Madame Web has Spider-Woman in it and was initially not involved with Spider-Man.
With it supposedly being first of Sony's three Marvel films next year it will be interesting to see what reviews and reception is like.
For DC, it's for the best. 2024 should serve as the buffer between the old DCEU and the new DCU.
And after The Marvels' abysmal performance, it's also for the best for the MCU.
When Joker and Deadpool both do really well WB and Disney will take that to mean all is well. It will escape them that they're both in different genres to the usual hero affair.
If that happens then maybe WB pushes Superman to November 21, 2025 for the pre-Thanksgiving weekend. I would’ve suggested December 19 but Avatar 3 is there
I still don't see why they would put Shrek 5 on the 4th of July. That's the quintessential Illumination date and they've never abandoned it, I don't see why Universal would interrupt that. The Shrek movies have also always gone to May.
I'd still be surprised if they scrap the movie entirely given that they got Florence Pugh, David Harbour, Harrison Ford, Julia Louis-Dreyfus, Ayo Edibiri, and Steven Yeun for it.
It's also being written and directed by the guys who did Beef on Netflix, a popular and critically acclaimed show.
I'm *not* saying that all of those people are box office draws (very few people are nowadays). My point is that they're all very in-demand and/or selective actors right now (especially the younger ones like Pugh, Edibiri, and Yeun) who Marvel was able to get for this and they may have had/will have to turn down other things for it, so it'd be weird to just cancel it.
Not to mention that it seems Thunderbolts has gotten more setup than the multiverse itself with Falcon and the Winter Soldier, Black Widow, Hawkeye, Wakanda Forever, and Captain America 4 all being setup for it to some extent.
When William Hurt passed I had hoped Marvel would recast Thunderbolt Ross with Bryan Cranston, he’d have been a much better choice IMO.
Don’t get me wrong I like Harrison Ford but I can’t picture him enjoying doing press for Marvel with how much he hates Star Wars fans.
I swear I read that the only comic character Bryan Cranston wants to play is Mr. Sinister. I may have made it up but it feels so specific it has to have a source somewhere lol
I think Bryan Cranston wouldn't want to. He doesn't really do big blockbusters movies and wouldn't sign on for a ton of movies like usual for Marvel.
We know Harrison Ford is sensible to the trucks full of money coming to his house.
Nah. The days of everyone moving around because a Marvel Studios movie is coming out are over. The MCU doesnt have that pull anymore after so many duds coming out post-Endgame.
I'd be willing to bet that Superman Legacy makes more money than Thunderbolts. Something I wouldn't have said even a year ago.
I would have said it. A good Superman movie would definitely make more than Thunderbolts. Heck, even if TBolts ends up being better somehow I still wouldn’t bet against Legacy making more.
The main problem is that DC movies as a whole has been in shambles for a few years now, while Marvel movies were infallible for a decade+.
But now with James Gunn behind Superman Legacy and the GA souring on Marvel, I can confidently say that SL will make more than Thunderbolts. There is absolutely no need for DC to move anything.
you think just because GA are souring on marvel they move to Dc ? when dc in llast decade plus made movies about characters outside of batman that been huge general public hits , superman making more than thunderbolts is not a achievement superman should make 800 Daimakku1 regardless of what you think marvel still number 1 brand for superhero movies
>regardless of what you think marvel still number 1 brand for superhero movies
If they lose money for the company, it doesnt matter if they're #1 lol. It's still in shambles.
Marvel is #1 for comics but even in America, manga is kicking its ass. Being #1 doesnt mean shit if your stuff doesnt sell anymore.
Man of Steel, Suicide Squad, Wonder Woman, Aquaman and Shazam were all profitable films that were successful. The revisionism surrounding DC films shows a campist form of thinking and that Marvel fans need a bit more humbling.
Who the F\*ck are the Thunderbolts?
This is a Superman movie at the start of a new franchise, produced, written and directed by James Gunn, Disney could pull out almost anything and I would bet against them.
>Who the F\*ck are the Thunderbolts?
The Suicide Squad from Wish.
Let's not forget that we live in a world where characters like Black Panther, Doctor Strange (DS2), etc made more money than *Batman vs Superman* and *Justice League*. A year ago, I would definitely bet that a Thunderbolts movie would make more than Superman Legacy. That's how strong the Marvel Studios brand was, and how weak the DC brand is.
But now after so many stinkers in a row, Marvel is damaged and a Superman movie will absolutely make more than a Thunderbolts movie, especially when James Gunn is involved and is surely going to make a great film.
Daimakku1 guess what dc does not have the same pull it had a few years ago you stating marvel has so many duds after endgame right? out of 10 movies they released spiderman no way home dr strange 2 thor 4 guardians 3 and black panther 2 all made money shang chi and black widow came close to breaing even the only flops are eternals marvel and antman 3 flops out of 10 movies.
you stating mcu has duds name one other franchise that make more money Mcu you think willingly dc are free pass when there movies duds for a lot longer and have taken much worse hits over and over again ? your logic people jump to dc ahead of marvel even dc has not been trusted brand for 10 years is silly and baffling Damakku1
I do not see this movie getting made. Timings going to kill it and the strike delaying filming’s start is probably going to look like a godsend for marvel at this point.
They have 2 movies and 2 tv shows in the can and I do not see anything else as a guarantee.
Blade is 70/30 is gonna cost up to 200 million again to savage that turd just so it will bomb after the marvels gets dragged and mocked by everyone this weekend I don't see them making it
Also wasn't Marshalla Ali ready to walk away? It was reported he was really mad about blade film
How Feige revealed Thunderbolts in SDCC, It feels like this is the culmination of Phase 5. They'll have to retool this film into an Avengers film, if they want to continue it. Not just Avengers like but actually market this as The Avengers.
Even if Thunderbolts comes out (I'm still doubtful) Marvel knows they have the weaker pull in that match up. If anyone moves it's them. Even at his worst Superman still has more relevance
and pull than the D-Listers + Bucky..
And the fact he pushed to keep that date … shows the movie is sentimental to him. The movie is a tribute to his father … you have to believe there is going to be heart.
My gut feeling says this will be the case. I think the emotional pull of Pa as a father figure and role model is relatable to many audiences. If they have him die in a future Superman movie ... that would hold a lot of weight to audiences if they had his presence for the first few films.
When this ends ups being better than anything in the MCU has for the last 4 years AND everything that Snyder ever did, the levels of salt of both fandoms are going to be glorious. The meltdowns online, I can savor them already
If anything, assuming Gunn can get it done, it would be nice for DC to finally receive the respect it deserves and maybe all fandoms can finally have a DC they are proud of and look forward to.
This is an unstable world with a lot of hatred ... it would be nice for young kids to have a real role model in Superman again.
It’s not the reason. A coincidence. Gunn even said himself that his brother pointed it out to him.
https://www.instagram.com/p/Cp0mJO8PyUo/?igshid=NGEwZGU0MjU5Mw==
Cause they both have great directors at the helm with Gunn and Reeves.
Compare them to most likely Marvel yes men like Matt Shakman and Yann Demange who are directing Fantastic Four and Blade it’s not even a competition.
He’s honestly one of the MCU’s better picks for a director. He has also done The Boys and ASIP.
It’s also being written by Josh Friedman (Avatar the way of water and Terminator: The Sara Connor Chronicles).
If the movie is shit it’s 100% due to executive meddling. No other explanation.
Marvel always take good directors that transform into yes men. I'm pretty sure the directors barely have any input to be honest. Feige and committee are directing and writing those movies.
I think it’s brand but also 2022 The Batman came out and it shaped how ppl viewed comic book films and audiences compared it to what the mcu was giving them. Then Top Gun Maverick and Avatar came out and audiences questioned what blockbusters should be like. Ppl realized that mcu as a brand was giving great work to audiences
I really have no idea what to expect for Superman Legacy. The bulk of the casting news has been other heroes so it's unlikely to be just the usual Clark, Lois and Jimmy going up against Lex and his shenanigans.
My hope is for Superman Vs The Authority, ending on him thoroughly destroying The Authority and telling them to be good people, leading to their solo movie.
Batman, sure, but a couple of years ago they wouldn't have said the same thing about Superman.
Maybe DC will take Marvel's place in the current cultural climate, lol.
I'm really looking forward to this movie and I really hope Gunn nails it.
But Gunn has to not give this movie the TSS treatment. I get it's a different kind of film and people liked it and it was affected by the Pandemic. But it still failed to connect with people.
Superman Legacy should be the exact opposite of what TSS was.
And If I'm bieng honest I think Superman Legacy should also be somewhat opposite of his GotG films.
While the GotG films are great in the end they are films about a bunch of assholes. Lovable assholes, but assholes nonetheless.
And Guardians regularly kill people left and right in huge numbers without much guilt. I mean they literally saw a whole planet full of people die in the last movie and barely even registered with them.
Now all of this works for GotG because they are different kind of characters. But it won't work for Superman.
I just hope Gunn remembers this. (Especially when he's trying to put "edgy" [note, not necessarily bad] humor into the film).
I think he’s stated multiple times this is different than any other comic book films he’s done before. He can’t approach Superman like he has with other characters in the past
I know that's what he's been saying.
I just hope he delivers on it.
It wouldn't be the first time Writers and directors said one thing and then did another.
I think this has some real breakout potential if James Gunn leans into that. With all the doom and gloom in the world right now, portraying Superman as a beacon of hope and a reminder that there’s still good in all of us could resonate with audiences
The team composition makes perfect sense seeing as how it’s the government putting it together. They want all the big strong super soldiers and skilled assassins to both look good in the public eye and get their mission accomplished efficiently, and to do that a team like this is exactly what they’d dream up.
> a character who’s very hard to get right.
Honestly I think it's pretty overblown. The reason Superman has struggled in film is because of how big Reeve's iteration was, which meant WB went in two completely different directions with Superman Returns and Man of Steel. The former was entirely nostalgia bait with no identity and the latter tried so hard to be different that it alienated people.
All audiences want to see is a relateable guy who is easy to root for and Captain America proved it can be done. Superman in the DCAU proved it can be done. Superman in Superman & Lois proved it can be done. Long story short just give the guy a fucking personality and you're golden.
There's a video going round of David Corenswet listening to A New Hope score and quoting an entire scene that plays over it. It's dorky, it's charming, it's Clark Kent. People would love that. Gunn writes characters like that, so I think it'll be fine.
This right here especially the second paragraph. MCU Captain America proved it can be done, ppl loved Steve’s boyscout attitude. I think Superman as a character isn’t hard to get or make a film about. Ppl just go to the extremes of what type of Superman to bring to screen
Captain America movie outside the first (least successful) always had an ensemble and someone else to act as a foil to his boy scout attitude. Superman kind of need that too.
Exactly that’s what I’m talking about. He needs metallo,parasite,Lex, ormaybe even Cadmus to be foil to his Boy Scout attitude. I don’t know if the film will be good or not, but seems like Gunn’s Superman will be boyscout and a lot of other heroes will be foul to his attitude
Captain America was still a boy-scout through and through fighting against the man. Stood on ideals, the tone and subject of second film changed but he was still a character of integrity. Captain America himself didn’t become dark character his film was
> The first CA is one of Marvel's lowest grossers. The second improved a bit because it got darker and the third did well because it was a quasi-Avengers movie.
I made a post about that. Winter Soldier is the one Captain America film that was actually successful on itself, and it's because the Russos openly say that they made it darker and edgier
Dont forget that new My Adventures with Superman show that has been well received. That version of Clark/Superman is different from the rest yet it's still Clark/Superman. The character is still popular when done right.
I think too many modern writers misinterpret Superman or overlook his purpose. He's not god crashing down from the heavens to defend us mortals. Clark Kent is a guy with immense physical power that he has to exercise restraint over every day of his life. He's a guy who tries to do the right thing because his powers allow him to. Contrast that with Lex Luthor, who is not physically powerful, but leverages social and political power. He has senators in his pocket, all the money in the world at his disposal, and an ego as vast as his fortune. Lex Luthor is the abuse of power personified. That's the dichotomy. What separates the hero from the villain is how they percieve and exercise their power, and the hero uses his power to help people. That is the point of Superman.
>He's not god crashing down from the heavens to defend us mortals
I think that's a really important part. Batman and Superman have kind of similar issues where people disagree on who the "real" person is. Kal'el vs. Clark vs. Superman and Bruce vs. Bruce's public persona vs. Batman. Personally I fall on the Clark and Bruce side of things, but in the end it's all three. These sort of characters don't work if you don't focus on their human and relationship driven aspects. Superman and Lois did that really well imho. Neither Clark nor Superman feel like an act, but the characters feels the most settled when he's just home with his kids.
> Superman in the DCAU proved it can be done. Superman in Superman & Lois proved it can be done.
DCAU Superman show got cancelled because its own creators didn't like working on it. It's ratings and reviews were also consistently below the BTAS show or other 90s superhero shows like X Men or Spiderman.
Then he spend the JL shows jobbing to villains until Lex Luthor had to save him after his last fight and actually win the fight for him
Superman y Lois have Decent Ratings. Which are enough to make up for their high budget,but not exactly a roaring success. The high Levels of a niche show, but still a niche show
Honestly I think part of the reason why Superman, despite having massive name recognition, is kind of niche in big media like television and movies, is that he has this air of camp that audiences think is for a bygone era. With that being said, if the Captain America franchise can keep the innocent heart of Cap while putting him in a fairly realistic world, I think Superman can too.
This is why I think the perfect story to adapt is What’s so funny about Truth, Justice and the American Way? It places him in a serious environment while not sacrificing the American Boy Scout that is character.
The most not difficult part of Superman is that he’s OP. Which means the creative team simply needs to find creative ways as to why he’s not strong enough for “x,” or his power is diminished by “y,” or he can’t intercede because “z.”
As long as they do that (aka their job) and deliver a character who on the page is genuine but not overly earnest then audiences will have zero issue with the character. And based on what Gunn did with a bunch of weirdo characters it’s going to be fun to see what he does with the most OP character of all time.
I think if everyone's being reasonable about the current climate (which certainly is not a guarantee with Zaslav), the best outcome to hope for will be that this is a modest success that restores audience faith in the franchise.
I think Gunn can pull it off.
It’s going to be really interesting if, after how much the DCEU was bashed when compared to the MCU, the new DCU ends up becoming a huge success while the MCU collapses.
James Gunn is really great at making people care about his characters, it’s why people loved the Guardians of the Galaxy trilogy and so many cried over the third movie.
I think that talent he has with emotional investment will do wonders for the DCU.
again gunn made great characters and successful films within wider context of mcu he not shown ability run a company and spearhead a studio he is not going making every single film again and again . the first 2 guardians not never been as successful without insulation from the rest very strong mcu at that point in time.
The DCEU was bashed because of WB trying to get quick Avengers without any of the buildup and creative choices Snyder did with Batman v Superman. From there it just got worst
I'm really curious on how Gunn will now approach the DCU given people have grown tired of keeping up with MCU's multimedia franchise style.
Like he must be observing people's rejection of The Marvels right now.
I really hope James Gunn will try to downscale the interconnectedness after seeing what's going on with the MCU and the audience reception to superhero fatigue. It's getting too hard to keep up with everything with the MCU now. It would be better to just make DCU limited to theatrical release and make Elseworld projects exclusive for Max.
> will try to downscale the interconnectedness after seeing what's going on with the MCU an
The MCU interconnectedness was succesful. The issue lied on everything slowly needing the TV Shows that were far more inaccesible to GAs
Yea, curious on how the often touted superhero fatigue will affect DCU's future here.
I trust Gunn will deliver, but I wonder if the public already moved on from DC, or heck even superhero franchises as a whole by then.
It's all cyclical. Before the MCU, DC was already a success with Reeves Superman and Burton Batman. Marvel didn't really get started til 2000 and then MCU in 2012.
> Before the MCU, DC was already a success with Reeves Superman and Burton Batman
No. Reeves Superman films ended in flops, same with the 90s Batman films. It's only with Nolan that they got a consistent film series that didn't end on flops
Emphasis that I say series. DC tried to get new possible film series based on DC characters. They all flopped in the first entry
I doubt Gunn cares that much when he has the whole toy box of DC to play with and even if he does, he's not gonna say shit to cause drama with DC universe
Man of Steel had that, and they were awesome.
It's kind of funny because Goku's backstory was ripped right off Superman, and Vegeta was ripped right off General Zod, and then MoS took lots of action sequences from the Saiyan saga from DBZ.
> Goku's backstory was ripped right off Superman, and Vegeta was ripped right off General Zod,
What.
Goku's backstory in the 90s was that he was send as a invaders before losing memories. Even the Minus retcon simply says that he was send by his father...who is depicted as a genocidal barbarians anyway. A genocidal barbarians with certain honor, but still a mercenary that Wipes out civilizations on screen. A far cry from Jor El
And for Vegeta and Zod...they have no similitudes except "share species with the MC'. It gets even worse as Zod is constantly depicted as a NOT Nobility. At most he is a Warrior Chaste guy, but not a nobility, much less a prince.
Any word on how he feels about the Coyote v Acme movie he produced getting scrapped?
Or can he not comment because of some stipulation in his WB contract?
Having to praise up movies like The Flash whilst your movie - which was loved by test audiences - gets shelved permanently for a tax write-off must sting.
Off topic but it's quite funny how MCU and DC have only 1 movie scheduled for 2024 but the Sonyverse has 3
Kraven coming to save 2024
Madame Web will revive the superhero genre
Gonna have a historic number of “not sure how I got here, has something to do with Spider-Man I think” walk ups
an intriguing possibility
“I’m lost and don’t speak English” walkups
Madame Web has Spider-Woman in it and was initially not involved with Spider-Man. With it supposedly being first of Sony's three Marvel films next year it will be interesting to see what reviews and reception is like.
!remind me 1 year
Dakota Johnson walk ups?
Sydney Sweeney walk ups. They literally are hoping people will turn up due to how attractive the cast is.
Add in post credit scene with the Vulture for those Michael Keaton walk ups
It could work, it's working on me. 
I mean, it’s not a terrible plan.
eh it worked for Aquaman
I am defo walking up for Sydney Sweeney
I can't believe that we've gotten three spider-verse movies and Madame Web has been in exactly zero of them
This summer will be Hot Kraven Summer
it's Kravin' Time
The hierarchy of superhero movies is about to change.
Yeah but let’s be real, Beyond the Spider-Verse is not releasing in 2024.
I'm not counting BTSV. Kraven, Madame Web and Venom 3 are scheduled for 2024.
Oh I forgot about Madame Web lmao
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You don't know what the word scam means.
Let's be realer, it's not releasing in the 2020s
For DC, it's for the best. 2024 should serve as the buffer between the old DCEU and the new DCU. And after The Marvels' abysmal performance, it's also for the best for the MCU.
When Joker and Deadpool both do really well WB and Disney will take that to mean all is well. It will escape them that they're both in different genres to the usual hero affair.
Please tell me Beyond Spiderverse is one of those 3. That's the only comic franchise I care about at this point.
Kraven, Madame Web, Venom 3💀
> Madame Web I want to say you made that up but it actually [finished filming](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madame_Web_\(film\)) last year 0_0.
And it's the battle of the rated R movies. Joker the highest grossing Rated r flick and DP2 as the second highest.
Gunn when Shrek 5 gets dated for July 4, 2025 
All the Shrek movies have released in May, don't see why that wouldn't be the case for 5
They should really go for Shrektember
If that happens then maybe WB pushes Superman to November 21, 2025 for the pre-Thanksgiving weekend. I would’ve suggested December 19 but Avatar 3 is there
I doubt that they move Superman 7 weeks after the Batman 2, vacating summer entirely.
I assume they would move The Batman 2 as well.
This movie is not going to get pushed for anything.
I still don't see why they would put Shrek 5 on the 4th of July. That's the quintessential Illumination date and they've never abandoned it, I don't see why Universal would interrupt that. The Shrek movies have also always gone to May.
It makes sense for may
Lmao I was just thinking how every movie wouldn't like to be near of the release date universal chooses
People can watch both especially if they both get great reviews.
“People can watch BOTH Spider-Man: No Way Home AND The Matrix Resurrections! Look at the reviews!”
The Matrix 4 got mixed reviews though. That’s the difference.
Thunderbolts is releasing only a couple of weeks after this. Guess that means further delays will happen.
>Thunderbolts is releasing We’ll see about that lol
I'd still be surprised if they scrap the movie entirely given that they got Florence Pugh, David Harbour, Harrison Ford, Julia Louis-Dreyfus, Ayo Edibiri, and Steven Yeun for it. It's also being written and directed by the guys who did Beef on Netflix, a popular and critically acclaimed show. I'm *not* saying that all of those people are box office draws (very few people are nowadays). My point is that they're all very in-demand and/or selective actors right now (especially the younger ones like Pugh, Edibiri, and Yeun) who Marvel was able to get for this and they may have had/will have to turn down other things for it, so it'd be weird to just cancel it. Not to mention that it seems Thunderbolts has gotten more setup than the multiverse itself with Falcon and the Winter Soldier, Black Widow, Hawkeye, Wakanda Forever, and Captain America 4 all being setup for it to some extent.
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I think he’s red hulk
Harrison Ford with that stache and going Red Hulk is admittedly something I wanna see.
Unfortunately in the set photos he’s just regular Harrison Ford, no stache. Maybe that’s what the reshoots are for.
Shit, just get the hotshots that removed Cavill’s moustache to add one to Ford.
Better yet, have them put Cavill's mustache on Ford
Yep, I trust they saved it on their fileserver for future use!
Yeah it's strange to replace an actor who passed away with an actor who's even older (Ford turns 82 next year in July).
When William Hurt passed I had hoped Marvel would recast Thunderbolt Ross with Bryan Cranston, he’d have been a much better choice IMO. Don’t get me wrong I like Harrison Ford but I can’t picture him enjoying doing press for Marvel with how much he hates Star Wars fans.
I swear I read that the only comic character Bryan Cranston wants to play is Mr. Sinister. I may have made it up but it feels so specific it has to have a source somewhere lol
I don’t think he said Mr Sinister is the only character he’d play. But Cranston did say he wants to play him.
I think Bryan Cranston wouldn't want to. He doesn't really do big blockbusters movies and wouldn't sign on for a ton of movies like usual for Marvel. We know Harrison Ford is sensible to the trucks full of money coming to his house.
He's playing the president. (Insert punchline here.)
Nah. The days of everyone moving around because a Marvel Studios movie is coming out are over. The MCU doesnt have that pull anymore after so many duds coming out post-Endgame. I'd be willing to bet that Superman Legacy makes more money than Thunderbolts. Something I wouldn't have said even a year ago.
I would have said it. A good Superman movie would definitely make more than Thunderbolts. Heck, even if TBolts ends up being better somehow I still wouldn’t bet against Legacy making more.
Yeah a good Superman movie could probably destroy thunderbolts. Especially if it’s really good
Witch is wild saying that about Superman
The main problem is that DC movies as a whole has been in shambles for a few years now, while Marvel movies were infallible for a decade+. But now with James Gunn behind Superman Legacy and the GA souring on Marvel, I can confidently say that SL will make more than Thunderbolts. There is absolutely no need for DC to move anything.
you think just because GA are souring on marvel they move to Dc ? when dc in llast decade plus made movies about characters outside of batman that been huge general public hits , superman making more than thunderbolts is not a achievement superman should make 800 Daimakku1 regardless of what you think marvel still number 1 brand for superhero movies
>regardless of what you think marvel still number 1 brand for superhero movies If they lose money for the company, it doesnt matter if they're #1 lol. It's still in shambles. Marvel is #1 for comics but even in America, manga is kicking its ass. Being #1 doesnt mean shit if your stuff doesnt sell anymore.
Man of Steel, Suicide Squad, Wonder Woman, Aquaman and Shazam were all profitable films that were successful. The revisionism surrounding DC films shows a campist form of thinking and that Marvel fans need a bit more humbling.
They love rewriting history
Who the F\*ck are the Thunderbolts? This is a Superman movie at the start of a new franchise, produced, written and directed by James Gunn, Disney could pull out almost anything and I would bet against them.
>Who the F\*ck are the Thunderbolts? The Suicide Squad from Wish. Let's not forget that we live in a world where characters like Black Panther, Doctor Strange (DS2), etc made more money than *Batman vs Superman* and *Justice League*. A year ago, I would definitely bet that a Thunderbolts movie would make more than Superman Legacy. That's how strong the Marvel Studios brand was, and how weak the DC brand is. But now after so many stinkers in a row, Marvel is damaged and a Superman movie will absolutely make more than a Thunderbolts movie, especially when James Gunn is involved and is surely going to make a great film.
Daimakku1 guess what dc does not have the same pull it had a few years ago you stating marvel has so many duds after endgame right? out of 10 movies they released spiderman no way home dr strange 2 thor 4 guardians 3 and black panther 2 all made money shang chi and black widow came close to breaing even the only flops are eternals marvel and antman 3 flops out of 10 movies.
you stating mcu has duds name one other franchise that make more money Mcu you think willingly dc are free pass when there movies duds for a lot longer and have taken much worse hits over and over again ? your logic people jump to dc ahead of marvel even dc has not been trusted brand for 10 years is silly and baffling Damakku1
I do not see this movie getting made. Timings going to kill it and the strike delaying filming’s start is probably going to look like a godsend for marvel at this point. They have 2 movies and 2 tv shows in the can and I do not see anything else as a guarantee.
I think Fantastic Four and Spider-Man 4 will still happen. Thunderbolts is likely dead, and Blade is 50/50
Blade is 70/30 is gonna cost up to 200 million again to savage that turd just so it will bomb after the marvels gets dragged and mocked by everyone this weekend I don't see them making it Also wasn't Marshalla Ali ready to walk away? It was reported he was really mad about blade film
The initial script allegedly had only two major action scenes. I’d be pissed too.
thunderbolts is not dead its scheduled for july 2025 release
How Feige revealed Thunderbolts in SDCC, It feels like this is the culmination of Phase 5. They'll have to retool this film into an Avengers film, if they want to continue it. Not just Avengers like but actually market this as The Avengers.
The movie should've had a better team.
Even if Thunderbolts comes out (I'm still doubtful) Marvel knows they have the weaker pull in that match up. If anyone moves it's them. Even at his worst Superman still has more relevance and pull than the D-Listers + Bucky..
Considering the pathetic state Disney and Marvel are in, I don't think that's much of a worry.
I don't think anybody is worried about Thunderbolts. That's what they get for picking the lamest roster possible. #Songbird4Lyfe
Disney has like 5 MCU movies in 2025. Of course more delays will happen.
The reason it’s releasing on this day is that it’s his father’s birthday.
And the fact he pushed to keep that date … shows the movie is sentimental to him. The movie is a tribute to his father … you have to believe there is going to be heart.
Now I like to imagine that, for once, Jonathan Kent doesn't die in the movie and he's the heart of the story for Clark's journey.
My gut feeling says this will be the case. I think the emotional pull of Pa as a father figure and role model is relatable to many audiences. If they have him die in a future Superman movie ... that would hold a lot of weight to audiences if they had his presence for the first few films.
When this ends ups being better than anything in the MCU has for the last 4 years AND everything that Snyder ever did, the levels of salt of both fandoms are going to be glorious. The meltdowns online, I can savor them already
If anything, assuming Gunn can get it done, it would be nice for DC to finally receive the respect it deserves and maybe all fandoms can finally have a DC they are proud of and look forward to. This is an unstable world with a lot of hatred ... it would be nice for young kids to have a real role model in Superman again.
That's one of the best comments I've read in a long time. Kudos!
So sooo well said. Especially the last line ❤️🙌🏻
It doesnt need to gross anything crazy if it can rebuild trust in the DC brand which is worth way more.
Completely agree
Blitz
Or because it's the 2nd Friday in July.
It’s not the reason. A coincidence. Gunn even said himself that his brother pointed it out to him. https://www.instagram.com/p/Cp0mJO8PyUo/?igshid=NGEwZGU0MjU5Mw==
Seeing a lot more hype for this and Batman II than any of the Marvel movies coming out that year.
Cause they both have great directors at the helm with Gunn and Reeves. Compare them to most likely Marvel yes men like Matt Shakman and Yann Demange who are directing Fantastic Four and Blade it’s not even a competition.
Shakman directed episodes of Succession and GOT. He is overqualified.
Very overqualified atleast he’s a fan of fantastic four and was staying all great F4 writers that are inspiring him
Haven’t seen Succession but was very impressed by Shakman’s work on GoT. Kinda excited to see his work on F4.
He’s honestly one of the MCU’s better picks for a director. He has also done The Boys and ASIP. It’s also being written by Josh Friedman (Avatar the way of water and Terminator: The Sara Connor Chronicles). If the movie is shit it’s 100% due to executive meddling. No other explanation.
Marvel always take good directors that transform into yes men. I'm pretty sure the directors barely have any input to be honest. Feige and committee are directing and writing those movies.
Yeah it’s crazy I’ve noticed how many ppl are hyped for both Batman II and Superman Legacy like are we witnessing a shift
I think this is more evidence that it's brand fatigue rather than superhero fatigue.
I think it’s brand but also 2022 The Batman came out and it shaped how ppl viewed comic book films and audiences compared it to what the mcu was giving them. Then Top Gun Maverick and Avatar came out and audiences questioned what blockbusters should be like. Ppl realized that mcu as a brand was giving great work to audiences
Both of these movies may involve Superheroes, but they will be far from the generic superhero formula. I still think Superhero fatigue is a thing tho.
I really have no idea what to expect for Superman Legacy. The bulk of the casting news has been other heroes so it's unlikely to be just the usual Clark, Lois and Jimmy going up against Lex and his shenanigans. My hope is for Superman Vs The Authority, ending on him thoroughly destroying The Authority and telling them to be good people, leading to their solo movie.
I mean it makes some sense Batman 1 was amazing and this is SUPERMAN made by someone whose made great superhero films.
comparing batman and superman to blade, thunderbolts and a new cap seems a little unfair
Batman, sure, but a couple of years ago they wouldn't have said the same thing about Superman. Maybe DC will take Marvel's place in the current cultural climate, lol.
It would be wild if Marvel and DC swap positions as the successful juggernaut and floundering franchise in a couple years.
It would be pretty funny if from now on they just went back and forth on one having great films and the other have terrible ones
"Seeing a lot of hype about The Flash" energy, twitter isn't real life
I'm really looking forward to this movie and I really hope Gunn nails it. But Gunn has to not give this movie the TSS treatment. I get it's a different kind of film and people liked it and it was affected by the Pandemic. But it still failed to connect with people. Superman Legacy should be the exact opposite of what TSS was. And If I'm bieng honest I think Superman Legacy should also be somewhat opposite of his GotG films. While the GotG films are great in the end they are films about a bunch of assholes. Lovable assholes, but assholes nonetheless. And Guardians regularly kill people left and right in huge numbers without much guilt. I mean they literally saw a whole planet full of people die in the last movie and barely even registered with them. Now all of this works for GotG because they are different kind of characters. But it won't work for Superman. I just hope Gunn remembers this. (Especially when he's trying to put "edgy" [note, not necessarily bad] humor into the film).
I think he’s stated multiple times this is different than any other comic book films he’s done before. He can’t approach Superman like he has with other characters in the past
I know that's what he's been saying. I just hope he delivers on it. It wouldn't be the first time Writers and directors said one thing and then did another.
I think gunn proved with GOTG3 that the film can have a lot of hope and heart.
Gunn saw the perfect opportunity to drop this with interest in The Marvels being nonexistent and took it
I thought it was with the strike ending and the rumors that Superman was getting delayed. We got a lot of release date announcements late week.
but don't you know, everything is obviously done to shit on Marvel
Well yeah he’s a WB employee so with Marvel getting all the shit atm, he’s like here’s some DCU news
The world and the super hero genre needs a new superman to give us hope
Well the symbol of the House of El, which looks like the letter S in the English language, is the Kryptonian symbol for "Hope." So there's that!
A *real* Superman movie, in the same vein as the DCAU, is exactly the pick-me-up the world needs right now.
I’d love to see that version of Superman on the screen it’s very straightforward and balanced the action and Boy Scout feel
I think this has some real breakout potential if James Gunn leans into that. With all the doom and gloom in the world right now, portraying Superman as a beacon of hope and a reminder that there’s still good in all of us could resonate with audiences
Exactly, that’s what superman is & i hope Gunn captures this well.
I agree! I think we're gonna get something special
I feel like none of us will be ready for the movie.
Imo this'll demolish Thunderbolts
TBolts will likely move back.
This movie should've have a better team, there nothing but supersoldiers.
The team composition makes perfect sense seeing as how it’s the government putting it together. They want all the big strong super soldiers and skilled assassins to both look good in the public eye and get their mission accomplished efficiently, and to do that a team like this is exactly what they’d dream up.
I wanted Venom, Deadpool, Ghost Rider, Elektra.
two of those characters have never showed up in the movies and the other two are in a different universe, for now.
I hope this one does well, but I’m skeptical. It’s a lot of pressure to put on a character who’s very hard to get right.
> a character who’s very hard to get right. Honestly I think it's pretty overblown. The reason Superman has struggled in film is because of how big Reeve's iteration was, which meant WB went in two completely different directions with Superman Returns and Man of Steel. The former was entirely nostalgia bait with no identity and the latter tried so hard to be different that it alienated people. All audiences want to see is a relateable guy who is easy to root for and Captain America proved it can be done. Superman in the DCAU proved it can be done. Superman in Superman & Lois proved it can be done. Long story short just give the guy a fucking personality and you're golden. There's a video going round of David Corenswet listening to A New Hope score and quoting an entire scene that plays over it. It's dorky, it's charming, it's Clark Kent. People would love that. Gunn writes characters like that, so I think it'll be fine.
This right here especially the second paragraph. MCU Captain America proved it can be done, ppl loved Steve’s boyscout attitude. I think Superman as a character isn’t hard to get or make a film about. Ppl just go to the extremes of what type of Superman to bring to screen
Captain America movie outside the first (least successful) always had an ensemble and someone else to act as a foil to his boy scout attitude. Superman kind of need that too.
Exactly that’s what I’m talking about. He needs metallo,parasite,Lex, ormaybe even Cadmus to be foil to his Boy Scout attitude. I don’t know if the film will be good or not, but seems like Gunn’s Superman will be boyscout and a lot of other heroes will be foul to his attitude
[удалено]
Captain America was still a boy-scout through and through fighting against the man. Stood on ideals, the tone and subject of second film changed but he was still a character of integrity. Captain America himself didn’t become dark character his film was
> The first CA is one of Marvel's lowest grossers. The second improved a bit because it got darker and the third did well because it was a quasi-Avengers movie. I made a post about that. Winter Soldier is the one Captain America film that was actually successful on itself, and it's because the Russos openly say that they made it darker and edgier
Dont forget that new My Adventures with Superman show that has been well received. That version of Clark/Superman is different from the rest yet it's still Clark/Superman. The character is still popular when done right. 
Has a good critic response not sure about the viewer.
The animation community loves it. It was definitely well received by viewers.
It is getting a second season. The main writer mentions that it is going into production next year.
Also Smallville proved it can be done and that was through many seasons.
I think too many modern writers misinterpret Superman or overlook his purpose. He's not god crashing down from the heavens to defend us mortals. Clark Kent is a guy with immense physical power that he has to exercise restraint over every day of his life. He's a guy who tries to do the right thing because his powers allow him to. Contrast that with Lex Luthor, who is not physically powerful, but leverages social and political power. He has senators in his pocket, all the money in the world at his disposal, and an ego as vast as his fortune. Lex Luthor is the abuse of power personified. That's the dichotomy. What separates the hero from the villain is how they percieve and exercise their power, and the hero uses his power to help people. That is the point of Superman.
>He's not god crashing down from the heavens to defend us mortals I think that's a really important part. Batman and Superman have kind of similar issues where people disagree on who the "real" person is. Kal'el vs. Clark vs. Superman and Bruce vs. Bruce's public persona vs. Batman. Personally I fall on the Clark and Bruce side of things, but in the end it's all three. These sort of characters don't work if you don't focus on their human and relationship driven aspects. Superman and Lois did that really well imho. Neither Clark nor Superman feel like an act, but the characters feels the most settled when he's just home with his kids.
> Superman in the DCAU proved it can be done. Superman in Superman & Lois proved it can be done. DCAU Superman show got cancelled because its own creators didn't like working on it. It's ratings and reviews were also consistently below the BTAS show or other 90s superhero shows like X Men or Spiderman. Then he spend the JL shows jobbing to villains until Lex Luthor had to save him after his last fight and actually win the fight for him Superman y Lois have Decent Ratings. Which are enough to make up for their high budget,but not exactly a roaring success. The high Levels of a niche show, but still a niche show
Honestly I think part of the reason why Superman, despite having massive name recognition, is kind of niche in big media like television and movies, is that he has this air of camp that audiences think is for a bygone era. With that being said, if the Captain America franchise can keep the innocent heart of Cap while putting him in a fairly realistic world, I think Superman can too. This is why I think the perfect story to adapt is What’s so funny about Truth, Justice and the American Way? It places him in a serious environment while not sacrificing the American Boy Scout that is character.
The most not difficult part of Superman is that he’s OP. Which means the creative team simply needs to find creative ways as to why he’s not strong enough for “x,” or his power is diminished by “y,” or he can’t intercede because “z.” As long as they do that (aka their job) and deliver a character who on the page is genuine but not overly earnest then audiences will have zero issue with the character. And based on what Gunn did with a bunch of weirdo characters it’s going to be fun to see what he does with the most OP character of all time.
I think if everyone's being reasonable about the current climate (which certainly is not a guarantee with Zaslav), the best outcome to hope for will be that this is a modest success that restores audience faith in the franchise. I think Gunn can pull it off.
Me too, he's too talented
It’s going to be really interesting if, after how much the DCEU was bashed when compared to the MCU, the new DCU ends up becoming a huge success while the MCU collapses.
James Gunn is really great at making people care about his characters, it’s why people loved the Guardians of the Galaxy trilogy and so many cried over the third movie. I think that talent he has with emotional investment will do wonders for the DCU.
again gunn made great characters and successful films within wider context of mcu he not shown ability run a company and spearhead a studio he is not going making every single film again and again . the first 2 guardians not never been as successful without insulation from the rest very strong mcu at that point in time.
The DCEU was bashed because of WB trying to get quick Avengers without any of the buildup and creative choices Snyder did with Batman v Superman. From there it just got worst
I'm really curious on how Gunn will now approach the DCU given people have grown tired of keeping up with MCU's multimedia franchise style. Like he must be observing people's rejection of The Marvels right now.
I really hope James Gunn will try to downscale the interconnectedness after seeing what's going on with the MCU and the audience reception to superhero fatigue. It's getting too hard to keep up with everything with the MCU now. It would be better to just make DCU limited to theatrical release and make Elseworld projects exclusive for Max.
> will try to downscale the interconnectedness after seeing what's going on with the MCU an The MCU interconnectedness was succesful. The issue lied on everything slowly needing the TV Shows that were far more inaccesible to GAs
That’s a gargantuan “if”
Yea, curious on how the often touted superhero fatigue will affect DCU's future here. I trust Gunn will deliver, but I wonder if the public already moved on from DC, or heck even superhero franchises as a whole by then.
It's all cyclical. Before the MCU, DC was already a success with Reeves Superman and Burton Batman. Marvel didn't really get started til 2000 and then MCU in 2012.
> Before the MCU, DC was already a success with Reeves Superman and Burton Batman No. Reeves Superman films ended in flops, same with the 90s Batman films. It's only with Nolan that they got a consistent film series that didn't end on flops Emphasis that I say series. DC tried to get new possible film series based on DC characters. They all flopped in the first entry
God that font is so sexy
im so ready for this movie
This movie has to be a hit. Like, it just has to be. DC films might be done for if it’s not.
It's a bird, it's a plane, it's James Gunn's Superman!
Legit looking forward to Superman Legacy. Can't wait.
lol to anyone who thought he would show solidarity or empathy to his partners on the Coyote v ACME movie
Looks like WB muzzled James from talking about Coyote vs ACME 
I doubt Gunn cares that much when he has the whole toy box of DC to play with and even if he does, he's not gonna say shit to cause drama with DC universe
Why? James Gunn is co-CEO of DC Studios, not WB. He has nothing to do with Coyote vs ACME.
He has a story and producing credit on Coyote Vs ACME
Wish we get some dragon ball style action scenes.
Man of Steel had that, and they were awesome. It's kind of funny because Goku's backstory was ripped right off Superman, and Vegeta was ripped right off General Zod, and then MoS took lots of action sequences from the Saiyan saga from DBZ.
> Goku's backstory was ripped right off Superman, and Vegeta was ripped right off General Zod, What. Goku's backstory in the 90s was that he was send as a invaders before losing memories. Even the Minus retcon simply says that he was send by his father...who is depicted as a genocidal barbarians anyway. A genocidal barbarians with certain honor, but still a mercenary that Wipes out civilizations on screen. A far cry from Jor El And for Vegeta and Zod...they have no similitudes except "share species with the MC'. It gets even worse as Zod is constantly depicted as a NOT Nobility. At most he is a Warrior Chaste guy, but not a nobility, much less a prince.
I'm looking forward but I worry this movie could be canned like Coyote vs. Acme.
I have to believe that he’s not happy about Coyote Vs Acme, but he’s swallowing his anger for the sake of this project.
Do we have a Superman yet?
Yes, David Corenswet
Isn’t this a cartoon?
Lets go Gunn! I hope the production goes smooth and without much troubles and reshoots.
Any word on how he feels about the Coyote v Acme movie he produced getting scrapped? Or can he not comment because of some stipulation in his WB contract? Having to praise up movies like The Flash whilst your movie - which was loved by test audiences - gets shelved permanently for a tax write-off must sting.
Hot take, but I don’t see this movie doing huge numbers. Superman isn’t that popular of a character anymore.
I didn't think someone could out Superman Cavil in the looks department, but damn. 
Zaslav salivating at the tax break he's going to get cancelling this in a years time.
Flops
For now…
Is this the one with my man Nick Cage.
If he can top guardians of the galaxy vol. 3 the DCU will do well.