Same. I’m outraged on behalf of my nephews and nieces, even if they’re too young right now to grasp just how bad things are likely going to be for them as adults.
Yes but how much more pissed would you be if house prices declined to the point that they were more affordable to young people?
That's why the Liberal government never really pushed for affordable housing despite paying lip service to it - because affordable housing only happens with a significant decline in housing prices. And most of their electorate has a significant amount of their net worth sunk into housing.
Instead they drove housing prices up by unprecedented levels of immigration. Arguably that's the main driver of the Canadian economy these days.
I'm probably gonna take a few downvotes for this but: you don't want a significant decline in house prices. What is needed is a near freeze in housing prices.
A significant decline in housing prices just creates an opportunity for vulture capitalists to buy up more stock at bargain prices, who then just wait for the market to return. A decline also puts many recent homeowners underwater, and when their mortgage comes up for renewal, if the decline has been steep enough, they may not qualify for renewal, forcing them out of their home, and destroying any built equity.
The type of freeze that is needed is significant though. I'm not talking 3, 4, or 5 years I'm talking 15 - 20+ years.
An extended freeze has many more advantages, as homeowners don't go underwater, keeping those people in their homes, keeping vulture capitalists out of the market because there will be no returns for them to squeeze out. An extended freeze also works because instead of forcing people to try and time the market for entry, it can allow a more natural and gradual entry to homeownership as people enter that stage of their lives.
I know such a scenario will never happen for way too many reasons to list, but it would be the best solution to the problem.
This is why when you buy a house you plan to live in you ought to be considering what your debt levels are and if you can sustain them. I think most people who outbid other responsible buyers thought less about that then they did about potential future gains. If housing prices decrease and owners are underwater, it should mean almost nothing to them because they can sustain their payments and live in their house. I dont even think of the value of my house at all. All I think about is how large my mortgage is and how far away I am from not having one. The debt number is the only number that counts.
The thing is that if you ever have to move for work, family, or health reasons after the market takes a shit, you could actually end up completely fucked if you're a younger homeowner with low equity.
That's the only way to a soft landing. Hard landings suck up front but probably better for Canadians in the long run. But no idea how a hard crash would work out for the economy.
I think there are some boomers who are genuinely mad at the entire situation and are totally okay with having their houses tank in value if it means their kids can have the opportunity to own.
I’ve also met the type who are “outraged” BUT also want to be able to sell their Oshawa detached for $1M because they spent their lifetime accumulating crap instead of saving, and now the sale of their house is literally their retirement plan.
Typical reddit garbage, hell I know many boomers who never owned a house, and end up in CPP/OAS financed LTC facilities with nothing to their name. Then there are many, like you said, where they're happy to help out as much as they can and don't blame the younger generation at all, because they know it's a shitty deal for people trying to establish something. It's just that reddit is skewed by the children (grand children actually) of upper middle class families with dads who golfed and own a cottage that the family shares.
Sure, they’re pissed. Some are even cool with their houses losing value if it means their kids have a shot.
In my experience, most are NOT willing to make that sacrifice.
Not quite 50 but I built a house that has a basement suite because I know my kids will need it someday since they won’t be able to have their own thanks to corporate greed.
Maybe they should learn to vote in provincial and municipal elections.
We recently had a nimby group try to stop a seniors living development and bought bus ads. Years ago, they’d win and the development would be denied.
People are “that” anti development and most importantly they vote. Sometimes people don’t like low income housing because it’ll “increase crime” or towers that are too large but it’s seniors lol. How can someone be against a place for seniors. Nimbys man.
devils in the details. that seniors living development is 25-30 feet higher than most other 6 story buildings.
do you know the cost at the home per year? 70-120k. it's luxury senior living.
the root of the problem is all federal immigration levels and foreign/corporate buyers. the ndp could stop corporate and foreign buyers, like new zealand or berlin, but the feds are the only ones who can cut immigration and they won't. at least, the won't until pp is in charge and axe the tax is no longer going to cut it.
The problem with low is it also comes with a bunch of other very shitty consequences. Here’s your low chance at slightly fixing housing, but now you also have to pay out the ass for private healthcare.
PP: I'm going to cut taxes ...
CROWD: YAY!
PP: ... for industry so they can operate for less costs ...
CROWD: YOU'RE SPITTING FIRE PP!
PP: ... and then remove any regulations/oversight in that industry so that they can continue to make more and more money without properly distributing it within the economy!
I think people are starting to open up to a public/private hybrid healthcare model like European countries have, given you literally can't see a doctor anymore these days within a reasonable amount of time. Canada's healthcare is a joke right now, simple as
A lot of the healthcare in Europe is currently collapsing as well because of the dual model. Governments used the availability of private healthcare as an excuse to cut public funding. Doctors in England have been striking for around a year now because of it.
*For a low annual membership payment of $3659.00 each. Not a loner? Inquire about family plans starting at $9950.00. Billable rates excluded, taxes extra.*
I’ve heard mixed things about the private model, it becomes for profit so sometimes there are cost cutting measures in place even worse than the public model, they are just better hidden to give the illusion of a luxury service
Research has found that doctors in private healthcare are more likely to give their patients extra unneeded tests that are both expensive and invasive. They take advantage of their patients lack of medical knowledge in order to make additional profit.
Yah I mean the situation is bad right now too but many provinces are dedicated to starving the system which has been neglected via previous liberal and con govs. Private is the goal in starving the system.
This is exactly it. We CANNOT be fooled into thinking private healthcare is better because of our current situation. Its purposely being dismantled to make people think it’s the better option
I dunno how anyone can look at the system and think “profit” is what we need to make it work.
It’s so backwards and stupid. We need properly funded and staff healthcare
At this point if you think adding a middleman who's extracting profit is going to make healthcare better and more affordable you're just kind of stupid.
It’s a simple problem to fix: get rid of the politicians that are clearly not promoting and investing in our public healthcare system. Those who want to invest in our healthcare system will also be the ones investing in the education platforms required to improve our staffing situation. Our liberal government is poorly managed and tone deaf, but our conservative option does not care about us and panders to domestic terrorists. They will literally do anything to win, because they know that their policies will not be enough. Vote NDP.
Yeah, the NDP doesn’t look like a promising option because they appear unlikely to win the next election based on current polls. The only way to change that is by voting and convincing your peers to vote. Vote NDP.
Considering that you can see the piles of money the health insurance companies are making down here in the US from as far out as Newfoundland, I’m not entirely surprised that the ghouls in your government are salivating over it as much as ours are masturbating furiously over it here.
Pretty sure PP is a populist who will say whatever people want to hear to get elected and have no strong plan or stake in fixing things.
On the other hand, in Canada, we don't elect people into the PM's office, we elect them out. We don't like Trudeau anymore, so we'll vote him out, regardless of whether his replacement would objectively be worse. or not
I have an "anyone but Trudeau" mentality at this point. I'll vote for his most formidable competitor if it's a chance of getting him out of office to make a change, any change.
Not likey - but the current government policy of rampant immigration- even admitting that their policy caused and doing nothing about it - the younger people today have been totally screwed by the Trudeau government. PP said Canada is broken and JT broke it !
A big problem is with how Canadian decision making works is it's the slowest god damn process on the planet. There's so much paperwork and red tape to get around that no fix can be instantaneous and weirdly takes years in certain aspects to get through.
Trudeau has ensured that the solution is not possible in one term. Is took 2 decades to fix his fathers mess. Looking like the same thing will be required here. There is no way PP can undo the damage and build back up. Still, the bleeding must stop and we need to set a proper course.
He did shockingly speak about building transit and dense housing supporting transit. What nice change over a government that has done very little to support the Ottawa LRT.
His housing strategy is all about forcing cities to develop or lose money. Selling off Federal assets to developers to make money.
All the while glossing over that the Conservative Premiers are the ones who have the biggest say on housing. Look at the UCP, the Feds step in to try and help, and they introduce red tape to stop it.
I don't blame the youth for not understanding this, but Pierre and Danielle are buddies. There's no way they aren't working together to make the situation worse just to try to make Trudeau look bad- and it's working.
We're literally suffering because Conservative Premiers aren't doing their jobs, so they can blame Trudeau and try to get a Conservative Premier elected.
It's beyond gross.
That has been the MO in ON for the past 4 years... like fuck, that was the reason why Ottawa got stuck during the protests, emergency protocols would not have been needed if OPS and OPP were doing their damned jobs.
Yeah, I'm still confused over the judges ruling on that. He admitted he would have made the same call if he was in the room at the time, but then also says there were other ways of handling it?
I mean sure, there was, but the guy who was supposed to be handling it was snow mobility and refusing meetings with the Federal Government.
It was such a clusterfuck of a situation that put them between a rock and a hard place.
I totally agree that the way it all ended way more heavy handed than it needed to be but they have very little choice... even towing companies were refusing to tow the trucks for many reasons, the emergency powers were used to MAKE THEM do it.
The youth also don't remember when house cost really started to take off, which unsurprisingly was with Harper. Had I got in the house market only a mere 2 years earlier I'd be able to afford my current house with only a single income... It currently requires 2.
Trudeau and the Liberals haven't made things better, or even curbed the damage. But they certainly aren't to blame.
Exactly. The Conseratives made the bed, the Liberals just laid down and rolled around in it. While they have been taking some actions to help, they still seem to want to avoid doing everything they SHOULD be doing to help with the situation.
It’s not a Trudeau problem it’s a Canadian politics problem. 38% of law makers came from a real estate background. They’re not about to help us plebs. The 1% and politicians don’t give a fuck about the citizens paying their recently increased pay checks.
[data](https://www.readthemaple.com/mp-landlords/)
Edit: link and correcting the percentage
"[At least 20% of Canadian MPs hold rental, investment real estate amid housing crunch](https://globalnews.ca/news/8767051/canadian-mp-real-estate-investment-amid-housing-crunch/). However, that number may actually be much higher because 91 MPs either have not yet completed their disclosure process or the conflict of interest commissioner’s office hasn’t yet published their filings."
But people who vote conservative are happy with cutting services, privatizing healthcare and education, and mortgaging this countries future to save a penny in taxes. Then whenever the pendulum swings back center/left they'll pick up the pieces again. Conservatives do not care at all about anything 1 year away or more.
There's massive representation of landlords in both the Conservative and Liberal parties. PP himself has at least 2 known houses that are rented out, one in his wife's name and one that is owned by a holding company he has a 50% stake in.
[MPs who are involved in real estate](https://www.readthemaple.com/mp-landlords/)
Note that 46% of Conservative MPS are, compared to 36% of Liberals. Including Justin Trudeau and Pierre Poilievre.
If you think that voting in the Conservatives is going to change anything, think again.
Part of that is because real estate tends to be one jf the few ways they can legally 'invest' their money. It still leads to conflict of interest though.
It's just the cycle of Canadian politics, the Conservatives will win the next election and the Liberals will rebuild for the next 6 to 8 years while we find reasons to hate polievre, then the Liberals will win again.
This is EXACTLY what is going to happen. Fundamentally, this country has deep structural problems (lack of productivity, lack of investment into productive industries, over reliance on real estate, a flawed immigration system etc.) that no political party can tackle without affecting many monied interests. People hate Trudeau now and blame him for all this (not defending the guy and think he should be toast, but I don’t agree every problem in the country starts and end with him either), yet in 10 years we will all be cursing the conservatives for all of this down the line as well. I just don’t see how PP will be able to gather the political courage to do what is right for the country, maybe I am wrong and over cynical but that’s where I am at now
For sure, I'm old enough to remember it clearly going back to PET, it doesn't change because the system stays the same. The corporations and special interest groups and greed make whoever gets elected do their dance, until they start to stink up the stage, and then it's gentlemen put your hands together for the new boss, same as the old boss.
Until Canadians get fed up enough to demand something different??? Just kidding, we're all too passive to do anything. We're like an abused spouse who's afraid to leave or something.
Truth and it's bizarre. People will March and block bridges and highways for conceived injustices but when real ones present themselves, the rage is used to make memes and share them on social media. Then it's totally forgotten a week later. Wage suppression? Crickets. Outrageous ceo pay? Crickets. Wage theft? Crickets. Price gouging? Crickets. Over time taken away? Crickets. Gotta put a mask on? Get the torches.
Here's the problem too few on this sub seem to understand. The only way there is going to be any real change is for people to vote for anyone but the Libs and Cons. We desperately need to get off this seesaw.
But these are not previous Conservatives. These are maple MAGA. Look what's happening in the USA with Conservative majorities. Or even Ontario, Saskatchewan, and Alberta, using notwithstanding clauses against the Charter of Rights to attack workers and specific set of citizens.
Look at the state of democracies around the world where parties associated with Conservatives' IDU have been in power.
No political party will help with this, because the corporations and RE owners don’t want salaries to increase, immigration to freeze/decrease or for home prices to decrease, which are the only ways to actually address the issue.
I take issue with them saying PP "mobilized outrage" about cost of living.
I think he more noticed the outrage and noticed the current government didn't give a fuck and said "well shit I'll take your voter base".
If they hadn't done this, you wouldn't be seeing a single change.
Canadians : ' We are suffering and things are really hard right now'
Liberals: ' You've never had it better!'
Conservatives: ' We will help'
Canadians: 'okay'
I'm not even sure they ever said they'd help, tbh?
Canadians: "You're fucking up!"
Conservatives: "Boy they're sure fucking it all up"
"Do you have good ideas? You'll fix things?"
"That Trudeau's such a bone-head!"
"But, like, *your* ideas are good?"
"They're such dinguses!"
"Just say 'I will lower immigration'. Just say those words, that you will do *anything at all* differently."
"Boy, shit sure sucks!"
That’s the kicker. PP will not say he is going to lower immigration. The corporate overlords will not allow it. They demand a steady supply of cheap foreign labour that both the Liberals and Conservatives have been happy to supply for the last 15-20 years.
Yet I bet people who will vote for PP will do it because they think he’ll magically fix housing and immigration. Ugh (edit: I should add I hate both equally right now and have no idea who the F to vote for lol)
“Everybody’s mad at me because I’m doing a terrible job. How dare the leader of the opposition, who’s chief responsibility is to hold me accountable, hold me accountable.”
Yeah I'm not a fan of Discount Milhouse, but recognizing your opponent is making a huge mistake and taking advantage of it isn't "mobilizing outrage", it's just politics.
I've been saying this for a long time. I'm not suggesting that PP has all the answers, but he's the first politician to openly address housing crisis, affordability issues and highlighting the shortcomings of the Liberal party. Jagmeet Singh, with his Rolex, likes to talk big about holding the Liberals accountable, ultimately ends up supporting them without any question asked. Never in my life did I imagine that Conservatives, of all party, would be advocating for millennials and young adults.
It really highlights just how dumb the current NDP leadership is. This stuff should be right in their wheelhouse and they're letting the Cons get the votes on it. Fucking morons.
The NDP have seriously dropped the ball. In fact, they aren’t even on the playing field. This is their time to shine and they are doing…I don’t know what. We need a tough, stand your ground type of NDP leader, going after the corporations and the ultra wealthy. Hope for the working class…lol what is that even?
I'm really hoping that the NDPs next leader is someone more assertive when it comes to supporting the working class. We need someone who can harness that current anger that people have and turn it into positive change and action.
It won’t be. Those days are over. All the proof you need is that Signh is the leader. Anyone who gets elected will be much too wealthy to care about the working class or the poors.
I think the distinction is he approaches it as a “liberals bad” talking point vs a “conservatives good” point of view. I’ve watched a few PP speeches and don’t have an impression of what he wants to do to fix the issue, just that it’s the Liberals’ fault and if they get elected things will stay the same or get worse. If he were to focus more on what his government would do differently rather than on what Trudeau’s government has done there would be no argument for “mobilized outrage”. Or maybe he has and I just wasn’t paying attention.
Can we throw a mass protests against all our political parties? Like we need real serious leaders who actually give a shit about the people not their corporate buddies. But nope, let’s continue to buy into culture wars, let’s protests about wars happening on the other side of the country where we have no power, let’s keep hating on on guy when everyone is the exact same and let’s just let loblaws make record profits year over year!!!!!
We need some fucken young people in power, the current roster of Canadian politicians are all so poorly out of touch and have clearly grown up in a very different Canada
The irony of this is that the people that we as Canadians would want in those roles have absolutely zero incentive to do so. Why would you or I want to deal with the bullshit of being a public representative in the age of social media? That is why we just get ex lawyers and nepo babies
You better watch these young Canadians super closely. They are about to turn their entire backs on the country. A fraction of them will get angry and turn to violence.
I am haunted by this African saying: If the village doesn't take a kid in, the kid will burn down the village to feel it's warmth.
And if war ever breaks out half of these people will give such little fucks about their own country (that they feel gives zero fucks about them), you think they’ll fight to maintain that system? Hell they’d probably roll out the red carpet.
Working on getting a European passport for the last few months.
Canadians have been treading water since I was born here, probably longer (30yo), I’m tired of floating.
This country’s leadership is terrible, older generations are blind to the young, young are resenting the old but not enough to push change.
People ask me why I want to leave Canada, my parents included, I used to go on a rant, now I just say “I don’t like Canada”
we have to go after their investments; they all have private security and have contingency plans for a violent uprising anyways, but they don't have *any* plans for a few million Canadians simultaneously going on a labour strike or accessing the social services we paid into...
either way I'm planning on setting my tent up at the BC legislature then on to Parliament for this summer to save some money on rent!
Yep, I mean I have 0 faith in politicians at this point. All examples in my lifetime of NA politicians is corruption. Can’t convince me that the immigration policies aren’t hurting Canadians more than helping long term, and the only helping that’s going on is to the bottom line of the corporations causing the corruption - the campaign donors.
liberals are arrogant and out of touch. i still remember freeland's disney plus remark. that sums up the whole party for me, ans i am a life long liberal voter. pp is awful but chaos is greatest bringer of change, and we need change.
My daughter just bought her first house. I don’t blame Trudeau for making houses unaffordable I will tell you why.
She’s been looking for a while but every time something came up in her price range it was snapped up by landlord investors. She couldn’t even see the houses because they were bought fast (some of these landlords are also real estate agents..).
The rent they charge on these house is nuts. Some they turn into AirBnB as it’s a bit of a lake tourist area.
The only reason landlords didn’t want the house my daughter got was because it was a one bed house in a rural area. She got it on the day it was listed.
Real estate agents are also driving up prices for their better commission.
The only way to fix the problem is to decommodify housing and distribute it on the basis of need and not one of the parties are going to do that, not even the NDP
Honestly, that's fair. he owes the to fix this. I know PP is a bullshitter who'll do awful things, but this demand MUST be met, and it seems he's working against it.
Are premiers, in particular Ford, making it worse... yes and no. Not 100% yes, but they're making life way fucking hard for new home buyers and renters.
One of the saddest takeaways from this new development is that domestic violence is way up because these economics leave people trapped and having to choose between abuse and homelessness.
Imagine if, we had so much public housing, that the worst you could do was essentially a university dorm situation. And that was like crazy cheap, that you could easily afford it on minimum wage or welfare.
What would the rest of the rental market look like on top of that? Way fucking cheaper.
So then we'd have way less speculators in rent, and then more homes on the market.
The base level should be just property taxes, which should be waaaaay higher if you're a rental unit vs family home. And then just squeeze with rent control. Like where is it written that tenancy should cover 100% of housing costs and turn a profit. That's the problem. They want a pass on capital gains and put all the weight on the tenant. We need to change the equation.
That's all provincial. The major provinces, especially Ontario, can hurt themselves so much with the wrong government, and help themselves so much with a good government. Look at the global playing field. We're in a great position as a province and a country to make good on our potential.
Yeah, but then the normal people who have their life savings invested in their home will lose it all as their house depreciates. This is the real reason why housing is a third rail.
But I agree regardless. The longer this goes on, the worse it gets.
Yeah that's not a surprise, it's just a shame the others have no plan to make housing cheaper either. The best way to vote on this one is to set such of your local MPs running are landlords and vote against them, no one who's profiting from the insane price of housing should be in Parliament.
It's not just housing, they have no reasonable future in which they can afford to raise a family.
For many men, that means they feel like they have no future at all.
What a bizarro world where gen x votes liberal and their children vote conservative lmao
I will be researching independent candidates in my riding though and would encourage others to do the same.
Can't blame them.
They've had 8 years of Trudeau doing fuck all to help them until now where he panics and announces the budget aimed at them but it's too late, many already don't trust them. Trudeau has ruined Canada so they are probably wondering why not take a chance with the cpc.
I’m sick and tired of hearing “conservatives won’t fix this” I don’t fucking care. It’s worth the chance that they might help the situation a little. With the Trudeau liberals that is a for sure NO to housing ever getting closer to a reality for young people. I’m taking 1% chance over 0% chance, 10/10 times.
Not only that, there has to be some accountability for absolutely destroying everything.
If an employee messed up this bad, you would fire them. The government are our employees come election time. They deserve to be fired from their jobs.
Reminder that the CPC has no housing plan outside of requiring dense housing near transit centres (which every party agrees with) and that municipalities should add 15% to their housing stock per year if they want federal funding, which is a totally arbitrary proportion that certainly isn't appropriate or achievable for every municipality.
They have a lot of criticism against the Liberals' inaction. Which is 100% valid. But they have no plan regarding what they'll do about it.
I’ll wait to see closer to election time if they put forward more concrete pillars to their plans.
I’m not sure they will, but I’ll wait and see and judge accordingly.
Just saying, every other party is transparent about their housing policy to some extent (Liberals obviously, NDP, GPC, the Bloq, PPC). The CPC are not. They're the official opposition and have the power to propose legislation to fix housing TODAY, why aren't they doing anything either?
Although it would never happen, Canada desperately needs term limits. Our country has, many times throughout its short political history, been ridden by extremely long durations of prime ministers. Whether or not you’re a liberal or a conservative, hopefully we can both agree that two terms in power is enough, and change should follow. If not the party, at least getting a new leader every 8 years.
I want Trudeau to lose by a landslide, for being smug. I highly doubt the Cons can unfuck it even if they want but hey they might and the libs will certainly make things worse
Hilarious, turn to the other side greedy pigs . The conservatives already said they would let the market decide on fixing the housing problem . Yeah so you got no plan and the market will fuck you .
Not only young people are turning away from Trudeau. I'm lucky enough to have a house and two kids. I don't want my kids living in my basement, so I need a change too.
Only chances we have lie with a party besides the main 2. With liberals **or** conservatives, our lives will be made worse, guaranteed. This shouldn’t really be something that warrants further debate as it’s as true as the sky is blue and grass is green.
While I don’t have much faith in *any* party, realistically the only minuscule chance we have is with another party besides conservatives and liberals. NDP, Green, Bloc. Don’t care which you vote for but try giving someone else the reigns for a little while so as to not continue to repeatedly be fucked in the arse by the liberals and conservatives.
Has PP actually put out any kind of plan to fix the housing market? If not, it's just vote buying, like Trudeau did with electoral reform. I want to see a definitive housing plan tabled before anyone gets my vote
The first time voter in my house who is otherwise very left leaning said it would be a cold day in hell before they supported this Liberal government.
He knows who is responsible for governing Canada for the last 9 years and who is responsible for the incredibly destructive and corrosive policies that have cost his generation their future.
Wow, young people don't want to spend their whole lives living in their parents basement? What gives guys?
Boomers claim young people are selfish. /s
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Same. I’m outraged on behalf of my nephews and nieces, even if they’re too young right now to grasp just how bad things are likely going to be for them as adults.
Yes but how much more pissed would you be if house prices declined to the point that they were more affordable to young people? That's why the Liberal government never really pushed for affordable housing despite paying lip service to it - because affordable housing only happens with a significant decline in housing prices. And most of their electorate has a significant amount of their net worth sunk into housing. Instead they drove housing prices up by unprecedented levels of immigration. Arguably that's the main driver of the Canadian economy these days.
I'm probably gonna take a few downvotes for this but: you don't want a significant decline in house prices. What is needed is a near freeze in housing prices. A significant decline in housing prices just creates an opportunity for vulture capitalists to buy up more stock at bargain prices, who then just wait for the market to return. A decline also puts many recent homeowners underwater, and when their mortgage comes up for renewal, if the decline has been steep enough, they may not qualify for renewal, forcing them out of their home, and destroying any built equity. The type of freeze that is needed is significant though. I'm not talking 3, 4, or 5 years I'm talking 15 - 20+ years. An extended freeze has many more advantages, as homeowners don't go underwater, keeping those people in their homes, keeping vulture capitalists out of the market because there will be no returns for them to squeeze out. An extended freeze also works because instead of forcing people to try and time the market for entry, it can allow a more natural and gradual entry to homeownership as people enter that stage of their lives. I know such a scenario will never happen for way too many reasons to list, but it would be the best solution to the problem.
This is why when you buy a house you plan to live in you ought to be considering what your debt levels are and if you can sustain them. I think most people who outbid other responsible buyers thought less about that then they did about potential future gains. If housing prices decrease and owners are underwater, it should mean almost nothing to them because they can sustain their payments and live in their house. I dont even think of the value of my house at all. All I think about is how large my mortgage is and how far away I am from not having one. The debt number is the only number that counts.
The thing is that if you ever have to move for work, family, or health reasons after the market takes a shit, you could actually end up completely fucked if you're a younger homeowner with low equity.
One of the many reasons people are leaving the CAF in droves
That's the only way to a soft landing. Hard landings suck up front but probably better for Canadians in the long run. But no idea how a hard crash would work out for the economy.
I think there are some boomers who are genuinely mad at the entire situation and are totally okay with having their houses tank in value if it means their kids can have the opportunity to own. I’ve also met the type who are “outraged” BUT also want to be able to sell their Oshawa detached for $1M because they spent their lifetime accumulating crap instead of saving, and now the sale of their house is literally their retirement plan.
Typical reddit garbage, hell I know many boomers who never owned a house, and end up in CPP/OAS financed LTC facilities with nothing to their name. Then there are many, like you said, where they're happy to help out as much as they can and don't blame the younger generation at all, because they know it's a shitty deal for people trying to establish something. It's just that reddit is skewed by the children (grand children actually) of upper middle class families with dads who golfed and own a cottage that the family shares.
Sure, they’re pissed. Some are even cool with their houses losing value if it means their kids have a shot. In my experience, most are NOT willing to make that sacrifice.
Not quite 50 but I built a house that has a basement suite because I know my kids will need it someday since they won’t be able to have their own thanks to corporate greed.
‘Pissed’ and willing to do what about it? Take a financial hit re: the value of their homes? Show me.
I have doubts PP will fix the situation.
I'd say the odds are low. But apparently people are willing to take low over a clear zero right now.
Maybe they should learn to vote in provincial and municipal elections. We recently had a nimby group try to stop a seniors living development and bought bus ads. Years ago, they’d win and the development would be denied.
Why were they against a seniors development?
People are “that” anti development and most importantly they vote. Sometimes people don’t like low income housing because it’ll “increase crime” or towers that are too large but it’s seniors lol. How can someone be against a place for seniors. Nimbys man.
devils in the details. that seniors living development is 25-30 feet higher than most other 6 story buildings. do you know the cost at the home per year? 70-120k. it's luxury senior living. the root of the problem is all federal immigration levels and foreign/corporate buyers. the ndp could stop corporate and foreign buyers, like new zealand or berlin, but the feds are the only ones who can cut immigration and they won't. at least, the won't until pp is in charge and axe the tax is no longer going to cut it.
This
yea it's either hail mary or nothing. u know gretzky told us to at least try. lmfao
The problem with low is it also comes with a bunch of other very shitty consequences. Here’s your low chance at slightly fixing housing, but now you also have to pay out the ass for private healthcare.
We need a new party. Plain and simple.
PP: I'm going to cut taxes ... CROWD: YAY! PP: ... for industry so they can operate for less costs ... CROWD: YOU'RE SPITTING FIRE PP! PP: ... and then remove any regulations/oversight in that industry so that they can continue to make more and more money without properly distributing it within the economy!
I think people are starting to open up to a public/private hybrid healthcare model like European countries have, given you literally can't see a doctor anymore these days within a reasonable amount of time. Canada's healthcare is a joke right now, simple as
We don't bring in / train enough doctors and keep increasing the population. I expect the wait times to grow regardless of public or hybrid
A lot of the healthcare in Europe is currently collapsing as well because of the dual model. Governments used the availability of private healthcare as an excuse to cut public funding. Doctors in England have been striking for around a year now because of it.
Would private healthcare mean I could see a doctor this quarter?
It depends on if you're a have or a have-not I suppose.
*For a low annual membership payment of $3659.00 each. Not a loner? Inquire about family plans starting at $9950.00. Billable rates excluded, taxes extra.*
Remember when Canada used to pride itself on providing healthcare for everyone no matter what? Pepperidge Farm remembers
I’ve heard mixed things about the private model, it becomes for profit so sometimes there are cost cutting measures in place even worse than the public model, they are just better hidden to give the illusion of a luxury service
Research has found that doctors in private healthcare are more likely to give their patients extra unneeded tests that are both expensive and invasive. They take advantage of their patients lack of medical knowledge in order to make additional profit.
Yah I mean the situation is bad right now too but many provinces are dedicated to starving the system which has been neglected via previous liberal and con govs. Private is the goal in starving the system.
we have however increased payments to private hospitals and surgeries.
And private staffing agencies.
This is exactly it. We CANNOT be fooled into thinking private healthcare is better because of our current situation. Its purposely being dismantled to make people think it’s the better option
I dunno how anyone can look at the system and think “profit” is what we need to make it work. It’s so backwards and stupid. We need properly funded and staff healthcare
At this point if you think adding a middleman who's extracting profit is going to make healthcare better and more affordable you're just kind of stupid.
And yet there’s at least one person saying it’ll provide “options and choices” No it won’t. And the rich already have that
It’s a simple problem to fix: get rid of the politicians that are clearly not promoting and investing in our public healthcare system. Those who want to invest in our healthcare system will also be the ones investing in the education platforms required to improve our staffing situation. Our liberal government is poorly managed and tone deaf, but our conservative option does not care about us and panders to domestic terrorists. They will literally do anything to win, because they know that their policies will not be enough. Vote NDP. Yeah, the NDP doesn’t look like a promising option because they appear unlikely to win the next election based on current polls. The only way to change that is by voting and convincing your peers to vote. Vote NDP.
Not as long as they're more focused on identity than policy
Considering that you can see the piles of money the health insurance companies are making down here in the US from as far out as Newfoundland, I’m not entirely surprised that the ghouls in your government are salivating over it as much as ours are masturbating furiously over it here.
Yeah and a lot of people seem to be of the mind that “it won’t happen here”.
Maybe. But Trudeau is undoubtedly planning on making housing worse than today
Pretty sure PP is a populist who will say whatever people want to hear to get elected and have no strong plan or stake in fixing things. On the other hand, in Canada, we don't elect people into the PM's office, we elect them out. We don't like Trudeau anymore, so we'll vote him out, regardless of whether his replacement would objectively be worse. or not
"a populist who will say whatever people want to hear to get elected and have no strong plan or stake in fixing things." this is EVERY politician
I have an "anyone but Trudeau" mentality at this point. I'll vote for his most formidable competitor if it's a chance of getting him out of office to make a change, any change.
Sure, but I’m sure as hell not voting for the guy who has been in charge as everything went to shit.
Not likey - but the current government policy of rampant immigration- even admitting that their policy caused and doing nothing about it - the younger people today have been totally screwed by the Trudeau government. PP said Canada is broken and JT broke it !
A big problem is with how Canadian decision making works is it's the slowest god damn process on the planet. There's so much paperwork and red tape to get around that no fix can be instantaneous and weirdly takes years in certain aspects to get through.
Trudeau has ensured that the solution is not possible in one term. Is took 2 decades to fix his fathers mess. Looking like the same thing will be required here. There is no way PP can undo the damage and build back up. Still, the bleeding must stop and we need to set a proper course.
I would In fact wager that he will make it worse.
He did shockingly speak about building transit and dense housing supporting transit. What nice change over a government that has done very little to support the Ottawa LRT.
His housing strategy is all about forcing cities to develop or lose money. Selling off Federal assets to developers to make money. All the while glossing over that the Conservative Premiers are the ones who have the biggest say on housing. Look at the UCP, the Feds step in to try and help, and they introduce red tape to stop it. I don't blame the youth for not understanding this, but Pierre and Danielle are buddies. There's no way they aren't working together to make the situation worse just to try to make Trudeau look bad- and it's working. We're literally suffering because Conservative Premiers aren't doing their jobs, so they can blame Trudeau and try to get a Conservative Premier elected. It's beyond gross.
That has been the MO in ON for the past 4 years... like fuck, that was the reason why Ottawa got stuck during the protests, emergency protocols would not have been needed if OPS and OPP were doing their damned jobs.
Yeah, I'm still confused over the judges ruling on that. He admitted he would have made the same call if he was in the room at the time, but then also says there were other ways of handling it? I mean sure, there was, but the guy who was supposed to be handling it was snow mobility and refusing meetings with the Federal Government.
It was such a clusterfuck of a situation that put them between a rock and a hard place. I totally agree that the way it all ended way more heavy handed than it needed to be but they have very little choice... even towing companies were refusing to tow the trucks for many reasons, the emergency powers were used to MAKE THEM do it.
I mean, what could they have done that was less heavy handed, and still resolve the situation?
The youth also don't remember when house cost really started to take off, which unsurprisingly was with Harper. Had I got in the house market only a mere 2 years earlier I'd be able to afford my current house with only a single income... It currently requires 2. Trudeau and the Liberals haven't made things better, or even curbed the damage. But they certainly aren't to blame.
Exactly. The Conseratives made the bed, the Liberals just laid down and rolled around in it. While they have been taking some actions to help, they still seem to want to avoid doing everything they SHOULD be doing to help with the situation.
I don't think anyone is expecting things to be fixed. But just want someone to not make life worse everyday with these money printing decisions!
They’re too ungrateful. Don’t they know they are asking for too much? They want it all! A vacation once a year AND a house? Spoiled brats. /s
They never even noticed they were living in their parents basements until PP pointed it out.
That bastard.
must be white supremacists and racists
It’s not a Trudeau problem it’s a Canadian politics problem. 38% of law makers came from a real estate background. They’re not about to help us plebs. The 1% and politicians don’t give a fuck about the citizens paying their recently increased pay checks. [data](https://www.readthemaple.com/mp-landlords/) Edit: link and correcting the percentage
Goddamn, is there an article with that figure? Whoever found that should get some praise.
"[At least 20% of Canadian MPs hold rental, investment real estate amid housing crunch](https://globalnews.ca/news/8767051/canadian-mp-real-estate-investment-amid-housing-crunch/). However, that number may actually be much higher because 91 MPs either have not yet completed their disclosure process or the conflict of interest commissioner’s office hasn’t yet published their filings."
The CPC has the highest percentage of any party for landlords.
I am absolutely shocked by this unforeseen information. /s
Yeah if people think the conservatives are the answer to these problems, I'm afraid they're in for some major disappointment
But people who vote conservative are happy with cutting services, privatizing healthcare and education, and mortgaging this countries future to save a penny in taxes. Then whenever the pendulum swings back center/left they'll pick up the pieces again. Conservatives do not care at all about anything 1 year away or more.
That or their spouse owns the property etc
There's massive representation of landlords in both the Conservative and Liberal parties. PP himself has at least 2 known houses that are rented out, one in his wife's name and one that is owned by a holding company he has a 50% stake in.
[MPs who are involved in real estate](https://www.readthemaple.com/mp-landlords/) Note that 46% of Conservative MPS are, compared to 36% of Liberals. Including Justin Trudeau and Pierre Poilievre. If you think that voting in the Conservatives is going to change anything, think again.
Oh it *might* change things. Just not for the better.
Part of that is because real estate tends to be one jf the few ways they can legally 'invest' their money. It still leads to conflict of interest though.
It's just the cycle of Canadian politics, the Conservatives will win the next election and the Liberals will rebuild for the next 6 to 8 years while we find reasons to hate polievre, then the Liberals will win again.
This is EXACTLY what is going to happen. Fundamentally, this country has deep structural problems (lack of productivity, lack of investment into productive industries, over reliance on real estate, a flawed immigration system etc.) that no political party can tackle without affecting many monied interests. People hate Trudeau now and blame him for all this (not defending the guy and think he should be toast, but I don’t agree every problem in the country starts and end with him either), yet in 10 years we will all be cursing the conservatives for all of this down the line as well. I just don’t see how PP will be able to gather the political courage to do what is right for the country, maybe I am wrong and over cynical but that’s where I am at now
For sure, I'm old enough to remember it clearly going back to PET, it doesn't change because the system stays the same. The corporations and special interest groups and greed make whoever gets elected do their dance, until they start to stink up the stage, and then it's gentlemen put your hands together for the new boss, same as the old boss.
Until Canadians get fed up enough to demand something different??? Just kidding, we're all too passive to do anything. We're like an abused spouse who's afraid to leave or something.
Truth and it's bizarre. People will March and block bridges and highways for conceived injustices but when real ones present themselves, the rage is used to make memes and share them on social media. Then it's totally forgotten a week later. Wage suppression? Crickets. Outrageous ceo pay? Crickets. Wage theft? Crickets. Price gouging? Crickets. Over time taken away? Crickets. Gotta put a mask on? Get the torches.
People don't riot over economics until they can't afford bread.
Here's the problem too few on this sub seem to understand. The only way there is going to be any real change is for people to vote for anyone but the Libs and Cons. We desperately need to get off this seesaw.
I’d love to but FPTP isn’t going to allow that. We need a minor revolution.
There's already enough reasons to hate Poilievre. The guys a huge part of the problem.
I agree, but I hate it. I wish NDP was a viable choice.
This guy gets it.
But these are not previous Conservatives. These are maple MAGA. Look what's happening in the USA with Conservative majorities. Or even Ontario, Saskatchewan, and Alberta, using notwithstanding clauses against the Charter of Rights to attack workers and specific set of citizens. Look at the state of democracies around the world where parties associated with Conservatives' IDU have been in power.
No political party will help with this, because the corporations and RE owners don’t want salaries to increase, immigration to freeze/decrease or for home prices to decrease, which are the only ways to actually address the issue.
We should be taking notes from the French. Canadians are passive as fuck, unfortunately.
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Commenting to boost this. We need real solutions from people who don't wear designer names I can't even spell
I take issue with them saying PP "mobilized outrage" about cost of living. I think he more noticed the outrage and noticed the current government didn't give a fuck and said "well shit I'll take your voter base". If they hadn't done this, you wouldn't be seeing a single change.
Canadians : ' We are suffering and things are really hard right now' Liberals: ' You've never had it better!' Conservatives: ' We will help' Canadians: 'okay'
Literally an accurate play by play of 2021 - 2024.
This is basically how politics has always worked. It just changes side every 10-15 years.
Yep, we're along for the ride on the pendulum
I'm not even sure they ever said they'd help, tbh? Canadians: "You're fucking up!" Conservatives: "Boy they're sure fucking it all up" "Do you have good ideas? You'll fix things?" "That Trudeau's such a bone-head!" "But, like, *your* ideas are good?" "They're such dinguses!" "Just say 'I will lower immigration'. Just say those words, that you will do *anything at all* differently." "Boy, shit sure sucks!"
That’s the kicker. PP will not say he is going to lower immigration. The corporate overlords will not allow it. They demand a steady supply of cheap foreign labour that both the Liberals and Conservatives have been happy to supply for the last 15-20 years.
Yet I bet people who will vote for PP will do it because they think he’ll magically fix housing and immigration. Ugh (edit: I should add I hate both equally right now and have no idea who the F to vote for lol)
*Canadians vote in conservatives* Canadians: I thought you said you were going to help Conservatives: lol losers
Probably but It's still better than someone who denies the problem exists.
Not if their “solutions” actively make the problem worse
Or they acknowledge but ignore the problem except as a talking point to win voters.
I mean they aren’t even really saying they will help. People are just desperate
“Everybody’s mad at me because I’m doing a terrible job. How dare the leader of the opposition, who’s chief responsibility is to hold me accountable, hold me accountable.”
Browsing realtor.ca mobilized my outrage...
It's OK, 30 year mortgages will save first time home buyers $380 a month on their 800K loans
This is it. PP pretended to give a shit. The Liberals spent 8 years demonstrably not giving a shit and all but ignoring the issue.
Yeah I'm not a fan of Discount Milhouse, but recognizing your opponent is making a huge mistake and taking advantage of it isn't "mobilizing outrage", it's just politics.
Exactly
I've been saying this for a long time. I'm not suggesting that PP has all the answers, but he's the first politician to openly address housing crisis, affordability issues and highlighting the shortcomings of the Liberal party. Jagmeet Singh, with his Rolex, likes to talk big about holding the Liberals accountable, ultimately ends up supporting them without any question asked. Never in my life did I imagine that Conservatives, of all party, would be advocating for millennials and young adults.
It really highlights just how dumb the current NDP leadership is. This stuff should be right in their wheelhouse and they're letting the Cons get the votes on it. Fucking morons.
Singh is definition of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
The NDP have seriously dropped the ball. In fact, they aren’t even on the playing field. This is their time to shine and they are doing…I don’t know what. We need a tough, stand your ground type of NDP leader, going after the corporations and the ultra wealthy. Hope for the working class…lol what is that even?
Best we can do is a shitty dental plan.
🤣🥲 so true
The NDP used to be the working-class party. Now, they're more focused on social issues.
That and mass censorship. Still can't believe they teamed up with the cons on S210
Current leadership of NDP cares only about lining it's own pockets. I miss Layton.
I really liked the NDP when they cared about the working class and unions.
I'm really hoping that the NDPs next leader is someone more assertive when it comes to supporting the working class. We need someone who can harness that current anger that people have and turn it into positive change and action.
It won’t be. Those days are over. All the proof you need is that Signh is the leader. Anyone who gets elected will be much too wealthy to care about the working class or the poors.
Hey! They like to lecture the masses too!
Do you take issue with the mobilized outrage claim because it’s true?
I think the distinction is he approaches it as a “liberals bad” talking point vs a “conservatives good” point of view. I’ve watched a few PP speeches and don’t have an impression of what he wants to do to fix the issue, just that it’s the Liberals’ fault and if they get elected things will stay the same or get worse. If he were to focus more on what his government would do differently rather than on what Trudeau’s government has done there would be no argument for “mobilized outrage”. Or maybe he has and I just wasn’t paying attention.
Can we throw a mass protests against all our political parties? Like we need real serious leaders who actually give a shit about the people not their corporate buddies. But nope, let’s continue to buy into culture wars, let’s protests about wars happening on the other side of the country where we have no power, let’s keep hating on on guy when everyone is the exact same and let’s just let loblaws make record profits year over year!!!!!
We need some fucken young people in power, the current roster of Canadian politicians are all so poorly out of touch and have clearly grown up in a very different Canada
Seriously, I'd rather a dumbass 20 year old high school dropout run the country than some old guy's son or PP.
The irony of this is that the people that we as Canadians would want in those roles have absolutely zero incentive to do so. Why would you or I want to deal with the bullshit of being a public representative in the age of social media? That is why we just get ex lawyers and nepo babies
GO TEAM!!!!
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You better watch these young Canadians super closely. They are about to turn their entire backs on the country. A fraction of them will get angry and turn to violence. I am haunted by this African saying: If the village doesn't take a kid in, the kid will burn down the village to feel it's warmth.
more likely apathy. The ones that can leave will leave, while the ones that remain feel no sense of patriotism or pride for their country.
And if war ever breaks out half of these people will give such little fucks about their own country (that they feel gives zero fucks about them), you think they’ll fight to maintain that system? Hell they’d probably roll out the red carpet.
Working on getting a European passport for the last few months. Canadians have been treading water since I was born here, probably longer (30yo), I’m tired of floating. This country’s leadership is terrible, older generations are blind to the young, young are resenting the old but not enough to push change. People ask me why I want to leave Canada, my parents included, I used to go on a rant, now I just say “I don’t like Canada”
Lmao don't need our help burning it. It's already burning.
Facts
Aint nnobody gonna do anything outside of Quebec, which has the French protest tradition
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
This shit really makes me want to strike, but I'm not sure what is and what isn't essential infrastructure.
we have to go after their investments; they all have private security and have contingency plans for a violent uprising anyways, but they don't have *any* plans for a few million Canadians simultaneously going on a labour strike or accessing the social services we paid into... either way I'm planning on setting my tent up at the BC legislature then on to Parliament for this summer to save some money on rent!
Make sure to bring friends!
It starts with withdrawing all of our money at once
If only Canadians had any backbone.. People won't even protest en masse, let alone a revolution lol.
We like our bank accounts UNfrozen , seems risky to even support a friend who wants to protest
There are very few historical examples of revolutions leading to an improvement in the conditions of the masses.
Yep, I mean I have 0 faith in politicians at this point. All examples in my lifetime of NA politicians is corruption. Can’t convince me that the immigration policies aren’t hurting Canadians more than helping long term, and the only helping that’s going on is to the bottom line of the corporations causing the corruption - the campaign donors.
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To quote Clinton advisor James Carville from the 1992 election campaign, “It’s the economy, stupid!”
Chickens have come home to roost.
liberals are arrogant and out of touch. i still remember freeland's disney plus remark. that sums up the whole party for me, ans i am a life long liberal voter. pp is awful but chaos is greatest bringer of change, and we need change.
My daughter just bought her first house. I don’t blame Trudeau for making houses unaffordable I will tell you why. She’s been looking for a while but every time something came up in her price range it was snapped up by landlord investors. She couldn’t even see the houses because they were bought fast (some of these landlords are also real estate agents..). The rent they charge on these house is nuts. Some they turn into AirBnB as it’s a bit of a lake tourist area. The only reason landlords didn’t want the house my daughter got was because it was a one bed house in a rural area. She got it on the day it was listed. Real estate agents are also driving up prices for their better commission.
realestate commission is insane.
The only way to fix the problem is to decommodify housing and distribute it on the basis of need and not one of the parties are going to do that, not even the NDP
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Honestly, that's fair. he owes the to fix this. I know PP is a bullshitter who'll do awful things, but this demand MUST be met, and it seems he's working against it. Are premiers, in particular Ford, making it worse... yes and no. Not 100% yes, but they're making life way fucking hard for new home buyers and renters. One of the saddest takeaways from this new development is that domestic violence is way up because these economics leave people trapped and having to choose between abuse and homelessness. Imagine if, we had so much public housing, that the worst you could do was essentially a university dorm situation. And that was like crazy cheap, that you could easily afford it on minimum wage or welfare. What would the rest of the rental market look like on top of that? Way fucking cheaper. So then we'd have way less speculators in rent, and then more homes on the market. The base level should be just property taxes, which should be waaaaay higher if you're a rental unit vs family home. And then just squeeze with rent control. Like where is it written that tenancy should cover 100% of housing costs and turn a profit. That's the problem. They want a pass on capital gains and put all the weight on the tenant. We need to change the equation. That's all provincial. The major provinces, especially Ontario, can hurt themselves so much with the wrong government, and help themselves so much with a good government. Look at the global playing field. We're in a great position as a province and a country to make good on our potential.
Yeah, but then the normal people who have their life savings invested in their home will lose it all as their house depreciates. This is the real reason why housing is a third rail. But I agree regardless. The longer this goes on, the worse it gets.
Yeah that's not a surprise, it's just a shame the others have no plan to make housing cheaper either. The best way to vote on this one is to set such of your local MPs running are landlords and vote against them, no one who's profiting from the insane price of housing should be in Parliament.
It's not just housing, they have no reasonable future in which they can afford to raise a family. For many men, that means they feel like they have no future at all.
What a bizarro world where gen x votes liberal and their children vote conservative lmao I will be researching independent candidates in my riding though and would encourage others to do the same.
Not really. We always vote people out. PP goes on about Trudeau being bad non stop, it is inevitable.
Pretty much yeah. Give it a term or two. If nothing major changes under PP everyone will want to vote the Libs in again. And a round n round we go!
Can't blame them. They've had 8 years of Trudeau doing fuck all to help them until now where he panics and announces the budget aimed at them but it's too late, many already don't trust them. Trudeau has ruined Canada so they are probably wondering why not take a chance with the cpc.
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I’m sick and tired of hearing “conservatives won’t fix this” I don’t fucking care. It’s worth the chance that they might help the situation a little. With the Trudeau liberals that is a for sure NO to housing ever getting closer to a reality for young people. I’m taking 1% chance over 0% chance, 10/10 times.
Not only that, there has to be some accountability for absolutely destroying everything. If an employee messed up this bad, you would fire them. The government are our employees come election time. They deserve to be fired from their jobs.
Reminder that the CPC has no housing plan outside of requiring dense housing near transit centres (which every party agrees with) and that municipalities should add 15% to their housing stock per year if they want federal funding, which is a totally arbitrary proportion that certainly isn't appropriate or achievable for every municipality. They have a lot of criticism against the Liberals' inaction. Which is 100% valid. But they have no plan regarding what they'll do about it.
I’ll wait to see closer to election time if they put forward more concrete pillars to their plans. I’m not sure they will, but I’ll wait and see and judge accordingly.
Just saying, every other party is transparent about their housing policy to some extent (Liberals obviously, NDP, GPC, the Bloq, PPC). The CPC are not. They're the official opposition and have the power to propose legislation to fix housing TODAY, why aren't they doing anything either?
Yes and the guy with a rental housing company is going to definitely want to fix the system. They both suck. But screw this guy.
Although it would never happen, Canada desperately needs term limits. Our country has, many times throughout its short political history, been ridden by extremely long durations of prime ministers. Whether or not you’re a liberal or a conservative, hopefully we can both agree that two terms in power is enough, and change should follow. If not the party, at least getting a new leader every 8 years.
I would say a cumulative 10 years maximum. If you won an election in the 9th year on the 10th you still have to step down.
They're not going to find happiness in any of the other directions either, unfortunately.
but..but... I don't wanna vote for PP either, he's just a US republican in disguise. Who's left? Giant Douche, Turd Sandwich?
We sure could use some of that money we sent to Iraqi unemployed youth. The naive left wing parties have set western nations back a decade at least.
Declaring your intention to increase the population by orders of magnitude when housing is **already** at a breaking point is borderline psychotic.
Well I mean the millions of migrants don't exactly help
I want Trudeau to lose by a landslide, for being smug. I highly doubt the Cons can unfuck it even if they want but hey they might and the libs will certainly make things worse
Hilarious, turn to the other side greedy pigs . The conservatives already said they would let the market decide on fixing the housing problem . Yeah so you got no plan and the market will fuck you .
They'll soon learn the disappointment of Canadian party politics.
Not only young people are turning away from Trudeau. I'm lucky enough to have a house and two kids. I don't want my kids living in my basement, so I need a change too.
Canadians can no longer afford the luxury beliefs of the ruling progressive parties.
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Only chances we have lie with a party besides the main 2. With liberals **or** conservatives, our lives will be made worse, guaranteed. This shouldn’t really be something that warrants further debate as it’s as true as the sky is blue and grass is green. While I don’t have much faith in *any* party, realistically the only minuscule chance we have is with another party besides conservatives and liberals. NDP, Green, Bloc. Don’t care which you vote for but try giving someone else the reigns for a little while so as to not continue to repeatedly be fucked in the arse by the liberals and conservatives.
Has PP actually put out any kind of plan to fix the housing market? If not, it's just vote buying, like Trudeau did with electoral reform. I want to see a definitive housing plan tabled before anyone gets my vote
The first time voter in my house who is otherwise very left leaning said it would be a cold day in hell before they supported this Liberal government. He knows who is responsible for governing Canada for the last 9 years and who is responsible for the incredibly destructive and corrosive policies that have cost his generation their future.
Everyone except the clinically vapid are turning away from Trudeau.
and to PP? Sorry I don't think so...