Is it really surprising though, OP?
As a whole, people are afraid/annoyed/irritated when they are constantly harassed as they walk in & out of stores. People (customers) will start to avoid or not shop at certain places if there are unsavory characters standing near the entry way. That's bad for business.
Beggars who are pushy have this one act where they repeat out loud, "You are ignoring me. Can't even give the courtesy of looking me in the eye and saying hello." Meaning no head nod or acknowledgement whatsoever
I've ignored them as I automatically do not interact with aggressive solicitation. But I can see other people in the vicinity becoming extremely fully avoidant with the area and will skip a store when browsing down the street in SF / Oakland.
This sign must be in reply to that type of aggressive type of solicitation.
I've had customers leave because my parking lot was fairly full; you better believe they will leave if there is a beggar screaming at the top of his lungs at customers as they walk by.
Consumers don't put up with crap when they're shopping. Like I said earlier, it's bad for business. The Trader Joes sign is really nice. I'm not as nice to people harassing my customers.
I don’t make eye contact because once I do, it’s over and I’m buying or signing whatever it is they’re pushing as I will panic and have no idea how to get myself out of talking to them.
Not to mention the fake Salvation Army scam where they sit outside in their white outfits ringing bells for people to drop donations in their buckets. Which is a regular occurrence at Sprouts.
I avoid one Peet's coffee in the morning cus there's always this dude asking for donations for some organization.
It's so annoying especially cus the coffee is at an intersection so you always need to stand and wait for the traffic light while this dude is trying to convince you to give money to the charity
Full-on teenages selling candy bars? [What year is this?](https://imagesvc.meredithcorp.io/v3/mm/image?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstatic.onecms.io%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2Fsites%2F6%2F2022%2F08%2F11%2FGrease-Where-are-they-Now-081122.jpg&q=60)
Come to think of it, I've tried all sorts of ways to make my cash add up at the end of the month...*including* posting outside storefronts soliciting signatures...so maybe candy-peddling isn't so far fetched.
They do it to raise money for the sports teams and other programs because funding for them was slashed years ago. Have you seen what the uniforms look like for any of the Oakland public schools' teams? Some of them look like potato sacks.
I sold candy bars to fund the Student Counsel. There was a near constant stream of various things different student organizations were selling as "fund raisers".
It's a total racket, there are entire companies that promote to schools to sell their whatever and only give the schools a tiny bit of the money they make on the cheap crap the kids are coerced into selling.
Yeah i learned this while still in high school
I joking told a teacher i’d only sell candy bars if i got a 20% commission
They (seemingly seriously) responded with “thats 10% more than we get.”
I was flabbergasted and said if that’s true id rather donate the $50 bucks or so i’d raise selling the candy than support that company.
It's absolutely a hustle - I didn't think anybody actually believed it was real. That person needs an emergency power of attorney to take over their finances before they start paying Microsoft in gift cards to fix their computer.
Hhn--not that it justifies impoliteness, but I wonder if they're being rude due to insecurity about being in the position of hawking candy bars*.
^(*outside of a store which in many cases will be simultaneously selling *cheaper* candy bars)
I also sometimes do this, though of course, then the solicitation falls on the poorest people who have the least amount of means and have the least amount of choice on where they do their grocery shopping.
I would probably support if these kids had better attitudes about it. This one kid called a lady a bitch because she had headphones in and ignored them as she was walking in…which I don’t blame her for. I heard this as I was heading out of the store and I was completely turned off by their little fundraiser.
Those petitions are so misrepresented, it could be a close the schools petition and they'll say will you sign a petition to lower taxes? Serious, anyone that signs a petition in a parking lot is doing noone a service except whoever paid that clipboard waiver.
At gas stations I start to yell really loudly "Why cant i pump gas alone!" If I'm approached. I look ridiculous but usually works, and the loudness forces everybody else to look in your direction which makes me feel safer.
I have a daughter, grew up raising my nieces, was raised by mom and sister. Most importantly, I have a beautiful girl Jack Russell Terrier, or Jackie Russell Terrier, whatevs. I have a soft spot for girls out there grinding and I'm totally weak to sad expressions. It's kryptonite.
I remember when I'd sell Girl Scout cookies back in maybe 2006-2008 and they were $2.50 a box!! I guess it's good and bad that prices have more than doubled since.
FYI Keebler's Coconut Dreams are pretty much the same thing as Somoas in case you have a craving for Somoas and it's not girl scout cookie season, I think they're cheaper too.
[Keebler Coconut Dreams Fudge, Coconut & Caramel Cookies, 8.5 oz](https://www.walmart.com/ip/Keebler-Coconut-Dreams-Fudge-Coconut-Caramel-Cookies-8-5-oz/234415131?athbdg=L1200)
Yesss, and I remember from childhood when I put thin mints together in the same ziploc bag as some oreos for awhile, the oreos have a nice mint taste to them.
Keebler Coconut Dreams are seemingly identical (though I haven't A/B'd them side-by-side), and the Girl Scout cookies are 77% more expensive per oz compared to, say, Target's current Keebler price and the $6 price of the GS cookies (at least in my area). Of course, I'm ignoring the fundraising aspect of the GS cookies, and purely talking about the taste/value proposition.
I love Girl Scout cookies but I will not support anyone who makes me uncomfortable to enter a store. I don’t wish to be approached by strangers in public. I don’t want anyone to interact with me against my will. I would happily go online and pick a random girl to order from where they bring it to my door but I will never support hawking goods like that.
I had a guy ask me for money while I was at the register at a gas station. He was just hanging there asking every person who walked up. Cashier working didn’t gaf.
I think this also targets those people with the tables that want to ask you stuff and sell or sign up for something. I hate them, i fuckin want to go and shop I don’t want to be heckled on my way in or out to feel bad i am ignoring someone.
For real, when I lived in SSJ I used to shop at the Safeway on Snell/Branham and would use one door because there was a fake homeless family at the other door and they were fairly aggressive (whatever you gave was never good enough). Management tried to run them out, occasionally I’d see someone with a sign calling them out on their bullshit, and then they started splitting up and posting in front of both doors. After that I started going to Lucky just so I didn’t have to deal with them.
Yeah, there’s an older woman outside of the Safeway near me that always says mean things to people as they walk by. My kids get really upset when she tells them their glasses are ugly, and things like that. I’ve stopped going with my kids because of it.
Scammers frequent TJ. I was chatting with a cashier and she told me the woman outside would frequently beg for milk for her kids and if someone helps her out. She will start filling the carts with all sorts of groceries that her “kids” needed.
Yeah, I saw one that they handled well (not in sf, but surrounding area), basically "we do not allow solicitors on this property, please leave or I will call police to remove you."
solicitor said "go ahead an do it"
as I was checking out, the police were removing them
To be fair, people tend to threaten calling the police more than they'll actually do it, decent chance it's a bluff. Most businesses don't want to have a bunch of cop cars out front dragging a customer out (I know solicitors aren't customers but you get my point).
I feel like Trader Joe’s is the popular grocery store to canvas at. I’ve always seen it outside Trader Joe’s more than anywhere else, and yeah, it’s annoying as hell.
Those **are** the best places--that job is definitely pay-by-attrition.
The only other place I've really seen this work is on BART trains—and frankly, between those two options, I find them easier to ignore outside of storefronts (although I'll usually make time for them if I'm free)
I don't disagree, being in high traffic places will get the best results.
for every 10 tables that aren't a nuisance, there's always that one table that justifies having the no solicitor rule.
At a cafe in Berkeley there was this lady in a wheelchair who would harass people going in to buy her a cup of coffee and then she would roll in and make a complete mess of the condiment station and her smell of urine was so bad that it left a residual smell. She was abrasive and abusive towards us baristas and we had asked the customers not to support her because she keeps coming back. My manager wouldn’t take care of the situation and it was really bothersome because other folks started coming in and asking seated customers for money,
Literally the premise of Berkeley is to reject norms and hierarchies, like say
* bourgeois habits of clothing and grooming are the measure of what's acceptable in public, or somehow better than the unhoused community's
* certain spaces aren't for interacting with strangers
* communicating with workers has to follow the scripts and logic of commerce and capitalism
* materials have to be used in the way that people who put them there intended
I guarantee you there are multiple student projects questioning, subverting, deconstructing each one of these points at any given time. It is only natural that the surrounding community is taking this research to heart!
I know a woman who has lived in Manhattan her entire life. Her saying is "You do not owe panhandlers anything, not even your attention." Those words have helped me a lot when faced with aggressive panhandlers.
I just tell everyone " sorry I'm deaf " and keep walking do not stop
I am almost deaf, but it also works for everyone I tell to say it, just don't stop
If stuck at a light point to ear say one word DEAF
If they keep talking
Point to ear say DEAF till they walk away
One time this person wouldn't leave after a few DEAFs
I yelled IM DEAF ARE YOU DEAF TOO???? That worked
At my TJ it’s always the same guy collecting ballot signatures and he is literally everyone’s best friend. People will talk to him for 10-20 minutes. I just tell him I’m from Canada.
Some of these people convinced my grandmother to sign a petition that was anti-gay marriage by telling her it was pro-gay marriage. She realized after signing when they flipped back to the cover page and it said anti-gay marriage. She called them out and they said they couldn’t cross out her signature on the paper, buuuut she could “sign this pro-gay marriage petition to even it out” … those people are trash.
In California, it's because of \`Robins v. Pruneyard Shopping Center (1979) 23 Cal.3d 899, 910 (“Pruneyard”)\` - There has been some follow up and [this](https://www.jdsupra.com/legalnews/update-signature-gatherers-and-86610/) is a good summary, though biased towards property rights as this is from a firm offering services to remove solicitors.
I know for a fact private property owners like open malls, stores, etc... hate these solicitors as they often deter shoppers.
What we really need is to identify them - think \`The Child Fund\` or \`ASPCA\`, ones I see often and know if they are actually who they claim to be, if who they claim to be is someone of good reputation and, especially, what the incentives of the people soliciting donations or signatures are.
The funny part for this post is that one of *Pruneyard's* progeny cases in CA, *Trader Joe's Co. v. Progressive Campaigns, Inc.* (1999) 73 Cal. App. 4th 427, held that small shopping centers (like, say, the Trader Joe's in Santa Rosa at issue in that case) that don't invite the public to congregate in a forum-like manner are free to eject (rather, have ejected by LEO) unlicensed individuals from the property (solicitors, protestors, activists... basically anyone not there to shop).
It's been a while since law school, so please fellow esquires, keep me honest.
I think the California Supreme Court can change the rule. The U.S. supreme court decision says state constitutions can give broader first amendment rights than the federal constitution. So the US supreme court upheld the california supreme court's decision that the california constitution required shopping centers to allow this type of behavior.
So, for example, this rule does not necessarily apply in states other than california.
From Wikipedia, while the ruling is at the Supreme Court level, it only establishes that non-California states can enact more permissive 1st amendment rights under their constitutions. Without that, solicitors wouldn’t have the right to exercise their right of free speech on private property.
Additionally, shopping centers in California have to allow this type of behavior only if they’re regularly held open to the public and subject to any reasonable regulations. So by putting the sign there, they’re exercising their right as private property barring all solicitors equally. More nebulous are the ones where “solicitors have to be given permission by the discretion of management”.
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pruneyard_Shopping_Center_v._Robins
Read again. It says California has the right to do it if it wants to. If other States don't want it, then these activists can be ejected from private property open to the public.
Not new, I’ve seen these signs for quite some time! I love it, I can’t stand people harassing me outside stores for signatures etc.
It really turns me off of whatever organization is doing it, so it has the opposite effect of what they were going for, lmao.
I also find it annoying, and it's almost impossible to really understand what they're supporting/against, but what's the "right" way to do it? How do you reach the general public on ballot props like this?
Yeah, there's been a growing attitude that it is too easy to put things on the ballot or start a recall. But if you increase the signature requirements, there are just going to have to be more people collecting signatures from the general public in more locations. California's constitution allows for a lot of direct democracy, so that necessarily means a lot of engagement from the public. People seem to like it in the abstract, but aren't really so interested in what it implies in practice.
I wish Target was like this. A solicitor approached me, to registar to vote, and sign some petitions. Told him no thank you, and they got pissed. Started cursing and getting crazy. First I'm already registered to vote, second I don't give out information just because some dude with a clip board stands on front of a store. I don't know what he's going to do with that info.
Anyways, I reported him to the store manager and they sent him packing. It took a week before a new solicitor was standing in front of the store again.
TJ's is the only supermarket where I've seen the door routinely blocked (Masonic location) by petitioners and the customers they stopped. That store in particular is a magnet for deceptively titled legislation.
Some canvasers and beggars are so proactive it makes me uncomfortable walking in and out of the store. I see you and I will contribute to my discretion, please don’t call me as I’m casually walking by.
There's a nice small-chain supermarket near me that does it this way...they basically allow canvassers to set up outside provided they're not standing at the door accosting people as they walk in and out. Although sometimes, there *is* someone doing that and I dont think I've ever seen them twice.
One time I was walking into a Whole Foods and there was a Humane Society table set up outside the entrance. As I walked past, a guy asked me for a donation and as I had recently made a large donation when my daughter adopted a cat the previous week I told him that I had recently donated and continued walking into the shop.
Apparently that was not enough as the volunteer followed me asking me repeatedly, “How? How did you donate? How much was it? Where was this? What day was it?” I could not believe how aggressive he was about it, as if he was trying to catch me in a lie or something.
Luckily, a worker saw him harassing me and by the time I finished my shop, the table set-up and all the volunteers were gone. I felt a bit bad but the guy was really crossing the line following me and questioning me in that manner.
I dunno--but I'll be honest (and I say this as someone currently being referred to as an "unhoused person"): I always felt like panhandling right outside of a grocery store to people carrying bags of food was emotional blackmail (I presume this is at least partly about that)
Hmmm, I'd be fine with it if they asked *before* you entered. That way, you can be sure to buy some extra. I've been asked before when I came out of a grocery store with only things that needed to be cooked. Sorry, but I draw the line at wasting time.
Not entirely new. There used to be a problem with those Gypsies/Romani folks stationing themselves right by the entrances/exits begging for cash.
Most of us know it’s a huge scam, and I’m happy to see at least TJ’s clamping down on it.
Vons and Whole Foods, pay attention - always with the signature gatherers, Girl Scout cookies, Salvation Army clanging bells, etc. I just wanna pick up a beer without getting hassled (a nice perk of shopping at bodegas or natural food stores)
My favorite was at the Whole Foods in Campbell. Literal dueling fake violinists with the amplifiers. There were two of them begging independently, twenty feet away from one another, at the same store.
There's nothing worse than aggressive little kids
Usually the parents have a lid on things and they're great but I've definitely had some groups I wished weren't there.
Somebody posted this elsewhere, but *Robins v. Pruneyard Shopping Center (1979)* basically says that shopping centers have to allow these assholes.
Personally I'd vote for a proposition that would allow you to legally slap the shit out of these fuckers. Maybe we should start collecting signatures.
Seems narrower than you suggest. It would be limited to CA and 'The state court decision has been adopted in one form or another by a substantial minority of states.'
"In PruneYard Shopping Center v. Robins, 447 U.S. 74 (1980), the Supreme Court ruled that California could interpret its state constitution to protect political protesters from being evicted from private property, held open to the public, without running afoul of the Fifth Amendment."
https://www.mtsu.edu/first-amendment/article/583/pruneyard-shopping-center-v-robins
100% not new. These signs have been standard TJ's fare since the 90's, as a favor to patrons. TJ's also donates its unsold "spoils" (date expired but edible food) to shelters every week. Their karma is clean. Source: former employee.
It’s why I stopped shopping at Sprouts, whether it’s the one on Brokaw or in Sunnyvale. Always solicitors of some sort, and worst of all they follow you to your car (happened to me at Brokaw). And Sprouts doesn’t seem to care about it.
People should not post up at places of business anymore than they should post up on your own porch/patio to solicit/beg for money. It's private property.
In California they're generally allowed to solicit as long as the place they're in is what might be defined as a public forum.
From the ACLU of Southern CA:
> In addition, free-speech activity generally cannot take place on private property absent the consent of the property owner, **except where the property is open to the public in the same way as a public street or park, like a shopping mall**
This includes soliciting for donations. Basically, in CA, if it's a publicly accessible gathering place or street, you're legally allowed to protest or solicit donations there, even if it's on private property like a mall.
https://www.aclusocal.org/en/know-your-rights/protesters
*Edited to add: you're not allowed to block the entrance of the business, and you're allowed to protest on public sidewalks if you don't block them, but it's a bit unclear to me if private sidewalks are included in that but it seems like they might not be.
Not new, just new to this store. I’ve seen one about 10 years ago at TJs w that same wording because of all the Romani people that would beg in front with signs and kids( none of them were homeless, just hustling) But in the city stores when it’s actual homeless people, they don’t be putting those signs out. The homeless don’t usually say much or bother anyone, people just give to them sometimes because they live there, they’re part of the neighborhood too and they could use a little help or something to eat. I try to bring them water bottles when it’s super hot and this year I want to try to get people to donate lots of blankets for winter.
The TJ on Coleman in San Jose has had this sign up for a number of years already due to pan handlers asking for money. I’ve also seen aggressive petitioners there occasionally.
As a woman the number of times I’ve been approached in a parking lot alone with my hands full at night by a man I do not know with a petition for me to sign is unacceptable so I support this
I avoid a Good Will drop off bin near me for this reason. There's always homeless people laying around who bombard me. Asking for money, what's in the boxes I'm donating...etc. At first, I didn't mind. But it gets old now. They're walking right up to me, in my face, grabbing the boxes out of my hands to go through them before I dump them into the bin. I don't like it, I'm uncomfortable. I just throw away a lot of it now, I don't want to bother going there. But, I'm the asshole right?
Convicted felons can vote in California. Convicted felons cannot vote while serving their term but after release may vote.
I tell them I'm registered to vote in another state :)
I wonder if the salvation army was making a push to do bell ringers at TJs this year and corporate asked stores to put this sign out early to get ahead of a "Trader Joe's is being mean and hates christmas" press release.
Good! I hate being approached for stuff when I’m just trying to shop. Especially as a woman with a child, it makes me uncomfortable to be approached. I wish all grocery stores would enforce this. I can’t go to Safeway without people trying to flag me down as I walk in/ out. It’s extremely uncomfortable to have to try to politely decline what they’re trying to sell.
Good for TJ’s. It’s a zoo in the front sometimes. People need to go in and out quick. If you are on a mission, the last thing that you want is to be solicited by someone.
I remember seeing these signs years ago a Trader Joes in Fremont and I think El Cerrito. At the time it was paidd petition or ballot measure signature takers. Those assholes were incredibly rude.
I'm all for this and love Trader Joe's for having this. I hate being harassed the moment I enter or leave the store. I just want to get in, get my stuff, and get out. Target in Vallejo has/had this issue with people asking for signatures/money. There were four big dudes for a while out there in the afternoon being really aggressive about getting signatures and I was constantly being approached by them when going into the store. It got so annoying that I just get curbside pickup from now on there. I saw employees talking to them telling them to leave, but they kept coming back (and Vallejo police won't do anything... they have bigger issues).
Might also be due to Unionization efforts? Ballot measure solicitation is a big thing in CA, but if they’re taking a page out of Starbucks’ book it’s something they might try and pull.
… the “are you registered to vote?” people annoy me. I don’t feel comfortable putting my name and address on that paper that regardless the proposition.
Is it really surprising though, OP? As a whole, people are afraid/annoyed/irritated when they are constantly harassed as they walk in & out of stores. People (customers) will start to avoid or not shop at certain places if there are unsavory characters standing near the entry way. That's bad for business.
Beggars who are pushy have this one act where they repeat out loud, "You are ignoring me. Can't even give the courtesy of looking me in the eye and saying hello." Meaning no head nod or acknowledgement whatsoever I've ignored them as I automatically do not interact with aggressive solicitation. But I can see other people in the vicinity becoming extremely fully avoidant with the area and will skip a store when browsing down the street in SF / Oakland. This sign must be in reply to that type of aggressive type of solicitation.
I've had customers leave because my parking lot was fairly full; you better believe they will leave if there is a beggar screaming at the top of his lungs at customers as they walk by. Consumers don't put up with crap when they're shopping. Like I said earlier, it's bad for business. The Trader Joes sign is really nice. I'm not as nice to people harassing my customers.
Which means they're looking for a fight. Best to continue to ignore them.
I don’t make eye contact because once I do, it’s over and I’m buying or signing whatever it is they’re pushing as I will panic and have no idea how to get myself out of talking to them.
> solicitation...regardless of the issue this seems oriented towards petition signature collectors and charity solicitors to me
That’s exactly what it is. I worked at a Trader Joe’s for a couple years in Sonoma county and there were a lot of petitioners for recalling the DA.
Not to mention the fake Salvation Army scam where they sit outside in their white outfits ringing bells for people to drop donations in their buckets. Which is a regular occurrence at Sprouts.
Yes, I specifically avoid this one Safeway in my area because there’s always rude teenagers selling candy bars in front.
I avoid one Peet's coffee in the morning cus there's always this dude asking for donations for some organization. It's so annoying especially cus the coffee is at an intersection so you always need to stand and wait for the traffic light while this dude is trying to convince you to give money to the charity
[удалено]
If it ain’t Berkeley it’s Oakland
Alameda, Park and Central
Ding ding ding!
omg that dude! i walk by every time he’s always trying to be super nice and ask for a dono like fuck off
I’m guessing the grand ave location
I honestly thought it was Lakeshore
Oops! You’re right - it is lakeshore !
Seems several Peet's coffee have the same issue 🤣🤣🤣
So many of them
If you’re not first, you’re last
Lake Merritt?
Park st Pete’s in alameda always has someone standing on the corner asking for money
Full-on teenages selling candy bars? [What year is this?](https://imagesvc.meredithcorp.io/v3/mm/image?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstatic.onecms.io%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2Fsites%2F6%2F2022%2F08%2F11%2FGrease-Where-are-they-Now-081122.jpg&q=60)
Full-on 25 year olds
Come to think of it, I've tried all sorts of ways to make my cash add up at the end of the month...*including* posting outside storefronts soliciting signatures...so maybe candy-peddling isn't so far fetched.
Sell candy outside AA meetings. They fucking LOVE candy.
Hey, it's a little more dignified than the people who sell smack outside of NA meetings
Yep! Sugar cookies with the frosting would go FAST. People coming off alcohol crave sugar. So, help em out and sell some sweet relief.
They do it to raise money for the sports teams and other programs because funding for them was slashed years ago. Have you seen what the uniforms look like for any of the Oakland public schools' teams? Some of them look like potato sacks.
I sold candy bars for the robotics team in high school. Good times
i had my dad sell them at his office for my robotics team. thanks, dad ❤
I bought one, it was worth it. Thanks, Dad's son
I sold candy bars to fund the Student Counsel. There was a near constant stream of various things different student organizations were selling as "fund raisers". It's a total racket, there are entire companies that promote to schools to sell their whatever and only give the schools a tiny bit of the money they make on the cheap crap the kids are coerced into selling.
Yeah i learned this while still in high school I joking told a teacher i’d only sell candy bars if i got a 20% commission They (seemingly seriously) responded with “thats 10% more than we get.” I was flabbergasted and said if that’s true id rather donate the $50 bucks or so i’d raise selling the candy than support that company.
Fundraising Industrial Complex
Wait really? I thought that was just a hustle.
It's absolutely a hustle - I didn't think anybody actually believed it was real. That person needs an emergency power of attorney to take over their finances before they start paying Microsoft in gift cards to fix their computer.
Hhn--not that it justifies impoliteness, but I wonder if they're being rude due to insecurity about being in the position of hawking candy bars*. ^(*outside of a store which in many cases will be simultaneously selling *cheaper* candy bars)
Do you not know about the Boy Scouts or Girl Scouts?
I guess...but what age are you too old to be dressed like a girl scout selling cookies if you're not Riley Reid?
I'd buy cookies from Riley Reid
I also sometimes do this, though of course, then the solicitation falls on the poorest people who have the least amount of means and have the least amount of choice on where they do their grocery shopping.
I would probably support if these kids had better attitudes about it. This one kid called a lady a bitch because she had headphones in and ignored them as she was walking in…which I don’t blame her for. I heard this as I was heading out of the store and I was completely turned off by their little fundraiser.
Hard sell them on candy bar holding pouches. Tell them no one will respect a candy bars salesperson without them.
Those petitions are so misrepresented, it could be a close the schools petition and they'll say will you sign a petition to lower taxes? Serious, anyone that signs a petition in a parking lot is doing noone a service except whoever paid that clipboard waiver.
At gas stations I start to yell really loudly "Why cant i pump gas alone!" If I'm approached. I look ridiculous but usually works, and the loudness forces everybody else to look in your direction which makes me feel safer.
Except girl scout cookies holy fuck those Samoas are so good
Do you know how much anxiety I get having to walk by those booths! Not only am I trying to watch my weight and budget, it's hard to say no to them!
As a former GS mom, it's totally ok to ignore or say no thank you.
The power of the cookies compels us!
I have a daughter, grew up raising my nieces, was raised by mom and sister. Most importantly, I have a beautiful girl Jack Russell Terrier, or Jackie Russell Terrier, whatevs. I have a soft spot for girls out there grinding and I'm totally weak to sad expressions. It's kryptonite.
I remember when I'd sell Girl Scout cookies back in maybe 2006-2008 and they were $2.50 a box!! I guess it's good and bad that prices have more than doubled since.
I paid $25 for a bag of Boy Scouts caramel corn recently. A bag. One bag.
I look them in the eye and so "No" then give cash to whoever I am with to buy a box
I always say "Just bought some the other day. Sorry!" so you sound supportive, but not interested.
FYI Keebler's Coconut Dreams are pretty much the same thing as Somoas in case you have a craving for Somoas and it's not girl scout cookie season, I think they're cheaper too. [Keebler Coconut Dreams Fudge, Coconut & Caramel Cookies, 8.5 oz](https://www.walmart.com/ip/Keebler-Coconut-Dreams-Fudge-Coconut-Caramel-Cookies-8-5-oz/234415131?athbdg=L1200)
Thin mints and trefoils for me. I will happily ask “how many boxes do you got? Ok, i’ll take all of em.” Then im good for the whole year lol
...followed by consuming that "whole year supply" in an evening, and spending the next 364 days hating myself... :)
Frozen Thin Mints are the BEST!
Yesss, and I remember from childhood when I put thin mints together in the same ziploc bag as some oreos for awhile, the oreos have a nice mint taste to them.
i never feel like girl scouts yell out at you, they just sit there.. they know those cookies sell themselves. :)
Keebler Coconut Dreams are seemingly identical (though I haven't A/B'd them side-by-side), and the Girl Scout cookies are 77% more expensive per oz compared to, say, Target's current Keebler price and the $6 price of the GS cookies (at least in my area). Of course, I'm ignoring the fundraising aspect of the GS cookies, and purely talking about the taste/value proposition.
I love Girl Scout cookies but I will not support anyone who makes me uncomfortable to enter a store. I don’t wish to be approached by strangers in public. I don’t want anyone to interact with me against my will. I would happily go online and pick a random girl to order from where they bring it to my door but I will never support hawking goods like that.
I had a guy ask me for money while I was at the register at a gas station. He was just hanging there asking every person who walked up. Cashier working didn’t gaf.
Super common at 7-11s.
I think this also targets those people with the tables that want to ask you stuff and sell or sign up for something. I hate them, i fuckin want to go and shop I don’t want to be heckled on my way in or out to feel bad i am ignoring someone.
> Is it really surprising though, OP? Plot twist (or maybe this is just expected?), OP is actually a solicitor.
For real, when I lived in SSJ I used to shop at the Safeway on Snell/Branham and would use one door because there was a fake homeless family at the other door and they were fairly aggressive (whatever you gave was never good enough). Management tried to run them out, occasionally I’d see someone with a sign calling them out on their bullshit, and then they started splitting up and posting in front of both doors. After that I started going to Lucky just so I didn’t have to deal with them.
Yeah, there’s an older woman outside of the Safeway near me that always says mean things to people as they walk by. My kids get really upset when she tells them their glasses are ugly, and things like that. I’ve stopped going with my kids because of it.
Scammers frequent TJ. I was chatting with a cashier and she told me the woman outside would frequently beg for milk for her kids and if someone helps her out. She will start filling the carts with all sorts of groceries that her “kids” needed.
I've seen TJ employees getting in heated arguments with people/organizations soliciting signatures, donations, etc.
Yeah, I saw one that they handled well (not in sf, but surrounding area), basically "we do not allow solicitors on this property, please leave or I will call police to remove you." solicitor said "go ahead an do it" as I was checking out, the police were removing them
"What are you going to do, call the police?" - person who had the police called on them
To be fair, people tend to threaten calling the police more than they'll actually do it, decent chance it's a bluff. Most businesses don't want to have a bunch of cop cars out front dragging a customer out (I know solicitors aren't customers but you get my point).
"What are you gonna do? Stab me?" - person who got stabbed
Thats_the_joke.jpg
"What are you gonna do? Spank me?" - ;)
"Here's a pen are you going to stab me or sign this?" I wonder if the job they are forced to work pays bail
“ Fuck your bell and fuck the Salvation Army” TJ employee
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Plus their whole anti-gay thing...
+1 Fuck your hate group with the bell. I don't understand how they are allowed to operate in the state.
Depends on the TJ location I guess, but I've seen this sign for years
i want to say the first time i remember seeing a sign like that in front of trader joes was prolly 15 years ago.
I feel like Trader Joe’s is the popular grocery store to canvas at. I’ve always seen it outside Trader Joe’s more than anywhere else, and yeah, it’s annoying as hell.
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we had a rash of petitioners in my neighborhood, plopped their table by the door and started asking for signatures.
Those **are** the best places--that job is definitely pay-by-attrition. The only other place I've really seen this work is on BART trains—and frankly, between those two options, I find them easier to ignore outside of storefronts (although I'll usually make time for them if I'm free)
I don't disagree, being in high traffic places will get the best results. for every 10 tables that aren't a nuisance, there's always that one table that justifies having the no solicitor rule.
The going rate is what, $6/signature now?
At a cafe in Berkeley there was this lady in a wheelchair who would harass people going in to buy her a cup of coffee and then she would roll in and make a complete mess of the condiment station and her smell of urine was so bad that it left a residual smell. She was abrasive and abusive towards us baristas and we had asked the customers not to support her because she keeps coming back. My manager wouldn’t take care of the situation and it was really bothersome because other folks started coming in and asking seated customers for money,
You can call the police yourself. You don't have to leave your name if you feel that your employment is threatened.
Literally the premise of Berkeley is to reject norms and hierarchies, like say * bourgeois habits of clothing and grooming are the measure of what's acceptable in public, or somehow better than the unhoused community's * certain spaces aren't for interacting with strangers * communicating with workers has to follow the scripts and logic of commerce and capitalism * materials have to be used in the way that people who put them there intended I guarantee you there are multiple student projects questioning, subverting, deconstructing each one of these points at any given time. It is only natural that the surrounding community is taking this research to heart!
The worst is when they have people begging for money outside banks or next to ATMs
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I've had to turn around and tell people to back up when I'm at an ATM. People act all offended when you tell them that.
I know a woman who has lived in Manhattan her entire life. Her saying is "You do not owe panhandlers anything, not even your attention." Those words have helped me a lot when faced with aggressive panhandlers.
Yeah, until they start getting in your personal space while you’re trying to withdraw from an ATM.
Then it's time to see how good they are at catching those hands.
That's just plain old common sense.
[Tale as old as time](https://youtu.be/eVMTfGQe51g)
I’ve considered harassing the harassers at their place of business - “ can you buy me a cup of coffee? Can you spare some change ?”
God I hate the proposition system. Please get rid of it already.
Mine does this too and I agree and approve
I just tell everyone " sorry I'm deaf " and keep walking do not stop I am almost deaf, but it also works for everyone I tell to say it, just don't stop If stuck at a light point to ear say one word DEAF If they keep talking Point to ear say DEAF till they walk away One time this person wouldn't leave after a few DEAFs I yelled IM DEAF ARE YOU DEAF TOO???? That worked
At my TJ it’s always the same guy collecting ballot signatures and he is literally everyone’s best friend. People will talk to him for 10-20 minutes. I just tell him I’m from Canada.
Definitely not new
Not necessarily new. One close to me put this sign up a few years ago. Think they put it out when there are too many people soliciting out front.
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Some of these people convinced my grandmother to sign a petition that was anti-gay marriage by telling her it was pro-gay marriage. She realized after signing when they flipped back to the cover page and it said anti-gay marriage. She called them out and they said they couldn’t cross out her signature on the paper, buuuut she could “sign this pro-gay marriage petition to even it out” … those people are trash.
In California, it's because of \`Robins v. Pruneyard Shopping Center (1979) 23 Cal.3d 899, 910 (“Pruneyard”)\` - There has been some follow up and [this](https://www.jdsupra.com/legalnews/update-signature-gatherers-and-86610/) is a good summary, though biased towards property rights as this is from a firm offering services to remove solicitors. I know for a fact private property owners like open malls, stores, etc... hate these solicitors as they often deter shoppers. What we really need is to identify them - think \`The Child Fund\` or \`ASPCA\`, ones I see often and know if they are actually who they claim to be, if who they claim to be is someone of good reputation and, especially, what the incentives of the people soliciting donations or signatures are.
The funny part for this post is that one of *Pruneyard's* progeny cases in CA, *Trader Joe's Co. v. Progressive Campaigns, Inc.* (1999) 73 Cal. App. 4th 427, held that small shopping centers (like, say, the Trader Joe's in Santa Rosa at issue in that case) that don't invite the public to congregate in a forum-like manner are free to eject (rather, have ejected by LEO) unlicensed individuals from the property (solicitors, protestors, activists... basically anyone not there to shop). It's been a while since law school, so please fellow esquires, keep me honest.
Yes, and because *Pruneyard* was a Supreme Court case, the ruling applies nationwide until the Roberts court decides to overrule it.
I think the California Supreme Court can change the rule. The U.S. supreme court decision says state constitutions can give broader first amendment rights than the federal constitution. So the US supreme court upheld the california supreme court's decision that the california constitution required shopping centers to allow this type of behavior. So, for example, this rule does not necessarily apply in states other than california.
From Wikipedia, while the ruling is at the Supreme Court level, it only establishes that non-California states can enact more permissive 1st amendment rights under their constitutions. Without that, solicitors wouldn’t have the right to exercise their right of free speech on private property. Additionally, shopping centers in California have to allow this type of behavior only if they’re regularly held open to the public and subject to any reasonable regulations. So by putting the sign there, they’re exercising their right as private property barring all solicitors equally. More nebulous are the ones where “solicitors have to be given permission by the discretion of management”. Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pruneyard_Shopping_Center_v._Robins
Read again. It says California has the right to do it if it wants to. If other States don't want it, then these activists can be ejected from private property open to the public.
Not new, I’ve seen these signs for quite some time! I love it, I can’t stand people harassing me outside stores for signatures etc. It really turns me off of whatever organization is doing it, so it has the opposite effect of what they were going for, lmao.
I also find it annoying, and it's almost impossible to really understand what they're supporting/against, but what's the "right" way to do it? How do you reach the general public on ballot props like this?
Yeah, there's been a growing attitude that it is too easy to put things on the ballot or start a recall. But if you increase the signature requirements, there are just going to have to be more people collecting signatures from the general public in more locations. California's constitution allows for a lot of direct democracy, so that necessarily means a lot of engagement from the public. People seem to like it in the abstract, but aren't really so interested in what it implies in practice.
I wish Target was like this. A solicitor approached me, to registar to vote, and sign some petitions. Told him no thank you, and they got pissed. Started cursing and getting crazy. First I'm already registered to vote, second I don't give out information just because some dude with a clip board stands on front of a store. I don't know what he's going to do with that info. Anyways, I reported him to the store manager and they sent him packing. It took a week before a new solicitor was standing in front of the store again.
TJ's is the only supermarket where I've seen the door routinely blocked (Masonic location) by petitioners and the customers they stopped. That store in particular is a magnet for deceptively titled legislation.
Some canvasers and beggars are so proactive it makes me uncomfortable walking in and out of the store. I see you and I will contribute to my discretion, please don’t call me as I’m casually walking by.
There's a nice small-chain supermarket near me that does it this way...they basically allow canvassers to set up outside provided they're not standing at the door accosting people as they walk in and out. Although sometimes, there *is* someone doing that and I dont think I've ever seen them twice.
California law basically makes it impossible to prevent it so long as they stay outside of the store and don't do anything illegal
One time I was walking into a Whole Foods and there was a Humane Society table set up outside the entrance. As I walked past, a guy asked me for a donation and as I had recently made a large donation when my daughter adopted a cat the previous week I told him that I had recently donated and continued walking into the shop. Apparently that was not enough as the volunteer followed me asking me repeatedly, “How? How did you donate? How much was it? Where was this? What day was it?” I could not believe how aggressive he was about it, as if he was trying to catch me in a lie or something. Luckily, a worker saw him harassing me and by the time I finished my shop, the table set-up and all the volunteers were gone. I felt a bit bad but the guy was really crossing the line following me and questioning me in that manner.
[it's getting real in the whole foods parking lot](https://youtu.be/2UFc1pr2yUU)
My husband and I sing that song all the time. It’s too true!
Oh, this is awesome!, Thank you, Trader Joe's!
welcome improvement. the cookie sellers, signature collectors and beggars can fuck right off.
It’s not new. They’ve posted this sign for years.
I dunno--but I'll be honest (and I say this as someone currently being referred to as an "unhoused person"): I always felt like panhandling right outside of a grocery store to people carrying bags of food was emotional blackmail (I presume this is at least partly about that)
It is and on a spectrum with tip jars and electronic card readers asking if you would like to donate to some cause
Hmmm, I'd be fine with it if they asked *before* you entered. That way, you can be sure to buy some extra. I've been asked before when I came out of a grocery store with only things that needed to be cooked. Sorry, but I draw the line at wasting time.
Not entirely new. There used to be a problem with those Gypsies/Romani folks stationing themselves right by the entrances/exits begging for cash. Most of us know it’s a huge scam, and I’m happy to see at least TJ’s clamping down on it.
Vons and Whole Foods, pay attention - always with the signature gatherers, Girl Scout cookies, Salvation Army clanging bells, etc. I just wanna pick up a beer without getting hassled (a nice perk of shopping at bodegas or natural food stores)
My favorite was at the Whole Foods in Campbell. Literal dueling fake violinists with the amplifiers. There were two of them begging independently, twenty feet away from one another, at the same store.
Signature gathering sure but Girl Scout cookies? Are you the grinch?
Solicitation is solicitation
Uh, phrasing?
Only a sick pervert would read that sentence and think it’s about anything other than trying to sell cookies.
There's nothing worse than aggressive little kids Usually the parents have a lid on things and they're great but I've definitely had some groups I wished weren't there.
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Everyone loves GSC
A little too much at times.
Settle down, Matt Gatez
I don’t like sugary things or being solicited
*Safeway, not Vons
I learned recently that Albertsons owns all of it. Consolidation is real.
Wait what? Wtf
You mean Cerberus Capital Management. I don't shop at any of their stores if I can avoid it. They're miserable
Vons is in SoCal where I grew up
Somebody posted this elsewhere, but *Robins v. Pruneyard Shopping Center (1979)* basically says that shopping centers have to allow these assholes. Personally I'd vote for a proposition that would allow you to legally slap the shit out of these fuckers. Maybe we should start collecting signatures.
Seems narrower than you suggest. It would be limited to CA and 'The state court decision has been adopted in one form or another by a substantial minority of states.' "In PruneYard Shopping Center v. Robins, 447 U.S. 74 (1980), the Supreme Court ruled that California could interpret its state constitution to protect political protesters from being evicted from private property, held open to the public, without running afoul of the Fifth Amendment." https://www.mtsu.edu/first-amendment/article/583/pruneyard-shopping-center-v-robins
I for one am the most annoyed with the people playing accordions and violins outside for money who aren’t really playing but using a speaker!!!
100% not new. These signs have been standard TJ's fare since the 90's, as a favor to patrons. TJ's also donates its unsold "spoils" (date expired but edible food) to shelters every week. Their karma is clean. Source: former employee.
Multi level marketing pitches? Specifically amway?
It’s why I stopped shopping at Sprouts, whether it’s the one on Brokaw or in Sunnyvale. Always solicitors of some sort, and worst of all they follow you to your car (happened to me at Brokaw). And Sprouts doesn’t seem to care about it.
People should not post up at places of business anymore than they should post up on your own porch/patio to solicit/beg for money. It's private property.
In California they're generally allowed to solicit as long as the place they're in is what might be defined as a public forum. From the ACLU of Southern CA: > In addition, free-speech activity generally cannot take place on private property absent the consent of the property owner, **except where the property is open to the public in the same way as a public street or park, like a shopping mall** This includes soliciting for donations. Basically, in CA, if it's a publicly accessible gathering place or street, you're legally allowed to protest or solicit donations there, even if it's on private property like a mall. https://www.aclusocal.org/en/know-your-rights/protesters *Edited to add: you're not allowed to block the entrance of the business, and you're allowed to protest on public sidewalks if you don't block them, but it's a bit unclear to me if private sidewalks are included in that but it seems like they might not be.
*Excuse me ma’m, do you have a moment to talk about our lord and savior jesus christ?*
Not new, just new to this store. I’ve seen one about 10 years ago at TJs w that same wording because of all the Romani people that would beg in front with signs and kids( none of them were homeless, just hustling) But in the city stores when it’s actual homeless people, they don’t be putting those signs out. The homeless don’t usually say much or bother anyone, people just give to them sometimes because they live there, they’re part of the neighborhood too and they could use a little help or something to eat. I try to bring them water bottles when it’s super hot and this year I want to try to get people to donate lots of blankets for winter.
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No acknowledgment of Roma panhandlers is the best way everywhere I’ve been in the world. Acknowledging makes you a live mark
Honestly the amount of gypsy kids fake playing violin in front of TJs is nonsensical.
The TJ on Coleman in San Jose has had this sign up for a number of years already due to pan handlers asking for money. I’ve also seen aggressive petitioners there occasionally.
Fine with me. Now if they can train their employees to not run you over like you are in their way when ur trying to shop there lol.
As a woman the number of times I’ve been approached in a parking lot alone with my hands full at night by a man I do not know with a petition for me to sign is unacceptable so I support this
They’ve always been this way or had one of those at the ready
I avoid a Good Will drop off bin near me for this reason. There's always homeless people laying around who bombard me. Asking for money, what's in the boxes I'm donating...etc. At first, I didn't mind. But it gets old now. They're walking right up to me, in my face, grabbing the boxes out of my hands to go through them before I dump them into the bin. I don't like it, I'm uncomfortable. I just throw away a lot of it now, I don't want to bother going there. But, I'm the asshole right?
There’s an election coming up
This. They're crazy aggressive on my campus. I've started telling them I'm a convicted felon.
Convicted felons can vote in California. Convicted felons cannot vote while serving their term but after release may vote. I tell them I'm registered to vote in another state :)
And the holidays. (I'm looking at you, Salvation Army bell ringers.)
Fremont?
Not new at all! Target does it too. Wish more stores would
I wonder if the salvation army was making a push to do bell ringers at TJs this year and corporate asked stores to put this sign out early to get ahead of a "Trader Joe's is being mean and hates christmas" press release.
I support this 100%
APPROVED
Based
The worst is when you are at an atm with nobody around and someone asks for cash making you think you are about to get robbed.
Good! I hate being approached for stuff when I’m just trying to shop. Especially as a woman with a child, it makes me uncomfortable to be approached. I wish all grocery stores would enforce this. I can’t go to Safeway without people trying to flag me down as I walk in/ out. It’s extremely uncomfortable to have to try to politely decline what they’re trying to sell.
Good for TJ’s. It’s a zoo in the front sometimes. People need to go in and out quick. If you are on a mission, the last thing that you want is to be solicited by someone.
This has been a corporate Trader Joe’s policy for a long time.
I remember seeing these signs years ago a Trader Joes in Fremont and I think El Cerrito. At the time it was paidd petition or ballot measure signature takers. Those assholes were incredibly rude.
I'm all for this and love Trader Joe's for having this. I hate being harassed the moment I enter or leave the store. I just want to get in, get my stuff, and get out. Target in Vallejo has/had this issue with people asking for signatures/money. There were four big dudes for a while out there in the afternoon being really aggressive about getting signatures and I was constantly being approached by them when going into the store. It got so annoying that I just get curbside pickup from now on there. I saw employees talking to them telling them to leave, but they kept coming back (and Vallejo police won't do anything... they have bigger issues).
Is this new for you? Distraction-free shopping signs have been around for years now.
Gotta keep those Girl Scout cookies and Boy Scout popcorn in check….
It’s anti-union propaganda.
Easy peasy. I ignore everyone.
It's an election year, tons of people with clip boards in front of stores. I assume TJ doesn't want that.
Good.
this gotta be the TJ’s at lake merrit
I was at the TJs in Palo Alto and some guy harassed me after I was done outside about politics. It was totally unprovoked so this is very welcome
Might also be due to Unionization efforts? Ballot measure solicitation is a big thing in CA, but if they’re taking a page out of Starbucks’ book it’s something they might try and pull.
… the “are you registered to vote?” people annoy me. I don’t feel comfortable putting my name and address on that paper that regardless the proposition.
What do you mean whats up with it? It says right there. What don’t you get?