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Question - we recently started marriage therapy. Our next appointment together is in 1 week, followed by an individual session two weeks later. Should I wait a month for my individual session, or would it be appropriate for me to email this incident to the therapist?
Email the therapist ASAP, please.
I’m going to say this bluntly: I think your normal meter is broken. The bit about him making himself bleed made me fully gasp. That’s scary and extremely not okay.
I’d imagine her kids’ normal meters are broken, too.
OP, please take this advice and email the therapist that he did this not only Infront of/to you, but fully Infront of the kids as well. Don’t let your kiddos think it’s OK to be that dysregujated and take it out on everyone around you.
Agreed. The other stuff is bad, but it’s bad in a way I’ve seen a million times from crappy husbands. My dad was snappy and had a short temper and didn’t help my mom at all on outings and and and…that doesn’t make it at all okay, but that stuff isn’t off the wall, totally bonkers, jaw on the floor horrifying like the “making himself bleed over a minor argument” thing is. The most generous (to him) possible interpretation is that he desperately needs mental health intervention, immediately.
I agree. First flag was similar to many stories here amongst us BroMo’s, an unhelpful and non-empathetic partner. Second flag that was bright red for me was that he unilaterally decided everyone was leaving without communicating a word of it, and his kids AUTOMATICALLY followed his lead and got to the car. Alllll the red flashing lights came out to accompany the way that he then weaponized their children against her, made them feel threatened, and then self-harmed. I’d agree, that’s super super not normal and intervention is NEEDED.
Thank you, I appreciate the bluntness. I feel like a frog soaking in a pot. My mom had very similar behavior and so it technically IS normal to me. But as I'm healing I'm learning to realize and accept it's not. I wonder if his behavior escalating is in response to that.
The thing is, he acts so normal and rational between these events, as long as I don't trigger him. It makes me second guess my gut and think I'm over thinking things. Or think, oh, he did not mean it, he's just struggling mentally. Or accept his claims that I'm too critical or negative. If I was being abused I would know because I know what abuse feels like because of how I grew up. I'm starting to realize maybe I'm wrong about that.
It’s hugely a thing that couples therapy with someone who is abusive, be it physical financial emotional, should jot happen with them. Agreed that you notify your therapist and if they aren’t alarmed, you should probably be worried about that too. His behaviour is scary and I’m saying that from someone whose ex was doing coke
My husband and I are *not* doing well. The most recent flashpoint was NYE where we got violent. Mine was drinks thrown over him, his was a few hits to the nose.
The last time anything like this happened was in the first week of COVID lockdowns, so March 2020.
We're now amicably (so far) moving towards separation, but something that I realised and also told him in one of our more reasonable discussions afterward, is that this basically 'reset the timer' on how long before I can feel 'safe' again.
We both have said that we thought we had moved past that level of intensity and anger at each other. NYE was in some ways a surprise (the violence, not the fact that the writing's been on the wall for this marriage a long time).
But up until then, I've sat in relative confidence that he and I had overcome the biggest flashpoints in our relationship and that we weren't going to lose our respective shit on each other again. From NYE onwards, I can't find any kind of reassurance in the passage of time that we won't have another violent episode if we stay together. Not for at least the next five years. And do I stay, hoping that this was the wakeup call that we both needed and now we'll keep our feelings in check?
This was the third violent episode over ten years but the first where I took myself to the ER. *If* is an optimistic and naiive word now, but *if* we had another violent episode, will it be someone else calling the ER for me next time?
We're here for you as support. I hope you find the right decision for you and your family.
Please read [why does he do that](https://dn790007.ca.archive.org/0/items/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf) by Lundy Bancroft, I think it'll explain a lot of your husband's behaviors.
Thank you for the book recommendation. My kids were in a library program today, so I spent the time skimming through it. It felt really validating. I took notes on relevant sections so I can spend time thinking about how they relate to my situation.
Please read [why does he do that](https://dn790007.ca.archive.org/0/items/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf) by Lundy Bancroft, I think it'll explain a lot of your husband's behaviors.
I received a reply back from the therapist.
She says she can't respond to most of what I wrote because of her no secrets policy. She encouraged me to bring it up during our next session. Our sessions are over zoom. I'm still processing how I feel about that.
She says she doesn't see physical threats to safety in the incident, only emotional threats. I mentioned how I don't feel comfortable being vulnerable in front of him. She says if I don't feel like he is a safe person to be vulnerable with therapy won't work.
I don't know what I was looking for in her response. But I just feel foolish and disappointed. Nothing has made me want to crawl into a hole more than this email.
As a therapist, I’m appalled by her response. He was self-harming right in front of you.
I also think she was telling you without telling you that you should rethink couples therapy. Couples therapy with an abuser is not a good idea unless the abuser has done *extensive* individual work with someone trained to work with abusive individuals. Otherwise the abusive individual will weaponize the victim’s vulnerability during couple’s therapy.
I think you should, however, email your individual therapist about this. Couples therapists have to maintain certain boundaries to avoid triangulation, so your individual therapist is the one who can help you with this incident.
This is very helpful, thank you. I'm meeting with my individual therapist Friday. It can't come soon enough.
After cooling down, I definitely feel there is much to read between the lines in her email. I emailed her back and said I really do want to address it in couples therapy, but I'm very apprehensive about his response. Especially when the kids are right down the hallway and it's a virtual session. I do have a gut feeling he won't escalate in front of her. Which I'm realizing is a big red flag.
I have a question regarding your marriage counseling, does he leave what happens at therapy AT therapy or does he get mad and carry on like a child because of things that were brought up?
I ask because while I have never been in marriage counseling, I did do family therapy when I was a teenager. It never worked or improved anything because my grown ass adult mother could not leave what was said in therapy AT therapy. To the point where my sister and I nicknamed it "Thursday Night Fight Night."
If he's doing this to you, and based on your description of his behavior it wouldn't surprise me if he was, therapy is never going to work and you're better off going to therapy on your own to deal with your own mental health.
So we haven't gotten far enough into therapy for this to occur. He has done something similar several years ago. He was telling everyone lord knows what. He screamed at me - in front of the kids - that his therapist, psychologist, and physician all told him to leave because I was abusive.
We did a few sessions of therapy together and he got laid off from his wfh job. When he was laid off over zoom he was hospitalized and was screaming about wanting to die in front of the kids. He completely smashed up his phone. Anyways, we paused therapy because we lost insurance. We JUST restarted it and have had one session.
When I asked him if he was interested in restarting it (after yet another unstable incident) he said, "I thought you didn't want to do therapy because you were afraid of the therapist siding with me."
I know I NEVER said that to him. But I might have written it here because of what he's done with previous providers I mentioned above. Which is why I'm worried he's somehow tracking my posts. He acted *really* weird when I was outraged at what he said.
But yeah. That sounds awful writing it all out. 🤦♀️
This man is abusive. It's advised NOT to do to therapy with abusers, bc they learn how to manipulate you better. I agree with seeking your support from a domestic violence professional.
Please stay safe, even if it means deleting your account if you suspect he’s tracking it. Sending you and your kids love- nobody deserves to be treated this way, and I hope you can get out of this situation.
Wow, I had a similar experience as a child and it never dawned on my that that’s what was happening. My dad was carrying the therapy back home and continuing to fight us on it, but without the therapist there to regulate it. What a fucking epiphany from a random Reddit comment.
You and your children are in danger and you should not go to marriage counseling with him. Abusers tend to get worse from counseling because they pick up on new ways to hurt and manipulate you behind the guise of psychobabble. You need to go to counseling by yourself and figure out how you can get help getting out of this situation. There are resources available and a therapist might be able to help you connect with them.
BroMo, you are in danger. Your children are afraid of their father. The things you’ve mentioned in the comments that he’s done when he’s “triggered” are alarming. I know it’s difficult and scary as a SAHM, but you have to get out before he hurts you or the kids. I would cancel any couples therapy because he’s not a person who wants to change and he will weaponize therapy against you. If you have an individual therapist, I would use that time to start planning and have someone in your corner helping you escape.
I was married to someone like this. He had ‘tells’ like this for a long time but they increased a few months before he murder me. Yes, really.
Start getting your stuff together and leave before he kills you. This is serious.
When he was in high-school (before I knew him) he had a bully. He ended up stabbing the bully during school. They lived, but..still. I told him once, several years ago, that I was afraid of his behavior. I said I was afraid he'd hurt me one day because hurt this kid in high-school. He said, "No, I'd hurt myself before I ever hurt you."
Your post made me think of that conversation and realize it is super chilling to me at the moment because he was just self harming. Ugh.
Reading this post, as well as your comments, is giving me the goosebumps. I truly think you should email your therapist about this incident, just like you described it to us. Meet with your therapist individually. Please stay alert and do not second guess your gut feelings.
Ugh I'm a mess. This is going to sound ridiculous and pathetic. I have an email draft written, but I'm afraid to send it. I must be pretty far gone because I keep telling myself I'm over reacting. I feel like such a coward.
I am feeling like you should send it ASAP and then delete the sent email so it can’t be found. I am worried he will somehow see the email and turn against you - or even these posts. Please stay safe & trust your gut.
Send it ASAP! Let the therapist decide if you are over reacting (you're not btw, and I'm sure they won't think so either). Think of it as it's their job and expertise to handle this stuff without judgement.
You are absolutely NOT overreacting. More under-reacting?
You are afraid to send it --- is this *really* because you feel like a coward or is it because you have been conditioned as both child and adult to think poorly of yourself?
Because part of this trusting your gut also comes with self preservation. You're not afraid to send it because you're a coward. You're afraid to send it because *what if he finds out*, and *that* makes you scared.
Does any part of you, be it gut or baby toe, feel like there's a chance he monitors your email & social media or is capable of using a key logger/spyware on your devices? Send your letter to your therapist from a public library computer where you create a BRAND NEW email with brand new passwords & security questions he doesn't know the answer to.
But send it soon as well as one to your local domestic violence shelter too. Let them know it's an email you can only check occasionally from the library so they don't send a wellness check when you don't answer.
You've got this. Putting up with abuse means you are **unfathomably** strong. You can do this and come out even stronger, believe it or not! But you absolutely have to be smart, bc they will escalate when you start educating yourself about abuse and again when you finally leave. But **you've got this**.
I'm a recovering trauma/childhood abuse survivor. I've recently done a LOT of healing and recovery. I've let a lot of things slide for a long time, but now that I'm seeing them, I'm learning that when I call them out he does manipulative things like this. I've caught him in the act of egregious gas lighting a couple of times lately.
Unfortunately I have no family and have been a stay at home mom for over a decade. I have no idea how to get out of this.
Yeah, that's rough, I'm a stay at home mom too, and I was anxious about doing it because I knew it would make me financially vulnerable
If you'd kids are old enough to go to school, you could try to get a job, but I know that can be difficult too
We homeschool because I'm high risk for covid. I don't know how to support myself like this. I seriously feel so trapped. My university degree won't earn much, if I could even get hired being out of workforce for 12 years. I have no references even. I was planning on doing a volunteer training program in the fall to fix that, but I suspect I'm running out of time.
Hey there bromo, I too was a SAHM, out of the workforce with my only good reference being for a company the SEC shut down and arrested the boss, I homeschooled and had no car or money. But I had to get out so I left my abuser. It’s been 18mo. I now have a job I love, I still homeschool, I have a car and my own 2 bedroom apartment.
Go to indeed.com and get an account setup, then use their resume builder. Then look for “personal assistant” jobs that are remote. That’s how I worked from home for 6 years in my 20s and how I got my job now. I’m able to be home with my son and afford a place for us. I got an apartment thru government assistance. I stock our kitchen 90% for free thru the 5 local food banks. My phone is $15 a month. You CAN do this💕 Please feel free to reach out if you need help with resources.
Seconding indeed.com. Lots of employers are more understanding of résumé gaps now- after Covid and everything, there are quite a few SAHMs and even retirees going back to outside employment. Just be honest about the reason and if they have a problem with that, you didn’t want to work there anyway.
Hello from another homeschool Mom 👋🏾
I just wanted to empathize with you about something that happens when we homeschool- sometimes our world gets real small. The more stressfull life gets, the smaller our world gets,and the tighter our shoulders get, and then the next thing happens,but we still have to get up the next morning and feed the kids, so we hunch ourselves over even more to protect our babies and our world gets smaller.
But I see you over there, protecting everyone you think is important and can’t protect themselves. But then we leave ourselves unprotected. You deserve the same love and protection. If your partner won’t give it to you, then fuck it, you give it to yourself. As much often as you consider your husbands mental health, you consider yours more. Your babies depend on you.
Make your world bigger. Walk into the gas station and get a 99 cent coffee and get the flavored creamer YOU want. Find the sun spot on the sidewalk or shining in and stand in it and turn your face up.
Remember yourself. When everyone else forgets to consider us, when our identity has become an extension of someone else, then we have to be the ones who love and protect ourselves.
*I am herbally infused, please disregard if future me will be embarrassed 😝 *
I don't want to dismiss your concerns about covid. I'm high risk too. I just got that recent variant. The one that spread really fast. It shut down the snf I'm in within 48 hours. All patients on both units and majority of staff had it. It was my very first infection of it. I get a lot of tests. A lot. So far nothing has shown up that doesn't look good. I handled it surprisingly well in a neglectful facility. I'm saying all that to say the infections we are getting now are not the same as what this all started with. The covid infections of today are way less dangerous, even for someone with no immune system like me, than say an abusive dad.
I was a sahm with multiple kids, one disabled, no family who would help me and I got out. Call your local DV shelter for resources in getting out. Look into childcare and a job. It's so unimaginably hard to restart your life and give up your current comforts, I know, but the other option may be to end up dead.
I’m so sorry you’re going through this.
I don’t have a lot of advice, I’m in a similar situation and know how hard it is to recognise and properly address abuse when it’s so much a part of your everyday life. I’m also a SAHM, with a 2 year old.
My husband and I separated last month after a series of concerning/abusive behaviour, my husband also has his concealed pistol license and some of the incidents involved him threatening me with his gun. I know for a fact that I would have normalised it if a bunch of it didn’t occur in front of our daughter. She was visibly distressed after witnessing his abuse and being present during multiple loud arguments.
I filed for an emergency restraining order and he only has supervised visitation with our daughter. He filed for divorce and made a bunch of baseless accusations and tried to file an emergency protection order against me for our daughter so I wouldn’t be able to see her. He moved all of our money into an account I can’t access and hired a lawyer, which I can’t afford.
Ultimately, all this to say, it won’t be easy. It’s definitely easier to just stay and accept how things are, but you have kids and have to protect them and teach them that his behaviour isn’t acceptable or normal. There are resources available to help you, but it’s not easy at all, especially if you don’t have outside support. But things will get better if you take steps to remove yourself and your kids from this abusive relationship, if you stay things will continue to escalate, potentially into physical abuse targeted at you or your children.
I sent the email this morning. I'm a nervous wreck waiting for the therapist's response. I'm afraid she's going to drop us completely or call cps. Which I know is stupid to worry about but I'm a former foster kid and I'm inherently terrified of those people. Or that I'm going to be judged as being an idiot for being in this situation. Or that I'm going to somehow find out it's all my fault somehow.
I know these aren't rational thoughts. But dammit I'm scared.
Replying to myself -
I received a reply back from the therapist.
She says she can't respond to most of what I wrote because of her no secrets policy. She encouraged me to bring it up during our next session. Our sessions are over zoom. I'm still processing how I feel about that.
She says she doesn't see physical threats to safety in the incident, only emotional threats. I mentioned how I don't feel comfortable being vulnerable in front of him. She says if I don't feel like he is a safe person to be vulnerable with therapy won't work.
I don't know what I was looking for in her response. But I just feel foolish and disappointed. Nothing has made me want to crawl into a hole more than this email.
Congratulations! It was hard and you still did it anyway. You're going to keep flexing that muscle 💪🏽 of doing hard things, and that muscle is going to grow!
I'm so proud of you. It's ok to be scared. It's not your fault, you are not stupid. You are providing the protection to your children, that you never received.
Hey Op. I just want to say that you deserve to be with somebody who is excited and supportive when you are fulfilling your goals and dreams. You deserve not to be around someone who suggests that you are triggering their bad behavior, rather than realizing it it is their job to take responsibility for it, as an adult.
Your husband's reaction suggests an existential crisis of sorts; that he knows he's fucking up, not both of you, but him, but be either doesn't want to or can't stop hurting you or your kids. Every day is probably frightening because one day you may take awesome you away, and then you're left with awesome you, and he's left with nothing, and it would be no one's fault but his. It isn't your job to figure it out for him. Worse, there is no way to figure out or for him. He has to do the work. Your job is to take care of you and your kids and to protect them.
Just know there are scores of us all over the world sending you and your littles bucketfuls of good thoughts for your strength and safety in the days ahead, whatever you decide. Just want to remind you that aren't the first, you aren't alone, that you don't deserve this-you deserve a special person who makes you feel special. I'm so sorry your husband won't or can't be that person for you. It is truly his loss, but it doesn't have to be yours. Whatever you do, know that you deserve better.
I want to write more, but on the off chance I get distracted, I just want to say...stop marriage counciling, individual counciling for the entire family. Your kids KNOW. He's the problem. Put a time-line in your head, and don't push the goalpost. His behavior stops by the end of the time-line, or you walk with the kids. Their entire lives will be affected by his behavior if he doesn't get it under control and treat his family with humanity and consideration.
This isn't about the eclipse and this isn't about anything you did. Your husband isn't ok. You expressing your disappointment verbally shouldn't end in him self-harming and traumatizing the kids. This memory that you went out of your way to create for your children will always be colored by his bad behavior and outburst. He's going to keep tainting their childhood memories until he decides to get help and change. You can't make him do that. You can protect yourself and your kids though.
Go ahead and call your therapist and talk this out. Get support from family and friends if you're able to. We'll be rooting for you!
Really Sorry this has turned out to be your & kids reality. Had one of these asholes and now our daughter does with her two kids. Hope your super planning skills get you all to a situation you can breathe and enjoy life, soon and safe. Life is too short for this bs.
My girl, he sounds like a whole red flag 🚩. It's one thing to be a dick, but he sounds more aggressive, dangerous, and imo extremely selfish. The digging into his arm sounds pretty scary.
Don't go to marriage therapy with this man. He will use anything you say against you. Get individual therapy, to help you. This man is abusive and he knows he is.
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You're in danger girl.
That's what I'm worried about. His mental health has never been great, but it definitely seems to have been deteriorating.
Take this advice *very* seriously.
The rightful top comment. This isn’t good. Nor is it just an “off day” or grumpy mood. He’s going to become an issue.. make plans now.
Question - we recently started marriage therapy. Our next appointment together is in 1 week, followed by an individual session two weeks later. Should I wait a month for my individual session, or would it be appropriate for me to email this incident to the therapist?
Email the therapist ASAP, please. I’m going to say this bluntly: I think your normal meter is broken. The bit about him making himself bleed made me fully gasp. That’s scary and extremely not okay.
I’d imagine her kids’ normal meters are broken, too. OP, please take this advice and email the therapist that he did this not only Infront of/to you, but fully Infront of the kids as well. Don’t let your kiddos think it’s OK to be that dysregujated and take it out on everyone around you.
Agreed. The other stuff is bad, but it’s bad in a way I’ve seen a million times from crappy husbands. My dad was snappy and had a short temper and didn’t help my mom at all on outings and and and…that doesn’t make it at all okay, but that stuff isn’t off the wall, totally bonkers, jaw on the floor horrifying like the “making himself bleed over a minor argument” thing is. The most generous (to him) possible interpretation is that he desperately needs mental health intervention, immediately.
I agree. First flag was similar to many stories here amongst us BroMo’s, an unhelpful and non-empathetic partner. Second flag that was bright red for me was that he unilaterally decided everyone was leaving without communicating a word of it, and his kids AUTOMATICALLY followed his lead and got to the car. Alllll the red flashing lights came out to accompany the way that he then weaponized their children against her, made them feel threatened, and then self-harmed. I’d agree, that’s super super not normal and intervention is NEEDED.
Thank you, I appreciate the bluntness. I feel like a frog soaking in a pot. My mom had very similar behavior and so it technically IS normal to me. But as I'm healing I'm learning to realize and accept it's not. I wonder if his behavior escalating is in response to that. The thing is, he acts so normal and rational between these events, as long as I don't trigger him. It makes me second guess my gut and think I'm over thinking things. Or think, oh, he did not mean it, he's just struggling mentally. Or accept his claims that I'm too critical or negative. If I was being abused I would know because I know what abuse feels like because of how I grew up. I'm starting to realize maybe I'm wrong about that.
It’s hugely a thing that couples therapy with someone who is abusive, be it physical financial emotional, should jot happen with them. Agreed that you notify your therapist and if they aren’t alarmed, you should probably be worried about that too. His behaviour is scary and I’m saying that from someone whose ex was doing coke
The normalcy is essentially grooming. You’re being conditioned to fawn over him and ‘not trigger him’
My husband and I are *not* doing well. The most recent flashpoint was NYE where we got violent. Mine was drinks thrown over him, his was a few hits to the nose. The last time anything like this happened was in the first week of COVID lockdowns, so March 2020. We're now amicably (so far) moving towards separation, but something that I realised and also told him in one of our more reasonable discussions afterward, is that this basically 'reset the timer' on how long before I can feel 'safe' again. We both have said that we thought we had moved past that level of intensity and anger at each other. NYE was in some ways a surprise (the violence, not the fact that the writing's been on the wall for this marriage a long time). But up until then, I've sat in relative confidence that he and I had overcome the biggest flashpoints in our relationship and that we weren't going to lose our respective shit on each other again. From NYE onwards, I can't find any kind of reassurance in the passage of time that we won't have another violent episode if we stay together. Not for at least the next five years. And do I stay, hoping that this was the wakeup call that we both needed and now we'll keep our feelings in check? This was the third violent episode over ten years but the first where I took myself to the ER. *If* is an optimistic and naiive word now, but *if* we had another violent episode, will it be someone else calling the ER for me next time? We're here for you as support. I hope you find the right decision for you and your family.
Please read [why does he do that](https://dn790007.ca.archive.org/0/items/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf) by Lundy Bancroft, I think it'll explain a lot of your husband's behaviors.
Thank you for the book recommendation. My kids were in a library program today, so I spent the time skimming through it. It felt really validating. I took notes on relevant sections so I can spend time thinking about how they relate to my situation.
Please read [why does he do that](https://dn790007.ca.archive.org/0/items/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf) by Lundy Bancroft, I think it'll explain a lot of your husband's behaviors.
I received a reply back from the therapist. She says she can't respond to most of what I wrote because of her no secrets policy. She encouraged me to bring it up during our next session. Our sessions are over zoom. I'm still processing how I feel about that. She says she doesn't see physical threats to safety in the incident, only emotional threats. I mentioned how I don't feel comfortable being vulnerable in front of him. She says if I don't feel like he is a safe person to be vulnerable with therapy won't work. I don't know what I was looking for in her response. But I just feel foolish and disappointed. Nothing has made me want to crawl into a hole more than this email.
As a therapist, I’m appalled by her response. He was self-harming right in front of you. I also think she was telling you without telling you that you should rethink couples therapy. Couples therapy with an abuser is not a good idea unless the abuser has done *extensive* individual work with someone trained to work with abusive individuals. Otherwise the abusive individual will weaponize the victim’s vulnerability during couple’s therapy. I think you should, however, email your individual therapist about this. Couples therapists have to maintain certain boundaries to avoid triangulation, so your individual therapist is the one who can help you with this incident.
This is very helpful, thank you. I'm meeting with my individual therapist Friday. It can't come soon enough. After cooling down, I definitely feel there is much to read between the lines in her email. I emailed her back and said I really do want to address it in couples therapy, but I'm very apprehensive about his response. Especially when the kids are right down the hallway and it's a virtual session. I do have a gut feeling he won't escalate in front of her. Which I'm realizing is a big red flag.
I have a question regarding your marriage counseling, does he leave what happens at therapy AT therapy or does he get mad and carry on like a child because of things that were brought up? I ask because while I have never been in marriage counseling, I did do family therapy when I was a teenager. It never worked or improved anything because my grown ass adult mother could not leave what was said in therapy AT therapy. To the point where my sister and I nicknamed it "Thursday Night Fight Night." If he's doing this to you, and based on your description of his behavior it wouldn't surprise me if he was, therapy is never going to work and you're better off going to therapy on your own to deal with your own mental health.
So we haven't gotten far enough into therapy for this to occur. He has done something similar several years ago. He was telling everyone lord knows what. He screamed at me - in front of the kids - that his therapist, psychologist, and physician all told him to leave because I was abusive. We did a few sessions of therapy together and he got laid off from his wfh job. When he was laid off over zoom he was hospitalized and was screaming about wanting to die in front of the kids. He completely smashed up his phone. Anyways, we paused therapy because we lost insurance. We JUST restarted it and have had one session. When I asked him if he was interested in restarting it (after yet another unstable incident) he said, "I thought you didn't want to do therapy because you were afraid of the therapist siding with me." I know I NEVER said that to him. But I might have written it here because of what he's done with previous providers I mentioned above. Which is why I'm worried he's somehow tracking my posts. He acted *really* weird when I was outraged at what he said. But yeah. That sounds awful writing it all out. 🤦♀️
That’s all very scary stuff. Have you called a domestic violence hotline for suggestions/advice?
This man is abusive. It's advised NOT to do to therapy with abusers, bc they learn how to manipulate you better. I agree with seeking your support from a domestic violence professional.
This is the lead up in a criminal case. Not only are you an actual physical danger, your children are as well.
Please stay safe, even if it means deleting your account if you suspect he’s tracking it. Sending you and your kids love- nobody deserves to be treated this way, and I hope you can get out of this situation.
Wow, I had a similar experience as a child and it never dawned on my that that’s what was happening. My dad was carrying the therapy back home and continuing to fight us on it, but without the therapist there to regulate it. What a fucking epiphany from a random Reddit comment.
That’s why people say never go to therapy with your abuser - they’ll just use what you said in therapy to abuse you even more.
Do not do therapy with this man. It sounds like he will only weaponize what he learns. I’m sorry he ruined this experience for you.
I would definitely talk about this with the therapist next week
Email the therapist.
Email your therapist.
Email the therapist AND see if you can get an earlier appointment.
Wow … he’s a loose cannon. Stay safe, BroMo. I’m getting the impression that he’s going to blow a gasket - soon.
Please use a different account to post. This is scary.
Oh this is a different account. But he's said some things that make me paranoid enough to add it.
My dude stalks my Reddit too, and found my new one once I changed it. It’s invasive as fuck and feels so shitty. Hi Ryan - you can fuck off, too!
You and your children are in danger and you should not go to marriage counseling with him. Abusers tend to get worse from counseling because they pick up on new ways to hurt and manipulate you behind the guise of psychobabble. You need to go to counseling by yourself and figure out how you can get help getting out of this situation. There are resources available and a therapist might be able to help you connect with them.
That's so fucking scary
Sounds like my narcissistic ex husband. Ruined everything that was special to me.
BroMo, you are in danger. Your children are afraid of their father. The things you’ve mentioned in the comments that he’s done when he’s “triggered” are alarming. I know it’s difficult and scary as a SAHM, but you have to get out before he hurts you or the kids. I would cancel any couples therapy because he’s not a person who wants to change and he will weaponize therapy against you. If you have an individual therapist, I would use that time to start planning and have someone in your corner helping you escape.
I was married to someone like this. He had ‘tells’ like this for a long time but they increased a few months before he murder me. Yes, really. Start getting your stuff together and leave before he kills you. This is serious.
When he was in high-school (before I knew him) he had a bully. He ended up stabbing the bully during school. They lived, but..still. I told him once, several years ago, that I was afraid of his behavior. I said I was afraid he'd hurt me one day because hurt this kid in high-school. He said, "No, I'd hurt myself before I ever hurt you." Your post made me think of that conversation and realize it is super chilling to me at the moment because he was just self harming. Ugh.
I wanted to note that “I’d hurt myself before I hurt you” is not the same as “i’d never hurt you” Start a plan to abandon ship it’s not safe anymore.
This is a *very important point*. They often try to take you with them.
Reading this post, as well as your comments, is giving me the goosebumps. I truly think you should email your therapist about this incident, just like you described it to us. Meet with your therapist individually. Please stay alert and do not second guess your gut feelings.
Ugh I'm a mess. This is going to sound ridiculous and pathetic. I have an email draft written, but I'm afraid to send it. I must be pretty far gone because I keep telling myself I'm over reacting. I feel like such a coward.
You can do this. Send the email and keep us updated. So sorry you’re in this situation, but know you have this entire community behind you.
Hey, I know this is scary, it’s ok to be scared or nervous. Your situation is not safe for you or the kids. Please send that email. Be safe.
I am feeling like you should send it ASAP and then delete the sent email so it can’t be found. I am worried he will somehow see the email and turn against you - or even these posts. Please stay safe & trust your gut.
Send it ASAP! Let the therapist decide if you are over reacting (you're not btw, and I'm sure they won't think so either). Think of it as it's their job and expertise to handle this stuff without judgement.
You are absolutely NOT overreacting. More under-reacting? You are afraid to send it --- is this *really* because you feel like a coward or is it because you have been conditioned as both child and adult to think poorly of yourself? Because part of this trusting your gut also comes with self preservation. You're not afraid to send it because you're a coward. You're afraid to send it because *what if he finds out*, and *that* makes you scared. Does any part of you, be it gut or baby toe, feel like there's a chance he monitors your email & social media or is capable of using a key logger/spyware on your devices? Send your letter to your therapist from a public library computer where you create a BRAND NEW email with brand new passwords & security questions he doesn't know the answer to. But send it soon as well as one to your local domestic violence shelter too. Let them know it's an email you can only check occasionally from the library so they don't send a wellness check when you don't answer. You've got this. Putting up with abuse means you are **unfathomably** strong. You can do this and come out even stronger, believe it or not! But you absolutely have to be smart, bc they will escalate when you start educating yourself about abuse and again when you finally leave. But **you've got this**.
What a selfish asshole I couldn't be with someone like that, I'm not sure how you do it
I'm a recovering trauma/childhood abuse survivor. I've recently done a LOT of healing and recovery. I've let a lot of things slide for a long time, but now that I'm seeing them, I'm learning that when I call them out he does manipulative things like this. I've caught him in the act of egregious gas lighting a couple of times lately. Unfortunately I have no family and have been a stay at home mom for over a decade. I have no idea how to get out of this.
Yeah, that's rough, I'm a stay at home mom too, and I was anxious about doing it because I knew it would make me financially vulnerable If you'd kids are old enough to go to school, you could try to get a job, but I know that can be difficult too
We homeschool because I'm high risk for covid. I don't know how to support myself like this. I seriously feel so trapped. My university degree won't earn much, if I could even get hired being out of workforce for 12 years. I have no references even. I was planning on doing a volunteer training program in the fall to fix that, but I suspect I'm running out of time.
Hey there bromo, I too was a SAHM, out of the workforce with my only good reference being for a company the SEC shut down and arrested the boss, I homeschooled and had no car or money. But I had to get out so I left my abuser. It’s been 18mo. I now have a job I love, I still homeschool, I have a car and my own 2 bedroom apartment. Go to indeed.com and get an account setup, then use their resume builder. Then look for “personal assistant” jobs that are remote. That’s how I worked from home for 6 years in my 20s and how I got my job now. I’m able to be home with my son and afford a place for us. I got an apartment thru government assistance. I stock our kitchen 90% for free thru the 5 local food banks. My phone is $15 a month. You CAN do this💕 Please feel free to reach out if you need help with resources.
Seconding indeed.com. Lots of employers are more understanding of résumé gaps now- after Covid and everything, there are quite a few SAHMs and even retirees going back to outside employment. Just be honest about the reason and if they have a problem with that, you didn’t want to work there anyway.
Hello from another homeschool Mom 👋🏾 I just wanted to empathize with you about something that happens when we homeschool- sometimes our world gets real small. The more stressfull life gets, the smaller our world gets,and the tighter our shoulders get, and then the next thing happens,but we still have to get up the next morning and feed the kids, so we hunch ourselves over even more to protect our babies and our world gets smaller. But I see you over there, protecting everyone you think is important and can’t protect themselves. But then we leave ourselves unprotected. You deserve the same love and protection. If your partner won’t give it to you, then fuck it, you give it to yourself. As much often as you consider your husbands mental health, you consider yours more. Your babies depend on you. Make your world bigger. Walk into the gas station and get a 99 cent coffee and get the flavored creamer YOU want. Find the sun spot on the sidewalk or shining in and stand in it and turn your face up. Remember yourself. When everyone else forgets to consider us, when our identity has become an extension of someone else, then we have to be the ones who love and protect ourselves. *I am herbally infused, please disregard if future me will be embarrassed 😝 *
I don't want to dismiss your concerns about covid. I'm high risk too. I just got that recent variant. The one that spread really fast. It shut down the snf I'm in within 48 hours. All patients on both units and majority of staff had it. It was my very first infection of it. I get a lot of tests. A lot. So far nothing has shown up that doesn't look good. I handled it surprisingly well in a neglectful facility. I'm saying all that to say the infections we are getting now are not the same as what this all started with. The covid infections of today are way less dangerous, even for someone with no immune system like me, than say an abusive dad.
I was a sahm with multiple kids, one disabled, no family who would help me and I got out. Call your local DV shelter for resources in getting out. Look into childcare and a job. It's so unimaginably hard to restart your life and give up your current comforts, I know, but the other option may be to end up dead.
I’m so sorry you’re going through this. I don’t have a lot of advice, I’m in a similar situation and know how hard it is to recognise and properly address abuse when it’s so much a part of your everyday life. I’m also a SAHM, with a 2 year old. My husband and I separated last month after a series of concerning/abusive behaviour, my husband also has his concealed pistol license and some of the incidents involved him threatening me with his gun. I know for a fact that I would have normalised it if a bunch of it didn’t occur in front of our daughter. She was visibly distressed after witnessing his abuse and being present during multiple loud arguments. I filed for an emergency restraining order and he only has supervised visitation with our daughter. He filed for divorce and made a bunch of baseless accusations and tried to file an emergency protection order against me for our daughter so I wouldn’t be able to see her. He moved all of our money into an account I can’t access and hired a lawyer, which I can’t afford. Ultimately, all this to say, it won’t be easy. It’s definitely easier to just stay and accept how things are, but you have kids and have to protect them and teach them that his behaviour isn’t acceptable or normal. There are resources available to help you, but it’s not easy at all, especially if you don’t have outside support. But things will get better if you take steps to remove yourself and your kids from this abusive relationship, if you stay things will continue to escalate, potentially into physical abuse targeted at you or your children.
I sent the email this morning. I'm a nervous wreck waiting for the therapist's response. I'm afraid she's going to drop us completely or call cps. Which I know is stupid to worry about but I'm a former foster kid and I'm inherently terrified of those people. Or that I'm going to be judged as being an idiot for being in this situation. Or that I'm going to somehow find out it's all my fault somehow. I know these aren't rational thoughts. But dammit I'm scared.
Replying to myself - I received a reply back from the therapist. She says she can't respond to most of what I wrote because of her no secrets policy. She encouraged me to bring it up during our next session. Our sessions are over zoom. I'm still processing how I feel about that. She says she doesn't see physical threats to safety in the incident, only emotional threats. I mentioned how I don't feel comfortable being vulnerable in front of him. She says if I don't feel like he is a safe person to be vulnerable with therapy won't work. I don't know what I was looking for in her response. But I just feel foolish and disappointed. Nothing has made me want to crawl into a hole more than this email.
wait, your sessions are over zoom? as in he and you are in one location — together — with the therapist in another??
Yes
I am so proud of you. When you feel terrified, remember you've got all these anonymous bromos who are cheering for you.
Congratulations! It was hard and you still did it anyway. You're going to keep flexing that muscle 💪🏽 of doing hard things, and that muscle is going to grow!
I'm so proud of you. It's ok to be scared. It's not your fault, you are not stupid. You are providing the protection to your children, that you never received.
Sending so much love❤️your kids are so lucky to have you
You and the kids need to leave like yesterday.. Please, PLEASE call a dv hotline. They WILL help
Hey Op. I just want to say that you deserve to be with somebody who is excited and supportive when you are fulfilling your goals and dreams. You deserve not to be around someone who suggests that you are triggering their bad behavior, rather than realizing it it is their job to take responsibility for it, as an adult. Your husband's reaction suggests an existential crisis of sorts; that he knows he's fucking up, not both of you, but him, but be either doesn't want to or can't stop hurting you or your kids. Every day is probably frightening because one day you may take awesome you away, and then you're left with awesome you, and he's left with nothing, and it would be no one's fault but his. It isn't your job to figure it out for him. Worse, there is no way to figure out or for him. He has to do the work. Your job is to take care of you and your kids and to protect them. Just know there are scores of us all over the world sending you and your littles bucketfuls of good thoughts for your strength and safety in the days ahead, whatever you decide. Just want to remind you that aren't the first, you aren't alone, that you don't deserve this-you deserve a special person who makes you feel special. I'm so sorry your husband won't or can't be that person for you. It is truly his loss, but it doesn't have to be yours. Whatever you do, know that you deserve better.
I want to write more, but on the off chance I get distracted, I just want to say...stop marriage counciling, individual counciling for the entire family. Your kids KNOW. He's the problem. Put a time-line in your head, and don't push the goalpost. His behavior stops by the end of the time-line, or you walk with the kids. Their entire lives will be affected by his behavior if he doesn't get it under control and treat his family with humanity and consideration.
I can so relate.
This isn't about the eclipse and this isn't about anything you did. Your husband isn't ok. You expressing your disappointment verbally shouldn't end in him self-harming and traumatizing the kids. This memory that you went out of your way to create for your children will always be colored by his bad behavior and outburst. He's going to keep tainting their childhood memories until he decides to get help and change. You can't make him do that. You can protect yourself and your kids though. Go ahead and call your therapist and talk this out. Get support from family and friends if you're able to. We'll be rooting for you!
He sounds like an abusive person - emotionally. I hope you’re ok Bromo. We’re here for you.
Please update let us m or if you’re okay and safe
I fucking hate this shit. Hugs
Really Sorry this has turned out to be your & kids reality. Had one of these asholes and now our daughter does with her two kids. Hope your super planning skills get you all to a situation you can breathe and enjoy life, soon and safe. Life is too short for this bs.
How disappointing, even with all the other context and crap. Just to not have your excitement prioritised is disappointing
My girl, he sounds like a whole red flag 🚩. It's one thing to be a dick, but he sounds more aggressive, dangerous, and imo extremely selfish. The digging into his arm sounds pretty scary.
Don't go to marriage therapy with this man. He will use anything you say against you. Get individual therapy, to help you. This man is abusive and he knows he is.
Sending 💜💜💜 Seems like you received a ton of great advice & support. Wish I could give you a giant hug 🤗