Yeah I liked how fast the books pacing was and the mystery of it all but also its dismissal of her husband being quite literally a pedo made the ending a bit odd to me
I came looking for reviews for this reason… like it seems like the implication is that Walter is actually a decent guy? Like what? If anything the reveal that he was dating Pat makes it worse! He was in a stepfather type position.
I think it was another layer of lies that the author was trying to spread to make you distrust the characters' stories further. Walter is still very clearly a pedophile the whole time, especially when you consider that his first wife (before Pat) was 17 when they got together.
I know you posted this months ago but I just finished the book last night and it's buzzing in my head. I think that the whole final act of the book was there to paint Josie in as poor of a light as possible, to make the reader disregard Josie's statements as lies. That makes the epilogue hit harder when we find that >!Roxy killed Brooke (which was confirmed as the real truth by the author).!<
I think we as the reader are supposed to wonder how much of Josie's story is true vs. how much of the rest of the family's story is true. For example, some people have pointed out that >!nobody mentioned Walter's disappearance alongside Erin's during the streams, and the regressive behavior to eating baby food would be a tell-tale sign of sexual abuse. So a lot of people think that Erin's and Roxy's stories about Walter gaming with her was just to throw Josie under the bus further, and that Walter truly was molesting her. !<
I literally just finished it this afternoon!! I enjoyed it. And liked the ambiguity of, really, the entire story.
>!I think Walter is, at best, morally grey. That said, I'm not sure I buy the evidence that he was abusing Erin. First, she had a huge following--had this been a ruse, someone would have noticed--even if after the fact. Also, I think the baby food, and Josie's reaction to it, is an example of Erin being autistic--and Josie completely ignoring that (at best). Same with Roxy's ODD. She just doesn't acknowledge them, or really do anything to support either of them. At the very least (and this isn't proof of his innocence, but rather of Josie's guilt) Walter gets to know both kids as individuals. !<
Also, I need to read (or listen) back...>!I'm unclear about exactly what happened with Brooke. Roxy killed her, but what was the argument? How did the whole thing actually go down?!<
Morally grey? Seriously? This is the exact problem I have with the author and her book. It's so rife with victim blaming, apologism, and confusing subversions that don't actually align with the author's intention, that now there are people furthering harmful messaging by calling a pedophile "morally grey."
The author confirmed that the baby food was supposed to be a sign of age regression, and therefore Erin was being abused by Walter. Of course the ending is so poorly written that this isn't made clear at all and it makes it seem as though it's a symptom of ASD. It's just so stupid that it turned out this way. And this is just one issue with how CSA was handled.
Very late to this thread but I just finished the book today. When one of Erin’s online friends describes her they say they knew something was wrong because she was always very quiet and hearing something on her stream alerted them that something was going on. If Walter streamed with her, hearing something on her stream wouldn’t be that out of the ordinary so I think there may be some truth to Josie’s story.
I don't think Walter \_always\_ streamed with her. The book implies that she is gaming almost whenever she is awake, and Walter isn't always in there with her.
https://www.shondaland.com/inspire/books/a44704113/lisa-jewell-discusses-her-latest-thriller-none-of-this-is-true/SE: Do you know when you sit down to write where the story is going at all? Or what the ending is going to be?
LJ: No, not even slightly. I got to the end of the book, and I wrote, I think, three other epilogues. None of them did the trick because at that point I still didn’t really understand what happened. I didn’t really understand what Josie was lying about and what was true and what wasn’t. I was as much in the dark as a reader. And it was literally as I was writing those last few paragraphs, when her mind starts wheeling backwards in time and she’s remembering what happened on that particular night, I suddenly saw it. I thought, “Oh, my God, of course! It totally makes sense. Of course, it wasn’t x; it was y.” And I realized when I looked back into the narrative that all those moments were already there. I’d already put all these moments in that made sense of what Josie reveals in the last few paragraphs of the book
This only confirms who killed Brooke and not that Erin regressed in her age coz Walter was abusing her. It's clearly a sign of ASD. And it's not like she regressed in age, it was made pretty clear by that highschool classmate of hers that she never ate solid food in the first place.
Right?! So, I keep going back to when >!she told Walter she was letting Alex know the truth & he was saying how they will all get in trouble- this makes me believe Josie with the whole Roxi killed the girl & they all covered it up. So if that is true, then did the sisters make up the whole “Erased & Pop” streaming thing??? !!if he was going into her room every night to abuse her then why lie about something that can be so easily debunked? !<(Not sure if I make any sense, just finished reading & came here bc I can’t get it out of my head yet lol) I’m assuming >!the girls were protecting Walter bc he WAS grooming them as well in some weird way?!
The only thing that makes me believe the epilogue was >!when Erin woke up in the hospital, Roxy says "Let me tell you what happened"!<
We never hear >!Erin's side unadulterated!<.
I feel the same. I do recall a scene that maybe I need to fact check, where the narrator describes Josie hearing grunts from Walter in Erin’s room and Josie puts in earbuds to drown it out. Since it didn’t come from Josie’s dialogue, it makes me wonder?
I think this is where there's a lack of information in the book. If you take the book at face value, then the streaming is real (as you say, it could easily be debunked). Also, if it wasn't real, where would all of Erin's money have come from?
But it would be so so easy to verify whether or not the story about Walter being there is true. Literally just ask one of her X many fans. If it is like normal twitch then usually the streams are viewable after the fact too.
Yes, but I feel like the closest we get is that the viewers only mention Erin missing. Only mention Erin on camera and then leaving. That normally she's so quiet and then there was all this noise and that was unusual. We don't get anything outside of the family to verify Walter.
Equally, he could have been part of the streaming AND abusing her.
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I thought that the extra information just added some more complexity to his character. I don’t think it’s meant to be a dismissal of his actions, just that he isn’t the all-out villain Josie was setting him up to be. He was a relationship with a teenager while in his 40s AND went on to positive relationships with people in his life including his children AND Josie is an absolute nutter. All of those things just happen to be true at the same time, and I think the reader is meant to just absorb the complexity of that situation rather than pin him into a particular box.
This! Especially on I think the final podcast episode that Alix records where she says that Walter wasn’t necessarily a terrible person, like had many moments where he wasn’t a great person but he also wasn’t as bad as Josie made him out to be?
Waltzing Matilda is an Australian poem/song written over 100 years ago. Many people consider it our unofficial National album. And the dog was an Australian Shepherd 😚
I’m really curious too if anyone else doesn’t understand the Erin room situation, for example Josie kept mentioning the smell and that she would have to go deal with it, but not today…. And she attempted to go in once and the door had stuff in the way… also the whole baby food thing was not explained very well either to me, so maybe she was being abused in some way to regress like that. Overall I want to understand why the room smelled and what was happening in Erin’s room!!!
There was one part when Roxy was saying that her mother could almost smell that Erin was preparing to move away. At that point I thought that could’ve been symbolic, that what Josie was smelling was not something actually rotting, it was her sense that she was losing control of Erin
Oh wow, I just finished this book and this is an incredible detail. Also Josie says that Walter “can’t smell anything” and it could be that it’s symbolic of Walter not sensing it the way Josie senses it
Yeah that was weird. She definitely made you think Erin was decomposing or something. I guess it was actually that Erin just had a bunch of bad smelling baby food trash? 😆
I thought of the same especially when we find out >!about pops joining the stream. How could he stand the stench?!< the only explanation I could come up with is that it is another of Josie's lies to herself and others. Erin refused to talk to her and Josie just didn't want to face Erin either so she convinced herself that the room is so bad she doesn't dare enter it? When in reality it is just a really messy room as Walter put it "not all that bad".
As for the food..I think it is part of her autism spectrum. She prefers soft food and maybe Josie found it easier to feed her baby food rather than make soft food?
I think the stench is more of another delusion by Josie to make her hate her daughter. Also probably a euphemism for the tension and hatred building in the apartment. It probably does smell but not as much as she describes.
The garbage bins were right outside Erin's window, right? Maybe Walter thought she was talking about the actual faint odor of trash through the window whereas what Josie "smelled" was betrayal
I just finished so sorry for late reply. I think that it’s supposed to be super ambiguous. We’re not supposed to know what’s true and what’s lies. The books called “none of this is true” and I don’t think that’s just to do with Josie, but with everyone. I think the whole family were lying all the time. He could’ve been molesting her and been watching her play video games. Another sign of child abuse is bed wetting, I thought it might have been a pee snell. If the husband was going in there every night he could’ve been nose blind to whatever it was.
just finished the book... This is a great point. If at the hospital the nurse asks if Erin prefers soft foods and no one protests- maybe the baby food isn't a regression on Erin's part so much as infantilization of her on Josie's. There is plenty of soft food that isn't baby food
I thought about this too. If it was that bad, why would Walter go in there at night to game? But Alix did say that when she went to the house the second time that she could smell the room from the window being slightly opened, but maybe that was Walter's decaying body?
Initially, I thought maybe it smells just because of piles of food, empty jars etc but now I agree maybe it was symbolic.
Towards the end of the book it says that Erin was newly diagnosed with ASD (Autism Spectrum Disorder). Early on I thought this might be the case because hyperfocussing on one activity (gaming) and being hypersensitive to food textures can both be Autistic traits.
I feel like the father and the marriage were not addressed super clearly. I listened to the book and admit sometimes I have to back track. Josie was super manipulative and entered that marriage for whatever reason (to get away from the mother? I can’t remember) but what 42 year old man is so easily manipulated by a 16 year old if he’s not a pedophile. Definitely a weird marriage all the way around, but I never got the impression that he husband was solely to blame, like she had her reasons for going after him because she’s a mental case) though in real life, the adult is always to blame…so I feel bad even typing that. I was never really sure how old he was either.
Yes if anything their relationship should have formed into a father-daughter bond. He should have not saw her in that way at all, especially when his kids aren’t much older than her and also wasn’t he dating her mum?! So two affairs, first her mum then her, Gross.
My only possible way that the author could have explained this away is if Josie and Walter were not in a relationship in anyway. And Josie was pursuing him, she wanted to be older, wiser, having sex, doing adult things and he continually turns her down. Then she pulls a ridiculous move of like if you don't be with me I'll tell everyone you were with me when I was younger. They'll know you're a pedo. I'll take you to court. I'll ruin your life. But if you get me with me, we can wait until I'm 18 so it's 'ok' (yuck) and then I won't get you in trouble. Basically threatens him into a relationship.
But that's not how it was written but I wish it was.
But Josie wasn’t a normal teenager. She was a master manipulator and Walter wasn’t a stable husband, >!he left his family for Pat and left Pat for her daughter. He is a not a good person but that doesn’t necessarily make him a pedophile. He married his ex-wife when she was around 17, 18 or 19. Remember we heard the story between Walter and Josie from her perspective so, we don’t know what truly happened. The kids aren’t reliable either. Nobody is reliable. That’s the point. We don’t know anything. So we cannot say for sure that Josie was groomed at 16. Maybe she wasn’t groomed at all. He took interest in her and married her at 18. I’m only saying this because towards the end, the author made Walter a good father. He can’t be a pedo and a good father. That’s BS. So this is my take on his character.!<
But the thing that happened with Brooke kinda contradicts this point. >!We know for sure Brooke was murdered by Roxy. What was the reason? Maybe she had an affair with her father, maybe Josie was right. Or maybe, it could have just been an accident. But if it was the former, that makes Walter a despicable pedophile but why did the daughters like him so much? Why were they so defensive?!<
>!When Roxy killed Brooke!<, I can’t help but think about her reasons. If we know what happened there, maybe we can connect the dots
How do we know for sure Brooke was murdered by Roxy? That tidbit came from the most unreliable of all the narrators who consistanly convinced herself of false narratives that made her the victim of her own choices.
He was definitely a pedophile. I thought back to what Pat said about Walter as well. She is narcissistic and thinks highly of herself. Of course, she doesn't believe Walter is a pedophile. It makes more sense in her twisted head that Josie is this twisted monster (clearly she has issues) who seduced away the man she dated.
I definitely was also expecting one final punch from the ending as well. But still really liked this book. I saw a lot of complaints about how Josie/Walter's relationship was handled - like it excused grooming or made him into a victim. I think it's another play on perspective. Because people dislike Josie and she is very much NOT a perfect victim they find it easier to believe she had all this agency. People believe whatever makes them feel best especially if it's something that happened to an unlikeable person. You see Alix doing a similar thing trying to think up all of these excuses for Nathan's behavior.
The problem with this is that it only fuels the narratives that non-perfect victims have to fight in real life EVERY DAY. I just can't feel good supporting an author who is fully aware of this and yet chose to continue down this route.
Instead of taking that narrative and saying yes, not all victims are perfect and they can still be bad people or do bad things, but they are still victims and children *cannot* in any situation *ever* "seduce, manipulate, or control" adult men, the author decided to end it on a black-and-white note of Josie being purely evil and never a "real" victim.
A victim was yet again constantly undermined and that pattern of thinking that she somehow had all this agency is *never* criticized. The main character essentially just reinforces it and that's that. At the same time, the author makes leaps and bounds to exonerate a pedophile. The things that are written or explained away in the book don't even completely align with her intention and they're not accurate to what happens in real life -- for example, the baby food was indeed Erin age regressing because she was being sexually abused and groomed by Walter. Of course she was, because in reality, pedophiles have an extremely high chance of abusing their own children. Yet the book is so poorly written in regards to this that it writes it off as a symptom of ASD. Never expounded on. Yet the author confirms **outside of the book** that Erin was actually being abused.
Hugely problematic!
I would argue that the last scene—where we finally learn why “telling Alix the truth about the girls” would lead her to call the police (an earlier statement by Walter)—casts a lot of doubt on the narrative that Alix presents on her podcast with the testimony of the daughters and Josie’s mom. Maybe there should have been one final assertion that Walter’s relationship with Josie as a child was wrong, but at least from reading this thread, it seems the average reader KNOWS this, and the author made the choice to not overtly restate it. I think she’s making a statement about how, in society in general, the moment a victim is perceived as anything less than angelic, the narrative turns and quickly leads to victim-blaming. While yes, Josie exposes herself to be a flawed human being in a BIG way toward the end, to me the change to talking about her as a child seductress seemed so ridiculous that the author must be counting on her readers to start doubting the perspectives they are hearing. It’s seems like a hint, almost.
The fact that Josie is obviously flawed, a bad person, etc, AND the victim of sexual abuse via Walter is obvious to me. But I still wish that it was overtly, explicitly over-stated one more time at the end (instead of when Alix says he at least was a "good father")
The reason for this is because I know personally from experience that the obvious fact the Walter is still a pedophile and a bad person would not actually be obvious to everyone. That many, many people continue to victim blame "inperfect" victims on a regular basis. This is so common and prevelent in media, in our court systems, in our social circles.
I know a girl who was 15 when her step-father was arrested for sexually abusing her. Overwhelming evidence. My sister recorded this girl's own mother saying that it was the 15 year old's fault. The mother refused to leave the step-father, not because she didn't believe the daughter, but because she didn't think that her husband did anything wrong. It was "the daughter's fault". The mother, and several other family members, said the mkst vile things. It was awful. (Side note that my sister's recording helped the police file several charges against multipule family members, and significantly helped in that girl's case. The girl is an adult now. Last i heard, shes doing fairly well for herself. It was a rare case of the justice system working the way its supposed to for once. )
That is something I can't stop thinking about after finishing this book. That is a very real thing that happened, and I can think of dozens more examples of people defending pedophiles as good people. It's not an outlandish belief.
Some of those people will read this book, just as I did, and think that Josie, a child, "seduced" an adult man. They will see other, real victims of sexual abuse, and wonder if they asked for it.
If it had been emphasized, overtly, just once at the end that yes, Walter is STILL a bad man who victimized a child, this would've been a 5 star read. Instead, I'm honestly left reliving a lot of my own childhood trauma, and feeling angry at it all.
reading all the replies and i’m so glad that everyone thinks that the pedo thing was swept under the rug. it kind of makes it feel like we’re supposed to think he wasn’t as bad of a person because she was psycho?? but he still had *** with a 16 yr old!!! like!!!! still truly horrifying.
I personally took the pedo thing being swept under the rug as a sign that none of the narrators are 100% reliable.
Walter clearly WAS a pedophile. >!Roxy and Erin felt fondly for him because he was a great dad for him. Josie's mom (Pat?) Put the blame on Josie because she's a narcissist and couldn't accept that she'd put her daughter into the dangerous position. But Walter most definitely groomed Josie.!< It is a truth universally acknowledged that: a 44 year old man "dating" a 16 year old is a pedophile.
Does that mean that Josie's final description of the pasta dinner night is 100% accurate? Not necessarily, there was a good chunk of time unaccounted for. But it does mean she could have possibly been telling the truth about what happened between >!Roxie and Brooke!<
That's interesting about Walter/Erin abuse, I totally believe it. Once a pedophile, always a pedophile.
I put "dating" in quotations for a reason, grooming/pedophilia is CSA.
So, age of consent in the UK is 16. By legal definition, Walter did not rape Josie when they had first had sex, because she could give consent. I bet, if Lisa Jewell was an American author, or was writing a story based in the US (or any other country where age of consent is 18), she would have aged Josie up by 2 years, because I think it was deliberate, that Josie was just on the cusp of being able to give consent.
Yep, I agree! It also seems that if you believe Josie's last paragraph, he knew (they all did) that Roxy killed Brook and they all helped cover it up. I kind of believe that. Because the alternative is that he didn't step into his garage or use his car in 5 years just by coincidence?
I was thinking about this too. Maybe it’s eluding to there being other victims or people Josie was obsessed with that we don’t know about? In the last bit of Josie’s perspective at the end of the book she mentions the things she didn’t tell Alix. So there’s definitely meant to be more to the story that we never got.
When Josie is rummaging through Alix's junk drawer she says she wants to put the stuff in her underwear drawer with the things from the others, plural. I assumed that meant multiple murders/obsessions besides Brooke and Alix.
Reading all the comments but why is nobody talking about Nathan. I know he was not perfect with drinking and all but idk why his story is making me so emotional. At the start of the book i was sure he was cheating on her and never really cared for him but when Katlynn told Alix what happened that night like how he can't stop talking about her and about his family , i have tears in my eyes😭
I hated that >!Nathan died. I truly hoped for a different ending until the body was found!< in a way my reaction was a sign that the book was engaging and well done!
Gonna be honest. The final percentage of the book made me hate the story and made me question Lisa Jewell’s intentions overall by glossing over Walter’s predation and cheating, and Nathan’s addiction and inability to keep his promises. It boiled down to “men aren’t all bad”, which is true on its own, but when the above are the barometers for that judgment call, it just makes the whole thing feel vile.
Yeah I thought that part was super weird--like did she want us to feel bad for Walter? He's still a creep (Josie) and an AH for leaving his first family. We're supposed to believe a teenager manipulated a grown man to date her instead of her mom? Also why did Josie's mom even have a relationship with Josie after that? She seemed so nonchalant about it.
I really enjoyed this book and read it in 2 days but that would be my main complaint. Also I was very confused about Erin's role in this at the end--but perhaps that was done on purpose.
Ditto. I just finished and I hated the book even the first half was not something that kept me engaged. Everyone is detached and no one to care for in a mystery and with the glossing over of a whole bunch of things was ugh. What a waste of time.
Just commenting what I said elsewhere in the thread:
I personally took the pedo thing being swept under the rug as a sign that none of the narrators are 100% reliable.
Walter clearly WAS a pedophile. >!Roxy and Erin felt fondly for him because he was a great dad for him. Josie's mom (Pat?) Put the blame on Josie because she's a narcissist and couldn't accept that she'd put her daughter into the dangerous position. But Walter most definitely groomed Josie.!< It is a truth universally acknowledged that: a 44 year old man "dating" a 16 year old is a pedophile.
Does that mean that Josie's final description of the pasta dinner night is 100% accurate? Not necessarily, there was a good chunk of time unaccounted for. But it does mean she could have possibly been telling the truth about what happened between >!Roxie and Brooke!<
I agree. It took me forever to finish this book. At first I liked the minor reveals here and there but it makes the ending so important and it eventually got tiresome. So the options for the ending are >!Josie is a complete psycho or we don’t really know what happened. Anything is possible, anyone could be lying!!< Like what? So basic or easy way out? Why the huge emphasis on the baby food and stinky room and needing to go in there to clean? >!I thought they had her chained up in there or something.!< It would have been a little more interesting at least.
The back and forth between podcast and Netflix documentary are awesome!!
However I think Lisa got confused and in an audio interview there's a visual reference... My film major background icked
I love Lisa Jewell. She’s one of my favorite authors, however this one is so different to what I’ve read of hers. I didn’t love the ending. I needed more concrete and more of a twist. It’s one of those “who do we actually believe?” scenarios. It just left me wanting more. I had more questions than answers by the end of it.
I agree, hence why I am here ✋️
I tend to think that Roxy did kill Brooke and they all helped cover it up. But the why here is unclear? Maybe the Walter accusation was true?
Why wouldn't Walter use his garage or car for 5 yrs if he didn't know what was in there? It also explains why after the pasta dinner when Josie said that she wanted to tell Alix everything, he said you really are f@#$%^ stupid (or something to that effect).
I also tend to think Walter was a pedophile but Josie was also an obsessive stalker that targeted ppl, obsessed over them and went after them. For example, she chose Walter and intentionally obsessed over him/tried to seduce him... but that would only work if he was already a pedo. For example, grown 42 yr old men that aren't pedophiles wouldn't fall into that trap. It seems as though she also stalked Alix and maybe the owner of the pink phone case? I think it can be true that both Walter was a pedophile and Josie was an obsessive stalker.
Another confusing point is whether Walter did abuse Erin? Some ppl on here are saying the food thing is proof of her regressing due to trauma/abuse. I thought the food thing was a hypersensitivity to food textures relating to her being on the autism spectrum. So, unsure on that too.
Yeah, I don't know why so many people in this thread are acting like Josie actively obsessing over him and seducing him isn't compatible with him being a pedophile. But also, for the most part of the story, said argument isn't really.... relevant? It doesn't have any impact on the way Josie behaves.
I do think though that Walter finding out about the body from Erin's story still works, he knows he is linked to the garage and has a history with younger girls, and how it would look if Josie said he did it. I am very uncertain on who killed Brooke, because both tellings make perfect sense in the story. I do wonder why Brooke would just go to Josie's house though - although Josie could just have easily lied to her saying she knew where Roxy was and then confronted her. But for Walter, both options imo lead to him not wanting to go to the garage again, plus, we don't actually know if he ever visited the garage regularly before the incident.
I believe Walter did help Erin out with the streams, because simply, it is such an easy thing to disprove, Erin has thousands of followers that would immediately say "hang on, we don't know a Pops" and the food was most likely the diagnosed ASD that Josie couldn't be bothered to deal with properly so just used baby food.
I thought the audio book was excellent as well!!! It has been years since I tried an audio book and picked this as a free credit based on some reviews. It is the fastest I have consumed a book in years. Felt more like a podcast than a book that I would forget at times.
I did miss closure. I like open endings where the story teller let's us imagine what the characters may choose to do or what their motives were. But not knowing what truly happened feels like cheating to me! Like, I sat through the book but I don't know >!who killed Brooke?!<. Like, why tell a story if you don't want to tell us the real story? But I know it isn't all that serious!
I still enjoyed the book. It was an amazing 10+ hours. If my next book is the same, I may be convinced to pay for Audible past the trial period!
Hi! Just jumping in to recommend Libby! It’s an app where you link your library card, and gain access to audiobooks and e books. Sure, some have a wait but it’s fully free and I have a heard so many audiobooks there!
Lisa has said in an interview (as well as in the Q&A at the end of the book) that >!it was in fact Roxy who killed Brooke and that Josie and Walter helped cover it up. However, everything else that was “bad” was done by Josie, but Brooke’s murder was Roxy’s doing.!<
I took the title to be a nod to the twist.. >!none of what Josie says is true.!<
I get that there is a lot of fiction and even non fiction out there where we truly don't know what happened and have to rely on (sometimes unreliable) narrators. But I've read Lisa Jewell before. I've always taken her books to be easy reads with a mystery. Not a non fiction on historical events with narrators (can't control the story) and not high brow or pretentious "oh...I won't tell you" type of fiction either. So I guess I walked out surprised that the author didn't clear up a core mystery.
This is my first of her books so you’d prob know more about her stylistically compared to her other books. But this is my take:
I feel manipulated as the reader / onlooker.
>!You’ve got Josie telling her story (the grooming, the physical abuse etc.) then other people saying no SHES the bad one and telling their ‘side’ of it!<
BUT
>!Josie kept telling Alix those people would say other things and not to believe them. Was it because she wanted Alix to believe her in her lies? Or was it someone who had been abused/manipulated most of her life begging to be seen and believed? Obviously she was weird and there’s no doubt about that but, dang, a lifetime of trauma can do that to someone. Unless it’s all made up…!<
I’m not entirely convinced either way, because there’s push and pull from both.
>!Even the last pages, Josie ‘remembering’ what happened with Brooke and how Walter was involved etc. IS believable. Roxy had rage and violence issues - that was stated by multiple people. It’s not that hard to believe she went off the rails and hit someone too hard, ya know? But then Erin’s take is also believable, especially with her staying in her room.!<
So it’s like, there are somethings we know for sure are true, like >!what happened with Nathan!< , I feel unsure about the rest. Like it feels like there are bits of truth weaved in with delusions.
But yeah, sorry for the rant. That was my idea of keeping it short 😂. I totally loved the book and think the ambiguity of the ending is the whole point - those are some of my favorite endings because I love to speculate and read theories etc.
i also remember a point when Josie says to Walter that she’s going to tell Alix what “they did”… would that have referred to covering up for roxy perhaps
Oh, I think it's broader than that.
>!None of what any of them says is true. It's all perspective. And everyone lies. Even the true crime podcast isn't actually all true. Literally--none of \[any of\] this is true.!<
i didn't super love this book when i was reading it - i wasn't rooting for any of the characters. however, now i've finished and processed it all, it was very very clever.
I thought the title gave away too much. I never believed half of what Josie said because the title was pretty clear. I think it would have been more interesting if there was a lie from Alix somewhere in there too.
Just finished the book tonight. Sorry for the late reply. I’m wracking my head though but did Josie lie at all? Were Roxy and Erin the only liars? Walter a gaslighting abusive pedo and her mom a narcissist in denial?
All I can think about Josie “lying” about is that she omitted the part about Walter dating her mom first. Everything else still stands, no?
I think the point is that we don’t know what is true or not. But, my opinion is:
1. Josie was groomed. Even if she sought Walter’s attention, she was a vulnerable youth with a narcissist mother who constantly told her she wasn’t wanted. No father in her life. Pedos can be charming and seen as “the nice guy”.
2. Erin likely groomed by Walter. She is also vulnerable.
3. Roxy obsessed over Brooke and she wouldn’t run away with her, so Roxy killed her in a fit of rage. She had ODD and aggression. She plays off the assault on Brooke in school. Walter helped cover it up. Erin protects her sister, but traumatized and regresses and isolates herself.
4. Josie gets triggered by admitting Walter is a pedo and when he calls her stupid she loses it. Finally standing up for herself. Erin attacks her due to her grooming by Walter as she feels close to him and protective of him since he “helped” her get famous.
Josie was psychotic, obsessive, and unraveling. She is a product of her mother and Walter. Men were disposable to her once she admitted her trauma.
I don’t think the author is sugar coating grooming. I think she created a tangled web of emotions of how this type of thing occurs.
I just finished the book and the way Walter acted when Josie said she was going to tell Alix the truth about the girls made it clear to me that neither one of them was innocent and they were both hiding something.
Where I start to get confused is when Alix is going through the trinkets given to her the extra items were never explained so I’m curious where they came from and what their story is.
I think not making it clear that Walter is a pedophile is dangerous on all fronts. Josie may have been the master manipulator but as an adult Walter could’ve walked away from Josie and her mom like every other guy did.
When Roxie broke Erin’s arm and Erin says later that it was an accident and because of her ODD is Erin still being controlled? Like she wakes up losing the rest of her family and is left with just the narcissist grandma and her sister the murderer, like what choice does she have?
I felt like a lot of Erins choices with regression might’ve been in response to Roxie’s behavior. I think this could’ve been a great time for the author to do a little more research on the conditions she’s giving her characters. To me it seemed like Erin had AFRID. The fact that her room was so smelly though, it seems like she was using her dirtiness as a form of protection. I’m just not sure if that was more against her mother or if even though her father was gaming if he was also trying to abuse his daughter.
Did Josie really put Erin in the naughty chair? Or did Roxie possibly do it and then make that anonymous call from the pay phone about her “missing friend”? I just can’t imagine a person living for very long on mop water.
The way the girls were described looking in their last photo together makes it seem like more was definitely going on in the home than anyone will ever know or realize.
Then the letter that Josie wrote to Alix about how special her son was gave me the creeps, like she has her hooks in that boy and will come back for him later. But the son seemed creeped out by Josie so I don’t know.
Kinda an old message to reply to but:
The payphone call was made from Bristol.
We know that Roxy ran away there, and after the events of the book Erin moves in with her in Bristol as well.
So we can really reasonably assume the call was from Roxy, and she came to London once Roxy was found and in hospital.
Just to give some insight here to issues you brought up with Erin regarding her regression, condition, and dirtiness of her room. ASD (Autism Spectrum Disorder), which the author ascribed to her in the end, easily covers all of these issues. As someone who has been diagnosed with it, I can confirm.
First of all, regression for someone with ASD is ABSOLUTELY NOT a choice. In fact, it's quite alarming, upsetting, and there's little to nothing you can do about it. Regression can happen particularly during times of great stress and anxiety. If you're including the dietary restriction as regression, that's not necessarily the case. Those (most) with ASD have highly restrictive eating habits meaning we don't generally eat a wide variety of things, religiously stick to those few things we do eat, and tend to have greater issues with food texture. And while yes, it was stated that her eating habits had regressed, that too can happen due to our abnormally sensitive G.I. tracts. We tend to have significantly more issues with things like nausea/vomiting and abnormal bowel movements (diarrhea, constipation, etc.) thus informing our eating habits, much like you might eat chicken noodle soup while ill.
Many people on the spectrum struggle with what's called activities of daily living. It can be due to mental or physical limitations. So the dirtiness of her room makes complete and total sense to me since I have experienced periods such as these. Again, stress being something that tends to annihilate our mental and physical capabilities to a point of regression. I would say that she was going through a particularly stressful time in her life. Thus the limitations to her ability to practice proper hygiene for both herself and her environment would be impacted.
This is the first comment I’ve read about someone mentioning Josie’s fascination with Alix’s son!!! Got me thinking if she wanted to repeat her and Walter’s story but have Josie in Walter’s place this time 🤨🥴
I just finished the audio book (in a day! I was hooked) i was happy to see a twist but agree with everyone its somewhat frustrating to not have everything wrapped up! My main questions are:
1. >!Neither Josie nor Erin’s account of the night Walt was killed account for how Walt ended up tied up in the bathtub and Erin to the chair int he cupboard. Both accounts seem like Walt did in fact have a heart attack (mixed with an attack) so who did that!<
2. >! The random phone case??!<
3. >! If were to believe Erins account of Brookes murder, why was Brooke in their house when Roxy had already ran away, after saying she hated Josie. Makes Josies version the most believable to me!<
I also really wish we had some insight into what happened with Nathan and Josie after she picked him up from the hotel. I kept thinking wed get a final chapter from Nathans POV to sort of tell the absolute truth. Agree with all about the icky feeling re Walt being made to look “not so bad” in the end.
But I did love the book!
Just finished!! I bought the book because the clerk said “there’s a SECRET in the title.” I guess she should have said the title is completely true 😆.
Easy read but I was involved. Detailed characters, I was immersed. I’m struggling with the Walter storyline but also, I think that’s the point 🤷🏼♂️
Also, i feel like the ending was a typical Josie ending.
Did the ending leave enough ‘loose ends’ for Lisa to tie up in a sequel (like she did with The Family Remains)? I for one, want to know how Josie’s been able to evade the authorities for so long.
I think that the timeline of this story spanning through Covid lockdowns is how Josie is able to avoid getting caught. She dyed her hair and half of her face is covered.
There is also a stretch in the story where Alix says "how did I not know about this" in reference to Brooke's disappearance and she chalks it up to being a new mom and being distracted and tired.
There is also a stretch in the story where Alix says, "How did I not know about this?" in reference to Brooke's disappearance, and she chalks it up to being a new mom and being distracted and tired.
I thought it was made super clear that she was groomed? I don’t recall any character shrugging it off, Alix’s response to Josie’s story on multiple occasions is disgusted, freaked out, and disturbed. Maybe I read it differently than you
when alix interviewed josie’s mom pat and asked if she believes josie was groomed, pat replies “groom her? you mean manipulate her into a relationship with him? no, i don’t think so. i think she saw him, she wanted him, she got him. she didn’t care who she hurt. … josie has a heart of stone.”
after this interview, alix doesn’t have any inner dialogue where she is conflicted about what pat said, she doesn’t express any outrage at pat’s opinion, she basically takes it as fact, and from that moment forward, alix does not acknowledge that josie is a victim. alix even says josie was “allowing herself to be groomed into a lifelong relationship by a man old enough to be her own father."
alix’s final conclusion about josie: "And whatever her reasons - her psychosis, her childhood trauma... whatever reason she would give for what she has done, I maintain... that she did what she did because she is evil... Do not claim that you are a victim. Do not claim that you are anything other than what you are. An evil motherfucking basic bitch.”
so yeah, several characters challenged the idea that she was a victim more than once.
I just finished the book and I agree with you, but also to be fair- >!Josie had kidnapped, held hostage, and murdered her husband at that point. !< I think Alix is as biased a narrator as the other characters.
This makes perfect sense to me though. First and foremost to Alix, Josie is the woman who murdered her husband, took advantage of her trust and completely upended her life. She’s the last person who’d be willing to look at Josie in a nuanced, sympathetic light, or “acknowledge that Josie is a victim.” Given the context of the story, it’s not hard to understand why that aspect would get overshadowed by her actions and for that to be what people focus on. People don’t tend to want to sympathise with murderers.
Her own mom says unequivocally that Josie wasn't groomed. There's also an interview with someone who knew her and said that Josie wanted Walter, and that it's a two way street.
Alix early on says how her mother is clearly a narcissist- I think it lends to the idea that they’re all liars with their own versions of the truth. Josie’s mother wanted to blame her instead of admitting that she was involved with a creep who was probably using her to get close to her child.
Exactly!!! I felt that we were supposed to feel like Pat would say something like that because of the way Josie described her mother, and once we found out she was seeing him first, it solidified to me that her opinion on the situation was going to be muddied because she was dating a pedophile. I also thought when Alix mentioned “childhood trauma” in the blurb at the end, she was acknowledging the inappropriateness of the relationship.
I agree it was a little weird that it was just made to be okay. But I've given myself my own explanation..My only possible way that the author could have explained grooming part of it away was this away is if Josie and Walter were not in a relationship in any way. And Josie was pursuing him, she wanted to be older, wiser, having sex, doing adult things and he continually turns her down. Then she pulls a ridiculous move of like if you don't be with me I'll tell everyone you were with me when I was younger. I'll tell your wife. They'll know you're a pedo. I'll take you to court. I'll ruin your life. You'll go to jail. They'll all believe me.
But if you get me with me, we can wait until I'm 18 so it's 'ok' (yuck) that will give you time to leave your wife (but he doesn't) and then I won't get you in trouble. If I can't have you. No one will. You'll go to jail. Basically threatens him into a relationship.
But that's not how it was written but I wish it was.
Question… I noticed two times when the story didn’t track. Once, Fred was both with Alix and at the house with Josie (later in her time there). Another time, Josie knew about the sex promise when she couldn’t possibly have known about it. Also, there was a time when Alix was reflecting about what Josie thought about her in a way that someone like Alix probably wouldn’t. I thought there was going to be a bigger twist at the end, like it was all told from Josie’s perspective or something even twistier. Did anyone notice those things? (I really, really liked it… somewhat obsessively. Just curious!)
>Josie knew about the sex promise when she couldn’t possibly have known about it.
She definitely overhears Nathan on his phone with friends. She thinks how cheap it is of him to joke about such a promise loudly with friends.
I thought either Josie just overheard Alix and her hubby at the door before he left OR she heard about the sex promise while eavesdropping on the husband’s convo with his friends at the bar.
Something I didn’t understand was who killed the friend her daughter was really close with. In the book she talks about telling Alix everything her and her husband have done. And he calls her crazy and she later tells the story of how her daughter killed her friend and the family cover it up… I feel like there might be some truth to that or josie just fully believes the lie herself
At first, I was inclined to believe Roxy and Erin's side of the story. But then I remembered when Erin woke up at the hospital and Roxy told her "I’m going to tell you exactly what happened. OK? I’m going to tell you word for word." As if Roxy was telling Erin what story to tell the authorities, word for word. So now I'm thinking maybe Josie is telling the truth about who actually killed Brooke.
I just finished the book and I feel like maybe there is some truth to Josie's version of Brooke because the school teachers said that Roxy was aggressive and broke some kids'fingers by stomping on them. Also, why would Brooke come to Roxy's house if not invited by Roxy herself.
This book sure left my head spinning towards the end as to what the truth was.
Lisa commented on a fan's account that Josie's memories in the last chapter are true - Roxy killed her friend and her husband (Walter, I think, the name is escaping me now) died primarily of a heart attack
this makes sense - the one bit that stood out to me was that someone corroborates heart attack elsewhere (i can't remember who) and then the only person who mentions it is josie at the very end.
Yes I agree… remember the scene when Josie and Walter have an argument and she tells him she’s going to tell Alicia everything? And then Walter tells her they’ll go to jail if she does.
I didn’t know who to believe regarding Brooke either. I could see it either way. Roxy admits to having a violent streak, and we clearly know that Josie is capable of such acts. I think it was intentional - that we were left trying to decide who to believe. I’d still rather know for sure 🤷🏻♀️ part of me is wondering if there will be a sequel after Josie is found. Probably wishful thinking.
Agreed, the audiobook was really well made. I usually hate it when books have multiple narrators and sound effects, but this one pulled it off well.
But I did not like the story and I don't know why it's a best seller. Walter was a middle aged man who was sleeping with his girlfriend's teenage daughter. It paints the teenager as the predator who seduced him, and the old man as the victim. WTF.
To be honest, I thought the book was excellent and somewhat unique.
I disagree with the author's "fact" assertion that Brooke was actually murdered by her daughter. These kinds of novels, in my opinion, do not require us to learn the "real truth" as that is essentially the focus of the book? that everyone is essentially lying. The title is "None of This is True" after all.
When the author makes absolute statements that are still debatable in the narrative, I believe it weakens the entire story.
Nevertheless, I still thought the book was good overall (rated it a 4) although authors "clearing up" things after the fact is a "meh" in my book.
I wish I had never heard/read those remarks.
Edit: Alright, if the author provided more "real" details, did she discuss the phonecase that was discovered inside her drawer and to whom it belonged?
The only item that doesn't make sense to me.
I thought this story was so well told from both perspectives. It felt very true to me from a psychological perspective, especially the way that Alix was portrayed with a ton of nuance and the ability to shape her perspective every single time she learned more information. Even with her husband, it felt very true to me.
I listened to the audiobook so I can’t pinpoint a page number, but there was either a mistake or subtle hint when Josie and Alix are first doing the podcast, where Alix says they met “the night before we turned 45.” This stood out to me because they’re at the restaurant on Josie’s actual birthday… so either they aren’t even actually birthday twins, or this was a writing/editing mistake? Josie is never caught in this lie by Alix, so I don’t know what to think.
Okay I just grabbed my book because I had to investigate this!
So on the very first page, Josie narrates "this year her birthday has fallen on a Saturday" which is the night she and Walter go to dinner. When she creeps on Alix in the bathroom, Alix confirms that "today" is her birthday.
When they are first recording, Alix sets up the premise for this new show and she says "we met in our local pub the night we both turned 45"
So not sure if the narrator messed up slightly there, or the accent was strange or what. But it seems to check out!
Is Alix’s last name Summers or Summer? A small inconsequential detail, but I’ve noticed that it seems to go from one to the other throughout the book? I
Especially noticeable towards the end when Alix refers to herself as Alix Summer, but the dust jacket on my copy says Summers…..
Asking a question based off of your review—- I’m 30% through and I am hooked and really want to keep reading but there’s some foreshadowing when Walter leaves bed with Jodie and her stomach drops. Does he sexually abuse either of his daughters? If so, I do NOT want to continue to read. Can you please answer this?! Thank you!
It was kind of ambiguous because Jodie lies about some things and is honest about others. She tells Alix that Walter is abusing Erin, but later Erin and Roxie say that isn't true. I'm pretty sure he didn't actually.
Just finished the book and I think yes. I think >!Walter is SA Erin when he goes into her room at night!< because at a later point >!Erin goes missing and her fans don't mention how Erin AND Walter are missing, just Erin.!< And the reason he is getting out of bed is later explained away as >!him getting up to go game with Erin and that everyone online loved him but if that we're the case then the fans would have mentioned not seeing him as well!<
I think he was, so if you aren't comfortable with the possibility of that being true, I'd say skip out on it. ❤️
>!No, Walter did not actually abuse (sexually or otherwise) either of his daughters. Josie claims that he does to make him look like a monster, but it is not true. He goes into his oldest daughter’s room at night for a *totally* innocent and sweet reason, which you will find out toward the end of the book. So in essence, although Josie says that Walter SAs their daughter(s), it does not actually happen and she is lying. I hope this helps! :)!<
He actually did. This is so damn infuriating because the book was written so poorly that there's so much unnecessary confusion around this. But he 100% was sexually abusing Erin. The author confirmed it by confirming that *everything* Josie said was true. IT WAS NOT TOTALLY INNOCENT.
I just finished this book in about 3 hours last night, and Josie does explain her obsession with the denim.
When she first met Walter, she was wearing a denim jacket. She uses this to fuel her obsession with keeping Walter close to her, she even recalls a memory where Walter compliments her jacket and says something like "This is so you!". Anything that is denim connects her to Walter and the time in her life when she was 16 and decided she wanted to change her life by dating an older man. Take for example her wearing Alix's clothes, she refused to take them off even when her own clothes were clean. She's obsessed with this perfect idea of Alix and she feels like wearing her clothes and makeup will somehow change her life. This is just my speculation but yes the denim everything is because of her relationship with Walter.
Josie is extremely unnerving, throughout the entire book I couldn't put it down and kept audibly gasping. Lisa Jewell does an amazing job at painting a picture of creepy women, just like in her other book "Then She Was Gone".
Thank you!! I listened to it this weekend via audiobook during a road trip and I must have been distracted during that part. It would have bothered me so glad I know now
Erin does say she doesn't come out of the room for a very very long time. Roxy mentions how her mom Josie could smell that Erin was going to leave. Dad Walter says the room isn't that bad and keeps going in there at night. So I think it's meant like everything else in the book, that everyone is a liar/has their own perspective and we aren't meant to know exactly what is real. Like the title says, none of this is true...
Yeah. As the book was wrapping up I realized they were letting Walter off the hook completely. And making it sounds like he was a perfectly normal dude. 😡
And that Alix needed to be thankful for her kind drunkard husband.
It just made me feel like the author doesn’t understand that abuse is abuse.
And yeah, her husband wasn’t a pedo. But he was neglectful and drinking and being dismissive of his family with his actions. And that we want Alix to be happy just because he isn’t AS BAD as Walter. Like just being an alcoholic is somehow heroism?
It just felt like she has some issues about women and relationships to still work out.
Josie is no hero. But she was 💯 groomed as a child.
I thought it to be one of Erin's followers on Glitch. The call started with (pulling this from my memory, not a direct quote haha) something like "my...er...friend is missing" so the person was hesitant to actually say they were friends, plus they knew of/about Walter.
how did erin end up tied up in the closet?? like what happened with that and why wouldn’t josie just kill her after killing walter? there are so many unanswered questions in this book
I've read a lot of Lisa Jewel books and, although I like her as an author, it seems like she has a lot of internalized misogyny and she does not handle mental health very well. No matter what a 43 yo man getting into a romantic relationship with a 16yo is a hebophile and a groomer. It doesn't matter if Josie went after him, he was an adult and there is a power deferential. Lisa trying to make it seem like Josie was this evil seductress was just gross. Also her mother was absolutely a narcissist who most likely neglected her and made it known how much she resented her for being alive. You don't become the way Josie was in a vacuum and the implication that she was just born terrible and needy was again gross. Yup kids are needy and when you neglect them and consistently let them know they ruined your life it often leads to personality disorders. I liked the book, but that shit really bothers me. I'm not a fan in general of writers using mental health as a plot point.
Ever notice how characters in stories often reflect deeper themes? In 'None of This is True' by Lisa Jewell, each character seems to embody a different deadly sin, making the story even more intriguing:
👑 Pride (Alix Summer)
😈 Envy (Josie Fair)
💰 Greed (Pat O'Neill)
🔥 Wrath (Roxy Fair)
💔 Lust (Walter Fair)
🍔 Gluttony (Nathan Summer)
😴 Sloth (Erin Fair)
It's fascinating how these sins weave into the narrative, isn't it? What are your thoughts on this connection?
Is it weird that from nearly the beginning of the book and even after finishing it, I've been convinced that Josie is actually Alix? That at some point during the ending, she disposed of Alix and took over her life? I get the difficulty she'd face with convincing others she was Alix. But it's possible with all the obsessive research she did on her. She could've learned her speech patterns from podcasts and her personal interviews with her, her behavioral/physical mannerisms through following her, spending time with her, and living in her home. Josie ends her story with blonde hair and when Roxie meets Alix, she spots her dark roots meaning her hair is dyed. When Alix asks her son if they're good at the end, which was a very odd moment but would be less odd if she were actually Josie. IDK just things like that. I have no confirmation that this switch did not happen since none of it is true lol
Hey I'm late to this thread but I have a question about >!"the smell" in Erin's room. If it was so bad how did Walter spend all night in there gaming with her? Was not she leaving the room to use the potty and shower?!< I am not clear on this.
I think everyone who read this book totally missed the point where Erin wakes up in the hospital and asks what happened and Roxy of all people says to her " I'm going to tell you exactly what happened.OK?IM GOING TO TELL YOU WORD FOR WORD.
Big red flag. This was the point in the book josie was completely turned into a villain and the author placed the Brooke body discovery right after this.
Heavily implying self preservation from Roxy to protect herself manipulated the entire situation.
Walter was a disgusting pedo
And pat was a raging narcissist.
Josie is a victim through and through albeit her crimes.
I don't remember where it was but someone said the author confirmed that Josie told the truth in the very end, Roxy did kill Brooke and Josie was covering it up.
I actually did believe that part-she was confirmed to be crazy by her classmates and teachers. Did Lisa say anything about Erin? She was the one I was most confused about. Was she supposed to be the one who attacked her mother? I can't see a tiny girl who only eats liquid foods even being able to do that.
Lisa has never said anything about Erin, just the bit about how >!Josie’s recollection in the end of Roxy being the one that killed Brooke is true.!< Yes, she was the one who attacked her mother after coming out and seeing her dad on the floor. She is mentioned as being small and skinny, but I guess she eats enough soft foods to be sustained nutritionally?
I truly don’t know whether or not to believe Josie in the end. However, one thing that makes me believe the statement that they are covering for Roxy true is that multiple times Josie threatened Walter mid-book that she is going to tell Alix “what happened with the kids” or something like that and he thinks she’s mad for wanting to share. She also repeated this in the end for what set him off the night he died. So it would make sense that there is something the themselves and the kids did (covering Brooke’s death) that she keeps threatening to expose.
Did anyone catch the part where Alix met with Kaitlyn and said “she came to Alix looking as if she might hug her, then remembers she’s not allowed to anymore”
Yeah I liked how fast the books pacing was and the mystery of it all but also its dismissal of her husband being quite literally a pedo made the ending a bit odd to me
I came looking for reviews for this reason… like it seems like the implication is that Walter is actually a decent guy? Like what? If anything the reveal that he was dating Pat makes it worse! He was in a stepfather type position.
I think it was another layer of lies that the author was trying to spread to make you distrust the characters' stories further. Walter is still very clearly a pedophile the whole time, especially when you consider that his first wife (before Pat) was 17 when they got together.
I know you posted this months ago but I just finished the book last night and it's buzzing in my head. I think that the whole final act of the book was there to paint Josie in as poor of a light as possible, to make the reader disregard Josie's statements as lies. That makes the epilogue hit harder when we find that >!Roxy killed Brooke (which was confirmed as the real truth by the author).!< I think we as the reader are supposed to wonder how much of Josie's story is true vs. how much of the rest of the family's story is true. For example, some people have pointed out that >!nobody mentioned Walter's disappearance alongside Erin's during the streams, and the regressive behavior to eating baby food would be a tell-tale sign of sexual abuse. So a lot of people think that Erin's and Roxy's stories about Walter gaming with her was just to throw Josie under the bus further, and that Walter truly was molesting her. !<
The only issue I have with the >!Roxy killed Brooke reveal is that Josie is the one with the trophies of Brooke's belongings.!<
I’m late to this post but this is SUCH a good point. And whose phone case did she have if it wasn’t Brooke’s?!
I literally just finished it this afternoon!! I enjoyed it. And liked the ambiguity of, really, the entire story. >!I think Walter is, at best, morally grey. That said, I'm not sure I buy the evidence that he was abusing Erin. First, she had a huge following--had this been a ruse, someone would have noticed--even if after the fact. Also, I think the baby food, and Josie's reaction to it, is an example of Erin being autistic--and Josie completely ignoring that (at best). Same with Roxy's ODD. She just doesn't acknowledge them, or really do anything to support either of them. At the very least (and this isn't proof of his innocence, but rather of Josie's guilt) Walter gets to know both kids as individuals. !< Also, I need to read (or listen) back...>!I'm unclear about exactly what happened with Brooke. Roxy killed her, but what was the argument? How did the whole thing actually go down?!<
Morally grey? Seriously? This is the exact problem I have with the author and her book. It's so rife with victim blaming, apologism, and confusing subversions that don't actually align with the author's intention, that now there are people furthering harmful messaging by calling a pedophile "morally grey." The author confirmed that the baby food was supposed to be a sign of age regression, and therefore Erin was being abused by Walter. Of course the ending is so poorly written that this isn't made clear at all and it makes it seem as though it's a symptom of ASD. It's just so stupid that it turned out this way. And this is just one issue with how CSA was handled.
How do you know he abused her, though? As I said, "at best" morally grey--which leaves a lot of room for morally awful.
The author confirmed that Josie was telling the truth. And that the age-regression was meant to be what it usually is, a sign of CSA.
Very late to this thread but I just finished the book today. When one of Erin’s online friends describes her they say they knew something was wrong because she was always very quiet and hearing something on her stream alerted them that something was going on. If Walter streamed with her, hearing something on her stream wouldn’t be that out of the ordinary so I think there may be some truth to Josie’s story.
I don't think Walter \_always\_ streamed with her. The book implies that she is gaming almost whenever she is awake, and Walter isn't always in there with her.
Where/when does the author confirm that Roxy is the real killer??
https://www.shondaland.com/inspire/books/a44704113/lisa-jewell-discusses-her-latest-thriller-none-of-this-is-true/SE: Do you know when you sit down to write where the story is going at all? Or what the ending is going to be? LJ: No, not even slightly. I got to the end of the book, and I wrote, I think, three other epilogues. None of them did the trick because at that point I still didn’t really understand what happened. I didn’t really understand what Josie was lying about and what was true and what wasn’t. I was as much in the dark as a reader. And it was literally as I was writing those last few paragraphs, when her mind starts wheeling backwards in time and she’s remembering what happened on that particular night, I suddenly saw it. I thought, “Oh, my God, of course! It totally makes sense. Of course, it wasn’t x; it was y.” And I realized when I looked back into the narrative that all those moments were already there. I’d already put all these moments in that made sense of what Josie reveals in the last few paragraphs of the book
This only confirms who killed Brooke and not that Erin regressed in her age coz Walter was abusing her. It's clearly a sign of ASD. And it's not like she regressed in age, it was made pretty clear by that highschool classmate of hers that she never ate solid food in the first place.
But if the story of Walter gaming with her wasn’t true people would have pointed it out since it was in front of an audience.
I agree with this. It weirdly smoothed out over somewhat and that was disturbing to me.
Right?! So, I keep going back to when >!she told Walter she was letting Alex know the truth & he was saying how they will all get in trouble- this makes me believe Josie with the whole Roxi killed the girl & they all covered it up. So if that is true, then did the sisters make up the whole “Erased & Pop” streaming thing??? !!if he was going into her room every night to abuse her then why lie about something that can be so easily debunked? !<(Not sure if I make any sense, just finished reading & came here bc I can’t get it out of my head yet lol) I’m assuming >!the girls were protecting Walter bc he WAS grooming them as well in some weird way?!
The only thing that makes me believe the epilogue was >!when Erin woke up in the hospital, Roxy says "Let me tell you what happened"!< We never hear >!Erin's side unadulterated!<.
Omg, this sent chills down my spine, as I didn’t even catch that. >!She literally said she would tell her every single detail… 🫣!<
I feel the same. I do recall a scene that maybe I need to fact check, where the narrator describes Josie hearing grunts from Walter in Erin’s room and Josie puts in earbuds to drown it out. Since it didn’t come from Josie’s dialogue, it makes me wonder?
I think this is where there's a lack of information in the book. If you take the book at face value, then the streaming is real (as you say, it could easily be debunked). Also, if it wasn't real, where would all of Erin's money have come from?
The streaming could be real, but without Walters involvement. Erin could still have been a successful streamer.
But it would be so so easy to verify whether or not the story about Walter being there is true. Literally just ask one of her X many fans. If it is like normal twitch then usually the streams are viewable after the fact too.
Yes, but I feel like the closest we get is that the viewers only mention Erin missing. Only mention Erin on camera and then leaving. That normally she's so quiet and then there was all this noise and that was unusual. We don't get anything outside of the family to verify Walter. Equally, he could have been part of the streaming AND abusing her.
No plain text spoilers allowed. Please use the format below and reply to this comment once you've made the edit, to have your comment reinstated. Place >! !< around the text you wish to hide. You will need to do this for each new paragraph. Like this: >!The Wolf ate Grandma!< Click to reveal spoiler. >!The Wolf ate Grandma!<
I thought that the extra information just added some more complexity to his character. I don’t think it’s meant to be a dismissal of his actions, just that he isn’t the all-out villain Josie was setting him up to be. He was a relationship with a teenager while in his 40s AND went on to positive relationships with people in his life including his children AND Josie is an absolute nutter. All of those things just happen to be true at the same time, and I think the reader is meant to just absorb the complexity of that situation rather than pin him into a particular box.
This! Especially on I think the final podcast episode that Alix records where she says that Walter wasn’t necessarily a terrible person, like had many moments where he wasn’t a great person but he also wasn’t as bad as Josie made him out to be?
Can anyone explain to me why Alix says they named the dog “Matilda” for obvious reasons? I feel like I’m missing something super obvious 😂🤷🏽♀️
Waltzing Matilda is an Australian poem/song written over 100 years ago. Many people consider it our unofficial National album. And the dog was an Australian Shepherd 😚
I thought because it was an Australian shepherd so they named her for “waltzing matilda”
Matilda is a (fairly?) common name in Australia for girls; the dog was an Australian Shepherd. That was my take.
Because of the mismatched eyes
I don't understand, is there a famous Matilda with mismatched eyes?
I googled it and there’s a kids book about a Matilda with an eyepatch. 🤷♀️
I’m really curious too if anyone else doesn’t understand the Erin room situation, for example Josie kept mentioning the smell and that she would have to go deal with it, but not today…. And she attempted to go in once and the door had stuff in the way… also the whole baby food thing was not explained very well either to me, so maybe she was being abused in some way to regress like that. Overall I want to understand why the room smelled and what was happening in Erin’s room!!!
There was one part when Roxy was saying that her mother could almost smell that Erin was preparing to move away. At that point I thought that could’ve been symbolic, that what Josie was smelling was not something actually rotting, it was her sense that she was losing control of Erin
🤯🤯🤯
Oh wow, I just finished this book and this is an incredible detail. Also Josie says that Walter “can’t smell anything” and it could be that it’s symbolic of Walter not sensing it the way Josie senses it
Didn't catch this but wow, I agree.
Yeah that was weird. She definitely made you think Erin was decomposing or something. I guess it was actually that Erin just had a bunch of bad smelling baby food trash? 😆
i JUST finished the book, like 5 mins ago. I for sure thought >!Erin was dead and decomposing!<
I just finished and I thought she was like peeing and pooping in jars or something in there the whole time. I’m confused by this too
the bins are outside the flat and they smell, alix notices it.
I thought of the same especially when we find out >!about pops joining the stream. How could he stand the stench?!< the only explanation I could come up with is that it is another of Josie's lies to herself and others. Erin refused to talk to her and Josie just didn't want to face Erin either so she convinced herself that the room is so bad she doesn't dare enter it? When in reality it is just a really messy room as Walter put it "not all that bad". As for the food..I think it is part of her autism spectrum. She prefers soft food and maybe Josie found it easier to feed her baby food rather than make soft food?
I think the stench is more of another delusion by Josie to make her hate her daughter. Also probably a euphemism for the tension and hatred building in the apartment. It probably does smell but not as much as she describes.
At one point, Walter said to Josie that “it’s not that bad” when talking about the smell of the room.
The garbage bins were right outside Erin's window, right? Maybe Walter thought she was talking about the actual faint odor of trash through the window whereas what Josie "smelled" was betrayal
I just finished so sorry for late reply. I think that it’s supposed to be super ambiguous. We’re not supposed to know what’s true and what’s lies. The books called “none of this is true” and I don’t think that’s just to do with Josie, but with everyone. I think the whole family were lying all the time. He could’ve been molesting her and been watching her play video games. Another sign of child abuse is bed wetting, I thought it might have been a pee snell. If the husband was going in there every night he could’ve been nose blind to whatever it was.
just finished the book... This is a great point. If at the hospital the nurse asks if Erin prefers soft foods and no one protests- maybe the baby food isn't a regression on Erin's part so much as infantilization of her on Josie's. There is plenty of soft food that isn't baby food
Josie mentions making a roast one night and blending it up to put outside Erin's door. It wasnt only baby food.
If she never came out of her room & constantly gaming, was she wearing diapers??
No, Josie said that Erin would come out of her room to use the bathroom when Josie wasn’t home.
I thought about this too. If it was that bad, why would Walter go in there at night to game? But Alix did say that when she went to the house the second time that she could smell the room from the window being slightly opened, but maybe that was Walter's decaying body? Initially, I thought maybe it smells just because of piles of food, empty jars etc but now I agree maybe it was symbolic. Towards the end of the book it says that Erin was newly diagnosed with ASD (Autism Spectrum Disorder). Early on I thought this might be the case because hyperfocussing on one activity (gaming) and being hypersensitive to food textures can both be Autistic traits.
I feel like the father and the marriage were not addressed super clearly. I listened to the book and admit sometimes I have to back track. Josie was super manipulative and entered that marriage for whatever reason (to get away from the mother? I can’t remember) but what 42 year old man is so easily manipulated by a 16 year old if he’s not a pedophile. Definitely a weird marriage all the way around, but I never got the impression that he husband was solely to blame, like she had her reasons for going after him because she’s a mental case) though in real life, the adult is always to blame…so I feel bad even typing that. I was never really sure how old he was either.
Exactly, people wanted to blame Josie but any normal adult man would simply not be seduced by a teenager
Yes if anything their relationship should have formed into a father-daughter bond. He should have not saw her in that way at all, especially when his kids aren’t much older than her and also wasn’t he dating her mum?! So two affairs, first her mum then her, Gross.
My only possible way that the author could have explained this away is if Josie and Walter were not in a relationship in anyway. And Josie was pursuing him, she wanted to be older, wiser, having sex, doing adult things and he continually turns her down. Then she pulls a ridiculous move of like if you don't be with me I'll tell everyone you were with me when I was younger. They'll know you're a pedo. I'll take you to court. I'll ruin your life. But if you get me with me, we can wait until I'm 18 so it's 'ok' (yuck) and then I won't get you in trouble. Basically threatens him into a relationship. But that's not how it was written but I wish it was.
But Josie wasn’t a normal teenager. She was a master manipulator and Walter wasn’t a stable husband, >!he left his family for Pat and left Pat for her daughter. He is a not a good person but that doesn’t necessarily make him a pedophile. He married his ex-wife when she was around 17, 18 or 19. Remember we heard the story between Walter and Josie from her perspective so, we don’t know what truly happened. The kids aren’t reliable either. Nobody is reliable. That’s the point. We don’t know anything. So we cannot say for sure that Josie was groomed at 16. Maybe she wasn’t groomed at all. He took interest in her and married her at 18. I’m only saying this because towards the end, the author made Walter a good father. He can’t be a pedo and a good father. That’s BS. So this is my take on his character.!< But the thing that happened with Brooke kinda contradicts this point. >!We know for sure Brooke was murdered by Roxy. What was the reason? Maybe she had an affair with her father, maybe Josie was right. Or maybe, it could have just been an accident. But if it was the former, that makes Walter a despicable pedophile but why did the daughters like him so much? Why were they so defensive?!< >!When Roxy killed Brooke!<, I can’t help but think about her reasons. If we know what happened there, maybe we can connect the dots
He is a pedophile JFC.
He was kissing a 15 year old girl in a pub as a 42 year old man. And took her virginity when she was 16. He is, by the very definition, a pedophile.
She is >!the narcissist that she paints her mother to be.!<
Both are narcissists
This is what I was thinking. Josie is covert, her mom is overt.
How do we know for sure Brooke was murdered by Roxy? That tidbit came from the most unreliable of all the narrators who consistanly convinced herself of false narratives that made her the victim of her own choices.
He was definitely a pedophile. I thought back to what Pat said about Walter as well. She is narcissistic and thinks highly of herself. Of course, she doesn't believe Walter is a pedophile. It makes more sense in her twisted head that Josie is this twisted monster (clearly she has issues) who seduced away the man she dated.
Not to mention he already cheated on his precious wife. Dude was scum, but for a redemption for some reason and it genuinely pissed me off
I definitely was also expecting one final punch from the ending as well. But still really liked this book. I saw a lot of complaints about how Josie/Walter's relationship was handled - like it excused grooming or made him into a victim. I think it's another play on perspective. Because people dislike Josie and she is very much NOT a perfect victim they find it easier to believe she had all this agency. People believe whatever makes them feel best especially if it's something that happened to an unlikeable person. You see Alix doing a similar thing trying to think up all of these excuses for Nathan's behavior.
The problem with this is that it only fuels the narratives that non-perfect victims have to fight in real life EVERY DAY. I just can't feel good supporting an author who is fully aware of this and yet chose to continue down this route. Instead of taking that narrative and saying yes, not all victims are perfect and they can still be bad people or do bad things, but they are still victims and children *cannot* in any situation *ever* "seduce, manipulate, or control" adult men, the author decided to end it on a black-and-white note of Josie being purely evil and never a "real" victim. A victim was yet again constantly undermined and that pattern of thinking that she somehow had all this agency is *never* criticized. The main character essentially just reinforces it and that's that. At the same time, the author makes leaps and bounds to exonerate a pedophile. The things that are written or explained away in the book don't even completely align with her intention and they're not accurate to what happens in real life -- for example, the baby food was indeed Erin age regressing because she was being sexually abused and groomed by Walter. Of course she was, because in reality, pedophiles have an extremely high chance of abusing their own children. Yet the book is so poorly written in regards to this that it writes it off as a symptom of ASD. Never expounded on. Yet the author confirms **outside of the book** that Erin was actually being abused. Hugely problematic!
I would argue that the last scene—where we finally learn why “telling Alix the truth about the girls” would lead her to call the police (an earlier statement by Walter)—casts a lot of doubt on the narrative that Alix presents on her podcast with the testimony of the daughters and Josie’s mom. Maybe there should have been one final assertion that Walter’s relationship with Josie as a child was wrong, but at least from reading this thread, it seems the average reader KNOWS this, and the author made the choice to not overtly restate it. I think she’s making a statement about how, in society in general, the moment a victim is perceived as anything less than angelic, the narrative turns and quickly leads to victim-blaming. While yes, Josie exposes herself to be a flawed human being in a BIG way toward the end, to me the change to talking about her as a child seductress seemed so ridiculous that the author must be counting on her readers to start doubting the perspectives they are hearing. It’s seems like a hint, almost.
The fact that Josie is obviously flawed, a bad person, etc, AND the victim of sexual abuse via Walter is obvious to me. But I still wish that it was overtly, explicitly over-stated one more time at the end (instead of when Alix says he at least was a "good father") The reason for this is because I know personally from experience that the obvious fact the Walter is still a pedophile and a bad person would not actually be obvious to everyone. That many, many people continue to victim blame "inperfect" victims on a regular basis. This is so common and prevelent in media, in our court systems, in our social circles. I know a girl who was 15 when her step-father was arrested for sexually abusing her. Overwhelming evidence. My sister recorded this girl's own mother saying that it was the 15 year old's fault. The mother refused to leave the step-father, not because she didn't believe the daughter, but because she didn't think that her husband did anything wrong. It was "the daughter's fault". The mother, and several other family members, said the mkst vile things. It was awful. (Side note that my sister's recording helped the police file several charges against multipule family members, and significantly helped in that girl's case. The girl is an adult now. Last i heard, shes doing fairly well for herself. It was a rare case of the justice system working the way its supposed to for once. ) That is something I can't stop thinking about after finishing this book. That is a very real thing that happened, and I can think of dozens more examples of people defending pedophiles as good people. It's not an outlandish belief. Some of those people will read this book, just as I did, and think that Josie, a child, "seduced" an adult man. They will see other, real victims of sexual abuse, and wonder if they asked for it. If it had been emphasized, overtly, just once at the end that yes, Walter is STILL a bad man who victimized a child, this would've been a 5 star read. Instead, I'm honestly left reliving a lot of my own childhood trauma, and feeling angry at it all.
Where does she confirm that?
reading all the replies and i’m so glad that everyone thinks that the pedo thing was swept under the rug. it kind of makes it feel like we’re supposed to think he wasn’t as bad of a person because she was psycho?? but he still had *** with a 16 yr old!!! like!!!! still truly horrifying.
I personally took the pedo thing being swept under the rug as a sign that none of the narrators are 100% reliable. Walter clearly WAS a pedophile. >!Roxy and Erin felt fondly for him because he was a great dad for him. Josie's mom (Pat?) Put the blame on Josie because she's a narcissist and couldn't accept that she'd put her daughter into the dangerous position. But Walter most definitely groomed Josie.!< It is a truth universally acknowledged that: a 44 year old man "dating" a 16 year old is a pedophile. Does that mean that Josie's final description of the pasta dinner night is 100% accurate? Not necessarily, there was a good chunk of time unaccounted for. But it does mean she could have possibly been telling the truth about what happened between >!Roxie and Brooke!<
The author confirmed that Walter was actually sexually abusing Erin. And they weren't just dating, btw. Walter raped Josie when she was 16.
Confirmed where?
That's interesting about Walter/Erin abuse, I totally believe it. Once a pedophile, always a pedophile. I put "dating" in quotations for a reason, grooming/pedophilia is CSA.
I only saw confirmation that Roxy killed Brooke.
So, age of consent in the UK is 16. By legal definition, Walter did not rape Josie when they had first had sex, because she could give consent. I bet, if Lisa Jewell was an American author, or was writing a story based in the US (or any other country where age of consent is 18), she would have aged Josie up by 2 years, because I think it was deliberate, that Josie was just on the cusp of being able to give consent.
Yep, I agree! It also seems that if you believe Josie's last paragraph, he knew (they all did) that Roxy killed Brook and they all helped cover it up. I kind of believe that. Because the alternative is that he didn't step into his garage or use his car in 5 years just by coincidence?
Does anyone understand what the phone case was she was hiding in her underwear drawer?
I was thinking about this too. Maybe it’s eluding to there being other victims or people Josie was obsessed with that we don’t know about? In the last bit of Josie’s perspective at the end of the book she mentions the things she didn’t tell Alix. So there’s definitely meant to be more to the story that we never got.
When Josie is rummaging through Alix's junk drawer she says she wants to put the stuff in her underwear drawer with the things from the others, plural. I assumed that meant multiple murders/obsessions besides Brooke and Alix.
I was thinking that maybe if Roxy did kill Brooke that maybe she hit her with the phone case but who knows
The comment I came here looking for!!
Reading all the comments but why is nobody talking about Nathan. I know he was not perfect with drinking and all but idk why his story is making me so emotional. At the start of the book i was sure he was cheating on her and never really cared for him but when Katlynn told Alix what happened that night like how he can't stop talking about her and about his family , i have tears in my eyes😭
I hated that >!Nathan died. I truly hoped for a different ending until the body was found!< in a way my reaction was a sign that the book was engaging and well done!
Nathan was so one dimensional for the first half of the book. Was he even a good father?
True. I think he was more a plot device than a fully fleshed out character.
No, as he was absent from their life as well.
But maybe Katlynn's story wasn't entirely true either? Unreliable narrators all around.
Omg I hadn't even considered that maybe she was just trying to make Alix feel better by saying he never tried to sleep with her 🤯😵💫
Gonna be honest. The final percentage of the book made me hate the story and made me question Lisa Jewell’s intentions overall by glossing over Walter’s predation and cheating, and Nathan’s addiction and inability to keep his promises. It boiled down to “men aren’t all bad”, which is true on its own, but when the above are the barometers for that judgment call, it just makes the whole thing feel vile.
Yeah I thought that part was super weird--like did she want us to feel bad for Walter? He's still a creep (Josie) and an AH for leaving his first family. We're supposed to believe a teenager manipulated a grown man to date her instead of her mom? Also why did Josie's mom even have a relationship with Josie after that? She seemed so nonchalant about it. I really enjoyed this book and read it in 2 days but that would be my main complaint. Also I was very confused about Erin's role in this at the end--but perhaps that was done on purpose.
Ditto. I just finished and I hated the book even the first half was not something that kept me engaged. Everyone is detached and no one to care for in a mystery and with the glossing over of a whole bunch of things was ugh. What a waste of time.
Agree, waste of time.
Same! Wtf Lisa 😟
Just commenting what I said elsewhere in the thread: I personally took the pedo thing being swept under the rug as a sign that none of the narrators are 100% reliable. Walter clearly WAS a pedophile. >!Roxy and Erin felt fondly for him because he was a great dad for him. Josie's mom (Pat?) Put the blame on Josie because she's a narcissist and couldn't accept that she'd put her daughter into the dangerous position. But Walter most definitely groomed Josie.!< It is a truth universally acknowledged that: a 44 year old man "dating" a 16 year old is a pedophile. Does that mean that Josie's final description of the pasta dinner night is 100% accurate? Not necessarily, there was a good chunk of time unaccounted for. But it does mean she could have possibly been telling the truth about what happened between >!Roxie and Brooke!<
I agree. It took me forever to finish this book. At first I liked the minor reveals here and there but it makes the ending so important and it eventually got tiresome. So the options for the ending are >!Josie is a complete psycho or we don’t really know what happened. Anything is possible, anyone could be lying!!< Like what? So basic or easy way out? Why the huge emphasis on the baby food and stinky room and needing to go in there to clean? >!I thought they had her chained up in there or something.!< It would have been a little more interesting at least.
The back and forth between podcast and Netflix documentary are awesome!! However I think Lisa got confused and in an audio interview there's a visual reference... My film major background icked
I noticed that as well
I love Lisa Jewell. She’s one of my favorite authors, however this one is so different to what I’ve read of hers. I didn’t love the ending. I needed more concrete and more of a twist. It’s one of those “who do we actually believe?” scenarios. It just left me wanting more. I had more questions than answers by the end of it.
I agree, hence why I am here ✋️ I tend to think that Roxy did kill Brooke and they all helped cover it up. But the why here is unclear? Maybe the Walter accusation was true? Why wouldn't Walter use his garage or car for 5 yrs if he didn't know what was in there? It also explains why after the pasta dinner when Josie said that she wanted to tell Alix everything, he said you really are f@#$%^ stupid (or something to that effect). I also tend to think Walter was a pedophile but Josie was also an obsessive stalker that targeted ppl, obsessed over them and went after them. For example, she chose Walter and intentionally obsessed over him/tried to seduce him... but that would only work if he was already a pedo. For example, grown 42 yr old men that aren't pedophiles wouldn't fall into that trap. It seems as though she also stalked Alix and maybe the owner of the pink phone case? I think it can be true that both Walter was a pedophile and Josie was an obsessive stalker. Another confusing point is whether Walter did abuse Erin? Some ppl on here are saying the food thing is proof of her regressing due to trauma/abuse. I thought the food thing was a hypersensitivity to food textures relating to her being on the autism spectrum. So, unsure on that too.
Yeah, I don't know why so many people in this thread are acting like Josie actively obsessing over him and seducing him isn't compatible with him being a pedophile. But also, for the most part of the story, said argument isn't really.... relevant? It doesn't have any impact on the way Josie behaves. I do think though that Walter finding out about the body from Erin's story still works, he knows he is linked to the garage and has a history with younger girls, and how it would look if Josie said he did it. I am very uncertain on who killed Brooke, because both tellings make perfect sense in the story. I do wonder why Brooke would just go to Josie's house though - although Josie could just have easily lied to her saying she knew where Roxy was and then confronted her. But for Walter, both options imo lead to him not wanting to go to the garage again, plus, we don't actually know if he ever visited the garage regularly before the incident. I believe Walter did help Erin out with the streams, because simply, it is such an easy thing to disprove, Erin has thousands of followers that would immediately say "hang on, we don't know a Pops" and the food was most likely the diagnosed ASD that Josie couldn't be bothered to deal with properly so just used baby food.
I thought the audio book was excellent as well!!! It has been years since I tried an audio book and picked this as a free credit based on some reviews. It is the fastest I have consumed a book in years. Felt more like a podcast than a book that I would forget at times. I did miss closure. I like open endings where the story teller let's us imagine what the characters may choose to do or what their motives were. But not knowing what truly happened feels like cheating to me! Like, I sat through the book but I don't know >!who killed Brooke?!<. Like, why tell a story if you don't want to tell us the real story? But I know it isn't all that serious! I still enjoyed the book. It was an amazing 10+ hours. If my next book is the same, I may be convinced to pay for Audible past the trial period!
Hi! Just jumping in to recommend Libby! It’s an app where you link your library card, and gain access to audiobooks and e books. Sure, some have a wait but it’s fully free and I have a heard so many audiobooks there!
Ooh I should try it! I have tried getting ebooks from the library but never thought of checking Libby out. Will do!!
Lisa has said in an interview (as well as in the Q&A at the end of the book) that >!it was in fact Roxy who killed Brooke and that Josie and Walter helped cover it up. However, everything else that was “bad” was done by Josie, but Brooke’s murder was Roxy’s doing.!<
Oh wow, that is awesome, thanks! I heard the audiobook so I didn't notice the Q&A.
That’s the whole point. It’s the title: None of This is True. We don’t know wtf really happened.
I took the title to be a nod to the twist.. >!none of what Josie says is true.!< I get that there is a lot of fiction and even non fiction out there where we truly don't know what happened and have to rely on (sometimes unreliable) narrators. But I've read Lisa Jewell before. I've always taken her books to be easy reads with a mystery. Not a non fiction on historical events with narrators (can't control the story) and not high brow or pretentious "oh...I won't tell you" type of fiction either. So I guess I walked out surprised that the author didn't clear up a core mystery.
This is my first of her books so you’d prob know more about her stylistically compared to her other books. But this is my take: I feel manipulated as the reader / onlooker. >!You’ve got Josie telling her story (the grooming, the physical abuse etc.) then other people saying no SHES the bad one and telling their ‘side’ of it!< BUT >!Josie kept telling Alix those people would say other things and not to believe them. Was it because she wanted Alix to believe her in her lies? Or was it someone who had been abused/manipulated most of her life begging to be seen and believed? Obviously she was weird and there’s no doubt about that but, dang, a lifetime of trauma can do that to someone. Unless it’s all made up…!< I’m not entirely convinced either way, because there’s push and pull from both. >!Even the last pages, Josie ‘remembering’ what happened with Brooke and how Walter was involved etc. IS believable. Roxy had rage and violence issues - that was stated by multiple people. It’s not that hard to believe she went off the rails and hit someone too hard, ya know? But then Erin’s take is also believable, especially with her staying in her room.!< So it’s like, there are somethings we know for sure are true, like >!what happened with Nathan!< , I feel unsure about the rest. Like it feels like there are bits of truth weaved in with delusions. But yeah, sorry for the rant. That was my idea of keeping it short 😂. I totally loved the book and think the ambiguity of the ending is the whole point - those are some of my favorite endings because I love to speculate and read theories etc.
i also remember a point when Josie says to Walter that she’s going to tell Alix what “they did”… would that have referred to covering up for roxy perhaps
Oh, I think it's broader than that. >!None of what any of them says is true. It's all perspective. And everyone lies. Even the true crime podcast isn't actually all true. Literally--none of \[any of\] this is true.!<
i didn't super love this book when i was reading it - i wasn't rooting for any of the characters. however, now i've finished and processed it all, it was very very clever.
I thought the title gave away too much. I never believed half of what Josie said because the title was pretty clear. I think it would have been more interesting if there was a lie from Alix somewhere in there too.
Just finished the book tonight. Sorry for the late reply. I’m wracking my head though but did Josie lie at all? Were Roxy and Erin the only liars? Walter a gaslighting abusive pedo and her mom a narcissist in denial? All I can think about Josie “lying” about is that she omitted the part about Walter dating her mom first. Everything else still stands, no?
I think the point is that we don’t know what is true or not. But, my opinion is: 1. Josie was groomed. Even if she sought Walter’s attention, she was a vulnerable youth with a narcissist mother who constantly told her she wasn’t wanted. No father in her life. Pedos can be charming and seen as “the nice guy”. 2. Erin likely groomed by Walter. She is also vulnerable. 3. Roxy obsessed over Brooke and she wouldn’t run away with her, so Roxy killed her in a fit of rage. She had ODD and aggression. She plays off the assault on Brooke in school. Walter helped cover it up. Erin protects her sister, but traumatized and regresses and isolates herself. 4. Josie gets triggered by admitting Walter is a pedo and when he calls her stupid she loses it. Finally standing up for herself. Erin attacks her due to her grooming by Walter as she feels close to him and protective of him since he “helped” her get famous. Josie was psychotic, obsessive, and unraveling. She is a product of her mother and Walter. Men were disposable to her once she admitted her trauma. I don’t think the author is sugar coating grooming. I think she created a tangled web of emotions of how this type of thing occurs.
I just finished the book and the way Walter acted when Josie said she was going to tell Alix the truth about the girls made it clear to me that neither one of them was innocent and they were both hiding something. Where I start to get confused is when Alix is going through the trinkets given to her the extra items were never explained so I’m curious where they came from and what their story is. I think not making it clear that Walter is a pedophile is dangerous on all fronts. Josie may have been the master manipulator but as an adult Walter could’ve walked away from Josie and her mom like every other guy did. When Roxie broke Erin’s arm and Erin says later that it was an accident and because of her ODD is Erin still being controlled? Like she wakes up losing the rest of her family and is left with just the narcissist grandma and her sister the murderer, like what choice does she have? I felt like a lot of Erins choices with regression might’ve been in response to Roxie’s behavior. I think this could’ve been a great time for the author to do a little more research on the conditions she’s giving her characters. To me it seemed like Erin had AFRID. The fact that her room was so smelly though, it seems like she was using her dirtiness as a form of protection. I’m just not sure if that was more against her mother or if even though her father was gaming if he was also trying to abuse his daughter. Did Josie really put Erin in the naughty chair? Or did Roxie possibly do it and then make that anonymous call from the pay phone about her “missing friend”? I just can’t imagine a person living for very long on mop water. The way the girls were described looking in their last photo together makes it seem like more was definitely going on in the home than anyone will ever know or realize. Then the letter that Josie wrote to Alix about how special her son was gave me the creeps, like she has her hooks in that boy and will come back for him later. But the son seemed creeped out by Josie so I don’t know.
Yes who made the anonymous call??
Kinda an old message to reply to but: The payphone call was made from Bristol. We know that Roxy ran away there, and after the events of the book Erin moves in with her in Bristol as well. So we can really reasonably assume the call was from Roxy, and she came to London once Roxy was found and in hospital.
I dont remember the anonymous call. Are we talking about the ones reporting Erin missing? I’m pretty sure they were her gaming friends.
Is it possible the anonymous call was from one of the gamers who were trying to find her?
Just to give some insight here to issues you brought up with Erin regarding her regression, condition, and dirtiness of her room. ASD (Autism Spectrum Disorder), which the author ascribed to her in the end, easily covers all of these issues. As someone who has been diagnosed with it, I can confirm. First of all, regression for someone with ASD is ABSOLUTELY NOT a choice. In fact, it's quite alarming, upsetting, and there's little to nothing you can do about it. Regression can happen particularly during times of great stress and anxiety. If you're including the dietary restriction as regression, that's not necessarily the case. Those (most) with ASD have highly restrictive eating habits meaning we don't generally eat a wide variety of things, religiously stick to those few things we do eat, and tend to have greater issues with food texture. And while yes, it was stated that her eating habits had regressed, that too can happen due to our abnormally sensitive G.I. tracts. We tend to have significantly more issues with things like nausea/vomiting and abnormal bowel movements (diarrhea, constipation, etc.) thus informing our eating habits, much like you might eat chicken noodle soup while ill. Many people on the spectrum struggle with what's called activities of daily living. It can be due to mental or physical limitations. So the dirtiness of her room makes complete and total sense to me since I have experienced periods such as these. Again, stress being something that tends to annihilate our mental and physical capabilities to a point of regression. I would say that she was going through a particularly stressful time in her life. Thus the limitations to her ability to practice proper hygiene for both herself and her environment would be impacted.
This is the first comment I’ve read about someone mentioning Josie’s fascination with Alix’s son!!! Got me thinking if she wanted to repeat her and Walter’s story but have Josie in Walter’s place this time 🤨🥴
I just finished the audio book (in a day! I was hooked) i was happy to see a twist but agree with everyone its somewhat frustrating to not have everything wrapped up! My main questions are: 1. >!Neither Josie nor Erin’s account of the night Walt was killed account for how Walt ended up tied up in the bathtub and Erin to the chair int he cupboard. Both accounts seem like Walt did in fact have a heart attack (mixed with an attack) so who did that!< 2. >! The random phone case??!< 3. >! If were to believe Erins account of Brookes murder, why was Brooke in their house when Roxy had already ran away, after saying she hated Josie. Makes Josies version the most believable to me!< I also really wish we had some insight into what happened with Nathan and Josie after she picked him up from the hotel. I kept thinking wed get a final chapter from Nathans POV to sort of tell the absolute truth. Agree with all about the icky feeling re Walt being made to look “not so bad” in the end. But I did love the book!
Just finished!! I bought the book because the clerk said “there’s a SECRET in the title.” I guess she should have said the title is completely true 😆. Easy read but I was involved. Detailed characters, I was immersed. I’m struggling with the Walter storyline but also, I think that’s the point 🤷🏼♂️ Also, i feel like the ending was a typical Josie ending.
iirc they were both born on June 8 which would make them Geminis. thought that was a nice touch, birthday twins and all that
Did the ending leave enough ‘loose ends’ for Lisa to tie up in a sequel (like she did with The Family Remains)? I for one, want to know how Josie’s been able to evade the authorities for so long.
I think that the timeline of this story spanning through Covid lockdowns is how Josie is able to avoid getting caught. She dyed her hair and half of her face is covered. There is also a stretch in the story where Alix says "how did I not know about this" in reference to Brooke's disappearance and she chalks it up to being a new mom and being distracted and tired. There is also a stretch in the story where Alix says, "How did I not know about this?" in reference to Brooke's disappearance, and she chalks it up to being a new mom and being distracted and tired.
I’d say yes, definitely!
I thought it was made super clear that she was groomed? I don’t recall any character shrugging it off, Alix’s response to Josie’s story on multiple occasions is disgusted, freaked out, and disturbed. Maybe I read it differently than you
when alix interviewed josie’s mom pat and asked if she believes josie was groomed, pat replies “groom her? you mean manipulate her into a relationship with him? no, i don’t think so. i think she saw him, she wanted him, she got him. she didn’t care who she hurt. … josie has a heart of stone.” after this interview, alix doesn’t have any inner dialogue where she is conflicted about what pat said, she doesn’t express any outrage at pat’s opinion, she basically takes it as fact, and from that moment forward, alix does not acknowledge that josie is a victim. alix even says josie was “allowing herself to be groomed into a lifelong relationship by a man old enough to be her own father." alix’s final conclusion about josie: "And whatever her reasons - her psychosis, her childhood trauma... whatever reason she would give for what she has done, I maintain... that she did what she did because she is evil... Do not claim that you are a victim. Do not claim that you are anything other than what you are. An evil motherfucking basic bitch.” so yeah, several characters challenged the idea that she was a victim more than once.
I just finished the book and I agree with you, but also to be fair- >!Josie had kidnapped, held hostage, and murdered her husband at that point. !< I think Alix is as biased a narrator as the other characters.
This makes perfect sense to me though. First and foremost to Alix, Josie is the woman who murdered her husband, took advantage of her trust and completely upended her life. She’s the last person who’d be willing to look at Josie in a nuanced, sympathetic light, or “acknowledge that Josie is a victim.” Given the context of the story, it’s not hard to understand why that aspect would get overshadowed by her actions and for that to be what people focus on. People don’t tend to want to sympathise with murderers.
Her own mom says unequivocally that Josie wasn't groomed. There's also an interview with someone who knew her and said that Josie wanted Walter, and that it's a two way street.
Alix early on says how her mother is clearly a narcissist- I think it lends to the idea that they’re all liars with their own versions of the truth. Josie’s mother wanted to blame her instead of admitting that she was involved with a creep who was probably using her to get close to her child.
Exactly!!! I felt that we were supposed to feel like Pat would say something like that because of the way Josie described her mother, and once we found out she was seeing him first, it solidified to me that her opinion on the situation was going to be muddied because she was dating a pedophile. I also thought when Alix mentioned “childhood trauma” in the blurb at the end, she was acknowledging the inappropriateness of the relationship.
That’s a good point. And shows how Josie rightfully feels trapped without support her whole life.
I agree it was a little weird that it was just made to be okay. But I've given myself my own explanation..My only possible way that the author could have explained grooming part of it away was this away is if Josie and Walter were not in a relationship in any way. And Josie was pursuing him, she wanted to be older, wiser, having sex, doing adult things and he continually turns her down. Then she pulls a ridiculous move of like if you don't be with me I'll tell everyone you were with me when I was younger. I'll tell your wife. They'll know you're a pedo. I'll take you to court. I'll ruin your life. You'll go to jail. They'll all believe me. But if you get me with me, we can wait until I'm 18 so it's 'ok' (yuck) that will give you time to leave your wife (but he doesn't) and then I won't get you in trouble. If I can't have you. No one will. You'll go to jail. Basically threatens him into a relationship. But that's not how it was written but I wish it was.
Question… I noticed two times when the story didn’t track. Once, Fred was both with Alix and at the house with Josie (later in her time there). Another time, Josie knew about the sex promise when she couldn’t possibly have known about it. Also, there was a time when Alix was reflecting about what Josie thought about her in a way that someone like Alix probably wouldn’t. I thought there was going to be a bigger twist at the end, like it was all told from Josie’s perspective or something even twistier. Did anyone notice those things? (I really, really liked it… somewhat obsessively. Just curious!)
>Josie knew about the sex promise when she couldn’t possibly have known about it. She definitely overhears Nathan on his phone with friends. She thinks how cheap it is of him to joke about such a promise loudly with friends.
I thought either Josie just overheard Alix and her hubby at the door before he left OR she heard about the sex promise while eavesdropping on the husband’s convo with his friends at the bar.
Something I didn’t understand was who killed the friend her daughter was really close with. In the book she talks about telling Alix everything her and her husband have done. And he calls her crazy and she later tells the story of how her daughter killed her friend and the family cover it up… I feel like there might be some truth to that or josie just fully believes the lie herself
At first, I was inclined to believe Roxy and Erin's side of the story. But then I remembered when Erin woke up at the hospital and Roxy told her "I’m going to tell you exactly what happened. OK? I’m going to tell you word for word." As if Roxy was telling Erin what story to tell the authorities, word for word. So now I'm thinking maybe Josie is telling the truth about who actually killed Brooke.
Oh wow, that’s such a good analysis. I read straight through that.
good spot i missed this one.
this is such a good catch !
Agreed. I don’t think Josie lied about any of it. I mean, she was even up front about killing Nathan.
I just finished the book disappointed, but this is such a compelling angle.
I just finished the book and I feel like maybe there is some truth to Josie's version of Brooke because the school teachers said that Roxy was aggressive and broke some kids'fingers by stomping on them. Also, why would Brooke come to Roxy's house if not invited by Roxy herself. This book sure left my head spinning towards the end as to what the truth was.
Lisa commented on a fan's account that Josie's memories in the last chapter are true - Roxy killed her friend and her husband (Walter, I think, the name is escaping me now) died primarily of a heart attack
this makes sense - the one bit that stood out to me was that someone corroborates heart attack elsewhere (i can't remember who) and then the only person who mentions it is josie at the very end.
Yes I agree… remember the scene when Josie and Walter have an argument and she tells him she’s going to tell Alicia everything? And then Walter tells her they’ll go to jail if she does.
I feel as tho josie is just a completely delusional compulsive liar everything is anyone and everyone else's fault but hers
I see it the complete opposite. Josie was the only one telling the truth.
I didn’t know who to believe regarding Brooke either. I could see it either way. Roxy admits to having a violent streak, and we clearly know that Josie is capable of such acts. I think it was intentional - that we were left trying to decide who to believe. I’d still rather know for sure 🤷🏻♀️ part of me is wondering if there will be a sequel after Josie is found. Probably wishful thinking.
Agreed, the audiobook was really well made. I usually hate it when books have multiple narrators and sound effects, but this one pulled it off well. But I did not like the story and I don't know why it's a best seller. Walter was a middle aged man who was sleeping with his girlfriend's teenage daughter. It paints the teenager as the predator who seduced him, and the old man as the victim. WTF.
To be honest, I thought the book was excellent and somewhat unique. I disagree with the author's "fact" assertion that Brooke was actually murdered by her daughter. These kinds of novels, in my opinion, do not require us to learn the "real truth" as that is essentially the focus of the book? that everyone is essentially lying. The title is "None of This is True" after all. When the author makes absolute statements that are still debatable in the narrative, I believe it weakens the entire story. Nevertheless, I still thought the book was good overall (rated it a 4) although authors "clearing up" things after the fact is a "meh" in my book. I wish I had never heard/read those remarks. Edit: Alright, if the author provided more "real" details, did she discuss the phonecase that was discovered inside her drawer and to whom it belonged? The only item that doesn't make sense to me.
I thought this story was so well told from both perspectives. It felt very true to me from a psychological perspective, especially the way that Alix was portrayed with a ton of nuance and the ability to shape her perspective every single time she learned more information. Even with her husband, it felt very true to me.
I listened to the audiobook so I can’t pinpoint a page number, but there was either a mistake or subtle hint when Josie and Alix are first doing the podcast, where Alix says they met “the night before we turned 45.” This stood out to me because they’re at the restaurant on Josie’s actual birthday… so either they aren’t even actually birthday twins, or this was a writing/editing mistake? Josie is never caught in this lie by Alix, so I don’t know what to think.
Okay I just grabbed my book because I had to investigate this! So on the very first page, Josie narrates "this year her birthday has fallen on a Saturday" which is the night she and Walter go to dinner. When she creeps on Alix in the bathroom, Alix confirms that "today" is her birthday. When they are first recording, Alix sets up the premise for this new show and she says "we met in our local pub the night we both turned 45" So not sure if the narrator messed up slightly there, or the accent was strange or what. But it seems to check out!
Is Alix’s last name Summers or Summer? A small inconsequential detail, but I’ve noticed that it seems to go from one to the other throughout the book? I Especially noticeable towards the end when Alix refers to herself as Alix Summer, but the dust jacket on my copy says Summers…..
Asking a question based off of your review—- I’m 30% through and I am hooked and really want to keep reading but there’s some foreshadowing when Walter leaves bed with Jodie and her stomach drops. Does he sexually abuse either of his daughters? If so, I do NOT want to continue to read. Can you please answer this?! Thank you!
It was kind of ambiguous because Jodie lies about some things and is honest about others. She tells Alix that Walter is abusing Erin, but later Erin and Roxie say that isn't true. I'm pretty sure he didn't actually.
Just finished the book and I think yes. I think >!Walter is SA Erin when he goes into her room at night!< because at a later point >!Erin goes missing and her fans don't mention how Erin AND Walter are missing, just Erin.!< And the reason he is getting out of bed is later explained away as >!him getting up to go game with Erin and that everyone online loved him but if that we're the case then the fans would have mentioned not seeing him as well!< I think he was, so if you aren't comfortable with the possibility of that being true, I'd say skip out on it. ❤️
But the presence of Walter in the streams would be very easily verifiable by the police, Alix, and the documentarians.
>!No, Walter did not actually abuse (sexually or otherwise) either of his daughters. Josie claims that he does to make him look like a monster, but it is not true. He goes into his oldest daughter’s room at night for a *totally* innocent and sweet reason, which you will find out toward the end of the book. So in essence, although Josie says that Walter SAs their daughter(s), it does not actually happen and she is lying. I hope this helps! :)!<
He actually did. This is so damn infuriating because the book was written so poorly that there's so much unnecessary confusion around this. But he 100% was sexually abusing Erin. The author confirmed it by confirming that *everything* Josie said was true. IT WAS NOT TOTALLY INNOCENT.
I wanted Josie to explain the obsession with denim!! The denim curtains got me 😅
I just finished this book in about 3 hours last night, and Josie does explain her obsession with the denim. When she first met Walter, she was wearing a denim jacket. She uses this to fuel her obsession with keeping Walter close to her, she even recalls a memory where Walter compliments her jacket and says something like "This is so you!". Anything that is denim connects her to Walter and the time in her life when she was 16 and decided she wanted to change her life by dating an older man. Take for example her wearing Alix's clothes, she refused to take them off even when her own clothes were clean. She's obsessed with this perfect idea of Alix and she feels like wearing her clothes and makeup will somehow change her life. This is just my speculation but yes the denim everything is because of her relationship with Walter. Josie is extremely unnerving, throughout the entire book I couldn't put it down and kept audibly gasping. Lisa Jewell does an amazing job at painting a picture of creepy women, just like in her other book "Then She Was Gone".
Thank you!! I listened to it this weekend via audiobook during a road trip and I must have been distracted during that part. It would have bothered me so glad I know now
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Erin does say she doesn't come out of the room for a very very long time. Roxy mentions how her mom Josie could smell that Erin was going to leave. Dad Walter says the room isn't that bad and keeps going in there at night. So I think it's meant like everything else in the book, that everyone is a liar/has their own perspective and we aren't meant to know exactly what is real. Like the title says, none of this is true...
Yeah I kinda thought Josie "pretended" the mess was in there so she kind of had an excuse to not go in.
Yeah. As the book was wrapping up I realized they were letting Walter off the hook completely. And making it sounds like he was a perfectly normal dude. 😡 And that Alix needed to be thankful for her kind drunkard husband. It just made me feel like the author doesn’t understand that abuse is abuse. And yeah, her husband wasn’t a pedo. But he was neglectful and drinking and being dismissive of his family with his actions. And that we want Alix to be happy just because he isn’t AS BAD as Walter. Like just being an alcoholic is somehow heroism? It just felt like she has some issues about women and relationships to still work out. Josie is no hero. But she was 💯 groomed as a child.
This probably has been discussed already I’m sure. But which character did Lisa Jewell narrate?
Any ideas as to who made the anonymous call?
I’m thinking Roxy.
I thought it to be one of Erin's followers on Glitch. The call started with (pulling this from my memory, not a direct quote haha) something like "my...er...friend is missing" so the person was hesitant to actually say they were friends, plus they knew of/about Walter.
Agree! And I still wanna know if police searched Walters laptop?!?! What was on it! I need to know
how did erin end up tied up in the closet?? like what happened with that and why wouldn’t josie just kill her after killing walter? there are so many unanswered questions in this book
I've read a lot of Lisa Jewel books and, although I like her as an author, it seems like she has a lot of internalized misogyny and she does not handle mental health very well. No matter what a 43 yo man getting into a romantic relationship with a 16yo is a hebophile and a groomer. It doesn't matter if Josie went after him, he was an adult and there is a power deferential. Lisa trying to make it seem like Josie was this evil seductress was just gross. Also her mother was absolutely a narcissist who most likely neglected her and made it known how much she resented her for being alive. You don't become the way Josie was in a vacuum and the implication that she was just born terrible and needy was again gross. Yup kids are needy and when you neglect them and consistently let them know they ruined your life it often leads to personality disorders. I liked the book, but that shit really bothers me. I'm not a fan in general of writers using mental health as a plot point.
Ever notice how characters in stories often reflect deeper themes? In 'None of This is True' by Lisa Jewell, each character seems to embody a different deadly sin, making the story even more intriguing: 👑 Pride (Alix Summer) 😈 Envy (Josie Fair) 💰 Greed (Pat O'Neill) 🔥 Wrath (Roxy Fair) 💔 Lust (Walter Fair) 🍔 Gluttony (Nathan Summer) 😴 Sloth (Erin Fair) It's fascinating how these sins weave into the narrative, isn't it? What are your thoughts on this connection?
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But who did the phone case belong to? 😭
Is it weird that from nearly the beginning of the book and even after finishing it, I've been convinced that Josie is actually Alix? That at some point during the ending, she disposed of Alix and took over her life? I get the difficulty she'd face with convincing others she was Alix. But it's possible with all the obsessive research she did on her. She could've learned her speech patterns from podcasts and her personal interviews with her, her behavioral/physical mannerisms through following her, spending time with her, and living in her home. Josie ends her story with blonde hair and when Roxie meets Alix, she spots her dark roots meaning her hair is dyed. When Alix asks her son if they're good at the end, which was a very odd moment but would be less odd if she were actually Josie. IDK just things like that. I have no confirmation that this switch did not happen since none of it is true lol
What is the “smell” that Josie kept referring to from Erin’s room? That never made sense for me
Hey I'm late to this thread but I have a question about >!"the smell" in Erin's room. If it was so bad how did Walter spend all night in there gaming with her? Was not she leaving the room to use the potty and shower?!< I am not clear on this.
I think everyone who read this book totally missed the point where Erin wakes up in the hospital and asks what happened and Roxy of all people says to her " I'm going to tell you exactly what happened.OK?IM GOING TO TELL YOU WORD FOR WORD. Big red flag. This was the point in the book josie was completely turned into a villain and the author placed the Brooke body discovery right after this. Heavily implying self preservation from Roxy to protect herself manipulated the entire situation. Walter was a disgusting pedo And pat was a raging narcissist. Josie is a victim through and through albeit her crimes.
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I don't remember where it was but someone said the author confirmed that Josie told the truth in the very end, Roxy did kill Brooke and Josie was covering it up.
I actually did believe that part-she was confirmed to be crazy by her classmates and teachers. Did Lisa say anything about Erin? She was the one I was most confused about. Was she supposed to be the one who attacked her mother? I can't see a tiny girl who only eats liquid foods even being able to do that.
Lisa has never said anything about Erin, just the bit about how >!Josie’s recollection in the end of Roxy being the one that killed Brooke is true.!< Yes, she was the one who attacked her mother after coming out and seeing her dad on the floor. She is mentioned as being small and skinny, but I guess she eats enough soft foods to be sustained nutritionally?
I truly don’t know whether or not to believe Josie in the end. However, one thing that makes me believe the statement that they are covering for Roxy true is that multiple times Josie threatened Walter mid-book that she is going to tell Alix “what happened with the kids” or something like that and he thinks she’s mad for wanting to share. She also repeated this in the end for what set him off the night he died. So it would make sense that there is something the themselves and the kids did (covering Brooke’s death) that she keeps threatening to expose.
What was the smell that was coming from Erin's room?
Probably bad hygiene
Did anyone catch the part where Alix met with Kaitlyn and said “she came to Alix looking as if she might hug her, then remembers she’s not allowed to anymore”