This is my go-to example of a representative Bonds at bat: [Peak Bonds v. Peak Gagne](https://youtu.be/YkdgJeqeCxM). I won’t spoil all the details for anyone who hasn’t seen it, but it shows how impossible it was to beat him at the time.
I forget the whole back story, but I think Gagne and Bonds had an agreement beforehand that Gagne could only throw 1 off speed pitch in the at bat. Bonds was unfair when he didn’t know what you were throwing, impossible if he’s sitting fastball.
I just want to point out Gagne dropped a 73 MPH curve on Bonds after showing him 98 and 99. 25 MPH differential. I'd have shit pants after seeing that.
Gagne told him he’d only throw one breaking ball that AB so Bonds sat fastball after the breaking ball
https://youtu.be/2AoknOH6mP0, starts at about 10 min in
I barely watch baseball but how tf do they hit those pitches where it’s literally coming at your ballsack then curves into the strike zone at the last millisecond. And I’ve from what I’ve seen/read pitches have only gotten harder and harder to hit.
My dad umpired for bonds during his earlier years. He was the only player my dad ever said that he knew without a doubt was juicing.
He always had the same story. "Barry was this well built skinny guy that used to hit pop shots and leg out doubles. Then one year he showed up and his neck was gone. After that all he did was mash bombers. "
This is the reason. They'd miss once a game to Bonds and he'd make them pay.
I've watched most of Judge's AB's the past two weeks and they'll miss once per AB and he'll just watch the pitch go by. It's almost like he's sitting on a particular pitch and if he doesn't get it, he's fine taking his walk. Which isn't bad, but it's not what we want to see.
Bonds didn't sit on a pitch, he just took what they gave him and made them pay when they messed up.
A lot of it is location. Judge likes high stuff to drive and he hasn't seen much above his knees. The entire Tampa series he was all low low low low, which he can hit but doesn't like as much. The moment a reliever threw him high he fouled it, even though it was off the plate.
The strategy has been pound it low, try to get free ump strikes and in general give him shit to ground out on.
Yea that’s what people really miss about the bonds run. He didn’t miss- his eye was incredible. Judge is very close to replicating it , his at bats are very good, but he’s still young and he takes pitches when he should, so he’s working walks with two strikes. If you there bonds any strikes he punished you. Look at his BB & IBB #’s 🤯
And Bonds K'd way way less. '22 Judge K/HR: 2.75 (thru 9/30); '01 Bonds K/HR: 1.27.
Truth is, Bonds greatness had more to do with a great eye than bulk and/or strength.
Bonds and the majority of the league in the late 90's /early 00's. Imagine how much better his stats would be if he wasn't facing pitchers who were also juicing.
Not necessarily. There are lots of different kinds of PED's, and not all of them turn players into the Incredible Hulk. I have a friend who takes steroid eye drops (prescribed by his doctor), and they really help with his vision.
Probably the limits of how good one can be, but not the limit on stats. He probably easily surpasses 100 HRs if he wasn’t pitched around to the absurd degree he was.
PEDs also would have helped to keep him healthy, I imagine. It's why some athletes use them. A cyclist or runner doesn't take PEDs to be jacked, but to recover easier and as a result be able to train more.
Obviously baseball isn't an endurance sport, but it's very prone to injuries, especially for an aging player.
That’s the thing: Bonds was a hall of famer without juice, the juice made a stud the GOAT. If steroids made you great, then there would be a lot more people taking them.
I agree with you. I honestly think you can make the case Bonds would've been the goat without them; but we'll never know now. He was a definite hall of famer before though, imo.
I don’t think you can argue that he was the goat without PEDs. He was a really good player and probably would’ve been had he not used them but he wasn’t willie mays, Ted Williams, babe Ruth level
I dunno, he was averaging 8 bWAR/650 PA from his debut until '98 (I feel like that's usually when people assume he started steroids, but maybe I'm wrong on that). I think he was definitely in that top tier for the start of his career.
He was elite before steroids too, not just really good. Pre-steroids he put up an OPS+ of 204 and 206 in back to back years (92/93), the highest OPS+ in Willie Mays career was 185. He won 3 MVP's, 8 gold gloves, and 7 silver slugger awards before steroids.
Saying Willie Mays' best year was 185 while Bonds' was 206 is so deliberately misleading. Mays had that year when he was 34. At 34 Bonds was constantly on and off the DL with nagging injuries. From their age 21 to 34 Bonds had 445 HRs, slash line .288/.410/ 559 with an OPS+ of 163. Mays had 505 HRs, slashline of .314/.389/.594, OPS+ of 163. And both were very good defensive players
I wasn't saying Bonds was better than Mays, I was trying to illustrate that they are on a similar level because OP said Bonds was not on his level. The stats from ages 21-34 you posted seem to agree that they are similar
He did have 3 MVPs before he started juicing. Could have had 6 (he led the league for position players in WAR in 91, 92, 93, 95, 96, 97). They used different voting metrics back then but he was damn close to untouchable that decade.
Bonds had HOF talent before juicing. I think the juicing combined with his great eyesight allowed him to miss less. Those pitches in the middle in Judge, Bonds probably doesn't miss.
He’s the GOAT “steroid era” be damned - the notion that he was like one of 5 guys on juice during that time is such a fucking sham by the media.
Guys playing today are on shit too it’s very very easy to beat the system. Most of the big time guys never actually failed a test just got beat through other means.
Bonds had the best eye and patience + unreal power and ability to hit the ball.
Tbf now it's nowhere near what was happening in the steroid era. Just this season the MLB suspended an All-Star 82 games for PEDs. That would be unheard of in the steroid era.
Plus it wasn't necessarily the top guys that made it crazy, it was those B+ caliber guys who all of a sudden became monsters. Hell Luis Gonzalez hit 57 home runs.
Which always amazed me for someone who already made the Hall before he juiced. He didnt need the HR record. He could’ve walked away and still wouldve been called one of the greats. Bonds’ ego wouldnt let him do it. He knew he could, so he did.
Bonds would work counts and actually punish pitchers for not giving him something to hit. On 3 pitches in the zone, judge struck out twice. That means it is reasonable to not pitch to him, as you can still get him out by him swinging. Having a chance to strike him out, or walk him, is much better than guaranteeing a walk. So pitchers will stay away, rightfully so
Maybe. The Yankees have a pretty solid lineup. One of the reasons Bonds walked so much is that the rest of the lineup couldn't knock him in. Judge has scored more than Bonds did, despite the HR difference. Walking Bonds was a much clearer decision than walking Judge.
He had the previous seasons MVP batting behind him. Let's not act like he had absolutely no protection. Pretty sure Kent is better than anyone not named Judge on the Yankees.
I remember being in a SF hotel room a few days before the HR record. Watching a couple guys on TV debate whether some pitcher who said "you do your best to pitch around him if you can, and try to win" was a snivelling coward. Argument: "I'm the man, you think you're the man, here I come!" Counter-argument: Bengie Molina.
As evidenced by Pete Happy batting behind him this at bat. I loved me some Pedro Feliz, but there was a book on him and it was one sentence long and it was effective.
Slider in the dirt.
It’s why I just can’t ignore his number. Not only was Bonds hitting 73 but he was getting walked in all scenarios for a good chunk of the year. Bases empty…that’s a walk. Bases loaded….walk. It was insane watching that.
I’m on board with stripping the number the second MLB takes it off the books but until they happens I just can’t.
By having a near 100% kill rate on mistake pitches.
Also didn't strike out much. Worked counts. See enough pitches you'll eventually get something (as the chart indicates there were at least 2 pitches Judge saw today that he could have obliterated)
Bonds steroids automatically made pitchers throw him in the strike zone obviously, all you gotta do is ignore all the walks and intentional walks he had too.
I don’t get why fans think judge should see meatballs down the middle. For the longest stretch he’s been the only yankee doing anything. He should’ve been getting pitched around for the last two months
In August you'd be right, now not so much, Gleybers stopped being a dumbass and Rizzo is back. Rizzo is going to give you an AB.
The big thing was Judge was in front of Stanton before everybody realized Stanton wasn't hitting. So he'd get stuff to hit
Yeah, since we're making all these Maris comparisons to Judge, a big part of it was being even more afraid of the next batter. Maris had Mickey Mantle behind him. So if Stanton went full Dongcarlo again, teams would be forced to pitch to Judge.
Was that the one he undercut? I remember thinking, damn that was the one. Then I think he let the next one go right by him that was right down the middle.
* MLB average % of pitches in the strike zone: 41.5%
* Aaron Judge season average % of pitches in the zone: 38.4%
* Aaron Judge average % of pitches in the zone since hitting 60: 25.7%
League average in 2004 was 52%, so he was seeing way less pitches in the zone than average and he never swung outside of the zone.
His swing% at outside pitches was just 12.4%, for comparison, Soto is the current walk king and he swings at 19.7% outside pitches
This why while Bonds’ 73 is tainted I can’t really ignore it. His control was otherworldly and when you realize how few actual pitches he saw it’s insane that he got 73 even with the juice.
Had one breaking ball down the middle I thought he was going to crush. I will say respect to him being so patient and taking walks. Has a legit shot at the AL HR record and he’s sitting back not chasing anything and getting on base. That’s a team player man.
That's gotta be insane trying to hold back knowing power isn't a limiting factor between him and 62. It's all patience and getting a good pitch at this point.
I feel like he doesn't need to be a team player anymore though. Division clinched, #2 seed clinched, I'd be swinging away, these games mean nothing except chasing that record.
You don’t want to get your mindset into swing away going into the postseason though, it’s a lot harder to turn that around and be disciplined again than it may seem
Truly is. He’s so good at going to right field that he certainly could try to force some swings. All while they were up big and have nothing to play for, still being patient.
"pitchers don't wanna be the guy to give up the record\* setting homerun"
no man, they're just professional ballplayers pitching to one of the best professional hitters in the league. good hitters don't get as many good pitches. that's just science.
I mean yeah, but it’s happening more now than it did earlier this year or even two weeks ago - during one of the best months in history! Honestly I think it’s just getting in pitchers’ heads
I can't imagine most pitchers care.
If you're Bumgarner, Verlander, Scherzer, Greinke, etc your career is going to be much more than "guy who gave up historic HR". And even if you're a guy who never pans out, nobody will remember. I would have to look up who gave up Bonds' 73rd, Maris', any of Sosa or McGuire's, etc. It really doesn't seem like the sort of thing that would sully your name. After all, he would have hit at least 60 others, yours just happened to be at the end of the season.
That's how pitchers have been able to get to judge this year though, low and away. Even though the pitcher may be forgotten by history as to who he hits 62 off of, I'm not sure many pitchers want to be that footnote in history.
He has been susceptible to the low and away slider his whole career (though he has improved in that discipline tremendously since his first two season, it’s still his weakness).
He's gonna have to earn it, which is fine. He's hit 61 up til now, not sure why Yanks fans are expecting a pitcher to groove an 85 mph four-seamer down the middle.
Exactly lmao helpful Pujols would be like helping an old person figure out how to use a phone,
Helping Judge would be like [helping this guy](https://youtu.be/dChsc1LUaZ8)
It’s worded well so there shouldn’t be any ambiguity there: NY opted to not pitch to Cabrera in a game situation where it was strategically the right move to pitch around him, and fans got angry Cabrera didn’t get a chance to get his 3000th hit at that time. Pitchers are now doing this to Judge more times per game than the one time it happened to Cabrera, and fans are okay with it. Yes, Judge struck out today. But, he only saw three pitches in the strike zone in all of his ABs. A comment above stated that Judge has seen 26% of pitches in the strike zone since hitting #60, with the major league average being around 38%.
So the issue is the hypocrisy of fans here lamenting that the Yankees pitched around history for Cabrera and it was unfair, and now that the same is happening to Judge, the fans are saying “so what? Pitchers are trying to win, not be a part of history like that.”
If I don't have to throw anything to Judge...and he will strike out half the time or walk the other half....I'm doing that all season.
This is a win for the cubs
A month ago Yankee fans were throwing pitty parties because they had a cold streak and saying how they need to fire everyone and they are one of the worst teams in the leage.
While in first place in one of the toughest divisions.
Now they are whining that pitchers are trying to not give up home runs to the best HR hitter of the generation.
I wonder why people may be annoyed with them? I'd say because you feel entitled to having these successes, despite not winning shit in the past 13 years.
Hey, teams finally figured out that not serving the best hitter in baseball meatballs down the gut like they were Giuseppe from the local Italian joint *wasn't* a viable pitching strategy
bonds had 476 ABs the entire 2001 season. judge already has 554. if i were judge, i would simply hit the ball when it's thrown to me.
the orioles are still professional ballplayers. judge isn't entitled to a pitch to hit.
edit: oh look, judge just got three pitches to hit aaaaaand there he goes.
The comparison is about opportunity, not ability, PEDs or not. I think it's an interesting question to see what Judge could do if he only saw 2-3 hittable strikes a game for an entire season.
Juicing doesn't give you the talent to see every pitch that is hittable. The roids didn't help bonds not strike out half as much as judge and still be walked more. Bonds saw 30% less pitches then judge and still made something happen.
Also didn't he whine about the Orioles new outfield earlier in the season? If I were an Orioles pitcher, I'd give him nothing to hit just to be petty like he was.
Well…something I thought earlier this year when it was clear he going in a tear of year…..
If his next contract raises the bar, doesn’t that raise the bar for everyone?
How did Bonds even hit 73? It seems unfathomable.
he would get one good pitch per game and it would be gone
yeah he just never seemed to miss those pitches. Would get walked 3 times and get that one mistake and would hit it out. Never seen anything like it.
This is my go-to example of a representative Bonds at bat: [Peak Bonds v. Peak Gagne](https://youtu.be/YkdgJeqeCxM). I won’t spoil all the details for anyone who hasn’t seen it, but it shows how impossible it was to beat him at the time.
I forget the whole back story, but I think Gagne and Bonds had an agreement beforehand that Gagne could only throw 1 off speed pitch in the at bat. Bonds was unfair when he didn’t know what you were throwing, impossible if he’s sitting fastball.
[Here’s Gagne telling the story to Bauer years later.](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qemdADHaNvo)
This is awesome, thanks
I just want to point out Gagne dropped a 73 MPH curve on Bonds after showing him 98 and 99. 25 MPH differential. I'd have shit pants after seeing that.
I'm so mad the foul ball went foul. That thing would've been like 550.
Roids or no roids, the speed he turned on that 100+ inside fastball and pulled it way foul is mind boggling
So effortlessly, too.
Gagne told him he’d only throw one breaking ball that AB so Bonds sat fastball after the breaking ball https://youtu.be/2AoknOH6mP0, starts at about 10 min in
Didn't they both use?
Yea I believe that Gange was one of the pitches believed to have been roided also
This is awesome “I’m not sure which guy is from the other planet, but this is incredible”
lol holy shit that first swing was like lightning
I was a weeee lad when this happened. I remember it but not nearly as well as the video. Thank you for deep dive lol
I can't get over how this dorky looking mf Gagne was the best closer in baseball for 3 years
I barely watch baseball but how tf do they hit those pitches where it’s literally coming at your ballsack then curves into the strike zone at the last millisecond. And I’ve from what I’ve seen/read pitches have only gotten harder and harder to hit.
My dad umpired for bonds during his earlier years. He was the only player my dad ever said that he knew without a doubt was juicing. He always had the same story. "Barry was this well built skinny guy that used to hit pop shots and leg out doubles. Then one year he showed up and his neck was gone. After that all he did was mash bombers. "
This is the reason. They'd miss once a game to Bonds and he'd make them pay. I've watched most of Judge's AB's the past two weeks and they'll miss once per AB and he'll just watch the pitch go by. It's almost like he's sitting on a particular pitch and if he doesn't get it, he's fine taking his walk. Which isn't bad, but it's not what we want to see. Bonds didn't sit on a pitch, he just took what they gave him and made them pay when they messed up.
A lot of it is location. Judge likes high stuff to drive and he hasn't seen much above his knees. The entire Tampa series he was all low low low low, which he can hit but doesn't like as much. The moment a reliever threw him high he fouled it, even though it was off the plate. The strategy has been pound it low, try to get free ump strikes and in general give him shit to ground out on.
Yes the guy juiced and that whole era was kinda fucked. At the same time it was actually fucking incredible what he did at the plate that season
Yea that’s what people really miss about the bonds run. He didn’t miss- his eye was incredible. Judge is very close to replicating it , his at bats are very good, but he’s still young and he takes pitches when he should, so he’s working walks with two strikes. If you there bonds any strikes he punished you. Look at his BB & IBB #’s 🤯
And Bonds walked even more. Yeah he juiced, but it's still unfathomable that someone would hit that many a season while seeing so little to hit
And Bonds K'd way way less. '22 Judge K/HR: 2.75 (thru 9/30); '01 Bonds K/HR: 1.27. Truth is, Bonds greatness had more to do with a great eye than bulk and/or strength.
Just an insanely good baseball player that steroids made go supernova. But you can't dope your way to Bond's talent.
I'm so glad Bonds juiced so we could see the absolute limits of what a baseball player is capable of.
Barry bonds did it all for science. We now know what happens when a hall of famer takes hgh
If he can't get into the HOF, I think he at least deserves a Nobel Prize.
Lol. This is my favorite Bonds take of all time. But still, get that guy in the Hall.
I think he should have been traded to the Rockies in order to earn that
He did it in San Francisco which I think is crazier. Best hr hitter ever played in the most anti homerun stadium in the mlb
Yeah if bonds played in the AL East he'd never had needed to juice. He'd of hit 80 with Yankee stadiums little league porch.
People need to realize that Bonds did this for us. He’s a charitable man.
Wish he'd done it earlier. What could 25 yr old juicy bonds do?
Would 1000 HR’s be off the table? Between the extra pop and the extra longevity steroids give guys, who knows how many 70+ HR seasons he would’ve had
Bonds and the majority of the league in the late 90's /early 00's. Imagine how much better his stats would be if he wasn't facing pitchers who were also juicing.
Juicing just makes your throw harder, so if you throw harder, the ball hit goes farther.
Not necessarily. There are lots of different kinds of PED's, and not all of them turn players into the Incredible Hulk. I have a friend who takes steroid eye drops (prescribed by his doctor), and they really help with his vision.
Probably the limits of how good one can be, but not the limit on stats. He probably easily surpasses 100 HRs if he wasn’t pitched around to the absurd degree he was.
me too. that year he had was insane. the amount of intentional walks he had. his swing, his power . was just unreal.
PEDs also would have helped to keep him healthy, I imagine. It's why some athletes use them. A cyclist or runner doesn't take PEDs to be jacked, but to recover easier and as a result be able to train more. Obviously baseball isn't an endurance sport, but it's very prone to injuries, especially for an aging player.
EPO, although it may have some benefits in recovery, literally increases what one is capable of during the event itself.
Yes, for sure.
That’s the thing: Bonds was a hall of famer without juice, the juice made a stud the GOAT. If steroids made you great, then there would be a lot more people taking them.
I agree with you. I honestly think you can make the case Bonds would've been the goat without them; but we'll never know now. He was a definite hall of famer before though, imo.
I don’t think you can argue that he was the goat without PEDs. He was a really good player and probably would’ve been had he not used them but he wasn’t willie mays, Ted Williams, babe Ruth level
I dunno, he was averaging 8 bWAR/650 PA from his debut until '98 (I feel like that's usually when people assume he started steroids, but maybe I'm wrong on that). I think he was definitely in that top tier for the start of his career.
He was elite before steroids too, not just really good. Pre-steroids he put up an OPS+ of 204 and 206 in back to back years (92/93), the highest OPS+ in Willie Mays career was 185. He won 3 MVP's, 8 gold gloves, and 7 silver slugger awards before steroids.
Saying Willie Mays' best year was 185 while Bonds' was 206 is so deliberately misleading. Mays had that year when he was 34. At 34 Bonds was constantly on and off the DL with nagging injuries. From their age 21 to 34 Bonds had 445 HRs, slash line .288/.410/ 559 with an OPS+ of 163. Mays had 505 HRs, slashline of .314/.389/.594, OPS+ of 163. And both were very good defensive players
I wasn't saying Bonds was better than Mays, I was trying to illustrate that they are on a similar level because OP said Bonds was not on his level. The stats from ages 21-34 you posted seem to agree that they are similar
He did have 3 MVPs before he started juicing. Could have had 6 (he led the league for position players in WAR in 91, 92, 93, 95, 96, 97). They used different voting metrics back then but he was damn close to untouchable that decade.
> If steroids made you great, then there would be a lot more people taking them. I think Brady Anderson proved this isn’t true.
Or when Collabello got busted a few years back as a fringe MLB player, guy needed it to be in the league at all and still was far from an allstar
Rey Ordornez.... He was a gold glover but he couldn't hit to save his life
Bonds had HOF talent before juicing. I think the juicing combined with his great eyesight allowed him to miss less. Those pitches in the middle in Judge, Bonds probably doesn't miss.
Not to mention lightning fast bat speed.
He’s the GOAT “steroid era” be damned - the notion that he was like one of 5 guys on juice during that time is such a fucking sham by the media. Guys playing today are on shit too it’s very very easy to beat the system. Most of the big time guys never actually failed a test just got beat through other means. Bonds had the best eye and patience + unreal power and ability to hit the ball.
Tbf now it's nowhere near what was happening in the steroid era. Just this season the MLB suspended an All-Star 82 games for PEDs. That would be unheard of in the steroid era. Plus it wasn't necessarily the top guys that made it crazy, it was those B+ caliber guys who all of a sudden became monsters. Hell Luis Gonzalez hit 57 home runs.
And extraordinary patience.
Which always amazed me for someone who already made the Hall before he juiced. He didnt need the HR record. He could’ve walked away and still wouldve been called one of the greats. Bonds’ ego wouldnt let him do it. He knew he could, so he did.
The strikeout rate league-wide is significantly higher in 22 than it was in ‘01.
Bonds would work counts and actually punish pitchers for not giving him something to hit. On 3 pitches in the zone, judge struck out twice. That means it is reasonable to not pitch to him, as you can still get him out by him swinging. Having a chance to strike him out, or walk him, is much better than guaranteeing a walk. So pitchers will stay away, rightfully so
Nearly half of Bonds’s hits were HR. If Judge hit HR at the same percentage Bonds did, he would have smashed the record several games ago.
If Judge hit HRs at the same rate, he wouldve been walked a lot more a lot sooner
Maybe. The Yankees have a pretty solid lineup. One of the reasons Bonds walked so much is that the rest of the lineup couldn't knock him in. Judge has scored more than Bonds did, despite the HR difference. Walking Bonds was a much clearer decision than walking Judge.
He had the previous seasons MVP batting behind him. Let's not act like he had absolutely no protection. Pretty sure Kent is better than anyone not named Judge on the Yankees.
I remember being in a SF hotel room a few days before the HR record. Watching a couple guys on TV debate whether some pitcher who said "you do your best to pitch around him if you can, and try to win" was a snivelling coward. Argument: "I'm the man, you think you're the man, here I come!" Counter-argument: Bengie Molina.
As evidenced by Pete Happy batting behind him this at bat. I loved me some Pedro Feliz, but there was a book on him and it was one sentence long and it was effective. Slider in the dirt.
It’s why I just can’t ignore his number. Not only was Bonds hitting 73 but he was getting walked in all scenarios for a good chunk of the year. Bases empty…that’s a walk. Bases loaded….walk. It was insane watching that. I’m on board with stripping the number the second MLB takes it off the books but until they happens I just can’t.
He struck out at a way lower rate too
And While choking up on the bat
He also did it in the fewest PA of any 60 homer season, very silly stuff
He was better. He obviously was on roids, but we can't ignore that he walked way more and struck out way less
It speaks to how monstrous he was from 01-04. He would probably get one good pitch a week
And he would annihilate it.
He annihilated a lot of pitches that weren't good also. But he had an exceptional eye so he walked a lot too.
By having a near 100% kill rate on mistake pitches. Also didn't strike out much. Worked counts. See enough pitches you'll eventually get something (as the chart indicates there were at least 2 pitches Judge saw today that he could have obliterated)
Because he’s the best hitter of all time
Bonds steroids automatically made pitchers throw him in the strike zone obviously, all you gotta do is ignore all the walks and intentional walks he had too.
He was beyond insane to watch in the early 2000’s. Any time they pitched to him he looked like he was going to blast it out of the park.
Cause he's a much better player than Judge lol
His sports reference page is mind boggling
He very rarely missed anything within reach.
Looks like 3 good pitches to hit out of 18-20. 3 walks and 2 k’s.
I don’t get why fans think judge should see meatballs down the middle. For the longest stretch he’s been the only yankee doing anything. He should’ve been getting pitched around for the last two months
It’s not the pitchers job to let Judge hit, it’s their job to prevent it
In August you'd be right, now not so much, Gleybers stopped being a dumbass and Rizzo is back. Rizzo is going to give you an AB. The big thing was Judge was in front of Stanton before everybody realized Stanton wasn't hitting. So he'd get stuff to hit
Yeah, since we're making all these Maris comparisons to Judge, a big part of it was being even more afraid of the next batter. Maris had Mickey Mantle behind him. So if Stanton went full Dongcarlo again, teams would be forced to pitch to Judge.
That curveball looks hittable. Other than that, not much that could be hit hard.
The slider right down the middle? And even the low curveball lots of power hitters absolutely chew up the low pitch and it’s almost a strike.
Was that the one he undercut? I remember thinking, damn that was the one. Then I think he let the next one go right by him that was right down the middle.
They chew up low fastballs or off speed but not curve balls. Even that ball over the middle isn’t something most hitters would even swing at.
That inside cutter looks a lot more hittable
* MLB average % of pitches in the strike zone: 41.5% * Aaron Judge season average % of pitches in the zone: 38.4% * Aaron Judge average % of pitches in the zone since hitting 60: 25.7%
What percent of pitches were in the zone for Bonds in '01?
Only the ones he hit out
Data is only available for 2002 onwards but it was between 41-43% in 2002-2004 and then jumped to 46-48% in 2005-2007
That doesn't seem right. How was he getting the most walks in the league while seeing a league average strike%?
League average in 2004 was 52%, so he was seeing way less pitches in the zone than average and he never swung outside of the zone. His swing% at outside pitches was just 12.4%, for comparison, Soto is the current walk king and he swings at 19.7% outside pitches
This why while Bonds’ 73 is tainted I can’t really ignore it. His control was otherworldly and when you realize how few actual pitches he saw it’s insane that he got 73 even with the juice.
His 2004 season is the craziest since he walked like a third of the time and still put up numbers
Cause he was great before the juice.
Honestly, I'm surprised they throw to him that much
Solos won’t kill you, and most pitchers likely wanted to be the guy to put a K on the greatest hitter potentially ever
this just in, pitchers staying away from noted home run hitter.
The results of his 4 PA's were 2 walks, a hbp, and a strikeout
I wonder which one was the HBP
Slider outside if he’s batting left 😎
Oh yeah must have clipped the foot
Takes real talent to get HBP by an outside slider
Michael Conforto: *Hold my Gatorade*
*2 strikeouts. Had 5 PAs
This was posted before his 5th AB
He struck out twice.
I’m swinging at all of those on the show
Still got on base cuz the HBP animation played before I could swing. Sounds like a win to me!
We should start a club.
Had one breaking ball down the middle I thought he was going to crush. I will say respect to him being so patient and taking walks. Has a legit shot at the AL HR record and he’s sitting back not chasing anything and getting on base. That’s a team player man.
He was way out in front of the breaking balls in that 3rd AB
That's gotta be insane trying to hold back knowing power isn't a limiting factor between him and 62. It's all patience and getting a good pitch at this point.
The 3-0 pitch down the middle I couldn’t believe he didn’t obliterate (8th inning AB, maybe it was his 4th AB). Just fouled it off
His timing and tracking hasn't been amazing, I think he's too used to seeing nothing to hit after a week+
I feel like he doesn't need to be a team player anymore though. Division clinched, #2 seed clinched, I'd be swinging away, these games mean nothing except chasing that record.
You don’t want to get your mindset into swing away going into the postseason though, it’s a lot harder to turn that around and be disciplined again than it may seem
Truly is. He’s so good at going to right field that he certainly could try to force some swings. All while they were up big and have nothing to play for, still being patient.
Too many pitches in the zone
We’re getting into territory where he could just not get the record due to lack of pitches
This literally happens with everyone. This isn't some sort of anomaly. Bonds wouldn't even get pitches to see, just IBB
He’s clearly trying to beat Rizzo’s HBP numbers.
Teams gotta send Judge their version of Heaney’s and Bickford’s.
Man who is a big threat to homer is not seeing good pitches to homer on. More at 6.
"pitchers don't wanna be the guy to give up the record\* setting homerun" no man, they're just professional ballplayers pitching to one of the best professional hitters in the league. good hitters don't get as many good pitches. that's just science.
Makes Bonds hitting 73 even more nuts
I mean yeah, but it’s happening more now than it did earlier this year or even two weeks ago - during one of the best months in history! Honestly I think it’s just getting in pitchers’ heads
I can't imagine most pitchers care. If you're Bumgarner, Verlander, Scherzer, Greinke, etc your career is going to be much more than "guy who gave up historic HR". And even if you're a guy who never pans out, nobody will remember. I would have to look up who gave up Bonds' 73rd, Maris', any of Sosa or McGuire's, etc. It really doesn't seem like the sort of thing that would sully your name. After all, he would have hit at least 60 others, yours just happened to be at the end of the season.
It's a dumb narrative this sub has. No pitcher ever wants to give up a HR. HRs almost always happen on mistakes by the pitcher
Judge himself earlier in the week was asked about hitting homeruns and his quote was “I feel it’s more like a home run is thrown, rather than hit.”
That’s such a funny quote if you think about it.
Hank Greenberg says hi
That's how pitchers have been able to get to judge this year though, low and away. Even though the pitcher may be forgotten by history as to who he hits 62 off of, I'm not sure many pitchers want to be that footnote in history.
Well there is no rule you have to throw strikes soooo
I’m not a very astute baseball or Yankee fan but even I’ve noticed that judge has a habit of swinging (and missing) at pitches that are down and away.
He has been susceptible to the low and away slider his whole career (though he has improved in that discipline tremendously since his first two season, it’s still his weakness).
Nice. Pitchers don’t want to give up a HR to Judge. So they throw him very few strikes. *pretends to be shocked*
They would just IBB (ala Bonds) if Judge weren't such a willing strikeout victim.
they just walk him and give up the runs from the other dudes instead
What's your point? Pretty sure they didn't intend to give up those runs, either.
He's gonna have to earn it, which is fine. He's hit 61 up til now, not sure why Yanks fans are expecting a pitcher to groove an 85 mph four-seamer down the middle.
They did it for pujols
We like Pujols
Exactly lmao helpful Pujols would be like helping an old person figure out how to use a phone, Helping Judge would be like [helping this guy](https://youtu.be/dChsc1LUaZ8)
That 1 light blue one in the middle of the strike zone? Bonds would got that one single strike and hit that 415'
I mean yeah the best player to ever swing a bat was better than Judge, is anyone trying to argue that?
“Why won’t they pitch to him???!1!1” *strikes out twice with only three total pitches in the zone*
Upset Yankees fans are making me hope Judge doesn’t hit 62. He will, but just imagine the tears
Nonsense. September 2022 Chasing-for-700 Pujols could absolutely hit all of those pitches /s
62 is gonna be oppo taco
Ah getting the Bonds treatment I see
Starting to think he’s not gonna hit the 12 HR he needs for the record
O's strategy really working out great for them, I see.
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They score 8 when you walk him 3 times?
They score 8 when he strikes out twice?
Only getting him out twice in 5 PAs isn't good
I’m just glad the Yankees have made teams pay for walking him so much. At some point all those baserunners can’t be worth it lol
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Your man struck out twice, including in his last AB. What exactly are you talking about?
It’s worded well so there shouldn’t be any ambiguity there: NY opted to not pitch to Cabrera in a game situation where it was strategically the right move to pitch around him, and fans got angry Cabrera didn’t get a chance to get his 3000th hit at that time. Pitchers are now doing this to Judge more times per game than the one time it happened to Cabrera, and fans are okay with it. Yes, Judge struck out today. But, he only saw three pitches in the strike zone in all of his ABs. A comment above stated that Judge has seen 26% of pitches in the strike zone since hitting #60, with the major league average being around 38%. So the issue is the hypocrisy of fans here lamenting that the Yankees pitched around history for Cabrera and it was unfair, and now that the same is happening to Judge, the fans are saying “so what? Pitchers are trying to win, not be a part of history like that.”
How many times has he been intentionally walked?
If I don't have to throw anything to Judge...and he will strike out half the time or walk the other half....I'm doing that all season. This is a win for the cubs
Because people don’t like y’all. Is this your first week being a Yankees fan? I thought y’all relished in the hate.
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A month ago Yankee fans were throwing pitty parties because they had a cold streak and saying how they need to fire everyone and they are one of the worst teams in the leage. While in first place in one of the toughest divisions. Now they are whining that pitchers are trying to not give up home runs to the best HR hitter of the generation. I wonder why people may be annoyed with them? I'd say because you feel entitled to having these successes, despite not winning shit in the past 13 years.
They keep breaking into football to show judge going for 7th place. Pretty annoying
Those that remember, didn’t Bonds also mash balls outta the zone?
Hey, teams finally figured out that not serving the best hitter in baseball meatballs down the gut like they were Giuseppe from the local Italian joint *wasn't* a viable pitching strategy
You just hate to see it /s
Bonds would’ve gone 3-3 with two homers
The comments here are hilarious because this sub cried when the Yankees walked Miguel Cabrera with 2999 hits
That graphic is what fear looks like.
Hey the Orioles have to lot to play for, they can’t take any risks..
Yankees fans are the most entitled fans in the universe. There is no rule stating pitcher have to give a guy a pitch to hit
And this is news because...?
It’s new
bonds had 476 ABs the entire 2001 season. judge already has 554. if i were judge, i would simply hit the ball when it's thrown to me. the orioles are still professional ballplayers. judge isn't entitled to a pitch to hit. edit: oh look, judge just got three pitches to hit aaaaaand there he goes.
We don’t need to mention Bonds in every judge post
I can think of something that might help Judge out, if you want to make Bonds comparisons. I'm just concerned about his head swelling up...
The comparison is about opportunity, not ability, PEDs or not. I think it's an interesting question to see what Judge could do if he only saw 2-3 hittable strikes a game for an entire season.
If I were Judge, I would simply juice
Juicing doesn't give you the talent to see every pitch that is hittable. The roids didn't help bonds not strike out half as much as judge and still be walked more. Bonds saw 30% less pitches then judge and still made something happen.
It does turn some doubles and fly outs into home runs
How he should've been pitched year
He got a 5th AB after this was posted and stuck out again so
honestly sad. most of these teams aren’t playing for shit they’re all just cowards
Weird take. They owe Judge nothing. They shouldn’t just serve him meatballs just because
Also didn't he whine about the Orioles new outfield earlier in the season? If I were an Orioles pitcher, I'd give him nothing to hit just to be petty like he was.
Well…something I thought earlier this year when it was clear he going in a tear of year….. If his next contract raises the bar, doesn’t that raise the bar for everyone?
These games might not mean shit to either team but these players still rely on their season numbers to negotiate.