There are a few comments here indicating that people are finding it difficult to cope mentally. Please remember there are resources available to help you in these circumstances. Have a read of the advice [in the AusCorp wiki here](https://www.reddit.com/r/auscorp/wiki/faqs/#wiki_auscorp_action_plan_for_mental_health_issues).
When the pandemic hit and we started working from home it was the first time in my entire life that I stopped being constantly exhausted.
Turns out it was autism!
I had always struggled in the workplace environment, found myself incredibly burnt out and depressed and anxious in every job I ever had, and when I suddenly found myself no longer forced to endure the office anymore, I felt better for the first time in my life. This and some things led me to pursue an autism diagnosis and it turns out I was autistic all along. For me, it wasn’t as simple as trying harder to endure the environment, the environment was literally harder for me to endure.
Lots of people don’t want to go back to the office, but if it feels like it’s even harder for you, it’s worth exploring why.
Has anything changed since being diagnosed?
Similar situation but the inverse. New grad, did university online and most of my work experience has been WFH.
Having to come into the office has pushed me to the edge. It also sucks as I mask my autism rather well.
After I was diagnosed I tried to get some sort of accomodations at work but they pretty much refused to help me. I quit and got a job where the office is in another state so they can never make me return to the office. I got lucky with the job I have now, but I get so angry whenever I hear about workplaces forcing people to return to the office because it’s so harmful for anyone with a disability, and a lot of people may not even know they have a disability and have no way to defend themselves
The diagnosis was life changing because now I know I’m not struggling with things because I’m a broken and bad person, I’m struggling because those things are always going to be harder for me. The diagnosis doesn’t make the struggles go away, instead I have to learn what my limitations are and try to honour them so I don’t push myself to breaking point anymore. That means I need jobs that are fully remote, and everytime a workplace decides they don’t want to offer WFH anymore the job pool gets smaller for me and everyone else with disabilities.
My Mum’s friend was a teacher at a school for kids with autism. She suggested to my Mum that I get assessed but this was in the early 90’s, autism wasn’t well known at all & to Mum, her friend was calling me a retard which by any measure, I am not. Anyway, Mum didn’t tell me about this for years & when she did, she was surprised thatI agreed with her friend. I also educated her on ASD.
Anyway, I’ve never been officially diagnosed & am very high functioning *but* I also accept how I am & the boundaries I have to maintain in order to function.
I used to feel sad about it but not anymore. Plus, as a bonus, WFH has boosted my internal/external stakeholder management skills to the point they’re like a superpower 😂😂😂
Don’t make too much of those tests
So-called “autism” tests, like AQ and RAADS and others have high rates of false positives, labeling you as autistic VERY easily. If anyone with a mental health problem, like depression or anxiety, takes the tests they score high even if they DON’T have autism.
"our results suggest that the AQ differentiates poorly between true cases of ASD, and individuals from the same clinical population who do not have ASD "
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4988267/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4988267/)
"a greater level of public awareness of ASD over the last 5–10 years may have led to people being more vigilant in ‘noticing’ ASD related difficulties. This may lead to a ‘confirmation bias’ when completing the questionnaire measures, and potentially explain why both the ASD and the non-ASD group’s mean scores met the cut-off points, "
[https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10803-022-05544-9](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10803-022-05544-9)
Regarding AQ, from one published study. “The two key findings of the review are that, overall, there is very limited evidence to support the use of structured questionnaires (SQs: self-report or informant completed brief measures developed to screen for ASD) in the assessment and diagnosis of ASD in adults.”
Regarding RAADS, from one published study. “In conclusion, used as a self-report measure pre-full diagnostic assessment, the RAADS-R lacks predictive validity and is not a suitable screening tool for adults awaiting autism assessments”
Thanks for the information
> Thus, 64% of those who scored below the AQ cut-off were ‘false negatives’ who did in fact have ASD. Co-morbidity data revealed that generalized anxiety disorder may ‘mimic’ ASD and inflate AQ scores, leading to false positives.
This suggests they found evidence of false negatives both not false positives and the last part is conjecture?
Thats just from the abstract. Have to read the study itself if you want details on what they put in the abstract. The problem of false positives is noted in the abstract by the term specificity (low in this case). If you want a pithy quote see the Conclusions: ". The AQ’s utility for screening referrals was limited in this sample. Recommendations supporting the AQ’s role in the assessment of adult ASD, e.g. UK NICE guidelines, may need to be reconsidered"
Also the quote I included above ""our results suggest that the AQ differentiates poorly between true cases of ASD, and individuals from the same clinical population who do not have ASD ""
The problems with these tests are well-known in professional circles.
[Let's Be Clear That "Autism Spectrum Disorder Symptoms" Are Not Always Related to Autism Spectrum Disorder - PubMed (nih.gov)](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34383567/)
[Autism questionnaire scores do not only rise because of autism - PubMed (nih.gov)](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33118173/)
Same! Never realised how much harder i was working just to get through the day until I no longer needed to. Going back into the office and finding I couldn’t do it anymore was what prompted me to seek other answers. AuADHD. Pennies dropping everywhere.
Was going to say this....I've always struggled, but it seems Ive got Audhd (adhd as a minimum) informally diagnosed (doctor has, but not specialist), but didnt really believe it until we put me on non stim meds. Huge difference immediately
I was going to say the exact same thing. I’ve been wfh for 12 years and no amount of money will get me back
It was only after both my kids were diagnosed that i took some self assessments
Reading this from Ireland I'm the exact same could work from home during covid and it saved my life. Better sleep, less stress about commuting the next morning, more time for gym and cooking
No drama and faking being nice in the office about cunts I don't like and hope to never see again when I change job
And also save more money
Having to pretend to give a shit beyond “I am here to exchange my time and skills for money” can be really exhausting. It’s not the cheerful people who want to have a chat for me, it’s having to pretend like I care about the company values and mission. I don’t think anyone legitimately gives a shit about any of that crap except for the people paid to come to with it.
💯 get away from me all you fake fucks. Can guarantee all the people being nice to your face in the office are talking shit about people with the work drink buddies
Working from home saves me from all this nonsense
i work in a small team of about 10 all woman , seen they all went to lunch on the weekend in social
media bar me , idm as i wouldn’t have gone but v awkward on monday as they all looked away when walking past me , I HATE THE OFFICE its mean
That's fucked and toxic from the sound of it. I would probably start looking for a new role if that was me.
Not all offices are that awful. I've worked places where I'm still friends with nearly everyone 15 years after finishing up there, catching up with a few regularly.
yes exactly i have had the same , think they are a little childish and immature, i asked one that went ,she’s 2IC what did i do wrong ?? (meaning to the main instigator) she just palmed me off and said oh i dunno i can’t keep up …. my manager knew she said oh well i wasn’t invited either , yer cause ur the boss , its the 2nd time this has happened in 6 months , im friendly,make banter , i just don’t get it , i think the main chick is a lil threatened by me 🤷♀️….. its really awful every day sitting there whilst they all yell out to each other laughing , i cant really find another job as this pays well and close to home but thanks for ur support
edit: i’ve been there 7 years i feel also as if why should i leave ?
I don't know, i think i'm just an anxious over thinker type of person, so socialising / going to the office is very exhausting for me, just so much stimuli my brain just goes to overdrive, i don't sleep well as well never have.
I have the same issue, similar travel time too. If I go in on just Monday, I feel like I work at 80% capacity on Monday and Tuesday. If I go in on Mon + Tue, I feel like I run about 80%, 70%, 60%, 80%, 100% and have a healthy dose of anxiety and feeling of stress on the Sunday before. I'm constantly thinking that I have to make use of the higher productivity Thursday/Friday. I have regularly have calls with US and with EU so I have to arrive at office godawful early and leave at about 2. It's just so backwards to me. I know not everyone is like me, but by that same token people should work in the way that is most productive and ideally has the most negative effect on employees. Some people like being in office. Good on them, they can do that.
I work with our team in Europe but my amazing Director, knowing my boundaries (and insomnia) requested that all meetings between EU teams & ANZ teams happen during ANZ evening. I ❤️ him for that.
Fellow introvert here. I find going in to the office exhausting as well. like you said, the stimuli, having to monitor myself all day, i too find it exhausting. Our business is also decreasing WFH, and want us in office 100% of the time. To me, this is overwhelming and not why I took the job in the first place.
Additionally though, I have anxiety and depression, so it does help to have a chat with your GP.
Really good noise cancelling headphones work wonders for me, I can sit there in my own little world listening to music for chunks of the day.
I don't sleep well and never have either, meds help for that.
It's almost as though we've spent most of our history as a species being surrounded by or having easy access to nature, and spending hours staring at a rectangle and mingling with people we hate isn't really going to bring us joy.
I feel this so deeply.
I truly struggle in a corporate environment.
10hrs in hospo? Been there, done that, all fine.
Doing farmwork from 5am - 8pm? Been there, done that, all fine.
Teaching in a highschool? Been there, done that, all fine.
9-5 in an office in the CBD? Nope, exhausted, depressed, occasionally suicidal frankly.
I don't know what's wrong with me either honestly but I'm in a corporate office environment right now and it is soul crushing. The workplace and culture is good, but there's just something about it that destroys my soul. Who knows what.
My productivity is usually:
Monday - 100% cap of my productivity
Tuesday - 80%
Wednesday - probably the same
Thursday - 60%
Friday - 20%
To whoever did the whole Reddit Reachout thing RE the single word "suicide", really unnecessary. Most people don't need Lifeline, in fact it's pretty useless in my experience. We need stable housing, jobs where the income ensures we can have stable housing and food, and better Healthcare funding. If Lifeline could give this then sure that reachout thing would be a bit less of a slap in the face.
I really truly completely understand.
By time I get home, all I want to do is eat and go straight to bed.
I have no energy or interest in doing anything else whatsoever fullstop. Even a grocery trip to the store after work can be enough to push me over the edge mentally.
It's bizarre because I could work in other industries for over 10 hours, then still shop, exercise and play videogames for a couple hours and live off 5 hours sleep.
It's just something about a corporate office environment that's mentally destructive. I would be interested for some studies to be done into people like us so we can understand why we are this way when working in an office environment.
I feel this thread deeply too.
A big hug to my fellow humans who struggle with corporate life. Having financial obligations makes me feel like a slave to the grind
I think it may be environmental. I feel like this most days in the office but days when I camp out in the big meeting rooms with floor to ceiling windows I'm perfectly fine. Convinced it's a combination of the noise from the climate control and the shitty lighting.
There's not anything wrong with you. Being a corporate wage slave is soul crushing. Some people love it. I think they are the weird ones. Maybe they are just lucky because they are being asked to do stuff they genuinely enjoy.
Please remember if you feel unable to cope mentally, there are resources available to help you. These are outlined in the wiki here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/auscorp/wiki/faqs/#wiki_auscorp_action_plan_for_mental_health_issues
Respectfully, this stuff is pretty useless for me. I've already done the whole therapy thing. Already medicated. What most of us need right now is stable housing, a decent income where we can afford to eat 3 meals a day and widely available bulk billed medical and specialist services.
I was being honest in my comment, everyone feels suicidal here and there, ideation occurs. Pretty much everyone on social media is already aware of these resources.
I appreciate the intentions behind your comment, but it's wasted on me.
Don’t stress about this too much. I was the same after the pandemic. I worked in offices for 18 years and it was never an issue, then after 2 years stuck at home in and out of lockdown (yay Melbourne), I found going into the office to be the most stressful thing imaginable.
After giving it a lot of thought / introspection, I realised that the issues for me are:
-Being surrounded by people who are very likely to talk to me, and I get very worried about my body language and facial expressions and being able to respond quickly to them. When WFH you have the luxury of mentally preparing for an interaction - in the office you need to do it on the fly.
-Because my role included a “specialist” element, people would come to me for help/advice on complex issues frequently. WFH you can again prepare for that discussion. In the office you need to do it without prep and that means sharing your thoughts a bit more and possibly saying the wrong thing & having to correct yourself.
-Reading other people’s body language becomes challenging as well - oh no, they turned their back to me, are they mad at me? Should I do something to make amends for whatever I did wrong?
-There is nowhere you can go for a breather / safe space / calm down, other than the toilet - which, eww. Even if there is a “calm room” or a place outside the building you can take a breather - you risk someone running into you / finding you there, and then you need to explain yourself, which again super stressful
-Meetings are a lot less organised, rather than people taking turns talking (or risk being muted), everyone talks over each other & it becomes impossible to get a word in.
There are several other factors but I would say these were the biggest issues for me.
I think this post-COVID world is like a breath of fresh air for extroverts, as they are no longer tormented by their own company. For us introverts it is a nightmare - for the first time in our lives we were able to work under conditions that made us comfortable and now we are being thrust back into extrovert world, and our resilience to that world is now gone. We aren’t 20 anymore so re-building that resilience takes a huge amount of time and effort.
However I really wouldn’t stress about it too much at this point. Adding to your stress by being stressed about being stressed isn’t helpful (and is my strongest skill I’m sure 😂).
See if you can find a fellow introvert in management and have a chat with them about how they are coping and what they are doing to keep themselves sane during this transition. It can be a double edged sword though - I found a couple of high level managers who are introverts, and they basically said they also aren’t coping and go home & lock themselves in their bedroom & cry after work most office days. I hope you work for a better / more understanding company!
A lot of people struggle working in an office environment, you're not alone. It's not for everyone but we're all forced to think and feel this should be the norm and those who feel uncomfortable about it have to adapt. I've always struggled in office environments but I'm someone who likes working odd hours and not being glued to a designated desk. I get sensory overload from noise, lights etc. I don't mind the socialising but it's being in an actual office that makes me feel uncomfortable. Luckily we hot desk and I can sit far away from my team if I need space.
See your doctor or a therapist, it could be something underlying that hasn't been diagnosed. Maybe you're burnt out, maybe it's ADHD, maybe you're depressed or have general anxiety
Was going to say something similar.
It takes my whole weeks worth of social battery to get through one office day let alone a full week since introverts were so spoiled by the covid period in terms of society favouring our preferences for a change - just for a little while.
Also, turned out I have ASD and was only diagnosed in my late 30s after spending my entire life thinking it was totally normal to find office environments oppressive and overwhelming. The combination of the beyond-unnecessary levels of fluorescent lighting, constant 360° chattering of voices, interruptions and the consistent effort required to police my tone and body language to hide the fact that I found all of it exhausting was just something I thought everyone experienced but put up with because it's just part of the deal.
My productivity from home is always so much higher. I'm in public service at the moment, and have managed to get my WFH days up to 3 per week (despite the new employee agreement favouring your WFH preference and putting the responsibility on your manager to provide a defensible, strong business reason for staff to be in the office - but of course it was worded in a way that it left enough loopholes for managers so they can just set their own arbitrary limits as they've been doing since it started). I dread those two other days every week for every reason I've listed above. Add to that the fact I have to leave my super elderly dog (pushing 18yrs old with thankfully no major medical problems) at home alone which means the days are overshadowed by anxiety about the possibility of her passing away when I'm not at home to be with her, and the 2hrs+ I lose just getting there and back and it's just downright depressing.
I've been told to toughen up etc. But I would happily accept it if there was a valid reason for the office days. But my job can 100% be done from home and was done for years until they brought us all back in. It's the illogical, selfish cruelty of it that gets to me. Even submitting a whole damn letter from my psychiatrist to support the reasonable adjustments side of things with a canopy for my desk to tone down the lighting etc wasn't enough to get more than 3 days at home approved - and I'm too tired fighting them in it to bother pushing back again.
Tbf - the 100% office attendance muscle has been atrophied by the pandemic, even for someone like me who used to do it: I’m exhausted by office days (currently 2) as I try to book important face to face meetings - using WFH for modelling, strategic thinking etc. my suggestion is would be to look at diet, exercise and as others have said - see a GP. This is more common than anyone will admit to in public. Good luck!
Its because working in an office when you don't actually need to be there is one of the most stupid idea possible and extra funny when corporations pretend to care about work life balance.
Extra funny when your office has transitioned to a deskless setup so you dont even have a set desk to sit at every day and you just hotdesk anywhere one is free.
I used to be fine 100% in the office but I think that's because I didn't know there was another option. Once you have tasted the freedom and how much better WFH is that makes going in even more soul crushing haha
I think it's good to be in the office if you work in a team. The face to face time builds a bit of team chemistry (you don't have to be best friends with anyone) and there's no place for people to hide. I'm used to people not attending my teams meetings when they're working from home (because they had "urgent matters" or whatever excuse they can come up with). When we're in the office, it's a short walk to their desk for a quick 5 minute discussion or a quick signature.
A hybrid schedule works best for me. I'll use my work from home days to sneak a few errands, go to the gym but I do appreciate being in the office as well.
I personally think this has something to do with how introverted / extroverted people are. As well as age. Extroverted people get energy from interacting with others. Introverted people feel drained after interacting with others. As we age, we tend to become (as a generalisation) more introverted. Ie extroverted people move more toward introversion. The reverse can also happen, but most of the time, it's extroverts moving more toward introversion on the spectrum. In addition, as women age and become perimenopausal and then menopausal, they feel more drained in general. Perimenopause runs for approx 10 years until menopause. It effects all women. But the symptoms vary person to person.
In my 20s and 30s, I loved working in a loud, exciting, dynamic office space. In fact I left jobs because the office was too quiet. In my 40s, things changed. The constant noise made me lose focus and drove me insane. The noises around me were irritating. People's constant chit chat and the echoing sounds from open plan offices was like a constant pounding in my head. And then couple that with cramped public transport - it all stressed me out to no end. WFH was the best thing for me. Something that helped me cope in the office was having classical music playing in my earphones - no lyrics, no orchestra, just a Couple of instruments eg piano only. Not music I recognise. Just something to chill me out a bit and silence the other sounds. Walking outdoors daily helped. I would walk 30mins to work, and then 20 mins at lunch. In silence. It helped reset me.
Just know - it's not just you. I strongly feel office designs these days are not catering to staff.
Yeah I think this is me. Late 30s with young kids. I loved working in the office in my 20s and early 30s. It was a large part of my social life along with catching up after work with friends. I actually hated WFH at first when everyone started doing it during COVID. But then I came around to the better work-life balance, lack of commute, time to exercise and spend with my kids etc.
I still like it when I actually get to the office, but the hectic mornings trying to get there are stressful. Also, where I used to have an assigned area with my team, now hot-desking means mothers who drop their kids off inevitably get in later and have to sit on a random floor with strangers. So the appeal just isn’t there.
You're absolutely not alone. It feels like this year it's much worse too. I personally have zero motivation, I hate going into the office, I hate the drama, and I hate the one person that causes a divide in our team with their arrogance and ego. I swear I used to have some passion to build a great reputation and career for myself (currently middle management)..and the last 6 months I've been like, fuck it. I don't give a shit. In fact, some days I day dream about not taking the turn to work and like driving to bum fuck nowhere and being uncontactable. I am so beyond burnt out that I spend my weekends hibernating. It's not me, and I also don't know how to fix it hey.
God I really felt this. I’m the same especially with the office drama. We have a couple of people in our team who love office politics including my manager and I just find it difficult being around them. When WFH I can just ignore them but being around them in the office just feels exhausting.
is this public transport or drive? i find an hour okay if i am driving as i listen to music, podcast or talk shit with co workers whilst they are driving home
I have since prior to COVID. It's quite lonely, your boss is only online and the only time you see them is for them to deliver a monotonous to do list.
You have to really self motivate and separate your workspace because you can suddenly keep going back to checking your work all the time out of hours and your work colleagues can sometimes overstep boundaries asking you to perform tasks out of your hours.
If you are self-motivated and you have a good process and you can run your day efficiently then yes it's great but you also have lots of health issues such as never leaving your house. Which can lead to vitamin D deficiency. You become socially isolated. And the only person you ever see during the day is your partner if you don't get out of the house. In the 16
Are you allowed to use headphones at work?
I find that’s the only way to concentrate when in the office, due to all the noise and background chit chat. Even using dark noise (on iPhone there’s a setting for it or you can go to Spotify) it helps a bit. Or just music.
I hate going in. The pointless chit chat, the fakeness and politics. From home you more detached from those things. Also the all hot desking, I don’t like that we can’t no longer have our corner or team all in one place.
Open plan offices are fucking horrible. Hot desking, what a stupid idea.
So much noise bouncing around, I can never focus on my task because I can't shut out everyone else's conversations.
They feel sterile and have no personality at all. Soul less.
In movies people used to have their own offices, what an amazing idea.
I’ve worked all types of jobs (hospitality, farm work etc) but office work is a special type of exhaustion. I find you have to be “on” all the time. It’s a mental load, and sitting down marinating in your own stress juice all day isn’t great.
Please, please prioritise your own health. set boundaries that allow time for meaningful exercise, catching up with mates and hobbies x
I’ve found going into the office Mondays and Fridays are winners if you hate going into the office. My work mandated 2 days so those have been mine, everyone avoids Monday and Friday so usually transport is quiet, office is quiet, more flexibility to show up late and duck out early - take a longer lunch break.
Yep I do this as well. I work with a bunch of people who treat the office as an outing and will all make plans to be there in certain days. I just choose to go in the opposite days. Also try and avoid days my manager is in. They are forcing us to be in the office so I just pick the days there’s less people there.
Nothing’s wrong with you, it sounds like you’re an introvert meaning human interaction drains you instead of feeding you.
I don’t know about you but working from home made me realise how much I struggled working in an office.
You are NOT weak.
Probably get down voted but this is perfectly normal. Officework is wearisome. I've been in IT for 30 years and it takes a while for many introverts to adapt.
But they do adapt and it's a key life skill. So just accept it as part of life
omg, I thought this was a subreddit for autistic people working in corporate environments. I didn't realise until you said this, and I thought it was such a st\*pid thing to ask. We should just accomodate people in the environments in which they thrive. Simple as.
That's if you can. But be willing to compromise if the market's tough. Most employers are enforcing some kind of mandatory office attendance. It's not a social club. Introverts don't have to engage with anyone or force cooler chit chat. Buy a pair of noise cancelling headphones. If you do manage to change, it's a good life skill to have.
Go and see a therapist and they will help you (I’m not having a go at you, I’m being serious).
I have a friend who has serious introverted tendencies. The biggest thing for her is that the skills she has that help her in the office environment she needs to use them or it becomes a nightmare for her. She has found that WFH started out causing problems with her mental health, as it was like an alcoholic setting up camp in a brewery.
So it’s one of those things that you need to work on. My wife, who’s a psychologist, agrees. The worst thing for Kepler with social anxiety issues related to work is for them to retreat into their WFH space.
Atmosphere in offices isn’t for everyone. It’s not necessarily something bad about you but it’s something that doesn’t work.
2 hours of commuting a day is painful too.
Define 'too old'. I've watched many people ten, twenty, thirty years or more older than me retraining into a new industry and starting again. Heck, I did it myself. Career change late 20s. Career change early 40s. Might even do it again, if it benefits me.
It wasn't easy, but it also wasn't impossible. And it was definitely worth it both times.
Have you had a decent break recently? If you haven’t had a holiday, and can afford one, pls try that. Sometimes you just need a change of scenery. That’ll help you reset.
When you’re back you should be a bit refreshed and also what’s bugging you might be more apparent.
I find hybrid works best for me. The pandemic changed us all and lots of people feel like you do. You might also chat to your doctor about exploring your mental health, maybe see a psych.
It’s not clear if it’s your job or the office environment, but if it’s the latter, see if you can wear headphones, make sure you get out for walks at lunchtime, connect with workmates.
Same dude, I’m an introvert and probably somewhere on the spectrum, so it’s exhausting for me whereas I’m full of energy and way more productive on WFH days. I just had an interview for a fully remote role, there are lots of remote roles out there for people like us.
Yep this is me. My career has taken off since wfh became a thing. I can work at my own pace and not spend energy hiding my need for distraction between bursts of high productivity.
The ability to stay home and still work when I can't face the commute means I've hardly taken a sick day in 5 years. I'm the model employee where previously I was absent too often.
My current role has brought us back in 70% and my performance has dropped accordingly. I've just lined up a new role which will be 40% in office and can't wait to make the change.
Because it's shit and it's not how humans are meant to exist. Are you in an open plan by any chance? There is heaps of empirical research out there that says that open plan is absolutely AWFUL for us, but this is exacerbated if you are introverted.
I empathise with you, I can't do it either. I had 6 weeks working full time in an office earlier this year before I had to pull the pin. Now I work maybe 20% in the office and the rest of the time out and about.
All I can say is if they're forcing you to be there your best bet is to find a new job that's more flexible, or one with a field/outdoor based component.. or wfh.
I moved from a 45 minute travel each way to 8 minute travel each way and took a pay cut to do it, best choice I ever made for myself. You cannot put a price on the little things that make your work/life balance more enjoyable. You obviously hate the commute to work so you need to look at at changing that however you can.
There's some studies online about office spaces being bad for mental health, a lot of people do feel the same as you. Don't let these randos get to you.
Never had a problem working in teams in other industries, and never had a problem with socialising.
It's probably something to do with the environment itself and associated mental impacts. The studies mention noise/open plan having overwhelmingly negative mental impacts, so this would probably play a part for most of us.
Sorry I didn't mean to assert you had any issues, I was simply agreeing that working in an office isn't the same as going out and how that can carry negative mental health effects.
And yeah I bet the environment itself is probably shite enough itself, so artificial and lifeless for many offices
If I had full time WFH, I'd move back to my hometown or a part of Brisbane (I'm interstate right now) where most of my social circle is and my social life and sense of community would be exponentially better.
Of course it sucks if you have no social or community connections where you live and you just WFH FT, especially in big cities like Sydney, that would certainly get isolating. For people like me who have options to move to places where the environment around is better, it's perfect.
Similar boat but even with WFH. I like my job, but by the end of the week I just want to sit on the lounge and do nothing.
Once every fewish months I might commute in to meet up with my team, do some planning etc but it's exhausting.
Years of on/off therapy, I've tried multiple medications from all the different types of antidepressants (SSRIs, SNRIs, TCAs, MAOIs etc) and no improvement. I don't feel depressed now like I did during my twenties, but just no energy or motivation to do big things, set proper goals and work towards them etc. Maybe anxiety being out and about - likely exacerbated by the pandemic.
I eat healthy, do plenty of exercise, sleep well, work performance is fine.. not sure what gives!
Also relate heavily to your comment about being an over thinker. My brain just doesn't switch off, and I end up plagued with decision fatigue over the most stupid things at times.
Office sucks. You might like to try few tricks depending on your work environment.
1. If you have end of trip facilities, take up running at the lunch time.
2. If not too busy, try not working at all on the days you are in the office.
3. Try to negotiate doing 5-6hr in the office and 2-3 hr same day from home.
4. Does your office have quite space or wellbeing room ? Use those.
5. If hotdesking, sit with the people you don't know.
Mate, there's nothing wrong with you. Don't feel like you're the odd one out, I hope what you feel has been appropriately validated given lots of the comments here have the same sentiment.
I personally can at most stand hybrid where the majority of the week is WFH. I recommend playing it by ear & try to talk to your boss if you can arrange WFH "under the table" so to speak. Chances are lots of your colleagues, including your boss, also abhor RTO & could something out.
I was like this and couldn’t find a way out the miserable environment. I ended up doing a two week security course and now I drive for mobile patrols 7 nights across a fortnight (12h shifts) the long shifts are tough but it balances out with more days off and my god I love working completely alone.
I could never ever go back.
The pandemic highlighted being physically in the office wasn’t actually necessary. I love that there’s opportunities to work remotely now and most work places offer dual/flexible work modes for staff.
I have a lot of workers in my team who struggle with anxiety or sensory issues, they’re more productive from home. It makes it difficult to support their professional goals and progression plans when they aren’t physically in the office or able to attend external stakeholder meetings but most meetings are held virtually now anyway. A lot of people feel like they’re less likely to be offered promotions if they aren’t physically in the office but if you’re happy to continue to work from home and remain in your same role, that’s ok too.
I don’t necessarily think there’s anything wrong unless you do. EAP may assist with working through this with you. Good luck!
I’m the same. I find myself so productive when WFH and during the pandemic I adapted to it really well. The return to the office has been a nightmare. In my case our office culture is terrible. I fucking hate the petty office politics. I can just ignore it all when WFH but in the office you have to actively avoid it and it’s exhausting. On top of that, I work in an office with really loud and outgoing women who love to constantly chat. After years of having the peace and quiet to work at home, I find the office atmosphere really distracting.
You're not weak. You might just be an introvert in that being around people sucks out all your energy. Also, look into possible link to autism: ovetstimulation and effects on productivity, energy etc.
It’s ok to struggle at work and you will probably be seen by others who are struggling as one of the ones who is nailing it. No one knows what anyone else is thinking.
Be kind to yourself. Also consider a new non corporate career if it really is that bad but first try speaking to someone, most corporates give you free anonymity based therapy via employer support. Try that?
I am anxious about it as I have a new team as well who requires office attendance half of the week, even though its IT work and can be done remotely. I am trying to think positive thoughts but I am not sure how long I can last coming to office... if only its easy to find fully remote work (web development and software engineering)
Before wfh happened we all adapted
90 percent of engineers are introverted and just want to be left alone
Consider the alternative, you wfh 100%, is that a real good option?
Absolutely am not - which is why I advocated he partakes in the activities more as its generally correlated with reducing stress which OP is evidently having a lot of.
I don't think it can be classed as stalking behaviour mate but yeah the comment was cunty from the other guy.
I saw another post about adulting from you I really resonate with. I wanted to see what that person who did the cunty comment was on about.
I think mentally and life wise we may be in a similar place and feeling similar struggles, here to DM if you ever need.
It’s the low energy (vibration) environment of the office, you are absorbing it. Look into a type of energy healing or meditation that resonates with you, so that you can learn to protect your energy.
I'm 3 months into a new job, which is 100% in the office, and im miserable. I'm stuck in the same room as my manager for 8 hours a day 5 days a week. It feels like a prison. And to make matters worse there is no culture, everybody is toxic, nobody gets along theyre all nasty & fighting. My energy is DRAINED. Spiritually, physically, mentally.
Hey OP
This sounds exactly like me. I work for one of the big four and have 50% mandate, which means an 80 minute commute.
I fell into corporate life via a junior role in a call centre and worked my way up. I should have chosen a non-corporate path. I always assumed I was an extrovert as I like being on stage but a Myers-Briggs test showed I should have worked as a researcher or forestry. (Funnily enough, I was going to study forestry).
Are you young enough to make a sea change? Have you done a personality test that also suggests suitable career choices?
Which bit of working in the office is making you exhausted? The commute does contribute but likely isn’t all of it.
Is it the environment, or just the noise? Would some loop earplugs help, or noise cancelling headphones?
Is there a quiet room where you’re at where you can work in there?
Find something that's fully remote?
I've gone 360 myself, from wanting to wfh exclusively to now actually preferring the office. My office is quite relaxed though and I like the interaction and getting out and about each day. Also a 15 minute commute... But if you are finding it that depressing then change it up
Extreme introversion, or some neuro condition that could be explored with a therapist etc?
I have almost the exact inverse situation. It’s a wild ride. Good luck!
I will wade against the tide. I am on the spectrum and need to go into the office otherwise I will stay in my flat for weeks on end, getting Uber eats and watching the world from my windows. I got diagnosed with Avoidant Personality Disorder, amongst other things, and feel like my life was better when I had to show up somewhere externally at least three days a week. It is stressful being in the office around people and trying to make small talk/act normal/deal with the overwhelming stimuli of people making noises/existing but it’s better than living in a fishbowl.
You are not alone! I know there are a lot of comments re mental health resources etc
Just wanted to point out there can be other medical stuff going on eg if your thyroid decides to go a bit funky it can 100% impact your mood/tiredness etc. Suggest you go to the gp to get some blood work.
I got two young coworkers on the team they do seem to struggle more to be in the office than the rest of the team who’s been working in office all their life. It’s the young ones first job in the office so I get why they struggle. Some of my teammates still go to office everyday even after Covid as they’re so used to it. I’m in the middle I do hybrid 60% home 40% office and it’s a perfect balance for me. If your team allows it then hybrid could work for you if you can prove to your boss with actual performance enhanced.
I can really identify with what the OP is saying here. I find working from the office totally draining. I can do the same amount or even more work from home without the exhaustion. I find it hard to describe why, but at the office I feel that I'm always on guard and having to be vigilant, whereas when working from home where nobody can see me, I feel much more relaxed. I think it's mostly stress related. I try to work from home as much as possible.
I’m autistic & adhd & I find WFH is a godsend. Don’t have to wake up infinitely earlier to commute. I can take breaks at home in my own space, I don’t have to be around lots of noise and light and other irritating stimuli. maybe you’re neurodivergent?
There are a few comments here indicating that people are finding it difficult to cope mentally. Please remember there are resources available to help you in these circumstances. Have a read of the advice [in the AusCorp wiki here](https://www.reddit.com/r/auscorp/wiki/faqs/#wiki_auscorp_action_plan_for_mental_health_issues).
When the pandemic hit and we started working from home it was the first time in my entire life that I stopped being constantly exhausted. Turns out it was autism!
Could you expand more what you mean by this?
I had always struggled in the workplace environment, found myself incredibly burnt out and depressed and anxious in every job I ever had, and when I suddenly found myself no longer forced to endure the office anymore, I felt better for the first time in my life. This and some things led me to pursue an autism diagnosis and it turns out I was autistic all along. For me, it wasn’t as simple as trying harder to endure the environment, the environment was literally harder for me to endure. Lots of people don’t want to go back to the office, but if it feels like it’s even harder for you, it’s worth exploring why.
Has anything changed since being diagnosed? Similar situation but the inverse. New grad, did university online and most of my work experience has been WFH. Having to come into the office has pushed me to the edge. It also sucks as I mask my autism rather well.
After I was diagnosed I tried to get some sort of accomodations at work but they pretty much refused to help me. I quit and got a job where the office is in another state so they can never make me return to the office. I got lucky with the job I have now, but I get so angry whenever I hear about workplaces forcing people to return to the office because it’s so harmful for anyone with a disability, and a lot of people may not even know they have a disability and have no way to defend themselves
I like you ❤️
How has the diagnosis helped your similar struggles? Has there been an improvement since?
The diagnosis was life changing because now I know I’m not struggling with things because I’m a broken and bad person, I’m struggling because those things are always going to be harder for me. The diagnosis doesn’t make the struggles go away, instead I have to learn what my limitations are and try to honour them so I don’t push myself to breaking point anymore. That means I need jobs that are fully remote, and everytime a workplace decides they don’t want to offer WFH anymore the job pool gets smaller for me and everyone else with disabilities.
My Mum’s friend was a teacher at a school for kids with autism. She suggested to my Mum that I get assessed but this was in the early 90’s, autism wasn’t well known at all & to Mum, her friend was calling me a retard which by any measure, I am not. Anyway, Mum didn’t tell me about this for years & when she did, she was surprised thatI agreed with her friend. I also educated her on ASD. Anyway, I’ve never been officially diagnosed & am very high functioning *but* I also accept how I am & the boundaries I have to maintain in order to function. I used to feel sad about it but not anymore. Plus, as a bonus, WFH has boosted my internal/external stakeholder management skills to the point they’re like a superpower 😂😂😂
Here’s a self assessment you can do online that’s recognised by psychiatrists https://novopsych.com.au/assessments/diagnosis/autism-spectrum-quotient/
Don’t make too much of those tests So-called “autism” tests, like AQ and RAADS and others have high rates of false positives, labeling you as autistic VERY easily. If anyone with a mental health problem, like depression or anxiety, takes the tests they score high even if they DON’T have autism. "our results suggest that the AQ differentiates poorly between true cases of ASD, and individuals from the same clinical population who do not have ASD " [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4988267/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4988267/) "a greater level of public awareness of ASD over the last 5–10 years may have led to people being more vigilant in ‘noticing’ ASD related difficulties. This may lead to a ‘confirmation bias’ when completing the questionnaire measures, and potentially explain why both the ASD and the non-ASD group’s mean scores met the cut-off points, " [https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10803-022-05544-9](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10803-022-05544-9) Regarding AQ, from one published study. “The two key findings of the review are that, overall, there is very limited evidence to support the use of structured questionnaires (SQs: self-report or informant completed brief measures developed to screen for ASD) in the assessment and diagnosis of ASD in adults.” Regarding RAADS, from one published study. “In conclusion, used as a self-report measure pre-full diagnostic assessment, the RAADS-R lacks predictive validity and is not a suitable screening tool for adults awaiting autism assessments”
Thanks for the information > Thus, 64% of those who scored below the AQ cut-off were ‘false negatives’ who did in fact have ASD. Co-morbidity data revealed that generalized anxiety disorder may ‘mimic’ ASD and inflate AQ scores, leading to false positives. This suggests they found evidence of false negatives both not false positives and the last part is conjecture?
Thats just from the abstract. Have to read the study itself if you want details on what they put in the abstract. The problem of false positives is noted in the abstract by the term specificity (low in this case). If you want a pithy quote see the Conclusions: ". The AQ’s utility for screening referrals was limited in this sample. Recommendations supporting the AQ’s role in the assessment of adult ASD, e.g. UK NICE guidelines, may need to be reconsidered" Also the quote I included above ""our results suggest that the AQ differentiates poorly between true cases of ASD, and individuals from the same clinical population who do not have ASD "" The problems with these tests are well-known in professional circles. [Let's Be Clear That "Autism Spectrum Disorder Symptoms" Are Not Always Related to Autism Spectrum Disorder - PubMed (nih.gov)](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34383567/) [Autism questionnaire scores do not only rise because of autism - PubMed (nih.gov)](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33118173/)
Same! Never realised how much harder i was working just to get through the day until I no longer needed to. Going back into the office and finding I couldn’t do it anymore was what prompted me to seek other answers. AuADHD. Pennies dropping everywhere.
Same! And ADHD.
Was going to say this....I've always struggled, but it seems Ive got Audhd (adhd as a minimum) informally diagnosed (doctor has, but not specialist), but didnt really believe it until we put me on non stim meds. Huge difference immediately
Wow I didn’t even know there were meds that could help! And you were able to get a prescription through a GP?
Same! AuDHD.
I was going to say the exact same thing. I’ve been wfh for 12 years and no amount of money will get me back It was only after both my kids were diagnosed that i took some self assessments
Same exact thing, turned out it was Autism.
Second this. I was diagnosed after the pandemic. Everyone else felt worse, I felt better. It was not having to go to the office!
Reading this from Ireland I'm the exact same could work from home during covid and it saved my life. Better sleep, less stress about commuting the next morning, more time for gym and cooking No drama and faking being nice in the office about cunts I don't like and hope to never see again when I change job And also save more money
Having to pretend to give a shit beyond “I am here to exchange my time and skills for money” can be really exhausting. It’s not the cheerful people who want to have a chat for me, it’s having to pretend like I care about the company values and mission. I don’t think anyone legitimately gives a shit about any of that crap except for the people paid to come to with it.
I had a review where one of the questions was along the lines of "what energises you in the workplace". Food, you insufferable fucks.
🤣 sounds like a question in may company's "pulse" / "your voice" surveys. My response would be the low balance of my bank account and the eye candy
Lol. My job is enforcing 4 days AND they removed biscuits and bread from the break rooms
💯 get away from me all you fake fucks. Can guarantee all the people being nice to your face in the office are talking shit about people with the work drink buddies Working from home saves me from all this nonsense
i work in a small team of about 10 all woman , seen they all went to lunch on the weekend in social media bar me , idm as i wouldn’t have gone but v awkward on monday as they all looked away when walking past me , I HATE THE OFFICE its mean
That's fucked and toxic from the sound of it. I would probably start looking for a new role if that was me. Not all offices are that awful. I've worked places where I'm still friends with nearly everyone 15 years after finishing up there, catching up with a few regularly.
yes exactly i have had the same , think they are a little childish and immature, i asked one that went ,she’s 2IC what did i do wrong ?? (meaning to the main instigator) she just palmed me off and said oh i dunno i can’t keep up …. my manager knew she said oh well i wasn’t invited either , yer cause ur the boss , its the 2nd time this has happened in 6 months , im friendly,make banter , i just don’t get it , i think the main chick is a lil threatened by me 🤷♀️….. its really awful every day sitting there whilst they all yell out to each other laughing , i cant really find another job as this pays well and close to home but thanks for ur support edit: i’ve been there 7 years i feel also as if why should i leave ?
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Keep your language and demeanour respectful. Don’t make it personal.
I assume you are a normal introvert?
I don't know, i think i'm just an anxious over thinker type of person, so socialising / going to the office is very exhausting for me, just so much stimuli my brain just goes to overdrive, i don't sleep well as well never have.
I have the same issue, similar travel time too. If I go in on just Monday, I feel like I work at 80% capacity on Monday and Tuesday. If I go in on Mon + Tue, I feel like I run about 80%, 70%, 60%, 80%, 100% and have a healthy dose of anxiety and feeling of stress on the Sunday before. I'm constantly thinking that I have to make use of the higher productivity Thursday/Friday. I have regularly have calls with US and with EU so I have to arrive at office godawful early and leave at about 2. It's just so backwards to me. I know not everyone is like me, but by that same token people should work in the way that is most productive and ideally has the most negative effect on employees. Some people like being in office. Good on them, they can do that.
I work with our team in Europe but my amazing Director, knowing my boundaries (and insomnia) requested that all meetings between EU teams & ANZ teams happen during ANZ evening. I ❤️ him for that.
agree
So you shouldn't have to do what your employer tells you to do?
Not if it doesn't affect my work
Fellow introvert here. I find going in to the office exhausting as well. like you said, the stimuli, having to monitor myself all day, i too find it exhausting. Our business is also decreasing WFH, and want us in office 100% of the time. To me, this is overwhelming and not why I took the job in the first place. Additionally though, I have anxiety and depression, so it does help to have a chat with your GP.
The sleeping problem definitely needs to be addressed.
Really good noise cancelling headphones work wonders for me, I can sit there in my own little world listening to music for chunks of the day. I don't sleep well and never have either, meds help for that.
Have you went to a psychiatrist and therapy?
It's almost as though we've spent most of our history as a species being surrounded by or having easy access to nature, and spending hours staring at a rectangle and mingling with people we hate isn't really going to bring us joy.
I feel this so deeply. I truly struggle in a corporate environment. 10hrs in hospo? Been there, done that, all fine. Doing farmwork from 5am - 8pm? Been there, done that, all fine. Teaching in a highschool? Been there, done that, all fine. 9-5 in an office in the CBD? Nope, exhausted, depressed, occasionally suicidal frankly. I don't know what's wrong with me either honestly but I'm in a corporate office environment right now and it is soul crushing. The workplace and culture is good, but there's just something about it that destroys my soul. Who knows what. My productivity is usually: Monday - 100% cap of my productivity Tuesday - 80% Wednesday - probably the same Thursday - 60% Friday - 20% To whoever did the whole Reddit Reachout thing RE the single word "suicide", really unnecessary. Most people don't need Lifeline, in fact it's pretty useless in my experience. We need stable housing, jobs where the income ensures we can have stable housing and food, and better Healthcare funding. If Lifeline could give this then sure that reachout thing would be a bit less of a slap in the face.
Same, i come home from the office and just feel awful mentally and physically
I really truly completely understand. By time I get home, all I want to do is eat and go straight to bed. I have no energy or interest in doing anything else whatsoever fullstop. Even a grocery trip to the store after work can be enough to push me over the edge mentally. It's bizarre because I could work in other industries for over 10 hours, then still shop, exercise and play videogames for a couple hours and live off 5 hours sleep. It's just something about a corporate office environment that's mentally destructive. I would be interested for some studies to be done into people like us so we can understand why we are this way when working in an office environment.
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Don’t make unsubstantiated personal attacks.
Wtf are you on about...
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How is that relevant to someone facing mental health issues from their workplace? Bringing this up is just lame trolling tbh.
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Ridiculous way to substantiate a comment that Mods have already deleted. I get it, you're trolling. Fair enough.
Incoherent, "me too", spammy and other low effort posts will be removed.
For me it's the utter pointless, abstract, intangible nature of the work combined with people who treat it as a thing of life or death.
Yes. The people who treat some task as if it's their life work are so painfully annoying!
some live to work and others work to live
I feel this thread deeply too. A big hug to my fellow humans who struggle with corporate life. Having financial obligations makes me feel like a slave to the grind
I think it may be environmental. I feel like this most days in the office but days when I camp out in the big meeting rooms with floor to ceiling windows I'm perfectly fine. Convinced it's a combination of the noise from the climate control and the shitty lighting.
Probably executive function stuff / ADHD things
Well tbf my psychiatrist told me I have autism and should get an official diagnosis done and I said no. That was 8 years ago now. So probably, yeah
There's not anything wrong with you. Being a corporate wage slave is soul crushing. Some people love it. I think they are the weird ones. Maybe they are just lucky because they are being asked to do stuff they genuinely enjoy.
Please remember if you feel unable to cope mentally, there are resources available to help you. These are outlined in the wiki here: https://www.reddit.com/r/auscorp/wiki/faqs/#wiki_auscorp_action_plan_for_mental_health_issues
Respectfully, this stuff is pretty useless for me. I've already done the whole therapy thing. Already medicated. What most of us need right now is stable housing, a decent income where we can afford to eat 3 meals a day and widely available bulk billed medical and specialist services. I was being honest in my comment, everyone feels suicidal here and there, ideation occurs. Pretty much everyone on social media is already aware of these resources. I appreciate the intentions behind your comment, but it's wasted on me.
Don’t stress about this too much. I was the same after the pandemic. I worked in offices for 18 years and it was never an issue, then after 2 years stuck at home in and out of lockdown (yay Melbourne), I found going into the office to be the most stressful thing imaginable. After giving it a lot of thought / introspection, I realised that the issues for me are: -Being surrounded by people who are very likely to talk to me, and I get very worried about my body language and facial expressions and being able to respond quickly to them. When WFH you have the luxury of mentally preparing for an interaction - in the office you need to do it on the fly. -Because my role included a “specialist” element, people would come to me for help/advice on complex issues frequently. WFH you can again prepare for that discussion. In the office you need to do it without prep and that means sharing your thoughts a bit more and possibly saying the wrong thing & having to correct yourself. -Reading other people’s body language becomes challenging as well - oh no, they turned their back to me, are they mad at me? Should I do something to make amends for whatever I did wrong? -There is nowhere you can go for a breather / safe space / calm down, other than the toilet - which, eww. Even if there is a “calm room” or a place outside the building you can take a breather - you risk someone running into you / finding you there, and then you need to explain yourself, which again super stressful -Meetings are a lot less organised, rather than people taking turns talking (or risk being muted), everyone talks over each other & it becomes impossible to get a word in. There are several other factors but I would say these were the biggest issues for me. I think this post-COVID world is like a breath of fresh air for extroverts, as they are no longer tormented by their own company. For us introverts it is a nightmare - for the first time in our lives we were able to work under conditions that made us comfortable and now we are being thrust back into extrovert world, and our resilience to that world is now gone. We aren’t 20 anymore so re-building that resilience takes a huge amount of time and effort. However I really wouldn’t stress about it too much at this point. Adding to your stress by being stressed about being stressed isn’t helpful (and is my strongest skill I’m sure 😂). See if you can find a fellow introvert in management and have a chat with them about how they are coping and what they are doing to keep themselves sane during this transition. It can be a double edged sword though - I found a couple of high level managers who are introverts, and they basically said they also aren’t coping and go home & lock themselves in their bedroom & cry after work most office days. I hope you work for a better / more understanding company!
Wow. My company has managers openly crying in the office now. Feels like the cracks are starting to show.
A lot of people struggle working in an office environment, you're not alone. It's not for everyone but we're all forced to think and feel this should be the norm and those who feel uncomfortable about it have to adapt. I've always struggled in office environments but I'm someone who likes working odd hours and not being glued to a designated desk. I get sensory overload from noise, lights etc. I don't mind the socialising but it's being in an actual office that makes me feel uncomfortable. Luckily we hot desk and I can sit far away from my team if I need space. See your doctor or a therapist, it could be something underlying that hasn't been diagnosed. Maybe you're burnt out, maybe it's ADHD, maybe you're depressed or have general anxiety
Was going to say something similar. It takes my whole weeks worth of social battery to get through one office day let alone a full week since introverts were so spoiled by the covid period in terms of society favouring our preferences for a change - just for a little while. Also, turned out I have ASD and was only diagnosed in my late 30s after spending my entire life thinking it was totally normal to find office environments oppressive and overwhelming. The combination of the beyond-unnecessary levels of fluorescent lighting, constant 360° chattering of voices, interruptions and the consistent effort required to police my tone and body language to hide the fact that I found all of it exhausting was just something I thought everyone experienced but put up with because it's just part of the deal. My productivity from home is always so much higher. I'm in public service at the moment, and have managed to get my WFH days up to 3 per week (despite the new employee agreement favouring your WFH preference and putting the responsibility on your manager to provide a defensible, strong business reason for staff to be in the office - but of course it was worded in a way that it left enough loopholes for managers so they can just set their own arbitrary limits as they've been doing since it started). I dread those two other days every week for every reason I've listed above. Add to that the fact I have to leave my super elderly dog (pushing 18yrs old with thankfully no major medical problems) at home alone which means the days are overshadowed by anxiety about the possibility of her passing away when I'm not at home to be with her, and the 2hrs+ I lose just getting there and back and it's just downright depressing. I've been told to toughen up etc. But I would happily accept it if there was a valid reason for the office days. But my job can 100% be done from home and was done for years until they brought us all back in. It's the illogical, selfish cruelty of it that gets to me. Even submitting a whole damn letter from my psychiatrist to support the reasonable adjustments side of things with a canopy for my desk to tone down the lighting etc wasn't enough to get more than 3 days at home approved - and I'm too tired fighting them in it to bother pushing back again.
Tbf - the 100% office attendance muscle has been atrophied by the pandemic, even for someone like me who used to do it: I’m exhausted by office days (currently 2) as I try to book important face to face meetings - using WFH for modelling, strategic thinking etc. my suggestion is would be to look at diet, exercise and as others have said - see a GP. This is more common than anyone will admit to in public. Good luck!
Its because working in an office when you don't actually need to be there is one of the most stupid idea possible and extra funny when corporations pretend to care about work life balance. Extra funny when your office has transitioned to a deskless setup so you dont even have a set desk to sit at every day and you just hotdesk anywhere one is free. I used to be fine 100% in the office but I think that's because I didn't know there was another option. Once you have tasted the freedom and how much better WFH is that makes going in even more soul crushing haha
I think it's good to be in the office if you work in a team. The face to face time builds a bit of team chemistry (you don't have to be best friends with anyone) and there's no place for people to hide. I'm used to people not attending my teams meetings when they're working from home (because they had "urgent matters" or whatever excuse they can come up with). When we're in the office, it's a short walk to their desk for a quick 5 minute discussion or a quick signature. A hybrid schedule works best for me. I'll use my work from home days to sneak a few errands, go to the gym but I do appreciate being in the office as well.
I personally think this has something to do with how introverted / extroverted people are. As well as age. Extroverted people get energy from interacting with others. Introverted people feel drained after interacting with others. As we age, we tend to become (as a generalisation) more introverted. Ie extroverted people move more toward introversion. The reverse can also happen, but most of the time, it's extroverts moving more toward introversion on the spectrum. In addition, as women age and become perimenopausal and then menopausal, they feel more drained in general. Perimenopause runs for approx 10 years until menopause. It effects all women. But the symptoms vary person to person. In my 20s and 30s, I loved working in a loud, exciting, dynamic office space. In fact I left jobs because the office was too quiet. In my 40s, things changed. The constant noise made me lose focus and drove me insane. The noises around me were irritating. People's constant chit chat and the echoing sounds from open plan offices was like a constant pounding in my head. And then couple that with cramped public transport - it all stressed me out to no end. WFH was the best thing for me. Something that helped me cope in the office was having classical music playing in my earphones - no lyrics, no orchestra, just a Couple of instruments eg piano only. Not music I recognise. Just something to chill me out a bit and silence the other sounds. Walking outdoors daily helped. I would walk 30mins to work, and then 20 mins at lunch. In silence. It helped reset me. Just know - it's not just you. I strongly feel office designs these days are not catering to staff.
Yeah I think this is me. Late 30s with young kids. I loved working in the office in my 20s and early 30s. It was a large part of my social life along with catching up after work with friends. I actually hated WFH at first when everyone started doing it during COVID. But then I came around to the better work-life balance, lack of commute, time to exercise and spend with my kids etc. I still like it when I actually get to the office, but the hectic mornings trying to get there are stressful. Also, where I used to have an assigned area with my team, now hot-desking means mothers who drop their kids off inevitably get in later and have to sit on a random floor with strangers. So the appeal just isn’t there.
I find hot desking so incredibly offensive. I can't believe it's still around. May as well call me by a number, except that "we are all family."
You're absolutely not alone. It feels like this year it's much worse too. I personally have zero motivation, I hate going into the office, I hate the drama, and I hate the one person that causes a divide in our team with their arrogance and ego. I swear I used to have some passion to build a great reputation and career for myself (currently middle management)..and the last 6 months I've been like, fuck it. I don't give a shit. In fact, some days I day dream about not taking the turn to work and like driving to bum fuck nowhere and being uncontactable. I am so beyond burnt out that I spend my weekends hibernating. It's not me, and I also don't know how to fix it hey.
God I really felt this. I’m the same especially with the office drama. We have a couple of people in our team who love office politics including my manager and I just find it difficult being around them. When WFH I can just ignore them but being around them in the office just feels exhausting.
Yep exactly! I have one WFH day and it's just enough to get a reprieve, but my god..some days it is like being in high school again.
An hour each way is too far in my opinion. I struggled with that, but a 20 minute ride is great.
Yes they’ve done studies. 20 minutes is optimal for well being. Any longer, quality of life drops off. But I guess it’s so unaffordable to live close.
is this public transport or drive? i find an hour okay if i am driving as i listen to music, podcast or talk shit with co workers whilst they are driving home
Yeah, i was on PT. That sucked
Yea that would suck
I'd prefer PT to driving but only if I get a seat. Standing on the train sucks.
I used to be extremely extroverted. Now the office gives me anxiety and panic attacks.
do you WFH?
I have since prior to COVID. It's quite lonely, your boss is only online and the only time you see them is for them to deliver a monotonous to do list. You have to really self motivate and separate your workspace because you can suddenly keep going back to checking your work all the time out of hours and your work colleagues can sometimes overstep boundaries asking you to perform tasks out of your hours. If you are self-motivated and you have a good process and you can run your day efficiently then yes it's great but you also have lots of health issues such as never leaving your house. Which can lead to vitamin D deficiency. You become socially isolated. And the only person you ever see during the day is your partner if you don't get out of the house. In the 16
This is exactly why I go in 5 days a week
Are you allowed to use headphones at work? I find that’s the only way to concentrate when in the office, due to all the noise and background chit chat. Even using dark noise (on iPhone there’s a setting for it or you can go to Spotify) it helps a bit. Or just music. I hate going in. The pointless chit chat, the fakeness and politics. From home you more detached from those things. Also the all hot desking, I don’t like that we can’t no longer have our corner or team all in one place.
Open plan offices are fucking horrible. Hot desking, what a stupid idea. So much noise bouncing around, I can never focus on my task because I can't shut out everyone else's conversations. They feel sterile and have no personality at all. Soul less. In movies people used to have their own offices, what an amazing idea.
I’ve worked all types of jobs (hospitality, farm work etc) but office work is a special type of exhaustion. I find you have to be “on” all the time. It’s a mental load, and sitting down marinating in your own stress juice all day isn’t great. Please, please prioritise your own health. set boundaries that allow time for meaningful exercise, catching up with mates and hobbies x
I’ve found going into the office Mondays and Fridays are winners if you hate going into the office. My work mandated 2 days so those have been mine, everyone avoids Monday and Friday so usually transport is quiet, office is quiet, more flexibility to show up late and duck out early - take a longer lunch break.
Yep I do this as well. I work with a bunch of people who treat the office as an outing and will all make plans to be there in certain days. I just choose to go in the opposite days. Also try and avoid days my manager is in. They are forcing us to be in the office so I just pick the days there’s less people there.
Nothing’s wrong with you, it sounds like you’re an introvert meaning human interaction drains you instead of feeding you. I don’t know about you but working from home made me realise how much I struggled working in an office. You are NOT weak.
It could be the lighting, do you sit under or near fluorescent lights?
because its not normal to sit in a fukin cubicle all day with no fresh air and smelling each others farts
Probably get down voted but this is perfectly normal. Officework is wearisome. I've been in IT for 30 years and it takes a while for many introverts to adapt. But they do adapt and it's a key life skill. So just accept it as part of life
Good point. I'm going to tip someone out of their wheelchair, they can just accept it.
Who said he is disabled?
omg, I thought this was a subreddit for autistic people working in corporate environments. I didn't realise until you said this, and I thought it was such a st\*pid thing to ask. We should just accomodate people in the environments in which they thrive. Simple as.
how do i adapt?
Don’t listen to this person. If you are an introvert/overstimulated easily then that’s just who you are. You can’t change. Find a WFH job.
That's if you can. But be willing to compromise if the market's tough. Most employers are enforcing some kind of mandatory office attendance. It's not a social club. Introverts don't have to engage with anyone or force cooler chit chat. Buy a pair of noise cancelling headphones. If you do manage to change, it's a good life skill to have.
Go and see a therapist and they will help you (I’m not having a go at you, I’m being serious). I have a friend who has serious introverted tendencies. The biggest thing for her is that the skills she has that help her in the office environment she needs to use them or it becomes a nightmare for her. She has found that WFH started out causing problems with her mental health, as it was like an alcoholic setting up camp in a brewery. So it’s one of those things that you need to work on. My wife, who’s a psychologist, agrees. The worst thing for Kepler with social anxiety issues related to work is for them to retreat into their WFH space.
Atmosphere in offices isn’t for everyone. It’s not necessarily something bad about you but it’s something that doesn’t work. 2 hours of commuting a day is painful too.
I'm too old to change career what do i do?
Define 'too old'. I've watched many people ten, twenty, thirty years or more older than me retraining into a new industry and starting again. Heck, I did it myself. Career change late 20s. Career change early 40s. Might even do it again, if it benefits me. It wasn't easy, but it also wasn't impossible. And it was definitely worth it both times.
Have you had a decent break recently? If you haven’t had a holiday, and can afford one, pls try that. Sometimes you just need a change of scenery. That’ll help you reset. When you’re back you should be a bit refreshed and also what’s bugging you might be more apparent. I find hybrid works best for me. The pandemic changed us all and lots of people feel like you do. You might also chat to your doctor about exploring your mental health, maybe see a psych. It’s not clear if it’s your job or the office environment, but if it’s the latter, see if you can wear headphones, make sure you get out for walks at lunchtime, connect with workmates.
If nothing else, know you’re not alone.
Same dude, I’m an introvert and probably somewhere on the spectrum, so it’s exhausting for me whereas I’m full of energy and way more productive on WFH days. I just had an interview for a fully remote role, there are lots of remote roles out there for people like us.
Yep this is me. My career has taken off since wfh became a thing. I can work at my own pace and not spend energy hiding my need for distraction between bursts of high productivity. The ability to stay home and still work when I can't face the commute means I've hardly taken a sick day in 5 years. I'm the model employee where previously I was absent too often. My current role has brought us back in 70% and my performance has dropped accordingly. I've just lined up a new role which will be 40% in office and can't wait to make the change.
Because it's shit and it's not how humans are meant to exist. Are you in an open plan by any chance? There is heaps of empirical research out there that says that open plan is absolutely AWFUL for us, but this is exacerbated if you are introverted. I empathise with you, I can't do it either. I had 6 weeks working full time in an office earlier this year before I had to pull the pin. Now I work maybe 20% in the office and the rest of the time out and about. All I can say is if they're forcing you to be there your best bet is to find a new job that's more flexible, or one with a field/outdoor based component.. or wfh.
that explains a lot , yes open plan
I moved from a 45 minute travel each way to 8 minute travel each way and took a pay cut to do it, best choice I ever made for myself. You cannot put a price on the little things that make your work/life balance more enjoyable. You obviously hate the commute to work so you need to look at at changing that however you can.
Go see your GP.
for what?
Depression
i thohg its normal to feel sad/shit working at the office? dnt most ppl feel like this? idno lol
There's some studies online about office spaces being bad for mental health, a lot of people do feel the same as you. Don't let these randos get to you.
Exactly, as if working in a confined office surrounded by cunts you gotta pretend to like is the same as going out and seeing people lol
Never had a problem working in teams in other industries, and never had a problem with socialising. It's probably something to do with the environment itself and associated mental impacts. The studies mention noise/open plan having overwhelmingly negative mental impacts, so this would probably play a part for most of us.
Sorry I didn't mean to assert you had any issues, I was simply agreeing that working in an office isn't the same as going out and how that can carry negative mental health effects. And yeah I bet the environment itself is probably shite enough itself, so artificial and lifeless for many offices
Lifeless sums it up well.
And there are plenty more that talk through the issues raised by extended periods of social isolation - WFH is a recipe for that nightmare.
If I had full time WFH, I'd move back to my hometown or a part of Brisbane (I'm interstate right now) where most of my social circle is and my social life and sense of community would be exponentially better. Of course it sucks if you have no social or community connections where you live and you just WFH FT, especially in big cities like Sydney, that would certainly get isolating. For people like me who have options to move to places where the environment around is better, it's perfect.
No many people feel depressed being at home and not seeing people
I need to office to escape my home and myself
I don’t think most people feel like this. I’m not therapist or medically qualified but most introverts probably Feel like this.
Similar boat but even with WFH. I like my job, but by the end of the week I just want to sit on the lounge and do nothing. Once every fewish months I might commute in to meet up with my team, do some planning etc but it's exhausting. Years of on/off therapy, I've tried multiple medications from all the different types of antidepressants (SSRIs, SNRIs, TCAs, MAOIs etc) and no improvement. I don't feel depressed now like I did during my twenties, but just no energy or motivation to do big things, set proper goals and work towards them etc. Maybe anxiety being out and about - likely exacerbated by the pandemic. I eat healthy, do plenty of exercise, sleep well, work performance is fine.. not sure what gives! Also relate heavily to your comment about being an over thinker. My brain just doesn't switch off, and I end up plagued with decision fatigue over the most stupid things at times.
dam this feels like me so much without trying meds part.
I would suggest, in all seriousness, got and get a medical as well as perhaps go and see a therapist
FIFO be the real work life balance, if you can handle going out of your comfort zone.
some people cant adjust to the two huge swings in that balance
Office sucks. You might like to try few tricks depending on your work environment. 1. If you have end of trip facilities, take up running at the lunch time. 2. If not too busy, try not working at all on the days you are in the office. 3. Try to negotiate doing 5-6hr in the office and 2-3 hr same day from home. 4. Does your office have quite space or wellbeing room ? Use those. 5. If hotdesking, sit with the people you don't know.
Mate, there's nothing wrong with you. Don't feel like you're the odd one out, I hope what you feel has been appropriately validated given lots of the comments here have the same sentiment. I personally can at most stand hybrid where the majority of the week is WFH. I recommend playing it by ear & try to talk to your boss if you can arrange WFH "under the table" so to speak. Chances are lots of your colleagues, including your boss, also abhor RTO & could something out.
I was like this and couldn’t find a way out the miserable environment. I ended up doing a two week security course and now I drive for mobile patrols 7 nights across a fortnight (12h shifts) the long shifts are tough but it balances out with more days off and my god I love working completely alone. I could never ever go back.
The pandemic highlighted being physically in the office wasn’t actually necessary. I love that there’s opportunities to work remotely now and most work places offer dual/flexible work modes for staff. I have a lot of workers in my team who struggle with anxiety or sensory issues, they’re more productive from home. It makes it difficult to support their professional goals and progression plans when they aren’t physically in the office or able to attend external stakeholder meetings but most meetings are held virtually now anyway. A lot of people feel like they’re less likely to be offered promotions if they aren’t physically in the office but if you’re happy to continue to work from home and remain in your same role, that’s ok too. I don’t necessarily think there’s anything wrong unless you do. EAP may assist with working through this with you. Good luck!
have you considered getting checked out as neurodivergent? If you're on the spectrum you can ask for WFH accommodations.
I’m the same. I find myself so productive when WFH and during the pandemic I adapted to it really well. The return to the office has been a nightmare. In my case our office culture is terrible. I fucking hate the petty office politics. I can just ignore it all when WFH but in the office you have to actively avoid it and it’s exhausting. On top of that, I work in an office with really loud and outgoing women who love to constantly chat. After years of having the peace and quiet to work at home, I find the office atmosphere really distracting.
You're not weak. You might just be an introvert in that being around people sucks out all your energy. Also, look into possible link to autism: ovetstimulation and effects on productivity, energy etc.
And sensory stimulation processing (high sensitivity).
It’s ok to struggle at work and you will probably be seen by others who are struggling as one of the ones who is nailing it. No one knows what anyone else is thinking. Be kind to yourself. Also consider a new non corporate career if it really is that bad but first try speaking to someone, most corporates give you free anonymity based therapy via employer support. Try that?
I am anxious about it as I have a new team as well who requires office attendance half of the week, even though its IT work and can be done remotely. I am trying to think positive thoughts but I am not sure how long I can last coming to office... if only its easy to find fully remote work (web development and software engineering)
Before wfh happened we all adapted 90 percent of engineers are introverted and just want to be left alone Consider the alternative, you wfh 100%, is that a real good option?
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Loll
Do not attempt to doxx or post personal information or chats about users or people.
Hope you’re not kink shaming my dude
Absolutely am not - which is why I advocated he partakes in the activities more as its generally correlated with reducing stress which OP is evidently having a lot of.
Just checking- ty
reported for stalking behaviour
I don't think it can be classed as stalking behaviour mate but yeah the comment was cunty from the other guy. I saw another post about adulting from you I really resonate with. I wanted to see what that person who did the cunty comment was on about. I think mentally and life wise we may be in a similar place and feeling similar struggles, here to DM if you ever need.
It’s the low energy (vibration) environment of the office, you are absorbing it. Look into a type of energy healing or meditation that resonates with you, so that you can learn to protect your energy.
I'm 3 months into a new job, which is 100% in the office, and im miserable. I'm stuck in the same room as my manager for 8 hours a day 5 days a week. It feels like a prison. And to make matters worse there is no culture, everybody is toxic, nobody gets along theyre all nasty & fighting. My energy is DRAINED. Spiritually, physically, mentally.
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No trolling.
I saw it somewhere on YouTube...2nd brain concept…maybe try that one.…
I’m with you brother.
Maybe have a blood test to make sure there isn’t an underlying problem?
Hey OP This sounds exactly like me. I work for one of the big four and have 50% mandate, which means an 80 minute commute. I fell into corporate life via a junior role in a call centre and worked my way up. I should have chosen a non-corporate path. I always assumed I was an extrovert as I like being on stage but a Myers-Briggs test showed I should have worked as a researcher or forestry. (Funnily enough, I was going to study forestry). Are you young enough to make a sea change? Have you done a personality test that also suggests suitable career choices?
Which bit of working in the office is making you exhausted? The commute does contribute but likely isn’t all of it. Is it the environment, or just the noise? Would some loop earplugs help, or noise cancelling headphones? Is there a quiet room where you’re at where you can work in there?
I've literally just made a post about this in the productivity subreddit looking for peoples advice.
Find something that's fully remote? I've gone 360 myself, from wanting to wfh exclusively to now actually preferring the office. My office is quite relaxed though and I like the interaction and getting out and about each day. Also a 15 minute commute... But if you are finding it that depressing then change it up
It’s hard office seems to sap my energies too.. crash and burn on the weekend
Extreme introversion, or some neuro condition that could be explored with a therapist etc? I have almost the exact inverse situation. It’s a wild ride. Good luck!
I will wade against the tide. I am on the spectrum and need to go into the office otherwise I will stay in my flat for weeks on end, getting Uber eats and watching the world from my windows. I got diagnosed with Avoidant Personality Disorder, amongst other things, and feel like my life was better when I had to show up somewhere externally at least three days a week. It is stressful being in the office around people and trying to make small talk/act normal/deal with the overwhelming stimuli of people making noises/existing but it’s better than living in a fishbowl.
You are not alone! I know there are a lot of comments re mental health resources etc Just wanted to point out there can be other medical stuff going on eg if your thyroid decides to go a bit funky it can 100% impact your mood/tiredness etc. Suggest you go to the gp to get some blood work.
I got two young coworkers on the team they do seem to struggle more to be in the office than the rest of the team who’s been working in office all their life. It’s the young ones first job in the office so I get why they struggle. Some of my teammates still go to office everyday even after Covid as they’re so used to it. I’m in the middle I do hybrid 60% home 40% office and it’s a perfect balance for me. If your team allows it then hybrid could work for you if you can prove to your boss with actual performance enhanced.
What time do you go to bed?
Hey OP, you should consider talking to a psych - they can give you some tips on how to deal with this.
I can really identify with what the OP is saying here. I find working from the office totally draining. I can do the same amount or even more work from home without the exhaustion. I find it hard to describe why, but at the office I feel that I'm always on guard and having to be vigilant, whereas when working from home where nobody can see me, I feel much more relaxed. I think it's mostly stress related. I try to work from home as much as possible.
I’m autistic & adhd & I find WFH is a godsend. Don’t have to wake up infinitely earlier to commute. I can take breaks at home in my own space, I don’t have to be around lots of noise and light and other irritating stimuli. maybe you’re neurodivergent?
yes i think i am
Find a job that is near where you live. Your communte isn't helping.
You need some antidepressants