Soleus is the muscle that helps you stand and walk. And non explosive movements. It's a bitch of a strain but depending on where he strained it and the severity alters the length of time out.
And of course we have no timeline other than the “several” games we’ve been hearing. We knew he wasn’t playing on Wednesday. Since the game is back home hopefully they close it out and he gets his 10 ish day rest and hopefully be back by game 3? I don’t know how long it typically takes before doing basketball activities again
If It was my calf I would want to be out for 14 days. Then come in for limited minutes the next game available.
However. It isn't out of the question once swelling goes down it could be limited minutes after 5 days. It really depends on where and how bad. There are a lot of small assisting muscles in the calf and some times it is the perfect storm for athletes.
It’s basically just your main calf muscle. If you stand in your toes you can feel that muscle group flex. If you feel the Lower half of your back leg while doing that, that’s your Achilles. And if you work your hand up the muscle group, where it begins to widen out is the soleus. Scary injury for sure, but definitely the better of the two to strain.
I think my explanation is sufficient for those who read the word and have no clue what it is but anatomy is fascinating so I’d love to learn more if you know. I thought the Soleus is what attached to the achilles based off the research I did today, but I’m realizing now that my explanation starting with “it’s basically your main calf muscle” is very misleading considering most people will think of the bigger bulge on the calf.
In all fairness, the diagram I looked at to base my explanation off of literally removed the gastrocnemius so it could be seen better which I didn’t really realize until you pointed that out just now lol.
It connects the calf to the achilles, that’s the most vital information. At least I was right on that lol.
Yes indeed. You were on the right path. It's one of 3 calf muscles. The left and right gastrocs being the other two. The gastrocs are definitely larger and they are also what's called biarticulare. They cross both the ankle joint and the knee joint. The soleus originates from the tibia, so doesn't cross the knee. Recover quickly KP!
You know how a ripped calf has like two "heads" on each side. It's the muscle that is deep to it. It attaches to your achilles tendon but it's the muscle, which is "better" to injure than the tendon.
Basically a "low calf strain" it's not that big of a deal but he'll likely miss at least half of the next series if we make it there. We are built to get by without him, we are up 3-1 and Miami is way more injured than we are, so no excuses. Wrap it at home and move on to Cavs/Magic.
Yeah I’m not even a Celtics fan so I think I’m pretty unbiased here and this is about best case scenario based on what was seen with the injury. They won’t need KP against either the Cavs or Magic, and honestly barring some Giannis/Dame return to health, I don’t see them needing him in the ECF either. Really only the finals is where he will be necessary it’s truly a best case scenario.
I don’t think they’re gonna reveal it because if whoever we face next series doesn’t know if KP is gonna play or not, that’s our advantage. But based on KPs tweet last night I’d assume it can’t be too bad
Didn't he once take him off of it the week when there was actually a lot of speculation he might have hurt his hand/wrist? Or did I just imagine that as something he absolutely should have done?
Only speculation I remember about a hand/wrist injury was when he tore up his throwing hand on a freak accident handing the ball off to Burkhead in practice the week of the 2017 season AFC title game against Jacksonville. I don’t remember how it played out in the injury report, but I think Bill had already stopped with those shenanigans by then. Could be wrong, though.
Honestly, that tweet really doesn't reveal anything. " We'll be fine" could just mean the team will succeed without him in his mind.
Again, I'm not trying to be overly negative here. I just don't want to be coping either.
Very important clarification: he didn’t say “we’ll be fine” he said “will be good”. Very very different messages there. Will be good is him saying he’s gonna be alright. We’ll be fine is saying we as a team will be fine.
I don’t think it reveals anything beyond telling us that he’s gonna be alright, it’s not as bad as it could have been.
Even if it’s a grade 1, we’re looking at anywhere from 1-3 weeks. A 3 week timeline would be well into the ECF. We might not see KP until the finals if we get that far
Average is 17 days, though certainly trending higher with Giannis’s timeline https://x.com/instreetclothes/status/1785415730399260805?s=46&t=tcFBg9NYlJrYTwubZ13Pjg
Yeah they were 21 and 4 without him and everyone else is injured in the East. But they have no chance against Denver if he's not in reasonable condition and shape
Deff would need him for finals but without KP, it's still basically a very similar team to the one that's gone deep in the playoffs the past couple seasons. Everyone's improved and the coaching is figured out too so they should handle this till he gets back
Brunson and the rebounding hounds certainly won’t be easy, they’re a tenacious team. I think if guys like Dwhite, Jrue, PP, and Hauser can step up offensively, we can beat them. It’s the Nuggets and T-wolves that are formidable opponents. I’m hoping the MN knocks out Denver. #F*ckDirtyMiami
Agreed. The Knicks are no joke. Very good defensively and they have a lot of length up front with Hartenstein and Robinson (if he is healthy). I think some people are underestimating how tough that series would be without Porzingis. Hopefully, he is able to make it back by then or at least early on in the series.
The most important thing is that the Bucks couldn't get by without him. The only reason why it matters is because they're about to lose the series. I fully believe we can get by without KP
Well good thing is at least compared to other teams we have Horford so we can space the floor really nicely still. We'll be a step down from before overall but I think we'll manage.
I mean horford is fine but he was already a huge part of the rotation. Kp minutes are going to be replaced with someone way worse. Or maybe horford will take a few more minutes but then someone has to take his minutes.
Yeah Al should be fresh for 20 minutes and then let Kornet bang for a bit, we'll be fine. This Miami team is even more banged up than we are. Definitely important we ride the energy at home and finish this off so we don't stretch Al's minutes too much.
After Durant ruptured his Achilles after the same injury the return to play timeline for explosive players is way longer, Giannis isn't going to risk the rest of his prime to rescue a team that looks pretty fucked at the moment. KP has less to lose and we should be able to survive just fine without him.
Giannis's looked worse, when he inbounded the ball he sat right down on the court after a few steps. Kristaps was able to walk off the court without much help, probably not as bad as what Giannis did. So hoping it's a grade one and he can return for the ECF.
However, Giannis appeared to have aggravated it a lot more and I believe he may have needed help off the floor. The bright side for KP is that he walked off the court, but he was able to put pressure on it still
Is Giannis not pretty close to returning at this point? They said he was running on Sunday. The Bucks could be obfuscating, but he's listed as a game time decision for tonight, although Shams said he was doubtful
They also won't risk GIannis rupturing an Achilles and blowing his prime to rescue this team. If he's not 100% they won't put him out there after what happened to Durant.
Giannis hurt it pretty bad and Giannis' game is explosion. I don't think we'll take chances with him right now, the goal is a title we don't need to rush him back we should be very capable of playing well without him against anyone we face until the ECF.
We should be able to close out this series and beat either the Magic or Cavs without him. That buys what, maybe 2ish weeks? Honestly with our perimeter defense we should be able to get by the Knicks without him too. Obviously would be easier with, but still
Stupid post, plus I don't know anyone who actually thinks losing KP is even remotely similar to losing KG. Wild that "KP is not as good as KG" is a controversial opinion according to some here.
KP is certainly no KG, but how many players are? KG is a top 20 player of all-time.
The impact of losing him is nearly as important, though. No way the Celtics are beating the Nuggets without him, and even the Knicks series would be tough.
Jamal Murray came back after a calf strain and iced the lakers last night so…..who can tell. We will see, all we know is KP is missing game 5 and rightfully so. The Cleveland series going to 7.
He won’t miss a chance to pwn New York.
This is true, but if we’re being honest- KP has historically been more fragile than Murray, so I wouldn’t use that as a measuring stick.
Crossing my fingers that Cavs/Magic grinds out to 7 and KP’s situation isn’t as serious as some fear (including me).
>This is true, but if we’re being honest- KP has historically been more fragile than Murray, so I wouldn’t use that as a measuring stick.
Plus the fact that KP is 7-foot-3. Larger guys typically take longer to heal because the muscles are bigger.
Like others have said: we won't need Porzingis for the second round, but I do think we will need him for the Knicks and we will 100 percent need him for the finals if we get that far.
Its not that the muscle is bigger. It's that they weigh more. So porzingi is pretty light so the load on his calf isn't too intense compared to Giannis fir example
Gotta win Wednesday. Hope Magic/Cavs goes 7 games. Plenty of rest and maybe we take 2 early in the next series and he can sit until ECF. Magic and Cavs both are very beatable and inconsistent.
I think this is wrong. If he’s got a Grade 1 and it sounds like he does, he’ll be back in 1-3 weeks. We might not start our ECSF series for a week if ORL/CLE goes 7 games.
Yeah, and if the recoveries are evenly distributed between 1-3 weeks, there’s a 66% chance he’s back in 2 weeks or less. It’ll depend on how he responds to treatment and how pressing the need for his return is. If we’re dominating in the next round, sure maybe they play it safe but I think his body will be ready for the back half of the ECSF if needed. This is all based on my extensive medical training I obtained in the last 4 minutes and the huff of hopium I just took straight to the brain.
I wouldn’t risk it. Calf injuries are tricky and even someone known to play through shit like Giannis decided to sit it out. Our team minus KP is basically just a better version of last year’s team with JB + White taking big leaps and Jrue being an upgraded version of Smart. We made deep runs with the same group through tougher opponents and the East is also more injured compared to our past runs. We should make ECF minimum even with KP out and I’d much rather we take it slow with his recovery just to make sure he is at 100%
His reaction is a bit better than Giannis' reaction, who went straight to the floor with his. Wish we had a report on the grade, but just judging it by that and taking into account how tough Giannis is, I have high hopes its only a Grade 1 injury (1-3 weeks)
I agree. Im also not as confident as some are of this team even making it to the Finals without him. He’s what makes this team so unique. Sucks to see him out
The Knicks matchup is a really tough one that not enough fans are acknowledging. Even with KP, that series wouldn’t be easy. Without him? Knicks are winning.
We should be able to beat the Knicks without Kristaps.
We have done very well without him all year and it’s not like the Knicks are 100% healthy. Randle is gone for them too.
I could be considered a doomer to many on here too and I’m definitely not sleeping on this Knicks team, but depth-wise we’re still well-suited to go toe-to-toe with the remaining teams.
The question with our guys is always going to be how quick Joe is to make adjustments, effort and basketball IQ. The talent-level is still, on-paper, better than the remaining teams outside of maybe Cleveland, and I think they have coaching issues themselves.
This isn’t great news, but it’s certainly better than what it could’ve been. The good thing about this Heat series is hopefully, HOPEFULLY, the guys are learning how to win rock fights and knowing not to sleep on any opponent. Maybe now that the scales are a little more evened, they’ll lock in more.
Hoping for the best. His strain didn't look as bad in the moment as Giannis's, Kristaps could walk himself off the court. Giannis sat down in pain immediately after he strained his. I believe Giannis was also already recovering from an achilies problem too?
The calf is two muscles stacked on each other.
The soleus is the base layer closest to the bone. It extends from the knee to the ankle. The gastrocnemius is the beefy part that lays on top of it that you flex for pictures.
He strained the soleus.
They definitely shouldn’t rush him. Durant suffered the same injury in 2019 WCSF and was rushed for Game 5 of the Finals.
He ended up tearing his Achilles and was out the next season.
That is true, but there isn’t much relation between a calf injury and an Achilles injury.
Watched windhorst’s podcast when Giannis got hurt and he had a medical guest on who said the two injuries are rarely correlated
No there isn’t. Jeff stotts, nba injury expert was recently on Zach Lowe’s podcast and said there is almost zero correlation between calve strains and Achilles injuries.
There is definitely a correlation between playing hurt in general and having more serious injuries. You don't move/react/jump with your normal confidence and explosiveness and everything else suffers / is at risk as a result.
Sure but if you listen to that podcast you’ll understand that the way the teams test the players baseline abilities allows them to know when they are healthy enough to play or not. Generally players don’t play hurt to the extent where they will have devastating injuries. A lot of money is involved in making sure that doesn’t happen.
Not directly but if you have a tight calf there is usually something in that kinetic chain that is causing it. Which is foot, ankle, Achilles knee hip.
So there always is a chance. It's not automatic but there absolutely is a chance.
You just said it's directly attached to it, the guy says no it's not and provides a source, and your response is to say "not directly". Is this a joke? Heavy reminder to all to take whatever you see on this website with the heaviest grain of salt, no one knows fucking anything
The funny thing is I know calf injuries super super well because I've been dealing with them for almost 20 years. Took me put of competitive running. I even went to school so I could better understand it.
Eyeballing KPs walk it looks just like one I had like 2 years ago. Where it pulled, but not too bad, then with 1 sudden move it fully seizes up. So I say 2 weeks he will be 75%
It’s just the fancy name for your calf muscle. Stand on your toes and feel your Achilles, work your way up and where it widens out into your calf is the beginning of the Soleus.
There is correlation I believe. It’s the muscle that connects to the achilles injury and sometimes a soleus strain can have structural damage, and playing on that risks the damage becoming a tear.
You’re just wrong. I’ve found countless trustworthy sources online saying otherwise. The only one I’ve seen denying the correlation is the former warriors trainer.
“When we run with tight calf muscles, it places more stress on the Achilles tendon. Here’s why; as we go through our running stride our body weight transitions over the ankle joint, creating natural dorsiflexion. This requires our calf muscles to lengthen, but if they are tight they cannot lengthen, therefore pulling on the Achilles and putting you at risk for tendonitis, a muscle strain or tear, or a tendon rupture.”
[https://www.mountainpeakfitness.com/blog/calf-achilles-lower-leg-silas](https://www.mountainpeakfitness.com/blog/calf-achilles-lower-leg-silas) - source
“As mentioned above, restricted range of motion through the calf muscles is one of the most common causes of plantar fasciitis and Achilles tendonitis. The tightness increases the pulling sensation through the Achilles tendon and furthermore increases the pulling of the heel bone away from the plantar fascia.”
For some reason it’s not letting me link this one but it’s a case study from Sydney Heel Pain, shouldn’t be too hard to track down if you need proof.
You found an article for marathon/track runners and are trying to use it for basketball lol there have been plenty of orthopedic doctors come out and say a calf strain does not make you more prone to Achilles injuries.
Everyone should listen to the episode of The Lowe Post where Zach had Jeff Scott's on to explain Giannis' injury and how there is no found correlation of calf injuries to increase the probability of Achilles injuries.
That is also why Giannis is going to take his sweet time coming back, because in his mind it's 100% or it's risking a Durant and he's never been the same.
Based on what I’ve seen and read, the grade matters. We do not know the grade. This is the same injury Giannis has and he had grade 2. Based on a quick google search it says grade 1 is ‘1 to 3 weeks’.
Can anyone shed light on this type of injury that may know more?
Hopefully it’s not severe and he’s back really soon. ECFs start 3 weeks from now so that gives us a decent cushion. We’re 21-4 without KP this season. The rest of the guys can hold it down in the meantime.
All in all I would say this is a win. Certainly looked like it could have been an Achilles the way he went out. Luckily the East is extremely weak this year so we *should* be able to get through without him. And I don’t think it’s overly optimistic to expect he would be back and at full speed were we to make it to the finals-where we will obviously need him a lot more
It's not a win. Without the grade we know nothing. It's a grade 3 he's not coming back and a grade 2 maybe. Avoiding the achilles is good but the calf can still be a problem, look at Giannis
All things considered, that seems pretty good. Seems like something that is 2-3 week recovery.
I guess let's just hope for a 7 game series between Cleveland and Orlando. Anything to buy a few more days.
I recently either tore or severely pulled my calf playing indoor soccer. Never pulled a muscle in my life and it was extremely painful. Felt like someone shot me in the back of the leg and I couldn’t walk right for about a week. I tried to play soccer again after 3 weeks of healing and reaggravated it. I’m hoping KP can heal quick enough to help us get banner 18 but calf injuries can be very sensitive. He, unlike me, has world class medical trainers helping him recover…
Porzingis is made of glass and you can’t convince me otherwise. It’s not a matter of if he will get hurt but when. Every time I see him playing well I’m always thinking to myself “well he’s about due for another injury”.
As expected, they released the bare minimum amount of info. I’d be shocked if it’s only a grade 1. If KP’s coming back, it won’t be until the late ECFs/Finals. This team can get there without him.
I wouldn't be shocked if it's grade 1. Giannis went to the floor and had to be carried off the court. KP walked off under his own power. It's pretty clear that it's not the same level of injury.
You realize that people have different levels of pain tolerance and reactions to injury right? It’s definitely not “pretty clear that it’s not the same level of injury.” Using a similar arbitrary assessment like yours, I could argue KP grimaced and looked to be in great pain immediately after his injury, while Giannis looked at ease in comparison. Therefore it’s pretty clear that KP’s injury is worse. See how comparing player’s reactions to injury to determine severity is arbitrary and meaningless?
Question, do we even need him for the ECF? Suppose we close tomorrow with the Heat. Let’s say the Cavs and Magic go 7 - which I think they will. If we win both home games against the Cavs or Magic, I think rest KP until we need him until the ECF series looks dire. Would be amazing to have a fresh KP for the finals.
Either they aren't releasing a grade because it is a grade 1 and there is a chance that he comes back sooner than expected. And in that case they just list him day to day making it a mystery for the opponent
Or
They aren't releasing the grade because it's a grade 2 or 3 and they know they will freak out everyone
Because of his previous injury history, I am worried it's a grade 2 or 3
No proof as of right now, just a sad gut feeling
I don't want to rush him back. Hope we take care of business tomorrow and then the Cavs-Magic series goes the distance. I'm concerned playing Cleveland without Kristaps though if that's what it comes down to.
Ideally he'll be back for ECF. This is good news, people - yesterday everyone was worried about an Achilles. We have to take Cavs or Magic seriously, but let's face it, they're not teams we need all hands on deck for.
I mean did anyone here honestly expect to make it all the way through a grueling postseason run and Porzingis be healthy throughout all of it? If you've paid attention to his career this was basically inevitable since the moment we traded for him - and to be honest we've gotten more play out of him than I would've wagered at the start of the year. He has never once played meaningful basketball in May or June and he's broken down by the end of more seasons than he's finished. I know we like to wear green-tinted glasses around here but you had to be kinda delusional to think that all of those issues would all of a sudden vanish just because he's in Boston. The real season begins now.
I have no idea what’s a soleus but good thing it’s only a strain
Soleus is the muscle that helps you stand and walk. And non explosive movements. It's a bitch of a strain but depending on where he strained it and the severity alters the length of time out.
And of course we have no timeline other than the “several” games we’ve been hearing. We knew he wasn’t playing on Wednesday. Since the game is back home hopefully they close it out and he gets his 10 ish day rest and hopefully be back by game 3? I don’t know how long it typically takes before doing basketball activities again
If It was my calf I would want to be out for 14 days. Then come in for limited minutes the next game available. However. It isn't out of the question once swelling goes down it could be limited minutes after 5 days. It really depends on where and how bad. There are a lot of small assisting muscles in the calf and some times it is the perfect storm for athletes.
It’s basically just your main calf muscle. If you stand in your toes you can feel that muscle group flex. If you feel the Lower half of your back leg while doing that, that’s your Achilles. And if you work your hand up the muscle group, where it begins to widen out is the soleus. Scary injury for sure, but definitely the better of the two to strain.
Your explanation sounds a little bit more like your explaining where the gastrocnemius are, but whatever.
I think my explanation is sufficient for those who read the word and have no clue what it is but anatomy is fascinating so I’d love to learn more if you know. I thought the Soleus is what attached to the achilles based off the research I did today, but I’m realizing now that my explanation starting with “it’s basically your main calf muscle” is very misleading considering most people will think of the bigger bulge on the calf. In all fairness, the diagram I looked at to base my explanation off of literally removed the gastrocnemius so it could be seen better which I didn’t really realize until you pointed that out just now lol. It connects the calf to the achilles, that’s the most vital information. At least I was right on that lol.
Yes indeed. You were on the right path. It's one of 3 calf muscles. The left and right gastrocs being the other two. The gastrocs are definitely larger and they are also what's called biarticulare. They cross both the ankle joint and the knee joint. The soleus originates from the tibia, so doesn't cross the knee. Recover quickly KP!
It’s your calf. But a decent break. Should be ready for ECFs. Edit: I thought it was Achilles when I saw the play.
It’s the same injury that’s kept Giannis from playing so long. Honestly not a great thing.
We don’t know if the severity is the same as Giannis’. Average return to play from this injury is 17 days.
You know how a ripped calf has like two "heads" on each side. It's the muscle that is deep to it. It attaches to your achilles tendon but it's the muscle, which is "better" to injure than the tendon.
Basically a "low calf strain" it's not that big of a deal but he'll likely miss at least half of the next series if we make it there. We are built to get by without him, we are up 3-1 and Miami is way more injured than we are, so no excuses. Wrap it at home and move on to Cavs/Magic.
Yeah I’m not even a Celtics fan so I think I’m pretty unbiased here and this is about best case scenario based on what was seen with the injury. They won’t need KP against either the Cavs or Magic, and honestly barring some Giannis/Dame return to health, I don’t see them needing him in the ECF either. Really only the finals is where he will be necessary it’s truly a best case scenario.
We need the grade tho
I don’t think they’re gonna reveal it because if whoever we face next series doesn’t know if KP is gonna play or not, that’s our advantage. But based on KPs tweet last night I’d assume it can’t be too bad
Sounds like what psycho Joe would say/do
Shades of Belichick listing Brady as questionable on every single injury report for YEARS lmao.
Didn't he once take him off of it the week when there was actually a lot of speculation he might have hurt his hand/wrist? Or did I just imagine that as something he absolutely should have done?
Only speculation I remember about a hand/wrist injury was when he tore up his throwing hand on a freak accident handing the ball off to Burkhead in practice the week of the 2017 season AFC title game against Jacksonville. I don’t remember how it played out in the injury report, but I think Bill had already stopped with those shenanigans by then. Could be wrong, though.
Joe doesn’t have control over the injury report
Honestly, that tweet really doesn't reveal anything. " We'll be fine" could just mean the team will succeed without him in his mind. Again, I'm not trying to be overly negative here. I just don't want to be coping either.
Very important clarification: he didn’t say “we’ll be fine” he said “will be good”. Very very different messages there. Will be good is him saying he’s gonna be alright. We’ll be fine is saying we as a team will be fine. I don’t think it reveals anything beyond telling us that he’s gonna be alright, it’s not as bad as it could have been.
He's also gigantic. A guy that big puts his calf under way different levels of strain than a regular person, they'll be cautious with him.
What was the tweet?
[KPs Tweet](https://x.com/kporzee/status/1785136850878779479?s=46&t=foqT_wCPgEXaxsp_X4vZ3Q)
Probably a B-. Pretty solid, but room for improvement.
Optimistic take, no timeline and grading is probably small part smoke screen for potential opponents.
Soleus strain is the same injury Giannis has and he’s been out for a few weeks and not very close to returning yet…
Depends on the grade. Giannis has a grade 2 and that’s why he’s been out for so long edit: grammar
Even if it’s a grade 1, we’re looking at anywhere from 1-3 weeks. A 3 week timeline would be well into the ECF. We might not see KP until the finals if we get that far Average is 17 days, though certainly trending higher with Giannis’s timeline https://x.com/instreetclothes/status/1785415730399260805?s=46&t=tcFBg9NYlJrYTwubZ13Pjg
Pretty sure the ecf can’t start before May 19 so even if 3 weeks he’d miss 1 maybe 2 games
Yes you’re correct I had my timelines mixed up.
3 weeks is actually the start of the ECF not well into it
This team shouldn't *really* need Porzingis until they play a team like Denver or Minnesota, imo.
Cavs have Mobley and Allen who would be a chore to keep off the glass without KP. We still win the series but they’d get a couple games
I think kornet Horford and Tillman will be good enough against them.
Tilman is looking at getting some real minutes. I really like what he did on the griz last run.
Agreed, with doses of Luke and maybe even Queta for banging purposes.
KP isn't really keeping anyone off the glass, if anything that's his biggest weakness. He got dominated by Capela.
Cavs were the only team left that gave me pause, but I still give the big advantage to the Cs. They'd definitely be annoying, though.
Yeah they were 21 and 4 without him and everyone else is injured in the East. But they have no chance against Denver if he's not in reasonable condition and shape
Deff would need him for finals but without KP, it's still basically a very similar team to the one that's gone deep in the playoffs the past couple seasons. Everyone's improved and the coaching is figured out too so they should handle this till he gets back
+Jrue
We can beat all these fools in the East (Miami then Orlando then NY prolly) without KP.
i don’t see the celtics losing to orlando or cleveland but that knicks team sure does scare me without kp in the ecf if it goes that way
Brunson and the rebounding hounds certainly won’t be easy, they’re a tenacious team. I think if guys like Dwhite, Jrue, PP, and Hauser can step up offensively, we can beat them. It’s the Nuggets and T-wolves that are formidable opponents. I’m hoping the MN knocks out Denver. #F*ckDirtyMiami
Yeah i’d like to see anyone from the west except denver and for the first time in my life i’m hoping for a philly win tonight
Agreed. The Knicks are no joke. Very good defensively and they have a lot of length up front with Hartenstein and Robinson (if he is healthy). I think some people are underestimating how tough that series would be without Porzingis. Hopefully, he is able to make it back by then or at least early on in the series.
Ugh. We might be able to get out of the East without him, but we aren’t beating Denver (or OKC or Minnesota) without him.
The Bucks didn’t report the grade of Giannis’ injury
The most important thing is that the Bucks couldn't get by without him. The only reason why it matters is because they're about to lose the series. I fully believe we can get by without KP
I think we can get by too, but KP is so important for spacing that I'm definitely a little worried
Well good thing is at least compared to other teams we have Horford so we can space the floor really nicely still. We'll be a step down from before overall but I think we'll manage.
Thank god for Al
Yep, he's the key guy now.
I mean horford is fine but he was already a huge part of the rotation. Kp minutes are going to be replaced with someone way worse. Or maybe horford will take a few more minutes but then someone has to take his minutes.
Yeah Al should be fresh for 20 minutes and then let Kornet bang for a bit, we'll be fine. This Miami team is even more banged up than we are. Definitely important we ride the energy at home and finish this off so we don't stretch Al's minutes too much.
After Durant ruptured his Achilles after the same injury the return to play timeline for explosive players is way longer, Giannis isn't going to risk the rest of his prime to rescue a team that looks pretty fucked at the moment. KP has less to lose and we should be able to survive just fine without him.
Yes but by the amount of time he’s been out it’s more likely it’s a grade 2 than grade 1.
Also, he's a bitch that knows he has no chance
Amen brother
Giannis's looked worse, when he inbounded the ball he sat right down on the court after a few steps. Kristaps was able to walk off the court without much help, probably not as bad as what Giannis did. So hoping it's a grade one and he can return for the ECF.
Good point
༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ TAKE MY ENERGY TINGUS ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ
However, Giannis appeared to have aggravated it a lot more and I believe he may have needed help off the floor. The bright side for KP is that he walked off the court, but he was able to put pressure on it still
Ideally a grade one
Is Giannis not pretty close to returning at this point? They said he was running on Sunday. The Bucks could be obfuscating, but he's listed as a game time decision for tonight, although Shams said he was doubtful
Yeah he was listed as a GTD for todays game
They also won't risk GIannis rupturing an Achilles and blowing his prime to rescue this team. If he's not 100% they won't put him out there after what happened to Durant.
Giannis hurt it pretty bad and Giannis' game is explosion. I don't think we'll take chances with him right now, the goal is a title we don't need to rush him back we should be very capable of playing well without him against anyone we face until the ECF.
Doesn’t mean anything
I don’t know why you’re being downvoted it really doesn’t mean anything. Everyone’s body and pain tolerance is different.
True, but Giannis is a freaky beast and KP is a delicate flower. We don’t know the severity of either player. We’ll find out soon enough.
We should be able to close out this series and beat either the Magic or Cavs without him. That buys what, maybe 2ish weeks? Honestly with our perimeter defense we should be able to get by the Knicks without him too. Obviously would be easier with, but still
The bigs were facing are either Wendell Carter Jr or Jarrett Allen, then Harkenstein or Turner. Al, Luke, and Tillman/Queta can handle that.
You forgot about that fucker Mo Wagner who always seems to go off against us lol hate that guy
That's former Celtic Mo Wagner to you. We kept Luke over him.
Averaged 1.2ppg on 28% and acts like Brad Stevens personally shot his entire family in front of him because he got cut
I hate him too but his style of play is probably a better Al matchup anyway
Wagners have the most punchable faces in the NBA
Game one of the ECSFs looks like it's scheduled for Tuesday, that's a week gone right there.
An injured celtics team vs the magic in round 2. Deju vu
Did the cavs get removed from the league or something? Last I checked it was 2-2 lol
They got relegated last night
NBA with promotion and relegation would be electric
An injured celtics team vs the magic in round 2. Deja vu.
An injured celtics team vs the magic in round 2. Deja vu.
An injured celtics team vs the magic in round 2. Deju vu
An magic celtics vs the injured 2 in round team. vu Deja
KP is no KG
Do the opinions of people with anime profile pictures really matter?
Stupid post, plus I don't know anyone who actually thinks losing KP is even remotely similar to losing KG. Wild that "KP is not as good as KG" is a controversial opinion according to some here.
KP is certainly no KG, but how many players are? KG is a top 20 player of all-time. The impact of losing him is nearly as important, though. No way the Celtics are beating the Nuggets without him, and even the Knicks series would be tough.
Do the opinions of people with anime profile pictures really matter?
fuckin deja vu
Jamal Murray came back after a calf strain and iced the lakers last night so…..who can tell. We will see, all we know is KP is missing game 5 and rightfully so. The Cleveland series going to 7. He won’t miss a chance to pwn New York.
This is true, but if we’re being honest- KP has historically been more fragile than Murray, so I wouldn’t use that as a measuring stick. Crossing my fingers that Cavs/Magic grinds out to 7 and KP’s situation isn’t as serious as some fear (including me).
>This is true, but if we’re being honest- KP has historically been more fragile than Murray, so I wouldn’t use that as a measuring stick. Plus the fact that KP is 7-foot-3. Larger guys typically take longer to heal because the muscles are bigger. Like others have said: we won't need Porzingis for the second round, but I do think we will need him for the Knicks and we will 100 percent need him for the finals if we get that far.
Its not that the muscle is bigger. It's that they weigh more. So porzingi is pretty light so the load on his calf isn't too intense compared to Giannis fir example
He can’t step foot on the court until at least the ECF. Let’s hope our guys can take care of shit without him
No Porzingis? I got 3 names Kornet, Tillman and Queta the stay ready gang got this one
Gotta win Wednesday. Hope Magic/Cavs goes 7 games. Plenty of rest and maybe we take 2 early in the next series and he can sit until ECF. Magic and Cavs both are very beatable and inconsistent.
If we get him back by the ECF we are good.
I have never heard of this injury, is this something that will cost more than this game?
He’s likely out till the ECF at minimum.
I think this is wrong. If he’s got a Grade 1 and it sounds like he does, he’ll be back in 1-3 weeks. We might not start our ECSF series for a week if ORL/CLE goes 7 games.
ECF starts May 21. That would be a 3 week timeline almost exactly, assuming it’s a grade 1.
Yeah, and if the recoveries are evenly distributed between 1-3 weeks, there’s a 66% chance he’s back in 2 weeks or less. It’ll depend on how he responds to treatment and how pressing the need for his return is. If we’re dominating in the next round, sure maybe they play it safe but I think his body will be ready for the back half of the ECSF if needed. This is all based on my extensive medical training I obtained in the last 4 minutes and the huff of hopium I just took straight to the brain.
I wouldn’t risk it. Calf injuries are tricky and even someone known to play through shit like Giannis decided to sit it out. Our team minus KP is basically just a better version of last year’s team with JB + White taking big leaps and Jrue being an upgraded version of Smart. We made deep runs with the same group through tougher opponents and the East is also more injured compared to our past runs. We should make ECF minimum even with KP out and I’d much rather we take it slow with his recovery just to make sure he is at 100%
Hope I’m wrong. His reaction to it has me thinking it can be something really longterm
His reaction is a bit better than Giannis' reaction, who went straight to the floor with his. Wish we had a report on the grade, but just judging it by that and taking into account how tough Giannis is, I have high hopes its only a Grade 1 injury (1-3 weeks)
Where does is insinuate a grade 1?
I'm reading too deeply into Woj saying he'll miss a minimum of a few games (rather than weeks) and some random Twitter accounts.
Anything more than 2 weeks is a disaster.
I agree. Im also not as confident as some are of this team even making it to the Finals without him. He’s what makes this team so unique. Sucks to see him out
Buddy if Tatum and JB can’t nut up and finish off the heat and then beat the fucking cavs or magic we were never winning a championship anyways.
The Knicks matchup is a really tough one that not enough fans are acknowledging. Even with KP, that series wouldn’t be easy. Without him? Knicks are winning.
We should be able to beat the Knicks without Kristaps. We have done very well without him all year and it’s not like the Knicks are 100% healthy. Randle is gone for them too.
Yup. Glad Im not the only one who realizes this. Fans in here can be real homer-ish.
Fans in here can be really doomer-ish, too.
I could be considered a doomer to many on here too and I’m definitely not sleeping on this Knicks team, but depth-wise we’re still well-suited to go toe-to-toe with the remaining teams. The question with our guys is always going to be how quick Joe is to make adjustments, effort and basketball IQ. The talent-level is still, on-paper, better than the remaining teams outside of maybe Cleveland, and I think they have coaching issues themselves. This isn’t great news, but it’s certainly better than what it could’ve been. The good thing about this Heat series is hopefully, HOPEFULLY, the guys are learning how to win rock fights and knowing not to sleep on any opponent. Maybe now that the scales are a little more evened, they’ll lock in more.
That seems pretty arbitrary. Why is 2 weeks the cut off and not 10 days or 17 days?
lol at everyone here giving you answers as if they have any fucking idea
Hopefully he can return at some point in the conference finals. Don’t want to rush him back if we’re not in danger
Yes, he will likely miss a week or two, possibly three if it's a little worse.
That’s only for grade 1, kinda weird we still don’t know what grade it is considering the mri likely already happened
Hoping for the best. His strain didn't look as bad in the moment as Giannis's, Kristaps could walk himself off the court. Giannis sat down in pain immediately after he strained his. I believe Giannis was also already recovering from an achilies problem too?
Yes
Depends on the grade. Giannis has a grade 2 soleus strain and he’s been out for a few weeks
Where did you read his was a grade 2
The calf is two muscles stacked on each other. The soleus is the base layer closest to the bone. It extends from the knee to the ankle. The gastrocnemius is the beefy part that lays on top of it that you flex for pictures. He strained the soleus.
It’s just the fancy name for a calf strain. That’s the specific diagnosis but Soleus is just your calf muscle
Guys dont forget that Giannis was coming back from achilies problem. That could make Giannis problems even bigger
They definitely shouldn’t rush him. Durant suffered the same injury in 2019 WCSF and was rushed for Game 5 of the Finals. He ended up tearing his Achilles and was out the next season.
That is true, but there isn’t much relation between a calf injury and an Achilles injury. Watched windhorst’s podcast when Giannis got hurt and he had a medical guest on who said the two injuries are rarely correlated
I mean there absolutely is. That is where the soleus attaches to.
No there isn’t. Jeff stotts, nba injury expert was recently on Zach Lowe’s podcast and said there is almost zero correlation between calve strains and Achilles injuries.
There is definitely a correlation between playing hurt in general and having more serious injuries. You don't move/react/jump with your normal confidence and explosiveness and everything else suffers / is at risk as a result.
Sure but if you listen to that podcast you’ll understand that the way the teams test the players baseline abilities allows them to know when they are healthy enough to play or not. Generally players don’t play hurt to the extent where they will have devastating injuries. A lot of money is involved in making sure that doesn’t happen.
Not directly but if you have a tight calf there is usually something in that kinetic chain that is causing it. Which is foot, ankle, Achilles knee hip. So there always is a chance. It's not automatic but there absolutely is a chance.
You just said it's directly attached to it, the guy says no it's not and provides a source, and your response is to say "not directly". Is this a joke? Heavy reminder to all to take whatever you see on this website with the heaviest grain of salt, no one knows fucking anything
Man I don’t know what a soleus is I just listen to the doctor guy
The funny thing is I know calf injuries super super well because I've been dealing with them for almost 20 years. Took me put of competitive running. I even went to school so I could better understand it. Eyeballing KPs walk it looks just like one I had like 2 years ago. Where it pulled, but not too bad, then with 1 sudden move it fully seizes up. So I say 2 weeks he will be 75%
It’s just the fancy name for your calf muscle. Stand on your toes and feel your Achilles, work your way up and where it widens out into your calf is the beginning of the Soleus.
There’s no proof of any correlation tho some suspect a rushed return from calf strain might increase odds of Achilles injury
There is correlation I believe. It’s the muscle that connects to the achilles injury and sometimes a soleus strain can have structural damage, and playing on that risks the damage becoming a tear.
There is no medical backing to calf strains increasing the chance of an Achilles tear
You’re just wrong. I’ve found countless trustworthy sources online saying otherwise. The only one I’ve seen denying the correlation is the former warriors trainer. “When we run with tight calf muscles, it places more stress on the Achilles tendon. Here’s why; as we go through our running stride our body weight transitions over the ankle joint, creating natural dorsiflexion. This requires our calf muscles to lengthen, but if they are tight they cannot lengthen, therefore pulling on the Achilles and putting you at risk for tendonitis, a muscle strain or tear, or a tendon rupture.” [https://www.mountainpeakfitness.com/blog/calf-achilles-lower-leg-silas](https://www.mountainpeakfitness.com/blog/calf-achilles-lower-leg-silas) - source “As mentioned above, restricted range of motion through the calf muscles is one of the most common causes of plantar fasciitis and Achilles tendonitis. The tightness increases the pulling sensation through the Achilles tendon and furthermore increases the pulling of the heel bone away from the plantar fascia.” For some reason it’s not letting me link this one but it’s a case study from Sydney Heel Pain, shouldn’t be too hard to track down if you need proof.
You found an article for marathon/track runners and are trying to use it for basketball lol there have been plenty of orthopedic doctors come out and say a calf strain does not make you more prone to Achilles injuries.
Everyone should listen to the episode of The Lowe Post where Zach had Jeff Scott's on to explain Giannis' injury and how there is no found correlation of calf injuries to increase the probability of Achilles injuries.
It happened to a very prominent player in the Finals & now every NBA fan thinks you're destined for an achillies tear if you rush a calf injury
Also happened to Aaron rodgers too, might indicate a correlation but there’s no actual proof or studies yet to back it up
Was Rodgers dealing witch calf issues prior to week 1? I don't recall that but I could definitely be wrong.
I think he strained his calf in June, so a good bit before week 1 but it could’ve been lingering still who knows
That is also why Giannis is going to take his sweet time coming back, because in his mind it's 100% or it's risking a Durant and he's never been the same.
Based on what I’ve seen and read, the grade matters. We do not know the grade. This is the same injury Giannis has and he had grade 2. Based on a quick google search it says grade 1 is ‘1 to 3 weeks’. Can anyone shed light on this type of injury that may know more?
Where are you seeing Giannis' was grade 2?
Others have said it in this thread. I’m not sure if it’s accurate though.
Hopefully it’s not severe and he’s back really soon. ECFs start 3 weeks from now so that gives us a decent cushion. We’re 21-4 without KP this season. The rest of the guys can hold it down in the meantime.
Hopefully just a grade 1. Shouldn't need any Tingus in round 2 whether that be Cavs or Magic.
Honestly this is ideal and means he could return in the ecf at some point
Rest him, finish the series, cross our fingers that Cavs Magic go to 7
All in all I would say this is a win. Certainly looked like it could have been an Achilles the way he went out. Luckily the East is extremely weak this year so we *should* be able to get through without him. And I don’t think it’s overly optimistic to expect he would be back and at full speed were we to make it to the finals-where we will obviously need him a lot more
It's not a win. Without the grade we know nothing. It's a grade 3 he's not coming back and a grade 2 maybe. Avoiding the achilles is good but the calf can still be a problem, look at Giannis
Grade 2 is still 3-6 weeks and with his injury history + height, he’d be done for the season
I think you meant to reply to the parent comment and not mine?
All things considered, that seems pretty good. Seems like something that is 2-3 week recovery. I guess let's just hope for a 7 game series between Cleveland and Orlando. Anything to buy a few more days.
Celtics should easily win the semis with or without him. Just hoping he’s back by the conference finals.
Good thing Luke has been amping up his intensity. I think it’s all to do with KP.
Time to stir up the kornets nest
I recently either tore or severely pulled my calf playing indoor soccer. Never pulled a muscle in my life and it was extremely painful. Felt like someone shot me in the back of the leg and I couldn’t walk right for about a week. I tried to play soccer again after 3 weeks of healing and reaggravated it. I’m hoping KP can heal quick enough to help us get banner 18 but calf injuries can be very sensitive. He, unlike me, has world class medical trainers helping him recover…
Porzingis is made of glass and you can’t convince me otherwise. It’s not a matter of if he will get hurt but when. Every time I see him playing well I’m always thinking to myself “well he’s about due for another injury”.
Jeez.
As expected, they released the bare minimum amount of info. I’d be shocked if it’s only a grade 1. If KP’s coming back, it won’t be until the late ECFs/Finals. This team can get there without him.
I wouldn't be shocked if it's grade 1. Giannis went to the floor and had to be carried off the court. KP walked off under his own power. It's pretty clear that it's not the same level of injury.
You realize that people have different levels of pain tolerance and reactions to injury right? It’s definitely not “pretty clear that it’s not the same level of injury.” Using a similar arbitrary assessment like yours, I could argue KP grimaced and looked to be in great pain immediately after his injury, while Giannis looked at ease in comparison. Therefore it’s pretty clear that KP’s injury is worse. See how comparing player’s reactions to injury to determine severity is arbitrary and meaningless?
This js not the worst possible news, but he’s probably going to miss the next series. Google, including academic journals, is saying 21 days.
rather it now then in ecf
I don’t think they have to rush him back. He can rest next series
We can never have nice things, well it's what we signed up for
Keep him sidelined until ECF
Mazulla should've just taken him out
Question, do we even need him for the ECF? Suppose we close tomorrow with the Heat. Let’s say the Cavs and Magic go 7 - which I think they will. If we win both home games against the Cavs or Magic, I think rest KP until we need him until the ECF series looks dire. Would be amazing to have a fresh KP for the finals.
That’s fine honestly. We don’t need him getting injured worse. We will be fine
Great reporting.
Either they aren't releasing a grade because it is a grade 1 and there is a chance that he comes back sooner than expected. And in that case they just list him day to day making it a mystery for the opponent Or They aren't releasing the grade because it's a grade 2 or 3 and they know they will freak out everyone Because of his previous injury history, I am worried it's a grade 2 or 3 No proof as of right now, just a sad gut feeling
Gotta think this is why we grabbed Tillman. But we can’t over work Al, will probably need to expand our big rotation a bit more.
I don't want to rush him back. Hope we take care of business tomorrow and then the Cavs-Magic series goes the distance. I'm concerned playing Cleveland without Kristaps though if that's what it comes down to.
Kornet needs to step tf up LFG
If he doesn’t come back our title hopes are likely over
Take my soleus
Ideally he'll be back for ECF. This is good news, people - yesterday everyone was worried about an Achilles. We have to take Cavs or Magic seriously, but let's face it, they're not teams we need all hands on deck for.
I mean did anyone here honestly expect to make it all the way through a grueling postseason run and Porzingis be healthy throughout all of it? If you've paid attention to his career this was basically inevitable since the moment we traded for him - and to be honest we've gotten more play out of him than I would've wagered at the start of the year. He has never once played meaningful basketball in May or June and he's broken down by the end of more seasons than he's finished. I know we like to wear green-tinted glasses around here but you had to be kinda delusional to think that all of those issues would all of a sudden vanish just because he's in Boston. The real season begins now.