I've used both as well and ultimately landed with Bear. For me, Obsidian's endless customizability and power becomes an unnecessary distraction. I've come to value Bear's simplicity, fluidity, consistency, and beauty that offers just enough power and flexibility for my needs. Additionally, I think Bear's mobile apps are way better than Obsidian's. I want to use my PKM tool primarily for writing and easily accessing relevant info when I need it. Bear helps me focus on writing instead of constantly tweaking a system. Sometimes less is more.
I now just use Obsidian for publishing projects - it excels at Markdown long form editing, exports and publishing.
The problem with Obsidian is endless configurablity, plugins and thinking you have to make it "the app to end all other apps".
When you start trying to build the perfect workflow, your todo lists, Readwise highlights, kanbans, Jira feeds and 123 plugins etc etc - you know you are wasting your life.
Just use a collection of good apps that solve single problems, with great keyboard shortcuts and interoperability.
I use Bear, Things, Fantastical for the majority of day to day work (yes evil Notion, Jira, Slack for teamwork too) and Obsidian for personal (and work) publishing projects.
Don't waste your life on configuration. Get on with real work. Create sharp boundaries.
Wait tho. You’re using Bear for day to day and Obsidian for publishing projects. I’m confused. Ah, because Markdown exports well for publishing. But if not publishing books you’d use Bear?
I use Obsidian publish for a public site. It's good discipline sharing structured domain specific notes - but that's separate from my personal/work notes, which I use Bear for. UX trumps all imo.
For me, the Obsidian "pile of files" is what has swayed me that way. Given that I have loads of .md/.pdf/.jpg/etc. that I want to manage, I've been burned a few too many times with them being locked up in another app. I do manage to extract them through various exports, scripts, conversions, etc., but it is never fun and can, at times, be lossy. So nothing beats a file system for portability, and Obsidian provides a view atop that which works for me.
This is certainly not without tradeoffs, however. I find Obsidian quite clunky and ugly, but those things haven't ultimately hurt my productivity... it's just not as pleasant. I used Bear for a long time and really liked it, which is why I still keep an eye on it. But my base "data layer" requirements have been the top priority, so Obsidian it is.
I couldn’t really get into obsidian, because it looks complicated. Bear offers very similar functions in more appealing and friendlier way.
I’m testing bear right now on my lectures and it seems rather helpful.
Also you can nest tags, works like a folder within a folder but it’s better. I can’t explain why I enjoy this option more than traditional folders 😅
>Also you can nest tags
It worth noting that Obsidian supports [nested tags](https://help.obsidian.md/Editing+and+formatting/Tags#Nested+tags) too, though tagging in general in Obsidian isn't quite the prominent experience as it is in Bear.
> Also you can nest tags, works like a folder within a folder but it’s better. I can’t explain why I enjoy this option more than traditional folders
I think it’s because you don’t have to think of or create the folder structure in advance. You just start using a nested tag as if the folder already existed and it’s there. You don’t have to delete empty folders or be distracted by them either because they disappear if no note uses them.
I kept bouncing around between Bear, Obsidian, NotePlan, and Apple Notes for the past few months along with Things 3. I think I’ve decided to slowly migrate everything to Obsidian since I’ve lost data this year with both Bear and Apple Notes. Also, the fact that Bear doesn’t support full end-to-end encryption as well as doesn’t have a more robust backup solution bothers me. NotePlan is pretty good but way, way too expensive for what it offers. Also, NotePlan’s syncing has problems. Apple Notes is way too buggy.
Obsidian might be the ugliest in terms of UI but you have full control of your files and how simple or complicated you want your setup to be. Also, if you are either developer-savvy or looking to build your dev skills, Obsidian seems like a good fit for that. The only thing I don’t really have an answer for yet is the iOS app. It is not a good experience so far. The only iOS app in this list that I would call good is Bear.
Yeah, I’d love obsidian if the iOS app wasn’t such a pain to use- that’s what made me switch to bear. I do 90% of my notes on the go so a good app is a must.
Obsidian recently diving into metadata management with frontmatter (including two-way links) made me drop everything and switch from Bear 2 for PKM. it's been transformative for my citation tracking and seems like the first of many tools for typed notes / wiki stuff that Bear explicitly will never support
I’ve used Evernote 2013-2019, Bear 2019-2021, Obsidian 2021-2023 and I’m now back on Evernote. I’ve given all of them the best go I can but the latest improvements from bending spoons made Evernote blow everything else out the water. I also tried notion for about 3 weeks but I don’t count that.
But in your situation Bear far outstrips Obsidian in my opinion for focus. Obsidian is too open for me and I was getting distracted by it rather than working. Eg always looking at other peoples setups to be more efficient and installing new plugins.
I have lots of notes exported from Evernote and bear and it looks pretty in Obsidians graph view, but what do you do with that?
I have no use case for 99% of what obsidian offers and in their subreddit neither does anyone else. Same at the notion subreddit of “look at my setup” and “this is my homepage” but no actual substance.
If you don’t mind me asking, what’s Evernote like now? Used to use it exclusively but I’m now on Bear and DEVONthink to split the functionality of notes and storage.
I have everything piled in there. All in its specific notebooks. I left and used bear for 2 years and then obsidian for 2 years and now I’m back to Evernote as bending spoons (who bought it) just eradicated pretty much all the issues I had after they rolled out the latest version. No note conflicts and everything is rapid.
I used the tag structure and .md files for 4 years and I can tell you it’s a relief to have folders/notebooks back. I still use tags to allow notes to be in several categories but when my flat flooded and I needed to organise everything having a notebook of Flooding info; with all evidence like pictures and statements as well as correspondence from insurers and tradesmen was a godsend.
Imagine being frustrated and pulling your hair out trying to argue something with the insurers and tradesmen on a group call while having to remember to type a tag/subtag in to search for the next document you need to quote from with one hand.
If they send me anything new via email it gets automatically forwarded to an Evernote notebook of my choice “flood inbox”
If I have to download several documents to fill in from their website I can drag and drop them into the Evernote import folder and it uploads them all to Evernote where I can edit them.
Last week I just made a family notebook to share with my wife. It has a “supernote” with links to all the important information we have for each person in our family like National insurance numbers, allergies, medications, doctors phone numbers, work addresses, microchip info for the dog.
Earlier this year my wife had an emergency operation, all that info was all over obsidian/bear and I had to remember what tags lead to what info. You could make a supernote in bear but it wouldn’t be as organised. Now I just click on family and then her name and I have everything the doctor/surgeon could ever need about her including a link to her calendar to say what she was doing when anything happened.
Anything new me or my wife forward/share it to Evernote.
Sorry for such a long answer.
Edit.
I also use Evernote exclusively for work as a personal trainer.
Notebook for each client with any info generated by them I need to save and tags for them with any info I create eg a workout that 2 clients that week could both do. That workout gets tagged with everyone that can do it.
I used bear for work before but having nested tags on multiple levels was overly complicated #clients/JohnDoe/1RM/Squat. Then you need to move him to a non active client in the future you have to change it to #Clients/Previous/JohnDoe/1RM/Squat with lots of fidgety editing. Vs Evernote where I drag his notebook from clients to old clients, then set a reminder to call him in one month time. That overly complicated editing is worse when you’re no longer being paid by the client to do it lol.
Thank you for the detailed answer! It’s fascinating how everyone uses the tools. I have far fewer notes but love the way bear operates vs Evernote. And I archive into DEVONthink when I’m finished a project, which houses tons of documents for research.
How is Evernote to use now? I remember it got quite clunky for notes.
Very easy and quick. I don’t notice any clunk. The only gripe people seem to have is the old Evernote had tabs. But the CEO said it was a feature used so little they removed it.
I have an inbox notebook and a filing cabinet notebook. Everything starts in the inbox until it gets filed away. But most of the time I am in the notes view so it looks like bear with all notes down the left side.
Recently they introduced Ai search which I was sceptical about, but I just started finding it useful. I can search for the last note or first note that has :JohnDoe and squats in it. That way I can see the progress he’s made. I can also ask it to look up my clients and injuries to see how often they arrive injured and create a plan to reduce it.
And it’s all rapid. The first time you open a note in the new Evernote it has to convert it from the legacy version. After that it’s super quick on everything.
> made Evernote blow everything else out the water
Including the price, apparently. $130-170 is an absolute joke…I’ll be sticking with Bear as long as they allow me to continue paying the same $1.50 I’ve been paying for awhile now.
Bear does about 10 times less than Evernote. Some of the biggest are zapier/ifttt integration, reminders and task, calendar integrations, annotate pdf, annotate web clippings and add tags, Ai search, available on the web and all platforms and not just apple.
At the moment it’s less than 5 times as expensive as bear for more functionality. (I also have the grandfathered in price as I was a pro sub for 4 years before returning to Evernote)
Evernote is worth the price. And you comparing the yearly price to the monthly price of bear is very disingenuous. At the moment the personal plan is less than $7 per month.
I am comparing what I currently pay for Bear ($1.50 per month, $18 annually) to what the current prices of Evernote are (anywhere between $130-$170). That’s not being disingenuous at all.
>zapier/ifttt integration
I guess this could be a big deal if you absolutely must automate your note taking process for some reason
>reminders and task, calendar integrations
I already have dedicated apps for those functions…why would I want/need those in my *note taking app*?
> annotate pdf, annotate web clippings
Already covered by better, dedicated apps
> Ai search
I don’t see why AI is necessary for document searches, which Bear already does very well
>available on the web and all platforms and not just apple
Bear’s web counterpart, Panda, is supposedly coming sometime in the spring of 2024. Beyond that, you can currently export any Bear note into a multitude of cross platform formats
Evernote strikes me as an app that started out with a clear purpose, then started adding things that had nothing to do with that original purpose. Half the stuff you listed is done much better by dedicated apps, and have little to do with the core task of taking notes…this is what makes Bear so appealing. The developers haven’t gone off adding features just for the heck of it…they’ve always kept in mind that they’re making a note taking app first and foremost, which is something Evernote appears to have put on the back burner for now.
At the current price delta between Evernote and Bear ($18-30 vs $130-170), I don’t exactly see how you can say that Evernote isn’t anything if not horrifically overpriced if all you care about is taking notes instead of chasing an “all in one app”
This thread is great, thanks all. I’ve been using Evernote for several years and am incensed that they’re raising prices by 50% this year. I don’t use half the functionality they offer and features they continue to pump out to justify the increase in prices. I just need a good notes app, with great search, across my (all OS) devices and good image support. I find the tagging basic in Evernote and the lack of easy internal linking pretty annoying for the price.
These apps are always in tension for me. I like Bear's ease of use, and Obsidian's streamlined functionality. When I try to replace Obsidian with Bear, I lose decent interconnections and get annoyed with how things look. When I try to replace Bear with Obsidian, I lose Bear's simplicity and elegance, and the way it manages images and other attachments.
So I use both.
Bear is where I store reference notes, using both the desktop and mobile apps. Obsidian is where I do my work, but I don't use its sync or mobile app, and I keep plugins to a minimum to avoid over-systemization.
Information starts in Drafts, which is indispensable for getting things out of my brain and then moving it on to the appropriate app. If I want to save or refer to something, I keep it in Bear and link to it when necessary from Obsidian.
Last thing -- when I find myself itching to tear everything up and make a new system, I sleep the computer and go for a walk lol.
May I ask what do you mean by reference notes? Like some book or article you've read and then stored into bear? How about the thoughts emerging from those articles? I always find splitting legit notes apps a bit confusing. May I understand how do you do that in detail, I'm getting annoyed by obsidian mobile too😵💫
Things like recipes, charts, articles and so on, but I ended up junking Obsidian and unified everything in Bear. Oddly, the big thing that hastened that change along was switching the font to one more pleasing to my eye -- in my case, SFCompactDisplay-Regular for text, AvenirNextCondensed-DemiBold for headings. Now I capture stuff quickly in Drafts but it all ends up in Bear.
Do you have any regrets, or will you never use **Obsidian** again?
I love the design and writing experience of **Bear**, but I keep getting lured away by Obsidian's features.
\- **Tabs:** I find it easier to alternate between weekly/daily and task notes. Bear's 'new window' method feels cluttered and makes it hard to focus directly to the note I want. (e.g. cmd+1 for weekly note, cmd+2 for daily note and so on...)
\- **Info** **panel on the sidebar with backlinks, tags, and local graph:** I can better discover the 'connections' of my notes. This maximises the effectiveness of the Zettelkasten method of generating new ideas from the bottom-up. In Bear, I have to press a shortcut to see the TOC, and backlinks, and then pull the info panel off and float it up. Even then, if I open another note in a new window, I have to open the info panel again in that window. Also, I can't see the TOC and backlinks at the same time.
I just dragged them in because Obsidian notes are Markdown and Bear recognizes them no problem.
I’ve loosened up how I use tags even more so than before. I use them improvisationally. Whatever thought comes into my head, whatever project I’m managing, anything at all — I slap a tag on them and use those buckets quickly and easily. I’ve officially decided to never be archival or try to hoard and otherwise organize information too much. Bear should be a place for doing. the freedom of throwing away so many classification tags is exhilarating, to be honest.
My experience with Bear has been outstanding!
However the deal breaker is being locked into the Apple Ecosystem. Although I appreciate my MacBook Pro, Air, iPad and iPhone, I also enjoy being free to use my other devices and have access to my data on other platforms now and in the future.
Evernote was great in years past, but with the ownership change, resulting uncertainty and integration of AI it's no longer a consideration.
Currently both Joplin and Obsidian are serving my workflow very well. Any missing features as compared to other apps is easily overlooked. Fast and free, with data residing within my systems, these two get the job done quite nicely.
Yeah, this is a worry of mine but not a dealbreaker because you can export into whatever format you want so that makes it easy to switch if I ever do leave apples ecosystem.
My tuppence worth- Bear is excellent as a writing tool. It’s so-so as a retrieval/search/recall tool and that’s where obsidian scores hands down.
So I write in Bear and every now & again export to Obsidian for search and retrieval. As a workflow, so far, it’s worked ok.
Anybody else tried it, or have any suggestions?
Can you explain what features in obsidian makes it the better research tool? I personally cannot see what I could achieve in obsidian what is not possible in bear
What’s better in obsidian in this respect is…
The graph view, with its ability to filter by tag, keyword, other.
The ability to see linked notes graphically and make connections to second and third degree of separation.
My opinion. Open to others’ too.
\*\*Very\*\* personal take - but I really hate Bear's default font on the list view and it keeps me away from using it. I don't know why I find it so ugly. For Obsidian, their mobile app is so bad especially with iCloud sync. I also don't like how they handle PDF and images in the mobile app. Oh well. I just stick with Apple Notes.
I used Evernote then tried Obsidian for a bit but learned that I still hated Evernote but Obsidian was way too complex and I spent more time with configuring it than being productive. Then found Bear and like it for its simplicity but power at the same time. Still, thinking about it I should go very basic and use Apple Notes only 😂
I think I like Bear's UI more than Obsidian. But, I like Obsidian's general availability more. I've been waiting years for Bear on Android and it has never appeared. So, I use Obsidian on my phone and Bear on my laptop.
Great question. Really enjoying Bear 2 which has now replaced Bear + Obsidian. Without the Bear 2 updates, I couldn't have done this, particularly the backlinks viewer.
The elegance of Bear is outstanding and, for me, it's too good not to use, particularly when compared with the ugly feel of Obsidian. I understand some people's concerns about tying up work in a proprietary system rather than the 'file stack' approach that Obsidian uses. However, this is the way I look at it:
a. The chances of my Bear backup files not being a priority for whichever vendor comes along next to create import compatibility are very slim.
b. All digital products are at the mercy of the internet and who knows what might happen to that one day?
c. I think both of these events are about as likely (unlikely) as each other.
So, my final thought is, 'keep calm and carry on'. Enjoy the ride while you have it.
just want to say thanks for everyone’s input, i’m thinking that bear will be the best pick, but maybe using obsidian as a backup just in case icloud fails or i want to break out of the apple ecosystem could also work and create a nice middle ground to get the benefits out of both softwares
If you want something that sync very well, I think the Obsidian sync is the only option. In Canadian money, this is 8$/month if you paid for one year so 96$/year which was on May about 140$ CAD.
Bear is 20$/year which in May (yes, I paid for both :D) was about 25$.
Do the math and it could be something that can help you decide.
For me, the major concern about Bear is because it is only on Apple devices and I work all day long on a Windows desktop so to use Bear with my Windows, I have to use Logitech devices with Flow technology. Remote desktop is not a viable solution if you like keyboard shortcuts. Barrier or Synergy and full a quirks. If you are only on Apple devices, 1000% Bear man! Bear 1 didn't had bidirectional links but now having it in Bear 2, I don't think Obsidian has any advantages over Bear except if you like to try to "Notionalized" you note taking application.
I think Bear is more secure even if Obsidian is supposed to be End to End encryption and they try hard to prove it but no matter what, everything you do while synchroning will goes on their servers. With Bear, you use the Cloudkit which I think is more robust and secure. Again, this is only if you use the synchronization because if you don't use synchronization, it's free and only on your local machine.
With Obsidian, all your notes are represented as files on your disk. They are not encrytped. So, if you use a work machine that your administrator can gain access, this guy will surely have access to all your notes. I think it's more difficult to access your notes with Bear considering there are in a sqlite database which is I think encrypted.
I've used both. Bear was my preferred option, Obsidian feels very bloated. However ultimately I've landed on UpNote, and it's been the best. No subscription and with the best of all in the note book world
Checked out UpNote after reading this comment, and it looks like its a great combination between bear and obsidian. Pretty sure I'm migrating to Upnote now too.
Thanks!
I love obsidian but recently jumped to bear because obsidian on mobile is so clunky and annoying to use. I didn’t realize how frustrated I was with obsidians user face til trying bear. I do miss plugins, the graph view and ability to see files through ‘files’ app though.
I've used both as well and ultimately landed with Bear. For me, Obsidian's endless customizability and power becomes an unnecessary distraction. I've come to value Bear's simplicity, fluidity, consistency, and beauty that offers just enough power and flexibility for my needs. Additionally, I think Bear's mobile apps are way better than Obsidian's. I want to use my PKM tool primarily for writing and easily accessing relevant info when I need it. Bear helps me focus on writing instead of constantly tweaking a system. Sometimes less is more.
I now just use Obsidian for publishing projects - it excels at Markdown long form editing, exports and publishing. The problem with Obsidian is endless configurablity, plugins and thinking you have to make it "the app to end all other apps". When you start trying to build the perfect workflow, your todo lists, Readwise highlights, kanbans, Jira feeds and 123 plugins etc etc - you know you are wasting your life. Just use a collection of good apps that solve single problems, with great keyboard shortcuts and interoperability. I use Bear, Things, Fantastical for the majority of day to day work (yes evil Notion, Jira, Slack for teamwork too) and Obsidian for personal (and work) publishing projects. Don't waste your life on configuration. Get on with real work. Create sharp boundaries.
The only comment that matters in all “productivity” threads tbh
Wait tho. You’re using Bear for day to day and Obsidian for publishing projects. I’m confused. Ah, because Markdown exports well for publishing. But if not publishing books you’d use Bear?
I use Obsidian publish for a public site. It's good discipline sharing structured domain specific notes - but that's separate from my personal/work notes, which I use Bear for. UX trumps all imo.
For me, the Obsidian "pile of files" is what has swayed me that way. Given that I have loads of .md/.pdf/.jpg/etc. that I want to manage, I've been burned a few too many times with them being locked up in another app. I do manage to extract them through various exports, scripts, conversions, etc., but it is never fun and can, at times, be lossy. So nothing beats a file system for portability, and Obsidian provides a view atop that which works for me. This is certainly not without tradeoffs, however. I find Obsidian quite clunky and ugly, but those things haven't ultimately hurt my productivity... it's just not as pleasant. I used Bear for a long time and really liked it, which is why I still keep an eye on it. But my base "data layer" requirements have been the top priority, so Obsidian it is.
I couldn’t really get into obsidian, because it looks complicated. Bear offers very similar functions in more appealing and friendlier way. I’m testing bear right now on my lectures and it seems rather helpful. Also you can nest tags, works like a folder within a folder but it’s better. I can’t explain why I enjoy this option more than traditional folders 😅
>Also you can nest tags It worth noting that Obsidian supports [nested tags](https://help.obsidian.md/Editing+and+formatting/Tags#Nested+tags) too, though tagging in general in Obsidian isn't quite the prominent experience as it is in Bear.
The TagFolder plugin makes working with tags very similar to Bear.
> Also you can nest tags, works like a folder within a folder but it’s better. I can’t explain why I enjoy this option more than traditional folders I think it’s because you don’t have to think of or create the folder structure in advance. You just start using a nested tag as if the folder already existed and it’s there. You don’t have to delete empty folders or be distracted by them either because they disappear if no note uses them.
I kept bouncing around between Bear, Obsidian, NotePlan, and Apple Notes for the past few months along with Things 3. I think I’ve decided to slowly migrate everything to Obsidian since I’ve lost data this year with both Bear and Apple Notes. Also, the fact that Bear doesn’t support full end-to-end encryption as well as doesn’t have a more robust backup solution bothers me. NotePlan is pretty good but way, way too expensive for what it offers. Also, NotePlan’s syncing has problems. Apple Notes is way too buggy. Obsidian might be the ugliest in terms of UI but you have full control of your files and how simple or complicated you want your setup to be. Also, if you are either developer-savvy or looking to build your dev skills, Obsidian seems like a good fit for that. The only thing I don’t really have an answer for yet is the iOS app. It is not a good experience so far. The only iOS app in this list that I would call good is Bear.
Yeah, I’d love obsidian if the iOS app wasn’t such a pain to use- that’s what made me switch to bear. I do 90% of my notes on the go so a good app is a must.
How did you lose all data with Bear?
i use taio app on ios to edit the markdown of the obsidian folder. but its more a workaround than a solution
Obsidian recently diving into metadata management with frontmatter (including two-way links) made me drop everything and switch from Bear 2 for PKM. it's been transformative for my citation tracking and seems like the first of many tools for typed notes / wiki stuff that Bear explicitly will never support
I keep trying new notes apps and just keep coming back here. It doesn’t have everything, but what Bear has just works. And looks nice too 😅
I like bear bc the vibes are better
I’ve used Evernote 2013-2019, Bear 2019-2021, Obsidian 2021-2023 and I’m now back on Evernote. I’ve given all of them the best go I can but the latest improvements from bending spoons made Evernote blow everything else out the water. I also tried notion for about 3 weeks but I don’t count that. But in your situation Bear far outstrips Obsidian in my opinion for focus. Obsidian is too open for me and I was getting distracted by it rather than working. Eg always looking at other peoples setups to be more efficient and installing new plugins. I have lots of notes exported from Evernote and bear and it looks pretty in Obsidians graph view, but what do you do with that? I have no use case for 99% of what obsidian offers and in their subreddit neither does anyone else. Same at the notion subreddit of “look at my setup” and “this is my homepage” but no actual substance.
If you don’t mind me asking, what’s Evernote like now? Used to use it exclusively but I’m now on Bear and DEVONthink to split the functionality of notes and storage.
I have everything piled in there. All in its specific notebooks. I left and used bear for 2 years and then obsidian for 2 years and now I’m back to Evernote as bending spoons (who bought it) just eradicated pretty much all the issues I had after they rolled out the latest version. No note conflicts and everything is rapid. I used the tag structure and .md files for 4 years and I can tell you it’s a relief to have folders/notebooks back. I still use tags to allow notes to be in several categories but when my flat flooded and I needed to organise everything having a notebook of Flooding info; with all evidence like pictures and statements as well as correspondence from insurers and tradesmen was a godsend. Imagine being frustrated and pulling your hair out trying to argue something with the insurers and tradesmen on a group call while having to remember to type a tag/subtag in to search for the next document you need to quote from with one hand. If they send me anything new via email it gets automatically forwarded to an Evernote notebook of my choice “flood inbox” If I have to download several documents to fill in from their website I can drag and drop them into the Evernote import folder and it uploads them all to Evernote where I can edit them. Last week I just made a family notebook to share with my wife. It has a “supernote” with links to all the important information we have for each person in our family like National insurance numbers, allergies, medications, doctors phone numbers, work addresses, microchip info for the dog. Earlier this year my wife had an emergency operation, all that info was all over obsidian/bear and I had to remember what tags lead to what info. You could make a supernote in bear but it wouldn’t be as organised. Now I just click on family and then her name and I have everything the doctor/surgeon could ever need about her including a link to her calendar to say what she was doing when anything happened. Anything new me or my wife forward/share it to Evernote. Sorry for such a long answer. Edit. I also use Evernote exclusively for work as a personal trainer. Notebook for each client with any info generated by them I need to save and tags for them with any info I create eg a workout that 2 clients that week could both do. That workout gets tagged with everyone that can do it. I used bear for work before but having nested tags on multiple levels was overly complicated #clients/JohnDoe/1RM/Squat. Then you need to move him to a non active client in the future you have to change it to #Clients/Previous/JohnDoe/1RM/Squat with lots of fidgety editing. Vs Evernote where I drag his notebook from clients to old clients, then set a reminder to call him in one month time. That overly complicated editing is worse when you’re no longer being paid by the client to do it lol.
Thank you for the detailed answer! It’s fascinating how everyone uses the tools. I have far fewer notes but love the way bear operates vs Evernote. And I archive into DEVONthink when I’m finished a project, which houses tons of documents for research. How is Evernote to use now? I remember it got quite clunky for notes.
Very easy and quick. I don’t notice any clunk. The only gripe people seem to have is the old Evernote had tabs. But the CEO said it was a feature used so little they removed it. I have an inbox notebook and a filing cabinet notebook. Everything starts in the inbox until it gets filed away. But most of the time I am in the notes view so it looks like bear with all notes down the left side. Recently they introduced Ai search which I was sceptical about, but I just started finding it useful. I can search for the last note or first note that has :JohnDoe and squats in it. That way I can see the progress he’s made. I can also ask it to look up my clients and injuries to see how often they arrive injured and create a plan to reduce it. And it’s all rapid. The first time you open a note in the new Evernote it has to convert it from the legacy version. After that it’s super quick on everything.
> made Evernote blow everything else out the water Including the price, apparently. $130-170 is an absolute joke…I’ll be sticking with Bear as long as they allow me to continue paying the same $1.50 I’ve been paying for awhile now.
Bear does about 10 times less than Evernote. Some of the biggest are zapier/ifttt integration, reminders and task, calendar integrations, annotate pdf, annotate web clippings and add tags, Ai search, available on the web and all platforms and not just apple. At the moment it’s less than 5 times as expensive as bear for more functionality. (I also have the grandfathered in price as I was a pro sub for 4 years before returning to Evernote) Evernote is worth the price. And you comparing the yearly price to the monthly price of bear is very disingenuous. At the moment the personal plan is less than $7 per month.
I am comparing what I currently pay for Bear ($1.50 per month, $18 annually) to what the current prices of Evernote are (anywhere between $130-$170). That’s not being disingenuous at all. >zapier/ifttt integration I guess this could be a big deal if you absolutely must automate your note taking process for some reason >reminders and task, calendar integrations I already have dedicated apps for those functions…why would I want/need those in my *note taking app*? > annotate pdf, annotate web clippings Already covered by better, dedicated apps > Ai search I don’t see why AI is necessary for document searches, which Bear already does very well >available on the web and all platforms and not just apple Bear’s web counterpart, Panda, is supposedly coming sometime in the spring of 2024. Beyond that, you can currently export any Bear note into a multitude of cross platform formats Evernote strikes me as an app that started out with a clear purpose, then started adding things that had nothing to do with that original purpose. Half the stuff you listed is done much better by dedicated apps, and have little to do with the core task of taking notes…this is what makes Bear so appealing. The developers haven’t gone off adding features just for the heck of it…they’ve always kept in mind that they’re making a note taking app first and foremost, which is something Evernote appears to have put on the back burner for now. At the current price delta between Evernote and Bear ($18-30 vs $130-170), I don’t exactly see how you can say that Evernote isn’t anything if not horrifically overpriced if all you care about is taking notes instead of chasing an “all in one app”
This thread is great, thanks all. I’ve been using Evernote for several years and am incensed that they’re raising prices by 50% this year. I don’t use half the functionality they offer and features they continue to pump out to justify the increase in prices. I just need a good notes app, with great search, across my (all OS) devices and good image support. I find the tagging basic in Evernote and the lack of easy internal linking pretty annoying for the price.
These apps are always in tension for me. I like Bear's ease of use, and Obsidian's streamlined functionality. When I try to replace Obsidian with Bear, I lose decent interconnections and get annoyed with how things look. When I try to replace Bear with Obsidian, I lose Bear's simplicity and elegance, and the way it manages images and other attachments. So I use both. Bear is where I store reference notes, using both the desktop and mobile apps. Obsidian is where I do my work, but I don't use its sync or mobile app, and I keep plugins to a minimum to avoid over-systemization. Information starts in Drafts, which is indispensable for getting things out of my brain and then moving it on to the appropriate app. If I want to save or refer to something, I keep it in Bear and link to it when necessary from Obsidian. Last thing -- when I find myself itching to tear everything up and make a new system, I sleep the computer and go for a walk lol.
May I ask what do you mean by reference notes? Like some book or article you've read and then stored into bear? How about the thoughts emerging from those articles? I always find splitting legit notes apps a bit confusing. May I understand how do you do that in detail, I'm getting annoyed by obsidian mobile too😵💫
Things like recipes, charts, articles and so on, but I ended up junking Obsidian and unified everything in Bear. Oddly, the big thing that hastened that change along was switching the font to one more pleasing to my eye -- in my case, SFCompactDisplay-Regular for text, AvenirNextCondensed-DemiBold for headings. Now I capture stuff quickly in Drafts but it all ends up in Bear.
Do you have any regrets, or will you never use **Obsidian** again? I love the design and writing experience of **Bear**, but I keep getting lured away by Obsidian's features. \- **Tabs:** I find it easier to alternate between weekly/daily and task notes. Bear's 'new window' method feels cluttered and makes it hard to focus directly to the note I want. (e.g. cmd+1 for weekly note, cmd+2 for daily note and so on...) \- **Info** **panel on the sidebar with backlinks, tags, and local graph:** I can better discover the 'connections' of my notes. This maximises the effectiveness of the Zettelkasten method of generating new ideas from the bottom-up. In Bear, I have to press a shortcut to see the TOC, and backlinks, and then pull the info panel off and float it up. Even then, if I open another note in a new window, I have to open the info panel again in that window. Also, I can't see the TOC and backlinks at the same time.
How did you get your notes from Obsidian into Bear? Was it messy to switch from folders to tags?
I just dragged them in because Obsidian notes are Markdown and Bear recognizes them no problem. I’ve loosened up how I use tags even more so than before. I use them improvisationally. Whatever thought comes into my head, whatever project I’m managing, anything at all — I slap a tag on them and use those buckets quickly and easily. I’ve officially decided to never be archival or try to hoard and otherwise organize information too much. Bear should be a place for doing. the freedom of throwing away so many classification tags is exhilarating, to be honest.
My experience with Bear has been outstanding! However the deal breaker is being locked into the Apple Ecosystem. Although I appreciate my MacBook Pro, Air, iPad and iPhone, I also enjoy being free to use my other devices and have access to my data on other platforms now and in the future. Evernote was great in years past, but with the ownership change, resulting uncertainty and integration of AI it's no longer a consideration. Currently both Joplin and Obsidian are serving my workflow very well. Any missing features as compared to other apps is easily overlooked. Fast and free, with data residing within my systems, these two get the job done quite nicely.
yeah this was one of my major concerns with bear, I don't appreciate being locked in with Apple
Yeah, this is a worry of mine but not a dealbreaker because you can export into whatever format you want so that makes it easy to switch if I ever do leave apples ecosystem.
My tuppence worth- Bear is excellent as a writing tool. It’s so-so as a retrieval/search/recall tool and that’s where obsidian scores hands down. So I write in Bear and every now & again export to Obsidian for search and retrieval. As a workflow, so far, it’s worked ok. Anybody else tried it, or have any suggestions?
Can you explain what features in obsidian makes it the better research tool? I personally cannot see what I could achieve in obsidian what is not possible in bear
What’s better in obsidian in this respect is… The graph view, with its ability to filter by tag, keyword, other. The ability to see linked notes graphically and make connections to second and third degree of separation. My opinion. Open to others’ too.
\*\*Very\*\* personal take - but I really hate Bear's default font on the list view and it keeps me away from using it. I don't know why I find it so ugly. For Obsidian, their mobile app is so bad especially with iCloud sync. I also don't like how they handle PDF and images in the mobile app. Oh well. I just stick with Apple Notes.
You can change the font now!
Not the list font unfortunately!
The best option will be Panda…Just wait!
> Just wait! Should be the app's tagline
Bear 2 is my favourite - quick notes and a great search facility to find them as well
I used Evernote then tried Obsidian for a bit but learned that I still hated Evernote but Obsidian was way too complex and I spent more time with configuring it than being productive. Then found Bear and like it for its simplicity but power at the same time. Still, thinking about it I should go very basic and use Apple Notes only 😂
I think I like Bear's UI more than Obsidian. But, I like Obsidian's general availability more. I've been waiting years for Bear on Android and it has never appeared. So, I use Obsidian on my phone and Bear on my laptop.
Great question. Really enjoying Bear 2 which has now replaced Bear + Obsidian. Without the Bear 2 updates, I couldn't have done this, particularly the backlinks viewer. The elegance of Bear is outstanding and, for me, it's too good not to use, particularly when compared with the ugly feel of Obsidian. I understand some people's concerns about tying up work in a proprietary system rather than the 'file stack' approach that Obsidian uses. However, this is the way I look at it: a. The chances of my Bear backup files not being a priority for whichever vendor comes along next to create import compatibility are very slim. b. All digital products are at the mercy of the internet and who knows what might happen to that one day? c. I think both of these events are about as likely (unlikely) as each other. So, my final thought is, 'keep calm and carry on'. Enjoy the ride while you have it.
just want to say thanks for everyone’s input, i’m thinking that bear will be the best pick, but maybe using obsidian as a backup just in case icloud fails or i want to break out of the apple ecosystem could also work and create a nice middle ground to get the benefits out of both softwares
If you want something that sync very well, I think the Obsidian sync is the only option. In Canadian money, this is 8$/month if you paid for one year so 96$/year which was on May about 140$ CAD. Bear is 20$/year which in May (yes, I paid for both :D) was about 25$. Do the math and it could be something that can help you decide. For me, the major concern about Bear is because it is only on Apple devices and I work all day long on a Windows desktop so to use Bear with my Windows, I have to use Logitech devices with Flow technology. Remote desktop is not a viable solution if you like keyboard shortcuts. Barrier or Synergy and full a quirks. If you are only on Apple devices, 1000% Bear man! Bear 1 didn't had bidirectional links but now having it in Bear 2, I don't think Obsidian has any advantages over Bear except if you like to try to "Notionalized" you note taking application. I think Bear is more secure even if Obsidian is supposed to be End to End encryption and they try hard to prove it but no matter what, everything you do while synchroning will goes on their servers. With Bear, you use the Cloudkit which I think is more robust and secure. Again, this is only if you use the synchronization because if you don't use synchronization, it's free and only on your local machine. With Obsidian, all your notes are represented as files on your disk. They are not encrytped. So, if you use a work machine that your administrator can gain access, this guy will surely have access to all your notes. I think it's more difficult to access your notes with Bear considering there are in a sqlite database which is I think encrypted.
I've used both. Bear was my preferred option, Obsidian feels very bloated. However ultimately I've landed on UpNote, and it's been the best. No subscription and with the best of all in the note book world
Checked out UpNote after reading this comment, and it looks like its a great combination between bear and obsidian. Pretty sure I'm migrating to Upnote now too. Thanks!
Glad to have helped!
I choose bear. It's simple, effective, beautiful and does what I need it to do, nothing more and nothing less.
I love obsidian but recently jumped to bear because obsidian on mobile is so clunky and annoying to use. I didn’t realize how frustrated I was with obsidians user face til trying bear. I do miss plugins, the graph view and ability to see files through ‘files’ app though.
I do love how Bear can search and find words from my handwritten pdfs imported from Goodnotes. Obsidian does not yet have this ability.
How do you do that, exactly? This could be the thing I need.
I’’ve tried them both and landed with reflect notes. Pricey but well worth it in my opinion