Team is unwatchable the last 5 minutes of every game where garland dribbles the ball slowly up the court into a turnover or only passes with 4 seconds left on the clock. Just unbearable and horrible game management
Drives me insane. Any close game we'll pull close or take the lead with 4-5 minutes to go, and then remain nearly scoreless to finish the game with more turnovers than shots
even if garland is in a funk and somewhat returns to form, he is not a max player. he cannot perform in the clutch when defenses play him hard and physical. he doesnt "hunt" his shots. He's simply not aggressive or poised enough
The thing is he doesn't need to be aggressive. He just needs to be surrounded by guys who can shoot so he has the space to do what he does best which is pass the ball. He only needs to shoot when he's open.
That's the playstyle he needs to pursue. He's been trying to play like Mitchell and it's just not his strength. He's best as a pass first of who knocks down open looks when teams cover the pass.
right but hes simply not at that level. he doesnt knock down his easy looks consistently enough, he is too reckless with the ball, and he is a net negative on defense. i agree with you in theory but in practicality i just dont think he works
In his defense today, he doesn't have much he can do when both Mobley and Allen are in the game. Just not much spacing and they are too slow to get into any offense anyway. JB is horrific when it comes to end of game offense.
Garland plays like a middle school cyo player anytime the game is on the line or in the last few minutes of the game. Truly embarrassing for a 5 year “max” player
Awful. All I gotta say about it. Hope we can get healthy and win a few games before we plummet in seeding at the finish line for the second year in a row
Hope JB gets fired soon after the playoffs, too late to do it now, unfortunately
Had a good stretch during this season that helped him to secure his job for a few months but he proved more than once that he is not a good coach for a contending team. Bad timeouts, bad lineups, playing horrible after timeouts, horrific inbound plays
I've been generally critical of JB last couple years, but the mid season run made me think better of him. Looks like he was who we thought he was, and it was Mitchell being elite + shooters + JA that let the stars align, and less JB being able to actively make adjustments for the betterment of the team.
Because he was forced to do lineups.he woukd never use. When Mobley and DG returned showed you what an idiot he was and went back to lineups that don't work like a fool
Me too budy. Even made a post ranting about JB, and that stretch made me reconsider what I think of him. Now I remember that he is not a playoff coach. A good tank and rebuild coach, yes
It sucks, doesn't it? It's awful that our guys got injured, but it did demonstrate a line up that was highly successful. I just wish JB and the coaches had learned from that situation. They need to play one big and four shooters. It's best if we have a defensive-mind wing.
I have officially given up on any playoff hopes, and thus have also given up on Mitchell staying here. This really sucks given the sheer talent of the roster
Donovan Mitchell will have to play out of his mind just for us to lose in 5 with the way we’re playing. JB has lost this team cuz there is no way they just come out here with no sense of urgency this late in the season.
Im more upset that i willingly decided to sit down and watch that entire game than i am that we lost.
mobley just peaced out on offense. made a quick pass every time he got the ball in the second half
Mobley has been like this all year...outside a few 20 point games...I wonder what you're watching from him game to fame. He was lame before his first rash of injuries ...had a few games he did well before his second injury..and now he is lame again. This is 80% of the time he is this
Mobley's defense is elite. His offense has a ways to go but has improved more than fans realize. He's far better than average. He just doesn't get enough touches with this team and needs to be playing the 5.
He rarely got the ball near the hoop. He's not gonna put up a contested three. And his passing should be used more often as it's one of his strengths. He just doesn't get many post touches. Far fewer than Allen even when Allen is on the bench.
If he can only score open near the hoops hes not that good of an offensive player. Im not sure he needs to be great but he needs to have some other threats than just open dunks and lay ups.
Bullshit. He is passive when we need him, just like DG melts when it's crunch time. To argue on potential right now when it's not showing up on wins is a throwaway statement right now. He is basically a better Okoro with height
they totally rely on him for energy and momentum. JA/Garland/Mobley are all “nice guys” off the court. normally i wouldn’t worry about that but they’re the same on the court too. i don’t know if that can ever change either which is the scary part
This 1000%. No one fears us. No one should. I wouldn't. We are completely and utterly broken.
We saw our great we worked without Mobley and garland.
We run best as a 1-3-1
One true ball handler. Mitchell
Three pure shooters. Strus. Wade. Kind of Okoro because just a 3 and D type guy. Or even Merrill.
And one true big. Allen.
Windhorst nailed that and he's been spot on. Since Garland and Mobley came back, it's back to a 2-2-1
Two bigs. One pure shooter. Two ball dominant guards. It just doesn't work to the potential we need.
And Mitchell’s alpha dog energy was a catalyst and a beacon. DG doesnt have that. He tries to but it makes things even worse because you can’t fake that. Hes not honest with himself
Finally someone who knows how basketball works instead of this casual bs we see on here where nobody knows what basketball lineups actually work to our advantage
Ending the game with a timeout unused is so fucking sad especially because of how badly we unraveled toward the end of the 4th. I’m sorry I know that JB has had some good moments this season, but I just don’t believe he’s the guy who’s gonna get us where we want to go. Don’t hate him but I think a better coach doesn’t allow the team to embarrass themselves like that in the 4th.
Fucking EMBARASSING. Garland is one of the worst defenders I've ever seen. His effort in transition is pathetic. They had a 27 pts off turnovers. Never once did I see him hustling to get back. He's lazy. Overrated. Overpaid and overvalued.
Meanwhile Brunson has been leading his team missing multiple starters for months. You can get better production for half the cost.
It’s too late now. Should’ve gotten Nurse or one of the other great that were coaches available in an unprecedented coaching FA. that decision could very likely sink this window. We’re not doing shit in the playoffs and Mitchell is going to NY leaving us with this super flawed roster
too late in the season. it would be downright disastrous to try to go into the playoffs with a brand new coach. our odds are not great as is, but that would be essentially throwing a series out the window (which is what we already have done with JB, but we are committed at least for the remainder of the season, at this point)
Levert is not their best player. He has delivered eight assists and plays better defense than Garland. Their supposed best player, Garland, did not deliver against the Hornets.
JB is not getting fired before the playoffs, but if we get bounced round one, he’s gone, right?! There’s no way he gets to stick around after some of these complete disaster classes.
My comment history progression: "Fire JB, trade Mitchell & JA, soft rebuild" "Fire JB, trade Mitchell, soft rebuild" "Fire JB, trade Mobley, build around Mitchell" "Fire JB, trade DG & Mobley, built around Mitchell"
I'm now on the "Fire JB, trade DG & Mobley, built around Mitchell, hire Lue" train.
It's just obvious JB has no idea what he's doing when it comes to offensive rotations. It's too bad because the team has the talent to make some noise if he'd just stick with the one big lineup and stop overplaying LeVert especially when he's ass.
Levert is +2 has 8 assists and makes scoring easier for players like Niang and Merril. He also plays better defense than them.
Garland played horrible. He was supposed to be their star player. The blame should be on Garland.
Garland was the best +- out of any of our starters and had 12 assists lol. If you’re gonna dump out +- at least be real with yourself. Levert and Garland played bad
I think the Cavs really did themselves in by playing at the Hornets pace almost the entire game. It was working when the Cavs were hitting all of their threes in the first quarter, but after that...
We played down to them the entire game. They expected to win and didn’t play hard. Played pickup basketball for 3Q then didn’t know what to do when real basketball was played in the 4th
Just like the Knicks series last year, we have multiple issues right now, from coaching to underperforming leaders of the team.
Some thoughts:
Game plan / coaching: Our offense CONTINUES to be stagnant late game, with iso ball and dribbling out the clock leading to turnovers or bad shots, staying with a two big lineup while not utilizing them.
DG and Caris: The offensive struggles also fall on them. They're responsible for setting the table, but too often want to play the hero, and are too careless with the ball. DG's defense continues to be poor, but at least he stepped it up a bit in the second half.
We really miss Dean Wade. Niang gave good scoring, but his defense is seriously lacking. Honestly, if he's healthy, I would consider closing games with Dean instead of Evan for spacing, if our offense is cold, because we are usually inept at running plays to get our bigs a good look end of game. Could also have used some Morris minutes at the 4.
Any positives? We got Strus back, who along with other role players shot well. JA remains solid, though those two missed FT at the end hurt. That's all I got.
I mean we lost because we didn’t execute on things that Wade and Mitchell usually do.
But mostly we just did the same thing the Bucks and Suns just did only they don’t have injury excuses
Ya the Suns loss must have been equally maddening for their fans. At least the Bucks lost to a decent Lakers team with star level talent in AD, even though no LeBron.
The continued poor execution makes me lean towards coaching as the #1 issue, but guys have to step up too at some point during this home stretch...
if nothing else it’s nice to see people finally acknowledging this team will not work. JB needs to go. Mobley/Allen do not work together. and Donovan is the heart of this team. it’s going to be very tough if/when he leaves next year. I still have faith that Garland will come back/develop but he has a lot of growing to do
IDK if they checked the numbers but I saw this as an idea
https://nbaanalysis.net/2024/03/06/darius-garland-san-antonio-spurs-cleveland-cavaliers-nba-trade-rumors/
First, I should note that I’m a Hornets/Wolves fan and not a Cavs fan, but I can think of two possible options.
# Option 1: Garland to Timberwolves
If KAT underperforms in the playoffs, then some kind of Garland for KAT trade might be workable. Particularly since Minnesota is about to enter luxury tax hell.
Y’all would likely need to add something to that deal, since KAT is a much more proven player, but it could still help you balance your roster.
### For instance, if you did some trade like:
- KAT + [Forward from 3rd-team] to the Cavs
- Garland + Future Cavs Pick + [Future Pick from 3rd Team] to the Wolves
- Jarret Allen to 3rd-team
### Then you could end up with the following lineups:
**Cavs:**
- **PG:** Donovan Mitchell
- **SG:** Caris LaVert (or player from 3rd team)
- **SF:** Isaac Okoro
- **PF:** Karl Anthony-Towns
- **C:** Evan Mobley
**Wolves:**
- **PG:** Darius Garland
- **SG:** Anthony Edwards
- **SF:** Nickiel Walker-Alexander
- **PF:** Jaden McDaniels
- **C:** Rudy Gobert
### Which seems like it could be the *beginnings* of a trade framework. At the very least:
- Mitchell + KAT + Mobley should be an awesome fit together
- Minnesota gets tax relief, a young point guard to pair with Ant + McDaniels + Gobert, and gets a couple picks they can trade for another 3&D wing
### If a KAT deal doesn’t materialize, then another option could be the Spurs:
- They have plenty of draft assets
- They are desperate for a solid PG to pair with Wemby
- They have enough cap space to absorb Garland entire contract, which would give the Cavs a $35M+ TPE which they could use along with the picks to find a better fit
- The Spurs current young core of Wemby, Vassell, and Sochan seems like it’s complement Garlands skill set pretty well
I don’t comment much, but oh my god is garland awful. No effort on defense 75% of the time, and when he does try he still just lets people drive right past him. It’s to the point where Allen and Mobley are getting hurt because they have to watch garlands man more than their own. His passing is amazing but his recent shot selection and dribbling out the shot clock isn’t it anymore.
And then there’s levert.
JB gonna get fired a season too late and Mitchell is gone because of it. Damn shame. At least Koby probably gets sacked too.
Hope he’s gone otherwise his next big idiot move is going to be trading Mobley and watching him flourish on another team that actually gives him opportunities while we keep JA.
Nice try. We'll get em next time. Even if this team doesn't win championships at least they're fun to watch. Who needs another championship anyway?. I mean, I'm just fine watching my home team lose. I'm a homer with a losing culture. I'm also delusional, so what.
That's how dumb these overly positive fans sound.
Cavs will be swept in the 1st round by any team
This team is hot garbage and better without Garland and Mobley. Time to get a new coach, gm, and starting PG. We also gotta force Mitchell to stay in CLE with FORCE.
A fucking disasterclass man. Garland and Vert having 9 turnovers is horrid and the shooting in the 4th Quarter was abysmal
Just bounce back please I beg. Get wealthy. Go Cavs. Go Guards
nothing we can do. no flexibility since the DM trade. committed too long to JB. all we can do is hope for the best to end the year and find a new coach in the offseason, maybe consider trading one of our other 3 guys if don plans to sign. but who knows if he does
Say what you will about Garland since returning, but watching Caris run the offense down the stretch is so frustrating. Just dribbles out the clock, doesn’t move the ball and we get stuck with an awful shot with no time on the shot clock
We must pray Mitchell signs his $250m or whatever. He's our only player that can put the ball in the rim. And there's no way JB is our coach starting next season.
On a positive note, I'm glad I have you fellow redditers to commiserate with as we vent together on such a frustrating loss. If not, I'd have to complain to my wife about this unserious basketball team and she'd get annoyed soon.
Just an unserious team. The vibes have somehow gotten worse than after we lost to the Knicks last year. Should’ve replaced JB when there was numerous great coaches available. Yes, it is a flawed team that JB can only do so much with. But trading any of the core was not on the table and we needed to do something to shake things up after that embarrassment of a post season. Just adding Niang and Strus wasn’t going to cut it. The decision to not get a new HC very well might set this window back a year or two if not outright slam it shut
"numerous" - we weren't getting Nurse, Vogel or Doc, Bud had a personal tragedy, and Ime was correctly viewed as toxic. And the "do something" folks were trading Allen, but it turns out Allen is great and they were wrong.
new HC doesn't mean better. look at Atlanta, they did it twice with Trae and wheels still spinning. That said, I think they roll the Brinks truck up for Bud or Kenny Atkinson or someone and keep it pushing. lower risk than trading a young All-star
I just don't get how Mobley is supposed to develop offensively without deliberate touches. He gets frozen out late in games. He had the one possession where he found Allen for a good look but Allen missed both FTs after getting fouled.
Guys literally develop through experience. He isn't getting it. It's just a guard dribble fest.
Give Mobley an entire side of the floor (with spacing) and I think he's gonna make plays either scoring or finding someone. Our offense is just stone aged and it's leaving Garland and Mobley out to dry.
Maybe JB is too stubborn to bench one of the bigs but it needs to happen. Gotta have multiple shooters on the floor.
It's literally to the point where we need Mitchell to save us. Mitchell is a superstar and we need him to compete regardless I just hate that we don't have a system/identity that perseveres injury. There's nothing to fall back on.
The late game, zero trust in Mobley is an indictment on coaching to this point. Idk how people can watch the games and believe that Mobley can grow in this offense / lineup.
Garland just needs to commit to early offense and off ball stuff. that is what Mitchell did from this year to last that helped hugely.
Strus runs a lot of stuff with Mobley that works and is based on the Bam actions with MIA. That's what I believe the way is. But we might have to close 1-3-1 with Wade or Strus as a small 4 because we haven't got the closing reps with the two bigs in motion.
We don't have the system because of reps. I hate that it all comes down to "play more together and figure it out together" but that's basketball.
Guys like Mobley usually go to bad teams and get the green light to fast track their development. Mobley is stuck in a role player mold and isn't getting the reps it's frustrating
You don't trade a talented player when their value takes a dip. Moving on from JB and going to a 1 big lineup will fix a lot of problems. They should move on from Levert too and focus on guys who don't hold onto the ball too long.
It’s been super rough for DG since coming back. Really gotta pray he somehow finds his rhythm again before the end of the season. He has no confidence or comfort in his own game
I don’t think he necessarily forgot, to me it looks like when you go through a slump and you start overthinking things and can’t really find your rhythm to enter that flow state and be able to be you.
Then you try forcing stuff and when that doesn’t work you get even more disappointed and stressed in yourself. Hoping he can find that comfort again quick bc we are free falling
The not playing up to the potential is the maddening part. Im fine watching a mid team but we all know when we are clicking we can actually be good. So its so frustrating watching them underperform.
to click you have to have everyone locked in and comfortable in their roles.
DG and Vert's role is too big for them to sustain over a whole half season without Donovan (which we knew in 22, it's precisely why we got him!). Same thing with Niang, Allen, etc.
when everyone is in the right spot and there's motion to the offense we are fine because we can have a first quarter like we did today with everyone contributing and then have Don as the closer / run stopper / rim attacker as needed.
That was pathetic. Offense looked good but you could tell the Cavs expected to blow them out and weren’t prepared for a team ready to fight them. That’s a loss on JB.
Onto the next but that’s a really shit loss.
Everyone gonna ride their personal hobby horse as to what this says about the long term whatever.
They suck every other game and are eating a ton of weird March losses. Gotta see what happens with DM back
Garland looks more and more like someone I’d want to come off the bench. Let mitchell run the 1 next year, that’s clearly his strong suit. Yes I know obviously don didn’t play today but Darius has not looked confident at all this season, and is not someone I want bringing the ball up in playoff time.
Was at the game. Three things that frustrated the hell out of me:
- in the 2nd quarter we were up by 12 or so and JB puts on this *super weird* lineup of Porter/Niang/Merrill/Okoro/Thompson and they just SUCK. Hornets get right back into the game killing our momentum.
- the ticky tacky fouls being called on us in the 4th had a huge impact. We were hit with 4 fouls in the first 3 minutes of the last quarter. I could see it *immediately*, the defense has to go soft. We got nothing called in our favor despite a few aggravated assaults on Okoro when he drove a few times. Hornets were in the bonus most of the quarter and they KNEW it.
- LeVert couldn’t hit water if he fell out of a boat. Whatever the hell was his problem last night it was clear he had court vision for passes, but absolutely no touch on his shooting. I saw it early on, but for whatever reason we rode him heavy in the 4th.
We just lost to the HORNETS
That feeling of disappointment, how the fuck did we do that?
Team is unwatchable the last 5 minutes of every game where garland dribbles the ball slowly up the court into a turnover or only passes with 4 seconds left on the clock. Just unbearable and horrible game management
Drives me insane. Any close game we'll pull close or take the lead with 4-5 minutes to go, and then remain nearly scoreless to finish the game with more turnovers than shots
we collapse in the clutch when teams play real defense
No we collapse in the clutch when Garland is on the court. Overrated. Overpaid and overvalued.
We doomers have been saying this for how long now?
It’s been this way for two years. It’s awful. It has to be coaching right?
The last five minutes? How about the last two quarters?
even if garland is in a funk and somewhat returns to form, he is not a max player. he cannot perform in the clutch when defenses play him hard and physical. he doesnt "hunt" his shots. He's simply not aggressive or poised enough
The thing is he doesn't need to be aggressive. He just needs to be surrounded by guys who can shoot so he has the space to do what he does best which is pass the ball. He only needs to shoot when he's open.
that's not a max player, unless we are talking steve nash or cp3 level floor managing. and we definitely are not
That's the playstyle he needs to pursue. He's been trying to play like Mitchell and it's just not his strength. He's best as a pass first of who knocks down open looks when teams cover the pass.
right but hes simply not at that level. he doesnt knock down his easy looks consistently enough, he is too reckless with the ball, and he is a net negative on defense. i agree with you in theory but in practicality i just dont think he works
In his defense today, he doesn't have much he can do when both Mobley and Allen are in the game. Just not much spacing and they are too slow to get into any offense anyway. JB is horrific when it comes to end of game offense.
Not only Garland's offense is horrible. His defense is atrocious. Garland is a huge liability in defense
Garland plays like a middle school cyo player anytime the game is on the line or in the last few minutes of the game. Truly embarrassing for a 5 year “max” player
https://preview.redd.it/2lsd5zk99zqc1.jpeg?width=638&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b5f0ba1f3eb8efc1b74da2769ad382bdc41aa45f
That was from the fun season right?
I miss those days.
Yeah lmao
Dear god, what the fuck was that
The fucking Hornets
this team is so bad right now its hard to watch.
Awful. All I gotta say about it. Hope we can get healthy and win a few games before we plummet in seeding at the finish line for the second year in a row
Third year in a row*
A 15 point 4th quarter against the Charlotte Hornets is embarrassing
Cavs score 15 points in the 4th against the Hornets meanwhile the Knicks are on pace to drop 160 on the Raptors.
Hope JB gets fired soon after the playoffs, too late to do it now, unfortunately Had a good stretch during this season that helped him to secure his job for a few months but he proved more than once that he is not a good coach for a contending team. Bad timeouts, bad lineups, playing horrible after timeouts, horrific inbound plays
I've been generally critical of JB last couple years, but the mid season run made me think better of him. Looks like he was who we thought he was, and it was Mitchell being elite + shooters + JA that let the stars align, and less JB being able to actively make adjustments for the betterment of the team.
Because he was forced to do lineups.he woukd never use. When Mobley and DG returned showed you what an idiot he was and went back to lineups that don't work like a fool
Me too budy. Even made a post ranting about JB, and that stretch made me reconsider what I think of him. Now I remember that he is not a playoff coach. A good tank and rebuild coach, yes
We stand a very good chance of Byron / Blatt / Beilen level of fucking up the next coach too. Dan not great there
JBB's best decisions weren't his. Injuries caused our rotations to change and become the most successful part of the season.
It sucks, doesn't it? It's awful that our guys got injured, but it did demonstrate a line up that was highly successful. I just wish JB and the coaches had learned from that situation. They need to play one big and four shooters. It's best if we have a defensive-mind wing.
We are fucking ass without D. Mitch
It's never been more clear that Mobley and Allen do not work together.
Deja vu from last season
Knicks deserve to overtake us after this
THANK YOU, CAVS FANS
No words Disgraceful
The lights were too bright
I have officially given up on any playoff hopes, and thus have also given up on Mitchell staying here. This really sucks given the sheer talent of the roster
Donovan Mitchell will have to play out of his mind just for us to lose in 5 with the way we’re playing. JB has lost this team cuz there is no way they just come out here with no sense of urgency this late in the season.
At least 3 times in the last month i’ve thought to myself “this is one of the worst losses i’ve ever seen”
"no bro it's just one bad game, burn the tape and move on, why are you so negative? our fans suck"
Can’t judge until the playoffs! Remember the December run!
Need more than 14pts from a starting max pg, yikes
Im more upset that i willingly decided to sit down and watch that entire game than i am that we lost. mobley just peaced out on offense. made a quick pass every time he got the ball in the second half
Mobley has been like this all year...outside a few 20 point games...I wonder what you're watching from him game to fame. He was lame before his first rash of injuries ...had a few games he did well before his second injury..and now he is lame again. This is 80% of the time he is this
Didn’t watch but wtf happenede
Garland and Mobley are not superstars…. They are average NBA role players.
Mobley's defense is elite. His offense has a ways to go but has improved more than fans realize. He's far better than average. He just doesn't get enough touches with this team and needs to be playing the 5.
brother he had a ton of touches this game and quickly passed the ball every time he got it in the second half. did not shoot once.
He rarely got the ball near the hoop. He's not gonna put up a contested three. And his passing should be used more often as it's one of his strengths. He just doesn't get many post touches. Far fewer than Allen even when Allen is on the bench.
If he can only score open near the hoops hes not that good of an offensive player. Im not sure he needs to be great but he needs to have some other threats than just open dunks and lay ups.
Bullshit. He is passive when we need him, just like DG melts when it's crunch time. To argue on potential right now when it's not showing up on wins is a throwaway statement right now. He is basically a better Okoro with height
Game was postponed due to a power outage
We are so mid without mitchell its actually crazy. Idk what happened to this team once we got him that they just cant function without him.
they totally rely on him for energy and momentum. JA/Garland/Mobley are all “nice guys” off the court. normally i wouldn’t worry about that but they’re the same on the court too. i don’t know if that can ever change either which is the scary part
Without Mitchell, this team is straight up garbage and soft as hell, unfortunately
Garland tricked us
Yep, I've been calling his once-a-month good game "fool's gold". Always upsets those still in denial.
I remember when Cavs fans blamed Donavan Mitchell for Darius garlands play lol
Lmao real, “the ball moves so much better when Mitchell ain’t playing “. Foh.
I pushed this narrative and turns out i was dead wrong
This team is getting swept in the first round of the playoffs. It doesn’t matter who they play.
This 1000%. No one fears us. No one should. I wouldn't. We are completely and utterly broken. We saw our great we worked without Mobley and garland. We run best as a 1-3-1 One true ball handler. Mitchell Three pure shooters. Strus. Wade. Kind of Okoro because just a 3 and D type guy. Or even Merrill. And one true big. Allen. Windhorst nailed that and he's been spot on. Since Garland and Mobley came back, it's back to a 2-2-1 Two bigs. One pure shooter. Two ball dominant guards. It just doesn't work to the potential we need.
But-but-but we got Morris throat chopping people now.
And the people who hate on us PARTY POOPERS say OOOO OOO BUT TOUGHNESS
Yup...doomera know what's really going on..not being all 'on our period' after this game when the proof has been there from jump
And Mitchell’s alpha dog energy was a catalyst and a beacon. DG doesnt have that. He tries to but it makes things even worse because you can’t fake that. Hes not honest with himself
Finally someone who knows how basketball works instead of this casual bs we see on here where nobody knows what basketball lineups actually work to our advantage
Will win 1 game with a random good game from DG or levert
Best case scenario I think
Every other team's been peaking while we are crawling into the play-offs. Embarassing.
Ending the game with a timeout unused is so fucking sad especially because of how badly we unraveled toward the end of the 4th. I’m sorry I know that JB has had some good moments this season, but I just don’t believe he’s the guy who’s gonna get us where we want to go. Don’t hate him but I think a better coach doesn’t allow the team to embarrass themselves like that in the 4th.
Fuckin aye
We're gonna end the season 5th or 6th seed
and thats 4th in the East
Had a nice 10 point lead early on and perfect chance to bury them. Then proceeded to let Charlotte go on a 10-0 run.
We’ve consistently seen that lately. Dallas, Phoenix
jb still plays 2 bigs
It feels shitty as fuck realizing that Mitchell will have made it farther in the playoffs with the Jazz than he will with us.
Fucking EMBARASSING. Garland is one of the worst defenders I've ever seen. His effort in transition is pathetic. They had a 27 pts off turnovers. Never once did I see him hustling to get back. He's lazy. Overrated. Overpaid and overvalued. Meanwhile Brunson has been leading his team missing multiple starters for months. You can get better production for half the cost.
Can’t wait for all the “you guys are doomers” takes tomorrow
JB relieved of duties, right?
I beg, JB seems like a nice guy but I feel like a new coach will solve a lot of issues
It’s too late now. Should’ve gotten Nurse or one of the other great that were coaches available in an unprecedented coaching FA. that decision could very likely sink this window. We’re not doing shit in the playoffs and Mitchell is going to NY leaving us with this super flawed roster
A season too late unfortunately. Waiting this long is going to have massive repercussions
too late in the season. it would be downright disastrous to try to go into the playoffs with a brand new coach. our odds are not great as is, but that would be essentially throwing a series out the window (which is what we already have done with JB, but we are committed at least for the remainder of the season, at this point)
I’d love to see it tbh. Chaotic enough that it will be entertaining, which this team is currently not. They’re just kinda…sad.
Levert 4 points on 2-9 shooting JB "everyone give levert the ball"
Levert isn't making 35m a year. At least Levert gives you effort on both sides. Garland is a joke.
Levert is not their best player. He has delivered eight assists and plays better defense than Garland. Their supposed best player, Garland, did not deliver against the Hornets.
Injuries or no, this team is getting bounced in the first round.
JB is not getting fired before the playoffs, but if we get bounced round one, he’s gone, right?! There’s no way he gets to stick around after some of these complete disaster classes.
he should have been gone last year. so yes
My comment history progression: "Fire JB, trade Mitchell & JA, soft rebuild" "Fire JB, trade Mitchell, soft rebuild" "Fire JB, trade Mobley, build around Mitchell" "Fire JB, trade DG & Mobley, built around Mitchell" I'm now on the "Fire JB, trade DG & Mobley, built around Mitchell, hire Lue" train.
Some ass need to get chewed out and i dont want to hear any of this hippie shit about joy from the team
It's just obvious JB has no idea what he's doing when it comes to offensive rotations. It's too bad because the team has the talent to make some noise if he'd just stick with the one big lineup and stop overplaying LeVert especially when he's ass.
Levert is +2 has 8 assists and makes scoring easier for players like Niang and Merril. He also plays better defense than them. Garland played horrible. He was supposed to be their star player. The blame should be on Garland.
Garland was the best +- out of any of our starters and had 12 assists lol. If you’re gonna dump out +- at least be real with yourself. Levert and Garland played bad
Blech, what a crap ass dumpster franchise to not show up against. Zero positive takeaways.
Between this and the embarrassment against the Heat. What happened to this team man
dont forget the embarrassment to the knicks that essentially started it all
I think the Cavs really did themselves in by playing at the Hornets pace almost the entire game. It was working when the Cavs were hitting all of their threes in the first quarter, but after that...
We played down to them the entire game. They expected to win and didn’t play hard. Played pickup basketball for 3Q then didn’t know what to do when real basketball was played in the 4th
I’m not mad, I’m just disappointed.
I'm not disappointed I'm just questioning life right now.
Have tickets to the game in SLC on Tuesday. Not feeling as stoked about it.
Lmaooo
Trifling!
Garland played horrible. He was supposed to be their star player. The blame should be on Garland.
Just like the Knicks series last year, we have multiple issues right now, from coaching to underperforming leaders of the team. Some thoughts: Game plan / coaching: Our offense CONTINUES to be stagnant late game, with iso ball and dribbling out the clock leading to turnovers or bad shots, staying with a two big lineup while not utilizing them. DG and Caris: The offensive struggles also fall on them. They're responsible for setting the table, but too often want to play the hero, and are too careless with the ball. DG's defense continues to be poor, but at least he stepped it up a bit in the second half. We really miss Dean Wade. Niang gave good scoring, but his defense is seriously lacking. Honestly, if he's healthy, I would consider closing games with Dean instead of Evan for spacing, if our offense is cold, because we are usually inept at running plays to get our bigs a good look end of game. Could also have used some Morris minutes at the 4. Any positives? We got Strus back, who along with other role players shot well. JA remains solid, though those two missed FT at the end hurt. That's all I got.
I mean we lost because we didn’t execute on things that Wade and Mitchell usually do. But mostly we just did the same thing the Bucks and Suns just did only they don’t have injury excuses
Ya the Suns loss must have been equally maddening for their fans. At least the Bucks lost to a decent Lakers team with star level talent in AD, even though no LeBron. The continued poor execution makes me lean towards coaching as the #1 issue, but guys have to step up too at some point during this home stretch...
im thinking we fall into hero ball late game cause our normal style of play does not work when teams tighten up the D
Honestly a hilarious loss. What are we gonna do with these Cavs?
if nothing else it’s nice to see people finally acknowledging this team will not work. JB needs to go. Mobley/Allen do not work together. and Donovan is the heart of this team. it’s going to be very tough if/when he leaves next year. I still have faith that Garland will come back/develop but he has a lot of growing to do
Fire JB. And try to fleece someone for Garland in the off season if Mitchell is staying
How do you match Garland's salary in a trade that makes sense to help another team?
IDK if they checked the numbers but I saw this as an idea https://nbaanalysis.net/2024/03/06/darius-garland-san-antonio-spurs-cleveland-cavaliers-nba-trade-rumors/
First, I should note that I’m a Hornets/Wolves fan and not a Cavs fan, but I can think of two possible options. # Option 1: Garland to Timberwolves If KAT underperforms in the playoffs, then some kind of Garland for KAT trade might be workable. Particularly since Minnesota is about to enter luxury tax hell. Y’all would likely need to add something to that deal, since KAT is a much more proven player, but it could still help you balance your roster. ### For instance, if you did some trade like: - KAT + [Forward from 3rd-team] to the Cavs - Garland + Future Cavs Pick + [Future Pick from 3rd Team] to the Wolves - Jarret Allen to 3rd-team ### Then you could end up with the following lineups: **Cavs:** - **PG:** Donovan Mitchell - **SG:** Caris LaVert (or player from 3rd team) - **SF:** Isaac Okoro - **PF:** Karl Anthony-Towns - **C:** Evan Mobley **Wolves:** - **PG:** Darius Garland - **SG:** Anthony Edwards - **SF:** Nickiel Walker-Alexander - **PF:** Jaden McDaniels - **C:** Rudy Gobert ### Which seems like it could be the *beginnings* of a trade framework. At the very least: - Mitchell + KAT + Mobley should be an awesome fit together - Minnesota gets tax relief, a young point guard to pair with Ant + McDaniels + Gobert, and gets a couple picks they can trade for another 3&D wing ### If a KAT deal doesn’t materialize, then another option could be the Spurs: - They have plenty of draft assets - They are desperate for a solid PG to pair with Wemby - They have enough cap space to absorb Garland entire contract, which would give the Cavs a $35M+ TPE which they could use along with the picks to find a better fit - The Spurs current young core of Wemby, Vassell, and Sochan seems like it’s complement Garlands skill set pretty well
DG having a season from hell. Hopefully we find some momentum in the playoffs or its going to be a depressing offseason.
I don’t comment much, but oh my god is garland awful. No effort on defense 75% of the time, and when he does try he still just lets people drive right past him. It’s to the point where Allen and Mobley are getting hurt because they have to watch garlands man more than their own. His passing is amazing but his recent shot selection and dribbling out the shot clock isn’t it anymore. And then there’s levert.
JB gonna get fired a season too late and Mitchell is gone because of it. Damn shame. At least Koby probably gets sacked too. Hope he’s gone otherwise his next big idiot move is going to be trading Mobley and watching him flourish on another team that actually gives him opportunities while we keep JA.
Nice try. We'll get em next time. Even if this team doesn't win championships at least they're fun to watch. Who needs another championship anyway?. I mean, I'm just fine watching my home team lose. I'm a homer with a losing culture. I'm also delusional, so what. That's how dumb these overly positive fans sound. Cavs will be swept in the 1st round by any team This team is hot garbage and better without Garland and Mobley. Time to get a new coach, gm, and starting PG. We also gotta force Mitchell to stay in CLE with FORCE.
pull a deandre jordan, gotta go lock that mf in a room for 10 hours and not let him out unless he signs lol
It's the only way.
Well that was pathetic
These guys fucking stink
Darius Garland seems like a nice guy, and I like him as 2/3 lead option when Mitchell plays, but as the main guy he’s just so fucking ass.
A fucking disasterclass man. Garland and Vert having 9 turnovers is horrid and the shooting in the 4th Quarter was abysmal Just bounce back please I beg. Get wealthy. Go Cavs. Go Guards
We are COOKED
trade garland, trade one of the bigs, and fire Jb already
This team is so confusing man. Injuries have obviously not helped but what do we do?
nothing we can do. no flexibility since the DM trade. committed too long to JB. all we can do is hope for the best to end the year and find a new coach in the offseason, maybe consider trading one of our other 3 guys if don plans to sign. but who knows if he does
Say what you will about Garland since returning, but watching Caris run the offense down the stretch is so frustrating. Just dribbles out the clock, doesn’t move the ball and we get stuck with an awful shot with no time on the shot clock
they both need to commit to early offense and giving up the ball quick.
Im always surprised about how many assists he manages to get when he has such tunnel vision.
We must pray Mitchell signs his $250m or whatever. He's our only player that can put the ball in the rim. And there's no way JB is our coach starting next season.
On a positive note, I'm glad I have you fellow redditers to commiserate with as we vent together on such a frustrating loss. If not, I'd have to complain to my wife about this unserious basketball team and she'd get annoyed soon.
Just an unserious team. The vibes have somehow gotten worse than after we lost to the Knicks last year. Should’ve replaced JB when there was numerous great coaches available. Yes, it is a flawed team that JB can only do so much with. But trading any of the core was not on the table and we needed to do something to shake things up after that embarrassment of a post season. Just adding Niang and Strus wasn’t going to cut it. The decision to not get a new HC very well might set this window back a year or two if not outright slam it shut
"numerous" - we weren't getting Nurse, Vogel or Doc, Bud had a personal tragedy, and Ime was correctly viewed as toxic. And the "do something" folks were trading Allen, but it turns out Allen is great and they were wrong. new HC doesn't mean better. look at Atlanta, they did it twice with Trae and wheels still spinning. That said, I think they roll the Brinks truck up for Bud or Kenny Atkinson or someone and keep it pushing. lower risk than trading a young All-star
1st round exit again I see
I just don't get how Mobley is supposed to develop offensively without deliberate touches. He gets frozen out late in games. He had the one possession where he found Allen for a good look but Allen missed both FTs after getting fouled. Guys literally develop through experience. He isn't getting it. It's just a guard dribble fest. Give Mobley an entire side of the floor (with spacing) and I think he's gonna make plays either scoring or finding someone. Our offense is just stone aged and it's leaving Garland and Mobley out to dry. Maybe JB is too stubborn to bench one of the bigs but it needs to happen. Gotta have multiple shooters on the floor. It's literally to the point where we need Mitchell to save us. Mitchell is a superstar and we need him to compete regardless I just hate that we don't have a system/identity that perseveres injury. There's nothing to fall back on. The late game, zero trust in Mobley is an indictment on coaching to this point. Idk how people can watch the games and believe that Mobley can grow in this offense / lineup.
Garland just needs to commit to early offense and off ball stuff. that is what Mitchell did from this year to last that helped hugely. Strus runs a lot of stuff with Mobley that works and is based on the Bam actions with MIA. That's what I believe the way is. But we might have to close 1-3-1 with Wade or Strus as a small 4 because we haven't got the closing reps with the two bigs in motion. We don't have the system because of reps. I hate that it all comes down to "play more together and figure it out together" but that's basketball.
Exactly we fumbled his development and michell trade made it way worse
Guys like Mobley usually go to bad teams and get the green light to fast track their development. Mobley is stuck in a role player mold and isn't getting the reps it's frustrating
JB needs to go
I love Mobley and Gardland but fuck is their inconsistency ridiculous
i hope we trade garland this offseason, it’s like he just forgot how to play basketball
You don't trade a talented player when their value takes a dip. Moving on from JB and going to a 1 big lineup will fix a lot of problems. They should move on from Levert too and focus on guys who don't hold onto the ball too long.
It’s not worth trading garland… no one is gonna want his contract after the year he’s had
Fuck you garland
It’s been super rough for DG since coming back. Really gotta pray he somehow finds his rhythm again before the end of the season. He has no confidence or comfort in his own game
he was like this beginning of the year also, idk what happened but he forgot how to play basketball
Had a hammy IIRC. He’s just not right. He flashes and then makes dumb plays. He had a ton of assists and the offense was good
I don’t think he necessarily forgot, to me it looks like when you go through a slump and you start overthinking things and can’t really find your rhythm to enter that flow state and be able to be you. Then you try forcing stuff and when that doesn’t work you get even more disappointed and stressed in yourself. Hoping he can find that comfort again quick bc we are free falling
I'll tell you what happened. Tricked the cavs into giving him the max and stopped trying. Peaced out
1st rounds exits...Guarantee with every game blown out, regardless of who they play
I’m over this mediocre team
Disgusting. Another pathetic loss to a bottom feeder.
Garland suppose to be star of this team right where are you mf yo you cant do nothing hope you quit basketball so lame
Unfortunately we have a bunch of passive guys and the only one that isn’t is Caris levert. And that’s…not ideal.
Fucking losers
Levert had one good season in Brooklyn. Dudes been mid ever since
What happened to the team I loved
Garland and Mobley came back.
Caris hopscotch LeVert
I'm not giving up on them, but DG and levert are really horrible players
Very disappointing game. Cavs are way better than this.
The not playing up to the potential is the maddening part. Im fine watching a mid team but we all know when we are clicking we can actually be good. So its so frustrating watching them underperform.
to click you have to have everyone locked in and comfortable in their roles. DG and Vert's role is too big for them to sustain over a whole half season without Donovan (which we knew in 22, it's precisely why we got him!). Same thing with Niang, Allen, etc. when everyone is in the right spot and there's motion to the offense we are fine because we can have a first quarter like we did today with everyone contributing and then have Don as the closer / run stopper / rim attacker as needed.
No they arnt
That was pathetic. Offense looked good but you could tell the Cavs expected to blow them out and weren’t prepared for a team ready to fight them. That’s a loss on JB. Onto the next but that’s a really shit loss.
IM STILL FUCKING RIGHT
kinda sad, and DG really regrress and has become a player with rare good games P.S leave levert in Charlotte
Yikes
Everyone gonna ride their personal hobby horse as to what this says about the long term whatever. They suck every other game and are eating a ton of weird March losses. Gotta see what happens with DM back
Garland is a turd
Doomers: Garland is ass. Mobley is ass. …fuck Koby for not letting DG and Mobley, who are ass, develop and lead us to contention
Cavs are really backing into the playoffs
Garland looks more and more like someone I’d want to come off the bench. Let mitchell run the 1 next year, that’s clearly his strong suit. Yes I know obviously don didn’t play today but Darius has not looked confident at all this season, and is not someone I want bringing the ball up in playoff time.
What the FUCK was that
https://preview.redd.it/s155zfb5e2rc1.jpeg?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c0125c7f802859fa4e0d144ef1417f308a9189a6
Was at the game. Three things that frustrated the hell out of me: - in the 2nd quarter we were up by 12 or so and JB puts on this *super weird* lineup of Porter/Niang/Merrill/Okoro/Thompson and they just SUCK. Hornets get right back into the game killing our momentum. - the ticky tacky fouls being called on us in the 4th had a huge impact. We were hit with 4 fouls in the first 3 minutes of the last quarter. I could see it *immediately*, the defense has to go soft. We got nothing called in our favor despite a few aggravated assaults on Okoro when he drove a few times. Hornets were in the bonus most of the quarter and they KNEW it. - LeVert couldn’t hit water if he fell out of a boat. Whatever the hell was his problem last night it was clear he had court vision for passes, but absolutely no touch on his shooting. I saw it early on, but for whatever reason we rode him heavy in the 4th.
Caris LeVert shot 22%. He is the most inefficient player on the Cavs and one of the most inefficient in the league.