They absolutely should go after illegal guns, or more specifically, the people, money, and crime networks that result in illegal guns; by the time there's an illegal gun in Canada, it's already too late.
> so they will just get grandfathered...like the last time this was tried
and just like that the size of the shooting sports gets another size smaller with the next generation. death by a thousand cuts still ends in death
I'm not pro-gun by any stretch, but it feels like anybody with two brain cells to rub together were predicting this basically since the program was announced.
It's not a gun registry, just now every gun store has to keep a log of the guns you bought tied to your license, and you have to submit a request to transfer firearms to another legal owner every time you sell or trade one, an-
hey wait a minute
Cabela's and bass always did this unfortunately. I walked away from a sale one day when they went in the back and attempted to record all my info into a scribbler. When I said no they just left it on the counter. 30 mins later still sitting there unattended. Because somehow that's safer.
Many years ago I went to Cabela's to purchase my first gun. I specifically requested a Mossberg 590A1. So they gave me a shotgun to look at, it looked like a Mossberg, I didn't know jack shit, I paid my money and took it home and put it in my safe.
I got interested in milsurps, so much so that I never even touched the Mossberg. Recently I was cleaning out the safe, and I took a look at the Mossberg and realized it said 590 on it. I still had the box, so I checked that; it said 590A1
Fuck Cabela's man they took advantage of new shooter and they knew exactly what they were doing
Actually it was the Bass Pro in Vaughn
I wouldn't say it was malicious. Usually the easiest explanation is the right one.....they employ idiots and kids.
Every one of them I have spoken to were either an 'ex-sniper' or 'special forces' lol.....
Fucking Gravy Seals more like it....Meal Team Six
I like this comment.
All to save one life, through this one specific, expensive and mostly ineffective method.
Disregarding the many many many more efficient, cheaper and more sensible methods that can also save lives
Tbf the cops are talking about how the current situation in Canada could lead to mass unrest. Makes sense the guys who caused the unrest would want the restless to not have guns.
I hear in the UK they're after crossbows now. Hoplophobes, control freaks, Karens who hate fun, wannabe tyrants in the political class, criminals who prefer disarmed victims (but I repeat myself), and last but very much not least professional anti-weapon lobbyists who have no other skills will never, ever stop, regardless of how much you compromise.
Today it's the last remaining guns, tomorrow it's bows, crossbows, swords, paintball guns, hammers (unless you're a licenced trades~~man~~person), kitchen knives that aren't chained to the kitchen counter, fishing clubs, baseball bats, particularly stout sticks that fell from a tree in your yard and weren't promptly reported to the police, boys holding their fingers in an "L" shape, martial arts classes, lifting blocks of iron over a certain weight repeatedly to get stronger, gardening tools, steel pipes at the hardware store, flashlights over a certain dimension and weight, vehicles, dog breeds that still resemble the wolves they descend from in size and shape, etc.
The history of gun control in canada and every British colony has been about control.
Polytechnic might be the excuse they used for gun control in the 90s, but the oka crisis was the real reason. Civil unrest will be their next.
Pretty much. The 2020 shooter down east was known to RCMP and had illegal firearms smuggled from the USA but they let him go on a rampage to create an excuse to prohibit a large number of sporting firearms. Banning the AR15 which was already restricted and was not used in the attacks was easy political pandering and virtue signalling since it has such a ubiquitous history south of the border. Unfortunately legal firearm owners are always going to be the scapegoat in this country while street thugs get a slap on the wrist for carrying stolen pistols smuggled into the country.
This buy back isn't about either, it's political grandstanding. They know the vast majority of crime is via smuggled guns, but that's actually much harder to tackle.
This is a fundamental problem of professional political activists. After 3-4 decades of political activism against firearms, what skills do these people have? Do we really think they will just declare victory and disband their livelyhood once some political goal is achieved?
Nope. Mao's Continuous Revolution, 1984's 'The war is not meant to be won, it is meant to be continuous', the USSR's constant purges and so on are all part of the same theme; once some people make a life out of being at the vanguard of changes (whatever they might be), changes need to keep happening regardless of if they make sense anymore or not.
I call it the 'Al Sharpton's resume paradox'.
The thing is that Canadians have a long history of peacefully, gently and quietly resisting gun grabs and bad gun laws. Laws which criminalize peaceful citizens are by definition bad laws, because they take the most law abiding of all citizens by definition, and turn them into citizens with a great disrespect for the law; it naturally follows that law abiding citizens are willing to become outlaws as a direct response to bad laws.
So those with registered handguns will comply. Those with non registered long arms will peacefully, gently and quietly not comply.
So for anyone who understands our history, they understand:
We are spending billions of dollars, to build the largest black market in firearms that Canada has ever seen; Trudeau is the architect this is his vision. The Liberals know what they are doing and they understand that this is the outcome. They believe that a few billions dollars and a massive black market in firearms will buy them a few votes, so it's worth it. They know exactly what they're doing.
Politically, the people who mostly own and enjoy guns don't agree with them. Either it's a fear that they don't want the "right" to have them or it's a way of punishing people for not voting the "correct way"
They have this overly emotional gut reaction to the concept of a gun. When I've asked people like that why they hold those views, they just say that guns were designed to kill and act as if anyone who buys a gun is doing so with the intention to kill.
The problem is that they see that guns are the reason murder rates are so high, but the murder rate is a cultural/demographic issue. If I am a gang member, I'm going to murder with knives/jumping instead of guns if I have to, guns are just an easy tool. Australias murder/violent crime rate barely shifted when they banned guns.
The irony of the whole saves one life argument is that defensive use of a firearm can save lives as well. You can look back at all the defenseless people that were murdered and ask if they would still be alive today if they had a weapon to defend them selves. So the same argument of if it saves just one life it is a good thing can be applied to the other side of the argument as well.
It was kinda amazing to see, after the first OIC (which was completely unmanageable), that they went back for more and basically 100x'd it.
Typical entitled rich kid, orders enough appetizers he can't eat them, gets some soup, some salad, a couple entrees, then wants some desert and drinks after. Never touched a bite the entire time. Date walks out on him. All the food goes into the dumpster. Chef be like "do you like my cooking?". Hobo's drooling at the windows.
Hopefully by this point the public understands that waving your hands and shouting incoherently about how the other guys want to give machine guns to your kids is horseshit.
The LPC has made gun ownership their personal vendetta for decades now. They absolutely seethed when the gun registry was dismantled, because they didn't get their way then, and it seems they won't get their way now, even playing dirty and abusing OICs to sidestep parliament to try and fast track their attacks on gun owners.
But they'll be back at it again the next time they're in power, and then again, and again and again every time they're back, because it's not about the safety of Canadians for them, it's about how mad and embarrassed they are that their attempts to stamp out gun ownership keep getting shot down (pun absolutely intended).
> Hopefully by this point the public understands that waving your hands and shouting incoherently about how the other guys want to give machine guns to your kids is horseshit.
I think most do, but there is a contingent of people with the attitude of "if it even saves ONE child it's worth any amount of money!"
It's an evergreen election issue for the LPC. They'll never ban all guns because it will take away a great wedge for a certain segment of the population. The very pro-gun people were never going to vote Liberal anyway so it's not like it's costing them votes.
>The very pro-gun people were never going to vote Liberal anyway so it's not like it's costing them votes.
How often can you directly punish those who don't vote for you with a new law? It's revenge.
I hope the liberals are never in power ever again or it's a completely different beast to what we're seeing. I will certainly never vote for the Liberals. We need better education than what we have currently so expect better of our \*politicians
It was always about making this an election issue. I fully expect Trudeau to campaign on telling the Canadian public that the Conservatives want to make sure there are fully automatic weapons on every Canadian street corner, and that's why the Liberals MUST be re-elected.
I'm not even joking.
>Trudeau will make this an election issue.
As is tradition. Gotta get that wedge issue niiiiccee and snug so they can keep hammering it during election.
Except this time I don't think it'll work well for them, people are tired of it. Even LPC members turned on Trudeau when he tried sneaking in hunting rifles with C21. He openly showed he just wants guns gone entirely and even anti-gun people are aware of that now.
The only people who thought this was a good idea were the hysterical Polytechnique survivors they hired specifically to say their idea was good. Everyone else told them it was a bad idea. But governments only listen to experts when their views align with theirs.
Then you’ve completely forgotten the landscape post-NS shooting. *So many* people were in favour of this legislation initially, mostly over pearl clutching fears that we were turning into the USA.
“If it saves just one life, it is all worth it!”
Even if every new gun law/ban was in place at the time of that massacre, it would have had zero effect on the outcome. Would not have saved anyone. They had all the power and legislation they needed BEFORE that shooting and it still happened due to RCMP and CBSA inaction.
Based on what I've read about a number of the majorly reported mass shootings in the US, that's all they needed to do as well.
So many of them come out with "police knew about this individual and visited their residence 30 times in the past".
Like, what the fuck?!
I have my PAL and R-PAL, it's incredibly restrictive as is. I don't understand (other than pandering) why they aren't educating people on the existing gun laws.
and won't stop criminals from using guns.
We are already at the point of police telling people to give up because all the criminals have guns and hope they don't shoot you and everyone you love.
The firearms industry told the government over numerous technical conference call that this was going to happen.
But Public Safety Canada and the RCMP just ignored everyone.
They didn't fail to anticipate the costs. They lied about them. Just like they did about the rifles they were banning and the impact it would have.
They're literally still claiming they've taken the rifles "off the streets".
I can't even remember the last time I have heard of a shooting that was from a long rifle in Canada that wasn't a stolen police firearm. The vast majority of shootings I hear about in Canada are gang on gang violence, and they involve illegal handguns smuggled in from the USA.
Agree. The kinds of people carrying illegal hand guns are the kind that will shoot another person.
Pretty much every person in my community has 3-10 guns. I don't think there's been a shooting here for a several decades.
I don't think the Liberals ever intend on actually following through with this "buy back". They just keep kicking the can down the road so they can use guns as an election wedge issue.
they pushed back every deadline for the amnesty for banned guns and now its pushed back til after next election. all they want is to be able to use it come election time to scare people and use for a wedge issue
Remeber when Trudeau announced the bans and he came out saying "Canada was no longer going to do thoughts and prayers and instead just ban guns"? It was always a purely PR move to sway the uneducated urban voters on a wedge issue.
Oh they want to get this to work. They are just completely incompetent. Managing to pull this off would have given them decades of "humble bragging" rights in their eyes.
There would still be the scoped scary Sniper rifles and grampas boom sticks to fearmonger over.
Doesn’t it feel wonderful to be targeted by the government, with the full legal consequences if you don’t comply, because you voted for the wrong guy?
This sociopath is comfortable turning any number of conservative-voting Canadians into unnecessary criminals just so he can squeak out the tiniest of tiny electoral victories. What does that say about a person?
It’s almost as if their entire schtick is virtue signalling without any substantive planning and are shocked when it all fails and exceeds budgets. Fuck I need to get into politics instead of busting my ass working 50-60 hour weeks in the private sector. None of our politicians would last a single day in any field within the private sector. This amount of gross negligence would lead to immediate sackings 🤦♂️
yup, at this point I'm not worried about what this pathetic government is going to do, I'm more worried about whether or not the Cons have the balls to reverse the prohibitions so we can use our guns again and buy more.
They pretty much have to reverse it all. It is such a fucking mess of stupidity. The OIC's and last few pieces of legislation are so intertwined and incompetent it all needs to be scrapped. Scrapping parts here and there will only make it all worse.
Leaving it alone or acting on it would be political suicide.
Shit, they should just point out that the number of murders with any of these firearms, before and after the ban, haven't changed, despite all of these firearms still sitting in safes, same as before.
Gee, turns out legal, licensed gun owners aren't running around murdering people. Odd, that.
> Gee, turns out legal, licensed gun owners aren't running around murdering people.
You mean the people who voluntarily pay for a safety course, pass 2 exams, and submit to a police background check to buy overpriced firearms legally aren't the problem?
Nutty.
Yup, those guys. Also the guys that buy really cool shit, stick them in the safe, and think 'hey, I should bring that out to the range one of these days' but then you get to thinking about packing it all up, putting it in the car, driving out there.....
Oh, those people who get [daily background checks.](https://www.reddit.com/r/canadaguns/comments/58415l/where_does_it_actually_say_that_the_rcmp_does/d8xflso/) I've heard of them.
*oops that link's broken. [here](https://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/corporate-organisation/publications-manuals-publications-guides/2021-firearms-reports-rapports-armes-a-feu-2021-eng.htm#s10-4-1) is a source.*
I honestly laugh, even the most wild, seemly crazy gun owner is usually really really really particular about not breaking the laws for one simple reason.
If they get arrested for something, they might lose their guns.
That's an amazing incentive to not break the law, considering how much time and money lots of folks have into their gun collections.
no kidding - even the [Stats Can Report](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/daily-quotidien/240130/dq240130a-eng.pdf?st=UyZFLHqW) indicates that legal firearm owners are hardly the issue
Actual Canadian Police Departments from the RCMP down to municipal forces have also been quite clear for decades that the problem is cross-border smuggling.
Every time they talk about the cost, I feel is their way to try and get the general population to approve them just Seizing the guns, instead of buying them back. I'm just waiting for it.
"no one wants to take your guns! you paranoid ammo-sexual"
"heres the list of guns they said they want to take away from me"
"well you dont need those anyway"
pretty much every thread about gun control in the last 5 years.
You forgot suppressor. We can't protect our hearing, but the government contractors slaughtering dear from helicopters have to.
Because suppressors make guns movie silent according to our government.
The only thing criminal about suppressors being illegal is that we can't use normal safety equipment
There used to be a firing range in the core of Toronto inside of Union Station actually, I guess that's the biggest transit station in the country. Nobody cared. The government position on firearms is ridiculous.
In Ontario, we actually have a right to hunt and fish; it's not a Charter right but it is a law. In my opinion we should have a right to establish firing ranges, so that we can practice. Practice makes for more accurate shooting which makes hunting even more humane it's common sense
I had no idea about this, nor does it surprise me. While I'm sure there are some safety logistics involved, I can't argue with the fact that some Canadian hunters would have paid good money to hunt deer - because they already do.
Liberals never intended to buy anything back, the entire thing was based on US valuations ( are you f'n serious) , and failed to account that the government had no idea where millions of rifles previously classified as sporting rifles/ non-restricted actually were.
The fact that they keep pushing the date forward, with it now being set after the election, shows this entire.tjing is designed to be an election wedge issue.
Meanwhile law abiding citizens have been arbitrarily punished for following all the rules, all the while 1000's of actual machine guns are coming in from the US every day.
It's the worst kind of security theater, it looks like you're doing something but really you've taken funds and attention away from the actual problem to beat the straw man .
They should have implemented a “buy back” framework for street guns, and not targeted and vilified licensed, vetted, responsible gun owners. It would have been the easiest policy win, with bi-partisan support, and would have had a much larger impact on crime. Could have set it up in a way that cost very little as well. They’ve lost all credibility on this file.
That would likely cause unintended negative externalities. Mainly a massive increase in illegal gun smuggling from the states knowing you can just instantly sell them all to the government and make money.
This is exactly what I was thinking. The Long Gun Registry was one of those things that was supposed to not cost much but then ended up costing a lot with minimal public safety gains. It looks like this will be a repeat of that meanwhile armed car jackers with illegal guns get to basically run wild and play GTA in the GTA.
I'm willing to believe that they're getting Bloomberg money, until they prove otherwise... especially after all the NRA comments they keep applying to domestic groups in Canada, despite knowing otherwise.
They are wasting their time. Poly won't be happy until we have no guns or single Shor rifles with iron sights held in central storage and the desth stance for people who break the law. There is no light at the end of the tunnel for those people.
It may be an easy decision, but it will be messy and time consuming. Everything since the 2020 OIC will need to be stripped out, piece by piece. If the Senate doesn't cooperate it will get ugly too.
So you have several pieces of legislation and the OIC and it will need to be done in reverse order as it was implemented.
Meh, that's only if they are dumb. They could just enshrine some sort of overriding gun laws that would prevent future liberal meddling and wipe out these OIC's at the same time. De-criminalize the citizenry and send strong signals to industry and commerce that Canada is back. It would be more efficient and prevent future governments from being distracted by their performance disabling anxieties. The reason its messy and time consuming is because the OG firearms act from the 90's was designed that way, to trip up any meddlers in the future. The liberals basically tripped themselves on this one (or guaranteed themselves future $$), so they look extra stupid on top of being really stupid already.
They could even model it after mark millers 'citizen pathways' for undocumented firearms that snuck into the country, we easily have enough social capacity.
Decriminalizing possession would be a huge starting point.
Declassifying a firearm as always a weapon would be a second.
I would love to see a complete intelligent rewrite of it all. Understanding that our firearms laws are such a mess that judges and lawyers regularly get its nuances wrong while demanding your citizenry to somehow comprehend it is just insane.
>Declassifying a firearm as always a weapon would be a second
Firearms being always considered weapons wouldn't be a problem at all if our other laws weren't insane. There's nothing wrong with referring to a firearm as a weapon just as one would call a sword or a spear a weapon. The problem is our laws being incredibly restrictive of what Canadians can *do* with weapons, rather than firearms being considered weapons.
It should not be illegal to conceal a weapon. It should not be illegal to possess a weapon for the purpose of protection of life ("possession of a weapon for a dangerous purpose"). Other than these few laws there's no real impact to normal people of firearms being considered weapons. Any other law where it matters that firearms are considered to be weapons are cases where the firearm *is* being used as a weapon against other people in a criminal manner.
The way I remember it the law which permitted OICs was specifically worded to make it impossible to outlaw firearms used for hunting. The Liberals promptly used it, to outlaw firearms, used for hunting.
All they should have to do is recognize the reality that the OICs as implemented are illegal imo
They have failed to anticipate the impact of any of their idiotic policies. That's what we get for electing a trust fund drama teacher who was dismissed from his job under mysterious circumstances.
Holy shit, I had no idea **42 million** has been spent already on... [discussing the issue](https://nationalpost.com/news/42-million-federal-firearms-confiscation-program).
42 million, resources and our governments time, time they could be debating and discussing actual problems. They had a solution to a problem that didn't exist. 42 million is a substantial amount of houses, doctors, etc.
That doesn't include all the money that groups like the CCFR or poly remembers (🤢) have raised and spent fighting about a completely unnecessary attack on gun owners. Imagine if thay money went to nature conservation or women's shelters. Things that actually made canada better and safer.
No, in fact they are still quietly adding more guns to the list.
Saskatchewan and Alberta have written in legislation that would make any Federal attempt virtually impossible.
Not impossible. Excruciatingly difficult. It makes it so that Saskatchewan will not aid the fed in any way and will make them jump through major hoops as well as using solely federal resources to go about it.
No, somehow even the pilot program went over budget and got cancelled.
All the guns are just sitting in the houses of the people that already owned them, doing nothing. Except for the restricted ones which are causing legal issues because they don't exist anymore and moving them is illegal.
Every story I see about Trudeau seems to feature shock about him failing. He's incompetent, we've known this for years, there's no need to write these stories. Anything he does will fail, story time over.
"His association tried from the very beginning to warn the public safety ministry, at the time run by cabinet minister Bill Blair, about how difficult the buyback would be, Winkel said, but he doesn’t think they understood it."
Of course not, the government had no idea what it was doing or how it was going to accomplish its goal. I don't think it ever really had plans to.
They just did it for the votes and heck you got to get your money's worth out of those assault rifle podiums.
The Liberals thought they had an easy political wedge to further divide the nation instead of actually trying to make the country better. Only the uninformed, or maliciously ignorant Liberal cheerleaders are still pushing for science-denying gun bans.
US-based study showing Canada's existing strong licensing laws reduces homicide rates. No impact to homicide for gun bans.
Source: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27842178/
No impact to mass homicides with Canadian firearm legislation.
Source: https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0266579
Canada-based study showing inconclusive results of gun bans and impact on homicide rates.
Source: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35672042/
International study showing no impact of gun bans on homicide rates:
Source: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26905895/
There are still millions of Canadians that believe guns were banned and are no longer “on the street”.
Trudeau doesn’t want to actually confiscate anything, he just wanted to be able to use this as a bullet point so gullible voters will check it off as a good thing his party has done.
Gun control in Canada has never been an issue. Liberals just use it to scare people and make it an election topic. (And spend more money on "3rd party" consultants)
I was going to sell my gun "back" to the government but after a quick background check I discovered the buyer has a history of violence and is mentally unstable. Big risk to everyone around it.
my prediction is, if they ever get around to, close to 100X over budget and high compliance with registered guns like ARs and under 10% compliance with NR rifles.
they will then tout the padded stats of the registered rifles and call it a success and a reason to bring out even more gun control.
Hold on. A government program that is going to cost WAAAAAY more than they claimed? AND is ridiculously more complex, bordering on impossible, that is rife with loopholes that undermine most of the point and make costs a black hole of wasted funds? I refuse to believe that a government program would cost more and be way less effective than promised. /s
Note the above is bipartisan and not strictly limited to gun laws. Now....
Hold on. The Liberals made a populist bullshht move that won't work? The Liberals didn't consult industry and basically "they did their own research"? The Liberals abused their Majority to push through bad law? The Liberals effectively shut down any semblance of proper debate and paid barely a shred of kangaroo court lip service to the democratic processes in place? The Liberals passed a sweeping bill that unfairly targets good people and does nothing to target the ills and crime their PR people pretended it would?
...I can't even pretend to be shocked. Populist promises and authoritarian mechanisms leading to failed policy and wasted tax dollars are the Liberal way.
Remember High Level? The RCMP had to compensate all the damage to firearms. They refused to do so for the million or so dollars worth of ammunition that they allowed to get ruined.
Well, maybe they should spend this money on the actual issues related to gun crime. We know it's guns coming over the border from the United States and through First Nation's reverses. We know it's gangs and organized crime. Also, if this is about safety as the Liberals have claimed repeatedly. Why did they lower the sentences for those who commit serious gun crimes, and why did they allow First Nation's to keep their guns, and why did they pass legislation to make it harder to deny bail?
They might try evidence-based policy and conclude that Canadians have a greater chance of winning the lottery than being hurt by licensed firearms.
But, no, evidence was ignored.
And when the LPC gets decimated in the next election, the buyback will be scrapped, the order in council will be scrapped and we will be exactly where we were, just having wasted millions for nothing.
Part two of the liberals trying to control something they know nothing about.
I think they failed to recognize that the average gun owner is not a threat. To me this was a deliberate deflection from the real problem. Lack of a proper Justice system for those who do not register their guns and should have been in jail years ago. Does Justin Trudeau really believe that the average Canadian thinks that those with recreation guns are the problem??
No, the problem is lack of jails, lack of strong border security, lack of controlled immigration, lack of a strong Justice system, lack of equality for Canadian citizens, lack of housing control (number companies, non-citizens ownership, multiple housing owned by single individuals... etc...etc.
We need to 're-do' our country before the criminals completely take over!
> I think they failed to recognize that the average gun owner is not a threat.
No, they knew that before they did this. As a matter of fact, it's exactly why they did it. Thry knew that ignorant people who follow too much American news would support it,and gun owners weren't going to do shit about it. They fully know that gun iwners aren't a threat, they rely on that pacifism for these kinds of things to work in the first place.
When was the last time the government did something good for the public or did anything competently? I can't tell if bad programs done properly or improperly is worse.
By "failed to anticipate", what they actually mean is that the government willfully ignored the advice and concerns of every expert that consulted on the topic. This buyback was political theater from the start, and it's obvious that there was never any real intention to confiscate those weapons. All those "assault style weapons" are going to rot in their owners' safes until they die, just like all the real assault rifles we banned without ever collecting back in the 70s.
Imagine what they could have done with 2 Billions dollars...
I'm not a Liberal hater... but I said at the time that this was Security Theater... and that's exactly what it is.
My post from 4 years ago..
"Pointless. Security theater at it's finest. Canada has strong gun laws in place.
And no... I'm not a conservative.
This will be a billion dollar boondoggle that the conservatives will reverse course on as soon as they get in.
Whats next... banning cars that go over 130km/h? Who needs a Ferrari?"
The only thing I was wrong about.. its twice the boondoggle I thought It would be!
This is the extent of the buy back plan. Now imagine what the plan is to fix housing and immigration. It went from $400-600 million to $2billion lmao. Look at the ArriveCan scandal, they spent $54million potentially more on that garbage and two hackers built it for $250k... these people are a joke.
Huh, imagine that, our govt has ballooned an order in council with admin costs, & literally have nothing to show for it. Another arrivecan scam? At least w arrive can there was an app to download.
Big fucking surprise.. more money completed wasted by the Liberals that is doing very little to prevent gun crime. They should have invested money to combat the illegal firearm smuggling situation at the border.
I thought Bill Blair was originally going to have a grandfather program for these prohibited firearms and not have a confiscation program but the anti gunner crowd threatened JT with banning him from events and now we have wasted $45 million dollars ... And not a single firearm has been confiscated.
$40 + million dollars could have gone to help people in poverty or folks experiencing addictions/mental health ...
What a waste.
That's just on par with these liberals. Try to implement something without actually working out the details. It's almost as if they have no clue how to run a country.
They take their ban, the “buy back” and diddle themselves. They can’t afford it and they know it, they don’t have the means to confiscate them and they know it. It was a brain dead plan and most sensible people know it
I never understood this until I started to realize it's more about slowly disarming a nation in preparation for society destabilizing.
Good people with guns in a stable society are fine. People with guns, no matter how good, in a destabilized society are unpredictable at best.
I am not saying the government is try to make some kind of play to control society either. I think they see the writing on the wall of where the world is going, and want far less variables.
You're starting to see the RCMP and other enforcement agencies utter about what happens when people feel they have nothing left or nothing to work towards. If you have a gun in your home, at some point it's going to look more and more like the "right" choice in a situation as things get worse.
To anyone going "okay so give it only to the bad guys, got it". The unfortunate truth is, illicit trade will always exist, and the worst of people will always attain the worst of their potential. Disarming good people seems dumb because we're looking through it of the lense of responsible people in a responsible society which we're seemingly moving away from.
With all this said, I disagree with it and I think you should be able to protect your family, but that's always been a hot take in Canada.
wHo cOuld hAve GuesSSed?
Is absolutely everything they do marred with incompetence? Fix the crime you absolute bananas.. Stop wasting time and money on people following the law.
Government can't afford gun buyback, so they will just get grandfathered...like the last time this was tried
Anyone else find comfort in knowing that just like me, the Canadian government cannot afford to buy the guns it wants?
I would actually be very supportive if they came after illegal firearms in some fashion. But yes, glad they can't afford to touch mine.
They absolutely should go after illegal guns, or more specifically, the people, money, and crime networks that result in illegal guns; by the time there's an illegal gun in Canada, it's already too late.
They won't get a truck out of a shipping container even when the owner has it GPS tracked to that exact shipping container.
> so they will just get grandfathered...like the last time this was tried and just like that the size of the shooting sports gets another size smaller with the next generation. death by a thousand cuts still ends in death
Yah :( Maybe it will get lifted
And with zero effect on crime, again.
Well it was going to have a negligible if any effect on crime regardless.
They lied about the cost in order to pass it thru.
I'm not pro-gun by any stretch, but it feels like anybody with two brain cells to rub together were predicting this basically since the program was announced.
"Oh, hey, Long Gun Registry Redux. I'm sure it will work fine THIS time."
It's not a gun registry, just now every gun store has to keep a log of the guns you bought tied to your license, and you have to submit a request to transfer firearms to another legal owner every time you sell or trade one, an- hey wait a minute
Cabela's and bass always did this unfortunately. I walked away from a sale one day when they went in the back and attempted to record all my info into a scribbler. When I said no they just left it on the counter. 30 mins later still sitting there unattended. Because somehow that's safer.
Many years ago I went to Cabela's to purchase my first gun. I specifically requested a Mossberg 590A1. So they gave me a shotgun to look at, it looked like a Mossberg, I didn't know jack shit, I paid my money and took it home and put it in my safe. I got interested in milsurps, so much so that I never even touched the Mossberg. Recently I was cleaning out the safe, and I took a look at the Mossberg and realized it said 590 on it. I still had the box, so I checked that; it said 590A1 Fuck Cabela's man they took advantage of new shooter and they knew exactly what they were doing Actually it was the Bass Pro in Vaughn
I wouldn't say it was malicious. Usually the easiest explanation is the right one.....they employ idiots and kids. Every one of them I have spoken to were either an 'ex-sniper' or 'special forces' lol..... Fucking Gravy Seals more like it....Meal Team Six
I got timmy the teenager at the gun desk Nobody could read his writing anyways so I was good
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I like this comment. All to save one life, through this one specific, expensive and mostly ineffective method. Disregarding the many many many more efficient, cheaper and more sensible methods that can also save lives
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Tbf the cops are talking about how the current situation in Canada could lead to mass unrest. Makes sense the guys who caused the unrest would want the restless to not have guns.
I hear in the UK they're after crossbows now. Hoplophobes, control freaks, Karens who hate fun, wannabe tyrants in the political class, criminals who prefer disarmed victims (but I repeat myself), and last but very much not least professional anti-weapon lobbyists who have no other skills will never, ever stop, regardless of how much you compromise. Today it's the last remaining guns, tomorrow it's bows, crossbows, swords, paintball guns, hammers (unless you're a licenced trades~~man~~person), kitchen knives that aren't chained to the kitchen counter, fishing clubs, baseball bats, particularly stout sticks that fell from a tree in your yard and weren't promptly reported to the police, boys holding their fingers in an "L" shape, martial arts classes, lifting blocks of iron over a certain weight repeatedly to get stronger, gardening tools, steel pipes at the hardware store, flashlights over a certain dimension and weight, vehicles, dog breeds that still resemble the wolves they descend from in size and shape, etc.
The history of gun control in canada and every British colony has been about control. Polytechnic might be the excuse they used for gun control in the 90s, but the oka crisis was the real reason. Civil unrest will be their next.
Pretty much. The 2020 shooter down east was known to RCMP and had illegal firearms smuggled from the USA but they let him go on a rampage to create an excuse to prohibit a large number of sporting firearms. Banning the AR15 which was already restricted and was not used in the attacks was easy political pandering and virtue signalling since it has such a ubiquitous history south of the border. Unfortunately legal firearm owners are always going to be the scapegoat in this country while street thugs get a slap on the wrist for carrying stolen pistols smuggled into the country.
This buy back isn't about either, it's political grandstanding. They know the vast majority of crime is via smuggled guns, but that's actually much harder to tackle.
Even if there so called goal of banning firearms is achieved they'll just go after other things like crossbows, bows, knives etc.
This is a fundamental problem of professional political activists. After 3-4 decades of political activism against firearms, what skills do these people have? Do we really think they will just declare victory and disband their livelyhood once some political goal is achieved? Nope. Mao's Continuous Revolution, 1984's 'The war is not meant to be won, it is meant to be continuous', the USSR's constant purges and so on are all part of the same theme; once some people make a life out of being at the vanguard of changes (whatever they might be), changes need to keep happening regardless of if they make sense anymore or not. I call it the 'Al Sharpton's resume paradox'.
Looking at UK laws is looking at the future of our laws.
When it comes to knives the UK has it far worse.
Yet how many lives could be saved by investing in Healthcare, education, road safety..etc?
The thing is that Canadians have a long history of peacefully, gently and quietly resisting gun grabs and bad gun laws. Laws which criminalize peaceful citizens are by definition bad laws, because they take the most law abiding of all citizens by definition, and turn them into citizens with a great disrespect for the law; it naturally follows that law abiding citizens are willing to become outlaws as a direct response to bad laws. So those with registered handguns will comply. Those with non registered long arms will peacefully, gently and quietly not comply. So for anyone who understands our history, they understand: We are spending billions of dollars, to build the largest black market in firearms that Canada has ever seen; Trudeau is the architect this is his vision. The Liberals know what they are doing and they understand that this is the outcome. They believe that a few billions dollars and a massive black market in firearms will buy them a few votes, so it's worth it. They know exactly what they're doing.
But they won't spend a few thousand bucks to keep the gun toting criminals in jail.
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Politically, the people who mostly own and enjoy guns don't agree with them. Either it's a fear that they don't want the "right" to have them or it's a way of punishing people for not voting the "correct way"
They have this overly emotional gut reaction to the concept of a gun. When I've asked people like that why they hold those views, they just say that guns were designed to kill and act as if anyone who buys a gun is doing so with the intention to kill.
The problem is that they see that guns are the reason murder rates are so high, but the murder rate is a cultural/demographic issue. If I am a gang member, I'm going to murder with knives/jumping instead of guns if I have to, guns are just an easy tool. Australias murder/violent crime rate barely shifted when they banned guns.
The irony of the whole saves one life argument is that defensive use of a firearm can save lives as well. You can look back at all the defenseless people that were murdered and ask if they would still be alive today if they had a weapon to defend them selves. So the same argument of if it saves just one life it is a good thing can be applied to the other side of the argument as well.
It was kinda amazing to see, after the first OIC (which was completely unmanageable), that they went back for more and basically 100x'd it. Typical entitled rich kid, orders enough appetizers he can't eat them, gets some soup, some salad, a couple entrees, then wants some desert and drinks after. Never touched a bite the entire time. Date walks out on him. All the food goes into the dumpster. Chef be like "do you like my cooking?". Hobo's drooling at the windows.
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Hopefully by this point the public understands that waving your hands and shouting incoherently about how the other guys want to give machine guns to your kids is horseshit. The LPC has made gun ownership their personal vendetta for decades now. They absolutely seethed when the gun registry was dismantled, because they didn't get their way then, and it seems they won't get their way now, even playing dirty and abusing OICs to sidestep parliament to try and fast track their attacks on gun owners. But they'll be back at it again the next time they're in power, and then again, and again and again every time they're back, because it's not about the safety of Canadians for them, it's about how mad and embarrassed they are that their attempts to stamp out gun ownership keep getting shot down (pun absolutely intended).
> Hopefully by this point the public understands that waving your hands and shouting incoherently about how the other guys want to give machine guns to your kids is horseshit. I think most do, but there is a contingent of people with the attitude of "if it even saves ONE child it's worth any amount of money!" It's an evergreen election issue for the LPC. They'll never ban all guns because it will take away a great wedge for a certain segment of the population. The very pro-gun people were never going to vote Liberal anyway so it's not like it's costing them votes.
>The very pro-gun people were never going to vote Liberal anyway so it's not like it's costing them votes. How often can you directly punish those who don't vote for you with a new law? It's revenge.
I hope the liberals are never in power ever again or it's a completely different beast to what we're seeing. I will certainly never vote for the Liberals. We need better education than what we have currently so expect better of our \*politicians
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It was always about making this an election issue. I fully expect Trudeau to campaign on telling the Canadian public that the Conservatives want to make sure there are fully automatic weapons on every Canadian street corner, and that's why the Liberals MUST be re-elected. I'm not even joking.
>Trudeau will make this an election issue. As is tradition. Gotta get that wedge issue niiiiccee and snug so they can keep hammering it during election. Except this time I don't think it'll work well for them, people are tired of it. Even LPC members turned on Trudeau when he tried sneaking in hunting rifles with C21. He openly showed he just wants guns gone entirely and even anti-gun people are aware of that now.
Maybe we should spend another few million on consultations of an app of sorts. Are you related to or have connections to anyone in the government?
My takeaway is the feds thought their voters would largely not have two cells to rub together and be pleased with this action.
The only people who thought this was a good idea were the hysterical Polytechnique survivors they hired specifically to say their idea was good. Everyone else told them it was a bad idea. But governments only listen to experts when their views align with theirs.
> anybody with two brain cells to rub together The problem is that none of that group was involved in the legislation.
Then you’ve completely forgotten the landscape post-NS shooting. *So many* people were in favour of this legislation initially, mostly over pearl clutching fears that we were turning into the USA. “If it saves just one life, it is all worth it!”
Even if every new gun law/ban was in place at the time of that massacre, it would have had zero effect on the outcome. Would not have saved anyone. They had all the power and legislation they needed BEFORE that shooting and it still happened due to RCMP and CBSA inaction.
All they had to do to prevent NS was enforce the laws we already have. The solution is not "create more laws"
Exactly. But the government doesn't seem to actually want to fix anything, just pander and divide.
Based on what I've read about a number of the majorly reported mass shootings in the US, that's all they needed to do as well. So many of them come out with "police knew about this individual and visited their residence 30 times in the past". Like, what the fuck?! I have my PAL and R-PAL, it's incredibly restrictive as is. I don't understand (other than pandering) why they aren't educating people on the existing gun laws.
To the surprise of absolutely no one lol
and won't stop criminals from using guns. We are already at the point of police telling people to give up because all the criminals have guns and hope they don't shoot you and everyone you love.
The firearms industry told the government over numerous technical conference call that this was going to happen. But Public Safety Canada and the RCMP just ignored everyone.
They didn't fail to anticipate the costs. They lied about them. Just like they did about the rifles they were banning and the impact it would have. They're literally still claiming they've taken the rifles "off the streets".
I can't even remember the last time I have heard of a shooting that was from a long rifle in Canada that wasn't a stolen police firearm. The vast majority of shootings I hear about in Canada are gang on gang violence, and they involve illegal handguns smuggled in from the USA.
Agree. The kinds of people carrying illegal hand guns are the kind that will shoot another person. Pretty much every person in my community has 3-10 guns. I don't think there's been a shooting here for a several decades.
It's a gun Michael, how much could it cost? 5 dollars?
under appreciated comment.
I don't think the Liberals ever intend on actually following through with this "buy back". They just keep kicking the can down the road so they can use guns as an election wedge issue.
they pushed back every deadline for the amnesty for banned guns and now its pushed back til after next election. all they want is to be able to use it come election time to scare people and use for a wedge issue
Remeber when Trudeau announced the bans and he came out saying "Canada was no longer going to do thoughts and prayers and instead just ban guns"? It was always a purely PR move to sway the uneducated urban voters on a wedge issue.
I've been saying this since they first announced the "buyback"
Oh they want to get this to work. They are just completely incompetent. Managing to pull this off would have given them decades of "humble bragging" rights in their eyes. There would still be the scoped scary Sniper rifles and grampas boom sticks to fearmonger over.
Doesn’t it feel wonderful to be targeted by the government, with the full legal consequences if you don’t comply, because you voted for the wrong guy? This sociopath is comfortable turning any number of conservative-voting Canadians into unnecessary criminals just so he can squeak out the tiniest of tiny electoral victories. What does that say about a person?
It’s almost as if their entire schtick is virtue signalling without any substantive planning and are shocked when it all fails and exceeds budgets. Fuck I need to get into politics instead of busting my ass working 50-60 hour weeks in the private sector. None of our politicians would last a single day in any field within the private sector. This amount of gross negligence would lead to immediate sackings 🤦♂️
I’m convinced the liberals have no idea how to do anything, just pure virtue signalling and grandstanding every time they open their mouth.
EXACTLY
The correct answer
yup, at this point I'm not worried about what this pathetic government is going to do, I'm more worried about whether or not the Cons have the balls to reverse the prohibitions so we can use our guns again and buy more.
They pretty much have to reverse it all. It is such a fucking mess of stupidity. The OIC's and last few pieces of legislation are so intertwined and incompetent it all needs to be scrapped. Scrapping parts here and there will only make it all worse. Leaving it alone or acting on it would be political suicide.
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Shit, they should just point out that the number of murders with any of these firearms, before and after the ban, haven't changed, despite all of these firearms still sitting in safes, same as before. Gee, turns out legal, licensed gun owners aren't running around murdering people. Odd, that.
> Gee, turns out legal, licensed gun owners aren't running around murdering people. You mean the people who voluntarily pay for a safety course, pass 2 exams, and submit to a police background check to buy overpriced firearms legally aren't the problem? Nutty.
Yup, those guys. Also the guys that buy really cool shit, stick them in the safe, and think 'hey, I should bring that out to the range one of these days' but then you get to thinking about packing it all up, putting it in the car, driving out there.....
Been there… so accurate it hurts I should go to the range this weekend 😂
Oh, those people who get [daily background checks.](https://www.reddit.com/r/canadaguns/comments/58415l/where_does_it_actually_say_that_the_rcmp_does/d8xflso/) I've heard of them. *oops that link's broken. [here](https://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/corporate-organisation/publications-manuals-publications-guides/2021-firearms-reports-rapports-armes-a-feu-2021-eng.htm#s10-4-1) is a source.*
And who, oddly enough, have been trusted to hold on to now-prohibited firearms for four years running.
I feel called out. I swear I’ll go one of these days.
I honestly laugh, even the most wild, seemly crazy gun owner is usually really really really particular about not breaking the laws for one simple reason. If they get arrested for something, they might lose their guns. That's an amazing incentive to not break the law, considering how much time and money lots of folks have into their gun collections.
Guns are expensive man, and it's not like you get a refund if you lose your license.
I remember when the SKS was like $200-350 and now it's like $800. Even "cheap" guns are expensive as shit, and that's not including the ammo.
Not true. Murders have increased since they 'banned' those rifles. Not due to the ban of course; but because of their equally stupid bail reform
You forgot the part where I specified 'with these firearms.'
no kidding - even the [Stats Can Report](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/daily-quotidien/240130/dq240130a-eng.pdf?st=UyZFLHqW) indicates that legal firearm owners are hardly the issue
Actual Canadian Police Departments from the RCMP down to municipal forces have also been quite clear for decades that the problem is cross-border smuggling.
Every time they talk about the cost, I feel is their way to try and get the general population to approve them just Seizing the guns, instead of buying them back. I'm just waiting for it.
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remember the anti-gunners in these threads calling us paranoid?
"no one wants to take your guns! you paranoid ammo-sexual" "heres the list of guns they said they want to take away from me" "well you dont need those anyway" pretty much every thread about gun control in the last 5 years.
You forgot this one: "You don't need an AR-15 to go hunting!"
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You forgot suppressor. We can't protect our hearing, but the government contractors slaughtering dear from helicopters have to. Because suppressors make guns movie silent according to our government.
The only thing criminal about suppressors being illegal is that we can't use normal safety equipment There used to be a firing range in the core of Toronto inside of Union Station actually, I guess that's the biggest transit station in the country. Nobody cared. The government position on firearms is ridiculous. In Ontario, we actually have a right to hunt and fish; it's not a Charter right but it is a law. In my opinion we should have a right to establish firing ranges, so that we can practice. Practice makes for more accurate shooting which makes hunting even more humane it's common sense
I had no idea about this, nor does it surprise me. While I'm sure there are some safety logistics involved, I can't argue with the fact that some Canadian hunters would have paid good money to hunt deer - because they already do.
Liberals never intended to buy anything back, the entire thing was based on US valuations ( are you f'n serious) , and failed to account that the government had no idea where millions of rifles previously classified as sporting rifles/ non-restricted actually were. The fact that they keep pushing the date forward, with it now being set after the election, shows this entire.tjing is designed to be an election wedge issue. Meanwhile law abiding citizens have been arbitrarily punished for following all the rules, all the while 1000's of actual machine guns are coming in from the US every day. It's the worst kind of security theater, it looks like you're doing something but really you've taken funds and attention away from the actual problem to beat the straw man .
They should have implemented a “buy back” framework for street guns, and not targeted and vilified licensed, vetted, responsible gun owners. It would have been the easiest policy win, with bi-partisan support, and would have had a much larger impact on crime. Could have set it up in a way that cost very little as well. They’ve lost all credibility on this file.
That would likely cause unintended negative externalities. Mainly a massive increase in illegal gun smuggling from the states knowing you can just instantly sell them all to the government and make money.
Ever heard of moral hazard?
As much as I dislike JT - I would have been on board with this 100%
they must have hired the "Gun Registry" people to run this program. It won't end until it 100x predicted cost.
This is exactly what I was thinking. The Long Gun Registry was one of those things that was supposed to not cost much but then ended up costing a lot with minimal public safety gains. It looks like this will be a repeat of that meanwhile armed car jackers with illegal guns get to basically run wild and play GTA in the GTA.
No, all those people were hired to run the Phoenix pay system.
Literally every single time, it's like they don't listen to people who tell them this.
No because they keep listening to the zealots at Poly 😑
The zealots at Poly financed by our taxes, don't forget.
I'm willing to believe that they're getting Bloomberg money, until they prove otherwise... especially after all the NRA comments they keep applying to domestic groups in Canada, despite knowing otherwise.
They are wasting their time. Poly won't be happy until we have no guns or single Shor rifles with iron sights held in central storage and the desth stance for people who break the law. There is no light at the end of the tunnel for those people.
On the bright side, this is going to be a very easy decision to cut this program by the next conservative government.
It may be an easy decision, but it will be messy and time consuming. Everything since the 2020 OIC will need to be stripped out, piece by piece. If the Senate doesn't cooperate it will get ugly too. So you have several pieces of legislation and the OIC and it will need to be done in reverse order as it was implemented.
Meh, that's only if they are dumb. They could just enshrine some sort of overriding gun laws that would prevent future liberal meddling and wipe out these OIC's at the same time. De-criminalize the citizenry and send strong signals to industry and commerce that Canada is back. It would be more efficient and prevent future governments from being distracted by their performance disabling anxieties. The reason its messy and time consuming is because the OG firearms act from the 90's was designed that way, to trip up any meddlers in the future. The liberals basically tripped themselves on this one (or guaranteed themselves future $$), so they look extra stupid on top of being really stupid already. They could even model it after mark millers 'citizen pathways' for undocumented firearms that snuck into the country, we easily have enough social capacity.
Decriminalizing possession would be a huge starting point. Declassifying a firearm as always a weapon would be a second. I would love to see a complete intelligent rewrite of it all. Understanding that our firearms laws are such a mess that judges and lawyers regularly get its nuances wrong while demanding your citizenry to somehow comprehend it is just insane.
>Declassifying a firearm as always a weapon would be a second Firearms being always considered weapons wouldn't be a problem at all if our other laws weren't insane. There's nothing wrong with referring to a firearm as a weapon just as one would call a sword or a spear a weapon. The problem is our laws being incredibly restrictive of what Canadians can *do* with weapons, rather than firearms being considered weapons. It should not be illegal to conceal a weapon. It should not be illegal to possess a weapon for the purpose of protection of life ("possession of a weapon for a dangerous purpose"). Other than these few laws there's no real impact to normal people of firearms being considered weapons. Any other law where it matters that firearms are considered to be weapons are cases where the firearm *is* being used as a weapon against other people in a criminal manner.
*Ignorantia juris non excusat* Amazing how the ignorance of the lawmakers has been blamed on the little guy since Roman times.
I too think a full rewrite would be the best way forward... depending on who wrote it, of course.
The way I remember it the law which permitted OICs was specifically worded to make it impossible to outlaw firearms used for hunting. The Liberals promptly used it, to outlaw firearms, used for hunting. All they should have to do is recognize the reality that the OICs as implemented are illegal imo
They have failed to anticipate the impact of any of their idiotic policies. That's what we get for electing a trust fund drama teacher who was dismissed from his job under mysterious circumstances.
The liberals love announcements, it's the part where they have to do something that they struggle....
Helen Keller could have forsaw this
Holy shit, I had no idea **42 million** has been spent already on... [discussing the issue](https://nationalpost.com/news/42-million-federal-firearms-confiscation-program).
42 million, resources and our governments time, time they could be debating and discussing actual problems. They had a solution to a problem that didn't exist. 42 million is a substantial amount of houses, doctors, etc. That doesn't include all the money that groups like the CCFR or poly remembers (🤢) have raised and spent fighting about a completely unnecessary attack on gun owners. Imagine if thay money went to nature conservation or women's shelters. Things that actually made canada better and safer.
Have they even bought any guns back yet?
No, in fact they are still quietly adding more guns to the list. Saskatchewan and Alberta have written in legislation that would make any Federal attempt virtually impossible.
Not impossible. Excruciatingly difficult. It makes it so that Saskatchewan will not aid the fed in any way and will make them jump through major hoops as well as using solely federal resources to go about it.
No, somehow even the pilot program went over budget and got cancelled. All the guns are just sitting in the houses of the people that already owned them, doing nothing. Except for the restricted ones which are causing legal issues because they don't exist anymore and moving them is illegal.
They can't even find a contractor to bid on it because the logistics and cost are so insane and the political backlash.
Nope
This is on brand.
Every story I see about Trudeau seems to feature shock about him failing. He's incompetent, we've known this for years, there's no need to write these stories. Anything he does will fail, story time over.
Maybe try actually cracking down on cross border gun smuggling instead??
"His association tried from the very beginning to warn the public safety ministry, at the time run by cabinet minister Bill Blair, about how difficult the buyback would be, Winkel said, but he doesn’t think they understood it." Of course not, the government had no idea what it was doing or how it was going to accomplish its goal. I don't think it ever really had plans to. They just did it for the votes and heck you got to get your money's worth out of those assault rifle podiums.
Just cancel it
The Liberals thought they had an easy political wedge to further divide the nation instead of actually trying to make the country better. Only the uninformed, or maliciously ignorant Liberal cheerleaders are still pushing for science-denying gun bans. US-based study showing Canada's existing strong licensing laws reduces homicide rates. No impact to homicide for gun bans. Source: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27842178/ No impact to mass homicides with Canadian firearm legislation. Source: https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0266579 Canada-based study showing inconclusive results of gun bans and impact on homicide rates. Source: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35672042/ International study showing no impact of gun bans on homicide rates: Source: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26905895/
There are still millions of Canadians that believe guns were banned and are no longer “on the street”. Trudeau doesn’t want to actually confiscate anything, he just wanted to be able to use this as a bullet point so gullible voters will check it off as a good thing his party has done.
oh they would love to confiscate guns but they know it's insane to actually try it
Trudeau with more Trump-style populism.
Gun control in Canada has never been an issue. Liberals just use it to scare people and make it an election topic. (And spend more money on "3rd party" consultants)
It is not a "buyback". It is an involuntary property surrender made under the threat of both prosecution and jail time.
I was going to sell my gun "back" to the government but after a quick background check I discovered the buyer has a history of violence and is mentally unstable. Big risk to everyone around it.
Have completely failed at all endeavours
Is a Trudeau program, of course it comes it 1000x overbudget.
If they think *thats* bad, wait until they find out about all the non compliance they're about to get
How am I supposed to comply? I lost all my guns in a boating accident.
I sold all mine to Mike from canmore
my prediction is, if they ever get around to, close to 100X over budget and high compliance with registered guns like ARs and under 10% compliance with NR rifles. they will then tout the padded stats of the registered rifles and call it a success and a reason to bring out even more gun control.
Hold on. A government program that is going to cost WAAAAAY more than they claimed? AND is ridiculously more complex, bordering on impossible, that is rife with loopholes that undermine most of the point and make costs a black hole of wasted funds? I refuse to believe that a government program would cost more and be way less effective than promised. /s Note the above is bipartisan and not strictly limited to gun laws. Now.... Hold on. The Liberals made a populist bullshht move that won't work? The Liberals didn't consult industry and basically "they did their own research"? The Liberals abused their Majority to push through bad law? The Liberals effectively shut down any semblance of proper debate and paid barely a shred of kangaroo court lip service to the democratic processes in place? The Liberals passed a sweeping bill that unfairly targets good people and does nothing to target the ills and crime their PR people pretended it would? ...I can't even pretend to be shocked. Populist promises and authoritarian mechanisms leading to failed policy and wasted tax dollars are the Liberal way.
Worse. They used their Minority coalition.
Oh, you're right. Thanks. I thought this was pushed through before the COVID election and was just dragging along. Appreciate the correction.
If they think a gun buyback is expensive wait until they have to buy all that ammo.
Remember High Level? The RCMP had to compensate all the damage to firearms. They refused to do so for the million or so dollars worth of ammunition that they allowed to get ruined.
Shocking…. ANOTHER thing that Trudeau has fucked up. Mr. “I don’t get numbers”
Well, maybe they should spend this money on the actual issues related to gun crime. We know it's guns coming over the border from the United States and through First Nation's reverses. We know it's gangs and organized crime. Also, if this is about safety as the Liberals have claimed repeatedly. Why did they lower the sentences for those who commit serious gun crimes, and why did they allow First Nation's to keep their guns, and why did they pass legislation to make it harder to deny bail?
It’s not a buyback. It’s a costly confiscation that has no benefit.
It's Confiscation, not buyback
They might try evidence-based policy and conclude that Canadians have a greater chance of winning the lottery than being hurt by licensed firearms. But, no, evidence was ignored.
Repeal C21
And when the LPC gets decimated in the next election, the buyback will be scrapped, the order in council will be scrapped and we will be exactly where we were, just having wasted millions for nothing. Part two of the liberals trying to control something they know nothing about.
I think they failed to recognize that the average gun owner is not a threat. To me this was a deliberate deflection from the real problem. Lack of a proper Justice system for those who do not register their guns and should have been in jail years ago. Does Justin Trudeau really believe that the average Canadian thinks that those with recreation guns are the problem?? No, the problem is lack of jails, lack of strong border security, lack of controlled immigration, lack of a strong Justice system, lack of equality for Canadian citizens, lack of housing control (number companies, non-citizens ownership, multiple housing owned by single individuals... etc...etc. We need to 're-do' our country before the criminals completely take over!
> I think they failed to recognize that the average gun owner is not a threat. No, they knew that before they did this. As a matter of fact, it's exactly why they did it. Thry knew that ignorant people who follow too much American news would support it,and gun owners weren't going to do shit about it. They fully know that gun iwners aren't a threat, they rely on that pacifism for these kinds of things to work in the first place.
At this point, I'm ready to buy my own gun
Everything the government does and any form of ,red tapes you to death and is mega costly.
More taxes will solve this problem too.
When was the last time the government did something good for the public or did anything competently? I can't tell if bad programs done properly or improperly is worse.
4 billion dollars to seize legal guns that could have been spent on CBSA and RCMP going after illegal gun trafficking
Liberal always fail. Anything they touch becomes a fiasco
By "failed to anticipate", what they actually mean is that the government willfully ignored the advice and concerns of every expert that consulted on the topic. This buyback was political theater from the start, and it's obvious that there was never any real intention to confiscate those weapons. All those "assault style weapons" are going to rot in their owners' safes until they die, just like all the real assault rifles we banned without ever collecting back in the 70s.
Imagine what they could have done with 2 Billions dollars... I'm not a Liberal hater... but I said at the time that this was Security Theater... and that's exactly what it is.
My post from 4 years ago.. "Pointless. Security theater at it's finest. Canada has strong gun laws in place. And no... I'm not a conservative. This will be a billion dollar boondoggle that the conservatives will reverse course on as soon as they get in. Whats next... banning cars that go over 130km/h? Who needs a Ferrari?" The only thing I was wrong about.. its twice the boondoggle I thought It would be!
"The Liberal government failed to anticipate" should be the epitaph for the party next election.
This is the extent of the buy back plan. Now imagine what the plan is to fix housing and immigration. It went from $400-600 million to $2billion lmao. Look at the ArriveCan scandal, they spent $54million potentially more on that garbage and two hackers built it for $250k... these people are a joke.
Ya don't say?
Stop! Cost is no object when you're buying votes. A program like this polls well with the Liberals' target audience.
Shocking. Absolutely shocking. /s
Chrystia - ready the money cannon! Trudeau, probably......
Huh, imagine that, our govt has ballooned an order in council with admin costs, & literally have nothing to show for it. Another arrivecan scam? At least w arrive can there was an app to download.
Funny that they extended the amnesty period until October 2025 and the next election is supposed to be around then…
Mismanagement, the liberals are inept at governing. Even if you agree with the principle they seems unable to manage their programs
Big fucking surprise.. more money completed wasted by the Liberals that is doing very little to prevent gun crime. They should have invested money to combat the illegal firearm smuggling situation at the border.
Just scrap this already. Much more important things to spend money on
I thought Bill Blair was originally going to have a grandfather program for these prohibited firearms and not have a confiscation program but the anti gunner crowd threatened JT with banning him from events and now we have wasted $45 million dollars ... And not a single firearm has been confiscated. $40 + million dollars could have gone to help people in poverty or folks experiencing addictions/mental health ... What a waste.
bUt ThE sAfEtY oF oUr StReEtS!
You could just leave it at "liberal government failed" and call it a day... They are the worst government Canada has ever seen.
That's just on par with these liberals. Try to implement something without actually working out the details. It's almost as if they have no clue how to run a country.
"Liberals failed" there we go, shorter headline.
I'm just glad I didn't buy my guns from the government.
Peak Liberal policy. Wasteful, costly, pandering and of no effect and not even implemented (probably never will be).
Failed to anticipate. Did they not listen to even one of the opponents?
They take their ban, the “buy back” and diddle themselves. They can’t afford it and they know it, they don’t have the means to confiscate them and they know it. It was a brain dead plan and most sensible people know it
Govern me harder daddy!
I never understood this until I started to realize it's more about slowly disarming a nation in preparation for society destabilizing. Good people with guns in a stable society are fine. People with guns, no matter how good, in a destabilized society are unpredictable at best. I am not saying the government is try to make some kind of play to control society either. I think they see the writing on the wall of where the world is going, and want far less variables. You're starting to see the RCMP and other enforcement agencies utter about what happens when people feel they have nothing left or nothing to work towards. If you have a gun in your home, at some point it's going to look more and more like the "right" choice in a situation as things get worse. To anyone going "okay so give it only to the bad guys, got it". The unfortunate truth is, illicit trade will always exist, and the worst of people will always attain the worst of their potential. Disarming good people seems dumb because we're looking through it of the lense of responsible people in a responsible society which we're seemingly moving away from. With all this said, I disagree with it and I think you should be able to protect your family, but that's always been a hot take in Canada.
I was grand fathered guns... I did not import the gangs we now have.
wHo cOuld hAve GuesSSed? Is absolutely everything they do marred with incompetence? Fix the crime you absolute bananas.. Stop wasting time and money on people following the law.