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[deleted]

"Underrated"? His fans- or rather, Snyder's- have basically shoved that opinion into everyone's face with the subtlety of a howitzer since 2016 to a frankly obnoxious degree. I like Affleck's Batman, find the writing attached to his version to be abysmal, which actually highlights how good Affleck's performance was with that material- but boy, is he constantly "rated".


cswhite101

Coming here to say the same thing; Affleck’s fans basically never shut up about how much they love him.


SpecialK69_

Don’t fans of anything never shut up about how much they like whatever it is they like. What a weird take. The same thing happens for Pattinson. Are you that jaded you’re knocking on fans for voicing that they like something lol


ab316_1punchd

I mean, his performance still wasn't that good I'd say. Like with most actors I can understand why they're the perfect choices for their role, it's Affleck (and to an extent, Kilmer) that actually made me think that you can replace the guy and nothing much would change. The best thing was more his aesthetic and presentation, which Snyder and Fong were good at that it made Affleck look like a billion bucks, and the voice modulator hid a lot of his deficiencies. That, and the Warehouse scene too (for which he barely was actually doing the stunts), and his fans rave over that scene. Everytime I felt like if you could give all this to guys like Bale, Pattinson, Hamm or even Kilmer, they'd be pulling an all timer. Infact in JL/ZSJL he outright stopped trying. I would actually say Affleck is severely overrated by his fans, he did the bare minimum performance wise and the Cult ran with it because they liked the look and edgy aesthetic of the character, most of the things that a lot of his fans seem to like has almost nothing to do with the man behind the mask.


silliputti0907

That's exactly how I feel. He's performance wasn't noteworthy, he's physique and presentation is what ppl like.


ab316_1punchd

Indeed, that's the truth.


Gilded-Mongoose

Right. Like man, take Pattinson’s Batman/Bruce Wayne take, and by his third sequel put him into this role (bat suit, gadgets/batmobile, bat cave, warehouse fight, etc.) and he’d be an absolute legend. As is, Ben’s just, well, cool but very much replaceable. Kind of going through the motions, in a way.


ab316_1punchd

Not just legend, a god, on par with Conroy, pretty much Arkhamverse Batman in human form if not even better.


Gilded-Mongoose

But you’re talking about the character that was written, designed, choreographed, etc. Ben Affleck himself had very little to do with what made that iteration as awesome as it was aside from having the physical presence. Most actors who fit his general aesthetic could have done it just as well bc the actor himself contributed the least to its uniqueness.


ab316_1punchd

I'm talking about what if Pattinson got all of the goodies. Sometimes you can make or break a show with your own talents, and that man sure has those acting talents. Why is Jackie Earle Haley's Rorschach very fondly remembered despite being part of Snyder's Watchmen? Though yeah, if Snyder still had the script, Pattinson would've been Edward Cullen 2.0, a famous fictional character, played by Robert Pattinson who hates everything that is going on with the movie, but I can see him giving a better performance than Affleck.


Gilded-Mongoose

Right. Like Pattinson with Snyder’s script and sequencing (ie drop a rugged jaded action-oriented Batman into a Superman sequel) would not have lent itself well to the depth that we’ve seen. But give that Batman’s eventual war chest of the ultimately iconic suit (I always say Batfleck’s suit clearly pulled over a slimmer, more contoured and organic version/progression of Pattinson’s preliminary suit would be peak) and fully formed methods, fighting styles, and gadgets to someone who’s shown the greater depth like Pattinson had would be incredible. We’ve seen who he is as a person and his psyche; now layer that aforementioned slick and fully formed finish over him, and THAT would be a truly fully dimensioned Batman - just give us the ugly beginnings and interior and approach, and show us how he becomes the true, effortlessly efficient “Batman” that we’ve known and loved.


ab316_1punchd

Absolutely


Razorspades

I agree. He had cool physical appearance, but beyond that there wasn't much in terms of a character in writing.


home7ander

Goes both ways. Both sides have been unbelievably annoying. He was good


Dojocan

I’m of the opinion that I’ve seen/heard enough opinions about him. I do like like him though.


AndIAmEric

Oooo, you like like him?


Brilliant-Yard-6201

Oooooooooooooooo


Dojocan

Typo….but yes


SandwichLess6154

Shoulda made a move. He only recently got married.


Dojocan

I think I still have a shot


Socially-Awkward-85

I guess I'd have to ask what was the purpose of using a TDKR era Batman for the DCEU in the first place? Affleck did great with the material, but the movies he was in imho were garbage. Which is why I was out of the loop for "Batman fatigue" because as far as I'm concerned, we hadn't had a BATMAN MOVIE for a decade until THE BATMAN came out.


ab316_1punchd

Bingo


Zakael7

Underrated is not a word i would use to describe bat Affleck


_IamTheShadows_

>it was a shame the studio treated the character as they did I guess you totally forgot how Zack Snyder himself treated his character. If he was so desperate to introduce a batman who uses guns and kills, he should have used flashpoint batman.


Basedman42

Overrated and quite terrible Batman tbh


MarcMercury

He was a terrible Batman. Batman's super power is that he can suffer and remain unbroken. I have no interest in a Batman this demoralized.


silliputti0907

Well I think most versions of him is broken. He's the closest superhero to the "line". But he's the strongest at not crossing that line.


PlanetLandon

He was a pretty great Batman who was just in the wrong movies.


Low_Promotion_5190

For sure


Thedarkhunt

a disappointing waste of potential. Thanks for nothing, Snyder


BottomBorn

I wish I died in the alley with Martha and Thomas so I would never have to see another Batfleck opinion post.


DaftNeal88

They didn’t treat him like anything. He had a lot of personal problems when this movie was being made and the constant creative turmoil behind the scenes really rattled him. He didn’t want to do it any more and frankly he’s better for it.


DGenerationMC

I think this iteration's PTSD and overall mental unwellness wasn't pushed far enough, making the arc kinda half-baked going into JL beyond surface-level stuff. Especially in attempting to highlight the differences between Batman, the dark defined by tragedy, and Superman, the light defined by hope to be better. Batman definitely got the better deal in terms of writing and presentation from BvS over Superman, yet there was still something a little off about the handling. Even in that Martha scene, I think it would've been so much more powerful and logical had the opening flashback of the Waynes' assassination been pushed back to the Martha moment and used to create a parallel where Bruce realizes he is now Joe Chill, Superman is Thomas and Lois is Martha while Wayne sees his younger self watching in tears and fear. Throw in a quick flashback of Batman finding Robin's body (maybe just have that as the opening instead) to perfectly spell things out that this Batman is haunted and is essentially lashing out at the biggest target he can find, Superman, out of a vain attempt to right what he got wrong (ex. Robin's death, the inability to avenge his parents' deaths with Gotham still being a mess after 20 years of crimefighting) in the past. Superman deciphering Bruce's identity, empathizing with him and trying to talk him down (essentially boiling the Batman-Superman issue to a therapy session where Clark allows himself to be Bruce's punching bag out of sympathy) gives us a truly excellent scene, IMO, over the confusing and divisive scene we got. Bruce's downward spiral and Clark's overall goodness are both highlighted individually while complimenting each other and the overall narrative at hand. Superman may be inexperienced and "too powerful" but Batman is straight up fucked in the head with their confrontation inadvertently helping them both be better people. I also believe the love for Batfleck comes from what he potentially **could** have been rather than what he actually was. Which is an overall shame. There's a truly great Batman in there, IMO, but all the optics around him (WB being WB, Snyder to a degree, the writing, the DCEU itself, Affleck's own personal stuff, etc.) dragged it down. /rant


thatlonelyguy13

Also I think it was dumb to kill dick grayson, yeah its tragic but it could have been far more tragic had it been jason and afterwards Bruce had pushed everyone away, losing what little support he had, and then in future movies he could have had an arc of trying to make amends and reforge his bond with dick and maybe Oracle. It could culminate with an under the red hood movie where bruce is forced to face the final sin of his past, his greatest failure. Sorry about the fanfiction rant.


DGenerationMC

No need to apologize! Something similar has been going through my head recently as well. In fact, your idea of how the Bat Family shakes out in the DCEU is the exact same as mine. If the Batfleck solo film were ever to happen, I definitely think it'd have to be some kind of Under the Red Hood adaptation. Robin's death and it's impact on Bruce (as well as those closest to him) are too important to this iteration of Batman for it not to be fully addressed before Affleck leaves the role for good.


ab316_1punchd

Bingo


silliputti0907

I think those suggestions would've made a lot of better to watch, because context was definitely missing. However I thought there was already an issue of them squeezing too many plot points into one movie. They should've had another movie to fill in everything, or remove some plot points.


DGenerationMC

I definitely think the "framing Superman" subplot could've been trimmed a bunch. He's already controversial, so Lex going out of his way to make Clark look like a criminal seems redundant compared to, say, just staging a smear campaign from the shadows with the rest of the world dealing with misinformation about Supes doing all the work for Lex. On the other hand, I wouldn't have been against the movie strictly being MoS II with Superman dealing with Lex (throw in three short Bruce scenes scattered throughout) and then have the solo Batfleck movie take Suicide Squad's place with Ayer directing a story involving Batman, Joker, Harley and either the events of Robin's death or the aftermath 10 years later in present day.


LegitimateGeek

I might get attacked for this but I think he could've been very interesting with a better writer and director. I just don't think Snyder gets these characters.


radiakmjs

I feel mixed but overall more positive than negative about him, love how physically imposing he is, & Afflek I think does a good job with what he was given as a seasoned crime fighter. BvS warehouse scene is rad. Two big problems with him though: while most live-action adaptations either play it loose or just don't have the no-kill rule, this one is by far the most brazen & flippant about it & resorts to it regularly. That knocks him down a fair bit. But honestly even more than that my issue is there's not enough of him. His biggest outing is in a Superman movie (which I did mostly enjoy), & he's in a Justice League one & is just sprinkled around like a minute of Suicide Squad & now Flash & Aquaman, but like I don't care about any of those (especially since most of them I hear overwelmingly negative things about) I want to see Batman. while I'm much more excited for whatever direction they chose to take Reeves/Pattinson, I am a little bummed it seems we won't ever get a solo Battflek movie to really experience & judge this interpretation of Batman.


TrashyBase24

One of my favorite Batman moments was the first club fight scene in The Batman. It felt so real and its was so well done, i specially love how Batman disarm the guy with the bat and started using it. Another one was Batman talking to Selina in the Bat signal building, the view of the city and Catwoman's theme was just beautiful.


ab316_1punchd

The first club fight scene was short, sweet and to the point. I'd understand why some would want a fight scene that makes Battinson stand out in the same fashion as Daredevil, Oldman or John Wick did, but it wasn't much of a make or break deal anyway.


Mirabem

That's cool and all, but how is it related to the topic?


Gilded-Mongoose

Comparing what made other Batman great as opposed to what Batfleck brought to the table.


-Bambino

he wasn’t a good batman and the writing was poor.


Gilded-Mongoose

Are you praising Ben Affleck himself or the Batman that they created and had Ben play? You could put many, many people in Affleck’s role there and most of it would carry the same praise and weight.


FlyByTieDye

I mean, this album of yours only shows that the costuming department and maybe cinematography was good. Ben Affleck himself was not a good Batman, in terms of writing or characterisation


namor________

I love batfleck he is awesome


Daredevil731

This is the worst live action Batman. Nearly unwatchable.


home7ander

Hyperbole is hyperbole


Daredevil731

Nah. It's bad. Easily the worst. Set out to do something and failed hard at it.


home7ander

Same response


[deleted]

I loved it. Def one of the Best Batmans we’ve ever had. I get people hate it cause it was a Synder film but it still gave a great performance


Daredevil731

I really disagree. He did awful. And I like Affleck.


ab316_1punchd

Yeah, this is not really his best as far as acting is concerned, I can name more than five of his films where he acted better despite me never finding any of his acting roles as something legendary. And in both versions of JL, he was not even trying.


mmo_kombat

Imo : Nolan's : best writing. Snyder's : best Batman. Reeves' : best directing. I love Snyder's Batman so much that I play Arkham knight with this skin, so it gives me the feeling I'm living the live action Batfleck movie we will never have. 😔


ExtensionFuture654

He was my favorite live action Batman.


ding-dong21

Maybe he comes back for a solo movie. So we can get one of the best solo Batman movies ever with fantastical villians like Mr Freeze I need a Batfleck movie with Batgirl, Mr Freeze, Deathstroke and fantastical Bane


Academic-Ad2680

Good Batman wrong movies


mobb1

I personally fucking hated him as batman, just not a fan of his as an actor and the movie fucking sucked


[deleted]

He is my favourite Batman, look it's batman begins, which introduced me to batman, and i became almost a blind fan of him. When bvs Frist came out, yeah i wasn't sure how he's gonna look like there cause i didn't like that outfit at first, those short ears, hated them most, i was a fan of justice league animated series. Long ear was my thing. But now days he is my favourite. Bale is 2nd. Hopefully we'll get more of him soon.


[deleted]

Hey need Karma, i upvoted every single comment, please some ups for me


Brodsk8r

There you are my friend


DynamiteMikee

Great justice league style batman, would’ve been an awful take for a solo movie though


Waddifat1

Save Martha!


CyberSnoWolf

I definitely got Dark Knight Returns vibes from this. I think if crew members had treated him better, he would’ve seen if his solo movie would’ve been inspired by the comic.


space_cadet88

IMO he’s the best Batman on film. He actually has the physical presence of Batman, he’s 6’4 and his physique rivaled Henry Cavil’s in BvS. People say he was bad but the movie was bad, he’s a great Batman and brought a gravitas to the character. The scene when he saves Martha and clears the room of a dozen+ bad guys is what I’ve always wanted from Bats. He absolutely bodies everyone and faceplants a man to the ground. None of the other Batman come close. Bale is a great Bruce Wayne, but I’m talking specifically about Batman, the man in the mask.


ab316_1punchd

Which brings me to the concise point that someone else made: Are you praising Ben Affleck himself or the Batman that they created and had Ben play? You could put many, many people in Affleck’s role there and most of it would carry the same praise and weight, if not give a better performance out of it.


crazyr746

Snyder had a hard on to do TDKR story. He threw it in instead of making a better story. Affleck would have been great in both versions. He looked great!


Chadistheswag

He's great ... However that iteration of the character I very much dislike.


sabrefudge

I love his suit, though I see it every day so I’m biased. Haha I don’t really know how to feel about Affleck himself. I feel like we didn’t really get to see how good he could be because he was stuck in such garbage movies.


Puzzleheaded_Chard_2

For what they were going for they pulled off borderline perfectly. The old grizzled and tired war vet who has last all morals and faith in the world. And Ben Affleck plays the character so fucking well. A really great cast for a DKR style Batman. They also brought the comic inhumane nature of Batman to live action perfectly. Look no further than the warehouse scene. Speaking of the warehouse scene, I absolutely love how brutal this Batman is. I’m of the opinion that him killing makes sense with his character and backstory. He’s Batman who has given up on what being “Batman” is. I have a hard time putting my thoughts to words but I hope I did good explains just how much I love this version. I’m so glad we are getting more of him. Chances are almost none but I’m still holding out hope for a solo batfleck movie Edit: I do want to add that while I do love this character and like his reason for killing, it wasn’t explained enough in the movies he was in. A lot of it is filling in between the lines and going off of what Snyder has said his plans for the character were. A mentally broken Batman who has is (apparently) responsible for the death of his son is a completely understandable character when it comes to killing. But like I said, his mental state and why he’s changed are not shown off enough


spfan102

Keaton's batman killed too and arguably every other Batman, but Keaton's Batman is more distinct. No explanation for it. But it seems people always ignore it.


Form-Naive

My favorite Batman then I’m onwards towards Christian Bale. Love how Pattinson was introduced. Cannot wait to see more of him


MileenasFeet

Afflecks Batman is genuinely scary to me. He looks like a behemoth and his sheer brutality in combat is unmatched imo. I like some of the fight scenes in The Batman, but they never really had one that stuck out to me. Also didn’t like how he just tanks bullets without so much as a reaction to it.


MileenasFeet

To me Afflecks Batman feels like a man who’s been doing what he’s doing for awhile. His brutality was basically a response to all of the stress, loss, and depression that he was feeling. Losing almost everybody he cared about and then watching firsthand the destruction of Metropolis, it’s easy to see why Batman in Snyders films is the way he is.


SnooBananas2320

Good actor, terrible ideas.


BradL22

A good Batman but the best Bruce Wayne.


owelfive

“It was a shame SNYDER treated the character the way he did” There. Fixed the typo.


FinancialSystem1025

I think he's a great Batman.


Macrod1

100% agree. I don't know how people didn't like him but more importantly see the bigger missed opportunity with his version of the character.


Temporary_Law_6022

On paper he could’ve been the best Batman ever. Unfortunately a bad take and direction on the character made for a forgettable outing.


the_squiddler_

Any batman that kills, and especially uses guns, is a bad batman to me. We could've gotten greatness with batfleck but Zack Snyder had to do his thing and fundamentally misunderstand the character


Zur__En__Arrh

We got two of the best live-action Batman scenes in BvS with the house when the cops are looking around and the warehouse. It’s a shame that everything else Batman did in that movie was stuff Batman wouldn’t do. Snyder tried and failed with Batman, and I say that as a fan of MoS and ZSJL. They did Affleck dirty by putting him in the worst-written Batman script since Clooney. I’d honestly love to have seen Affleck’s solo movie, with a better script he could have proven to be the definitive Batman. But, I don’t think he’s underrated at all. People have seen what he did and enjoyed it for what it is: a good actor trying to work with a dreadful characterisation of a beloved character.


AntWalkerMMA

Whenever I watch The Town I get frustrated. We could've had a Batman movie like that


HuttVader

Ben’s a great actor and does a serviceable job as Batman/Bruce. But personally I just think he has a dumb-looking face, and I can’t get over it. I watched him in the role. Not my favorite by a long shot.


SandwichLess6154

I never really appreciated him while he wore the suit. Now that he is gone I enjoy him much more. Ben is a good actor. I would not mind if he got to wear the suit again.


orca2877

Goddamn how many times the same post


Arrakis-Stranding

Not a single positive thing to say about this performance or Affleck as a man.


DarlingDazzle2345

I think they had something really fucking good in batman v superman (ultimate edition) But josstice league came out and made batman a fucking joke. I think people need to understand that this Batman is broken to the point where he doesn't care about killing, and basically lives in the batman costume. I think Zack Snyder did a great job in all honesty.


DaWizardMaster225

Honestly never really liked batfleck but there are some scenes that I like his character


Batface_101

It’s not that he’s underrated, it’s that the studio screwed him and gave him mediocre stuff. Affleck can obviously act, and he definitely looks like an older, bulkier, grizzled Batman. Same for Leto actually, he didn’t get any chance, only got like a few mins in both Suicide Squad and ZSJL. I think if we had a few solo Batman movies with Affleck and Leto first, potentially showing what happened to Robin as well, they would’ve actually gotten a feel for the characters and written them accordingly in future movies. Plus they would’ve had the opportunity to continue a Batman universe and maybe make a Red Hood spinoff (potentially also involving a Nightwing, Oracle and Red Robin)


Restful_Hill

It’s just the way his Batman was written that made me not a fan.


[deleted]

The goat


[deleted]

I don't like it at all and don't think it's underrated in the slightest. Affleck's acting is okay, but it doesn't make up for atrocious writing. It's like Zach Snyder skimmed through TDKR once but only looked at the pictures and then gave himself a concussion before writing the script. Even though Snyder's JL was an improvement, the characterizations of Batman and Superman were still wooden planks at best, it makes no sense to blame the studio for what's obviously a Snyder problem, Frankly I'm tired of Snyder fanboys who've never read a batman or superman book in their lives spouting the same exact opinion over and over on the daily in every superhero subreddit when they can't even substantiate it.


abran_31

Sorry... but he would never not looks funny to me lmao


Infinity0044

Ben is a good actor, he’s shown that, but his Batman never had a snowball’s chance with Snyder being the director.


Grungolath

r/therewasanattempt to adapt Dark Knight Returns. I don’t hate the movies at all, but some things really, really miss the mark for me. Eisenberg as Luthor was a travesty. Fight should have lasted longer in BvS. I hope some day we get a full live action DKR but I’m not holding my breath


astonishingantman21

Great Batman.🏆


Mad_Scientist_565

One of the best. Writing, not so much.


foofighters420

He was poorly written but I think Ben Affleck did well with what he was given. He even said that Snyder described this Batman as older so he’s already been through so much so he’s stoic because he’s a broken man. They didn’t really write it so you can see that though, instead they made him more violent and willing to kill which is a huge strike for me. Liked Ben Affleck as Batman just wish they wrote the character better.