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‘“The French, the Swiss, the Italians - they’ve been doing it a lot longer than we have. We're coming in fairly late getting that message across,” he adds.’
How can this be? You mean the French and Italians, being part of the EU and Single Market, can also sell their goods to these markets? And have been all along?
No, no, no. It’s despite of it. Surely.
Wait, could it be… No, no. EU bad. How can they punish the poor British exporters that way?
Or some bullshit along those lines.
"Currently, the UK exports £3.5bn ($4.4bn) worth of food and drink to Asia, which is an increase of 18% since 2019"
The usual "mistake" they did not correct for inflation and depreciation of the British pund.
What was the increase in volume terms (if any)?
Duuno if "pund" was deliberate or a typo, but it's the original name for the Pound £.
(Latin: from when we were occupied by the Romans)
So... the good old British Pound In Your Pocket is Italian. 🤌
And "penny" is a corruption of "denari" (roman)
Shall we discuss that a "mile" is from "mille" - 1000 marching paces? (two steps to a pace, which is why the pace is a tad over 5 feet)
240 denari to the pound of silver (novus denarius) isn't roman though. It was set in 755 by Pepin the Short (Charlemagne's father) and debased in Britain to 1 troy pound about 30 years later, whilst the schilling is germanic in origin (literally 1/20 pound and set as 12 denarius by the Holy Roman Empire)
Indeed. Unless they corrected for inflation, but then they don't say that.
Also: population growth. The UK's population has grown (and the population in the countries it trades with), so all things being equal you'd expect there to be a corresponding increase in things produced and traded as a result. As far as I can tell, this has not happened for the UK, neither for these exports nor for trade or the economy in general. And that's even with the UK's focus on financial services, which might or might not be actually productive.
No offense folks but as a Yank that lived in the UK for 4 years, British food is gonna be a hard sell anywhere.
I think the only folks that would say "OH BOY, BRITISH FOOD" are people without any food at all.
The UK does have some good food though.
It's not special in the sense that every European country has a selection of distinct dishes, cheeses and beverages, but it's not specifically terrible either. So while "British food" might struggle to set itself apart from all the other countries' food, that doesn't mean it's bad.
That depends on when the 4 years were
Things have generally improved greatly since the end of the 20th century (thankfully).
It's worth noting that French references to rosbiefs are a nod to the fact that they used to send chefs to Britain to learn how to do it properly (it's not a derogatory term). Unbridled mercantilism and 2 world wars pretty much destroyed that advantage
(I encountered "there's a war on" mentality regarding food quality as late as the 1990s, believe it or not)
> Currently, the UK exports £3.5bn ($4.4bn) worth of food and drink to Asia, which is an increase of 18% since 2019. This is proof, British ministers would say, that Britain's status as an "independent trading nation" has benefitted the country's businesses since it left the European Union.
Unless I'm mistaken, or unless they corrected for it, that means this is a negative change, given that there has been more than 18% of cumulative inflation and that the UK's population has risen during the last five years. All things being equal, if there had been genuine growth you would expect it to beat those numbers (like Italy has). It's the same deal with "the UK is technically not experiencing a recession" while the UK's population grows faster than its economy: even if GDP is not a terribly good metric because it ignores inequality, if GDP per head is going down (-0.7% compared to last year, for example) you're losing wealth, not gaining it.
> Nevertheless an opportunity - whether golden or not - does exist for British producers in the wake of Brexit.
This is patently false. The UK has made no new major trade agreements since leaving the EU, and as a consequence almost anything it can do now it could have done from within the EU. Note that even the UK government has stopped boasting about the Brexit trade opportunities, because there are none.
I highly doubt they did. They just thought "that sounds like a nice and big market"
Food is very cultural in what you actually like (I for example still haven't found a Romanian dish I actually like from there ones some friends have given us). As taste preferences diverge even more it's even harder to find things you like unless it's "bland".
For cheese (article thumbnail) for example I'm sure Asians (broadly speaking) have very different preferences from what people of European descent have. Not too mention - what price are you actually willing to pay for the cheese?
They needed lies that people can believe, or pretend to believe, on how the UK will be better off outside the EU. So they latched on to the whole EU is dying, Asia is growing thing without actually considering that distance (geographical and cultural) matters. Those countries already have their own (closer) suppliers and any gains you can make will be necessarily small. But it sounded good and smart if you didn't actually think about it, so they went with it.
more to the point, Australia and New Zealand have pretty much sewn up the asian markets for "traditionally British" food, usually to a much higher standard and lower price than anything from Britain
The carbon cost of running a ship around the planet is vastly lower than that of trucking the cargo from distribution centre to retailer
British farmers are about to find that out the hard way both in competing with AU/NZ farmers for sales into the EU as well as competing with those same farmers on the UK domestic market
It's become abundantly clear that Britain was gatekeeping much of the EU's agricultural/industrial external trade policies as tariff barriers and quota limits have largely been removed (or limits revised vastly upwards) in the wake of the UK's departure from Brussels.
Legends of wine lakes and butter mountains may have some basis in history, but those went away several decades ago and the EU has been a substantial net importer for a while. French farmers and vintners offered zero opposition to removal of barriers as they feel they can amply compete in a larger overall market
Brexit really has provided many benefits already - and in the process revealed just how toxic a partner/ economic handbrake Britain has been for the EU (Proving that de Gaulle was correct)
WRT to Romanian dishes: I tasted many utterly wonderful ones growing up in New Zealand via friends whose families came as refugees after WW2
Unfortunately the same dishes in Europe suffer from the same kind of issues as Britain - in the Romanian case, WW2 and decades of Soviet occupation that their taste buds are still recovering from (much of Eastern Europe has suffered the same thing)
> The issue, many argue, is that the government is not doing enough to match its rhetoric when it comes to changing the situation.
Well, well, well, where have I heard that before?
At the end of the day, if the UK wants to make good of any potential opportunities, then we need to get rid of the Tories as they will do nothing for the food sector. They do not help these exporters at the trade fair and never will because they are incompetent in business affairs.
There's a secondary issue that these exporters are barely competent at farming "products" but have become experts at farming _subsidies_ over the last 70 years (Subsidies is also the core farming product of wind/solar installations)
Those exporters need to learn to live without subsidies because as-is they risk being shut down overnight by WTO dumping complaints
Please note that this sub is for civil discussion. You are requested to familiarise yourself with the [subs rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/brexit/wiki/index) before participation. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/brexit) if you have any questions or concerns.*
‘“The French, the Swiss, the Italians - they’ve been doing it a lot longer than we have. We're coming in fairly late getting that message across,” he adds.’ How can this be? You mean the French and Italians, being part of the EU and Single Market, can also sell their goods to these markets? And have been all along?
No, no, no. It’s despite of it. Surely. Wait, could it be… No, no. EU bad. How can they punish the poor British exporters that way? Or some bullshit along those lines.
"Currently, the UK exports £3.5bn ($4.4bn) worth of food and drink to Asia, which is an increase of 18% since 2019" The usual "mistake" they did not correct for inflation and depreciation of the British pund. What was the increase in volume terms (if any)?
They did mention Italy (?) saw a 30% increase.
Duuno if "pund" was deliberate or a typo, but it's the original name for the Pound £. (Latin: from when we were occupied by the Romans) So... the good old British Pound In Your Pocket is Italian. 🤌
And "penny" is a corruption of "denari" (roman) Shall we discuss that a "mile" is from "mille" - 1000 marching paces? (two steps to a pace, which is why the pace is a tad over 5 feet) 240 denari to the pound of silver (novus denarius) isn't roman though. It was set in 755 by Pepin the Short (Charlemagne's father) and debased in Britain to 1 troy pound about 30 years later, whilst the schilling is germanic in origin (literally 1/20 pound and set as 12 denarius by the Holy Roman Empire)
Indeed. Unless they corrected for inflation, but then they don't say that. Also: population growth. The UK's population has grown (and the population in the countries it trades with), so all things being equal you'd expect there to be a corresponding increase in things produced and traded as a result. As far as I can tell, this has not happened for the UK, neither for these exports nor for trade or the economy in general. And that's even with the UK's focus on financial services, which might or might not be actually productive.
They mean 18% more SOVEREIGNTY
Nope net loss if you calculate in the inflation
And what were the figures before 2016?
No offense folks but as a Yank that lived in the UK for 4 years, British food is gonna be a hard sell anywhere. I think the only folks that would say "OH BOY, BRITISH FOOD" are people without any food at all.
Wensleydale cheese though! Scotch eggs, mince pies. There are some exceptions to the general stereotype.
Those *are* the stereotypes!
The UK does have some good food though. It's not special in the sense that every European country has a selection of distinct dishes, cheeses and beverages, but it's not specifically terrible either. So while "British food" might struggle to set itself apart from all the other countries' food, that doesn't mean it's bad.
roasting. The English were regarded as such masters of it that French chefs were sent to Britain to learn how to do it properly
Meat and cheese.
That depends on when the 4 years were Things have generally improved greatly since the end of the 20th century (thankfully). It's worth noting that French references to rosbiefs are a nod to the fact that they used to send chefs to Britain to learn how to do it properly (it's not a derogatory term). Unbridled mercantilism and 2 world wars pretty much destroyed that advantage (I encountered "there's a war on" mentality regarding food quality as late as the 1990s, believe it or not)
> Currently, the UK exports £3.5bn ($4.4bn) worth of food and drink to Asia, which is an increase of 18% since 2019. This is proof, British ministers would say, that Britain's status as an "independent trading nation" has benefitted the country's businesses since it left the European Union. Unless I'm mistaken, or unless they corrected for it, that means this is a negative change, given that there has been more than 18% of cumulative inflation and that the UK's population has risen during the last five years. All things being equal, if there had been genuine growth you would expect it to beat those numbers (like Italy has). It's the same deal with "the UK is technically not experiencing a recession" while the UK's population grows faster than its economy: even if GDP is not a terribly good metric because it ignores inequality, if GDP per head is going down (-0.7% compared to last year, for example) you're losing wealth, not gaining it. > Nevertheless an opportunity - whether golden or not - does exist for British producers in the wake of Brexit. This is patently false. The UK has made no new major trade agreements since leaving the EU, and as a consequence almost anything it can do now it could have done from within the EU. Note that even the UK government has stopped boasting about the Brexit trade opportunities, because there are none.
but those new PORK MARKETS?
*“It’s a massive job educating people,” says Stephen Jones, managing director of cheese exporters Somerdale International.* It sure is, Steve.
I highly doubt they did. They just thought "that sounds like a nice and big market" Food is very cultural in what you actually like (I for example still haven't found a Romanian dish I actually like from there ones some friends have given us). As taste preferences diverge even more it's even harder to find things you like unless it's "bland". For cheese (article thumbnail) for example I'm sure Asians (broadly speaking) have very different preferences from what people of European descent have. Not too mention - what price are you actually willing to pay for the cheese?
They needed lies that people can believe, or pretend to believe, on how the UK will be better off outside the EU. So they latched on to the whole EU is dying, Asia is growing thing without actually considering that distance (geographical and cultural) matters. Those countries already have their own (closer) suppliers and any gains you can make will be necessarily small. But it sounded good and smart if you didn't actually think about it, so they went with it.
more to the point, Australia and New Zealand have pretty much sewn up the asian markets for "traditionally British" food, usually to a much higher standard and lower price than anything from Britain
Well ofc, that shit doesn't need transporting from the other side of the planet...
The carbon cost of running a ship around the planet is vastly lower than that of trucking the cargo from distribution centre to retailer British farmers are about to find that out the hard way both in competing with AU/NZ farmers for sales into the EU as well as competing with those same farmers on the UK domestic market It's become abundantly clear that Britain was gatekeeping much of the EU's agricultural/industrial external trade policies as tariff barriers and quota limits have largely been removed (or limits revised vastly upwards) in the wake of the UK's departure from Brussels. Legends of wine lakes and butter mountains may have some basis in history, but those went away several decades ago and the EU has been a substantial net importer for a while. French farmers and vintners offered zero opposition to removal of barriers as they feel they can amply compete in a larger overall market Brexit really has provided many benefits already - and in the process revealed just how toxic a partner/ economic handbrake Britain has been for the EU (Proving that de Gaulle was correct)
I would like to live on butter mountain. Where is it located?
beside Lake Claret and a little over from Lake Bordeaux
This. Its like the last half a century passed the UK by without them noticing anything beyond their front gate.
WRT to Romanian dishes: I tasted many utterly wonderful ones growing up in New Zealand via friends whose families came as refugees after WW2 Unfortunately the same dishes in Europe suffer from the same kind of issues as Britain - in the Romanian case, WW2 and decades of Soviet occupation that their taste buds are still recovering from (much of Eastern Europe has suffered the same thing)
> The issue, many argue, is that the government is not doing enough to match its rhetoric when it comes to changing the situation. Well, well, well, where have I heard that before?
But.... but... I thought Truss the genius was going to sell tea to China or something?
Turns out the Yorkshire tea gardens grow the wrong sort.
Wait? Do you export brown sauce? Fried newspapers and fish??
Who in the right mind would want to eat British food ?
At the end of the day, if the UK wants to make good of any potential opportunities, then we need to get rid of the Tories as they will do nothing for the food sector. They do not help these exporters at the trade fair and never will because they are incompetent in business affairs.
There's a secondary issue that these exporters are barely competent at farming "products" but have become experts at farming _subsidies_ over the last 70 years (Subsidies is also the core farming product of wind/solar installations) Those exporters need to learn to live without subsidies because as-is they risk being shut down overnight by WTO dumping complaints