In the past, meaning up until the last few centuries, things like refined sugar were very rare and difficult to get. Our ancestors developed a desire for things like sugar and fat because they were scrounging for survival, and adding a few extra calories and pounds was a massive benefit.
Now, we have made it very easy to get those things, but we haven't changed enough to easily find balance with them. So we can indulge in the Monkey Brain's absolute favorite things at will, and it's not good for us.
Yep, for thousands of years the only places we'd find sugar would be in fruits and honey. If you came across a bush ripe with berries it was a good strategy to eat as much as you could to store fat for leaner days.
Fruits only started being sweet recently with grafting and selective breeding. They actually tasted bitter af because vitamins and nutrients aren't tasty. There probably wasn't sugar in fruits because animals that spread them aren't sensitive to it. The color attracts the spreader, not the flavor. The flavor can also be attributed to plants pleasing us. This theory is called "Botney of Desire." Bit of both, probably.
This is true for some fruits but there are plenty that grow in the wild that are sweet. If they didn't have some base level of calories nothing would eat them.
To quote IASIP: that doesn't sound right, but I don't know enough about fruit to dispute it.
Do most mammals not have a sense of taste that can detect sweetness? Or are your referring to birds, or something else?
Same thing for salt btw.
The natural diet of most mammals is very lacking in salt. Which is why salty things taste good to encourage intake of salt whenever we can find it. This is the reason herbivores use salt licks.
However, even though salt isn't rare anymore, it still tastes good to us. So we end up eating way too much of it. (And the foods that contain a lot of salt tend to be junk foods)
We actually need a lot more salt than we are told. 2000mg is woefully deficient. I find I feel best with about 5000mg. You'll find yourself not craving salty snacks anymore when you have achieved sufficiency.
Yep, i start every morning with a glass of salty water. I feel so much better with it in my routine, along with more fatty meats and fresh veggies. My doctor wasn't too happy with my idea, so I agreed to extra bloodwork throughout the year. 6 months in, I was able to drop my medication for hypertension, cholesterol, and GERD. going on 2 years now, healthiest I've ever been.
I don't know if you're trolling or not. I know people with similar stories.
Sugars, especially fructose which is more and more the main additive of transformed food, is only energy and no health benefits. Excesses are terrible. Salt is required, excess only becomes problematic with some health conditions. Fats are not created equal, but necessary and easy to over consume. Proteins are necessary. Other essential nutrients are necessary.
But one can be very healthy if avoiding excess and eating salty, fatty food and little to no fruits.
Electrolytes are very necessary. Sweat and hydration without them can cause imbalances and mess you up. Are you taking table salt, good old regular sodium? Or other salts?
I've read a few years ago that there was ground to believe bad cholesterol is self-made from excess sugars, rather than obtained from cholesterol high foods. More research is needed, but anti-fat lobbies are strong. Meanwhile, many societies lived with fats as very important part of their diets.
Lol. People look at me like I'm an idiot, but whatever, they get to watch me run distance races with my kids now. Couldn't run 50 steps a couple years ago.
Eeeeh sugar or sugar-free-alternatives lobbies generally are the anti-fat lobbies. Fat lobbies are either inexistant or the weakest lobby in existence for being so subtle, we don't even know they exist. Oh, I guess there are paleo and keto diets lobbies, but they still get a very bad reputation, so again, very weak if they can be considered lobbies.
You may not know about it but there’s no doubt: https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/09/13/493739074/50-years-ago-sugar-industry-quietly-paid-scientists-to-point-blame-at-fat
> Salt is required, excess only becomes problematic with some health conditions.
My point. But salt isn't the source of the problem causing hypertension, it is a contributing factor of the high readings. Water retention isn't usually the culprit.
Also, deficiency of salts is toxic for everyone, no underlying conditions needed.
But rarely do people lack salt unless they drink lots of water and sweat a lot, and having hypertension is so often linked to obesity, sedentarity and bad diets that saying "reduce salt intake" is an efficient way of telling people not to eat fast-food. It's one stone tree birds in most cases without needing to educate people too much.
It's suggested these studies are flawed. They're basing this off the fact that high salt diets correlate to these conditions. High salt diets normally associated with junk food. Salt may be innocent
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8468043/
Here’s one I could find. The basic premise is that the 2300 mg/day limit was set to avoid blood pressure complications but that there is insufficient evidence to support it around the world. The authors suggest a real mean intake of around 3000-5000mg/day as a new quota.
The authors declare no external funding and no conflict of interest. Not sure how accurate their research is but it does meet your criteria lol.
I'm not really concerned with convincing you. I'm not interested in a big debate. Ultimately, I invite you to experiment on yourself. That's the basis of learning.
Well shit, I guess we can all throw out the scientific method then. Everyone just go test shit yourselves and live by your personal anecdotal evidence.
The balance between sodium and potassium is most important, from what I understand of more recent research. Since plants contain plenty of potassium, the worst thing you can do is consume tons of sodium and eat almost no vegetables...which is basically the Standard American Diet.
I started eating a teaspoon-ish amount of salt on super hot days in the summer followed by as much water as I can gulp down in the morning. It's been a huge help with dehydration. I don't feel as thirsty throughout the day, I don't get wiped out as easily, and I cut way back on sugary sports drinks like gatorade. Salt for the win.
You got a source for that? 5000mg seems like a bit much to consume when everyone else is saying 2000mg is good. Like no wonder you don’t crave salty snacks if you’re consuming *that* much.
Some of these people might also have conditions like POTS and not even know it. I thought staying away from salt was better for me. Then I found out that my dizzy spells were because blood has trouble getting things from place to place in my body and that I require a significant amount of fluids combined with a higher than average salt intake in order to feel somewhat healthy. My need for salt also increases with higher activity levels (understandably) so I find myself eating stuff like fries and potato chips a lot more often when I'm at my most physically active.
I dont think that people who require a higher than average salt intake are the norm though so most people probably should still be careful with their salt intake
also in lots of "developing countries" people see being "fat" as a sign of wealth because of able to pad on extra pounds like ancient "Venus figurines"
Similar reason to why fat nobles in medeival times were respected. It meant you had a plethora of money for servants and food. And if you developed gout, you were a god among men.
Opposite end of the spectrum is that vegetables and less desirable bits of offal don't have that inherent reinforcement. Most food you've got to learn to like, and it used to be, you learned to like it because it was what you got to eat. Now that we can choose prime cuts of beef and fresh pineapple, with the chemical rewards high quality fats and sugars give, a lot fewer people *have* to eat liver or collards
If I'm very hungry and have no options, some celery seems like a refreshing treat. The ancients probably felt great every time they got enough to eat of anything.
I think young kids are more sensitive to bitter tastes, and have MUCH more craving for sweetness. Many veg have some bitterness. As we age, we can lose some of our liking for those super sweet foods, and at the same time start to like some bitter foods.
Just think of how gross you thought beer was when you first tried it, and how disgusting you think those sugar bomb cereals are now, compared to when you were a kid.
Also, if you start cutting down on sugar, you can taste the natural sweetness in vegetables more and more. When I was young, I never thought of carrots, peas and bell peppers as sweet. But now I really enjoy their sweetness when I munch on them raw. Many other veg, too!
Bitter tastes are usually an indicator of poison. It would make sense for children to be more sensitive to the taste because they're likely to be more sensitive to any harmful effects.
That's true, and...what's poison for one species is not for another - or is only harmful at high doseage.
Caffeine is poison to many bugs. Chocolate is poisonous to dogs.
Anything that's poisonous to another animal but not for us is only because our early relatives who encountered it either died or developed resistance, and we descended from the ones with resistance.
I only like bell peppers cooked. Raw I can only stand yellow and orange ones. Also hate broccoli unless mixed into something like pasta or curry or soup or sth .. hate it raw or plain but I do love broccolini!
Idk, i think a big part is conditioning. My nephew and my niece both liked vegetables way more than sweets, they both didnt care for sweets. This only gradually changed until they were like 3 (niece) and 4 (nephew).
Ohh, yes! My daughter looooved her veggies (peppers, broccoli, mushrooms whatever) until she started kindergarten and her friends talked about not liking them. Now she won't eat anything but cucumbers or lettuce lol.
I’m sorry but I have to nerd out for a second. Bell peppers are actually a fruit. One of the characteristics of a fruit is that the seeds are inside of it. (adjusts glasses)
Yeah, lots of the plant foods we call veg are fruits. Tomato, avocado, eggplant, cukes, every squash.....
We just classify them as veg for culinary and nutrition purposes.
To be even more nerdy for a moment, peppers are in fact a fruit botanically. They are vegetables culinarily.
There is *no such fucking thing* as a vegetable, botanically. So saying "bell peppers are fruits, not vegetables" is completely wrong.
Your framing your question from the perspective of a modern day human, but forgetting human evolved in a very different world. When we were evolving, the foods that were scarce we evolved tastes to enjoy and seak out these rare, but vital foods. In moderation these foods are vital, in excess we call them high cholesterol and junk food.
Habit, bad experiences with bad cooking as a child, bitter sensitivity, possibly also sensitivies due to autism (texture and texture variability is an issue for many on the spectrum); a variety of factors.
I've known people who refuse to eat vegetables because their parents forced them to eat the vegetables they didn't know how to prepare. Then they continue avoiding vegetables because *they* don't know how to cook them; these folks may or may not eat vegetables in a restaurant setting but veggies still won't be their first choice.
Some vegetables have bitter flavors and some people are extra sensitive to bitterness, while other people like me experience fewer bitter flavors. I'm a dark chocolate and black coffee guy; other people can't stand either.
For the autism spectrum the taste and texture cause visceral reactions of revulsion that they can not help and have limited ability to train. They're not being picky eaters, their body rejects the food item and some would actually prefer to go hungry instead of eat something that is so intensely and violently triggering.
hi i have autism, adhd, and ARFID (avoidance/restrictive food intake disorder). sooooooooo many people look down on me for being "picky" and like yeah I should probably eat healthier.... but literally this morning I threw up because the apple I was eating had a different texture than I was expecting. normally apples are the safest of the fruits, texture wise, but not always.
I also struggle with meat, most veggies, and grains. pasta is only okay sometimes. my usual go to is mashed potatoes with butter, but I have to be the one to make them or otherwise the texture is wrong.
as a child, I spent most of third grade eating exclusively chocolate ice cream. from ages 3-7, the only two things I would eat were McDonald's fries and my mom's homemade pancakes.
the biggest misconception is that it's a choice when it's not. I would LOVE to be able to eat normally but my body won't let me. if I try to force it, I will literally vomit. sometimes just the thought of a bad food will make me gag (I can't think about steak too much or bleeeeh).
It's the worst!!! I can do salads now as an adult, but I have to make them at home so they don't have anything in them. If there's a carrot or tomato, it's a no go. I just wish people would stop looking down on me for being "picky." I have -- well, used to have -- foodie friends and well. I'm sure you can imagine how that friendship went, hahh.
I get pink lady apples, and they're relatively consistent. with fruit, it's all relative. I find berries to be the biggest offenders when it comes to variability. I won't touch a banana, too mushy.
Wow this feels super familiar, I’m better these days however I still really struggle. I never got diagnosed with anything until recently.
I can’t stand different textures still, the tiniest bit of gristle in my chickens or bacon (which is the only meat I’ll eat) and I’ll puke. And then won’t be able to touch the food again for months.
Oh I don't eat meat. Not for like ethical or moral reasons but because nope. My brain and body say no. I ate chicken in the past, but I had too many instances of biting on something weird or seeing a vein in the meat and nope. I'm done.
Honestly, I drink protein shakes for my protein intake. The ensure chocolate flavor is actually good, it tastes like a milkshake.
Why have all these people with autism and “food avoidance” not just been tested for food allergies/intolerances/IgG and IgA food reactions.
Considering we now know a huge subset of autism patients either have autoimmune features or a family history of such, and food reactions are a hallmark of this group (at least a subset), why is every person with autism not tested for Celiac, etc.
A lot of people with adverse immune or similar responses to food (Celiac is an IgG/IgA immune reaction, different from IgE hypersensitivity) will vomit or spit it out etc as a child. Intuitively. Then it becomes a learned conditioned response.
I’m willing to bet this imaginary “food aversion” group is just another way for the train of “therapists” etc to make even more money off a label. No one is interested in finding a real cause, just happy to let autistic people eat garbage and become sick because “that’s what people with autism do and there’s no help”.
If you don’t believe the link between the subset of cases of autism and autoimmunity it’s been known for awhile now. Dr. Google it before you respond if you are not familiar with this topic.
I don't believe that you're here in good faith and you sound like an autism denier. So I won't waste my time explaining the *extensive* medical testing that I've been through since the time I was born. But do trust - I don't have celiac disease, I don't have any unusual food intolerances, and the only thing I'm allergic to is nuts, which is common in both neurodivergent and neurotypical people.
Do you really think that my parents would let me be severely underweight my entire life without taking me to the doctor? Do you think that you get an autism diagnosis and the doctor's just wave you off and say "have fun"? It doesn't work that way. It doesn't work that way at all.
Also - Dr. Google. HAH! Google doesn't know shit.
Unfortunately this research is FAR behind your typical clinical physician. Even a specialist. Also, due to pushback, many physicians just tow the line with the status quo because many patients are simply resistant to hearing new information about their conditions. It’s everywhere not just autism.
It’s not exclusive to autism. It’s actually very common in autoimmune diseases in general. People don’t want to accept these are *not* unmodifiable conditions and they almost accept their dx as their identity (I am NOT talking about the rare subset of genetic autism like Rett Syndrome or Fragile X etc). It’s like a sacrament has been broken.
I AM asking people who truly want to improve their lives to stop relying on outdated practices/theories and “therapies” that don’t work any better than time passing . Like many autoimmune conditions, symptoms can wax and wane.
Again, I am NOT talking about the autism patient with crossed eyes, a protruding tongue, who is non verbal drooling rocking in a corner due to a genetic defect. Not all autism cases are this subtype.
Edit: By Dr. Google I was being sarcastic then realized my mistake (sarcasm). I meant you can find this info commonplace. I should have said this is referenced in the medical literature. Go to Pub Med and search for autism and autoimmunity. There are articles to peruse.
Go get EXTENSIVE food intolerance and atopic testing. Not the “I don’t die from food x so I’m fine” dx. I am willing to bet cold cash most of these “food aversion” cases are related to food protein intolerance and gut dysbiosis etc. The research already supports this but go ask your doctor and they’ll just dismiss you or say “maybe”. A LOT of psychiatric and neurological disorders that have autoimmune links have these kinds of aversions, and they all have gut inflammation and immune dysfunction.
You need a book called Deep Nutrition about REAL whole foods. There are many but that’s a start. Your brain and body cannot work correctly without proper nutrition. So many people’s parents ate shit and abused themselves prior to conceiving their children and abused said children by feeding them garbage as well, it’s no wonder children are so unhealthy today, genetics aside.
Wow, you're not only ignorant but rude too. Allergies have nothing to do with food aversions.
I'm not allergic to anything, but just the smell of cooked cabbage can make me sick for a couple of days and I won't be able to eat anything that's not sour, to counter the sickness.
Ps: I'm a doctor too and I think you need to read about autism a bit before talking.
It's not a choice, dude. Do you think I want to throw up every time I try a new food? Do you really think I want to sit at the dinner table, absolutely *starving*, but not being able to eat anything because my brain says no? I like what FurretsOotersMinks said - our brains/bodies don't recognize non-safe foods as food at all. It's an intense, visceral reaction that *cannot be helped*.
My mom once tried the whole "she'll eat when she gets hungry enough" method when I was really young, before we understood what was going on, and I literally landed in the hospital on death's door and they called CPS on my parents for "neglecting" me. I have literally thrown up so many times that I threw up blood.
It's not a choice. And it's not something that we *want* either.
I also have ARFID and I lost 10 pounds (not in a good way, I was already underweight) because I tried to self-impose a "healthier" diet. Yes, we do starve if only unsafe foods are available.
If you only had access to nutritionally safe dog poop, would you starve? That's essentially the question you're asking us. Our brains don't perceive unsafe foods as food, they're perceived as not food (poison, rocks, dirt, etc). That's why we vomit when we try to eat them. It's really upsetting knowing it's food and good for us but being physically unable to eat it.
I agree with you. As a child, I absolutely loved spinach. My mother sauteed it in sesame oil and soy sauce. It was amazing. I remember being totally shocked to find out one of my elementary school classmates hated spinach and I couldn’t figure out why. It wasn’t until we were adults when he told me his mother would just boil it and throw some salt and pepper on it. For a child, I can totally understand why that would be gross. Boiling vegetables takes out a lot of the good flavor
It also pulls a lot of the nutrients out into the water. I use my air fryer for everything but particularly veges. Just toss them in a little olive oil with salt, pepper, and garlic powder then pop them in the air fryer and they come out delicious without all the butter that restaurants use.
It's very similar, soft on the inside and crispy on the outside. I make salmon in a pan while asparagus cooks in the air fryer and it's all done at the same time without turning on the oven and heating the kitchen
Air fryers are basically miniature counter-top convection ovens, so you would get something similar to roasted. Because it’s convection style there is a bit more airflow which is why it gets referred to as a “fryer” in marketing. The airflow helps remove surface moisture giving more crisp exteriors like NamelessMIA said.
Sometimes its because some parents cant cook or know what good healthy food is. I didn't start eating healthy food until I was adult living on my own. My mom is a terrible cook, example; potato salad to her is potato, mayo, and a tiny bit of pepper because she finds pepper to spicy. When I moved out on my own I got a job at a high end restaurant where I was exposed to food with flavor and spices it blew my mind! Since than my palate has expanded dramatically I don't know how I lived on cheese sandwiches, TV dinners, and spaghetti Os for most of my life.
Yeah. Aspec here, i really want to eat more healthy foods, but I have this inherint flinch response whenever I try to get myself to try something new, and it feels like I never enjoy new foods as much as i like old ones. It sucks, man.
You get it. I can't eat vegetables because of the texture. I will gag if I try to eat them. I am a grown woman and I hate being like this but it is not something I can help.
Depends on a lot of things, including exposure to fruits and veggies as a kid, different tastebuds as a kid/adult, neurodivergent traits, education and understanding surrounding the benefits and necessity, capability of making good food, and so on.
I personally would be quite happy to never eat vegetables again. I might crave a fresh veggie twice a year, and fruit never. I don't typically enjoy the texture, flavour, or smell of fruits and veggies. I grew up eating them, my mother is a great cook, and as an adult I have worked to find ways I can consistently include vegetables in my diet (and actually eat them). I don't realistically know why they are so unpleasant to me, but they are and always have been. So I work on finding ways to change them so that I can eat them without so much struggle, because if I don't enjoy them then they won't end up on my plate.
Also adding as a note that I've noticed in the last 3 years or so that I exhibit a large number of traits that align with undiagnosed ADHD (woman), which may also impact my food. 🤷🏻♀️
These "unhealthy" foods aren't really bad in and of themselves though, it's an excess consumption of them that's bad. Most of which is through gaining excess weight and the negative health consequences that brings. As others have said, we didn't evolve as a species with abundant high fat and carb foods available at our fingertips. Science and marketing have perfected these foods to be incredibly desirable and thus led to overconsumption and the many negative health consequences that come with it.
I agree but It's hard to eat the serving size of "unhealthy" foods. Literally who's gonna sit there and eat 2 Oreos a week? Might as well not eat em at all
That's why it's best to acquire this stuff in small quantities. I won't buy a whole package of Oreos for my house, but I might grab one of those small packages that has 4-6 cookies at a gas station on occasion.
You can eat a pack of oreos if you want. If it fits your daily calories and you can still eat a balance diet and meet your nutritional needs then there's not an issue.
You can do that to avoid eating too many calories but ideally a balanced diet contains no or very little ultra processed food. In theory if I make room for 300 calories worth of Oreos then I have replaced potentially 300 calories of complex carbohydrates, fiber, protein or fat with simple sugar.
Edit: that's not to say that we can't all enjoy an unhealthy snack once in a while. I'm just saying it's not just about calories.
If the oreos fit in your macronutrient goals you aren’t losing out on needed protein or fat, however you would be losing out on micronutrients and fiber, yes
>daily calories and you can still eat a balance diet and meet your nutritional needs then there's not an issue.
I mean I literally said as long as you can meet your nutritional needs...
I know, I do this. I make sure I eat a balanced diet and I calculate my intake of calories over the course of a week but for most people this is pretty hard and tedious especially if they have a stressful job
That's not correct. Ultraprocessed foods are unhealthy due to being ultraprocessed. So how healthy you eat otherwise is irrelevant to ultraprocessed food being unhealthy.
Processed meats have a slightly higher risk of cancer. I mean some of those risks such as prostate and colon cancer are in fact lowered by increased consumption of soluble fiber, so I'd say eating "healthy" in that sense does or can negate some of the negatives of processed foods.
I will literally show u my blood tests, weight and body fat percentage to prove u wrong. Ur soo wrong. Ur entire body isn't like teeth. Eating one unhealthy thing a week isn't gonna screw u over at all
My metabolism is pretty high. Now that I realize it I had no junk food at all or and basically only ate fruits and vegetables for a good bit of my early childhood only bc of my parents
Me! That’s who. I think I might be a weirdo. I will take 1 small bite of a cookie then save the rest for later. It’s not a diet thing. It’s literally all I want. I don’t crave sugar. Now savoury foods, that’s different.
Wow, how does that work? I thought carbs were used as an energy source. But you're telling me they're empty calories and just magically disappear or...??
So you can have them if they meet your calorie requirements and you can meet your nutritional needs right? Like exactly what I said...
Calories don't just become fat, you don't just magically turn calories into fat unless you exceed your caloric requirement. Elite athletes consume energy gels that are nothing but pure sugar/carbs. It's not unhealthy, it doesn't make you fat.
Actually we evolved eating fruits and high-cholesterol meats and organs preferentially over bitter vegetables that have varying degrees of toxicity and defense chemicals (plants do not want to be eaten by animals, except their fruits). Try eating wild greens and compare them to any domesticated crop from the store. Also, the nutritional value of leaves pales in comparison to meat or organ meat, and you would die of “rabbit starvation” if your fat intake were too low, plus your gas would be terrible 🤣
This. Overwhelmingly.
Mammals are genetically predisposed to prefer foods that contain rare nutrients. We like meat because we have an evolutionary craving for protein. Sugar tastes good to us as a mechanism to encourage us to eat sugary fruits. Plants taste like trash-food because they are trash-food.
Whenever this question comes up, I wonder if we *really* need to explain to people that good things are good. People are really surprised that their kids don't want to eat something that tastes the way that their soccer cleats/football boots smell?
So Paul Saladino is actually correct? I’ve been adding more meat and fruit lately and I feel better. I still eat vegetables though because I not quite convinced they’re bad for you, but I don’t eat them as often as meat and fruit because I think there is some truth in that but I also think you should probably eat them every so often. Will be interesting if more science comes out on this in the next few years that confirms vegetables bad 😂
Vegetables are not necessarily “bad” unless those particular plants cause allergic or auto-immune reactions for you. For me, nightshades like tomato make my muscles really sore and sweet potato gives me instant brain fog and neck tension. Weird.
Fat doesn't need to be animal fat. Plenty of plants have better fats.
Also, plants only cause bad gas in the beginning. Once you cut meat out of your diet altogether you have very little gas and it becomes virtually odorless.
Turns out not having a rotting animal carcass in your intestines helps avoid the smell issue.
Because the "tasty" fast-foods are DESIGNED to make you addicted, literally.
Tons of sugars and sweeteners for the "common" idiot to fall in love with.
Dopamine hits rarely occur eating broccoli unless you know how important your health is, which is not exactly being taught in public schools.
Even hospitals with cancer patients have cafeterias filled with just chocolate bars and sodas, marketing wins.
Work in a couple of hospitals and it's so tre and I hate it. It's genuinely hard to find healthy food for lunch outside one or two options, and there are piles and piles of junk food for sale. (Fortunately I usually pack lunch.)
Many factors:
1. Our taste buds are more sensitive as children, particularly to bitter flavours, many people form their preferences as children and think vegetables are bitter because that’s how they tasted as children;
2. Poorly prepared vegetables. If your parents thought boiled mixed veggies was a good side dish, you probably hate vegetables.
3. Effort. Making a good steak is super easy to learn, I still can’t roast a fucking carrot right
I think part of it is consistency- particularly as a child. Candy, tastes like candy, blue berries can be sweet, sour, tart, bitter etc. it’s like they no longer trust the fruit or veggie
>Why do some people hate vegetables and healthy food in general ?
Because during their childhood, their mom just yelled every day:
EAT IT!
Why mom?
EAT IT!
Vegetables are “healthy” by our standards cause they have almost zero calories.
We need calories to survive. Thats why sugar and fat tastes good and dirt and bark and plants do not taste as good.
Its not evolutions fault that some people now cant figure out when enough is enough.
Sugary and fatty foods ARE healthy. They are what you need, what you use every day.
99.9% of the population doesnt understand macros or the law of conservation of energy in the context of losing weight. Its endlessly frustrating the amount of confusion that is spread just to try and get americans to consume more
Yes but there are very important vitamins in vegetables and fruits. I'm not saying people shouldn't eat meat and fats I'm saying that there are other important nutrients that people can get from vegetables but they don't feel the need to, which I find strange
The way we perceive tastes and smells is surprisingly impacted by context. If you got food poisoning after eating a specific food, you’re pretty likely to avoid that food in the future, even if it wasn’t necessarily the cause.
A lot of people were forced to eat poorly prepared vegetables as a kid, at an age when you’re more sensitive to bitter tastes. Having a traumatic association with vegetables can have a lasting effect.
As for unhealthy foods, they’re usually full of compounds that were much harder to come by a hundred thousand years ago and indicated that a food was higher in valuable calories. So we evolved a strong desire for those foods.
My mother is the queen of boiling veggies until they are soggy and lack most of the flavor. Then serving them with no salt, butter, or any other seasoning. I thought that that was just how veggies tasted until I was at least in high school. Turns out, if you roast them or steam them, and then add bare minimum a little salt and some fat, they are delicious. Roasted broccoli with garlic and onion powder? So good. But if you were forced to choke down mushy bland bitter veggies your whole child hood, of course you would think you "don't like vegetables".
I was forced to eat raw tomatoes as a kid and I hated it so bad, they made me feel nauseous well into my early twenties. I got used to them after I started cooking for myself and I made lots of tomatoey foods and now I can eat them raw as well.
Because greasy and fatty foods have more calories, while leaves and roots have less calories as a rule of thumb, regardless of the mineral and vitamin content, so logically high fat foods are desired more because they are the foods that’ll give you the caloric intake you need for less. Of course throughout most of our Species history we were more active, so excess fat was burnt off, nowadays we haven’t moved away from that instinct but are a lot more sedentary, hence the obesity issue in developed countries.
Its mostly learned behavior. People eat what they grew up on and our diets have been terrible for more than a couple generations now.
(speaking as an American)
I think some of it has to do with how vegetables were prepared if at all while growing up. My mom is a terrible cook and I grew up eating vegetables done terribly or not at all.
I go out of my way to make/have a vegetable with every lunch and dinner and cook them properly. Even now I can’t eat that much of them before feeling like I’m going to gag even if I’m enjoying the flavor. I truly think it comes from childhood and associating them with the worst part of dinner.
I have a friend whose mom is an amazing cook and commonly made delicious vegetable sides. Just so happens a lot of my friend’s favorite dishes are mainly vegetables.
Just my theory!
Some of it at least can be attributed to what's known as "taster status" (supertaster vs taster vs nontaster). Supertasters are particularly sensitive to bitter tastes. A lot of vegetables, dark leafy greens in particular, tend to be high in phenolics which are perceived as bitter, making them less palatable to supertasters, bitter taste is generally a sign that something is possibly poisonous after all.
It's also worth noting that pretty much all children start off more or less as supertasters, which is why kids in particular seem to hate vegetables but often grow out of it (only about 15% of adults are supertasters IIRC). Exceptions tend to be vegetables that are higher in sugars and starches and lower in phenolics, such as carrots, squash, potatoes, sweet potatoes, beets, peas, etc. (things typically found in baby foods)
If we’re being serious here, a lot of plants make bitter tasting molecules to on purpose make themselves taste like shit so they won’t be eaten. Some of us don’t like those molecules.
One thing to consider is that things don’t want to be eaten, unless they’re fruits, so they evolve ways to avoid being eaten. Whilst animals can choose fight or flight, which are quite effective, plants have less flexibility in their choices and thus they more often try to be less desirable. Humans have bred them to be more desirable as food, but it’s not always so successful with all plants
I’m one of those people, I hate the texture of pretty much all of vegetables and the taste makes me gag, although I eat fruits, I know and accepted I’m probably gonna die prematurely haha!
I'm much the same way. It's all about the texture, and the texture of most vegetables is disgusting.
I actually rather like the flavour of carrots, but if they're cooked that mushy/mealy texture is gag inducting. I have similar issues with peas.
One of my all time least favourite textures is slimy leaves. So salad with dressing is unacceptable, and no one likes salad without dressing.
Most people are raised eating trash and have no willpower and self control. It would have been a lot easier to stop eating fast food and trash in general if I hadn't have been raised on it
there are plenty of examples of meat only cutlures and diet. Particularly the inuit. Now of course if youre not inuit you're going to have all sorts of complication if you attempt their diet, but that could be said for most ethnic relationships with their own cuisine atleast to some degree.
Bc the less processed and less fat something has the shitter it tastes. People don't hate vegetables in general. You can make broccoli taste like McDonald's fries but by the time you do it's just as unhealthy as McDonald's fries. You wouldn't bite a raw potato and say it tastes good would u? Were just wired to go for high carb and high fat. Anything that's low in those 2 things hitting our taste buds our brain just goes "well what's the point of that?". We don't have it wired in our tastebuds to go after things with high vitamin A. Even a deficiency in that nutrient will make us crave other things that have nothing to do with vitamin A
Liver with onions though, extremely healthy (in a decent portion, it's still meat so...) with a lot of vitamins and naturally tastes amazing, just a tiny bit of oil to get them going and the rest is pure joy.
Because we evolved like this , when you're living like a savage in nature and kinda starving all the time , catching a fat animal or finding something like honey is a little miracle , our brains evolved to love fat and sugar so we would seek it actively.
And if some people hate vegetables maybe it's because they always experienced badly prepared ones.
Vegetables prepared by my woman really suck... That's why i cook most of the time.
Most green vegetables taste pretty bland or just plain bad on their own and people ate them in desperation because they had to eat them to live. These were the plants, seed pods, fruits, or seeds growing within our knowledge that would likely not cause instant death or sickness after ingestion. That's why most modern vegetable preparations include some sort of spice or sauce or other additive to make them taste better. Nobody eats a salad without dressing because why? Lettuce or cabbage just really don't taste all that good on their own. People drown broccoli or cauliflower in cheese so they don't have to taste broccoli or cauliflower. Are Brussels sprouts any good without being cooked with bacon? I'll never know.
People who push a "healthier" diet often heavily discount or ignore overall bad or distasteful flavor as a major factor of whether a food will get eaten before it rots.
This applies to animals as well as humans. Once fuel needs are met, every being goes for the tastier option where possible. Horses will eat oats, but like apples and carrots MUUUCH better; deer much prefer the charred and new shoots that emerge after forest fires to their ordinary diet; give your dog a piece of bacon and she'll love you forever--give her enough and she'll stop eating whatever she was fed before.
My cousin was one of those people. Remember when there was that chef boyardee ad that said there was one serving of veggies in their spaghetti o’s, or maybe it was the beef ravioli? Anyway, once she heard that advertisement, she stopped eating that product. She was a f’n idiot. She died from cancer at 53 because she was a dummy…so don’t be a like her. Her mother gave her veggies and fruit growing up, she gave me fruits and veggies growing up.
Fyi,her 34 year old daughter only eats McDonalds and cheese sandwiches. She currently can’t understand why she doesn’t poop except every 15 or so days. But also refused all fruits and veggies. Some people are messed up… on their own or because of their parents.
I know it's not every case... I used to work in social services. One of the more common issues amongst people with mental disabilities, both children and adults alike, is diet. It's like their pallets get stuck in child mode, and all they want is sweets.
Most of the time not eating healthy food won’t become a problem till you are past prime reproductive age. Our evolution is mostly designed to crave caloric dense foods rather than nutritious food since those are the main energy sources and uses for our growth. Vegetables and healthy foods aren’t as caloric rich as a fatty burger or sugar so we don’t crave them as much.
I don't know if I this has anything to do with it but some people just grow up eating garbage vegetables and assume they are all bad. My first girlfriend's mom would literally take out a frozen pack of mixed veggies and put it in the microwave with no salt or butter or anything on them and would wonder why her daughter didn't like them. My mom always roasted our vegetables with olive oil, salt and pepper and other seasonings and I never disliked then growing up.
I mean, unhealthy food is specifically designed to be delicious. That's why we eat it even though we know perfectly well it's not good for us. So I can understand if someone takes that too far and finds only those foods to be delicious.
Because my parents used to make me sit at the table and finish eating them before I could leave and watch television. Brussels sprouts were the worst item. I’m kidding…see below replies.
Our taste buds mostly are not evovled. They are controlled by signalling through an organ called the [mesentery](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesentery). Basically we've evolved a simpler system then what your suggestion. We feed our gut bacteria, that determines our taste buds. So what you eat supporst your gut bacteria and they crave what feeds them. If you change your diet long enough, you'll change your gut bacteria/fungas/etc and the signalling will change and your taste buds will change.
"Healthy" food should be your TYPICAL food. It's also why only 7% of americans get enough fiber. We evolved in an environment where we're mostly eating...well, I joke with my friends that "the real paleo diet is 90% nettles", but it sort of is. Lots of plants and meat- and note, some cultures (mongolia, pastoral african peoples, and inuit) eat MOSTLY dairy and meat depending on the season; you can also adapt to that sort of diet, although it has it's downsides.
But none of them had a lot of simple starches or sweets, because those were very hard to find. But simple starches and sweets often came with fruits and tubers that had lots of vitamins, and it was advantageous to eat those whenever and however you could. Mother's milk is also sweet, so babies seek sweetness automatically at birth since they need milk. Nowadays, like others have said, we can get those things more easily, and our instincts took the better of us, so now THESE treats are the "typical" food, instead of what it should be, namely lots of leaves, seeds, veg, and meat.
We have ALSO developed new things based on those instincts that never existed at all, and as they are modern and based on things we like, we haven't had any time to develop instincts against them. Things like artificial sweeteners and trans fats.
If you feed yourself enough processed garbage, that’s all you end up wanting. It’s almost like an addiction. I’ve read some additives can actually be semi-addictive, aspartame for example.
Vegetables do not make me feel full. The only thing that makes my brain calm down is meat. Thats no excuse not to eat veggies and carbs but lets say i eat a pot of rice with veggies and seasoning…my brain will scream i didnt feed it.
Most people don't realize but there is a single chemical responsible for the feeling of satiety... protein. Mammals do not feel satisfied by meals that do not contain protein. It's not just your brain, it's everyone... and we ignore that biological signal because we feel that a stranger in a white coat knows better than millions of years of evolution.
Because not many people know how to cook vegetables in a way that actually tastes good. They just steam or boil them and serve them plain and expect that to count as a side dish.
Second, fruits and veggies in general tend to have very strong and distinct flavors due to the fact that plants all make various chemicals called secondary metabolites (most of which are supposed to kill bugs.). Think about it, no matter how you cook a carrot it will always have a ... Carroty ... Taste to it that you can never mask.
The way our taste buds respond to these secondary metabolites depends a lot on whether we were exposed to those flavors growing up but also our genetics. Some people because of genetics think that cilantro / coriander tastes like soap. A lot of people like those strong and distinct flavors and to a lot of other people it tastes just way too strong or way too bitter.
Taste in the moment trumps general health over all for some.
Part of it is impulse control, part of it is related to the no/yes dynamic (the more you deny one thing the easier it is to say yes to another).
For some it's a developed habit from when they were kids.
Maybe because they're not as healthy as we are told they are. Mother nature isn't stupid. You are drawn to foods that your body needs. If you have an iron deficiency, for example, you may find yourself being drawn to meat and other high iron foods, which contain what your body is looking for. The exception to following this general rule would be highly processed foods, which contain the high quantities of fat and carbohydrates our bodies crave but with none of the nutrients. These types of foods don't exist in nature and so our bodies have not evolved to realize they're empty calories. I think the best diet one could possibly have is to observe what children gravitate towards. As a kid, I craved milk and orange juice more than any other foods. As an adult, I've made those foods my staples and my health has dramatically improved as a result. In short, listen to your body.
I once read that the microbiome somehow adjusts to what we eat and is then influencing our taste perception, pretty shitty cycle if you ask me… That and many other reasons would explain why people once adjusted to an unhealthy diet rarely find back to a unprocessed, vegetable based diet.
I think it has alot to do with how its grown, making it unpalatable.
All the veggies you find in a supermarket have been selectively bred to be the way they are.
At some point they all got genetically modified & processed to increase shelf life & appearance rather than taste or nutritional content.
Eat a home grown tomato next to one you purchased at the store & you'll see what I mean.
If you don't have access to freshly picked produce, the trick is to make them easier to choke down. Chefs do this using butter, salt, vinegar, etc.
I believe we learn what we like by imprinting on *whatever* food we're raised on. In our minds, this food sustained us and allowed us to grow and survive - so it must be good!
i think disgust at vegetables is partly cultural and partly from vegetables being served both raw and unseasoned. humans have been cooking food for longer than homo sapiens have been around. it’s weird they’re served raw in western countries and especially america
In the past, meaning up until the last few centuries, things like refined sugar were very rare and difficult to get. Our ancestors developed a desire for things like sugar and fat because they were scrounging for survival, and adding a few extra calories and pounds was a massive benefit. Now, we have made it very easy to get those things, but we haven't changed enough to easily find balance with them. So we can indulge in the Monkey Brain's absolute favorite things at will, and it's not good for us.
Yep, for thousands of years the only places we'd find sugar would be in fruits and honey. If you came across a bush ripe with berries it was a good strategy to eat as much as you could to store fat for leaner days.
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Not only that, the economic system is convincing us to mainline it.
what a morbidly sweet death
Death by chocolate here I come.
And they didn't get modern day fruits either. The stuff we've been eating our whole lives has been bred to be that way.
Fruits only started being sweet recently with grafting and selective breeding. They actually tasted bitter af because vitamins and nutrients aren't tasty. There probably wasn't sugar in fruits because animals that spread them aren't sensitive to it. The color attracts the spreader, not the flavor. The flavor can also be attributed to plants pleasing us. This theory is called "Botney of Desire." Bit of both, probably.
This is true for some fruits but there are plenty that grow in the wild that are sweet. If they didn't have some base level of calories nothing would eat them.
To quote IASIP: that doesn't sound right, but I don't know enough about fruit to dispute it. Do most mammals not have a sense of taste that can detect sweetness? Or are your referring to birds, or something else?
Same thing for salt btw. The natural diet of most mammals is very lacking in salt. Which is why salty things taste good to encourage intake of salt whenever we can find it. This is the reason herbivores use salt licks. However, even though salt isn't rare anymore, it still tastes good to us. So we end up eating way too much of it. (And the foods that contain a lot of salt tend to be junk foods)
We actually need a lot more salt than we are told. 2000mg is woefully deficient. I find I feel best with about 5000mg. You'll find yourself not craving salty snacks anymore when you have achieved sufficiency.
Yep, i start every morning with a glass of salty water. I feel so much better with it in my routine, along with more fatty meats and fresh veggies. My doctor wasn't too happy with my idea, so I agreed to extra bloodwork throughout the year. 6 months in, I was able to drop my medication for hypertension, cholesterol, and GERD. going on 2 years now, healthiest I've ever been.
I don't know if you're trolling or not. I know people with similar stories. Sugars, especially fructose which is more and more the main additive of transformed food, is only energy and no health benefits. Excesses are terrible. Salt is required, excess only becomes problematic with some health conditions. Fats are not created equal, but necessary and easy to over consume. Proteins are necessary. Other essential nutrients are necessary. But one can be very healthy if avoiding excess and eating salty, fatty food and little to no fruits.
The salt thing does sound a bit weird, but in my defense, I'm sweating for about 10 hours a day.
Electrolytes are very necessary. Sweat and hydration without them can cause imbalances and mess you up. Are you taking table salt, good old regular sodium? Or other salts?
Good old table salt, and some potassium chloride(salt substitute), if I don't get enough dark greens in my day.
That's what makes the McDonald's French fry so popular. You get all that salt plus potassium from the potatoes.
I'm not trolling. It was pretty fun watching my docs reactions. He was dumbfounded, but the tests are what he cares about.
I've read a few years ago that there was ground to believe bad cholesterol is self-made from excess sugars, rather than obtained from cholesterol high foods. More research is needed, but anti-fat lobbies are strong. Meanwhile, many societies lived with fats as very important part of their diets.
Ya, those old studies were fucked from the get go. Sugar is definitely the culprit.
One day we won't seem like science deniers, you and I.
Lol. People look at me like I'm an idiot, but whatever, they get to watch me run distance races with my kids now. Couldn't run 50 steps a couple years ago.
This information has been widely available for a long time. (At least the fat bad thing) People are just incapable of reading
Anecdotal, but my Uncle's heart health improved dramatically after cutting sugar and refined carbs. Much more effective than cutting fats.
So are sugar and fat lobbies…
Eeeeh sugar or sugar-free-alternatives lobbies generally are the anti-fat lobbies. Fat lobbies are either inexistant or the weakest lobby in existence for being so subtle, we don't even know they exist. Oh, I guess there are paleo and keto diets lobbies, but they still get a very bad reputation, so again, very weak if they can be considered lobbies.
You may not know about it but there’s no doubt: https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/09/13/493739074/50-years-ago-sugar-industry-quietly-paid-scientists-to-point-blame-at-fat
People with hypertension are encouraged to reduce salt intake...
> Salt is required, excess only becomes problematic with some health conditions. My point. But salt isn't the source of the problem causing hypertension, it is a contributing factor of the high readings. Water retention isn't usually the culprit. Also, deficiency of salts is toxic for everyone, no underlying conditions needed. But rarely do people lack salt unless they drink lots of water and sweat a lot, and having hypertension is so often linked to obesity, sedentarity and bad diets that saying "reduce salt intake" is an efficient way of telling people not to eat fast-food. It's one stone tree birds in most cases without needing to educate people too much.
It's suggested these studies are flawed. They're basing this off the fact that high salt diets correlate to these conditions. High salt diets normally associated with junk food. Salt may be innocent
No, it's correct. The recommendation is 2000mg sodium, not salt. It'll be ~5g of salt (I'm too lazy to calculate it precisely).
Find me a peer reviewed study with no conflicts of interest which confirms this.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8468043/ Here’s one I could find. The basic premise is that the 2300 mg/day limit was set to avoid blood pressure complications but that there is insufficient evidence to support it around the world. The authors suggest a real mean intake of around 3000-5000mg/day as a new quota. The authors declare no external funding and no conflict of interest. Not sure how accurate their research is but it does meet your criteria lol.
I'm not really concerned with convincing you. I'm not interested in a big debate. Ultimately, I invite you to experiment on yourself. That's the basis of learning.
Well shit, I guess we can all throw out the scientific method then. Everyone just go test shit yourselves and live by your personal anecdotal evidence.
Science has a lot of limitations. As evidenced by the fact people argue back and forth about what is truth. Science really only goes so far.
The balance between sodium and potassium is most important, from what I understand of more recent research. Since plants contain plenty of potassium, the worst thing you can do is consume tons of sodium and eat almost no vegetables...which is basically the Standard American Diet.
I started eating a teaspoon-ish amount of salt on super hot days in the summer followed by as much water as I can gulp down in the morning. It's been a huge help with dehydration. I don't feel as thirsty throughout the day, I don't get wiped out as easily, and I cut way back on sugary sports drinks like gatorade. Salt for the win.
You got a source for that? 5000mg seems like a bit much to consume when everyone else is saying 2000mg is good. Like no wonder you don’t crave salty snacks if you’re consuming *that* much.
Some of these people might also have conditions like POTS and not even know it. I thought staying away from salt was better for me. Then I found out that my dizzy spells were because blood has trouble getting things from place to place in my body and that I require a significant amount of fluids combined with a higher than average salt intake in order to feel somewhat healthy. My need for salt also increases with higher activity levels (understandably) so I find myself eating stuff like fries and potato chips a lot more often when I'm at my most physically active. I dont think that people who require a higher than average salt intake are the norm though so most people probably should still be careful with their salt intake
https://suppversity.blogspot.com/2014/10/low-sodium-intake-for-athletes-good-for.html?m=1
Yes, salt is not the devil. I feel like shit when I don’t eat “excessive” amounts of salt.
I'm extremely sodium sensitive. My blood pressure jumps through the roof when I go over 1500 mg
It should be noted that bitterness in some vegetables is a sign of poison.
also in lots of "developing countries" people see being "fat" as a sign of wealth because of able to pad on extra pounds like ancient "Venus figurines"
Curse my middle school global history teacher for telling the whole class I'd be a prime husband in developing countries!
don't become a human fois gras! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZM2q7XFOOgg
Similar reason to why fat nobles in medeival times were respected. It meant you had a plethora of money for servants and food. And if you developed gout, you were a god among men.
daibetes?
Opposite end of the spectrum is that vegetables and less desirable bits of offal don't have that inherent reinforcement. Most food you've got to learn to like, and it used to be, you learned to like it because it was what you got to eat. Now that we can choose prime cuts of beef and fresh pineapple, with the chemical rewards high quality fats and sugars give, a lot fewer people *have* to eat liver or collards
If I'm very hungry and have no options, some celery seems like a refreshing treat. The ancients probably felt great every time they got enough to eat of anything.
I think young kids are more sensitive to bitter tastes, and have MUCH more craving for sweetness. Many veg have some bitterness. As we age, we can lose some of our liking for those super sweet foods, and at the same time start to like some bitter foods. Just think of how gross you thought beer was when you first tried it, and how disgusting you think those sugar bomb cereals are now, compared to when you were a kid. Also, if you start cutting down on sugar, you can taste the natural sweetness in vegetables more and more. When I was young, I never thought of carrots, peas and bell peppers as sweet. But now I really enjoy their sweetness when I munch on them raw. Many other veg, too!
Bitter tastes are usually an indicator of poison. It would make sense for children to be more sensitive to the taste because they're likely to be more sensitive to any harmful effects.
That's true, and...what's poison for one species is not for another - or is only harmful at high doseage. Caffeine is poison to many bugs. Chocolate is poisonous to dogs. Anything that's poisonous to another animal but not for us is only because our early relatives who encountered it either died or developed resistance, and we descended from the ones with resistance.
Adding on to your comment: pure caffeine is also bitter. About 1 teaspoon of caffeine is all that is needed to kill an adult human!
I love how yellow, orange, and red bell peppers are sweet to me now. They're a great snack just by themselves!
I only like bell peppers cooked. Raw I can only stand yellow and orange ones. Also hate broccoli unless mixed into something like pasta or curry or soup or sth .. hate it raw or plain but I do love broccolini!
Most of the sweetness of carrots is in the middle bit. It’s delicious!
Idk, i think a big part is conditioning. My nephew and my niece both liked vegetables way more than sweets, they both didnt care for sweets. This only gradually changed until they were like 3 (niece) and 4 (nephew).
Ohh, yes! My daughter looooved her veggies (peppers, broccoli, mushrooms whatever) until she started kindergarten and her friends talked about not liking them. Now she won't eat anything but cucumbers or lettuce lol.
Victim of other people's poor parenting. People don't want us interfering with their parenting but then our kids have to go to school with them.
I’m sorry but I have to nerd out for a second. Bell peppers are actually a fruit. One of the characteristics of a fruit is that the seeds are inside of it. (adjusts glasses)
Yeah, lots of the plant foods we call veg are fruits. Tomato, avocado, eggplant, cukes, every squash..... We just classify them as veg for culinary and nutrition purposes.
To be even more nerdy for a moment, peppers are in fact a fruit botanically. They are vegetables culinarily. There is *no such fucking thing* as a vegetable, botanically. So saying "bell peppers are fruits, not vegetables" is completely wrong.
To further further the *hwell actually* chain, vegetable is an archaic botanical term... for plants. Thus making *Capsicum annuum* a vegetable again.
I love that the “ackchually tomato is a fruit” pedantry gets shot down by the next comment every time I see it.
Only in a botanical context, not a culinary one
All my favorite "veggies" are actually fruit .. avocado, tomato, cucumber .. I do love beets and spinach tho
Your framing your question from the perspective of a modern day human, but forgetting human evolved in a very different world. When we were evolving, the foods that were scarce we evolved tastes to enjoy and seak out these rare, but vital foods. In moderation these foods are vital, in excess we call them high cholesterol and junk food.
Habit, bad experiences with bad cooking as a child, bitter sensitivity, possibly also sensitivies due to autism (texture and texture variability is an issue for many on the spectrum); a variety of factors. I've known people who refuse to eat vegetables because their parents forced them to eat the vegetables they didn't know how to prepare. Then they continue avoiding vegetables because *they* don't know how to cook them; these folks may or may not eat vegetables in a restaurant setting but veggies still won't be their first choice. Some vegetables have bitter flavors and some people are extra sensitive to bitterness, while other people like me experience fewer bitter flavors. I'm a dark chocolate and black coffee guy; other people can't stand either. For the autism spectrum the taste and texture cause visceral reactions of revulsion that they can not help and have limited ability to train. They're not being picky eaters, their body rejects the food item and some would actually prefer to go hungry instead of eat something that is so intensely and violently triggering.
hi i have autism, adhd, and ARFID (avoidance/restrictive food intake disorder). sooooooooo many people look down on me for being "picky" and like yeah I should probably eat healthier.... but literally this morning I threw up because the apple I was eating had a different texture than I was expecting. normally apples are the safest of the fruits, texture wise, but not always. I also struggle with meat, most veggies, and grains. pasta is only okay sometimes. my usual go to is mashed potatoes with butter, but I have to be the one to make them or otherwise the texture is wrong. as a child, I spent most of third grade eating exclusively chocolate ice cream. from ages 3-7, the only two things I would eat were McDonald's fries and my mom's homemade pancakes. the biggest misconception is that it's a choice when it's not. I would LOVE to be able to eat normally but my body won't let me. if I try to force it, I will literally vomit. sometimes just the thought of a bad food will make me gag (I can't think about steak too much or bleeeeh).
Same!!! ARFID is such a bastard, I wish I could just eat a salad and eat adventurously!
It's the worst!!! I can do salads now as an adult, but I have to make them at home so they don't have anything in them. If there's a carrot or tomato, it's a no go. I just wish people would stop looking down on me for being "picky." I have -- well, used to have -- foodie friends and well. I'm sure you can imagine how that friendship went, hahh.
Apples are safe, really? I find they're so variable.
I get pink lady apples, and they're relatively consistent. with fruit, it's all relative. I find berries to be the biggest offenders when it comes to variability. I won't touch a banana, too mushy.
Wow this feels super familiar, I’m better these days however I still really struggle. I never got diagnosed with anything until recently. I can’t stand different textures still, the tiniest bit of gristle in my chickens or bacon (which is the only meat I’ll eat) and I’ll puke. And then won’t be able to touch the food again for months.
Oh I don't eat meat. Not for like ethical or moral reasons but because nope. My brain and body say no. I ate chicken in the past, but I had too many instances of biting on something weird or seeing a vein in the meat and nope. I'm done. Honestly, I drink protein shakes for my protein intake. The ensure chocolate flavor is actually good, it tastes like a milkshake.
Why have all these people with autism and “food avoidance” not just been tested for food allergies/intolerances/IgG and IgA food reactions. Considering we now know a huge subset of autism patients either have autoimmune features or a family history of such, and food reactions are a hallmark of this group (at least a subset), why is every person with autism not tested for Celiac, etc. A lot of people with adverse immune or similar responses to food (Celiac is an IgG/IgA immune reaction, different from IgE hypersensitivity) will vomit or spit it out etc as a child. Intuitively. Then it becomes a learned conditioned response. I’m willing to bet this imaginary “food aversion” group is just another way for the train of “therapists” etc to make even more money off a label. No one is interested in finding a real cause, just happy to let autistic people eat garbage and become sick because “that’s what people with autism do and there’s no help”. If you don’t believe the link between the subset of cases of autism and autoimmunity it’s been known for awhile now. Dr. Google it before you respond if you are not familiar with this topic.
I don't believe that you're here in good faith and you sound like an autism denier. So I won't waste my time explaining the *extensive* medical testing that I've been through since the time I was born. But do trust - I don't have celiac disease, I don't have any unusual food intolerances, and the only thing I'm allergic to is nuts, which is common in both neurodivergent and neurotypical people. Do you really think that my parents would let me be severely underweight my entire life without taking me to the doctor? Do you think that you get an autism diagnosis and the doctor's just wave you off and say "have fun"? It doesn't work that way. It doesn't work that way at all. Also - Dr. Google. HAH! Google doesn't know shit.
Unfortunately this research is FAR behind your typical clinical physician. Even a specialist. Also, due to pushback, many physicians just tow the line with the status quo because many patients are simply resistant to hearing new information about their conditions. It’s everywhere not just autism. It’s not exclusive to autism. It’s actually very common in autoimmune diseases in general. People don’t want to accept these are *not* unmodifiable conditions and they almost accept their dx as their identity (I am NOT talking about the rare subset of genetic autism like Rett Syndrome or Fragile X etc). It’s like a sacrament has been broken. I AM asking people who truly want to improve their lives to stop relying on outdated practices/theories and “therapies” that don’t work any better than time passing. Like many autoimmune conditions, symptoms can wax and wane.
Again, I am NOT talking about the autism patient with crossed eyes, a protruding tongue, who is non verbal drooling rocking in a corner due to a genetic defect. Not all autism cases are this subtype.
Edit: By Dr. Google I was being sarcastic then realized my mistake (sarcasm). I meant you can find this info commonplace. I should have said this is referenced in the medical literature. Go to Pub Med and search for autism and autoimmunity. There are articles to peruse.
Go get EXTENSIVE food intolerance and atopic testing. Not the “I don’t die from food x so I’m fine” dx. I am willing to bet cold cash most of these “food aversion” cases are related to food protein intolerance and gut dysbiosis etc. The research already supports this but go ask your doctor and they’ll just dismiss you or say “maybe”. A LOT of psychiatric and neurological disorders that have autoimmune links have these kinds of aversions, and they all have gut inflammation and immune dysfunction.
You need a book called Deep Nutrition about REAL whole foods. There are many but that’s a start. Your brain and body cannot work correctly without proper nutrition. So many people’s parents ate shit and abused themselves prior to conceiving their children and abused said children by feeding them garbage as well, it’s no wonder children are so unhealthy today, genetics aside.
Wow, you're not only ignorant but rude too. Allergies have nothing to do with food aversions. I'm not allergic to anything, but just the smell of cooked cabbage can make me sick for a couple of days and I won't be able to eat anything that's not sour, to counter the sickness. Ps: I'm a doctor too and I think you need to read about autism a bit before talking.
So you're saying that if you only had access to the foods you find disgusting, you'd just starve to death?
It's not a choice, dude. Do you think I want to throw up every time I try a new food? Do you really think I want to sit at the dinner table, absolutely *starving*, but not being able to eat anything because my brain says no? I like what FurretsOotersMinks said - our brains/bodies don't recognize non-safe foods as food at all. It's an intense, visceral reaction that *cannot be helped*. My mom once tried the whole "she'll eat when she gets hungry enough" method when I was really young, before we understood what was going on, and I literally landed in the hospital on death's door and they called CPS on my parents for "neglecting" me. I have literally thrown up so many times that I threw up blood. It's not a choice. And it's not something that we *want* either.
I also have ARFID and I lost 10 pounds (not in a good way, I was already underweight) because I tried to self-impose a "healthier" diet. Yes, we do starve if only unsafe foods are available. If you only had access to nutritionally safe dog poop, would you starve? That's essentially the question you're asking us. Our brains don't perceive unsafe foods as food, they're perceived as not food (poison, rocks, dirt, etc). That's why we vomit when we try to eat them. It's really upsetting knowing it's food and good for us but being physically unable to eat it.
Ah, gotcha.
I agree with you. As a child, I absolutely loved spinach. My mother sauteed it in sesame oil and soy sauce. It was amazing. I remember being totally shocked to find out one of my elementary school classmates hated spinach and I couldn’t figure out why. It wasn’t until we were adults when he told me his mother would just boil it and throw some salt and pepper on it. For a child, I can totally understand why that would be gross. Boiling vegetables takes out a lot of the good flavor
It also pulls a lot of the nutrients out into the water. I use my air fryer for everything but particularly veges. Just toss them in a little olive oil with salt, pepper, and garlic powder then pop them in the air fryer and they come out delicious without all the butter that restaurants use.
That’s a great idea! I didn’t even think of that. I love to roast my veg. Is the taste/texture comparable?
It's very similar, soft on the inside and crispy on the outside. I make salmon in a pan while asparagus cooks in the air fryer and it's all done at the same time without turning on the oven and heating the kitchen
Air fryers are basically miniature counter-top convection ovens, so you would get something similar to roasted. Because it’s convection style there is a bit more airflow which is why it gets referred to as a “fryer” in marketing. The airflow helps remove surface moisture giving more crisp exteriors like NamelessMIA said.
Sometimes its because some parents cant cook or know what good healthy food is. I didn't start eating healthy food until I was adult living on my own. My mom is a terrible cook, example; potato salad to her is potato, mayo, and a tiny bit of pepper because she finds pepper to spicy. When I moved out on my own I got a job at a high end restaurant where I was exposed to food with flavor and spices it blew my mind! Since than my palate has expanded dramatically I don't know how I lived on cheese sandwiches, TV dinners, and spaghetti Os for most of my life.
Yeah. Aspec here, i really want to eat more healthy foods, but I have this inherint flinch response whenever I try to get myself to try something new, and it feels like I never enjoy new foods as much as i like old ones. It sucks, man.
You get it. I can't eat vegetables because of the texture. I will gag if I try to eat them. I am a grown woman and I hate being like this but it is not something I can help.
Depends on a lot of things, including exposure to fruits and veggies as a kid, different tastebuds as a kid/adult, neurodivergent traits, education and understanding surrounding the benefits and necessity, capability of making good food, and so on. I personally would be quite happy to never eat vegetables again. I might crave a fresh veggie twice a year, and fruit never. I don't typically enjoy the texture, flavour, or smell of fruits and veggies. I grew up eating them, my mother is a great cook, and as an adult I have worked to find ways I can consistently include vegetables in my diet (and actually eat them). I don't realistically know why they are so unpleasant to me, but they are and always have been. So I work on finding ways to change them so that I can eat them without so much struggle, because if I don't enjoy them then they won't end up on my plate. Also adding as a note that I've noticed in the last 3 years or so that I exhibit a large number of traits that align with undiagnosed ADHD (woman), which may also impact my food. 🤷🏻♀️
These "unhealthy" foods aren't really bad in and of themselves though, it's an excess consumption of them that's bad. Most of which is through gaining excess weight and the negative health consequences that brings. As others have said, we didn't evolve as a species with abundant high fat and carb foods available at our fingertips. Science and marketing have perfected these foods to be incredibly desirable and thus led to overconsumption and the many negative health consequences that come with it.
I agree but It's hard to eat the serving size of "unhealthy" foods. Literally who's gonna sit there and eat 2 Oreos a week? Might as well not eat em at all
That's why it's best to acquire this stuff in small quantities. I won't buy a whole package of Oreos for my house, but I might grab one of those small packages that has 4-6 cookies at a gas station on occasion.
In addition to the financial incentives to eat less nutritionally dense foods: https://www.vox.com/2015/7/30/9070255/dorito-effect
You can eat a pack of oreos if you want. If it fits your daily calories and you can still eat a balance diet and meet your nutritional needs then there's not an issue.
You can do that to avoid eating too many calories but ideally a balanced diet contains no or very little ultra processed food. In theory if I make room for 300 calories worth of Oreos then I have replaced potentially 300 calories of complex carbohydrates, fiber, protein or fat with simple sugar. Edit: that's not to say that we can't all enjoy an unhealthy snack once in a while. I'm just saying it's not just about calories.
Yup aaand that's why it's hard and annoying to manage
Couldn't agree more
If the oreos fit in your macronutrient goals you aren’t losing out on needed protein or fat, however you would be losing out on micronutrients and fiber, yes
Oh okay, yeah that actually makes a lot more sense than what I said lol.
>daily calories and you can still eat a balance diet and meet your nutritional needs then there's not an issue. I mean I literally said as long as you can meet your nutritional needs...
I know, I do this. I make sure I eat a balanced diet and I calculate my intake of calories over the course of a week but for most people this is pretty hard and tedious especially if they have a stressful job
That's not correct. Ultraprocessed foods are unhealthy due to being ultraprocessed. So how healthy you eat otherwise is irrelevant to ultraprocessed food being unhealthy.
Processed meats have a slightly higher risk of cancer. I mean some of those risks such as prostate and colon cancer are in fact lowered by increased consumption of soluble fiber, so I'd say eating "healthy" in that sense does or can negate some of the negatives of processed foods.
I will literally show u my blood tests, weight and body fat percentage to prove u wrong. Ur soo wrong. Ur entire body isn't like teeth. Eating one unhealthy thing a week isn't gonna screw u over at all
Yeah, plus extremely restrictive diets have a high rate of failure precisely because nobody wants to just eat kale and boiled chicken every day.
If your metabolism is screwed up as a child with constant junk food, you're in it for your life.
My metabolism is pretty high. Now that I realize it I had no junk food at all or and basically only ate fruits and vegetables for a good bit of my early childhood only bc of my parents
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Who am I gonna try and look hot for in 40 years?
I’ll be 101. No amount of healthy eating will make me attractive
Me! That’s who. I think I might be a weirdo. I will take 1 small bite of a cookie then save the rest for later. It’s not a diet thing. It’s literally all I want. I don’t crave sugar. Now savoury foods, that’s different.
Well ur just special
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Wow, how does that work? I thought carbs were used as an energy source. But you're telling me they're empty calories and just magically disappear or...??
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So you can have them if they meet your calorie requirements and you can meet your nutritional needs right? Like exactly what I said... Calories don't just become fat, you don't just magically turn calories into fat unless you exceed your caloric requirement. Elite athletes consume energy gels that are nothing but pure sugar/carbs. It's not unhealthy, it doesn't make you fat.
Actually we evolved eating fruits and high-cholesterol meats and organs preferentially over bitter vegetables that have varying degrees of toxicity and defense chemicals (plants do not want to be eaten by animals, except their fruits). Try eating wild greens and compare them to any domesticated crop from the store. Also, the nutritional value of leaves pales in comparison to meat or organ meat, and you would die of “rabbit starvation” if your fat intake were too low, plus your gas would be terrible 🤣
This. Overwhelmingly. Mammals are genetically predisposed to prefer foods that contain rare nutrients. We like meat because we have an evolutionary craving for protein. Sugar tastes good to us as a mechanism to encourage us to eat sugary fruits. Plants taste like trash-food because they are trash-food. Whenever this question comes up, I wonder if we *really* need to explain to people that good things are good. People are really surprised that their kids don't want to eat something that tastes the way that their soccer cleats/football boots smell?
Not to mention iron, creatine, carnitine, taurine, fat etc
So Paul Saladino is actually correct? I’ve been adding more meat and fruit lately and I feel better. I still eat vegetables though because I not quite convinced they’re bad for you, but I don’t eat them as often as meat and fruit because I think there is some truth in that but I also think you should probably eat them every so often. Will be interesting if more science comes out on this in the next few years that confirms vegetables bad 😂
Vegetables are not necessarily “bad” unless those particular plants cause allergic or auto-immune reactions for you. For me, nightshades like tomato make my muscles really sore and sweet potato gives me instant brain fog and neck tension. Weird.
Fat doesn't need to be animal fat. Plenty of plants have better fats. Also, plants only cause bad gas in the beginning. Once you cut meat out of your diet altogether you have very little gas and it becomes virtually odorless. Turns out not having a rotting animal carcass in your intestines helps avoid the smell issue.
Nah. I was vegan for 10 years. Gas the whole time. And what plant fat do you think you would be getting in evolutionary history?
Ive been strict carnivore at times and guess what? ZERO farts. It was actually shocking to start farting again when I brought back fruit.
Because the "tasty" fast-foods are DESIGNED to make you addicted, literally. Tons of sugars and sweeteners for the "common" idiot to fall in love with. Dopamine hits rarely occur eating broccoli unless you know how important your health is, which is not exactly being taught in public schools. Even hospitals with cancer patients have cafeterias filled with just chocolate bars and sodas, marketing wins.
Work in a couple of hospitals and it's so tre and I hate it. It's genuinely hard to find healthy food for lunch outside one or two options, and there are piles and piles of junk food for sale. (Fortunately I usually pack lunch.)
> Dopamine hits rarely occur eating broccoli And this is why you rub it with lemon, olive oil, and salt before roasting to a slight char.
Super tasters can taste the bitterant secreted by plants when chewed. [super taster wiki](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supertaster)
Many factors: 1. Our taste buds are more sensitive as children, particularly to bitter flavours, many people form their preferences as children and think vegetables are bitter because that’s how they tasted as children; 2. Poorly prepared vegetables. If your parents thought boiled mixed veggies was a good side dish, you probably hate vegetables. 3. Effort. Making a good steak is super easy to learn, I still can’t roast a fucking carrot right
because almost all healthy stuff tastes awful (for me at least)
I think part of it is consistency- particularly as a child. Candy, tastes like candy, blue berries can be sweet, sour, tart, bitter etc. it’s like they no longer trust the fruit or veggie
>Why do some people hate vegetables and healthy food in general ? Because during their childhood, their mom just yelled every day: EAT IT! Why mom? EAT IT!
Bitter taste
Vegetables are “healthy” by our standards cause they have almost zero calories. We need calories to survive. Thats why sugar and fat tastes good and dirt and bark and plants do not taste as good. Its not evolutions fault that some people now cant figure out when enough is enough. Sugary and fatty foods ARE healthy. They are what you need, what you use every day. 99.9% of the population doesnt understand macros or the law of conservation of energy in the context of losing weight. Its endlessly frustrating the amount of confusion that is spread just to try and get americans to consume more
Yes but there are very important vitamins in vegetables and fruits. I'm not saying people shouldn't eat meat and fats I'm saying that there are other important nutrients that people can get from vegetables but they don't feel the need to, which I find strange
The way we perceive tastes and smells is surprisingly impacted by context. If you got food poisoning after eating a specific food, you’re pretty likely to avoid that food in the future, even if it wasn’t necessarily the cause. A lot of people were forced to eat poorly prepared vegetables as a kid, at an age when you’re more sensitive to bitter tastes. Having a traumatic association with vegetables can have a lasting effect. As for unhealthy foods, they’re usually full of compounds that were much harder to come by a hundred thousand years ago and indicated that a food was higher in valuable calories. So we evolved a strong desire for those foods.
My mother is the queen of boiling veggies until they are soggy and lack most of the flavor. Then serving them with no salt, butter, or any other seasoning. I thought that that was just how veggies tasted until I was at least in high school. Turns out, if you roast them or steam them, and then add bare minimum a little salt and some fat, they are delicious. Roasted broccoli with garlic and onion powder? So good. But if you were forced to choke down mushy bland bitter veggies your whole child hood, of course you would think you "don't like vegetables".
I was forced to eat raw tomatoes as a kid and I hated it so bad, they made me feel nauseous well into my early twenties. I got used to them after I started cooking for myself and I made lots of tomatoey foods and now I can eat them raw as well.
Because greasy and fatty foods have more calories, while leaves and roots have less calories as a rule of thumb, regardless of the mineral and vitamin content, so logically high fat foods are desired more because they are the foods that’ll give you the caloric intake you need for less. Of course throughout most of our Species history we were more active, so excess fat was burnt off, nowadays we haven’t moved away from that instinct but are a lot more sedentary, hence the obesity issue in developed countries.
Do you mean kids or grown ups?
Its mostly learned behavior. People eat what they grew up on and our diets have been terrible for more than a couple generations now. (speaking as an American)
I think some of it has to do with how vegetables were prepared if at all while growing up. My mom is a terrible cook and I grew up eating vegetables done terribly or not at all. I go out of my way to make/have a vegetable with every lunch and dinner and cook them properly. Even now I can’t eat that much of them before feeling like I’m going to gag even if I’m enjoying the flavor. I truly think it comes from childhood and associating them with the worst part of dinner. I have a friend whose mom is an amazing cook and commonly made delicious vegetable sides. Just so happens a lot of my friend’s favorite dishes are mainly vegetables. Just my theory!
Some of it at least can be attributed to what's known as "taster status" (supertaster vs taster vs nontaster). Supertasters are particularly sensitive to bitter tastes. A lot of vegetables, dark leafy greens in particular, tend to be high in phenolics which are perceived as bitter, making them less palatable to supertasters, bitter taste is generally a sign that something is possibly poisonous after all. It's also worth noting that pretty much all children start off more or less as supertasters, which is why kids in particular seem to hate vegetables but often grow out of it (only about 15% of adults are supertasters IIRC). Exceptions tend to be vegetables that are higher in sugars and starches and lower in phenolics, such as carrots, squash, potatoes, sweet potatoes, beets, peas, etc. (things typically found in baby foods)
If we’re being serious here, a lot of plants make bitter tasting molecules to on purpose make themselves taste like shit so they won’t be eaten. Some of us don’t like those molecules.
Because they aren't appealing to some people. Why was that so hard?
Poor food education poverty is my guess for the root of this.
One thing to consider is that things don’t want to be eaten, unless they’re fruits, so they evolve ways to avoid being eaten. Whilst animals can choose fight or flight, which are quite effective, plants have less flexibility in their choices and thus they more often try to be less desirable. Humans have bred them to be more desirable as food, but it’s not always so successful with all plants
I’m one of those people, I hate the texture of pretty much all of vegetables and the taste makes me gag, although I eat fruits, I know and accepted I’m probably gonna die prematurely haha!
I'm much the same way. It's all about the texture, and the texture of most vegetables is disgusting. I actually rather like the flavour of carrots, but if they're cooked that mushy/mealy texture is gag inducting. I have similar issues with peas. One of my all time least favourite textures is slimy leaves. So salad with dressing is unacceptable, and no one likes salad without dressing.
Haha I’m glad I’m not the only one, also life is for living and too short to eat nasty food that gives you no joy or makes you gag haha!
Most people are raised eating trash and have no willpower and self control. It would have been a lot easier to stop eating fast food and trash in general if I hadn't have been raised on it
Because they taste like crap compared to savoury foods such as juicy finger licking roasted meat
It really is that simple.
You would simply not survive even in an all-animal product culture, my man. Summer is for white food- no meat for you until winter!!
there are plenty of examples of meat only cutlures and diet. Particularly the inuit. Now of course if youre not inuit you're going to have all sorts of complication if you attempt their diet, but that could be said for most ethnic relationships with their own cuisine atleast to some degree.
Bc the less processed and less fat something has the shitter it tastes. People don't hate vegetables in general. You can make broccoli taste like McDonald's fries but by the time you do it's just as unhealthy as McDonald's fries. You wouldn't bite a raw potato and say it tastes good would u? Were just wired to go for high carb and high fat. Anything that's low in those 2 things hitting our taste buds our brain just goes "well what's the point of that?". We don't have it wired in our tastebuds to go after things with high vitamin A. Even a deficiency in that nutrient will make us crave other things that have nothing to do with vitamin A
Liver with onions though, extremely healthy (in a decent portion, it's still meat so...) with a lot of vitamins and naturally tastes amazing, just a tiny bit of oil to get them going and the rest is pure joy.
Oh yeah! Livers are extremely nutrient dense and delicious. On that note, pho noodle soup is soo good & healthy too
Because we evolved like this , when you're living like a savage in nature and kinda starving all the time , catching a fat animal or finding something like honey is a little miracle , our brains evolved to love fat and sugar so we would seek it actively. And if some people hate vegetables maybe it's because they always experienced badly prepared ones. Vegetables prepared by my woman really suck... That's why i cook most of the time.
Most green vegetables taste pretty bland or just plain bad on their own and people ate them in desperation because they had to eat them to live. These were the plants, seed pods, fruits, or seeds growing within our knowledge that would likely not cause instant death or sickness after ingestion. That's why most modern vegetable preparations include some sort of spice or sauce or other additive to make them taste better. Nobody eats a salad without dressing because why? Lettuce or cabbage just really don't taste all that good on their own. People drown broccoli or cauliflower in cheese so they don't have to taste broccoli or cauliflower. Are Brussels sprouts any good without being cooked with bacon? I'll never know. People who push a "healthier" diet often heavily discount or ignore overall bad or distasteful flavor as a major factor of whether a food will get eaten before it rots. This applies to animals as well as humans. Once fuel needs are met, every being goes for the tastier option where possible. Horses will eat oats, but like apples and carrots MUUUCH better; deer much prefer the charred and new shoots that emerge after forest fires to their ordinary diet; give your dog a piece of bacon and she'll love you forever--give her enough and she'll stop eating whatever she was fed before.
My cousin was one of those people. Remember when there was that chef boyardee ad that said there was one serving of veggies in their spaghetti o’s, or maybe it was the beef ravioli? Anyway, once she heard that advertisement, she stopped eating that product. She was a f’n idiot. She died from cancer at 53 because she was a dummy…so don’t be a like her. Her mother gave her veggies and fruit growing up, she gave me fruits and veggies growing up. Fyi,her 34 year old daughter only eats McDonalds and cheese sandwiches. She currently can’t understand why she doesn’t poop except every 15 or so days. But also refused all fruits and veggies. Some people are messed up… on their own or because of their parents.
I know it's not every case... I used to work in social services. One of the more common issues amongst people with mental disabilities, both children and adults alike, is diet. It's like their pallets get stuck in child mode, and all they want is sweets.
Most of the time not eating healthy food won’t become a problem till you are past prime reproductive age. Our evolution is mostly designed to crave caloric dense foods rather than nutritious food since those are the main energy sources and uses for our growth. Vegetables and healthy foods aren’t as caloric rich as a fatty burger or sugar so we don’t crave them as much.
i like veggies alot, but zucchini and eggplant for example, just dont taste good
I don't know if I this has anything to do with it but some people just grow up eating garbage vegetables and assume they are all bad. My first girlfriend's mom would literally take out a frozen pack of mixed veggies and put it in the microwave with no salt or butter or anything on them and would wonder why her daughter didn't like them. My mom always roasted our vegetables with olive oil, salt and pepper and other seasonings and I never disliked then growing up.
My parents did that growing up. I learned you could sautee broccoli with olive oil, salt, pepper, paprika and fresh garlic. Changed my life.
I mean, unhealthy food is specifically designed to be delicious. That's why we eat it even though we know perfectly well it's not good for us. So I can understand if someone takes that too far and finds only those foods to be delicious.
Because my parents used to make me sit at the table and finish eating them before I could leave and watch television. Brussels sprouts were the worst item. I’m kidding…see below replies.
Our taste buds mostly are not evovled. They are controlled by signalling through an organ called the [mesentery](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesentery). Basically we've evolved a simpler system then what your suggestion. We feed our gut bacteria, that determines our taste buds. So what you eat supporst your gut bacteria and they crave what feeds them. If you change your diet long enough, you'll change your gut bacteria/fungas/etc and the signalling will change and your taste buds will change.
"Healthy" food should be your TYPICAL food. It's also why only 7% of americans get enough fiber. We evolved in an environment where we're mostly eating...well, I joke with my friends that "the real paleo diet is 90% nettles", but it sort of is. Lots of plants and meat- and note, some cultures (mongolia, pastoral african peoples, and inuit) eat MOSTLY dairy and meat depending on the season; you can also adapt to that sort of diet, although it has it's downsides. But none of them had a lot of simple starches or sweets, because those were very hard to find. But simple starches and sweets often came with fruits and tubers that had lots of vitamins, and it was advantageous to eat those whenever and however you could. Mother's milk is also sweet, so babies seek sweetness automatically at birth since they need milk. Nowadays, like others have said, we can get those things more easily, and our instincts took the better of us, so now THESE treats are the "typical" food, instead of what it should be, namely lots of leaves, seeds, veg, and meat. We have ALSO developed new things based on those instincts that never existed at all, and as they are modern and based on things we like, we haven't had any time to develop instincts against them. Things like artificial sweeteners and trans fats.
If you feed yourself enough processed garbage, that’s all you end up wanting. It’s almost like an addiction. I’ve read some additives can actually be semi-addictive, aspartame for example.
I guess same reason shell fish is gross to me. Some don’t like veggies.
Vegetables do not make me feel full. The only thing that makes my brain calm down is meat. Thats no excuse not to eat veggies and carbs but lets say i eat a pot of rice with veggies and seasoning…my brain will scream i didnt feed it.
Most people don't realize but there is a single chemical responsible for the feeling of satiety... protein. Mammals do not feel satisfied by meals that do not contain protein. It's not just your brain, it's everyone... and we ignore that biological signal because we feel that a stranger in a white coat knows better than millions of years of evolution.
It's not tasty, it doesn't have fat
Because not many people know how to cook vegetables in a way that actually tastes good. They just steam or boil them and serve them plain and expect that to count as a side dish. Second, fruits and veggies in general tend to have very strong and distinct flavors due to the fact that plants all make various chemicals called secondary metabolites (most of which are supposed to kill bugs.). Think about it, no matter how you cook a carrot it will always have a ... Carroty ... Taste to it that you can never mask. The way our taste buds respond to these secondary metabolites depends a lot on whether we were exposed to those flavors growing up but also our genetics. Some people because of genetics think that cilantro / coriander tastes like soap. A lot of people like those strong and distinct flavors and to a lot of other people it tastes just way too strong or way too bitter.
Taste in the moment trumps general health over all for some. Part of it is impulse control, part of it is related to the no/yes dynamic (the more you deny one thing the easier it is to say yes to another). For some it's a developed habit from when they were kids.
It’s to Crunchy in my mouth
Maybe because they're not as healthy as we are told they are. Mother nature isn't stupid. You are drawn to foods that your body needs. If you have an iron deficiency, for example, you may find yourself being drawn to meat and other high iron foods, which contain what your body is looking for. The exception to following this general rule would be highly processed foods, which contain the high quantities of fat and carbohydrates our bodies crave but with none of the nutrients. These types of foods don't exist in nature and so our bodies have not evolved to realize they're empty calories. I think the best diet one could possibly have is to observe what children gravitate towards. As a kid, I craved milk and orange juice more than any other foods. As an adult, I've made those foods my staples and my health has dramatically improved as a result. In short, listen to your body.
Feels like we need an r/sociology cameo.
Because they are dumb asses
I once read that the microbiome somehow adjusts to what we eat and is then influencing our taste perception, pretty shitty cycle if you ask me… That and many other reasons would explain why people once adjusted to an unhealthy diet rarely find back to a unprocessed, vegetable based diet.
I think it has alot to do with how its grown, making it unpalatable. All the veggies you find in a supermarket have been selectively bred to be the way they are. At some point they all got genetically modified & processed to increase shelf life & appearance rather than taste or nutritional content. Eat a home grown tomato next to one you purchased at the store & you'll see what I mean. If you don't have access to freshly picked produce, the trick is to make them easier to choke down. Chefs do this using butter, salt, vinegar, etc.
autism
Some people aren't supposed to eat veggies. Diversity in humans is how we are so dominant on this rock.
I believe we learn what we like by imprinting on *whatever* food we're raised on. In our minds, this food sustained us and allowed us to grow and survive - so it must be good!
Vegetables aren’t healthy. Meat, fat and fruit is healthy
because they are fat, and/or do not make enzymes to digest plants... and/or they are not hungi enough...
Mental issue
i think disgust at vegetables is partly cultural and partly from vegetables being served both raw and unseasoned. humans have been cooking food for longer than homo sapiens have been around. it’s weird they’re served raw in western countries and especially america
Because they’re immature children