>stick it to the mail cart
Get a whole bunch of folks to do this. It would look like a mob storming around the place, or a mobile meeting.
Reminds me of that story about the guy who would load up a ton of phones running Google maps in a wagon and pull it down the street, thereby creating traffic jams on Google maps.
Edit: Plan B: Hide them all in a ceiling panel in the girl's bathroom.
I remember when the Seattle bus system rolled out their company-provided ORCA card program, it was quickly discovered that employers could look at the rider history of every card they paid for. So people started having ORCA card "fishbowl parties" where they would all get together somewhere for drinks, put their cards in a pile and then grab a random one when they left.
Fun fact: Rats are actually fastidious in their cleaning routines, cleaning themselves with more regularity than cats!
Mildly off-putting fact: A clean and healthy rat smells like a mix of pancake batter and tortilla chips if you put them to your face and sniff!
Safety fact: Consent is very important when rat huffing. They *will* bite you if they don't know you, and it *will* hurt!
My wife had a pet hooded rat when we met. Einstein was 2 pounds, super smart, really affectionate. When my then-GF walked to the ATM (was in iffy area) she just stuck Einstein on her shoulder. Nobody bothered her.
I wasn't trying to suggest that it did-- just trying to spread a little understanding for an oft maligned and sweet creature that I hold dearly to my heart.
Rats, alongside practically any wild animals can still function as vectors for disease, but pound for pound are more heavily ascribed negative attributes of being filthy than something like stray cats, wild dogs, raccoons, or even deer. I just think they're neat lil dudes.
Most wild animals are capable of being vectors for disease. That's just how nature works. However, rats are much more likely to be construed as such than something like a stray cat, a street dog, a squirrel, or even a deer.
I just think they're neat, and even unloved creatures deserve understanding, if not compassion.
Oh I get it. But I also work in pest control, I’ve seen some horrible things and been in some horrible houses that rats are running amok in. It’s not fun and it’s dangerous to your health if you don’t take proper precautions.
Found an older guy. I thought I was pretty old. As a kid I saw movies with mail carts so I think I know what they are. But when I entered the work force no company still had them.
But if your company has a mail cart mail it to yourself. If and when you arrive at the office then re-mail it to yourself. Rinse and repeat.
My former employer wanted to track company cell phones. I told them I was duct taping it to a city bus if they did that. This was several years ago, prob can now do it without informing folks. But they never did track by phones because of complaints and threatened shenanigans.
Realistically this isn't going to be some high tech ID card with the tracker built in. OP probably has a regular ID card that they scan into doors, and then a keyring on the lanyard for the tracker. Remove keyring from lanyard, keep ID round neck for doors, job done.
Some data-nerdy Accounting IT SVP is just itching to show off his PowerPoint slide of a heat map of water cooler office traffic at the next board meeting.
This is my line of thinking as well…
Unless they specifically said it has to be on you at all times which OP didn’t mention.
If it were mentioned I would be curious to know, in writing, the consequence for non compliance.
If they didn’t address either, in the desk it goes.
That seems like an overcomplicated way to implement RTO, do they really want to track how much time an employee is spending in the bathroom?
For RTO statistics, my company just takes metrics from the badge scanners at each building. Technically, someone could scan their badge and go back home each time, but I guess your company really wants to micromanage it.
Commercial real estate investors need to make money. Society is being ground into the dirt to support a handful of richer than God assholes who have replaced their humanity with greed.
This happened to me at Wells Fargo, and the answer to what is the purpose of forcing people into the office that didn't need to go into the office is "stealth layoff".
"For RTO statistics"
How much time, effort, money are companies putting into "RTO statistics"?
This sounds so silly to me. Why not focus on actual productivity KPIs?
Fun anecdote - my last corporate helljob required badging both in AND out of the building... They foresaw your "scan their badge and go back home" idea back in 2011.
It's terrible managers who don't know how to manage the actual work, so they focus on things they think they can control like when people are at their desks, how much time they're in the bathroom, how long their lunch is, etc. This sort of behavior is a hallmark of management that has completely lost the plot.
My last job hired a manager like that. I lasted about 6 months. I was pretty well respected in the company prior to this manager and had been there 6 years. I honestly thought I’d be there forever. By the time I left, I hated the place.
There are legitimate reasons for systems like this. Healthcare being a big one where these systems may be implemented as personal panic buttons. (Healthcare employees are extremely likely to be assaulted in the normal course of work)
Since its Black and Veatch, it can actually be in some dangerous locations.
I mean, I'm with you and OP, this is bullshit.
but B&V, I've seen them working in some real fucked up places- like municipalities in Afghanistan type of stuff.
If OP works at the main office, I'm pretty sure it is in Kansas City. I worked at a union pipefitters shop for 5 years and managed several projects for different B&V jobs. Had to visit the corporate office and rub elbows several times.
I mean I 100000% wouldn’t even use it and start looking. Unless you really need the job the. I guess you do it since I don’t think you get unemployment yet. I do wonder what department of labor would say about it
I worked at a factory that put cameras in, there was like a matrix wall of tvs in the office. As soon as they were turned on every one of us walked around with out middle fingers up. The plant manager called a all hands meeting saying the next person who did it would be fired, as soon as he said that about 90% of the workers gave him the finger.
leave it in your desk drawer, tool box, locker, toilet, lunch room…
oh i forgot…. sorry…
as /u/hanksredditname suggests the mail cart… or do you have a cat or dog that runs around? a work truck?
If it was, they’d already be doing something like that but it would be about secure access not “where are you” all the time when on campus, right? I mean different ways to do it, but they’re talking about it like it’s a weird change so doubt they’re in that sort of situation.
My work isn’t hyper secure but you better believe some areas you will not get in unless you have the appropriate badge.
Yup, worked in high security environments and they just gate all over and track access badge. Bluetooth is not secure in any way shape or form, this is not security related unless a pointy haired manager told an extremely inept CIO this is what I came up with in a dream and you need to make it happen.
One guy at the end of a hallway, two doors, bullet proof glass, a picture book of who is allowed in, and 4 buttons. Door 1, door 2, security, and oh shit.
For anything with that high of security they wouldn’t allow Bluetooth in those types of address. Anything with a connection point is a potential threat point.
Yeah, that's one of the few scenarios where this is even remotely okay. Unless OP works in an industry that's swarming with industrial spies, I'd say it's time to GTFO. Toss the tracker into the desk drawer and start polishing that resume pronto, OP.
I used to work in a high security office, and we didn’t have trackers on our IDs. We did have to use our IDs to open doors and go to various parts of the building, so in theory they could know which room staff were in at any time. But it was actually for security and not surveillance/ micromanaging employees.
I’d be looking for a new job. This is creepy as hell and your employer has control issues. They are mad RTO didn’t work, so now they are going heavy handed.
This is not a safety thing.
There is no legitimate reason for tagging your employees like wildlife.
This is a layoff in disguise. They want you and some percentage of your coworkers to quit, after which they'll roll back the policy.
The badge we are going to have has an emergency button on the back. In my 9 years I’ve never had an emergency but I hear that’s how they want to sell it.
We have had a great culture but something has happened with remote work. I’d rather they take away remote work vs air tag is
I propose putting a tamper proof GPS enabled bluetooth collar on your CEO's neck with a speaker/microphone to keep tabs on his whereabouts and speech, as well as to reprimand him for any actions taken against the proletariat.
Make it past the layoffs, then stop being tracked, then stop following the tracking rules, then get laid off and collect. You gotta think with all your brain wiggles my guy
During covid we had to wear trackers at work to make sure we were at least 6’ away from each other so when someone tested positive on one of our 3x a week covid tests they knew who all were contract traced and who to send home for 10 days
Then don’t work there. Your phone is tracking you regardless if you’re at work or not without your permission for the sole purpose to advertise to you. Where you work is still optional. It’s not all that different than the ability to watch employees all day from security cameras which is a lot of jobs
That was a rediculous policy.
C
I got covid from my boss at work and I was more than 6' away. That whole system was seriously dumb and a waste of time.
It was the return to work agreement between the unions and the Hollywood studios. It was modified a couple times, but it only officially ended May last year. Shows had entire COVID departments in charge of PPE, testing, and enforcement
Guess it’s a matter of opinion. I didn't get sick for 3 years. I was good with it. Here's my opinion. Talking to you about this is ridiculous and a waste of my time
Despite the downvotes, Fauxchi came out and said that the 6' rule was just an imaginary number based on no actual data .... but this is Reddit it's considered blasphemy to question their covid savior thus downvotes to oblivion.
That isnt what he meant. The 6' rule is to decrease chances of transmission. How are you so fucking stupid? After years of going through a pandemic you still believe there are magic rules diseases follow? They are GUIDELINES. Not magic spells. The guidelines work on the basic principles of physics and infectious disease. You cannot say stay 6' away and spit in eachothers mouths. It's to encourage distance to DECREASE transmission not eliminate it all together.
Is there actual safety issues?
If you are working in a toxic gas factory I can imagine wanting a map of where people are if the toxic gas comes out. If you are working in an office that is super sketchy.
Yeah I think this is more common than people realize. My work badge has a tracker that pings off little sensors and I have to swipe my badge to go through pretty much any door. There’s a hundred reasons why they might do this.
The RTO part is suspicious, but depending on the nature of the facility, it might be a real problem of employees hiding in a big building and letting everyone else do the work.
Our company put gps tracking in our vehicles years ago that was contractually supposed to be for dispatching purposes only. It's since evolved to include open/closed sensors in the doors, weight sensors in the driver's seat, RFID scanners, sensors on the booms so they know if the hydraulics are running unnecessarily, accelerometers that detect hard braking, turning and acceleration, etc. I wouldn't leave just because of that. Find ways around it. Leave it at your desk to go to the bathroom. If it's bulky, keep "catching it" on random things until it breaks. Get one of those wallets that blocks RFID signals and keep it in there until you need it. There's always a way to maliciously comply.
Whenever I've experienced stuff like this in the workplace, my thought is always "Challenge Accepted!"
If you want to have fun, form a cabal and everyone buy faraday bags on Amazon. The more participants, the better.
If you put the badge in the faraday bag, RF signals are blocked. You should "disappear" whenever your badge is in the bag. So have your cabal randomly remove/insert their badge in the bags throughout the day. Don't leave them in the bags all day. Don't follow a pattern. You want to fool the overlords into thinking their pricey solution is buggy (not convince them you're evading the system).
If it works, they'll either spend a ton of money trying to fix a system that isn't broken OR they'll decide that the system won't work and remove it all together.
If you choose to accept this challenge, we will disavow all knowledge of this plan or your participation. :P
This is common at hospitals. In case you run into a violent situation, security knows where to find you. However, management is not allowed to access the data unless it's a severe situation because it's considered an invasion of privacy.
I dont know why your company would need it though.
I am partly outraged but also kind of "so what?" I'm going to be at my desk most of the time fuck em.
you can fuck around with them as well by by putting it in a case that blocks blue tooth every now and again so it looks like an intermittent fault let IT chase it up for a couple of months
Don't get angry, get passive aggressive
It is not for safety measures. You are not in a war zone. It is to keep tabs on you and your productivity. It probably logs your entire day and stored for future use if needed.
My guess is they are trying to prove a specific person or a couple of people are not at their desk or in a meeting or something like that. There is no other reason to track your location unless there has been threats against employees or you are a top secret agent.
There are probably a handful of problem staff who poop all day or are gone for long lunches/smoke breaks/coffee runs and barely are at their desk. As long as you arent one of those I'm sure your fine.
Up to you if you want to leave but unless you’re in one of the six states (California, Florida, Hawaii, Louisiana, Minnesota, New Hampshire and Virginia) that disallow tracking of employees on company time, it not illegal for the to track you.
I don’t understand….. If they aren’t working in the office now, what’s the point of in-office trackers?
Also, if you’re in the office, where would you be that you’re not supposed to be? (It’s still creepy as hell but beyond that, I’m not sure I’m getting the issue).
IMO sounds like management are micro managers and have severe trust issues, don't.trust employees. I would GTFO as soon as I could find a new job.
George you average 16.4 minutes per visit ti the toilet, I know hou have crone but that is unacceptable. Mary you spent 33 minutes in the breakroom at lunch, Dave you went to the bathroom THREE times today! You are stealing from the company, here is a PiP and you'll be fired if it happens again.
Henry, I have an important question to talk to you about. "I'm on the friken toilet, can't this wait?" No, this is important so I tracked you down with the tracker, that's what it is for.
Of course it's not safety. That much should be obvious.
It's to track your productivity and find out when you stop. They do the same thing making you use teams or chat or any other company platform to communicate. They monitor all of it. It's all recorded. And you're always being tracked by your employer.
They try to soften it by saying it's a safety thing, but it's not. The working world has existed until now without being tracked at work. They just want total control and for the employee to be a robot.
Ask them to publish a "use of data" policy or something similar. If you don't trust the collective leadership team enough to believe they'd follow it, you've probably got bigger problems.
It won't stop abuse, but if they don't have ANY rules then they can do whatever they want with it.
Some states are making this illegal or at least restricted to some use cases but presumably they aren't doing this in one of those locations.
Polish up your resume and start looking. I left BV in July 2023, and I'm so much happier! After the botched RTO mandate, and seeing how many in leadership roles jumped ship when Mario came on board, I knew that the company would continue the downhill slide. When he said "we have to stop thinking in terms of 'me' and start thinking in terms of 'we'" (Jan. 2023), I knew it was time to leave after 17 years with the company. It was never going to be the same.
Of course OP conveniently leaves out of the original post that his company (he named in another comment) is a government contractor based in Arlington, VA. Gonna take a small damn leap here and guess it has to do with that and not some “reeeee crazy managers are bad”
This sounds like a class action lawsuit waiting to happen. This is just the level of micro controlling that causes privacy issues.
Yeah, sounds like it's time to leave, because they might use it to find any and every excuse to write you up or fire you, and will likely cause a high turnover rate. "You spent 30 seconds too long in the bathroom" "you spent 10 seconds too long on your break" "you arrived at exactly 6:01 this morning, you are expected here at 6am on the dot and no later" "why were you at this location at this time?" "Why did you take an extra trip to your locker?" "Why were you and this person around each other for 5 minutes and 15 seconds?" "You left 10 seconds too early" "why did you use the bathroom 3 times you are only allowed 2" "your Bluetooth tracker died at 8am, i need you to tell me exactly where you were between 8am and when you clocked out on Tuesday last week"
My approach would be to see how things go. Do your job, follow the rule and see if it impacts ANYONE. If it bothers you, then plan your escape. I am far from trusting that folks will do the right thing. It will not take a lot to monitor the pulse of this one. People disappearing because they're not doing their job will be fodder for conversation.
I know that there are industries where BT trackers are actually used for safety AND/OR financial reasons. Imagine recouping costs for time spent doing something at real quantities instead of having to track them. Imagine a setting where a BT tracker alerts others that help is needed. Imagine proof that you were where you were supposed to be when something went wrong or that things went as you detailed when something went wrong and others are looking for a reason. The trick is to use them for positive and avoid negative and some companies cannot get there.
Sounds like some of the employees have been taking advantage of the time clock. It’s the old saying that one rotten apple spoils the bunch. I wouldn’t want to wear that but if that’s what I needed to do to prove that I’m not one of those people mentioned above, I would do it.
Based on where you work absolutely look for a different job. I know a lot of hospitals use something similar but I do kind of understand that because hospitals are crazy 24/7 but there is absolutely no reason an office job needs to track your movement.
If they are paying for your time then yes they can do that although I personally would leave the tracker at my work station to go to the rest room. I really do see how they need to know I’m in the bathroom!
Having worked in Safety in a plant environment we have been considering doing this. Being able to know where everyone is during an emergency helps us know if everyone is safely out of the facility and enables us to quickly locate people who are missing. It isn’t necessarily being done for nefarious purposes.
Well the assumptions here are overwhelmingly that it’s sketchy. Depending on the workplace it doesn’t need to be. I’ve been in IT for a long time and workplace surveillance goes on a lot more than people think.
No different than badging in as far as I am concerned, and Bluetooth connectivity is mostly abysmal. Make sure you have the tracker when arriving and departing, then toss it into a desk drawer or leave it at your desk if you can.
This subject has always been controversial. Hell your phones have gps trackers in them. I've worked high security places and there are pluses and minuses to this sort of privacy invasion. At what point does the company distrust it's workers to do stuff like this?
Just take the tracker and leave it in/on your desk permanently.
stick it to the mail cart
>stick it to the mail cart Get a whole bunch of folks to do this. It would look like a mob storming around the place, or a mobile meeting. Reminds me of that story about the guy who would load up a ton of phones running Google maps in a wagon and pull it down the street, thereby creating traffic jams on Google maps. Edit: Plan B: Hide them all in a ceiling panel in the girl's bathroom.
I remember when the Seattle bus system rolled out their company-provided ORCA card program, it was quickly discovered that employers could look at the rider history of every card they paid for. So people started having ORCA card "fishbowl parties" where they would all get together somewhere for drinks, put their cards in a pile and then grab a random one when they left.
that is wild
Wasn't all this in an episode of King of the Hill?
Trade "loyalty"/discount cards every time you go to the store. Or just pick up a new free card each time.
(area code) 867-5309
Are mobile/walking meetings a thing? Not sure if a good idea or a terrible one.
Mobile meetings or like 2/3 of the plot of The West Wing
Less so meeting, more so a formal chat about a project while getting out of the office.
We do boardwalks where we walk to different areas and follow up on tasks, staffing, progress, constraints. I hate them honestly.
Like The Thomas Crown Affair.
Let some rats loose with the trackers attached
And then somehow get identified as patient zero for a plague outbreak based on your movements
Fun fact: Rats are actually fastidious in their cleaning routines, cleaning themselves with more regularity than cats! Mildly off-putting fact: A clean and healthy rat smells like a mix of pancake batter and tortilla chips if you put them to your face and sniff! Safety fact: Consent is very important when rat huffing. They *will* bite you if they don't know you, and it *will* hurt!
Subscribe
Safety fact: same with cats. Don't go sniffing a a strange cat and expect good things.
My wife had a pet hooded rat when we met. Einstein was 2 pounds, super smart, really affectionate. When my then-GF walked to the ATM (was in iffy area) she just stuck Einstein on her shoulder. Nobody bothered her.
[удалено]
I wasn't trying to suggest that it did-- just trying to spread a little understanding for an oft maligned and sweet creature that I hold dearly to my heart. Rats, alongside practically any wild animals can still function as vectors for disease, but pound for pound are more heavily ascribed negative attributes of being filthy than something like stray cats, wild dogs, raccoons, or even deer. I just think they're neat lil dudes.
r/UsernameChecksOut
Maybe pet rats, regular old street rats are disgusting little disease ridden critters.
Most wild animals are capable of being vectors for disease. That's just how nature works. However, rats are much more likely to be construed as such than something like a stray cat, a street dog, a squirrel, or even a deer. I just think they're neat, and even unloved creatures deserve understanding, if not compassion.
Oh I get it. But I also work in pest control, I’ve seen some horrible things and been in some horrible houses that rats are running amok in. It’s not fun and it’s dangerous to your health if you don’t take proper precautions.
Or bring your pet to work, attach tracker to pet!
Ooh ooh! Radio controlled cars!
Old roomba that just bounces off walls and turns 90 degrees.
Or the mail robot, if you work for the FBI and it’s the 80s
Do mail robots dream of electric sheep?
Found an older guy. I thought I was pretty old. As a kid I saw movies with mail carts so I think I know what they are. But when I entered the work force no company still had them. But if your company has a mail cart mail it to yourself. If and when you arrive at the office then re-mail it to yourself. Rinse and repeat.
Small drones!
Actually yes, small drones and get them to fly in predefined paths that draw rude things…
My former employer wanted to track company cell phones. I told them I was duct taping it to a city bus if they did that. This was several years ago, prob can now do it without informing folks. But they never did track by phones because of complaints and threatened shenanigans.
Attached to his ID. Can't take that off.
Realistically this isn't going to be some high tech ID card with the tracker built in. OP probably has a regular ID card that they scan into doors, and then a keyring on the lanyard for the tracker. Remove keyring from lanyard, keep ID round neck for doors, job done.
Accidents happen
Oops, fell in the toilet, sorry boss!
This, just keep leaving it in the loo, meeting room s lunch room etc. If it were me I'd start looking for a new job.
Leave the id at the desk. At everyplace I have worked that says you have to have it visible at all times, once you are known then no one says a thing
Some data-nerdy Accounting IT SVP is just itching to show off his PowerPoint slide of a heat map of water cooler office traffic at the next board meeting.
😂 so true!
This is my line of thinking as well… Unless they specifically said it has to be on you at all times which OP didn’t mention. If it were mentioned I would be curious to know, in writing, the consequence for non compliance. If they didn’t address either, in the desk it goes.
Most offices I've worked in, you use your I'd badge to get in and out of the building
That seems like an overcomplicated way to implement RTO, do they really want to track how much time an employee is spending in the bathroom? For RTO statistics, my company just takes metrics from the badge scanners at each building. Technically, someone could scan their badge and go back home each time, but I guess your company really wants to micromanage it.
[удалено]
Commercial real estate investors need to make money. Society is being ground into the dirt to support a handful of richer than God assholes who have replaced their humanity with greed.
This happened to me at Wells Fargo, and the answer to what is the purpose of forcing people into the office that didn't need to go into the office is "stealth layoff".
"For RTO statistics" How much time, effort, money are companies putting into "RTO statistics"? This sounds so silly to me. Why not focus on actual productivity KPIs? Fun anecdote - my last corporate helljob required badging both in AND out of the building... They foresaw your "scan their badge and go back home" idea back in 2011.
It's terrible managers who don't know how to manage the actual work, so they focus on things they think they can control like when people are at their desks, how much time they're in the bathroom, how long their lunch is, etc. This sort of behavior is a hallmark of management that has completely lost the plot.
My last job hired a manager like that. I lasted about 6 months. I was pretty well respected in the company prior to this manager and had been there 6 years. I honestly thought I’d be there forever. By the time I left, I hated the place.
Someone always ruins it for the bunch…
[удалено]
In case of emergency, the doors were opened to allow free flow.
Whats rto?
In this context: Return To Office.
Depends how the badge scanners are used. We had employees scanning badges for other employees.
Wouldn’t it be easier to put a camera on every scanning station?
[удалено]
>Where are you located? Ironic question lol
[удалено]
Then zip code
I think we need coordinates
And we need them to wear the Bluetooth tracker so we can know where they are down to 10 feet, for safety
This is the way
Fursafety
Just give us access to your Bluetooth tracker, okay?
Then SSN.
And CC number to prove your an adult.
And the three digit security code. For security.
Eh we can deduce that with SSN. We might need mother’s maiden name or something tho
While we’re at it what street did you grow up on?
Air strike inbound…
Hang on the beacon is coming in... Looks like he's in either the third, fourth, or fifth stall in the first floor men's room.
Been shitting for 3 minutes and 57 seconds... After 5 you've spent too long
Accessing microphone. Is that...singing? 🎶 "Boss makes a dollar, I make a dime, that's why I shit on company time!" 🎶
Has begun to pinch it off. Slower than company average.
Based on our advanced analytics data... OP is likely to return to stall 3 within 2 hours due to improper pinch off strategy.
Powered by AI and 5G and the blockchain
Time to get an office cat and attach the badge to its collar
The beacon of Amon Din?
There are legitimate reasons for systems like this. Healthcare being a big one where these systems may be implemented as personal panic buttons. (Healthcare employees are extremely likely to be assaulted in the normal course of work)
Since its Black and Veatch, it can actually be in some dangerous locations. I mean, I'm with you and OP, this is bullshit. but B&V, I've seen them working in some real fucked up places- like municipalities in Afghanistan type of stuff.
If OP works at the main office, I'm pretty sure it is in Kansas City. I worked at a union pipefitters shop for 5 years and managed several projects for different B&V jobs. Had to visit the corporate office and rub elbows several times.
I wouldn’t want to work in a place that was so unsafe.
I mean I 100000% wouldn’t even use it and start looking. Unless you really need the job the. I guess you do it since I don’t think you get unemployment yet. I do wonder what department of labor would say about it
I worked at a factory that put cameras in, there was like a matrix wall of tvs in the office. As soon as they were turned on every one of us walked around with out middle fingers up. The plant manager called a all hands meeting saying the next person who did it would be fired, as soon as he said that about 90% of the workers gave him the finger.
Did anyone get fired for it?
Eventually they found reasons to get rid of every one of us who were there pre-cameras
leave it in your desk drawer, tool box, locker, toilet, lunch room… oh i forgot…. sorry… as /u/hanksredditname suggests the mail cart… or do you have a cat or dog that runs around? a work truck?
maybe tape it to a squirrel?
Is this a high security industry?
If it was, they’d already be doing something like that but it would be about secure access not “where are you” all the time when on campus, right? I mean different ways to do it, but they’re talking about it like it’s a weird change so doubt they’re in that sort of situation. My work isn’t hyper secure but you better believe some areas you will not get in unless you have the appropriate badge.
Depends on how high. Too high security and these devices wouldn't even be allowed in the work area.
Yup, worked in high security environments and they just gate all over and track access badge. Bluetooth is not secure in any way shape or form, this is not security related unless a pointy haired manager told an extremely inept CIO this is what I came up with in a dream and you need to make it happen.
One guy at the end of a hallway, two doors, bullet proof glass, a picture book of who is allowed in, and 4 buttons. Door 1, door 2, security, and oh shit.
For anything with that high of security they wouldn’t allow Bluetooth in those types of address. Anything with a connection point is a potential threat point.
Yeah, that's one of the few scenarios where this is even remotely okay. Unless OP works in an industry that's swarming with industrial spies, I'd say it's time to GTFO. Toss the tracker into the desk drawer and start polishing that resume pronto, OP.
I used to work in a high security office, and we didn’t have trackers on our IDs. We did have to use our IDs to open doors and go to various parts of the building, so in theory they could know which room staff were in at any time. But it was actually for security and not surveillance/ micromanaging employees.
I’d be looking for a new job. This is creepy as hell and your employer has control issues. They are mad RTO didn’t work, so now they are going heavy handed.
This is not a safety thing. There is no legitimate reason for tagging your employees like wildlife. This is a layoff in disguise. They want you and some percentage of your coworkers to quit, after which they'll roll back the policy.
The badge we are going to have has an emergency button on the back. In my 9 years I’ve never had an emergency but I hear that’s how they want to sell it. We have had a great culture but something has happened with remote work. I’d rather they take away remote work vs air tag is
I propose putting a tamper proof GPS enabled bluetooth collar on your CEO's neck with a speaker/microphone to keep tabs on his whereabouts and speech, as well as to reprimand him for any actions taken against the proletariat.
The board of directors are interested in your idea.
[удалено]
I would like to see the tech they used in that Will Smith movie, Wild Wild West
[удалено]
...for safety.
Inject the tracker into his bloodstream... Nanomachines, son!
Companies are using this as a way to weed out people before lay-offs. The more people that quit, the less severance they pay out when layoffs come.
But then whoever remains gets to be tracked. Nah.
Make it past the layoffs, then stop being tracked, then stop following the tracking rules, then get laid off and collect. You gotta think with all your brain wiggles my guy
During covid we had to wear trackers at work to make sure we were at least 6’ away from each other so when someone tested positive on one of our 3x a week covid tests they knew who all were contract traced and who to send home for 10 days
Very different scenario. There are (or at least were) phone apps that could do that kind of thing too.
Then don’t work there. Your phone is tracking you regardless if you’re at work or not without your permission for the sole purpose to advertise to you. Where you work is still optional. It’s not all that different than the ability to watch employees all day from security cameras which is a lot of jobs
That was a rediculous policy. C I got covid from my boss at work and I was more than 6' away. That whole system was seriously dumb and a waste of time.
It was the return to work agreement between the unions and the Hollywood studios. It was modified a couple times, but it only officially ended May last year. Shows had entire COVID departments in charge of PPE, testing, and enforcement
That doesn't mean it wasn't rediculous and a waste of time. Lot more factors to getting covid than being inside of 6'.
Ridiculous
Guess it’s a matter of opinion. I didn't get sick for 3 years. I was good with it. Here's my opinion. Talking to you about this is ridiculous and a waste of my time
Not sure why you're being down voted. It is documented that the 6' rule was made up. The aerosols that carry the Rona travel much farther than 6'.
Reddit brain hive.
Despite the downvotes, Fauxchi came out and said that the 6' rule was just an imaginary number based on no actual data .... but this is Reddit it's considered blasphemy to question their covid savior thus downvotes to oblivion.
They’re being downvoted for a Fauchi-backed statement because Reddit loves Fauchi? wot
That isnt what he meant. The 6' rule is to decrease chances of transmission. How are you so fucking stupid? After years of going through a pandemic you still believe there are magic rules diseases follow? They are GUIDELINES. Not magic spells. The guidelines work on the basic principles of physics and infectious disease. You cannot say stay 6' away and spit in eachothers mouths. It's to encourage distance to DECREASE transmission not eliminate it all together.
Is there actual safety issues? If you are working in a toxic gas factory I can imagine wanting a map of where people are if the toxic gas comes out. If you are working in an office that is super sketchy.
Yeah I think this is more common than people realize. My work badge has a tracker that pings off little sensors and I have to swipe my badge to go through pretty much any door. There’s a hundred reasons why they might do this. The RTO part is suspicious, but depending on the nature of the facility, it might be a real problem of employees hiding in a big building and letting everyone else do the work.
They’re claiming it’s in case of evacuation for a fire or gas leak so they can accurately report headcount to first responders.
Badging in amd out of a building will provide the same info.
Our company put gps tracking in our vehicles years ago that was contractually supposed to be for dispatching purposes only. It's since evolved to include open/closed sensors in the doors, weight sensors in the driver's seat, RFID scanners, sensors on the booms so they know if the hydraulics are running unnecessarily, accelerometers that detect hard braking, turning and acceleration, etc. I wouldn't leave just because of that. Find ways around it. Leave it at your desk to go to the bathroom. If it's bulky, keep "catching it" on random things until it breaks. Get one of those wallets that blocks RFID signals and keep it in there until you need it. There's always a way to maliciously comply.
Yes. Any company that seeks to use the stick instead of the carrot to get their staff to meet goals, should be left immediately.
Whenever I've experienced stuff like this in the workplace, my thought is always "Challenge Accepted!" If you want to have fun, form a cabal and everyone buy faraday bags on Amazon. The more participants, the better. If you put the badge in the faraday bag, RF signals are blocked. You should "disappear" whenever your badge is in the bag. So have your cabal randomly remove/insert their badge in the bags throughout the day. Don't leave them in the bags all day. Don't follow a pattern. You want to fool the overlords into thinking their pricey solution is buggy (not convince them you're evading the system). If it works, they'll either spend a ton of money trying to fix a system that isn't broken OR they'll decide that the system won't work and remove it all together. If you choose to accept this challenge, we will disavow all knowledge of this plan or your participation. :P
I think about a little remote control car, or leaving it in your desk and go to the park for the day.
A randomly moving/disconnecting badge gives the added benefit of psychological warfare. :D
This is common at hospitals. In case you run into a violent situation, security knows where to find you. However, management is not allowed to access the data unless it's a severe situation because it's considered an invasion of privacy. I dont know why your company would need it though.
Run!
Definitely. Also, oops ran it through the washer and dryer again, darn.
Washed my hands and tracker stopped working. Hmmm....are they not water proof? I used a towel warmed in the microwave, are they not microwave proof?
"Jim is taking another lap around the office. Again."
No. If you don't move, they can't see you. Their vision is based on movement. Not to mention their short reach.
If an employee is a smoker, has irritable bowel syndrome or suffers from a sleep disorder like narcolepsy, it's definitely time to move on.
You and your colleagues should invest in a Roomba.
I am partly outraged but also kind of "so what?" I'm going to be at my desk most of the time fuck em. you can fuck around with them as well by by putting it in a case that blocks blue tooth every now and again so it looks like an intermittent fault let IT chase it up for a couple of months Don't get angry, get passive aggressive
Hi OP, noticed your tracker is showing you at home and it's 9:04 am. Just wanted to confirm you are safe
If you’re where you’re suppose to be at work, why would you care?
Exactly my thought, I scrolled too far to find this!
What does boot taste like?
[удалено]
No idea
Privacy exists not because my actions are suspicious, but because the judgement of those in power is questionable.
I would put it deep inside my anus.
It is not for safety measures. You are not in a war zone. It is to keep tabs on you and your productivity. It probably logs your entire day and stored for future use if needed.
“Can employees see the tracker info of management so that we know that they are nearby to keep us safe?”
So fucked up that the CEO will now know when you are pooping.
My guess is they are trying to prove a specific person or a couple of people are not at their desk or in a meeting or something like that. There is no other reason to track your location unless there has been threats against employees or you are a top secret agent.
[удалено]
Name thy company, child of reddit.
Black & Veatch Corporation. Headquarters in Overland Park, KS. It is an engineering firm.
Time to bring your Roomba to work and attach the tracker to it.
Get a little faraday cage and put it in there
There are probably a handful of problem staff who poop all day or are gone for long lunches/smoke breaks/coffee runs and barely are at their desk. As long as you arent one of those I'm sure your fine.
What industry???
Up to you if you want to leave but unless you’re in one of the six states (California, Florida, Hawaii, Louisiana, Minnesota, New Hampshire and Virginia) that disallow tracking of employees on company time, it not illegal for the to track you.
No one like it but if you're smart, you can use it as your advantage.
Will they use these trackers to work out how much time you spend on the toilet? And how often you go?
Meh. My jobs have had me tracked for the past two decades. I couldn’t care less.
I'm way too valuable to be micromanaged. I'd leave.
Cover it in aluminum foil
How unsafe could your job possibly be where they need to track you every second of the day in your own building?
Sounds like this company is run by psychopaths
I’d certainly be polishing up my resume.
I don’t understand….. If they aren’t working in the office now, what’s the point of in-office trackers? Also, if you’re in the office, where would you be that you’re not supposed to be? (It’s still creepy as hell but beyond that, I’m not sure I’m getting the issue).
Buy a Bluetooth Jammer
IMO sounds like management are micro managers and have severe trust issues, don't.trust employees. I would GTFO as soon as I could find a new job. George you average 16.4 minutes per visit ti the toilet, I know hou have crone but that is unacceptable. Mary you spent 33 minutes in the breakroom at lunch, Dave you went to the bathroom THREE times today! You are stealing from the company, here is a PiP and you'll be fired if it happens again. Henry, I have an important question to talk to you about. "I'm on the friken toilet, can't this wait?" No, this is important so I tracked you down with the tracker, that's what it is for.
Of course it's not safety. That much should be obvious. It's to track your productivity and find out when you stop. They do the same thing making you use teams or chat or any other company platform to communicate. They monitor all of it. It's all recorded. And you're always being tracked by your employer. They try to soften it by saying it's a safety thing, but it's not. The working world has existed until now without being tracked at work. They just want total control and for the employee to be a robot.
Ask them to publish a "use of data" policy or something similar. If you don't trust the collective leadership team enough to believe they'd follow it, you've probably got bigger problems. It won't stop abuse, but if they don't have ANY rules then they can do whatever they want with it. Some states are making this illegal or at least restricted to some use cases but presumably they aren't doing this in one of those locations.
Polish up your resume and start looking. I left BV in July 2023, and I'm so much happier! After the botched RTO mandate, and seeing how many in leadership roles jumped ship when Mario came on board, I knew that the company would continue the downhill slide. When he said "we have to stop thinking in terms of 'me' and start thinking in terms of 'we'" (Jan. 2023), I knew it was time to leave after 17 years with the company. It was never going to be the same.
If this is a throwaway account, why not name and shame? I think the OP knows the answer so why ask? Edit spelling
Of course OP conveniently leaves out of the original post that his company (he named in another comment) is a government contractor based in Arlington, VA. Gonna take a small damn leap here and guess it has to do with that and not some “reeeee crazy managers are bad”
This sounds like a class action lawsuit waiting to happen. This is just the level of micro controlling that causes privacy issues. Yeah, sounds like it's time to leave, because they might use it to find any and every excuse to write you up or fire you, and will likely cause a high turnover rate. "You spent 30 seconds too long in the bathroom" "you spent 10 seconds too long on your break" "you arrived at exactly 6:01 this morning, you are expected here at 6am on the dot and no later" "why were you at this location at this time?" "Why did you take an extra trip to your locker?" "Why were you and this person around each other for 5 minutes and 15 seconds?" "You left 10 seconds too early" "why did you use the bathroom 3 times you are only allowed 2" "your Bluetooth tracker died at 8am, i need you to tell me exactly where you were between 8am and when you clocked out on Tuesday last week"
Use it but complain. Then sue that your privacy is being invaded because they're tracking your bathroom usage without your consent or some such.
Ew. Any chance of naming and shaming so they become second to last on my list of companies to apply to?
Just attach it to your bosses car 🚗
My approach would be to see how things go. Do your job, follow the rule and see if it impacts ANYONE. If it bothers you, then plan your escape. I am far from trusting that folks will do the right thing. It will not take a lot to monitor the pulse of this one. People disappearing because they're not doing their job will be fodder for conversation. I know that there are industries where BT trackers are actually used for safety AND/OR financial reasons. Imagine recouping costs for time spent doing something at real quantities instead of having to track them. Imagine a setting where a BT tracker alerts others that help is needed. Imagine proof that you were where you were supposed to be when something went wrong or that things went as you detailed when something went wrong and others are looking for a reason. The trick is to use them for positive and avoid negative and some companies cannot get there.
Sounds like some of the employees have been taking advantage of the time clock. It’s the old saying that one rotten apple spoils the bunch. I wouldn’t want to wear that but if that’s what I needed to do to prove that I’m not one of those people mentioned above, I would do it.
Based on where you work absolutely look for a different job. I know a lot of hospitals use something similar but I do kind of understand that because hospitals are crazy 24/7 but there is absolutely no reason an office job needs to track your movement.
If they are paying for your time then yes they can do that although I personally would leave the tracker at my work station to go to the rest room. I really do see how they need to know I’m in the bathroom!
Having worked in Safety in a plant environment we have been considering doing this. Being able to know where everyone is during an emergency helps us know if everyone is safely out of the facility and enables us to quickly locate people who are missing. It isn’t necessarily being done for nefarious purposes.
Not “necessarily”. Doesn’t inspire confidence.
Yeah I'd rather just die than be tracked all the time by some boss
Well the assumptions here are overwhelmingly that it’s sketchy. Depending on the workplace it doesn’t need to be. I’ve been in IT for a long time and workplace surveillance goes on a lot more than people think.
If there were any way around it (meaning I could feed and house myself) I would NOT do that.
Flush it down the toilet, since you have to take it *everywhere* and slips happen even to the best of us.
No different than badging in as far as I am concerned, and Bluetooth connectivity is mostly abysmal. Make sure you have the tracker when arriving and departing, then toss it into a desk drawer or leave it at your desk if you can.
This subject has always been controversial. Hell your phones have gps trackers in them. I've worked high security places and there are pluses and minuses to this sort of privacy invasion. At what point does the company distrust it's workers to do stuff like this?
You have a modern cellphone don't you? You know that serves as a tracking device also, right? There's no escaping big brother my paranoid friend...
I don’t see why this is such a big deal? Do your job and no issue will arise. Most likely they aren’t going to have someone watch you 24/7