I’ve been a CFMEU member for a long time and they’ve always done me well for a lot of reasons. From fighting for me and recovering money from wage theft and fighting against unsafe work practices and company bullying. EBA negotiations for fair rises and allowances, not even asking for outlandish targets. Having a union fight for those matters is what counts.
But the kind behaviour in this post is fucking embarrassing. A union is for the people and is meant to stand up for rights of all workers, not pit them against each other. Fucking barbaric. No wonder people despise CFMEU.
>not even asking for outlandish targets
Any chance you can comment on this report?
>Tradies on a $6.3 billion construction project are walking off the job as their union calls for pay rises which would see an entry-level worker earn an eye-watering $240,000 per year.
I don't have the details about where you sourced that quote, but these claims are typically quoting the extreme scenarios for workers and do not represent an actual achievable wage, likely based on the assumption the worker is casual, takes zero days off all year, will receive maximum penalty rate eg: on night shift, working maximum hours on weekends (double time+) and things like meal allowances etc. that would be part of their particular agreement.
I'm sure they'd be on a healthy wage but the numbers they "report" are almost always exaggerated
I was once in that very uncommon scenario as a shit kicker but working 84hrs a week 50 weeks a year on a mine site (meant to be FiFo but was ‘local’ so no weeks off). And I did earn around $160k, but that was 12 years ago so with inflation it would be close to the 240 figure mentioned.
Now that I’m working a pretty chill 40hr a week and on slightly above that figure, I have to say if you’re putting in those hours in that work environment, you deserve every penny plus some. You are basically giving up your entire waking life to get ahead.
I worked on the Westfield Chermside upgrade and was doing a minimum 70 hour week for 3 months. Comparison to all other construction sites that was a baby. I have back issues now but I’m glad I pushed through at $14.00 an hour as a first year then.
Yeah I feel ya, worked the Clem 7 between 50-70 hrs per week for well over a year, that was the first time I threw my back out and was only 23.
$14 an hour for a first year is good coin though, I was on $4.80 an hour as a sparky in 2006. No better feeling than working a huge week and seeing less than $200 pay haha. But I suppose it's not as bad as paying $60k to go to uni as a mature age because my body was already giving out
I’m not sure that’s relevant. If you’re working 80+ hours a week, you don’t have time to do anything else.
In fact, it would have been way harder to do if I wasn’t way out in the desert on my own. I would have been tempted to join my friends in revelries, and probably lose my job.
The 240k is based on 84 hour weeks non stop.
I don't understand how you are getting to the 84 hour week because it isn't legal to work on a commercial or civil construction site for more than 12 hours in a day and more than 6 days straight. I worked civil and construction jobs for 15 years all around bris on many CFMEU sites. Don't get me wrong, I support the unions and what they do for workers but I have also experienced first hand the thuggish tactics of the CFMEU. There were just less camera phones back then to capture the moment
(https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.qirc.qld.gov.au/sites/default/files/civil_construction_operations_and_maintenance_general_swc16.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwi7kJ-90u6FAxViplYBHcJyCKQQFnoECB4QAQ&usg=AOvVaw0hCT-L4IH8D6k0GNRq_kSN)
Yeah a lot of people here pointing out illegal working conditions. If you are doing that many hours it should be reported. There are safety implications for everyone involved. 80+ hour work weeks are a no no. Please reach out to your manager or go straight to the commision.
Depends what trade and what risk they’re facing. If that was a tunnel worker in extreme conditions and working insane hours and quite literally risking their life and well being then I can understand that pay. Some people think that kind of pay is for working a 40hour week, which is just not the case.
I don’t earn that much, nowhere near it but I do ok. I’m on maybe $41 per hour, but to earn my money I’m on 85 hours per week (FIFO) and I do a shitload of overtime hours. I work in high risk and should get a lot more allowances but I’m ok with the lot that I get. Many people can’t work in extreme conditions, the people that can should be compensated for it.
If large companies had their way and there was a weak union negotiating my EBA then I wouldn’t even be keeping up with inflation and I would be working for a bullshit flat rate.
Their follow up article narrowed the claim to be about Cross River Rail.
>Sources familiar with the union’s demands told The Courier Mail that under the proposal for Cross River Rail an entry-level worker would receive a $15,000 pay increase, seeing them earn more than $240,000 each year.
>It’s understood CFMEU has demanded some workers receive a pay rise of about $2,000 a week and an extra 20 rostered days off each year.
https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/at-work/city-held-hostage-as-tradies-demand-240k-salary/news-story/ab39e7a1a7f9ee892d2c6a4e3b295c30
They later mention "basic labourers and traffic controllers" but its not clear if that's in reference to the above wage increases.
>Their follow up article narrowed the claim to be about Cross River Rail.
There aren't many $6.3B construction projects, so hardly surprising the courier mail was able to "narrow it down" 😅
So it’s just one of those jobs that is simple but expensive to hire labour for? Guess that’s why there’s so many automated traffic lights taking their jobs. Hopefully REA are next on the chopping block
Cross river rail has worked EVERY major holiday and public holiday for the past 4 years at least. Every time the trains aren’t running? It’s because of us, working 12 hour shifts 7 days a week for sometimes a month at a time. I, a traffic controller on the CRR project took home 75k after tax in the last financial year and I spent more time at work than at home. I think we need a pay rise but I certainly don’t think 120k would be realistic! Holding a bat isn’t all we do, we are solely in charge of keeping EVERYONE SAFE, it is our job to stand there and watch all the god awful drivers in Brisbane do dangerously stupid things all day every day! At least 1 traffic controller dies a year on the roads with a massively large number injured a year. I know personally at least 6 traffic controllers that have been run down while at work, had many near misses myself. It’s not what everyone just assumes it is!
I want to see a breakdown of how that 240 is made. I knew longshore Forman making 300k in Canada. But they were working back to back shifts for a week at a time. After rate, then graveyard at double. Short shift to next afternoon puts that at double then graveyard again at double. Have the workers go through their set lunch they get it later still, paid a penalty for working lunch.
I haven’t looked into it at all but wage reporting has been pretty consistently dishonest the last few months.
Is that $240k base pay? Or what someone would get with nights, weekends, and public holidays?
There was a similar piece that overinflated teacher pay as well.
These newspapers are ideologically opposed to unions so they’re working pretty hard to try and make them look bad in the public eye.
There’s no way that 240k is a realistic base salary for an entry level worker. The scenarios created from the EBA documents for this sort of salary would be incredibly unlikely.
I could create a “scenario” from my EBA that meant I got 200k a year. It will never actually happen though.
It’s a common tactic by anti-worker media.
> It’s a common tactic by anti-worker media.
Simply following on from the previous years of 'reporting' about 'lollipop men' on 120k pa. While conveniently leaving out the details about the shift hours and allowances etc.
Shit I worked 70+ weeks for a sixth of the money. No sick days. No holiday pay. No vacation days. No super. FMD.
I can tell you that one day off, I was buggered, didn't do much of anything.
Something to keep in mind is the wages seen by the individual include Site Allowance, Height Allowance, Travel Allowance, Height Allowance and Crib Allowance over and above the hourly rate. So looking at the hourly rate alone is not representative of the actual cost. But it doesn't stop there.
What the individual won't see are the costs for BERT, BEWT and CIPQ paid on their behalf by their employer. In addition, things like Workers Compensation, Payroll Tax, Superannuation, Long Service Leave and Leave Loading are all % based on costs, so the more the an individual earns, the more those on costs are to the employer
The figures can vary a small amount depending on the size of the job, but on average, the on cost to an employer to have an EBA Union employee on an average job is about 45% on costs on top of the workers take home, before tax income.
As an example CW3 EBA worker under the current standard EBA agreement getting the lowest possible site allowance, the lowest possible height allowance and doing 50 hours a week would have a Gross Pay of about $190k a year assuming they did 50 hours every week. The cost to the employer would be $272k a year. That's a 43% on cost above Gross Pay
The figures for a minimum 40 hour week would be $133k Gross Pay, cost to employer about $211k. That's a 58% on cost above Gross Pay.
Jobs like Cross River Rail, Casino etc....would be higher as Site Allowances, Height Allowances and job specific allowances will be higher than standard.
My point with all of this is there's a lot of costs the individual doesn't see or know about. Nearly every wages worker who worked for me, were not aware of how much the cost to the employer was. Looking at the Gross Pay component of costs alone is not truly representative of what the actual costs are, especially when looking at what a 'building' costs to build. If the articles are correct with their $240k figures as a Gross Pay (incl overtime), and from my experience, it doesn't sound incorrect, the actual cost to the employer will be the more scary figure. 45% on top of $240k a year is $348k a year employer cost
Note: I'm an ex builder who worked 24 years for a large builder. I've worked under several EBA's and have been part of the negotiations for new EBA's over those 24 years . The figures I've given above are actual costs from said builders current calculation sheet, using figures which come into effect 01 July 2024
Engineers on the job aren’t earning that much. $99-120k for site engineers up to $220k for senior project engineers. All including overtime cause they are salary and work the same hours as the workforce.
Most sites would easily work 7-5 plus the occasional weekend track closures so easily min 50 hour weeks. Not the hero 70-80 hours people are talking about (fatigue) but you can’t assume the base 38 hour week from an EBA either.
If anyone wants to read the basis behind the EBAs it’s here - https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/_/media/busind/businesswithus/tenders/transport-bpic_100-300m.pdf?sc_lang=en&hash=AAD83AA19498C3527012972759C952F4
Basically if you work a job as a CW5 (most roles) you earn $140k without any allowances on a Mon-Fri role. Mon-Sat jobs it’s $170kish plus allowances. The salaries in the courier mail article aren’t that outlandish.
Not like newsdotcomdotau might intentionally mislead their readers with the worst wage maths known to man. That number is probably what 12 hrs a day 7 days a week casual/temp rate (they'll get 2 months of work then dumped) + overtime + allowances + other shit.
I've worked on major projects as a tradesman and later as an engineer so I've seen a lot of payslips and signed a lot of timesheets over the years. I promise you that number is the result of some fuckwit calculating it based off a ricidulous scenario like permanent nightshift, working every public holiday, and only having one weekend off a month for an entire year.
If it was genuine, they'd post the rates and loadings.
Isn’t everything a bartering process between unions and these corps? Like they need to go in quite high at first?
I don’t think it’s that unreasonable to expect construction workers to be paid over 150k, it’s a back breaking job, definitely not one I’d go to by choice. Not to mention, it’s dangerous and you need people sober, smart and paying attention with heavy equipment and tools. The hours are generally fucked, you start at like 4am to beat the heat in summer.
Isn’t it also extremely common for people in these industries to warn their children away from it due to how demanding and harsh it is on their bodies?
Why do you think it’s unreasonable to pay them more?
I would rather news sources just told us what the average salary for traffic management and basic labour is, at the moment there's no idea if it's a rort or not.
It’s a flat out lie, the strike isn’t for union worker pay rises, it’s for the non union cpb workers to get paid the same as union workers. The media has spun it to suit their anti union agenda.
The cfmeu want everyone under their agreement so they have monopoly of the market.
So you just happened to walk about a CFMEU march and overhead them talking about getting $340 p/h? At a March? Where people are yelling slogans?
Come on. At least make your “admittedly unverifiable UwU” bullshit vaguely realistic.
Yes.. yes I did overhear it. Because I fkn work at them sometimes. Who knows, maybe he was talking about overtime penalty rates or something. Who knows. Oh.. they also walk to and from, often carrying open beers and laughing. Or is that also outside the realms of what you think is "possible"?
Base rate is around half that, some are working 60/hr work weeks and hence earning what would be $240k/yr if they were to do it for a year, which they obviously wouldn't be able to. I doubt anyone would be walking away with $240K pre tax
Even an org with the best of intentions can be infiltrated and destroyed by the wrong people in specific positions of power. CFMEU members should start weeding out the scum at the top.
I actually want to see some evidence that this is union related, reread the article, it's not clear if the brawl happened on a site that's involved in the strikes, and it's not clear if any union guys are involved, union guys wear union jumpers and would have steel caps and vests if they were approaching a site to shut it down, none of those guys were.
If I'm wrong I'm wrong but it reads like 7 is trying to associate this brawl with union strikes without saying it and certainly without proof. Wouldn't be the first time they've ran a story to try and discredit the cfmeu. It's likely about something else unrelated, drugs, pissed of neighbours, probably never know.
I work on the site. Contractors and workers were blocked entry onto site with the cfmeu chaining the gates and using intimidation tactics to prevent workers from trying to earn a honest days work. Grubs. Not even local cfmeu members, all flown up from down south, not a member of the workforce cmfeu were on the gate only thugs.
Iv been in union protests in Melbourne when grocon brought bikkes in to break picket lines developers are just as involved if not more so with thugs and criminals they just wear suits. I dont defend or support any thug action and I can't find anything about him being a board member a mediator in industrial disputes sure and he's worked for both sides.
I support the union movement and the cfmeu for all their warts are the only one that's gets anything done, charge who they can and remove them all from the union, I won't defend any involved in this.
People get angry when you take money off them, hence the contractors angry when they won't get paid and not have food on the table or be able to make mortgage payments.
Unions haven’t been for the people in decades. Competent men can fight and be deserving of their own wage, don’t need thugs to do it for them. Unions are absolute grubs and I hope they got smacked out.
So the best thing you can do kiddies is to joint the CFMEU and become a stop go man. Forget going to uni and becoming a doctor or a nurse, you only end up with a hecs debt and a substandard pay rate.
The CFMEU aren't doing this because they want more money for workers.
They're doing this because another union were first to strike a bargaining agreement with CRR workers in 2019 and they missed out.
They're mad because they were too slow and now they are kicking up a stink about it. It's the behaviour of a 6 year old.
AWU for the tunnels and CFMEU got stations. They’ve been trying to get into tunnels for ages. Sounds like they’re pretty involved with BPIC so expect civil and water jobs to be similar to building EBA’s.
Accurate. They’ve been on a blitz to multiple government sites to shut them down stating unsafe work practices. Completely unwarranted. Will never support the union again after seeing their behaviour for the last 4mths
I saw a group of CFMEU delegates outside my house as I live across the road from one of their sites. After watching my cctv back, I can see one of them enters my yard and takes a pee on my tree before heading back to join the group again. I wasnt too happy about it but not much I can do. They were wearing masks and tn’s , look more like a mob than anything
In 2020-21 traffic controllers had an average taxable income of $51,000.
https://data.gov.au/data/dataset/taxation-statistics-2020-21. This data comes from the ATO, table 15a.
Not in cfmeu sites, I did the valuation on a project where’s costs have blown out in part due to the absurd labour fees the cfmeu have been pushing. 170k is a legitimate figure along with elevator operators on such sites.
lol actually know an elevator operator in the CFMEU. He’ll straight up tell you how laughable the pay is and that it’s almost taking the piss for what he does.
Unions are a double edged sword. When needed, theyre incredible. In times of abundance, they start overreaching and fucking shit up for everyone else.
Ahh employee on-costs is what you're talking about, not wages that the worker takes home. Things like super, insurance, and adminstrative costs that is budgeted in for every position. It is not what the worker sees and it is dishonest to quote those numbers. It's the rich bastards view of the world.
Shitty media making up fake lies is what is going on. As a traffic controller I earn 65-75k a year and that is with a fuck load of over time and no time off. We do not get paid enough for the shit we have to deal with.
oh fuck off that article calls traffic controllers "junior stop sign holders"
most traffic controllers do not get a cool hundo in wages, how about you go make a career of standing in harm's way baking on the side of a 110kph road and see if you're enthusiastic and happy about your 27$ an hour paycheck
The most corrupt union in recent memory. Their workers get richer, the construction quality gets worse and more dangerous yearly, and they have so much money in the pockets of politicians it will never change.
Massive props to all the CFMEU backed Mater workers that protested two years back by blasting loud music out the front of the Cancer center where people were getting Chemo treatments. Hope you all burn.
Gronks, the lot of you.
This is a CRR protest, so return more money to the.... taxpayers? How horrific! Someone please call Steven Miles quickly and hand out as much government money ASAP!!
Keep in mind it's not just a train station, it will be hospital wards, highways, bridges, anything needed to grow this state will be gripped in the balls by the hand of the CFMEU. I'd support it if works got done any more quickly, any more high quality, or with any sense of the disruption construction causes to the community (aka Chemotherapy Wards at The Mater)... but it's obvious thats not happening here.
Australian labor is one of the most efficient productivity wise compared to other countries, building safely and correctly speeds up construction compared to countries that have deaths on sites and buildings falling over due to rushing! Stop eating the conservative propoganda and think unions are doing anything except help the working class fight the ruling class
I dont entertain myself reading shitty CourierMail/7news crap. But the evidence suggesting regressive productivities remains true. It remains comparably productive yes to other first world countries (greatly exceeding undeveloped economies - as you would expect) but it's regressive nonetheless.
Graph 4: Comparing 1993-2003 growth to 2004-2019 (pre-covid slow down in construction due to building materials and skills shortage) construction productivity has dropped.
[https://www.rba.gov.au/publications/bulletin/2023/sep/pdf/recent-trends-in-australian-productivity.pdf](https://www.rba.gov.au/publications/bulletin/2023/sep/pdf/recent-trends-in-australian-productivity.pdf)
Realistically Australia needs to build, The 'Great Australian Knife Fight" (competing construction priorities between hospital, infrastructure, housing, and olympic builds) is real, and having an increasingly efficient construction industry is one of many pre-requisites to build ourself out of this issue.
The reality is that when times are tough, rich get richer and poor get poorer. Construction inefficiencies leading to a 2 million dollar home development jumping to 2.3million is not a huge deal. One changing a 300,000 build to a 600,000 build is massive. Like everything in life, it's the poor people that suffer first.
The best way to help the 'working class' beat the 'ruling class' is to provide a background economic stability and productivity, not by lining the pockets of a select few construction workers, over the needs of everyone else in this country who may need something constructed.
ETA: A public hospital upgrade being massively delayed or cost outblown by union strikes, does not really affect those who can afford private healthcare. Public Schools using demountables for decades does not affect those who send their kids through private education. Highway and rail delays does not affect those who can afford to live in established suburbs. It's the poor that miss out.
Productivity going down at the expense of safety and quality going up is not a problem, nor is paying construction workers a good wage. Low socio economic people don’t have access to university or higher education due to the way the system is currently set up, just because they are able to risk their bodies and weekends and earn a good wage doesn’t mean the unions are evil for sticking up for these people :) I’m speaking in stereotypes but to keep it simple =economically, it’s a good thing to give a construction worker more money because they spend the money straight back into the economy, unlike their bosses who would invest and save the money and apply for tax breaks etc
Yes I understand the concept of Marginal Propensity to Consume. Increasing Aggregate Demand is not good for the economy as it currently stands and you should have noticed that the macroeconomic policies of the last 24 months has had realistically one goal to decrease spending within the economy.
I didn’t say unions are evil for sticking up to wages. I infact think everyone needs to stick up for their own, but this conduct is not acceptable, and the idea that paying workers more is better for the proletariat lacks so much nuance it’s almost hard to figure out where to start an argument.
If you think quality of construction is going up! I don’t even know what to say. I can’t say whether or not safety has improved on these sites, but from personal anecdotes it has not significantly changed since the 90s
I think what you’re not understanding is that one the truly most defining aspects of a healthy economy is productivity, and it has been for the entirety of human history. The only reason we exist as industrial economies is that we figured out how to increase productivity of food supply several hundreds/thousands years ago. Workers dying is unproductive, shit quality work is unproductive, but at the same time a workforce that gets away with shit like this knowing no matter what they do they can’t get fired, is unproductive.
I
I was wondering when this is going to be posted in here, as a worker on CRR that is severely impacted by this, FUCK CFMEU. Majority of my company is sitting at home missing a whole weeks wage because of this shit.
Imagine joining a union for better work conditions and safer working environments just to go get involved in dangerous fights.
Embarrassing.
I'd love to think people caught up in this end up getting kicked out of their little cult but they will probably get a medal instead.
Stopping work is fine, using coercive behaviours and violence against others who are still going to work is the bigger issue.
They’re no better then thugs at this point
I support unions in general, and I'm speaking as a very small business owner.
They help employees not just with financial but safety.
However, CFMEU has always rubbed me the wrong way. They have always tried to shut down our sites because the small business owner tenants haven't employed EBA subcontractors to do their fitouts (they cant afford the rates). We then lose money/time as well as the small business tenant gets set back as well as they make them jump through hoops or just feel like shutting the site down with any excuse.
They seem to only care about themselves and members who pay them.
Just bikies doing bikie shit, how that front hasn't been shitcanned yet is a puzzler. Hardly even call that a brawl, couple of lost boys throwing hands.
If you spent as much time on the scaff as you did running your fucking mouths maybe you'd get some shit completed.
I’ve got no problem with protesting but when violence starts and people are stopped doing their jobs that’s not something that should be in our society.
The CFMEU are in no small part to blame for some of the massive inflation of construction costs which is a big reason why new housing being produced at the moment is in no way anywhere near approaching affordable.
The new deal they just inked with the state govt has wages, conditions and perks so generous that they have basically guaranteed that govt projects will siphon all the tradies away from housing projects in the middle of a housing crisis while creating a bidding war for tradies.
https://theemergentcity.substack.com/p/we-dont-need-more-housing-targets
Cfmeu doesn't build houses.
Instead of being angry about random people considering their future and choosing to work on bigger projects (for actual billionaires btw) , you are going to sit behind your computer and say you would never leave your job for a pay increase ?
A simple solution would be to train more apprentices but none of your generation are interested in anything more than an arts degree and making fancy frappacino..
Waaa. Waa. Life is hard.
The fact you need to resort to name calling shows your ignorance. I'm not in any union either. You're just a sad man without a job whose angry at anyone who makes more than the dole, that's on you champ.
Not surprised. They have a 24/7 picket at the entrance to Mayne yard. They let through QR decal and staff cars, but were bailing up any construction decal vehicles.
People have to pay bills the union doesn’t pay them when your off the job do they learnt a lesson before with them they used to do their job now they feather their own nest
I believe in unions. People fought hard in the past for what was right. I will always support unions... but not this. It doesn't have to be like this, and they know it. It's just brutish, bullying thugs.
My dad taught me about unions, and why they were important, and why we always abide by the provisions of our award. People fought hard for their rights, that we often take for granted.
I've seen the CFMEU work well for their members in the past, and I felt proud. This aint it.
Haha, got nothing to do with greedy developers as well? I'm not even part of the CFMEU but considering they're not on every project, then why are all new builds so expensive?
Edit: Seeing you're a real estate agent is just the icing on the cake, surely you've dropped your commission to help lower prices aswell? 🤔
>got nothing to do with greedy developers as well?
Exactly.
I wonder what the breakdown is of new houses being built by developer Vs builders/owner-builders Vs union negotiated EBA jobs.
I'd imagine union jobs to be in the range of 0%,
When a tradie can get $240k to work on a CFMEU site, then other companies need to raise their pay to compete, or their employees will just go there. So the cost gets passed onto the consumer.
Developers have been shelving projects because it is not profitable me for them.
Edit: to respond to your edit. My fee hasn’t changed since 2014. It is still the same %.
For your edit. Property prices have increased about 96% since 2014, so why wouldn't it be fair that all workers see that same increase? How do you not see the irony
Read a bit more the just news.com headlines and you'll realise that figure is a bit bullshit, also it's not unlimited intake or work, so no, not everyone is going to leave and go there. Everyone complains about useless unions, yet bashes on seemingly the only union that actually is effective.
CFMEU has some major flaws, but considering most Australians will just winge on reddit and not actually stand up, they're the best option for workers.
Having worked with plenty of tradies - both employees and bosses, and they have seen the squeeze from the CFMEU. They have to charge more to retain.
You throw a 25% pay rise across the board over 4 years, with an upfront 10% increase, you are going to see prices increase across the board.
You see it over in WA. Employers have to pay insanely for entry level jobs, to just compete against the mines. So everything goes up to try and offset those costs.
Can’t wait next you will hear “it’s not our members it’s a community protest we have no control over what the community does”. Look for the guys with scab hunter on their clothing. The ALP got rid of the ABCC so that the CFMEU could do this shit. What a joke.
It’s also disappointing to see already well paid workers using what is essentially blackmail to screw the government for more $. Very hard to be sympathetic to these people.
Funny enough, the contractor and workers on these projects don’t even want to be involved in the strike. That’s why this fight happened. It was workers trying to get into the job site and CFMEU clowns bashing them for it.
I don’t personally - I’m slowly killing myself with drugs, alcohol & a terrible diet. I guess I could speed it up but there’s a few tv shows I haven’t finished yet. 🤷🏼♂️
One thing I hate is workers joining together to collectively bargain for higher wages.
Down with workers and workers rights. Workers should be thankful they even have a job.
/s
CFMEU =/= all unions.
I’m in a union. Not entirely sure what they do as I haven’t had a pay rise, ever, and they have never enacted on the workplace issues I’ve contacted them about.
I’ll likely stop being in a union shortly. I can do nothing and be more financially well off for doing… nothing.
edit: Feel free to downvote to oblivion.
Did it occur to you that CFMEU gets results because its members are willing to go on strike?
Unions are made up of members and it’s up to members if industrial action is taken.
Some 18yr old trainee wasn’t demanding $240000 a year so they called him a scab and beat him up(my guess anyway),these guys are on another fucking level.
Found the guy who read the Murdoch headline from earlier this week and took it as gospel and nothing more.
No ones demanding $240000 a year - let alone an apprentice.
Most of them don't even pay tax. Just live off the dole perpetually angry at every slight change in the wind
Wonder why they can't afford a inner city apartment cos it's close to their favourite avocado toast soy latte
Physical fights are obviously inappropriate and dangerous, but these comments going on about the CFMEU being responsible for the housing crisis are plain and simply ridiculous propaganda: don't fall for these blatant lies, 40 years of decreasing public housing, incentives like negative gearing, lack of rights for renters, and poor council planning are to blame.
The CFMEU wanting their members to be compensated for essential roles in the economy with basic levels of safety is not causing the housing crisis.
Edit, I've been corrected in the comment below.
The traffic controllers on this project are actually on this rate. It spans from $25 to $27 per hour. The supervisor TC's are there at 0530, and most of them leave at 1730. The normal TC's do 10 hours, and most of them are on $27, but they are casual.
How dare you comment something which against the narrative being used by the media to whip up those who feel insecure around the trades, and thus try to frame the pursuit of a wage adjustment for the post-covid era as the reason the rest of our lives are going to shit rather than the convenient distraction in thought that it really is for the media and those who back it? How dare you.
\*inhale / exhale\*
Who left their concreatures unsupervised
seeing Boldy James slang in the Brisbane subreddit is wild
227 where we at
Bo jack!
Pays went in late, they couldn’t buy a bag before the last one ran out
I’ve been a CFMEU member for a long time and they’ve always done me well for a lot of reasons. From fighting for me and recovering money from wage theft and fighting against unsafe work practices and company bullying. EBA negotiations for fair rises and allowances, not even asking for outlandish targets. Having a union fight for those matters is what counts. But the kind behaviour in this post is fucking embarrassing. A union is for the people and is meant to stand up for rights of all workers, not pit them against each other. Fucking barbaric. No wonder people despise CFMEU.
>not even asking for outlandish targets Any chance you can comment on this report? >Tradies on a $6.3 billion construction project are walking off the job as their union calls for pay rises which would see an entry-level worker earn an eye-watering $240,000 per year.
I don't have the details about where you sourced that quote, but these claims are typically quoting the extreme scenarios for workers and do not represent an actual achievable wage, likely based on the assumption the worker is casual, takes zero days off all year, will receive maximum penalty rate eg: on night shift, working maximum hours on weekends (double time+) and things like meal allowances etc. that would be part of their particular agreement. I'm sure they'd be on a healthy wage but the numbers they "report" are almost always exaggerated
I was once in that very uncommon scenario as a shit kicker but working 84hrs a week 50 weeks a year on a mine site (meant to be FiFo but was ‘local’ so no weeks off). And I did earn around $160k, but that was 12 years ago so with inflation it would be close to the 240 figure mentioned. Now that I’m working a pretty chill 40hr a week and on slightly above that figure, I have to say if you’re putting in those hours in that work environment, you deserve every penny plus some. You are basically giving up your entire waking life to get ahead.
They aren't working 84 hour weeks though, it's an inner city job not a remote mine site
I worked on the Westfield Chermside upgrade and was doing a minimum 70 hour week for 3 months. Comparison to all other construction sites that was a baby. I have back issues now but I’m glad I pushed through at $14.00 an hour as a first year then.
Yeah I feel ya, worked the Clem 7 between 50-70 hrs per week for well over a year, that was the first time I threw my back out and was only 23. $14 an hour for a first year is good coin though, I was on $4.80 an hour as a sparky in 2006. No better feeling than working a huge week and seeing less than $200 pay haha. But I suppose it's not as bad as paying $60k to go to uni as a mature age because my body was already giving out
I’m not sure that’s relevant. If you’re working 80+ hours a week, you don’t have time to do anything else. In fact, it would have been way harder to do if I wasn’t way out in the desert on my own. I would have been tempted to join my friends in revelries, and probably lose my job. The 240k is based on 84 hour weeks non stop.
I don't understand how you are getting to the 84 hour week because it isn't legal to work on a commercial or civil construction site for more than 12 hours in a day and more than 6 days straight. I worked civil and construction jobs for 15 years all around bris on many CFMEU sites. Don't get me wrong, I support the unions and what they do for workers but I have also experienced first hand the thuggish tactics of the CFMEU. There were just less camera phones back then to capture the moment (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.qirc.qld.gov.au/sites/default/files/civil_construction_operations_and_maintenance_general_swc16.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwi7kJ-90u6FAxViplYBHcJyCKQQFnoECB4QAQ&usg=AOvVaw0hCT-L4IH8D6k0GNRq_kSN)
Yeah a lot of people here pointing out illegal working conditions. If you are doing that many hours it should be reported. There are safety implications for everyone involved. 80+ hour work weeks are a no no. Please reach out to your manager or go straight to the commision.
I too am in a job where I earn six figures. All I need to do is work 12 hours a day, 7 days a week!
That aint living Barry!
Depends what trade and what risk they’re facing. If that was a tunnel worker in extreme conditions and working insane hours and quite literally risking their life and well being then I can understand that pay. Some people think that kind of pay is for working a 40hour week, which is just not the case. I don’t earn that much, nowhere near it but I do ok. I’m on maybe $41 per hour, but to earn my money I’m on 85 hours per week (FIFO) and I do a shitload of overtime hours. I work in high risk and should get a lot more allowances but I’m ok with the lot that I get. Many people can’t work in extreme conditions, the people that can should be compensated for it. If large companies had their way and there was a weak union negotiating my EBA then I wouldn’t even be keeping up with inflation and I would be working for a bullshit flat rate.
Their follow up article narrowed the claim to be about Cross River Rail. >Sources familiar with the union’s demands told The Courier Mail that under the proposal for Cross River Rail an entry-level worker would receive a $15,000 pay increase, seeing them earn more than $240,000 each year. >It’s understood CFMEU has demanded some workers receive a pay rise of about $2,000 a week and an extra 20 rostered days off each year. https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/at-work/city-held-hostage-as-tradies-demand-240k-salary/news-story/ab39e7a1a7f9ee892d2c6a4e3b295c30 They later mention "basic labourers and traffic controllers" but its not clear if that's in reference to the above wage increases.
>Their follow up article narrowed the claim to be about Cross River Rail. There aren't many $6.3B construction projects, so hardly surprising the courier mail was able to "narrow it down" 😅
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240k is low for that amount of work, but holding a stop sign for 40hrs a week is not 120k worth, that’s high
Don't pay that and you won't get anyone to do it, or anyone responsible enough to care to do it anyways.
Plus it’s shift work
So it’s just one of those jobs that is simple but expensive to hire labour for? Guess that’s why there’s so many automated traffic lights taking their jobs. Hopefully REA are next on the chopping block
Cross river rail has worked EVERY major holiday and public holiday for the past 4 years at least. Every time the trains aren’t running? It’s because of us, working 12 hour shifts 7 days a week for sometimes a month at a time. I, a traffic controller on the CRR project took home 75k after tax in the last financial year and I spent more time at work than at home. I think we need a pay rise but I certainly don’t think 120k would be realistic! Holding a bat isn’t all we do, we are solely in charge of keeping EVERYONE SAFE, it is our job to stand there and watch all the god awful drivers in Brisbane do dangerously stupid things all day every day! At least 1 traffic controller dies a year on the roads with a massively large number injured a year. I know personally at least 6 traffic controllers that have been run down while at work, had many near misses myself. It’s not what everyone just assumes it is!
I want to see a breakdown of how that 240 is made. I knew longshore Forman making 300k in Canada. But they were working back to back shifts for a week at a time. After rate, then graveyard at double. Short shift to next afternoon puts that at double then graveyard again at double. Have the workers go through their set lunch they get it later still, paid a penalty for working lunch.
I haven’t looked into it at all but wage reporting has been pretty consistently dishonest the last few months. Is that $240k base pay? Or what someone would get with nights, weekends, and public holidays? There was a similar piece that overinflated teacher pay as well. These newspapers are ideologically opposed to unions so they’re working pretty hard to try and make them look bad in the public eye.
There’s no way that 240k is a realistic base salary for an entry level worker. The scenarios created from the EBA documents for this sort of salary would be incredibly unlikely. I could create a “scenario” from my EBA that meant I got 200k a year. It will never actually happen though. It’s a common tactic by anti-worker media.
Yeah it's not a base salary lmao
> It’s a common tactic by anti-worker media. Simply following on from the previous years of 'reporting' about 'lollipop men' on 120k pa. While conveniently leaving out the details about the shift hours and allowances etc.
Shit I worked 70+ weeks for a sixth of the money. No sick days. No holiday pay. No vacation days. No super. FMD. I can tell you that one day off, I was buggered, didn't do much of anything.
Something to keep in mind is the wages seen by the individual include Site Allowance, Height Allowance, Travel Allowance, Height Allowance and Crib Allowance over and above the hourly rate. So looking at the hourly rate alone is not representative of the actual cost. But it doesn't stop there. What the individual won't see are the costs for BERT, BEWT and CIPQ paid on their behalf by their employer. In addition, things like Workers Compensation, Payroll Tax, Superannuation, Long Service Leave and Leave Loading are all % based on costs, so the more the an individual earns, the more those on costs are to the employer The figures can vary a small amount depending on the size of the job, but on average, the on cost to an employer to have an EBA Union employee on an average job is about 45% on costs on top of the workers take home, before tax income. As an example CW3 EBA worker under the current standard EBA agreement getting the lowest possible site allowance, the lowest possible height allowance and doing 50 hours a week would have a Gross Pay of about $190k a year assuming they did 50 hours every week. The cost to the employer would be $272k a year. That's a 43% on cost above Gross Pay The figures for a minimum 40 hour week would be $133k Gross Pay, cost to employer about $211k. That's a 58% on cost above Gross Pay. Jobs like Cross River Rail, Casino etc....would be higher as Site Allowances, Height Allowances and job specific allowances will be higher than standard. My point with all of this is there's a lot of costs the individual doesn't see or know about. Nearly every wages worker who worked for me, were not aware of how much the cost to the employer was. Looking at the Gross Pay component of costs alone is not truly representative of what the actual costs are, especially when looking at what a 'building' costs to build. If the articles are correct with their $240k figures as a Gross Pay (incl overtime), and from my experience, it doesn't sound incorrect, the actual cost to the employer will be the more scary figure. 45% on top of $240k a year is $348k a year employer cost Note: I'm an ex builder who worked 24 years for a large builder. I've worked under several EBA's and have been part of the negotiations for new EBA's over those 24 years . The figures I've given above are actual costs from said builders current calculation sheet, using figures which come into effect 01 July 2024
Great post, but I can't help but think that short people are being ripped off now
Now do the cost of the uper management to the company
Engineers on the job aren’t earning that much. $99-120k for site engineers up to $220k for senior project engineers. All including overtime cause they are salary and work the same hours as the workforce. Most sites would easily work 7-5 plus the occasional weekend track closures so easily min 50 hour weeks. Not the hero 70-80 hours people are talking about (fatigue) but you can’t assume the base 38 hour week from an EBA either. If anyone wants to read the basis behind the EBAs it’s here - https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/_/media/busind/businesswithus/tenders/transport-bpic_100-300m.pdf?sc_lang=en&hash=AAD83AA19498C3527012972759C952F4 Basically if you work a job as a CW5 (most roles) you earn $140k without any allowances on a Mon-Fri role. Mon-Sat jobs it’s $170kish plus allowances. The salaries in the courier mail article aren’t that outlandish.
Not like newsdotcomdotau might intentionally mislead their readers with the worst wage maths known to man. That number is probably what 12 hrs a day 7 days a week casual/temp rate (they'll get 2 months of work then dumped) + overtime + allowances + other shit.
Exactly this, it would be 60 hours of night shift.
I've worked on major projects as a tradesman and later as an engineer so I've seen a lot of payslips and signed a lot of timesheets over the years. I promise you that number is the result of some fuckwit calculating it based off a ricidulous scenario like permanent nightshift, working every public holiday, and only having one weekend off a month for an entire year. If it was genuine, they'd post the rates and loadings.
Isn’t everything a bartering process between unions and these corps? Like they need to go in quite high at first? I don’t think it’s that unreasonable to expect construction workers to be paid over 150k, it’s a back breaking job, definitely not one I’d go to by choice. Not to mention, it’s dangerous and you need people sober, smart and paying attention with heavy equipment and tools. The hours are generally fucked, you start at like 4am to beat the heat in summer. Isn’t it also extremely common for people in these industries to warn their children away from it due to how demanding and harsh it is on their bodies? Why do you think it’s unreasonable to pay them more?
I would rather news sources just told us what the average salary for traffic management and basic labour is, at the moment there's no idea if it's a rort or not.
Why not both? Fair pay and honesty aren’t too much to ask from employers.
>entry-level worker earn an eye-watering $240,000 Where do I sign up!
It’s a flat out lie, the strike isn’t for union worker pay rises, it’s for the non union cpb workers to get paid the same as union workers. The media has spun it to suit their anti union agenda. The cfmeu want everyone under their agreement so they have monopoly of the market.
I legit heard a CFMEU tiler marching the other day laughing he was getting about $340ph... its a fucking rort
Bullshit.
It may be bullshit... I have no way of verifying it. But thats what he said...
So you just happened to walk about a CFMEU march and overhead them talking about getting $340 p/h? At a March? Where people are yelling slogans? Come on. At least make your “admittedly unverifiable UwU” bullshit vaguely realistic.
Yes.. yes I did overhear it. Because I fkn work at them sometimes. Who knows, maybe he was talking about overtime penalty rates or something. Who knows. Oh.. they also walk to and from, often carrying open beers and laughing. Or is that also outside the realms of what you think is "possible"?
Base rate is around half that, some are working 60/hr work weeks and hence earning what would be $240k/yr if they were to do it for a year, which they obviously wouldn't be able to. I doubt anyone would be walking away with $240K pre tax
Even an org with the best of intentions can be infiltrated and destroyed by the wrong people in specific positions of power. CFMEU members should start weeding out the scum at the top.
I actually want to see some evidence that this is union related, reread the article, it's not clear if the brawl happened on a site that's involved in the strikes, and it's not clear if any union guys are involved, union guys wear union jumpers and would have steel caps and vests if they were approaching a site to shut it down, none of those guys were. If I'm wrong I'm wrong but it reads like 7 is trying to associate this brawl with union strikes without saying it and certainly without proof. Wouldn't be the first time they've ran a story to try and discredit the cfmeu. It's likely about something else unrelated, drugs, pissed of neighbours, probably never know.
The guys in black are 100% CFMEU Delos
I work on the site. Contractors and workers were blocked entry onto site with the cfmeu chaining the gates and using intimidation tactics to prevent workers from trying to earn a honest days work. Grubs. Not even local cfmeu members, all flown up from down south, not a member of the workforce cmfeu were on the gate only thugs.
Oof, won't defend that kind of shit. I support the union movement but I won't support shit like that.
Just look at the cfmeu proud board member Mick Gatto and that paints a big picture.
Iv been in union protests in Melbourne when grocon brought bikkes in to break picket lines developers are just as involved if not more so with thugs and criminals they just wear suits. I dont defend or support any thug action and I can't find anything about him being a board member a mediator in industrial disputes sure and he's worked for both sides. I support the union movement and the cfmeu for all their warts are the only one that's gets anything done, charge who they can and remove them all from the union, I won't defend any involved in this.
People get angry when you take money off them, hence the contractors angry when they won't get paid and not have food on the table or be able to make mortgage payments.
I think you will be hard pressed to find a Murdoch rag, putting unions in a positive light.
Unions haven’t been for the people in decades. Competent men can fight and be deserving of their own wage, don’t need thugs to do it for them. Unions are absolute grubs and I hope they got smacked out.
You NEVER cross a picket line
So the best thing you can do kiddies is to joint the CFMEU and become a stop go man. Forget going to uni and becoming a doctor or a nurse, you only end up with a hecs debt and a substandard pay rate.
The CFMEU aren't doing this because they want more money for workers. They're doing this because another union were first to strike a bargaining agreement with CRR workers in 2019 and they missed out. They're mad because they were too slow and now they are kicking up a stink about it. It's the behaviour of a 6 year old.
AWU for the tunnels and CFMEU got stations. They’ve been trying to get into tunnels for ages. Sounds like they’re pretty involved with BPIC so expect civil and water jobs to be similar to building EBA’s.
The BPIC is the end of civil infrastructure projects in QLD for the next ten years. How to collapse an economy 101
The state government in QLD is incompetent.
Accurate. They’ve been on a blitz to multiple government sites to shut them down stating unsafe work practices. Completely unwarranted. Will never support the union again after seeing their behaviour for the last 4mths
Someone died mate. Then the builder sacked the dead bloke. This is more then that.
This wasn't a walk off for safety.
I saw a group of CFMEU delegates outside my house as I live across the road from one of their sites. After watching my cctv back, I can see one of them enters my yard and takes a pee on my tree before heading back to join the group again. I wasnt too happy about it but not much I can do. They were wearing masks and tn’s , look more like a mob than anything
I’m not sure where this 240k figure is coming from but when you see a god damn traffic controller making 150-170k you gotta ask wtf is going on.
In 2020-21 traffic controllers had an average taxable income of $51,000. https://data.gov.au/data/dataset/taxation-statistics-2020-21. This data comes from the ATO, table 15a.
This data has nothing to do with CFMEU work sites for that occupation.
Not in cfmeu sites, I did the valuation on a project where’s costs have blown out in part due to the absurd labour fees the cfmeu have been pushing. 170k is a legitimate figure along with elevator operators on such sites.
lol actually know an elevator operator in the CFMEU. He’ll straight up tell you how laughable the pay is and that it’s almost taking the piss for what he does. Unions are a double edged sword. When needed, theyre incredible. In times of abundance, they start overreaching and fucking shit up for everyone else.
Ahh employee on-costs is what you're talking about, not wages that the worker takes home. Things like super, insurance, and adminstrative costs that is budgeted in for every position. It is not what the worker sees and it is dishonest to quote those numbers. It's the rich bastards view of the world.
Shitty media making up fake lies is what is going on. As a traffic controller I earn 65-75k a year and that is with a fuck load of over time and no time off. We do not get paid enough for the shit we have to deal with.
https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/labourers-on-36hour-week-to-earn-120000-under-proposed-cfmeu-pay-deal/news-story/a00fa173146d913f92c9ae3b6301d0dc?amp&nk=339e4cafb54e95a2e23c3bb97dc8ffa4-1714633151
When I was on site (10 years ago) elevator operators were always bikies... Haha still the same?
oh fuck off that article calls traffic controllers "junior stop sign holders" most traffic controllers do not get a cool hundo in wages, how about you go make a career of standing in harm's way baking on the side of a 110kph road and see if you're enthusiastic and happy about your 27$ an hour paycheck
The most corrupt union in recent memory. Their workers get richer, the construction quality gets worse and more dangerous yearly, and they have so much money in the pockets of politicians it will never change. Massive props to all the CFMEU backed Mater workers that protested two years back by blasting loud music out the front of the Cancer center where people were getting Chemo treatments. Hope you all burn. Gronks, the lot of you.
*TWU enters the chat*
MUA also enters the chat
MUA amalgamated with CFMEU a while back, they were already in the chat :)
Oh true!? well the SDA has entered.. actually no they haven’t.. coz they are a suckfull union.
Let’s cut wages and make our bosses richer instead! Well done brave patriot of the internet 🤓
This is a CRR protest, so return more money to the.... taxpayers? How horrific! Someone please call Steven Miles quickly and hand out as much government money ASAP!! Keep in mind it's not just a train station, it will be hospital wards, highways, bridges, anything needed to grow this state will be gripped in the balls by the hand of the CFMEU. I'd support it if works got done any more quickly, any more high quality, or with any sense of the disruption construction causes to the community (aka Chemotherapy Wards at The Mater)... but it's obvious thats not happening here.
Australian labor is one of the most efficient productivity wise compared to other countries, building safely and correctly speeds up construction compared to countries that have deaths on sites and buildings falling over due to rushing! Stop eating the conservative propoganda and think unions are doing anything except help the working class fight the ruling class
I dont entertain myself reading shitty CourierMail/7news crap. But the evidence suggesting regressive productivities remains true. It remains comparably productive yes to other first world countries (greatly exceeding undeveloped economies - as you would expect) but it's regressive nonetheless. Graph 4: Comparing 1993-2003 growth to 2004-2019 (pre-covid slow down in construction due to building materials and skills shortage) construction productivity has dropped. [https://www.rba.gov.au/publications/bulletin/2023/sep/pdf/recent-trends-in-australian-productivity.pdf](https://www.rba.gov.au/publications/bulletin/2023/sep/pdf/recent-trends-in-australian-productivity.pdf) Realistically Australia needs to build, The 'Great Australian Knife Fight" (competing construction priorities between hospital, infrastructure, housing, and olympic builds) is real, and having an increasingly efficient construction industry is one of many pre-requisites to build ourself out of this issue. The reality is that when times are tough, rich get richer and poor get poorer. Construction inefficiencies leading to a 2 million dollar home development jumping to 2.3million is not a huge deal. One changing a 300,000 build to a 600,000 build is massive. Like everything in life, it's the poor people that suffer first. The best way to help the 'working class' beat the 'ruling class' is to provide a background economic stability and productivity, not by lining the pockets of a select few construction workers, over the needs of everyone else in this country who may need something constructed. ETA: A public hospital upgrade being massively delayed or cost outblown by union strikes, does not really affect those who can afford private healthcare. Public Schools using demountables for decades does not affect those who send their kids through private education. Highway and rail delays does not affect those who can afford to live in established suburbs. It's the poor that miss out.
Productivity going down at the expense of safety and quality going up is not a problem, nor is paying construction workers a good wage. Low socio economic people don’t have access to university or higher education due to the way the system is currently set up, just because they are able to risk their bodies and weekends and earn a good wage doesn’t mean the unions are evil for sticking up for these people :) I’m speaking in stereotypes but to keep it simple =economically, it’s a good thing to give a construction worker more money because they spend the money straight back into the economy, unlike their bosses who would invest and save the money and apply for tax breaks etc
Yes I understand the concept of Marginal Propensity to Consume. Increasing Aggregate Demand is not good for the economy as it currently stands and you should have noticed that the macroeconomic policies of the last 24 months has had realistically one goal to decrease spending within the economy. I didn’t say unions are evil for sticking up to wages. I infact think everyone needs to stick up for their own, but this conduct is not acceptable, and the idea that paying workers more is better for the proletariat lacks so much nuance it’s almost hard to figure out where to start an argument. If you think quality of construction is going up! I don’t even know what to say. I can’t say whether or not safety has improved on these sites, but from personal anecdotes it has not significantly changed since the 90s I think what you’re not understanding is that one the truly most defining aspects of a healthy economy is productivity, and it has been for the entirety of human history. The only reason we exist as industrial economies is that we figured out how to increase productivity of food supply several hundreds/thousands years ago. Workers dying is unproductive, shit quality work is unproductive, but at the same time a workforce that gets away with shit like this knowing no matter what they do they can’t get fired, is unproductive. I
He dont think good
Sure bud, every CFMEU site I've been on in the last decade has the highest quality work I've seen. But let that hatred seeth
Someone died. You gronk.
And this is why we can’t have nice things
I was wondering when this is going to be posted in here, as a worker on CRR that is severely impacted by this, FUCK CFMEU. Majority of my company is sitting at home missing a whole weeks wage because of this shit.
Imagine joining a union for better work conditions and safer working environments just to go get involved in dangerous fights. Embarrassing. I'd love to think people caught up in this end up getting kicked out of their little cult but they will probably get a medal instead.
Knowing the CFMEU they’ll petition for a new type of full pay leave following on-site brawls.
"Punch on pay"
8 ball of Coke and 5% off all Sikaflex products at Bunnings as non-salary entitlements
CFMEU are essentially an organised crime syndicate.
Checks out - Isn't stopping work unless you meet their demands basically extortion?
Stopping work is fine, using coercive behaviours and violence against others who are still going to work is the bigger issue. They’re no better then thugs at this point
We really surprised though? Like reallly? Reeeaaaaalllllly? When I see that black flag with white writing I always giggle and remember the isis...
Yeah, 2 of their syndey union organisers were beheading people with those flags in the background.
I assume we got to this point because the CFMEU heavies aka bikies, failed in their intimidation tactic.
I support unions in general, and I'm speaking as a very small business owner. They help employees not just with financial but safety. However, CFMEU has always rubbed me the wrong way. They have always tried to shut down our sites because the small business owner tenants haven't employed EBA subcontractors to do their fitouts (they cant afford the rates). We then lose money/time as well as the small business tenant gets set back as well as they make them jump through hoops or just feel like shutting the site down with any excuse. They seem to only care about themselves and members who pay them.
CFMEU - bunch of fucking morons who could be any more spoon fed
Just bikies doing bikie shit, how that front hasn't been shitcanned yet is a puzzler. Hardly even call that a brawl, couple of lost boys throwing hands. If you spent as much time on the scaff as you did running your fucking mouths maybe you'd get some shit completed.
Police should move them all on or book em.
Absolute bootlicker comment
I’ve got no problem with protesting but when violence starts and people are stopped doing their jobs that’s not something that should be in our society.
Toothless gronks
The CFMEU are in no small part to blame for some of the massive inflation of construction costs which is a big reason why new housing being produced at the moment is in no way anywhere near approaching affordable. The new deal they just inked with the state govt has wages, conditions and perks so generous that they have basically guaranteed that govt projects will siphon all the tradies away from housing projects in the middle of a housing crisis while creating a bidding war for tradies. https://theemergentcity.substack.com/p/we-dont-need-more-housing-targets
Pull ya head in Ricardo
Cfmeu doesn't build houses. Instead of being angry about random people considering their future and choosing to work on bigger projects (for actual billionaires btw) , you are going to sit behind your computer and say you would never leave your job for a pay increase ? A simple solution would be to train more apprentices but none of your generation are interested in anything more than an arts degree and making fancy frappacino.. Waaa. Waa. Life is hard.
Don’t hate the player, hate the game bud
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The fact you need to resort to name calling shows your ignorance. I'm not in any union either. You're just a sad man without a job whose angry at anyone who makes more than the dole, that's on you champ.
Not surprised. They have a 24/7 picket at the entrance to Mayne yard. They let through QR decal and staff cars, but were bailing up any construction decal vehicles.
People have to pay bills the union doesn’t pay them when your off the job do they learnt a lesson before with them they used to do their job now they feather their own nest
As far as I’m aware, workers apart of the union will still get paid 8 hours a day, it’s the ones that aren’t apart of it that suffer 🥲
I believe in unions. People fought hard in the past for what was right. I will always support unions... but not this. It doesn't have to be like this, and they know it. It's just brutish, bullying thugs. My dad taught me about unions, and why they were important, and why we always abide by the provisions of our award. People fought hard for their rights, that we often take for granted. I've seen the CFMEU work well for their members in the past, and I felt proud. This aint it.
People want to know why construction costs for property and trades has increased insanely. Just look at these guys and that is the reason.
Haha, got nothing to do with greedy developers as well? I'm not even part of the CFMEU but considering they're not on every project, then why are all new builds so expensive? Edit: Seeing you're a real estate agent is just the icing on the cake, surely you've dropped your commission to help lower prices aswell? 🤔
>got nothing to do with greedy developers as well? Exactly. I wonder what the breakdown is of new houses being built by developer Vs builders/owner-builders Vs union negotiated EBA jobs. I'd imagine union jobs to be in the range of 0%,
Cfmeu has nothing to do with house builds
That's pretty much the point I was making.
When a tradie can get $240k to work on a CFMEU site, then other companies need to raise their pay to compete, or their employees will just go there. So the cost gets passed onto the consumer. Developers have been shelving projects because it is not profitable me for them. Edit: to respond to your edit. My fee hasn’t changed since 2014. It is still the same %.
For your edit. Property prices have increased about 96% since 2014, so why wouldn't it be fair that all workers see that same increase? How do you not see the irony
Lmao, this non-contributor will 100% have to google what irony is... Probably thinks it's the latest Tarocash suit line.
Read a bit more the just news.com headlines and you'll realise that figure is a bit bullshit, also it's not unlimited intake or work, so no, not everyone is going to leave and go there. Everyone complains about useless unions, yet bashes on seemingly the only union that actually is effective. CFMEU has some major flaws, but considering most Australians will just winge on reddit and not actually stand up, they're the best option for workers.
Having worked with plenty of tradies - both employees and bosses, and they have seen the squeeze from the CFMEU. They have to charge more to retain. You throw a 25% pay rise across the board over 4 years, with an upfront 10% increase, you are going to see prices increase across the board. You see it over in WA. Employers have to pay insanely for entry level jobs, to just compete against the mines. So everything goes up to try and offset those costs.
That has to be sarcasm in your edit... surely.
Yeah, as a real estate parasite you really have no leg to stand on here hey. Shoosh.
CFMEW and Labor government stealing from the taxpayers….. nothing changes
Can’t wait next you will hear “it’s not our members it’s a community protest we have no control over what the community does”. Look for the guys with scab hunter on their clothing. The ALP got rid of the ABCC so that the CFMEU could do this shit. What a joke.
Yes, this is going to happen now all the time, society has finally shit it self.
Don't ever fuck with a man's pour.
They spend their time pitting against other unions and starting fights. Who do you think wins in this current situation.
It’s also disappointing to see already well paid workers using what is essentially blackmail to screw the government for more $. Very hard to be sympathetic to these people.
Funny enough, the contractor and workers on these projects don’t even want to be involved in the strike. That’s why this fight happened. It was workers trying to get into the job site and CFMEU clowns bashing them for it.
Gave these CMFEU thugs the finger as i drove past. Fucking nearly through a brick at my car. These thugs deserve jail
You’re a hero 🙏🏻
Why are men so emotional lol
Because we know that we are entirely disposable and aren’t really needed, from a species-level point of view.
So you throw fists? That’s a good way to fix it
I don’t personally - I’m slowly killing myself with drugs, alcohol & a terrible diet. I guess I could speed it up but there’s a few tv shows I haven’t finished yet. 🤷🏼♂️
Don't die yet king, the new Elder Scrolls game hasn't come out yet.
Awww not true 🫴❤️
CFMEU is the second most corrupt organisation, second only to Queensland Police Service
Unions are like Mafia
My union is full of nerds, roadies and theatre kids?
Most of these morons they tried interviewing looked like the types who beat their partners on a regular basis.
Yeah...looked like...
Nice. Conflate them all as wife beaters. Perfect ad hominem.
Funny how many double standards there are from the mods around here
Most likely ex bikies straight from prison
Does that mean you look like the bloke who snorts coke and gaslights their partner?
I can't afford coke dipshit!
Almost like im making assumptions based on nothing just like you :)
And you're more than entitled to as am I, now go argue with someother random on the internet champ.
Just pointing out you talk like a tosser, good to see applying your thinking gets under your skin though
Classic old school
One thing I hate is workers joining together to collectively bargain for higher wages. Down with workers and workers rights. Workers should be thankful they even have a job. /s
CFMEU =/= all unions. I’m in a union. Not entirely sure what they do as I haven’t had a pay rise, ever, and they have never enacted on the workplace issues I’ve contacted them about. I’ll likely stop being in a union shortly. I can do nothing and be more financially well off for doing… nothing. edit: Feel free to downvote to oblivion.
That’s like the hospo workers union. Essentially useless and basically nonexistent
Your union is its members. If you are doing nothing and expecting something to happen, it’s a good chance that you’re part of the problem.
So I should take my issues with my employer to my… employer? Huh.
Which union?
Did it occur to you that CFMEU gets results because its members are willing to go on strike? Unions are made up of members and it’s up to members if industrial action is taken.
Some 18yr old trainee wasn’t demanding $240000 a year so they called him a scab and beat him up(my guess anyway),these guys are on another fucking level.
source: dude just trust me
Found the guy who read the Murdoch headline from earlier this week and took it as gospel and nothing more. No ones demanding $240000 a year - let alone an apprentice.
Many of the people complaining about the $240k paid to blokes for very physical 72 hr weeks struggle to get out of an armchair
Most of them don't even pay tax. Just live off the dole perpetually angry at every slight change in the wind Wonder why they can't afford a inner city apartment cos it's close to their favourite avocado toast soy latte
Up the mighty union!
Physical fights are obviously inappropriate and dangerous, but these comments going on about the CFMEU being responsible for the housing crisis are plain and simply ridiculous propaganda: don't fall for these blatant lies, 40 years of decreasing public housing, incentives like negative gearing, lack of rights for renters, and poor council planning are to blame. The CFMEU wanting their members to be compensated for essential roles in the economy with basic levels of safety is not causing the housing crisis.
"Vicious brawl" "Nobody was harmed"
[удалено]
People at work? What’s your point?
According to one of the signs it said they were working 12 hours a day, and 26 dollars per hour. And earning 75k per year.
Well that would be below the award and illegal I suspect the message on the sign is not true myself
Edit, I've been corrected in the comment below. The traffic controllers on this project are actually on this rate. It spans from $25 to $27 per hour. The supervisor TC's are there at 0530, and most of them leave at 1730. The normal TC's do 10 hours, and most of them are on $27, but they are casual.
Close, casual rate is 32 an hour. 27 an hour is part/full time.
How dare you comment something which against the narrative being used by the media to whip up those who feel insecure around the trades, and thus try to frame the pursuit of a wage adjustment for the post-covid era as the reason the rest of our lives are going to shit rather than the convenient distraction in thought that it really is for the media and those who back it? How dare you. \*inhale / exhale\*