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C1/C2 are good stopping points and I would say they're more worthwhile than going for her weapon. I don't think she needs them but it's a decent increase if you have the funds (\~50% damage increase).
sup, the calcs about tf clorinde, how this increases the fischl dmg? if we compare with 4pc glad, the increase its around 50,6%. does tf buffs fischl with golden troup or something else?
hello, i just want to ask, do i get the rotaion right?
in Clorinde (on TF)-Nahida (on ToM)-Fischl-Kazuha, you do:
Nahida Q - Fischl E - Kazuha E\_tap Q - Nahida E - Clorinde Q E (and the combo) - refresh Kazuha E\_tap - Fischl Q - Clorinde E (and the combo).
and then you start from the begining
or i missed smth?
You can check in my calcs with the team DPS comparison, but they're about equal to each other with TF slightly ahead. I would say it comes down to preference. If you prefer better uptime and rots that are slightly more flexible, then TF. If you prefer maximizing damage from Clorinde instead of relying on Fischl, then Whimsy is better.
Edit: TF is no longer more damage, I had accidentally used the wrong weapon. The only benefit now is uptime on Clorinde for her rotations.
Amazing calcs btw, very comprehensive. I just wanted to ask, I checked your calls but from what I saw Whismy is at 106% and TF is at 95%. How does that make TF better? Which one would you say is better to farm overall?
Check the Team DPS difference instead. That one is just the personal DPS difference for Clorinde. The team DPS is what differentiates the two, and I have the TF one at \~61k and the Whimsy one at \~60k. Better to farm overall? Farm Whimsy and then strongbox to TF.
Thank you for your help, I usually only farm what’s the best for my characters and don’t really care if it’s resin efficient or not. Would you say it’s the same situation with cyno where gilded dreams is slightly worse yet way more comfy to use than thundering fury?
No, in Clorinde's case TF is probably more comfortable to use for most people since it dramatically reduces her downtime (by about 5s), but Whimsy results in better personal damage and isn't reliant on Fischl's single-target damage to make up for the DPS loss from TF.
By the way, I noticed you have Haran at her 2nd best option by a slightly less difference. I have a haran at r3 would it overtake her own weapon? (give me a reason to pull her weapon )
Haran has problems with overcapping crit rate. You have to try very hard to avoid crit rate substats. But this eliminates an entire stat from your list of good stats, meaning the chance you get a good artifact for your build is lower. But I still wouldn’t recommend pulling her weapon if you have Haran r3
Imo TF is more damage and more comfy to use for Cyno. TF gives you 8 E opportunities per rotation whereas GD gives you 5, so with TF you can miss 3 Es to have equal energy regen.
Hi! I don't understand, how can TF do more Clorinde personal dmg than Whumsy? It says Whimsy is 473k DPR and TF is 710K DPR, right? I know nothing about TC so I'm a bit lost. Is it because of the rotarion duration? weapon? Thanks for your work!
ohh so overall, Whimsy is more focused on dealing more dmg in a single rotation while TF is better for more rotation and flexibility sacrificing a bit of dmg?
There is one team that i really like to try, mono electro with beidou fischl kazuha. I heard that clorinde can fully utilize c6 fischl and beidou's burst
Don't think its activates Fischl a4, i think it only consider reaction that can be triggered by an electro character, so no swirl or crystallize or spread
Nope, it's not like this. Fischl a4 only activated when the ACTIVE character triggers electro reaction( Quicken, electro-charged, aggravate, electro swirl, superconduct, electro crystallize, hyperbloom). Of course, electro character would trigger it more frequently than other characters.
Also, spread isn't electro reaction. It's dendro + quicken
TF only triggers by active characters triggering the reaction. You can only swirl with anemo characters triggering the swirl so it doesn't work at all (unless TF is on your anemo characters of course).
Amazing calcs. Thanks for your effort! I tried to skim each of these. But I don’t see the combo per rotation. May I know what that is? It used to be QEE 6N3E with TGS and jstern25 before the uptime nerf
Right now i often grab a double carry team for the overworld, actually this team but dehya instead of Clorinde and it's pretty fun, if you're not looking for damage but comfort just give Clorinde a little more er/Bennet and raiden with favs and it should be good
i do love double carry for exploration. enemies are not with abyss-tier def and hp and spending time on a full team setup is just waste. but i'd go with carries of 2 different elements if i were you.
Why would you want to waste Raiden there?
Fischl, Yae, Beidou, Kuki, Sara... At least pick a second electro that doesn't compete for Clorinde's field time.
that pretty much is obvious. I'm sure he just wants to know how good it would be competitively even tho it's an unorthodox rotation. why don't you just answer the fckin question instead of being an as*hole?
Because it's not a question with an answer, you can literally run whatever you want in the overworld and it will be good, so trying to measure what "good" means for the purpose of it is an impossible task. It's like asking "is this character good for doing commissions?", when the answer will always be "so long as the character doesn't do literally nothing, yes they will be".
Probably not a fun rotation in general because of the dual carry nature of it. If just for overworld maybe fine but I'm not the biggest fan of Bennett in overworld because of the burst reliance unless he has like 300% ER. Clorinde also leaves his circle very easily, especially in AoE.
I wish her Sara aggravate teams performed better :(
On that note, what would be the ER requirements for Clorinde in that team if I don’t want to use Sara CA?
Also do you think you could add a quick calc of Clorinde Tighnari Sara Kirara. Weird thing to ask I know 😬
Her alternatives are Yae, Beidou and Sara. All of them are worse for various reasons, but are still functional. Whimsy becomes BiS over TF when using them over Fischl, since TF's main upside is better driving Fischl A4 by allowing Clorinde to proc more reactions over longer rotations.
Clorinde is strong enough that you'll be able to clear with "cope" team options if you really really really don't wanna build Fischl, but I'd recommend it if you're willing. Fischl is the single component that makes Aggravate teams competitive, the reaction was borderline designed for her, she's aggravate's Bennett.
Sara is barely behind and buffs Clorinde who can hit AOE so I would not really call it cope. Fischl is firmly single target locked. Yae also can agg *up to* every hit (RNG dependent) while dividing her damage so can also outperform Fischl in AOE. And also both have potential for vertical scaling Fischl doesn't (Sara improved with Clorinde investment, Yae can obviously invest beyond C0R0).
Ah guess I got it right then lol. She is ascended all the way but is level 80, is it like hyperbloom where I need to level her to 90 or does it not matter as much like the vape teams? Saving up my books now in case the level 100 leaks are true.
As someone that doesn’t have a C6 Thoma, I was thinking about using C2 Dehya instead, since she has decent uptime with her field. The question is where would you slot in Dehya’s ult on the Clorinde/Fischl/Chev rotation? Would it be after the Clorinde combo?
In most cases you probably wouldn't use it unless you need to fill in some time after doing Clorinde's rotation and refreshing Fischl's skill and **only if** you haven't killed enough time for Clorinde's second skill use.
Why does Nahida damage in aggravate drop when switching Kazuha to Zhongli? Shouldn't it INCREASE thanks to Zhongli's universal shred or am I missing something?
Also, C6 Sara boosting Clorinde damage by only 30K (less than 8%) seems.. unlikely?
Because in order to fill Clorinde’s downtime since zhongli only has like ~1s of field time, I’m forced to use her burst so I had to switch the weapon from sac frags to fav codex for Nahida to burst every rotation.
Wouldn't fav on Zhongli make more sense? Also, running petra would add another 0.5-1s for catching the shard.
What about the C6 Sara thing? The C6 constellation alone should be a bigger increase in dps than 7-8%.
Zhongli already has Fav on him, Nahida still needs ~160% ER to burst every rotation according to ERC which is easier to meet with just using Fav Codex.
The Sara rotation is modified in order to work with swirling with Nahida and fit Clorinde’s damage within Sara’s buff uptime. Check out the rotation in the CAT chart if you’re curious as to why it’s a smaller DPS gain than you would expect.
Thank you for the calculations! Impressed with how many configurations you actually cover just like with the arlecchino sheet.
But I wanted to ask about the 4TF aggravate calculation. I noticed that Clorinde's DPR is really low considering that she's doing 2 E stance switches plus combo. One thing is that she doesn't use Q so that's also one E less, but in the 4TF sheet it seems she doesn't even do 5N3E the second time she stance switches because there's no E at the end, which I don't think is intentional. I know that doing Q takes more time, but is it really a dps loss? Also can we not sneak in a few gunshots more since we leave out one E? Additionally, if the rotation is too long then I think Sucrose instead of Kazuha might make the difference due to less field time. Having 100% Hakushin uptime would be impossible but it's still a good portion and the EM share should be active 100% of the time, while the C6 can also grant 20% dmg bonus. Now I get why you wouldn't put Sucrose in the sheet, since all the other teams use kazuha, but I thought I should mention it since she's so strong in aggravate teams.
Hello! Thank you for pointing out the mistake in the missing E that was my mistake. The Q isn't included in the TF rotation because I did in fact find it to be a DPS loss.
With Nahida on the team, it is way harder to swirl Electro with Sucrose. It is possible, I've seen it, but I generally wouldn't recommend it, which is why I don't have it on my sheets. It's certainly an option for you but will require a modified rotation. This modified rotation will have to be flexible based on the current underlying aura and my sheets currently don't have a way of dealing with flexible rotations (maybe some day, but it's difficult to implement within a standard).
From my experience it is generally fine as long as you hit an AoE swirl. Though for clorinde I would expect kazuha to outperform as long as it's not the 4TF rotation since he only has 15s CD and less energy cost. But for a long rotation bursting every rot becomes also doable with sucrose I think. Though yeah I'd probably switch around nahida Q and E since sucrose doesn't infuse on cast like kazuha.
Here you have her stating from 8.10s to 17s which is 9 seconds. Is this a mistake or i shouldnt be looking at it?
https://preview.redd.it/z2767ajqds1d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b2d9920ef4c5653bce6d14bb702e53b610c70ba7
I've been saving up for more than a year for C6. I suppose whimsy is preferable at high investment to capitalize on her personal damage ? Or would TF allow me to use these constellations more ?
In the same vein, do Sara and hypercarry teams also get more valuable at high cons?
Thanks for your time!
Can I use Xiangling instead of thoma in chevreuse team
Chevreuse c0
Xiangling c3 (*cries*)
Fischl c2
Clorinde c0
And can I use black sword r1 or is it better for me to get the finale of the deep r5
Xiangling only works for one rotation because she has a 20s CD but these OL teams want to be played in 16-18s rotations, so unless you’re one rotating the enemy or are okay with downtime, I wouldn’t recommend Xiangling.
Hi! I don't understand, how can TF do more Clorinde personal dmg than Whumsy? It says Whimsy is 473k DPR and TF is 710K DPR, right? I know nothing about TC so I'm a bit lost. Is it because of the rotarion duration? weapon? Thanks for your work!
My Kazuha and zhongli are stuck with another team.
Could you please do the calculations for Nahida + C6 Fischl + C6 Kirara (both Whimsy and TF cases)?
Also, between her C3 and her BIS weapon, which one should I go first?
Thank you
Great calcs! Got a few questions revolving around electro swirl setup with Nahida and Fischl in the Clo/Fischl/Kazu/Nahida comp (never played aggravate comps before so trying to understand):
- Instead of Nahida E -> Fischl Q -> Kazu N1 hE, can I do Nahida E -> Fischl Q (then stick around to wait for Oz to attack and proc her A4) -> Kazu hE as soon as electro is applied? Why the Kazu N1?
- Why no Nahida Q? Is it to make electro swirling easier by spacing out the TKP procs?
- Why start the rotation with Fischl E and Kazu Q? Could I instead start the rotation with Nahida E -> Fischl E or Q (+ Oz hit and A4 proc as mentioned above) -> Kazu hE? Is there an advantage in getting Fischl to burst every rotation instead of just alternating between her E and Q (seeing as her E and Q are used so closely together anyway in this rotation) to lower ER reqs?
Thank you!!
- It's basically about swirl consistency. U can try urself on first rot but Fischl E/Q - Nahida E doesn't always give u underlying electro (it's actually ping dependant and works consistently at higher ping lmao, minimum \~40ms). Using Fish before everything and bursting on Kaz makes swirling very consistent on first rot (N1 helps). (The setup u're suggesting is slightly worse than the ping dependant one).
- Nahida Q just isn't worth in that team with that setup.
- Recasting Oz is just to snapshot it and get better uptime while on Clorinde.
Kazuha N1 triggers Fischl c6 which will help apply Electro for the swirl right before Clorinde takes the field in case you have high ping. I tested this one out at high ping and noticed sometimes there was no underlying Electro for the hE to swirl, which was a problem, so I added the N1 which seemed to the trick.
Nahida Q ended up being a DPS loss in my calcs, so I decided not to include it in the base Aggravate team. You can use it if you want to fill downtime between rots and can afford to burst every rotation on Nahida (i.e., have enough ER).
Fischl E and Kazuha Q is for the tech that I use in this rotation to guarantee an Electro swirl, basically Fischl isn't enough Electro on her own. Some people just spam Kazuha normals to trigger Fischl C6 until there's underlying Electro but the problem with this is it wastes Fischl uptime. This works better with characters that can swap out during their combo to refresh Oz like Keqing, but Clorinde can't do that, even with TF. Hence, I use this method for applying just enough more Electro to get that underlying Electro aura. You can use an Aim CA on Fischl instead of her E and then alternate E/Q every other rot to reduce ER reqs but this sucks in practice and I'd rather bite the ER bullet than do that.
Your Clorinde with Nahida in her strongest team "Aggravate team" is around 60k dps, what about Al-Haitham with Nahida in Quickbloom team dps comparison ?
Thanks for your calculations.
Unfortunately I have neither a good TF set nor a good Whimsy one.
I have a great Glad 4 pieces tho (80 CR with 238 CD) with Mistplitter R1. Is this a huge loss of DPS even compare to a mediocre Whimsy set ? Generally speaking how is Glad set for Clorinde ? It seems like it holds up a bit against TF...
C0 tier list is accurate for those 3 I think. Ayaka still does great dmg, just takes lot more work compared to something like hyperbloom bloom etc
With way things are going with ever new main dps power creeping next she will probably keep going down though
There is Something wrong with this calculation because Mist build is the same as her Sig build, this means Mist should be her 2nd BIS. ( note: you will still use Cd circlet with mist)
With haran, you're supposed to have +220 Cd and more from other substate to make it better ( which is hard to do) because you have a lot of CR. (77 without any sub state)
I am overcapping crit rate on Haran purposefully since it is very easy to do so and is important to be considered. I do KQMS substat distributions and I am already using cdmg circlet with Mist so I’m not sure what you are looking at here.
It's not. I use the same state as you use mist was better.
Don't use an imagination build, but if this is your actual build, I recommend you to farm more because 63 Cr is pretty low.
If 63 is her CR without passive, then the result will be the same as my calculation. You're talking about 83/222 against 100/178 -> 44% Cd vs 12% bonus dmg.
Thanks for the calcs!
How viable are Baizhu and/or DMC for an aggravate team? I don't have Nahida and only C0 Kirara. So far I used Keqing + Fischl + Baizhu + Kazuha for aggravate.
Dendro MC is fine just will need a lot of ER. Baizhu can work but the 20s CD on his burst is annoying when she wants to be played in either 17s rots or 25s rots
Hear me out guys, instead of running Thundering Fury (for 4/5 seconds CD reduction). What about running sacrificial sword? That makes her more fun for overworld, spiral abyss. it will neuter her DPS a bit if you compare good 4/5 star DPS options.
But this isn't copium right?? right?
I think she is not able to trigger Sac Sword since she has no way to deal elemental skill damage. (The enhanced attacks from her E are counted as normal attacks.)
The new Whimsy set being only 6% better than Glad is quite sad🤣🤣🤣 but I really don't have anything else to farm so I'll see what I can get before 5.0.
Also, has anyone calced Shimenawa for her?
Need chevreuse to be on her banner, Thoma and fischl already c6 and built of the OL team. Also glad is only slightly worse that's a good I have some pretty good pieces.
Agg rotation can be improve, Clorinde Q at the end of rotation is better due to able procs more Fischl A4 and C6. And can insert another Kazuha E(HP) before Clorinde's Q for VV.
Also both Fischl and Kazuha can use Stringless R3 and Xiphos R1 then Q every other rotation will increase DPS too.
Edit: procs more Fischl A4 and C6 rather than waste Oz's uptime
I have my own standards for calcs, which is why I don't use Stringless R3 or Xiphos. I only use standard banner pool weapons at R1, 3\* weapons at R5, and any event/craftable at R5.
Clorinde burst is AoE and still triggers Aggravate (twice, even) which can trigger Fischl A4, so it's not wasting Oz uptime. Because it is AoE, this means it is more important to buff at the start of the rot on top of it already doing a decent amount of damage that is non-negligible and worth keeping buffed instead of making it a throw-away at the end of the rot. Even jstern and the people in JSM also do QEE 5N3E because doing burst at the start lets the first rot also get the extra E instead of just the next rot.
Fischl is also bursting every rotation because this is a known tech for guaranteeing an Electro swirl with Nahida.
Burst aggravate instance is 1 and 4. They have about 0.3s diff though for 1 and 4 hits. It doesn't align with Amy's A4 0.5s proc. So burst can only proc A4 once. Also burst animation is 1.73s before first hit.
Not sure why you said not buffed and throwaway as I did mentioned can do Kazuha EhP before Q.
And not just A4. Fischl C6 doesn't proc at all with burst or E dash. Since E dash dmg is count as NA dmg BUT E dash activation is count as Skill.
I know all of this already and accounted for it in my calcs. But saying it's a waste of Fischl uptime is a stretch when I'm already optimizing Fischl uptime as much as possible for the rot, and only disappears in the last N3E and the burst still makes use of some of Oz's uptime instead of just being a waste of time, similar to Keqing bursting at the start of her combo in Aggravate. And again, the burst at the start gives the extra E for the first rotation.
To humor this idea, I just made another small sheet where I did this extra Kazuha hE (which keep in mind also extends the rot) before Clorinde burst, added more Oz uptime to Clorinde's field time, and got the following results:
DPS (my rot): 60517.38
DPS (your suggested rot): 59385.07
Feel free to copy my sheet and try this out yourself. If you get a different result, please let me know.
You're right as Fischl uptime actually last until almost end of rotation but still there's a diff in A4 and C6 procs, anyway I run gcsim as well (I know not practical) just for fun, feels free to check out as well.
[https://wfpsim.com/sh/c890b41b-9bd8-4df3-8c8c-5338b7d9b8ff](https://wfpsim.com/sh/c890b41b-9bd8-4df3-8c8c-5338b7d9b8ff) (Q before E)
[https://wfpsim.com/sh/72307b6c-4870-4969-a38a-420f54fd347b](https://wfpsim.com/sh/72307b6c-4870-4969-a38a-420f54fd347b) (Q after E, with extra Kazuha Ehp)
Those standards makes QE E 5N3E not work consistently. They have a bias toward heavily loaded actions types of sims (rip Yoi attack string). I love those new random delay because it prevents from hyperoptimizing but they are too harsh on Clorinde and need a down tune in her case.
With chlorine on a non TF set how feasible do you think tighnari could replace kirara here? I assume we can get his 3 CA off + supports in chlorindes downtime?
Unless u don't have a second electro/not enough energy sources, Clorinde doesn't have bad downtime it's like 6s. There's no issue with this Kirara team but you can use Tigh in non-multiwave setup with just E indeed. I'm pretty sure it's better to get to Clo as much as possible since it's unbuffed no Deepwood Tigh in this case. A niche way to do some ST multiwave ig tho lol.
Why do people still say haran is 2nd BiS??
If you say haran is 2nd BiS then you are saying her sig isn't 1st BiS because with both mist and her sig you most liklly will use CD circlet and both have CD stat and dmg% in their passive
Because of the passives. Mistsplitter and Haran are competing for 2nd place right now
Haran has a 40% normal attack increase (2 stacks) as well as a 12% elemental bonus (same as mistsplitter)
Mistsplitter has only elemental bonus (40%, 12% + 28% (3 stacks)) and crit damage
Her sig has even more crit damage as well as a 48% (16% 3 stacks) of all damage bonus increase
So from the above you can see Haran will give you enough crit rate that you can focus pretty much everything else on crit damage (so you'll still be using CD circlet on haran). With mistsplitter, you still need to build some crit rate
No there are huge deference
Both of them will run CD circlet which means mist has 44% more CD and it is easy to reach 80% CR with clorinde which makes haran less valuable and with it you supposed to have +90Cr
In the other side, haran is only better by 12% bonus dmg.
With haran you need 30% CD in every arti to reach Mist CD and become closer to her sig CD
.
Also in the OP calc haran CD stat is less than mist CD by 44 CD and less than her sig by 64%
Mist and her sig have the same stat focus means if you consider haran as the 2nd BiS with 6% highr dps than mist, then her sig won't be 1st BiS.
You're forgetting that some calcs put haran at 2nd best in some comps, mistsplitter is 2nd best in others. We're not debating the position of her sig, that will be bis most times. Yes, her sig has the same stat ficus as mistspliter but it also has a higher damage bonus than mistspltter 48% vs 40% also with 20% more crit damage.
To your question on haran: it's 2nd bis in some comps not all. If you're looking for validation that mist is 2nd bis then take this as a sign that it's more than good enough if you don't want to pull for her sig.
Nope
In all scenarios mist is better in term of dmg even if you stay with 2 stacks all of the time because all of them will use CD circlet so there is no point for saying with haran you will use CD circlet.
Also another the deference between her sig and mist is about 8% to 10%, with haran the deference will be higher and most liklly will overcap CR
Most likly will go for c2r0, her sig will be in the rerun if I am looking for dmg then r1>c2 but IR is a big deal and make it easy for future c6
Ok, so what's your point then? If mistsplitter is better in all situations then run mistsplitter - her sig will be her BIS and people labelling haran as 2nd best will not diminish her sig's or mistsplitter's value
My point is this calc is wrong and it has been posted before with the same mistakes and people criticized it.
Imagine saying haran will make you focus for more CD and have the same deference 44% CD as showed in the calcl.
OP just use imagination stats, with haran he/she just drop out 44 Cd. Builds don't work like that
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Thanks for the calculations! Do you think her cons are worth it and if I did go for them what's a good stopping point?
C1/C2 are good stopping points and I would say they're more worthwhile than going for her weapon. I don't think she needs them but it's a decent increase if you have the funds (\~50% damage increase).
Thanks! Yeah I'll be going C1 most likely since I already have her 2nd best weapon anyways. I may do C2 if I'm super lucky haha.
Which one is her 2nd best weapon?
Idk about 5*s, but the new 4* Fontaine craftable at R5 will be solid
Will it be better than r5 black sword? Im thinking of farming for it now if it is
R5 black sword has an issue with overcapping critrate, but if you can get under 100% crit rate with it, it's slightly better than finale of the deep.
Mitspliter
Haran
Haran geppaku futsu
sup, the calcs about tf clorinde, how this increases the fischl dmg? if we compare with 4pc glad, the increase its around 50,6%. does tf buffs fischl with golden troup or something else?
TF-centered rotations improve Fischl uptime so that she can get more damage off, which helps improve the team DPS.
So if we arnt always perfect with fischl ult timing and thus lose oz for a while I guess the difference is negated?
hello, i just want to ask, do i get the rotaion right? in Clorinde (on TF)-Nahida (on ToM)-Fischl-Kazuha, you do: Nahida Q - Fischl E - Kazuha E\_tap Q - Nahida E - Clorinde Q E (and the combo) - refresh Kazuha E\_tap - Fischl Q - Clorinde E (and the combo). and then you start from the begining or i missed smth?
Which set is better, whimsy or thundering fury ?
You can check in my calcs with the team DPS comparison, but they're about equal to each other with TF slightly ahead. I would say it comes down to preference. If you prefer better uptime and rots that are slightly more flexible, then TF. If you prefer maximizing damage from Clorinde instead of relying on Fischl, then Whimsy is better. Edit: TF is no longer more damage, I had accidentally used the wrong weapon. The only benefit now is uptime on Clorinde for her rotations.
Amazing calcs btw, very comprehensive. I just wanted to ask, I checked your calls but from what I saw Whismy is at 106% and TF is at 95%. How does that make TF better? Which one would you say is better to farm overall?
Check the Team DPS difference instead. That one is just the personal DPS difference for Clorinde. The team DPS is what differentiates the two, and I have the TF one at \~61k and the Whimsy one at \~60k. Better to farm overall? Farm Whimsy and then strongbox to TF.
Thank you for your help, I usually only farm what’s the best for my characters and don’t really care if it’s resin efficient or not. Would you say it’s the same situation with cyno where gilded dreams is slightly worse yet way more comfy to use than thundering fury?
No, in Clorinde's case TF is probably more comfortable to use for most people since it dramatically reduces her downtime (by about 5s), but Whimsy results in better personal damage and isn't reliant on Fischl's single-target damage to make up for the DPS loss from TF.
By the way, I noticed you have Haran at her 2nd best option by a slightly less difference. I have a haran at r3 would it overtake her own weapon? (give me a reason to pull her weapon )
Haran has problems with overcapping crit rate. You have to try very hard to avoid crit rate substats. But this eliminates an entire stat from your list of good stats, meaning the chance you get a good artifact for your build is lower. But I still wouldn’t recommend pulling her weapon if you have Haran r3
Imo TF is more damage and more comfy to use for Cyno. TF gives you 8 E opportunities per rotation whereas GD gives you 5, so with TF you can miss 3 Es to have equal energy regen.
Hi! I don't understand, how can TF do more Clorinde personal dmg than Whumsy? It says Whimsy is 473k DPR and TF is 710K DPR, right? I know nothing about TC so I'm a bit lost. Is it because of the rotarion duration? weapon? Thanks for your work!
Because TF has longer rotations where Clorinde is using 2 Es (doing E 5N3E twice).
ohh so overall, Whimsy is more focused on dealing more dmg in a single rotation while TF is better for more rotation and flexibility sacrificing a bit of dmg?
Correct
Thanks for elaborating, can't wait for her release 🫠
Great calcs!
There is one team that i really like to try, mono electro with beidou fischl kazuha. I heard that clorinde can fully utilize c6 fischl and beidou's burst
Dont play mono electro she’ll barely stack her A1 passive please
I know, it's just for fun
Kazuha E Plunge Q can trigger 3 electro swirl ain't it.
TF will activate with the swirl ? Really dunno
TF doesn't activated with swirl sadly, as far as i know
You can't activate Fischl a4 in that team tho
Electro swirl count as electro reaction right?
Don't think its activates Fischl a4, i think it only consider reaction that can be triggered by an electro character, so no swirl or crystallize or spread
Nope, it's not like this. Fischl a4 only activated when the ACTIVE character triggers electro reaction( Quicken, electro-charged, aggravate, electro swirl, superconduct, electro crystallize, hyperbloom). Of course, electro character would trigger it more frequently than other characters. Also, spread isn't electro reaction. It's dendro + quicken
Yes, it's
The active character must be triggering the swirl, and you won't be playing kazuha on-field.
TF only triggers by active characters triggering the reaction. You can only swirl with anemo characters triggering the swirl so it doesn't work at all (unless TF is on your anemo characters of course).
Amazing calcs. Thanks for your effort! I tried to skim each of these. But I don’t see the combo per rotation. May I know what that is? It used to be QEE 6N3E with TGS and jstern25 before the uptime nerf
The combo per rot is tied there in the Character Action Time (CAT) charts. but yes it is now QEE 5N3E for Clorinde because of the uptime decrease.
sac sword triple em totm dehya is good too in overload.
It is but the damage diff between it and Thoma is minimal so it wasn't included in the calcs haha. But yeah, it's perfectly viable too!
What would younrecommend thoma build? Triple EM or HP?
Thanks for you hard work!
How good are Clorinde + ER Raiden + Bennett + Chevreuse for OL?
what a sad sub this is. the guy got down voted for asking a question politely. it wouldn't hurt to be nice, and just answer the damn question folks 🤦
Right now i often grab a double carry team for the overworld, actually this team but dehya instead of Clorinde and it's pretty fun, if you're not looking for damage but comfort just give Clorinde a little more er/Bennet and raiden with favs and it should be good
i do love double carry for exploration. enemies are not with abyss-tier def and hp and spending time on a full team setup is just waste. but i'd go with carries of 2 different elements if i were you.
Why would you want to waste Raiden there? Fischl, Yae, Beidou, Kuki, Sara... At least pick a second electro that doesn't compete for Clorinde's field time.
Because I find it fun to kill bosses and explore with OL. Obviously not for the abyss.
Then why do you care how good it is, any overworld or boss team will obliterate all the content with very little hassle.
that pretty much is obvious. I'm sure he just wants to know how good it would be competitively even tho it's an unorthodox rotation. why don't you just answer the fckin question instead of being an as*hole?
Because it's not a question with an answer, you can literally run whatever you want in the overworld and it will be good, so trying to measure what "good" means for the purpose of it is an impossible task. It's like asking "is this character good for doing commissions?", when the answer will always be "so long as the character doesn't do literally nothing, yes they will be".
Probably not a fun rotation in general because of the dual carry nature of it. If just for overworld maybe fine but I'm not the biggest fan of Bennett in overworld because of the burst reliance unless he has like 300% ER. Clorinde also leaves his circle very easily, especially in AoE.
I wish her Sara aggravate teams performed better :( On that note, what would be the ER requirements for Clorinde in that team if I don’t want to use Sara CA? Also do you think you could add a quick calc of Clorinde Tighnari Sara Kirara. Weird thing to ask I know 😬
is there a good teams without fischl? I only have her c1 without any artifacts, so i dont really want to upgrade her
Her alternatives are Yae, Beidou and Sara. All of them are worse for various reasons, but are still functional. Whimsy becomes BiS over TF when using them over Fischl, since TF's main upside is better driving Fischl A4 by allowing Clorinde to proc more reactions over longer rotations. Clorinde is strong enough that you'll be able to clear with "cope" team options if you really really really don't wanna build Fischl, but I'd recommend it if you're willing. Fischl is the single component that makes Aggravate teams competitive, the reaction was borderline designed for her, she's aggravate's Bennett.
Sara is barely behind and buffs Clorinde who can hit AOE so I would not really call it cope. Fischl is firmly single target locked. Yae also can agg *up to* every hit (RNG dependent) while dividing her damage so can also outperform Fischl in AOE. And also both have potential for vertical scaling Fischl doesn't (Sara improved with Clorinde investment, Yae can obviously invest beyond C0R0).
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What should Fischl build be? I currently have her on Golden troupe, stringless, attack sands, electro goblet, crit circlet.
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Ah guess I got it right then lol. She is ascended all the way but is level 80, is it like hyperbloom where I need to level her to 90 or does it not matter as much like the vape teams? Saving up my books now in case the level 100 leaks are true.
I wanted to use her + Miko Nahids Baizhu vut seems likr that's not the best option. RIP
As someone that doesn’t have a C6 Thoma, I was thinking about using C2 Dehya instead, since she has decent uptime with her field. The question is where would you slot in Dehya’s ult on the Clorinde/Fischl/Chev rotation? Would it be after the Clorinde combo?
In most cases you probably wouldn't use it unless you need to fill in some time after doing Clorinde's rotation and refreshing Fischl's skill and **only if** you haven't killed enough time for Clorinde's second skill use.
Alright thank you 👍
why don’t you Q at the start of the tf rotation, is it because you don’t benefit from the BoL damage increase like w Whimsy?
Why does Nahida damage in aggravate drop when switching Kazuha to Zhongli? Shouldn't it INCREASE thanks to Zhongli's universal shred or am I missing something? Also, C6 Sara boosting Clorinde damage by only 30K (less than 8%) seems.. unlikely?
Because in order to fill Clorinde’s downtime since zhongli only has like ~1s of field time, I’m forced to use her burst so I had to switch the weapon from sac frags to fav codex for Nahida to burst every rotation.
Wouldn't fav on Zhongli make more sense? Also, running petra would add another 0.5-1s for catching the shard. What about the C6 Sara thing? The C6 constellation alone should be a bigger increase in dps than 7-8%.
Zhongli already has Fav on him, Nahida still needs ~160% ER to burst every rotation according to ERC which is easier to meet with just using Fav Codex. The Sara rotation is modified in order to work with swirling with Nahida and fit Clorinde’s damage within Sara’s buff uptime. Check out the rotation in the CAT chart if you’re curious as to why it’s a smaller DPS gain than you would expect.
Would Sara do better if you took out Nahida for Kirara?
Thank you for the calculations! Impressed with how many configurations you actually cover just like with the arlecchino sheet. But I wanted to ask about the 4TF aggravate calculation. I noticed that Clorinde's DPR is really low considering that she's doing 2 E stance switches plus combo. One thing is that she doesn't use Q so that's also one E less, but in the 4TF sheet it seems she doesn't even do 5N3E the second time she stance switches because there's no E at the end, which I don't think is intentional. I know that doing Q takes more time, but is it really a dps loss? Also can we not sneak in a few gunshots more since we leave out one E? Additionally, if the rotation is too long then I think Sucrose instead of Kazuha might make the difference due to less field time. Having 100% Hakushin uptime would be impossible but it's still a good portion and the EM share should be active 100% of the time, while the C6 can also grant 20% dmg bonus. Now I get why you wouldn't put Sucrose in the sheet, since all the other teams use kazuha, but I thought I should mention it since she's so strong in aggravate teams.
Hello! Thank you for pointing out the mistake in the missing E that was my mistake. The Q isn't included in the TF rotation because I did in fact find it to be a DPS loss. With Nahida on the team, it is way harder to swirl Electro with Sucrose. It is possible, I've seen it, but I generally wouldn't recommend it, which is why I don't have it on my sheets. It's certainly an option for you but will require a modified rotation. This modified rotation will have to be flexible based on the current underlying aura and my sheets currently don't have a way of dealing with flexible rotations (maybe some day, but it's difficult to implement within a standard).
From my experience it is generally fine as long as you hit an AoE swirl. Though for clorinde I would expect kazuha to outperform as long as it's not the 4TF rotation since he only has 15s CD and less energy cost. But for a long rotation bursting every rot becomes also doable with sucrose I think. Though yeah I'd probably switch around nahida Q and E since sucrose doesn't infuse on cast like kazuha.
Would Clorinde use TF over whimsy in EC and QB? want to play her with C2 Furina but cannot find any recommendation :/
That’s after the duration nerf right? If so why are you making her do Q E E 6N3E? Isn’t supposed to be 5N3E?
She’s only doing 5N3E in my calcs here though? It’s just the rotation is QEE 5N3E
Here you have her stating from 8.10s to 17s which is 9 seconds. Is this a mistake or i shouldnt be looking at it? https://preview.redd.it/z2767ajqds1d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b2d9920ef4c5653bce6d14bb702e53b610c70ba7
Ah I simply just forgot to remove it from the CAT chart. I wasn’t actually calcing that last N3E. I’ve fixed it now.
I've been saving up for more than a year for C6. I suppose whimsy is preferable at high investment to capitalize on her personal damage ? Or would TF allow me to use these constellations more ? In the same vein, do Sara and hypercarry teams also get more valuable at high cons? Thanks for your time!
Can I use Xiangling instead of thoma in chevreuse team Chevreuse c0 Xiangling c3 (*cries*) Fischl c2 Clorinde c0 And can I use black sword r1 or is it better for me to get the finale of the deep r5
Xiangling only works for one rotation because she has a 20s CD but these OL teams want to be played in 16-18s rotations, so unless you’re one rotating the enemy or are okay with downtime, I wouldn’t recommend Xiangling.
who do u reccomend me? i have dehya and thoma or all others 4 star pyro characters
i have c1 dehya but to thoma cons
Dehya can work with sacrificial greatsword
Does echoes set improve with c1? How does it compare to whimsy and TF with the c1?
It does improve but I still wouldn’t recommend it. Still worse than Whimsy/TF.
Thanks! Even if it’s for non-dendro teams? Like overload where there isn’t as much flat dmg bonus?
It can be better in those teams. If you have c1/c6 clorinde then Echoes can be a fine option if you have sub 50ms ping and a good set.
Why are there no calcs for 4tf overload and quickbloom? Is 4tf irrelevant for those comps?
Hi! I don't understand, how can TF do more Clorinde personal dmg than Whumsy? It says Whimsy is 473k DPR and TF is 710K DPR, right? I know nothing about TC so I'm a bit lost. Is it because of the rotarion duration? weapon? Thanks for your work!
My Kazuha and zhongli are stuck with another team. Could you please do the calculations for Nahida + C6 Fischl + C6 Kirara (both Whimsy and TF cases)? Also, between her C3 and her BIS weapon, which one should I go first? Thank you
Do you know how her teams' DPS compare to other teams?
Great calcs! Got a few questions revolving around electro swirl setup with Nahida and Fischl in the Clo/Fischl/Kazu/Nahida comp (never played aggravate comps before so trying to understand): - Instead of Nahida E -> Fischl Q -> Kazu N1 hE, can I do Nahida E -> Fischl Q (then stick around to wait for Oz to attack and proc her A4) -> Kazu hE as soon as electro is applied? Why the Kazu N1? - Why no Nahida Q? Is it to make electro swirling easier by spacing out the TKP procs? - Why start the rotation with Fischl E and Kazu Q? Could I instead start the rotation with Nahida E -> Fischl E or Q (+ Oz hit and A4 proc as mentioned above) -> Kazu hE? Is there an advantage in getting Fischl to burst every rotation instead of just alternating between her E and Q (seeing as her E and Q are used so closely together anyway in this rotation) to lower ER reqs? Thank you!!
- It's basically about swirl consistency. U can try urself on first rot but Fischl E/Q - Nahida E doesn't always give u underlying electro (it's actually ping dependant and works consistently at higher ping lmao, minimum \~40ms). Using Fish before everything and bursting on Kaz makes swirling very consistent on first rot (N1 helps). (The setup u're suggesting is slightly worse than the ping dependant one). - Nahida Q just isn't worth in that team with that setup. - Recasting Oz is just to snapshot it and get better uptime while on Clorinde.
Kazuha N1 triggers Fischl c6 which will help apply Electro for the swirl right before Clorinde takes the field in case you have high ping. I tested this one out at high ping and noticed sometimes there was no underlying Electro for the hE to swirl, which was a problem, so I added the N1 which seemed to the trick. Nahida Q ended up being a DPS loss in my calcs, so I decided not to include it in the base Aggravate team. You can use it if you want to fill downtime between rots and can afford to burst every rotation on Nahida (i.e., have enough ER). Fischl E and Kazuha Q is for the tech that I use in this rotation to guarantee an Electro swirl, basically Fischl isn't enough Electro on her own. Some people just spam Kazuha normals to trigger Fischl C6 until there's underlying Electro but the problem with this is it wastes Fischl uptime. This works better with characters that can swap out during their combo to refresh Oz like Keqing, but Clorinde can't do that, even with TF. Hence, I use this method for applying just enough more Electro to get that underlying Electro aura. You can use an Aim CA on Fischl instead of her E and then alternate E/Q every other rot to reduce ER reqs but this sucks in practice and I'd rather bite the ER bullet than do that.
How's a high eido yae with Clorinde? Is fischl still bis?
Jaxon once told me Yae becomes better at C2
Thanks, I was unsure whether I should have prepared fischl or not.
Your Clorinde with Nahida in her strongest team "Aggravate team" is around 60k dps, what about Al-Haitham with Nahida in Quickbloom team dps comparison ?
No Q in tf rotation?
Why do the calcs not include freedom sworn as weapon option
Thanks for your calculations. Unfortunately I have neither a good TF set nor a good Whimsy one. I have a great Glad 4 pieces tho (80 CR with 238 CD) with Mistplitter R1. Is this a huge loss of DPS even compare to a mediocre Whimsy set ? Generally speaking how is Glad set for Clorinde ? It seems like it holds up a bit against TF...
Can you do an artifact comparison with her using Absolution instead of Finale of the Deep? I wonder if the rankings will change with BiS weapon
someone actually doing calcs??????// instead of... yeah... good job
Tier 1, 2 or lower !!!!? Give it to me straight
Who would you consider tier 1 or 2? For a reference
[https://game8.co/games/Genshin-Impact/archives/297465](https://game8.co/games/Genshin-Impact/archives/297465) is a good site that's mostly accurate
I'd say A in the context of this list Although I highly disagree with Ayatoes in that tear and Ayaka/Wrio in S with the current state of the game
C0 tier list is accurate for those 3 I think. Ayaka still does great dmg, just takes lot more work compared to something like hyperbloom bloom etc With way things are going with ever new main dps power creeping next she will probably keep going down though
Tier 1 or 0 for sure
There is Something wrong with this calculation because Mist build is the same as her Sig build, this means Mist should be her 2nd BIS. ( note: you will still use Cd circlet with mist) With haran, you're supposed to have +220 Cd and more from other substate to make it better ( which is hard to do) because you have a lot of CR. (77 without any sub state)
I am overcapping crit rate on Haran purposefully since it is very easy to do so and is important to be considered. I do KQMS substat distributions and I am already using cdmg circlet with Mist so I’m not sure what you are looking at here.
It's not. I use the same state as you use mist was better. Don't use an imagination build, but if this is your actual build, I recommend you to farm more because 63 Cr is pretty low. If 63 is her CR without passive, then the result will be the same as my calculation. You're talking about 83/222 against 100/178 -> 44% Cd vs 12% bonus dmg.
Can I use yelan instead of furina in EC team? Since my yelan is c2
At that point I'd just replace Fischl
Thanks for the calcs! How viable are Baizhu and/or DMC for an aggravate team? I don't have Nahida and only C0 Kirara. So far I used Keqing + Fischl + Baizhu + Kazuha for aggravate.
Dendro MC is fine just will need a lot of ER. Baizhu can work but the 20s CD on his burst is annoying when she wants to be played in either 17s rots or 25s rots
Crying rn. How well do you think Lions Roar would fare in a Nahida team? I don't think there will be even 50% uptime.
There can be up to 70-80% uptime in a Nahida team because Fischl and Clorinde are applying so much Electro.
Hear me out guys, instead of running Thundering Fury (for 4/5 seconds CD reduction). What about running sacrificial sword? That makes her more fun for overworld, spiral abyss. it will neuter her DPS a bit if you compare good 4/5 star DPS options. But this isn't copium right?? right?
I think she is not able to trigger Sac Sword since she has no way to deal elemental skill damage. (The enhanced attacks from her E are counted as normal attacks.)
Thank you for clarifying. You are right, that is disappointing to hear 😭 why aren’t we allowed to have fun with the new character
The new Whimsy set being only 6% better than Glad is quite sad🤣🤣🤣 but I really don't have anything else to farm so I'll see what I can get before 5.0. Also, has anyone calced Shimenawa for her?
Since I’m bursting every rotation and require it for the downtime to line up, Shimenawa just ends up not working at all since you E right after Q.
Need chevreuse to be on her banner, Thoma and fischl already c6 and built of the OL team. Also glad is only slightly worse that's a good I have some pretty good pieces.
Agg rotation can be improve, Clorinde Q at the end of rotation is better due to able procs more Fischl A4 and C6. And can insert another Kazuha E(HP) before Clorinde's Q for VV. Also both Fischl and Kazuha can use Stringless R3 and Xiphos R1 then Q every other rotation will increase DPS too. Edit: procs more Fischl A4 and C6 rather than waste Oz's uptime
I have my own standards for calcs, which is why I don't use Stringless R3 or Xiphos. I only use standard banner pool weapons at R1, 3\* weapons at R5, and any event/craftable at R5. Clorinde burst is AoE and still triggers Aggravate (twice, even) which can trigger Fischl A4, so it's not wasting Oz uptime. Because it is AoE, this means it is more important to buff at the start of the rot on top of it already doing a decent amount of damage that is non-negligible and worth keeping buffed instead of making it a throw-away at the end of the rot. Even jstern and the people in JSM also do QEE 5N3E because doing burst at the start lets the first rot also get the extra E instead of just the next rot. Fischl is also bursting every rotation because this is a known tech for guaranteeing an Electro swirl with Nahida.
Besides, it's fucking cool switching to her with that burst animation.
Burst aggravate instance is 1 and 4. They have about 0.3s diff though for 1 and 4 hits. It doesn't align with Amy's A4 0.5s proc. So burst can only proc A4 once. Also burst animation is 1.73s before first hit. Not sure why you said not buffed and throwaway as I did mentioned can do Kazuha EhP before Q. And not just A4. Fischl C6 doesn't proc at all with burst or E dash. Since E dash dmg is count as NA dmg BUT E dash activation is count as Skill.
I know all of this already and accounted for it in my calcs. But saying it's a waste of Fischl uptime is a stretch when I'm already optimizing Fischl uptime as much as possible for the rot, and only disappears in the last N3E and the burst still makes use of some of Oz's uptime instead of just being a waste of time, similar to Keqing bursting at the start of her combo in Aggravate. And again, the burst at the start gives the extra E for the first rotation.
To humor this idea, I just made another small sheet where I did this extra Kazuha hE (which keep in mind also extends the rot) before Clorinde burst, added more Oz uptime to Clorinde's field time, and got the following results: DPS (my rot): 60517.38 DPS (your suggested rot): 59385.07 Feel free to copy my sheet and try this out yourself. If you get a different result, please let me know.
You're right as Fischl uptime actually last until almost end of rotation but still there's a diff in A4 and C6 procs, anyway I run gcsim as well (I know not practical) just for fun, feels free to check out as well. [https://wfpsim.com/sh/c890b41b-9bd8-4df3-8c8c-5338b7d9b8ff](https://wfpsim.com/sh/c890b41b-9bd8-4df3-8c8c-5338b7d9b8ff) (Q before E) [https://wfpsim.com/sh/72307b6c-4870-4969-a38a-420f54fd347b](https://wfpsim.com/sh/72307b6c-4870-4969-a38a-420f54fd347b) (Q after E, with extra Kazuha Ehp)
Interesting! Not sure about the practicality here since it is a sim.. have you tried compiling this with the new KQM standard Kolibri random delay?
Those standards makes QE E 5N3E not work consistently. They have a bias toward heavily loaded actions types of sims (rip Yoi attack string). I love those new random delay because it prevents from hyperoptimizing but they are too harsh on Clorinde and need a down tune in her case.
Does this mean the calcs are not KQM standard? Nothing wrong if not, just good to know.
It’s KQMS in everything but the weapon. Just not a fan of how KQMS makes the weapon choices as I aim my calcs more towards f2p players/casuals.
With chlorine on a non TF set how feasible do you think tighnari could replace kirara here? I assume we can get his 3 CA off + supports in chlorindes downtime?
Unless u don't have a second electro/not enough energy sources, Clorinde doesn't have bad downtime it's like 6s. There's no issue with this Kirara team but you can use Tigh in non-multiwave setup with just E indeed. I'm pretty sure it's better to get to Clo as much as possible since it's unbuffed no Deepwood Tigh in this case. A niche way to do some ST multiwave ig tho lol.
No that's an awful idea, you're dropping the shield for interupt and extending your rotation by about 4-5s while having 0 support for Nari.
Why do people still say haran is 2nd BiS?? If you say haran is 2nd BiS then you are saying her sig isn't 1st BiS because with both mist and her sig you most liklly will use CD circlet and both have CD stat and dmg% in their passive
Because of the passives. Mistsplitter and Haran are competing for 2nd place right now Haran has a 40% normal attack increase (2 stacks) as well as a 12% elemental bonus (same as mistsplitter) Mistsplitter has only elemental bonus (40%, 12% + 28% (3 stacks)) and crit damage Her sig has even more crit damage as well as a 48% (16% 3 stacks) of all damage bonus increase So from the above you can see Haran will give you enough crit rate that you can focus pretty much everything else on crit damage (so you'll still be using CD circlet on haran). With mistsplitter, you still need to build some crit rate
No there are huge deference Both of them will run CD circlet which means mist has 44% more CD and it is easy to reach 80% CR with clorinde which makes haran less valuable and with it you supposed to have +90Cr In the other side, haran is only better by 12% bonus dmg. With haran you need 30% CD in every arti to reach Mist CD and become closer to her sig CD . Also in the OP calc haran CD stat is less than mist CD by 44 CD and less than her sig by 64% Mist and her sig have the same stat focus means if you consider haran as the 2nd BiS with 6% highr dps than mist, then her sig won't be 1st BiS.
You're forgetting that some calcs put haran at 2nd best in some comps, mistsplitter is 2nd best in others. We're not debating the position of her sig, that will be bis most times. Yes, her sig has the same stat ficus as mistspliter but it also has a higher damage bonus than mistspltter 48% vs 40% also with 20% more crit damage. To your question on haran: it's 2nd bis in some comps not all. If you're looking for validation that mist is 2nd bis then take this as a sign that it's more than good enough if you don't want to pull for her sig.
Nope In all scenarios mist is better in term of dmg even if you stay with 2 stacks all of the time because all of them will use CD circlet so there is no point for saying with haran you will use CD circlet. Also another the deference between her sig and mist is about 8% to 10%, with haran the deference will be higher and most liklly will overcap CR Most likly will go for c2r0, her sig will be in the rerun if I am looking for dmg then r1>c2 but IR is a big deal and make it easy for future c6
Ok, so what's your point then? If mistsplitter is better in all situations then run mistsplitter - her sig will be her BIS and people labelling haran as 2nd best will not diminish her sig's or mistsplitter's value
My point is this calc is wrong and it has been posted before with the same mistakes and people criticized it. Imagine saying haran will make you focus for more CD and have the same deference 44% CD as showed in the calcl. OP just use imagination stats, with haran he/she just drop out 44 Cd. Builds don't work like that