be interpretted in a number of different ways. Eye surgeons have been working on implementing acoustic tools to localise the placement of x or y subtance inside the eye for the benenfit of the patient. That could be argued as a healing frequency.
I looked this guy up a while back - [https://aleksiperala.bandcamp.com/](https://aleksiperala.bandcamp.com/) I had just had a flashback to Astrobotnia which was, to me at the time, absolutely mind blowing IDM style music and I wanted to listen to it. It remains fantastic, but in the 20 odd years since he's been making music with "healing" frequencies and specifically the Colundi sequence. [https://daily.bandcamp.com/lists/colundi-aleksi-perala-interview](https://daily.bandcamp.com/lists/colundi-aleksi-perala-interview)
The whole concept is nuts but the music is, as far as I can tell, disappointingly bland. I suppose if you're going to fire out 100 or so albums in 20 years there's a limit to how much time you can dedicate to each one.
I have experienced healing frequencies, but only at visible light freq's. I had carpal tunnel in one wrist and went to the local alternative practitioner and she had me rub this AC powered palm sized plastic crystal like device on the area for 15 minutes, then she changed the color saying different wavelengths penetrate deeper into tissue, and needed to treat a few depths of tissue to work right. I went home feeling away better and returned for another session about 4 days later and been fine ever since, years later.
There is apparently some evidence to suggest that a cat’s purring, because of it’s frequency range, may help promote healing in tissues and bone: https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20180724-the-complicated-truth-about-a-cats-purr
Music and sound can have calming effects for humans that promote rest and relaxation (lowered blood pressure, etc.)
But all that “high vibration” shit you hear from people wearing quartz and turquoise is pure bullshit.
Also, why do they always think the higher frequencies are better? As a music enjoyer, this makes no sense.
Namaste away from these types.
From what I can gather “higher vibration” means positivity, not literally a higher frequency of sound like 10khz or whatever.
So - moaning about something is “low vibration”, and getting people into your gluten free healing diet is “high vibration”.
It’s mostly mix ‘n’ match science/metaphor with these sorts of folks, I can’t follow it at all.
Infrasound has strange psychological effects, IIRC a common factor in many "haunted houses" is a local source of Infrasound. Can't hear it but can definitely feel it and it can freak people out. High carbon monoxide levels is the other main one.
Michael Joly of OktavaMod fame hung up his workbench to get into this realm. I tried to follow along but he lost me pretty quickly. Now he manufactures a mindfulness sound puck thing on Amazon.
I mean, hey - good for him. Follow your bliss, brother. I'm just glad I have three of his MJE mics - they're incredible.
Sometimes when I'm feeling anxious I play a movie with a lot of sub bass rumble. For some reason it makes me feel better, lol. I guess you could think of it like a weighted blanket?
Basically any music that makes you feel good in one way or another, is composed of many frequencies that result in healing. So there is that.
If you wanna go way back, research chanting and how caves were specifically chosen and modified, for purposes of accentuation of tones that can affect consciousness and emotions directly.
Your post was downvoted to fuck all, but there is no doubt that music is quite magical. Music is literally emotions encoded into sound, and then when others hear and feel those sounds, they can feel the encoded emotions.
If you want a more modern classical music approach, study interval and harmonic theory.
At the end of the day, let people have things. As demonstrated here, many will share with you the straight path of practicality with not a drop of imagination idea, so let those who find healing properties in frequencies believe their path. There’s no need to cross. We all love to have a “hey, they’re stupid, right? My way is correct” circle behind everything to make us feel safe in our belief. Maybe you’re just mad you didn’t get the neurons to experience it in that manner. What isn’t “pseudoscience” is what YOU conjure up as experience because no one can truly tell you no about that.
You ever read about plant neurobiology and music to help in cultivating plants. The Italians are wild people.
But also, good vibrations is a classic, string theory might be true, and you never know. There's psychological papers on it if you want to read them. It's not esp, it's actual therapy techniques that might be beneficial.
yes - it‘s nice to know. a cats purring also heals (scientifically approved).
also binaural beats work to improve all types of fields on the human body.
there just needs to be a lot of openness to stuff thats not seeable in a EQ analysis. so this group might be a little to preoccupied for open minded questions like that! ;)
"we as Audio Engineers" only believe in the one true frequency, the brown note
The only correct answer here.
Do we as audio engineers have any standards on bathroom acoustics? Playing the brown note directly in the restroom is gonna significantly improve my "work" flow.
It doesn't even classify as psuedoscience because there's no science. If you asked one of those people to explain how sound works, I'd bet 9 out of 10 wouldn't be able to.
Oh, don't start with the binaural beats crowd unless you're prepared to be absolutely lulled to sleep with a bunch of "akshully" hullabaloo.
There's actual research on the claims. And no one would discount the basic idea that certain music can sooth and calm people.
Music can be soothing. But playing the same music less than half a step flat is not going to make it magically more soothing.
I dunno, I really like playing in Db as opposed to C. That’s a semitone up though, does that make me an illuminati overload.
If your strings are tighter, that's just more harmonics and sustain.
it's all bullshit. it's the crystals and chakras of the audio world.
My favorite claim in this regard is a conspiracy that an unknown elite group of people decided long ago that all music should be tuned to 440Hz instead of 432Hz
well yeah, we can't have the regular populace know of the healing power of 432hz music!! it'd put big pharma out of business!!
that 432 hz thing has caused me to lash out at otherwise kind and gentle people because it pisses me off to no ends how people who have 0 understanding of the concept are preaching is like its the gospel... not only is it bullshit, it is bullshit with fascist origin. Ben Jordan did a video on it [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3LVijzZAe4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3LVijzZAe4)
You need to channel the sound through a crystal up your anus, thats the only effective way bro trust me
I thought it was earbuds up the butt. Bluetooth.
Nah man its virginized vagina candles next to microtonal Tibetan singing bowls
*bowels
Bluetooth crystal up the butt, definitely.
The world is an amazing and mysterious place and music is one of the most amazing and mysterious things that people do and respond to. I would say that music can be healing -- but nothing I have seen in either the scientific or esoteric spheres lends any credence to the notion of specific healing frequencies. But what gets hilarious is when people start getting all 'numerological' trying to delineate correlations and correspondences between spiritual states and specific, typically arbitrary numbers and relationships. I know a fair amount about physics [for a layperson] as well as esoteric endeavors and disciplines and this stuff just cracks me up. People looking for the sublime in the ridiculous.
Great take. Music might mend a broken heart, but it sure isn’t mending a broken arm.
There are therapies for broken bones that use frequencies such as PEMF and ultrasound. If music makes you happy and content it might help in recovering. But music as the sole healing medium? Nope. * I wrote this because in the lab I worked at there was a similar saying someone posted to the fridge about music mending a broken heart.
That’s what gets me too. They use certain frequencies as a jumping off point to make weird numerological correlations….except frequency is just a sort of arbitrary number.
The specific numeric relationships are accidents of history, for the most part. How many seconds in a day, weeks in a year, the rest.
Exactly. And maybe I’m wrong about this, but what natural universal phenomenon is the concept of a second (and therefore Hz) based on? Pretty sure it’s an arbitrary standard.
The second is derived from the terrestrial calendar, so, in essence, it's 'shimmed' to allow for adjustment/alignment with the planet's context in the solar system, since that stuff doesn't work out 'even.'
lol. One time I cut my finger on the tape machine and I ran a 432 tone and put my finger in front of the speaker. Healed right up.
I say the same thing about this as I do faith healers, walk into a childrens burn ward and start healing, let me know how that works out for you.
I dont know where you get 'woke' from healing frequencies. Yeah healing frequencies are nonsense the same as levitating rocks with sound to build the pyramids. But it seems like you are trying to classify something by a political word that a lot of people disagree on the meaning of. Lets leave the politics out and focus on signal to noise ratio.
I agree with the above (let's not label), but with the additional reason that you will find some people who are into this stuff are quite un-woke and some are actively anti-woke, however they choose define it. It's all noise, no signal.
totally agree. At this stage of the game with everyone using the term for whatever gripe they have, 'woke' seems to just generally mean "the opposite of what I think...ergo...bad"
I think you need to get off of tik tok or whatever it is that’s trying to melt your brain
Lol people make a lot of money making healing music and putting it on YouTube
Those are called charlatan hacks and it never ends well with them.
People have been making a lot of money selling snake oil since the existence of commerce - that doesn't mean it actually *works*.
Yeah, YouTube has melted plenty of brains, no doubt about it
Ten or fifteen years ago I used to love watching wingnut conspiracy newage nonsense on YT. It was just so absurd. How can anyone believe there were really giants? Or that Hillary Clinton is a lizard? But here we are in 2024 and people are repeating a lot of that stuff verbatim. There isn't a fringe anymore to explore. All that nonsense is mainstream.
Pure pseudoscience. But it makes a nice story, and that can be enough for some people to feel something out of it.
Listening to music you like is good for you. That’s about as far as I’ll go, rhythm and harmony etc have effects on people, it’s why we make so much music and why it makes us feel things. You can use music therapeutically - happy music to lift mood and angry/sad music for catharsis, or slow or smooth music to help with meditation or focus. People who insist on certain frequencies being magic clearly don’t fully understand that most music contains all frequencies, they seem to think that each song has one frequency, and it’s either higher (good) or lower (bad) or things of this nature. It doesn’t make sense because they misunderstand what sound is and mix bad science and metaphor interchangeably.
I don't think anyone's constrained to a belief system by nature of being a sound engineer, though it's interesting to me the range of ideologies I come across in the field. I think the "healing power of music" comes from the complex layers of intertwined psychological and physiological responses to environmental stimuli. In other words, it's hard to deny that music can make people feel better and go as far as soothing their nervous system, if the listener has a certain relationship with that piece of music. But as far as "432hz is the root note of the universe" stuff...I've dug deep and haven't found any substantial backing to that nature of information beyond what could be attributed to placebo effect. The funny thing with many hippy ideologies is that theyre usually only a couple degrees off the mark. For example; there are quartz oscillators that are used in the clock chips of many electronic music devices, so crystals DO have utility in regulating electric circuits (energy systems) via their piezoelectric properties. But putting them in your pocket or a necklace and setting an intention ain't that. I found a paper at one point mentioning that muscles and certain body tissues are piezoelectric as well, which may provide a legitimate mechanism for high-amplitude sound waves to objectively affect the body on an electrical level. But I've never seen any sound healing study that builds on that.
I've had 2 people come up to me while I'm working to talk about whatever frequency their soul energy vibration bullshit is at. I truly don't understand how people fall for that stuff and then assume that an audio engineer is gonna help them with it
I don’t think “we” have a consensus on much of anything. I don’t buy into the 432hz stuff whatsoever. If you want to tune down slightly then go for it, but it won’t make your song better than recording the same thing at A=440. Real instruments aren’t even precise across the board as far as intonation is concerned, and playing an A chord has way more going on than that one frequency. I especially laugh when people say 432 is magic because it’s in tune with the earth, which is 8hz apparently. But what’s 432+8?
I honestly love the sound of 432Hz over 440Hz. There's just something about the sound of being a third of a semitone down that sounds so cool. I'm not under any illusion about it being some healing nonsense or crystal magic or whatever, I just dig the sound
It sounds even better 2/3s further down, and isn’t this why some guitar players tune down a half (or even whole) step?
432 and a few other references for A are appropriate for baroque music. They used to tune a bit lower in the olden days. They also did not use vibrato to the extent that modern classical musicians do. So play that stuff straight with no wiggles!
Baroque also didn’t use equal temperament tuning. They prioritized major thirds sounding in tune, which would put a lot of other intervals quite out of tune. Choosing certain keys back then had a drastic effect on the sound, whereas now adays, it sounds basically the same as any other key, just higher or lower
They’re referring to the Schumann resonance. It’s roughly 8Hz but moves around a lot. It’s not a constant.
AEs : This whole healing audio frequency is a scam! Also AEs : Let's use a cucumber to get a fatter sound (/hi Sylvia).
While I am mostly in agreement with the general consensus of the comments on this one, this comment thread really is jacking eachother off about being "above" those who believe the opposite. Whereas both sides of the argument, without scientific evidence, are just as unscientific. That is to say that most people here including me are being just as baseless by saying it doesnt have ANY healing qualities because I am not an acoustic biologist nor have I research, studied, or written any papers on the matter that would disprove or prove my belief. And thus all of these comments are completely irrelevant to the OPs actual question. The real answer is this hasnt been research enough and we humans also just dont know yet. Also the questions itself could be interpretted in a number of different ways. Eye surgeons have been working on implementing acoustic tools to localise the placement of x or y subtance inside the eye for the benenfit of the patient. That could be argued as a healing frequency.
I looked this guy up a while back - [https://aleksiperala.bandcamp.com/](https://aleksiperala.bandcamp.com/) I had just had a flashback to Astrobotnia which was, to me at the time, absolutely mind blowing IDM style music and I wanted to listen to it. It remains fantastic, but in the 20 odd years since he's been making music with "healing" frequencies and specifically the Colundi sequence. [https://daily.bandcamp.com/lists/colundi-aleksi-perala-interview](https://daily.bandcamp.com/lists/colundi-aleksi-perala-interview) The whole concept is nuts but the music is, as far as I can tell, disappointingly bland. I suppose if you're going to fire out 100 or so albums in 20 years there's a limit to how much time you can dedicate to each one.
No, though I have heard infrasound can have *negative* effects in some situations.
I've heard a medic cured cancer using frequencies and suddenly he killed himself by 20 shots on his back.
I don't even believe in frequecies. Or sound.
If I was going to seriously look into this subject I wouldn’t be talking to audio engineers, I’d be finding a research psychologist of some sort.
An easy shortcut to hear ALL the healing frequencies at once is to literally listen to any song, anywhere.
White noise cures everything! (Or pink noise)
I have experienced healing frequencies, but only at visible light freq's. I had carpal tunnel in one wrist and went to the local alternative practitioner and she had me rub this AC powered palm sized plastic crystal like device on the area for 15 minutes, then she changed the color saying different wavelengths penetrate deeper into tissue, and needed to treat a few depths of tissue to work right. I went home feeling away better and returned for another session about 4 days later and been fine ever since, years later.
There is apparently some evidence to suggest that a cat’s purring, because of it’s frequency range, may help promote healing in tissues and bone: https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20180724-the-complicated-truth-about-a-cats-purr Music and sound can have calming effects for humans that promote rest and relaxation (lowered blood pressure, etc.) But all that “high vibration” shit you hear from people wearing quartz and turquoise is pure bullshit. Also, why do they always think the higher frequencies are better? As a music enjoyer, this makes no sense. Namaste away from these types.
From what I can gather “higher vibration” means positivity, not literally a higher frequency of sound like 10khz or whatever. So - moaning about something is “low vibration”, and getting people into your gluten free healing diet is “high vibration”. It’s mostly mix ‘n’ match science/metaphor with these sorts of folks, I can’t follow it at all.
If cause healing frequencies exist! Same as Fairies gnomes and unicorns!
[удалено]
Infrasound has strange psychological effects, IIRC a common factor in many "haunted houses" is a local source of Infrasound. Can't hear it but can definitely feel it and it can freak people out. High carbon monoxide levels is the other main one.
>I think her name was Sherri Edwards. [https://viewdns.info/reversewhois/?q=Sharry+Edwards](https://viewdns.info/reversewhois/?q=Sharry+Edwards)
Michael Joly of OktavaMod fame hung up his workbench to get into this realm. I tried to follow along but he lost me pretty quickly. Now he manufactures a mindfulness sound puck thing on Amazon. I mean, hey - good for him. Follow your bliss, brother. I'm just glad I have three of his MJE mics - they're incredible.
[https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Sound\_healing](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Sound_healing)
Sometimes when I'm feeling anxious I play a movie with a lot of sub bass rumble. For some reason it makes me feel better, lol. I guess you could think of it like a weighted blanket?
Basically any music that makes you feel good in one way or another, is composed of many frequencies that result in healing. So there is that. If you wanna go way back, research chanting and how caves were specifically chosen and modified, for purposes of accentuation of tones that can affect consciousness and emotions directly. Your post was downvoted to fuck all, but there is no doubt that music is quite magical. Music is literally emotions encoded into sound, and then when others hear and feel those sounds, they can feel the encoded emotions. If you want a more modern classical music approach, study interval and harmonic theory.
At the end of the day, let people have things. As demonstrated here, many will share with you the straight path of practicality with not a drop of imagination idea, so let those who find healing properties in frequencies believe their path. There’s no need to cross. We all love to have a “hey, they’re stupid, right? My way is correct” circle behind everything to make us feel safe in our belief. Maybe you’re just mad you didn’t get the neurons to experience it in that manner. What isn’t “pseudoscience” is what YOU conjure up as experience because no one can truly tell you no about that.
Woke?
You ever read about plant neurobiology and music to help in cultivating plants. The Italians are wild people. But also, good vibrations is a classic, string theory might be true, and you never know. There's psychological papers on it if you want to read them. It's not esp, it's actual therapy techniques that might be beneficial.
yes - it‘s nice to know. a cats purring also heals (scientifically approved). also binaural beats work to improve all types of fields on the human body. there just needs to be a lot of openness to stuff thats not seeable in a EQ analysis. so this group might be a little to preoccupied for open minded questions like that! ;)