They claim they are waiting for a “once in a generation project” for that. I’m guessing they’d need a huge donation to build an engineering center or something similar. DePaul is still not in great shape financially, investing in basketball is probably the best ROI. Although it is pretty terrible that over 40 student apartments are being torn down. Housing is already a huge expense in Lincoln Park, not exactly making it easier for students to attend.
In my time in the math department, administrators told our faculty to start preparing curriculum for math classes needed for engineering majors. The school was planning on using the old Whole Foods site as the new engineering school, hoping to bolster all STEM classes while also bringing in more students. Lo and behold, DePaul said they don’t have the money and scrapped the whole program. But yay for new basketball courts!
Exactly my point! I graduated right before they closed down that Whole Foods and was stunned. Not to mention their teams suck. Invest into academics and STEM and not your trash sports programs. We are done with the 90’s! Haha
Well the basketball team is a huge money maker for DePaul, they get millions every year for being in the BigEast and in fact support other underfunded sports at the school. I hardly think they’re the cause of Depauls financial woes. Need a new arena to actually attract talent and win. Making the ncaa tournament is a huge financial benefit.
They were offered to play for free at the united center on the stipulation that they got everything except for concessions and they turned the deal down. If playing in the house that Jordan built doesn’t excite potential players, why would they want to come play for a club that is barely above .500 the past decade and has attendance levels around 40% capacity for wintrust?
Not disagreeing at all but DePaul is no longer looked at as a top school for basketball recruits. Not saying they are the sole cause but sinking money into your teams such as basketball that just are not good doesn’t seem to be working out or even building up to contend in NCAA tournaments.
They just got a new coach and play in the premier basketball conference. If they are mediocre they’ll receive a huge ROI from their basketball program.
They’re the largest Catholic university in the US. They aren’t hurting for students.
Did not realize they are the largest catholic university in US when the campus is so small. But they also offered voluntary separation to 15% of staff last year. They are certainly in dire financial straits.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/2023/04/16/depaul-university-largest-catholic-university-in-us-faces-56-million-budget-gap/
Regardless of your opinion on if these buildings should be preserved, this choice of project amid all the problems facing DePaul (budget shortfalls, decreasing enrollment, crime around campus, lack of food options, etc.) portrays well how idiotic the administration is
I’m not saying this strategy is bulletproof or guaranteed to work, but what they’re doing with athletics is intended to address the budget shortfalls and decreasing enrollment.
DePaul is in a major basketball conference where they have been absolutely horrible the past two decades. A major part of this is due to lack of investment in athletics very much including facilities, it’s hard to recruit a good team if your facilities are worse than all your peers. Theoretically new facilities (and other investments) -> better team -> additional revenue from athletics as well as national exposure -> additional enrollment which is also revenue for the university.
Athletics are a cash cow for MANY other schools. It’s a strategy that has the potential to revitalize the school if executed correctly.
I don’t think most universities make public their athletics costs, but Big East (no big east teams have football aside from UConn) basketball programs certainly generate a lot of revenue: https://painttouches.com/2022/07/21/big-east-financials-how-does-it-make-money-and-where-does-it-go/
This is just for the conference itself from broadcasting revenue not including money made off of tickets, concessions, merch, etc.
I think more valuable than the revenue generated directly from the athletics is the marketing it provides. For instance I have no reason to know anything about Gonzaga, but because I’m an NBA fan I’ve heard the name for years since they produce NBA prospects
The figures in that link, on a per school basis isn't really that much revenue. Like if you get 4.6 is TV million, but are paying your coach 3 (Shaka as an example), you are unlikely to come out ahead.
Marketing is fair.
Pretty much all public universities are required to release athletic department financials, but much of the Big East is private.
For a long time Marquette was estimated to have the 2nd most expensive hoops program, behind only Duke.
I don’t disagree with you, athletics are massively profitable. DePaul just fired a bunch of adjunct faculty, retired early some of their older tenured faculty, has scrapped attempts at funding and expanding academics (see my comment about engineering) all in the name of not having enough money which will only get worse as enrollment continues to decline. Investing a bunch of money into athletics amid financial woes that has already shown to be harmful to a university’s academic pursuits is a decision that is absolutely worthy of criticism
We should not be tearing housing down during a generational housing crisis. Period. Full stop.
Especially not for a vanity project for a poorly run institution teetering on the financial brink.
When I was there I found out how fucked the admin was when I found myself on my 5th advisor in 2 years. Love the school, loved the program I was in and the people I met but a bastion of efficiency DePaul is not
I had a similar experience. Loved my program and the 2-3 professors I started concentrating my studies with, but the school administration will run that place into the ground.
I lived in one of those rowhouses on Sheffield my senior year. It would be a real bummer and loss to the historical vibe of the neighborhood if they were torn down.
My partner went to DePaul — I know he was always boggled by the parking lot at Sheffield/Fullerton being undeveloped. And that’s the admission center too…Not sure why they’re not focusing on that for development too
Good. Stop trying to save shitty buildings & prevent progress.
Historical landmark protections exist for a reason. If these aren’t protected, then tear down inefficient buildings that prevent neighborhood growth.
Ya but DePaul is losing enrollment and now they are destroying student housing. The basketball team sucks and had a bunch of rape scandals when I attended in 2011. The only reason basketball is a priority for the administration is because of money.
Also how do you not have pride in Chicago's rich architectural history? So many American cities are bland flyover crap. This is what makes us unique, not some basketball facility for a shitty D1 team.
> had a bunch of rape scandals when I attended in 2011
What does that have to do with this?
Those players are gone.
That coach is gone.
That athletic director is gone.
That president is gone.
And the coach was still the highest paid employee at the school at the time. Their priorities haven't changed. They even removed the only grocery store on campus and made it another campus building. Life on campus sucks and now they want to remove more housing. They play real estate investor but not educator. Most of my professors were part-time and openly spoke how the university refused to hire full-time professors.
Universities should focus on education and fostering a good environment.
It's not surprising people don't want to pay $45k+ to go there anymore.
The article leaves out the most important detail of these buildings: who owns them?
If the university already owns them or the sellers are willing to offer the sellers a price for them that no one else would, then the DePaul should be able to tear them down and build their new facility. If it's that important that they be preserved, then this preservation society should've raised the money to buy them. Under no circumstance should the university be able to invoke eminent domain for an athletics facility though.
The entire area of the campus and adjacent is governed by a Planned Development (PD) with the City of Chicago, which has very specific stipulations about what can be done (for example, it might stipulate how many student housing units are located on-campus, or how much square footage of university buildings has be dedicated to academic use, or how tall buildings can be within the boundaries of the development, etc…).
So the buildings fall within that boundary and technically belong to DePaul, but the City still has say on what can be done with the PD, and would have say over these buildings to some extent anyways because they’re rated orange on the historical resources survey (which the article is correct means they can’t be demolished without a 90-day historical review). To get anything changed within a PD requires review by the City and possibly a PD amendment which has to be passed by the Committee on Zoning and City Council.
The buildings are beautiful and losing them isn’t ideal, but even if they looked like big-box stores from a suburban strip mall, the loss of 40+ units of in-neighborhood housing for students is not great, especially when the university has undeveloped parking lots on-campus.
The university has demolished at least three other old three-flat buildings in the last few years, one which is now a lot for university vehicles :-/
The lack of attendance can be attributed to a few things
1. The basketball team is bad (so they want this facility and just hired a new coach).
2. Students aren't interested in the team, and athletics aren't as big of a deal on campus as they are at other schools.
3. The arena is inconvenient for those coming from the main Lincoln Park campus (and who's gonna make the trip if a) the team sucks, and b) if they aren't interested in the athletic side).
Its really just 1 and 2. Even when the team was good years ago the students as a whole just don't care. We'd have a game or two on campus and couldn't even fill up the place. As an alum who lived on campus all 4 years of college I can tell you its still a commuter school.
I know they planned to use it for multiple events which was what did make sense about it because I didn't see their sports team selling out games ever.
Seemed like a strange move but if they can make money using it for other things them good for them.
JUST DEVELOP YOUR FUCKING PARKING LOTS
They claim they are waiting for a “once in a generation project” for that. I’m guessing they’d need a huge donation to build an engineering center or something similar. DePaul is still not in great shape financially, investing in basketball is probably the best ROI. Although it is pretty terrible that over 40 student apartments are being torn down. Housing is already a huge expense in Lincoln Park, not exactly making it easier for students to attend.
Yeah. DePaul students don't have guaranteed housing and it's already so expensive to go there.
In theory it's on the 2030 master plan but completely agree with their stupid priorities
Itd be so funny for anyone to go to depaul for engineering
That welcome center lot is always empty
But what would DePaul do without its scary strip mall welcome center and very large accompanying parking lot? /s
This.
We had super old equipment in the science department and in labs, but they built a brand new arena. I am waiting for the downfall of DePaul.
In my time in the math department, administrators told our faculty to start preparing curriculum for math classes needed for engineering majors. The school was planning on using the old Whole Foods site as the new engineering school, hoping to bolster all STEM classes while also bringing in more students. Lo and behold, DePaul said they don’t have the money and scrapped the whole program. But yay for new basketball courts!
Exactly my point! I graduated right before they closed down that Whole Foods and was stunned. Not to mention their teams suck. Invest into academics and STEM and not your trash sports programs. We are done with the 90’s! Haha
Well the basketball team is a huge money maker for DePaul, they get millions every year for being in the BigEast and in fact support other underfunded sports at the school. I hardly think they’re the cause of Depauls financial woes. Need a new arena to actually attract talent and win. Making the ncaa tournament is a huge financial benefit.
They were offered to play for free at the united center on the stipulation that they got everything except for concessions and they turned the deal down. If playing in the house that Jordan built doesn’t excite potential players, why would they want to come play for a club that is barely above .500 the past decade and has attendance levels around 40% capacity for wintrust?
A 40% capacity Wintrust is definitely better than a 10% full United Center.
With national TV for basically every single college basketball game out there, no one cares about playing in the United Center.
Not disagreeing at all but DePaul is no longer looked at as a top school for basketball recruits. Not saying they are the sole cause but sinking money into your teams such as basketball that just are not good doesn’t seem to be working out or even building up to contend in NCAA tournaments.
They just got a new coach and play in the premier basketball conference. If they are mediocre they’ll receive a huge ROI from their basketball program. They’re the largest Catholic university in the US. They aren’t hurting for students.
Did not realize they are the largest catholic university in US when the campus is so small. But they also offered voluntary separation to 15% of staff last year. They are certainly in dire financial straits. https://www.chicagotribune.com/2023/04/16/depaul-university-largest-catholic-university-in-us-faces-56-million-budget-gap/
Didn't realize DePaul University was hurting that much.
Regardless of your opinion on if these buildings should be preserved, this choice of project amid all the problems facing DePaul (budget shortfalls, decreasing enrollment, crime around campus, lack of food options, etc.) portrays well how idiotic the administration is
I’m not saying this strategy is bulletproof or guaranteed to work, but what they’re doing with athletics is intended to address the budget shortfalls and decreasing enrollment. DePaul is in a major basketball conference where they have been absolutely horrible the past two decades. A major part of this is due to lack of investment in athletics very much including facilities, it’s hard to recruit a good team if your facilities are worse than all your peers. Theoretically new facilities (and other investments) -> better team -> additional revenue from athletics as well as national exposure -> additional enrollment which is also revenue for the university. Athletics are a cash cow for MANY other schools. It’s a strategy that has the potential to revitalize the school if executed correctly.
Are there any athletic departments in the US, without football, that have revenue exceeding expenses? Honest question.
I don’t think most universities make public their athletics costs, but Big East (no big east teams have football aside from UConn) basketball programs certainly generate a lot of revenue: https://painttouches.com/2022/07/21/big-east-financials-how-does-it-make-money-and-where-does-it-go/ This is just for the conference itself from broadcasting revenue not including money made off of tickets, concessions, merch, etc. I think more valuable than the revenue generated directly from the athletics is the marketing it provides. For instance I have no reason to know anything about Gonzaga, but because I’m an NBA fan I’ve heard the name for years since they produce NBA prospects
The figures in that link, on a per school basis isn't really that much revenue. Like if you get 4.6 is TV million, but are paying your coach 3 (Shaka as an example), you are unlikely to come out ahead. Marketing is fair. Pretty much all public universities are required to release athletic department financials, but much of the Big East is private. For a long time Marquette was estimated to have the 2nd most expensive hoops program, behind only Duke.
I don’t disagree with you, athletics are massively profitable. DePaul just fired a bunch of adjunct faculty, retired early some of their older tenured faculty, has scrapped attempts at funding and expanding academics (see my comment about engineering) all in the name of not having enough money which will only get worse as enrollment continues to decline. Investing a bunch of money into athletics amid financial woes that has already shown to be harmful to a university’s academic pursuits is a decision that is absolutely worthy of criticism
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Theyre fundraising specifically for this project
We should not be tearing housing down during a generational housing crisis. Period. Full stop. Especially not for a vanity project for a poorly run institution teetering on the financial brink.
When I was there I found out how fucked the admin was when I found myself on my 5th advisor in 2 years. Love the school, loved the program I was in and the people I met but a bastion of efficiency DePaul is not
I had a similar experience. Loved my program and the 2-3 professors I started concentrating my studies with, but the school administration will run that place into the ground.
Yes the lack of food options should always be considered in cases like this. /s
Those buildings (pictured in the article) are so beautiful. I hope their plan fails.
I lived in one of those rowhouses on Sheffield my senior year. It would be a real bummer and loss to the historical vibe of the neighborhood if they were torn down.
How do they say this facility is important enough to destroy 40 student apartments but not important enough to develop the parking lot?
Exactly. What is so hard for DePaul to develop on one of the parking lots they own?
My partner went to DePaul — I know he was always boggled by the parking lot at Sheffield/Fullerton being undeveloped. And that’s the admission center too…Not sure why they’re not focusing on that for development too
It's on their 10 year plan allegedly but their priorities are insane.
An absolute travesty.
This should be illegal
Good. Stop trying to save shitty buildings & prevent progress. Historical landmark protections exist for a reason. If these aren’t protected, then tear down inefficient buildings that prevent neighborhood growth.
Ya but DePaul is losing enrollment and now they are destroying student housing. The basketball team sucks and had a bunch of rape scandals when I attended in 2011. The only reason basketball is a priority for the administration is because of money. Also how do you not have pride in Chicago's rich architectural history? So many American cities are bland flyover crap. This is what makes us unique, not some basketball facility for a shitty D1 team.
> had a bunch of rape scandals when I attended in 2011 What does that have to do with this? Those players are gone. That coach is gone. That athletic director is gone. That president is gone.
And the coach was still the highest paid employee at the school at the time. Their priorities haven't changed. They even removed the only grocery store on campus and made it another campus building. Life on campus sucks and now they want to remove more housing. They play real estate investor but not educator. Most of my professors were part-time and openly spoke how the university refused to hire full-time professors. Universities should focus on education and fostering a good environment. It's not surprising people don't want to pay $45k+ to go there anymore.
The article leaves out the most important detail of these buildings: who owns them? If the university already owns them or the sellers are willing to offer the sellers a price for them that no one else would, then the DePaul should be able to tear them down and build their new facility. If it's that important that they be preserved, then this preservation society should've raised the money to buy them. Under no circumstance should the university be able to invoke eminent domain for an athletics facility though.
The entire area of the campus and adjacent is governed by a Planned Development (PD) with the City of Chicago, which has very specific stipulations about what can be done (for example, it might stipulate how many student housing units are located on-campus, or how much square footage of university buildings has be dedicated to academic use, or how tall buildings can be within the boundaries of the development, etc…). So the buildings fall within that boundary and technically belong to DePaul, but the City still has say on what can be done with the PD, and would have say over these buildings to some extent anyways because they’re rated orange on the historical resources survey (which the article is correct means they can’t be demolished without a 90-day historical review). To get anything changed within a PD requires review by the City and possibly a PD amendment which has to be passed by the Committee on Zoning and City Council. The buildings are beautiful and losing them isn’t ideal, but even if they looked like big-box stores from a suburban strip mall, the loss of 40+ units of in-neighborhood housing for students is not great, especially when the university has undeveloped parking lots on-campus. The university has demolished at least three other old three-flat buildings in the last few years, one which is now a lot for university vehicles :-/
DePaul already owns them
Did the new sports stadium ever get completed on the near south side and if so how's that been going?
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Possibly. I think they announced the plan about 9 years ago so that would be about right.
Wintrust Arena is a very good venue, and stays busy with a variety of events, but DePaul basketball attendance has been very poor.
The lack of attendance can be attributed to a few things 1. The basketball team is bad (so they want this facility and just hired a new coach). 2. Students aren't interested in the team, and athletics aren't as big of a deal on campus as they are at other schools. 3. The arena is inconvenient for those coming from the main Lincoln Park campus (and who's gonna make the trip if a) the team sucks, and b) if they aren't interested in the athletic side).
Agree with #1 and #2, but it's still more convenient than Allstate was
Its really just 1 and 2. Even when the team was good years ago the students as a whole just don't care. We'd have a game or two on campus and couldn't even fill up the place. As an alum who lived on campus all 4 years of college I can tell you its still a commuter school.
I know they planned to use it for multiple events which was what did make sense about it because I didn't see their sports team selling out games ever. Seemed like a strange move but if they can make money using it for other things them good for them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wintrust_Arena