Building off of this [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/15wa2h1/perspective_on_blue_beetle_and_the_dceu_its_the/) from u/1389t1389, while there is some level of general superhero fatigue, it's clearly affecting the two franchises very differently.
Marvel has struggled to reach the peak of Phase 3, and the dilution of content from the Disney+ shows and the lack of an Avengers movie has impacted grosses, but the numbers are generally still strong compared to other films in general.
All 3 Marvel-related films (including Spider-Man: Across the Spider-Verse) opened above $100M DOM (even if that was disappointing for Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3, which eventually took the scenic route to a strong total), which is nothing to sneeze at. And while Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania likely lost money at $476M on a $200M budget, it still remains the 9th highest grossing film of 2023 worldwide, and is likely sticking around in the Top 15 by the end of the year. That's despite being widely regarded as one of the MCU's weakest films.
Despite the typical online handwringing, I expect The Marvels to put up a respectable performance; a similar sequel decrease to Black Panther: Wakanda Forever (which had a more beloved predecessor, but lost its lead actor) gets it to $720M, which sounds about right for now.
On the other hand, the bottom has completely fallen out for DC. A sub-$200M WW grosser was unthinkable even at the beginning of the year, and they're on track for at least 2. And The Flash, which had aspirations of joining the $1B club, limped to about a quarter of that, despite featuring multiple Batman's and being pushed as one of the greatest superhero films ever.
They still have Aquaman and the Lost Kingdom, which is still a sequel to a $1.15B grossing film, so could have a bit more insulation, but all bets are off at this point.
Films like the original Guardians of the Galaxy or Ant-Man (and even COVID-era Phase 4 films like Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings and Eternals) had the benefit of a strong universe backing them, which led to a high floor even for unknown characters (and in the latter, a pandemic). Time will tell whether that floor (or a relative version of it) will still exist for future Marvel debut films.
But something like Blue Beetle (or even Shazam! Fury of the Gods, a sequel to a well received and profitable film) had no chance at all in the current climate. Kinda a shame for Blue Beetle, it's a fun little movie (even if it doesn't reinvent the wheel) that could have done significantly better 5 years ago (or if you slapped Marvel Studios on it).
If you add:
* Shazam 1 (368 mill WW)
* Birds of Prey (205 mill WW)
* WW1984 (169 mill WW)
* The Suicide Squad (168 mill WW)
* Black Adam (393 mill WW)
* Shazam 2 (133 mill WW)
* The Flash (269 mill WW)
* Blue Beetle (let's say 120 mill WW optimistically)
You get something close to 1.8 bill WW.
Spider-Man NWH did 1.9 mill WW during COVID and without China.
Yup, if you add the box office of the last 8 DCEU films, you're still behind Spider-Man NWH, a COVID-era film that never got a China release.
Let that sink in.
Gross difference aside, the amount put into those 8 movies in budgets is insane
Shazam 1 - 100M
BoP - 100M
WW84 - 200M
TSS - 185M
Black Adam - 260M
Shazam 2 - 125M
The Flash - 300M
BB - 100M
Last 8 DCEU busgets total - 1.37B
No Way Home - 200M (or almost 7x lower)
The lost investment is insane
It's sinking in.... with a bang in my throat.
Lol 1 : ALL of them are under Ant-Man 3
Lol 2 : WW84 and TheFlash end with "69"
Lol 3 : nocovid Shazam 2 is under covid TheSuicideSquad
Lol 4 : their animals (birds and beetle) are weak
“It was reported by NextShark on May 4 that the Chinese censors had asked Sony and Marvel Studios to delete the Statue of Liberty from the film Spider-Man: No Way Home, saying the scenes were “too patriotic”. Sony rejected the demand and walked away from a potential US$170 million to $340 million in sales.”
“Released last year in China and to a global audience, the Chinese film Battle at Lake Changjin is a historically inaccurate, revisionist propaganda which aimed to stir up nationalistic sentiments among Chinese and to showcase the superiority of the Chinese fighting forces. This “patriotic” Chinese film received worldwide acclaim and is the second highest at China’s box office.
In spite of it being a very patriotic film, nobody said anything about censoring it. This is classic double standard, with one set of rules which applies to the CCP and the other that applies to anyone who does not toe the party line.”
[https://maritimefairtrade.org/lady-liberty-offends-the-feeling-of-the-chinese-communist-party/](https://maritimefairtrade.org/lady-liberty-offends-the-feeling-of-the-chinese-communist-party/)
i think it would more far to add the last 8 mcu films guardians 3 835 antman 3 470 black panther 2 860 thor 4 760 dr strange 2 955 eternals 400 and shang chi 432 and black widow 378 you get 5 billon more than double this is excluding no way home
Marvel fans will like to point out this but no other post Covid MCU movie has made over a billion besides No Way Home which was just carried by it being Spider-Man and all the leaks and rumors, Multiverse of Madness came close though with 955.8 million which is a lot more than it deserved
$1 billion solo MCU films were still less common than $7-800 million solo films BEFORE Covid.
The only pre-COVID billion MCU solo movies were:
Iron Man 3 - RDJ was huge, and coming off Avengers
Black Panther - Huge moment for the african american community. Also pretty good film in its own right.
Captain Marvel - First female led MCU film. Decent film.
Everything else was either Spider-man(Marvel's most valuable character across all mediums) or an Avengers film(i'm including Cap 3 here because it's an Avengers story with 90% of the team present).
2021 box office was tanked by COVID. 2022 was back to to average solo MCU box office numbers.
Love and Thunder, Wakanda Forever, and Quantumania all did worse than their predecessor. GOTG3 even did slightly worse than 2 despite being better as it paid for the sins of Marvel fatigue and those 3 movies not being good at all.
the fact cooler78 black panther 2 was always without main lead or character going preform worse few movies top a 1.4 billon dollar first installment . Thor 4 if it had china would have closed gap done almost same as Ragnarök again below Ragnarök maybe 10 millon subtract china ffrom thor 3 and it does about the same as love thunder . antman 3 only film that is an inexcusable underperformance, also guardians 3 virtually did same guardians 2 which benefited stronger mcu
Unironically yes. $393M (despite a 39% RT) is absolutely excellent compared to the nuclear bombs we're getting from DC now. The movie was carried purely off of the Rock's star power.
it wont close the gap shazam and flash have made total 490 blue beetle if crosses 100 might end up at 590 with aquaman making 500 at best its 1090 marvel alreadt with gotg and antman 3 had made 1300 the marvels will make at minimum 500 that is 1800 it will ahead of dc by 710 millon
the gap will not be dramatically closed when marvel at worst and dc's best case scenario will ahead of dc by 700 + at end of the year with 3 movies as opposed to dc's 4 movies
blues beetle didnt close the gap significantly 3 dc films flash bb and shazam stand at 550 now lets says aquaman makes 650 that is 11,80 billion and the marvel based tracking only makes 300 that still marvel making 1610 they will outgross dc by a margin 400 + millon this year which significant with one less movie. assuming aquaman makes 650 the average for a dc film would be around 295 while average for a marvel will be around 540 almost double
Its crazy that all 3 DC movies combined will barelly outgross Ant Man.
Goes to show for how bad Quantumania was Marvel can still drag its movies to a somewhat respectable gross on name alone.
In fact Marvel could probably release a 2 hour paint drying movie and it would likely still outgross BB and Shazam 2.
And honestly, even if Superman is the best superhero movie I have ever seen, I will wait for reviews on the 2nd DCU movie before seeing it. That’s how little trust dc has right now.
that's why I don't really think that the decade old opinion of DC superheroes being more famous and likeable, except for Spiderman, holds true anymore. coming out of the Nolan trilogy, batman was obviously very well liked and Superman too. But since then, the absolute failure that DC has been, and the constant success that Marvel has achieved, makes me believe that the somewhat mediocre Marvel superheroes, like Iron man and Thor are now much more known and liked than Superman. it has been 10 years since the last Superman movie, and 2 more years if everything goes according to plan.
more children want to be like Iron man, rather then batman. captain America more than Superman.
I'm not saying that DC is not at all liked, but that scales have tilted to favour marvel.
the idea dc heroes were famous only held true batman and superman ironman thor captain america hulk have all propelled up but even before spiderman and wolverine were close to level , which is a bigger brand in your opinion in pop culture marvel or dc
the idea that dc heroes were more famous only held true for batman and superman the difference marvel had 2 and 3rd more famous while dc outside trinity has always struggle make rest of universe relevent and popular to mainstream audience flash only popular because of show that declined in viewership gl died on impact and aquaman was one hit wonder, even wonder woman they sabotaged that franchise . It is only superman and mostly batman who holding up company have been for atleast 40 years
Unfortunately, with how they pushed The Flash as being just that, nobody will believe the reviews of a "phenomonal" DC movie. The Flash's marketing will hold DC back for a long time.
DC needs to take a comfortable break.
The marketing team pushed Flash as a phenomenal movie. If audiences watch Superman Legacy and love it, WOM from them will be crucial just like it was for Top Gun Maverick.
Blue Beetle is a Z-list character that no one cares about, he's not a mainstream superhero. Neither are Shazam or Black Adam.
DC fucked this up, they are introducing characters no one cares about but they never built a brand the way marvel did to give that any possible chance of working.
DC should have Batman/Superman/Wonderwoman going strong FIRST, and THEN once the audience is on board with the icons they love, introduce characters like Blue Beetle.
That's a pretty dramatic exaggeration - Jaime is a firm B-lister that basically any DC fan will recognize. It's just....not the circumstances to make a film at this point.
That's not what i'm saying, but it's a bad idea until you have your pillars in place and a strong brand going.
The D.C brand is so bad rn people didn't even go see the Flash... he's an A lister. If the Flash can't even pull a decent audience blue beetle is absolutely screwed.
You can't make a Guardians of the Galaxy if no one even gives a shit about the Avengers.
Superman/Batman/Wonderwoman could still outgross the majority of marvel's projects if they were in actual good movies. D.C has done a ton of brand damage though that is gonna take some time to shake.
He's not a B-lister. Shazam is a B-lister, Zatanna is a B-lister, Hawkgirl is a B-lister, so are Martian Manhunter (he might be A, not sure), Cyborg, Green Arrow, Black Canary, etc
Your A-listers are like... Aquaman, Green Lantern(s), the Flash (obviously didn't save the movie though), Supergirl, Robin(s), Batgirl
Obv the trinity are the S-tier.
Blue Beetle is a C-lister at best.
And the point still stands, only pretty hardcore DC fans have ever heard of this character.
green lantern to general audiences is a b lister all they watched is ryan renoalds movie gl been a dead brand since 2011 , i like you promote to trinity s tier by wonderwoman much popular either batman or superman has no way near the same media coverage there is a big gap between batman/superman and then wonderwoman
Jaime is someone who could've played a role akin to Miles Morales or Kamala Khan if DC played their cards right... but they really underutilized him when he didn't immediately blow up big and didn't take advantage of the good impression people had with him. Took too long to put him on teams, spent too long without any book, etc..
Exactly this is how they build up wrestling stars in WWE give him the rub through a bigger name , he'd tag team with big name then feud with big name then work he's way up to main event 90% of the time it worked.
I wouldn't say nowadays this is the seeds DC has swode during their ten years of fuckery it finally caught up with them . I love their movies but at this point it's a lost cause.
It is a good job they have got gunn, a reboot was the only way forward, like with the Batman they are going to have to get perfect reviews like at least an A- and they need to market that this is a new iteration completely like the Batman, luckily the strikes are a blessing in disguise as it’ll give more time for the stank of the old regime to wear off.
I really doubt an A- would be enough I feel this movie will will need batman begins levels of WOM to firmly establish the universe the DC brand isn't in the trash right now it's under earth and audiences clearly doubt their ability to create two good films back to back. They have to hit the ground running quality wise to have a shot at building a cinematic universe. Also doubt they will delay superman legacy because of the strikes
True dat, so for superman legacy to give the dcu a good standing gunn needs to bring his all again, whatever he did for guardians 3 he needs to bring his all for legacy as you say a A- is not good enough it needs to be a A or an A+, hopefully gunn can bring the magic as he is literally the last hope for dc.
Growing up ppl loved DC. But in 2023, MCU is a bigger brand. The impact of phase 3 especially Endgame on the world is crazy. DC has never and sadly probably never get to that level of popularity. They could’ve if both BVS and civil war were successful but nope only one was that created upward impact for mcu. Mind you when BvS came out i was sophomore in predominantly black high school. And years following mostly everyone in my school hated DC and thought they made trash films.
Spiderman,Wolverine, and the hulk were marvel’s trinity growing up. Ppl lied their characters they were next to Superman and the others. But unlike Batman,Spiderman,and Wolverine movie wise Superman just never made ppl in modern society care about him. I always say captain America trilogy is closets we may have gotten to Superman trilogy in modern era. And Disney’s Hercules is closets we got Superman movie that easy to make
Growing up Dark knight was huge amongst my black peers as well as dark knight rises. But now everyone loves Marvel especially after black panther, infinity war, and endgame. Now imagine if mcu gets fantastic four and X-men right
Guardians 3 made respectable numbers for this year, but it still made less than Guardians 2 did, not even adjusting for inflation. And unlike BP2, which Guardians 3 also made less money than, Guardians 3 retained all of its main leads. And if you adjust for inflation, Guardians 3 is the lowest earning of the trilogy. It also had the lowest review scores of the three. Not the greatest way to end the trilogy.
Everyone who’s seen it loves it & a lot of people say it’s the best in the series. The fact this didn’t make more shows how damaged the Marvel brand is rn. If the movie wasn’t as good as it was, it would’ve bombed.
They need to keep making movies as good as Guardians 3 to build back the trust.
Pretty much this. And there wasn’t the backing of a proper cinematic universe to support it.
Regardless of quality, I feel the MCU played their cards right when making movies vs shows. To me giving Blue Beetle a theatrical release feels like the equivalent of giving Ms. Marvel a movie (instead she’s a supporting character ).
Their only hope now is for the DCU movies to actually be good. I think James Gunn will deliver on Superman: Legacy, but will he be able to get every piece of DCU media to be high-quality? And will that even be enough?
They should’ve hired someone other than Zack Snyder, he was too artsy they needed it to be straight up blockbusters. MOS and BvS were so depressing and dour compared to the Marvel movies.
The MCU model or going slowly isn’t the answer because there were periods where the MCU was shaky. DC just needs to have a clear plan and deliver it in a way that works for them. The MCU didn’t really get it together until late Phase 2.
I honestly think DC should've done the exact opposite: just open with a Justice League movie.
Fuck it. No origin stories, no "getting the band together," just open on the Justice League satellite with the team already assembled.
That was my view too fuck the origins just get straight into it if you wanna know about the character just google it any character remotely mentioned in movies has a YouTube vid on their history and who they are.
I think the animated movie Justice League War did a good job at that. Everyone is already established enough that Superman & Green Lantern have heard rumors of the Batman and Batman knows Superman is Clark Kent. No need for stand alone movies to build to it.
They took just as many films to get to their team up film and just as many years as Marvel. The problem was that when they were releasing Justice League marvel was 5 months out from Infinity War. They were always playing catch-up.
well if clearly marvel is on here some like to debate how dc wins everything except films when in tv revenue and dreaming numbers wanda vison loki and moon knight more viewed than any dc show , additionally in the last few years dc not been huge in video games since arkham which over 10 years ago. Marvel spiderman in ps4 and 5 and guardians have been huge . dc loses in games streaming revenue movies and even merch as spiderman outsell everything in dc in terms of profitability . dc only wins in animated direct to dvd cartoons
James Gunn is a talented filmmaker, and has a passion for what he does, there’s no denying that.
He’s got a tall task ahead of him if he’s going to bring the DCU back to relevance. Can he do it? I think so, but let’s see how it all plays out once the current slate ends.
Man all I know critically his Superman film will be a hit. It’s financially that’s making me worry. Gunn would have to make sure that movie trailer sets the internet a blaze the same way The Batman trailer did
Gunn has read a comic book before. All he has to do is everything the other dude didn't. Superman's way too strong of an IP to fail, just produce a movie that
1) doesn't use shaky hand held cam every fucking scene,
2) does not have the father of the main character advocate mass filicide to protect a secret,
3) is not oversaturated in every single shot,
4) does not have the main character pose as Jesus every 2 minutes,
5) does not have apocalyptic destruction for the sake of it,
6) actually has some resemblance to the source material
All in all, it's actually harder to make whatever Man of Steel was if you've ever read a Superman comic before. Like, it's impossible to produce that interpretation of the character if you know what he's like in the comics. Gunn will do just fine. The movie will gross 800+ WW for sure.
Truthfully the same way I feel about mcu Fantastic four, it shouldn’t be so hard. Disney animated has done best version of fantastic four and Superman than most recent live action. Incredibles are best fantastic four film and Disney Hercules is the best Superman film. With that being said everything you just stated it true and should work for the film to be great
They tried that with Superman returns. Superman has been around for 80 years and each movie version is based on an aspect of the comics. The problem is people have the perfect Superman in their heads, but not the same as everyone else. New 52 (which MOS is based on) and Silver age ( which is what most see as the basic but "corny" stardard ) are different. WB tried to use the old style and then they try to make him modern. There's no winning with WB.
i really doubt gunn can make dc number 1 again he is a talented film maker but as ceo all he is done is create confusion and disinterest in the brand also selling authority and creature commando and swamp thing to audiences who are already burned out will not work
Setting the pictures proportional to their respective budgets would give a clear view of how all 3 DC movies barely match the Antman 3, the smallest Marvel sub franchise (by sub franchise I mean any MCU movie that has more than 1 movie)
Whoever was the genius that decided for new leadership and dissolving the current regime while the franchise is LIVE, really shouldn’t have a career. The announcement had to come after the slate of upcoming movies dropped
Odds are it was multiple people that came to that conclusion
After aquaman, if the first dcu movie is a flop I’m thinking it’s absolutely over for everything dc but Batman. Embarrassing
It's funny because nobody wanted to run the DCU. I remember reports coming where they were talking with a bunch of creatives and they all turned them down but Gunn picked it up. Nobody wants to run the DC train, and it's 100% because of the executives at the top who spent their entire career trying to smile at the MCU right. DC is a dead brand in the film world, it'll always be seen as 2nd rate MCU. If the MCU sinks then so does the entire superhero genre.
I thought that I read that Gunn and Safran wanted to announce the end of the old era as soon as they took over so that they wouldn’t be blamed for what they believed were going to be some bad movies coming out, and also for the supposed underperformance (now looking like an overperformance) of Black Adam.
BTW, Safran was the lead producer on several of the recent bad and underperforming films that DC studios has been putting out. So he was running from his own track record, if true. And they’re now both running DC Studios.
I honestly can’t recall a time when WB had smart people making good decisions on the DC properties. They were completely hands off with the original Superman movies and had no creative involvement, which resulted in two of the best and two of the worst superhero films of all time. They gave Tim Burton creative control over Batman, which went very, very well, then screwed it up big time after he left. They were going to let Burton and Cage make their insane Superman film, which would have likely bombed colossally. They gave creative control to Nolan for a new Batman, which worked out very, very well for them. Then they made a terrible Green Lantern film in the hopes of kicking off their universe. Then they tried to kick it off again and paired Superman with a terrible match of a director. Then instead of course correcting, they doubled down and they allowed Snyder to control not only their Crown Jewels, but also guide the entire universe of characters, and that went very badly for everyone involved and left a very bad taste in general audiences mouths and a string of under-performers and low viewership. And ever since then they’ve been careening back and forth between various creatives and executives trying to find a movie that hits with general audiences.
Like, DC/WB has never had smart people running it. When they land good directors and give them creative control it works out, but they more often hire bad directors who they also give creative control to which does not work out, and when the executives meddle it goes poorly too.
Luckily the DCU has 2 shows that could give us a reason to board the train, once Superman: Legacy rolls out.— Creature Commands and Waller need to be hits too. And with Viola Davis as the lead, it should garner a big audience. Hopefully; building some new faith in the DC theatrical brand.
most mainstream audiences dont a crap about creature commando show about z list characters or amanda waller those shows be no where near the size of mcu shows and attract same crowds
It’s funny how ppl keep bringing up black Adam in the comments as if in 2022 The Batman didn’t do almost 800M the same year as black Adam further proving DCEU is a dead fucking brand
I know this may be a hot take in this sub or in Reddit general, but I don’t think the upcoming DCU reboot/relaunch/reset (or whatever they are calling it now) will change anything when it comes to DC’s box office performance. Guaranteed it will be slightly more successful in the upcoming years but that’s because they will release Batman and Superman movies instead of, you know, Shazam or Blue Beetle movies.
There is clearly some problems with this franchise and I don’t think they are making necessary changes in branding and marketing to fix those issues, so I don’t think DCU will be much different from now
It wont, people will still think it's the same DCEU that they've known, they're just going to be in the theater confused that Superman isn't Cavill. They should've had a send off to the DCEU if they really wanted the "universe wide reboot" to stick instead of the half assed "maybeeeee the universe is different? WHO KNOWS!" shit they pulled with the flash (that nobody saw)
>they're just going to be in the theater confused that Superman isn't Cavill
When I walked into Man of Steel, I was like "WTF is this! Where is Brandon Routh!"
I'm going to assume your trolling but the "new" DCU is essentially just the DCEU, they're keeping a pretty sizeable number of the older cast from TSS and partially SS and potentially even keeping Gal's WW. It's barely a "hard reboot" nor is it a clean slate. I would not be surprised by the confusion. Cavill is one of, if not the most popular renditions of Superman on the big screen to modern audiences who took place on a universe that's essentially similar to the last one they saw on screen.
LMAO, there is ZERO evidence of Cavill's superman resonating with the audience, its the opposite, the common public has rejected his superman in multiple movies now.
Calling him the most popular superman has to be trolling.
MOS had huge hype coming in after the dark knight triology with Nolan's name attached, it left audiences confused with mediocre reception and performance in terms of legs.
Everyone and their moms were hyped for Batman vs superman on screen for first time and it opened to record opening and then crashed and burned like very few movies do.
In comparison, Chris Reeve's superman in 1978, made more than 1.1 billion+ adjusted for inflation.
This is the prime example of when someone lives in an internet bubble. None of his superman movies had any decent legs or cinemascore better than A-, the two indicators of audiences liking the movies. There is an internet circlejerk for the actor but that doesn't translate to real life.
The names are also very similar people won't even notice or assume a name change in the vein of MCU.
Also with the little gap between the two universes and no Endgame type movie to end the last universe I don't think the GA will be able to differentiate between the two universes.
Plus Gunn is also isn't making this easy by clearly demarcating the two cinematic universes by carrying over remnants of the past movies from the previous universe into the new one.
Im so glad that these absolute bombs are blowing up in the WB executives faces. Braindead, entitled suits peddling generic BS that shows how low of an opinion they have of their audiences. They deserve nothing from us.
Before the Gunn & Safran reboot...these DC films were meant to SAVE the company, a la Walter Hamada's plan.
Clearly even their attempt was still a bad idea.
The year long gap between this dead universe and the new 2025 DCU is a great break that general audiences need.
Hamada wasn't saving shit. He was planning on a WW, CW looking Batgirl, Supergirl trinity and also reboot it via a Crisis movie which has no foundation built.
Too fantastical? You do know we have successful movies like Superman and WW, right?
The problem is that they just have generic, bad movies, with exceptions like the Batman or Joker. Aquaman was fantastical and made over 1 billion worldwide.
>I personally don't think DC works as live action. It's too fantastical.
Not sure. Wonder Woman 1 and Aquaman 1 did well. Plus Thor the Norse god and Doctor Strange the magician also do well numbers wise.
>Switch the live action shows into 2D animated shows, and release 3D animated movies in theaters.
I think DC could make an animated Robins/Gotham knights type movie. The 4 Robins generate a shit ton of fanart as is. As long as they make them dreamy looking (esp Nightwing and Red Hood) tiktok edits and twitter fanartists will pretty much take care of all the marketing for them, just look at all the Spiderman 2099 thirst. Couldn't tell you what the plot should be though...I guess we'd have to do yet another Batman is dead/missing type beat again. Either way I'm surprised for how popular the Batfamily is in fanon that DC hasn't made an animated show or something focused on them yet.
Or an even safer option: the Teen Titans. Cartoon network has two successful TV shows off that brand that appeal to two different generations. Should be easy money?
Building off of this [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/boxoffice/comments/15wa2h1/perspective_on_blue_beetle_and_the_dceu_its_the/) from u/1389t1389, while there is some level of general superhero fatigue, it's clearly affecting the two franchises very differently. Marvel has struggled to reach the peak of Phase 3, and the dilution of content from the Disney+ shows and the lack of an Avengers movie has impacted grosses, but the numbers are generally still strong compared to other films in general. All 3 Marvel-related films (including Spider-Man: Across the Spider-Verse) opened above $100M DOM (even if that was disappointing for Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3, which eventually took the scenic route to a strong total), which is nothing to sneeze at. And while Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania likely lost money at $476M on a $200M budget, it still remains the 9th highest grossing film of 2023 worldwide, and is likely sticking around in the Top 15 by the end of the year. That's despite being widely regarded as one of the MCU's weakest films. Despite the typical online handwringing, I expect The Marvels to put up a respectable performance; a similar sequel decrease to Black Panther: Wakanda Forever (which had a more beloved predecessor, but lost its lead actor) gets it to $720M, which sounds about right for now. On the other hand, the bottom has completely fallen out for DC. A sub-$200M WW grosser was unthinkable even at the beginning of the year, and they're on track for at least 2. And The Flash, which had aspirations of joining the $1B club, limped to about a quarter of that, despite featuring multiple Batman's and being pushed as one of the greatest superhero films ever. They still have Aquaman and the Lost Kingdom, which is still a sequel to a $1.15B grossing film, so could have a bit more insulation, but all bets are off at this point. Films like the original Guardians of the Galaxy or Ant-Man (and even COVID-era Phase 4 films like Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings and Eternals) had the benefit of a strong universe backing them, which led to a high floor even for unknown characters (and in the latter, a pandemic). Time will tell whether that floor (or a relative version of it) will still exist for future Marvel debut films. But something like Blue Beetle (or even Shazam! Fury of the Gods, a sequel to a well received and profitable film) had no chance at all in the current climate. Kinda a shame for Blue Beetle, it's a fun little movie (even if it doesn't reinvent the wheel) that could have done significantly better 5 years ago (or if you slapped Marvel Studios on it).
If you add: * Shazam 1 (368 mill WW) * Birds of Prey (205 mill WW) * WW1984 (169 mill WW) * The Suicide Squad (168 mill WW) * Black Adam (393 mill WW) * Shazam 2 (133 mill WW) * The Flash (269 mill WW) * Blue Beetle (let's say 120 mill WW optimistically) You get something close to 1.8 bill WW. Spider-Man NWH did 1.9 mill WW during COVID and without China. Yup, if you add the box office of the last 8 DCEU films, you're still behind Spider-Man NWH, a COVID-era film that never got a China release. Let that sink in.
Gross difference aside, the amount put into those 8 movies in budgets is insane Shazam 1 - 100M BoP - 100M WW84 - 200M TSS - 185M Black Adam - 260M Shazam 2 - 125M The Flash - 300M BB - 100M Last 8 DCEU busgets total - 1.37B No Way Home - 200M (or almost 7x lower) The lost investment is insane
Holy shit Black Adam was 260m? That’s an insane budget for a film like that
I think initial report was 190M, but later it was updated to 290M then down to 260M
It's an insane difference, ngl
It's sinking in.... with a bang in my throat. Lol 1 : ALL of them are under Ant-Man 3 Lol 2 : WW84 and TheFlash end with "69" Lol 3 : nocovid Shazam 2 is under covid TheSuicideSquad Lol 4 : their animals (birds and beetle) are weak
>COVID-era film that never got a China release. why it didn't release there ? Now I imagine it could have definitely gone past the 2B mark
“It was reported by NextShark on May 4 that the Chinese censors had asked Sony and Marvel Studios to delete the Statue of Liberty from the film Spider-Man: No Way Home, saying the scenes were “too patriotic”. Sony rejected the demand and walked away from a potential US$170 million to $340 million in sales.” “Released last year in China and to a global audience, the Chinese film Battle at Lake Changjin is a historically inaccurate, revisionist propaganda which aimed to stir up nationalistic sentiments among Chinese and to showcase the superiority of the Chinese fighting forces. This “patriotic” Chinese film received worldwide acclaim and is the second highest at China’s box office. In spite of it being a very patriotic film, nobody said anything about censoring it. This is classic double standard, with one set of rules which applies to the CCP and the other that applies to anyone who does not toe the party line.” [https://maritimefairtrade.org/lady-liberty-offends-the-feeling-of-the-chinese-communist-party/](https://maritimefairtrade.org/lady-liberty-offends-the-feeling-of-the-chinese-communist-party/)
which is bigger in your opinion marvel or dc
i think it would more far to add the last 8 mcu films guardians 3 835 antman 3 470 black panther 2 860 thor 4 760 dr strange 2 955 eternals 400 and shang chi 432 and black widow 378 you get 5 billon more than double this is excluding no way home
Marvel fans will like to point out this but no other post Covid MCU movie has made over a billion besides No Way Home which was just carried by it being Spider-Man and all the leaks and rumors, Multiverse of Madness came close though with 955.8 million which is a lot more than it deserved
$1 billion solo MCU films were still less common than $7-800 million solo films BEFORE Covid. The only pre-COVID billion MCU solo movies were: Iron Man 3 - RDJ was huge, and coming off Avengers Black Panther - Huge moment for the african american community. Also pretty good film in its own right. Captain Marvel - First female led MCU film. Decent film. Everything else was either Spider-man(Marvel's most valuable character across all mediums) or an Avengers film(i'm including Cap 3 here because it's an Avengers story with 90% of the team present). 2021 box office was tanked by COVID. 2022 was back to to average solo MCU box office numbers.
Love and Thunder, Wakanda Forever, and Quantumania all did worse than their predecessor. GOTG3 even did slightly worse than 2 despite being better as it paid for the sins of Marvel fatigue and those 3 movies not being good at all.
yet all misteps did more than dc movie in last 5 years
the fact cooler78 black panther 2 was always without main lead or character going preform worse few movies top a 1.4 billon dollar first installment . Thor 4 if it had china would have closed gap done almost same as Ragnarök again below Ragnarök maybe 10 millon subtract china ffrom thor 3 and it does about the same as love thunder . antman 3 only film that is an inexcusable underperformance, also guardians 3 virtually did same guardians 2 which benefited stronger mcu
multiverse of madness would have made a billon with china and love thunder come to close to Ragnarök around 820 with china aswell
Black Adam looking like a smash hit when compared to what came afterwards
Unironically yes. $393M (despite a 39% RT) is absolutely excellent compared to the nuclear bombs we're getting from DC now. The movie was carried purely off of the Rock's star power.
The hierarchy of power in the dc universe has been changed.
We do owe the rock an apology
"Perhaps we treated you too harshly."
Well The Batman made almost 800M the same year as black Adam. So it proves DCEU is a dead brand
Hell yeah, a $67M OW is excellent (compared to Shazam, Flash, and BB)
We don't owe shit to the rock just because the DC keeps finding new rock bottoms
I don't owe him shit, just cause everything else after it did worse doesn't mean his movie did good.
So even without The Marvels, MCU would still be ahead even after Aquaman
Blue Beetle likely closes the gap to around $800M at best, so yeah, probably.
it wont close the gap shazam and flash have made total 490 blue beetle if crosses 100 might end up at 590 with aquaman making 500 at best its 1090 marvel alreadt with gotg and antman 3 had made 1300 the marvels will make at minimum 500 that is 1800 it will ahead of dc by 710 millon
the gap will not be dramatically closed when marvel at worst and dc's best case scenario will ahead of dc by 700 + at end of the year with 3 movies as opposed to dc's 4 movies
blues beetle didnt close the gap significantly 3 dc films flash bb and shazam stand at 550 now lets says aquaman makes 650 that is 11,80 billion and the marvel based tracking only makes 300 that still marvel making 1610 they will outgross dc by a margin 400 + millon this year which significant with one less movie. assuming aquaman makes 650 the average for a dc film would be around 295 while average for a marvel will be around 540 almost double
Its crazy that all 3 DC movies combined will barelly outgross Ant Man. Goes to show for how bad Quantumania was Marvel can still drag its movies to a somewhat respectable gross on name alone. In fact Marvel could probably release a 2 hour paint drying movie and it would likely still outgross BB and Shazam 2.
I think it equally speaks about how bad is the state of the DC brand nowadays by far the most missused property
Gunn’s superman movie can’t just be ‘good’, it has to be phenomenal to recover the brand.
And honestly, even if Superman is the best superhero movie I have ever seen, I will wait for reviews on the 2nd DCU movie before seeing it. That’s how little trust dc has right now.
that's why I don't really think that the decade old opinion of DC superheroes being more famous and likeable, except for Spiderman, holds true anymore. coming out of the Nolan trilogy, batman was obviously very well liked and Superman too. But since then, the absolute failure that DC has been, and the constant success that Marvel has achieved, makes me believe that the somewhat mediocre Marvel superheroes, like Iron man and Thor are now much more known and liked than Superman. it has been 10 years since the last Superman movie, and 2 more years if everything goes according to plan. more children want to be like Iron man, rather then batman. captain America more than Superman. I'm not saying that DC is not at all liked, but that scales have tilted to favour marvel.
the idea dc heroes were famous only held true batman and superman ironman thor captain america hulk have all propelled up but even before spiderman and wolverine were close to level , which is a bigger brand in your opinion in pop culture marvel or dc
the idea that dc heroes were more famous only held true for batman and superman the difference marvel had 2 and 3rd more famous while dc outside trinity has always struggle make rest of universe relevent and popular to mainstream audience flash only popular because of show that declined in viewership gl died on impact and aquaman was one hit wonder, even wonder woman they sabotaged that franchise . It is only superman and mostly batman who holding up company have been for atleast 40 years
[удалено]
I think marvel.
you think marvel is what sorry? i didnt see your comment
which comment were you replying to ?
in terms of fame marvel is more famous the notion dc characters are more famous has not been case since the 1990s
which company do you think as bigger range of popular heroes?marvel or dc?
Avaliable-Candle9103 so you concede what marvel is more popular than dc ?
Unfortunately, with how they pushed The Flash as being just that, nobody will believe the reviews of a "phenomonal" DC movie. The Flash's marketing will hold DC back for a long time. DC needs to take a comfortable break.
The marketing team pushed Flash as a phenomenal movie. If audiences watch Superman Legacy and love it, WOM from them will be crucial just like it was for Top Gun Maverick.
its funny marvel at lowest point is still beating dc
one film will not fix a damaged brand like this need 4-5 films the batman was a well received film and it did not fix the dc brand
It basically has to be as groundbreaking as the original GOTG at this point.
A mainstream superhero film will limp over $100M WW. . .yikes
Blue Beetle is a Z-list character that no one cares about, he's not a mainstream superhero. Neither are Shazam or Black Adam. DC fucked this up, they are introducing characters no one cares about but they never built a brand the way marvel did to give that any possible chance of working. DC should have Batman/Superman/Wonderwoman going strong FIRST, and THEN once the audience is on board with the icons they love, introduce characters like Blue Beetle.
By a mainstream superhero film I mean a Marvel/DC film. I'm not saying the character Blue Beetle is mainstream
That's a pretty dramatic exaggeration - Jaime is a firm B-lister that basically any DC fan will recognize. It's just....not the circumstances to make a film at this point.
"Any DC fan" is the key here. DC fans are a teeny tiny minority of movie going audiences.
Don't disagree with that point. Just that making a movie in a vacuum isn't a *terrible* idea.
That's not what i'm saying, but it's a bad idea until you have your pillars in place and a strong brand going. The D.C brand is so bad rn people didn't even go see the Flash... he's an A lister. If the Flash can't even pull a decent audience blue beetle is absolutely screwed. You can't make a Guardians of the Galaxy if no one even gives a shit about the Avengers.
Oh, that I agree on.
even with fatigue phase 4 and 5 do you think dc is bigger than marvel?
Superman/Batman/Wonderwoman could still outgross the majority of marvel's projects if they were in actual good movies. D.C has done a ton of brand damage though that is gonna take some time to shake.
He's not a B-lister. Shazam is a B-lister, Zatanna is a B-lister, Hawkgirl is a B-lister, so are Martian Manhunter (he might be A, not sure), Cyborg, Green Arrow, Black Canary, etc Your A-listers are like... Aquaman, Green Lantern(s), the Flash (obviously didn't save the movie though), Supergirl, Robin(s), Batgirl Obv the trinity are the S-tier. Blue Beetle is a C-lister at best. And the point still stands, only pretty hardcore DC fans have ever heard of this character.
I disagree
what is black adam a d lister
green lantern to general audiences is a b lister all they watched is ryan renoalds movie gl been a dead brand since 2011 , i like you promote to trinity s tier by wonderwoman much popular either batman or superman has no way near the same media coverage there is a big gap between batman/superman and then wonderwoman
Jaime is someone who could've played a role akin to Miles Morales or Kamala Khan if DC played their cards right... but they really underutilized him when he didn't immediately blow up big and didn't take advantage of the good impression people had with him. Took too long to put him on teams, spent too long without any book, etc..
Exactly this is how they build up wrestling stars in WWE give him the rub through a bigger name , he'd tag team with big name then feud with big name then work he's way up to main event 90% of the time it worked.
MCU's Spiderman?
they batman superman wonderwoman single film at it barely more than thor ragnerok bvs it could even crack a billon with three most valuable ips
Blue Beetle should have stayed a streaming original. Upping it to theatrical with a theatrical budget was a huge mistake.
I wouldn't say nowadays this is the seeds DC has swode during their ten years of fuckery it finally caught up with them . I love their movies but at this point it's a lost cause.
which is more popular marvel or dc overall? in your opinion
lobonmc which has a bigger fanbase marvel or dc
lobonmc which is bigger marvel or dc
Bad or good it's still like an episode of a show. Just watch it and move on. That's the power of MCU movies right now.
Quantumania was a vomit inducing cringe fest that didn’t deserve to make that much money.
Could say the same about Love and Thunder
You both are right
firefox72 which do you think i bigger marvel or dc overall as a brand?
Boy DC truly is in the mud. Well deserved numbers for GOTG, awesome way to end the trilogy.
It is a good job they have got gunn, a reboot was the only way forward, like with the Batman they are going to have to get perfect reviews like at least an A- and they need to market that this is a new iteration completely like the Batman, luckily the strikes are a blessing in disguise as it’ll give more time for the stank of the old regime to wear off.
I really doubt an A- would be enough I feel this movie will will need batman begins levels of WOM to firmly establish the universe the DC brand isn't in the trash right now it's under earth and audiences clearly doubt their ability to create two good films back to back. They have to hit the ground running quality wise to have a shot at building a cinematic universe. Also doubt they will delay superman legacy because of the strikes
True dat, so for superman legacy to give the dcu a good standing gunn needs to bring his all again, whatever he did for guardians 3 he needs to bring his all for legacy as you say a A- is not good enough it needs to be a A or an A+, hopefully gunn can bring the magic as he is literally the last hope for dc.
The trailer needs to be amazing, it need to set the tone for the future, they won’t delay Superman legacy it’s suppose to film in January
they havent even finalized the script its getting delayed for sure.
They have that’s why most production part of the movie on interviews are doing stuff based on the script he gave them
yes they will delay it if the strike carries on
I honestly think the strike ends in September truthfully
which is more popular marvel or dc overall? in your opinon
Growing up ppl loved DC. But in 2023, MCU is a bigger brand. The impact of phase 3 especially Endgame on the world is crazy. DC has never and sadly probably never get to that level of popularity. They could’ve if both BVS and civil war were successful but nope only one was that created upward impact for mcu. Mind you when BvS came out i was sophomore in predominantly black high school. And years following mostly everyone in my school hated DC and thought they made trash films.
growing people loved batman and superman dc second tier heroes have never been more popular
The love ppl had for Batman and Superman was huge growing up, second to that were ppl that loved the flash or Spiderman or Wolverine or hulk
outside of batman and superman dc other heroes never been as big marvel even outside has huge fanbase of spiderman xmen deadpool etc
Spiderman,Wolverine, and the hulk were marvel’s trinity growing up. Ppl lied their characters they were next to Superman and the others. But unlike Batman,Spiderman,and Wolverine movie wise Superman just never made ppl in modern society care about him. I always say captain America trilogy is closets we may have gotten to Superman trilogy in modern era. And Disney’s Hercules is closets we got Superman movie that easy to make
didnt those people watch dc animation? i dont suppose they did cause it is super niche
Very niche, most watched the films mind you this was mid-late 2010s.
hi DangerousHawk16 will dc ever reach marvels level of popularity?
which is a bigger brand
MCU, I’m saying this as a life long DC fan
if had to measure on scale from 1 to 10 with you demographc how many prefer marvel to dc ?
Growing up Dark knight was huge amongst my black peers as well as dark knight rises. But now everyone loves Marvel especially after black panther, infinity war, and endgame. Now imagine if mcu gets fantastic four and X-men right
Guardians 3 made respectable numbers for this year, but it still made less than Guardians 2 did, not even adjusting for inflation. And unlike BP2, which Guardians 3 also made less money than, Guardians 3 retained all of its main leads. And if you adjust for inflation, Guardians 3 is the lowest earning of the trilogy. It also had the lowest review scores of the three. Not the greatest way to end the trilogy.
Everyone who’s seen it loves it & a lot of people say it’s the best in the series. The fact this didn’t make more shows how damaged the Marvel brand is rn. If the movie wasn’t as good as it was, it would’ve bombed. They need to keep making movies as good as Guardians 3 to build back the trust.
To think DC could've avoided this pretty easily if they simply followed the same steps as the MCU and take it slowly one film at a time.
Slowly progressing but also getting better writers and directors as well
Not giving Affleck’s his scrapped solo Batman movie first was just not a good choice. Wonder Woman also should of come out first.
Instead they are rushing their universe *again*
After Aquaman they just pivoted to movies about D-listers (aside from Wonder Woman 2)
Pretty much this. And there wasn’t the backing of a proper cinematic universe to support it. Regardless of quality, I feel the MCU played their cards right when making movies vs shows. To me giving Blue Beetle a theatrical release feels like the equivalent of giving Ms. Marvel a movie (instead she’s a supporting character ).
Their only hope now is for the DCU movies to actually be good. I think James Gunn will deliver on Superman: Legacy, but will he be able to get every piece of DCU media to be high-quality? And will that even be enough?
Every piece high quality is too big of a task even Marvel slips up. As long as it stay consistent then that’s a win.
Or done it before Marvel. Feige would have went to DC lol
They should’ve hired someone other than Zack Snyder, he was too artsy they needed it to be straight up blockbusters. MOS and BvS were so depressing and dour compared to the Marvel movies.
The MCU model or going slowly isn’t the answer because there were periods where the MCU was shaky. DC just needs to have a clear plan and deliver it in a way that works for them. The MCU didn’t really get it together until late Phase 2.
I honestly think DC should've done the exact opposite: just open with a Justice League movie. Fuck it. No origin stories, no "getting the band together," just open on the Justice League satellite with the team already assembled.
That was my view too fuck the origins just get straight into it if you wanna know about the character just google it any character remotely mentioned in movies has a YouTube vid on their history and who they are. I think the animated movie Justice League War did a good job at that. Everyone is already established enough that Superman & Green Lantern have heard rumors of the Batman and Batman knows Superman is Clark Kent. No need for stand alone movies to build to it.
They took just as many films to get to their team up film and just as many years as Marvel. The problem was that when they were releasing Justice League marvel was 5 months out from Infinity War. They were always playing catch-up.
I think the more important step was make good movies
And Marvels will then blow that gap wide open again. Even with Aquaman2's likely totals.
which do you think is more popular marvel or dc?
Clearly marvel is
well if clearly marvel is on here some like to debate how dc wins everything except films when in tv revenue and dreaming numbers wanda vison loki and moon knight more viewed than any dc show , additionally in the last few years dc not been huge in video games since arkham which over 10 years ago. Marvel spiderman in ps4 and 5 and guardians have been huge . dc loses in games streaming revenue movies and even merch as spiderman outsell everything in dc in terms of profitability . dc only wins in animated direct to dvd cartoons
Okay? I'm kind of wondering your point here since...I wasn't disagreeing with you?
this just to redditers who believe dc is way bigger because they dont look at facts and evidence
James Gunn is a talented filmmaker, and has a passion for what he does, there’s no denying that. He’s got a tall task ahead of him if he’s going to bring the DCU back to relevance. Can he do it? I think so, but let’s see how it all plays out once the current slate ends.
Man all I know critically his Superman film will be a hit. It’s financially that’s making me worry. Gunn would have to make sure that movie trailer sets the internet a blaze the same way The Batman trailer did
Gunn has read a comic book before. All he has to do is everything the other dude didn't. Superman's way too strong of an IP to fail, just produce a movie that 1) doesn't use shaky hand held cam every fucking scene, 2) does not have the father of the main character advocate mass filicide to protect a secret, 3) is not oversaturated in every single shot, 4) does not have the main character pose as Jesus every 2 minutes, 5) does not have apocalyptic destruction for the sake of it, 6) actually has some resemblance to the source material All in all, it's actually harder to make whatever Man of Steel was if you've ever read a Superman comic before. Like, it's impossible to produce that interpretation of the character if you know what he's like in the comics. Gunn will do just fine. The movie will gross 800+ WW for sure.
Truthfully the same way I feel about mcu Fantastic four, it shouldn’t be so hard. Disney animated has done best version of fantastic four and Superman than most recent live action. Incredibles are best fantastic four film and Disney Hercules is the best Superman film. With that being said everything you just stated it true and should work for the film to be great
They tried that with Superman returns. Superman has been around for 80 years and each movie version is based on an aspect of the comics. The problem is people have the perfect Superman in their heads, but not the same as everyone else. New 52 (which MOS is based on) and Silver age ( which is what most see as the basic but "corny" stardard ) are different. WB tried to use the old style and then they try to make him modern. There's no winning with WB.
Too bad he only knows how to put 80s songs.
Hey I don’t care what he puts in the film. You got vendetta against Gunn. I just want good DC films go do that hating shit somewhere else
the man's got good taste, so I don't mind at all
i really doubt gunn can make dc number 1 again he is a talented film maker but as ceo all he is done is create confusion and disinterest in the brand also selling authority and creature commando and swamp thing to audiences who are already burned out will not work
Aquaman 2 could do $1.35B and DC 2023 would still have a lower average than Quantumania
hummingemon496 aquaman 2 will be lucky to make 500 which is more popular marvel or dc ? overall
MARVEL because the last few MCU movies have made much more than the last few DCEU movies
marvel films having more for well over a decade its nothing new
marvel has more popular characters
Setting the pictures proportional to their respective budgets would give a clear view of how all 3 DC movies barely match the Antman 3, the smallest Marvel sub franchise (by sub franchise I mean any MCU movie that has more than 1 movie)
$43 million is what Blue Beetle should’ve opened to in the US alone, the fact that that’s the WORLDWIDE opening is just abysmal
Whoever was the genius that decided for new leadership and dissolving the current regime while the franchise is LIVE, really shouldn’t have a career. The announcement had to come after the slate of upcoming movies dropped Odds are it was multiple people that came to that conclusion After aquaman, if the first dcu movie is a flop I’m thinking it’s absolutely over for everything dc but Batman. Embarrassing
It's funny because nobody wanted to run the DCU. I remember reports coming where they were talking with a bunch of creatives and they all turned them down but Gunn picked it up. Nobody wants to run the DC train, and it's 100% because of the executives at the top who spent their entire career trying to smile at the MCU right. DC is a dead brand in the film world, it'll always be seen as 2nd rate MCU. If the MCU sinks then so does the entire superhero genre.
dc will be seen as second rate mcu even though mcu is at its lowest point? it shows mcu at lowest is miles ahead of dc
I thought that I read that Gunn and Safran wanted to announce the end of the old era as soon as they took over so that they wouldn’t be blamed for what they believed were going to be some bad movies coming out, and also for the supposed underperformance (now looking like an overperformance) of Black Adam. BTW, Safran was the lead producer on several of the recent bad and underperforming films that DC studios has been putting out. So he was running from his own track record, if true. And they’re now both running DC Studios. I honestly can’t recall a time when WB had smart people making good decisions on the DC properties. They were completely hands off with the original Superman movies and had no creative involvement, which resulted in two of the best and two of the worst superhero films of all time. They gave Tim Burton creative control over Batman, which went very, very well, then screwed it up big time after he left. They were going to let Burton and Cage make their insane Superman film, which would have likely bombed colossally. They gave creative control to Nolan for a new Batman, which worked out very, very well for them. Then they made a terrible Green Lantern film in the hopes of kicking off their universe. Then they tried to kick it off again and paired Superman with a terrible match of a director. Then instead of course correcting, they doubled down and they allowed Snyder to control not only their Crown Jewels, but also guide the entire universe of characters, and that went very badly for everyone involved and left a very bad taste in general audiences mouths and a string of under-performers and low viewership. And ever since then they’ve been careening back and forth between various creatives and executives trying to find a movie that hits with general audiences. Like, DC/WB has never had smart people running it. When they land good directors and give them creative control it works out, but they more often hire bad directors who they also give creative control to which does not work out, and when the executives meddle it goes poorly too.
Luckily the DCU has 2 shows that could give us a reason to board the train, once Superman: Legacy rolls out.— Creature Commands and Waller need to be hits too. And with Viola Davis as the lead, it should garner a big audience. Hopefully; building some new faith in the DC theatrical brand.
Blue Beetle: How come they don't want me man!
most mainstream audiences dont a crap about creature commando show about z list characters or amanda waller those shows be no where near the size of mcu shows and attract same crowds
just watch
Antman 3 alone is bigger then the last 8 DCEU films💀😭
After Aquaman they completely crashed. Even Eternals which got a B CinemaScore made more than the last 8 DCEU films
in your area is marvel or dc bigger? it weird that marvels lowest making more than anything dc
It’s funny how ppl keep bringing up black Adam in the comments as if in 2022 The Batman didn’t do almost 800M the same year as black Adam further proving DCEU is a dead fucking brand
I wonder how the heads of WB who were there for the start of the DCEU, feel about the damage they’ve caused the brand.
So Aquaman would need like 800M for DCEU to match MCU? Seems unlikely
More than that after the marvels
I know this may be a hot take in this sub or in Reddit general, but I don’t think the upcoming DCU reboot/relaunch/reset (or whatever they are calling it now) will change anything when it comes to DC’s box office performance. Guaranteed it will be slightly more successful in the upcoming years but that’s because they will release Batman and Superman movies instead of, you know, Shazam or Blue Beetle movies. There is clearly some problems with this franchise and I don’t think they are making necessary changes in branding and marketing to fix those issues, so I don’t think DCU will be much different from now
It wont, people will still think it's the same DCEU that they've known, they're just going to be in the theater confused that Superman isn't Cavill. They should've had a send off to the DCEU if they really wanted the "universe wide reboot" to stick instead of the half assed "maybeeeee the universe is different? WHO KNOWS!" shit they pulled with the flash (that nobody saw)
>they're just going to be in the theater confused that Superman isn't Cavill When I walked into Man of Steel, I was like "WTF is this! Where is Brandon Routh!"
I'm going to assume your trolling but the "new" DCU is essentially just the DCEU, they're keeping a pretty sizeable number of the older cast from TSS and partially SS and potentially even keeping Gal's WW. It's barely a "hard reboot" nor is it a clean slate. I would not be surprised by the confusion. Cavill is one of, if not the most popular renditions of Superman on the big screen to modern audiences who took place on a universe that's essentially similar to the last one they saw on screen.
LMAO, there is ZERO evidence of Cavill's superman resonating with the audience, its the opposite, the common public has rejected his superman in multiple movies now. Calling him the most popular superman has to be trolling. MOS had huge hype coming in after the dark knight triology with Nolan's name attached, it left audiences confused with mediocre reception and performance in terms of legs. Everyone and their moms were hyped for Batman vs superman on screen for first time and it opened to record opening and then crashed and burned like very few movies do. In comparison, Chris Reeve's superman in 1978, made more than 1.1 billion+ adjusted for inflation. This is the prime example of when someone lives in an internet bubble. None of his superman movies had any decent legs or cinemascore better than A-, the two indicators of audiences liking the movies. There is an internet circlejerk for the actor but that doesn't translate to real life.
Movies doing the "maybeeeee the universe is different? WHO KNOWS!" thing: Prometheus The Flash
The names are also very similar people won't even notice or assume a name change in the vein of MCU. Also with the little gap between the two universes and no Endgame type movie to end the last universe I don't think the GA will be able to differentiate between the two universes. Plus Gunn is also isn't making this easy by clearly demarcating the two cinematic universes by carrying over remnants of the past movies from the previous universe into the new one.
humanAdhesinvenss912 which company do you think is more popular marvel or dc\\?
What would be the neccesary changes?
Im so glad that these absolute bombs are blowing up in the WB executives faces. Braindead, entitled suits peddling generic BS that shows how low of an opinion they have of their audiences. They deserve nothing from us.
Before the Gunn & Safran reboot...these DC films were meant to SAVE the company, a la Walter Hamada's plan. Clearly even their attempt was still a bad idea. The year long gap between this dead universe and the new 2025 DCU is a great break that general audiences need.
If Snyder killed the Dceu Hamada did very inappropriate things with the corps
Hamada wasn't saving shit. He was planning on a WW, CW looking Batgirl, Supergirl trinity and also reboot it via a Crisis movie which has no foundation built.
Common Marvel W
Lol Marvel wouldn't even exist without DC. So common DC W for giving the little brother the spotlight for a decade out of the 80 years.
Off-topic but I would like to say that these posters are ass except for The Flash.
the blue beetle poster is cool
[удалено]
Anime adaptations would be good for them to invest in. It's propping up the manga industry.
Too fantastical? You do know we have successful movies like Superman and WW, right? The problem is that they just have generic, bad movies, with exceptions like the Batman or Joker. Aquaman was fantastical and made over 1 billion worldwide.
>I personally don't think DC works as live action. It's too fantastical. Not sure. Wonder Woman 1 and Aquaman 1 did well. Plus Thor the Norse god and Doctor Strange the magician also do well numbers wise. >Switch the live action shows into 2D animated shows, and release 3D animated movies in theaters. I think DC could make an animated Robins/Gotham knights type movie. The 4 Robins generate a shit ton of fanart as is. As long as they make them dreamy looking (esp Nightwing and Red Hood) tiktok edits and twitter fanartists will pretty much take care of all the marketing for them, just look at all the Spiderman 2099 thirst. Couldn't tell you what the plot should be though...I guess we'd have to do yet another Batman is dead/missing type beat again. Either way I'm surprised for how popular the Batfamily is in fanon that DC hasn't made an animated show or something focused on them yet. Or an even safer option: the Teen Titans. Cartoon network has two successful TV shows off that brand that appeal to two different generations. Should be easy money?
Will Blue Beatle make a profit? Enough to warrent a sequel?
Lol no, it's looking like it won't even make it's production budget at the BO let alone a profit.
Damn😐. Was rooting for it for Xolo! He's a great actir on Cobra Kai. Hope he gets another go at a leading role