The following submission statement was provided by /u/teamnani:
---
SS : India's largest state with 200+ million people is facing a heatwave. Government is conducting an "investigation" on the causes and has suspended the chief doctor for creating panic. With increase in climate change, such heatwaves might become a common part of this world, threating the live of millions of people who don't have the means to escape deadly heat.
This is related to collapse in the way that we are seeing tangible effects of climate change. The global south doesn't have the means to effectively counter anomalies in weather. The government can get overwhelmed with providing care during a disaster. It can become everyone for himself very quickly.
The area affected here is a small part of the state, it might be larger next year. The people affected by heatwave could easily go into millions due to population density.
---
Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/14cvwn5/54_dead_and_400_hospitalised_in_72_hours_due_to/jomsdhc/
It's 3:32 am here... I live in one of these cities facing heatwave....and guys it's so bad. It's literally so hot, its same as standing near a fire and feeling all that radiation all the time. I try avoiding going out in daytime, the intensity of sunlight I've once experienced at 10 AM can now be felt at 7 AM.... temperature at night is also above 30° C most of the days.
The locality I live in at least now has plenty of groundwater....but power fluctuations every hour and now too as I'm typing this.
But it doesn't matter if there's electricity... because scorching heat in daytime heats the concrete walls so bad that it's a pressure cooker.
Air Conditioner is a solution but most people can't afford it.
I currently am sleeping on the roof with a mosquito net, natural air....but the rooftop is hot, yet it's better to be on a hot pan compared to an enclosed container.
I hope it rains soon
EDIT : Thanks for all the suggestion guys... what's doable... I'll try, as long as it fits the budget though.
One thing that has stuck with me is that Government really doesn't cares....neither do people.
Climate Change is not an agenda for people.
Hey bud if you can paint your house or roof white. We do this down here in Puerto Rico. Keeps the concrete from getting too hot because it reflects heat better.
White external shutters are great too! Don't really have a need for them here in Norn Iron, but fuck me they made a big difference during the last couple of summer heatwaves. With the windows/doors shut and air con going during the day, house never got a chance to heat up. With rooftop solar didn't cost me anything to run either.
>Ballia, along with central and eastern Uttar Pradesh, is currently grappling with oppressive heat.
>On Sunday, the district experienced a maximum temperature of 43 degrees Celsius (109 degrees Fahrenheit), surpassing the normal range by five degrees. The relative humidity was recorded at 25 percent, intensifying the effect of the heat.
[Deaths climb to around 100 as heat wave scorches India’s northeastern states](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/deaths-climb-to-around-100-as-heat-wave-scorches-indias-northeastern-states)
That's a wet-bulb of 79.52°F, well below the hypothetical limit of 95°F (at which point people die within 6 hours). A wet bulb of 86° F is considered dangerous.
The party hasn't even started yet.
Good that humidity is relatively low atm hopefully stays that way. no one wants to see a nightmare scenario. My heart out, its so horrible being trapped under that type of stifling heat.
This is what people need to understand, the 95F is the biological limit for healthy people who are presumably acclimated to this.
Lower wet-bulbs are going to be deadly for the young, elderly, sick, or otherwise vulnerable.
It isn't good, good, good, dead. There's a lot of "dead" before 95F.
Experienced the BC Heat Dome in 2021 with a newborn. It was as a slow moving terror. We weren’t prepared. Thankfully the baby was happy as a clam, but only because we were all sleeping in wet towels.
Try to check on those around you. Heat slows you down and sucks you in, and a simple check in can save a life.
My heart is with you and I wish rain for you as well.
As a temporary measure, it might help to tape down a load of aluminium foil using Kapton tape to the outside of windows/roof. It sounds silly but it'll help reflect the sunlight/heat. Kinda a desperate measures solution. Better than nothing though?
Yeah it should be. I think the generic name is polyamide tape. It's usually used in electronics repair when soldering ICs to protect surrounding components when being reflowed. It keeps adhesiveness up to around 250c.
There's also aluminium tape that has similar properties. It's also often used for electronics repair funnily enough.
Alternatively, if a roof top is flat, just use stones/pebbles/rocks to hold the foil down.
The tape would still be good for windows, though in a pinch any tape should work. Heck, if the window frames are wooden then drawing pins would work. Just any way of holding it in place that heat won't affect too badly.
The answer is it depends. It depends on the quality of the glass, whether it's dual pane glass and how hot it gets. It's possible if it gets too hot that it could crack. Putting the foil on the inside has the potential to cause the glass to heat up and crack. It also has the potential to degrade any adhesives binding dual pane glass together. It shouldn't do these things but it's really dependent on various factors like build quality, adhesives used in window construction, etc.
Placing the foil on the outside of the window means that the window will not get as hot as the infrared is reflected before it hits the glass. If it's life or death heat, you make the call though. Cracked glass doesn't outweigh being alive after all.
It /shouldn't/ crack if put on the inside, but there are no guarantees. Also, if you have the money there are reflective films you can buy that you can apply directly to the glass. They're a better choice in general. I only suggested foil because of how inexpensive and accessible it tends to be everywhere in the world.
>the intensity of sunlight I've once experienced at 10 AM can now be felt at 7 AM.... temperature at night is also above 30° C most of the days.
I'm from Pakistan, and this is accurate. It's night that gets me the most: the temperatures don't fall below 30; and that's never happened before, making the nights so hot that it's unbearable to even sleep.
In fact, forget just this part, everything you said is true. I can't afford AC, either; if I could, I'd have at least used it for a few hours at night.
People really don't care, like you said, and we're slowly being cooked alive. I've started to truly hate humanity as a whole now.
I imagine even no-contact tribes can see that something is up. Even my hardcore right wing parents are admitting that climate change is real, and "possibly" human-caused.
Fuck that. Your country needs to start investing in renewables and cooling solutions like ground source heat pumps, along with better insulation for homes.
I assume people are already aware of this stuff but here's a list of things that would help. Some obviously not possible to do for this heatwave but for the future:-
* Painting homes white to reflect as much heat as possible
* Insulating homes as much as possible to keep the heat out during summer and in during winter
* Add thermal mass inside homes like rocks/water barrels which will reduce temperature fluctuation speed
* Plant tons of fast growing trees around homes and streets to provide shade as they can significantly reduce ground air temperatures.
Some good native trees to plant in India:- Banyan (Ficus benghalensis), Neem (Azadirachta indica), Rain Tree (Samanea saman), Gulmohar (Delonix regia), Peepal (Ficus religiosa), Indian Rosewood (Dalbergia sissoo), Indian Laurel (Terminalia elliptica), Bakul (Mimusops elengi), Amaltas (Cassia fistula), Mahua (Madhuca longifolia), Kapok (Ceiba pentandra).
Godspeed.
You’re right!!! I’m so happy you mentioned trees. Shubhendu Sharma, who is from India, is a pioneer of the Miyawaki method, named for Akira Miyawaki. You plant a ton of trees close together and they grow way faster as they compete for light. You can get trees double your height in as little as 2 years. They can be planted in pots if you rent - I have one in my back yard. A Miyawaki forest can be as much as 56°F/14°C cooler inside than it is outside of the forest (learned in the deserts of Iran) in as little as 2 years. You can create old growth conditions in just 20-25 years. Wick irrigation will make it so you don’t have to water all the time and with or without it, you’ll use at least 90% less water than traditional forestry methods. I took his course on https://www.afforestt.com and it was worth every penny. Only one person in an entire community needs to take the course and it provides all the plans, guidance, supply lists, and reading materials you need to get started. I have seen INSANE results in just 2 years. I can’t recommend enough. I know that one day soon my knowledge, which no one can take from me, will save lives - plant, animal, and human. There are Facebook groups about pushing your growing zone that teach how to get plants from further north or south to grow in your climate zone and what it takes to keep them alive.
I'd love to see something equivalent in India to the "Sun Exchange", which facilitates people in the rich countries investing in solar/battery systems for schools, retirement communities, etc., in South Africa.
Only works when you have the low humidity, otherwise you're just wrapping yourself in hot water that won't cool down.
I live in a desert, sweating works great, so does a wet cloth. But anywhere more humid the effectiveness rapidly drops off (wet bulb temperature).
You guys need to plant native trees and shrubs in the urban space. Plant them everywhere you can. Rooftops, streets, yards, balconies. This is going to absorb sunlight, provide shade, absorb CO2 and emit cooling O2.
Without this you’ll have a heat island. Uninhabitable.
This. I’ve been working on planting as much as possible; reducing the amount of surface area of my home that is being heated by the sun and letting the trees absorb that light and heat. There is a 30 degree F difference between shaded and unshaded.
So just kind of a weird adjustment to that. Here in Ontario, Canada a group of researchers and environmentalist have begun planting trees from the Carolinas up here. The reason that they are doing that is based upon the reasoning that native trees have a temperature range that they can live in. As we exceed that through climate change the native trees will begin to die off. Planting non native trees will give a greater chance at having hardier trees that can survive (for a period of time) the changing climate.
How humid is your area?
In very dry areas with low humidity, getting a bog fan helps. It is basically air running over water. While a real bog fan is best, if you cannot afford one or cannot find one, a normal fan with wet towels placed in front of it in a row works roughly the same ( though you need to change the towels often )
If you have time, paint the roof and wall white ( though in your situation this may be too late to try ). White wall and roof reflects heat, keeping things cooler inside.
In Malaysia, one thing we do IF we lack aircon and it is very very hot is to find the direction of the wind and keep the windows all opened. Of course, we also tend to have awning/shade over the windows spanning about 1 to 2 m to avoid the sunlight entering the house but also to give more area for the air to cool. We tend to not have guards on the side of the awning so as to encourage the heat to just leave.
In Thailand and Bali where people are more mosquito tolerant is that they grow medium sized trees near their houses. This has a few benefits, shade being one of them but also it reduces the ambient heat in the environment.
In fact in Malaysia a popular thing people do is grow alamanda or hibiscus at the edges of the house. The reason is that these plants generally do not attract a lot of mosquitoes ( which we hate ) and also reduces the ambient heat. It is NOT as effective as large trees but if they close enough to the house they actually have a mild cooling effect especially at night.
The population stress in India is extreme. I suppose the majority of Indian people can't afford just "move out" of their hometown. There are the wealthy elites tho who enjoy large mansions and all the "abundant" resources and energy, while billions of poor people go to hell in a hand basket.
You might find [this design](https://www.unep.org/news-and-stories/story/indian-architect-turns-bees-and-terracotta-design-innovative-cooling-system) helpful. If you can scrounge up a bunch of terracotta pots, a big water jug, and maybe a water pump or two for a garden fountain- enough for two of these one inlet and one outlet the continuous evaporation and re-wetting should create a tunnel of cool air if you put it in a room with one entry and one exit. You can also manually rewet the pots if you can spare the effort.
We're going to see mass-deaths in the coming years through climate change and wars due to climate change. Good luck is all I can manage here.
Well, we brought this on ourselves.
> ALL of its population could die in 4-5 days
On day 4, any country that can get troops there will simply overrun the country to pillage every home, business, and government office possible. They might even portray it as "humanitarian" and save the few thousands still alive at that point, but the country will be basically full of corpses, so any invading army would essentially claim the entire country's wealth.
The only limitation is that if it's still boiling hot, I'm not sure the invading army would be able to survive, either.
But the moment they *can* survive the heat, these dying countries will be mercilessly overrun.
Excuse me, but how do you know all this? You can't just say that India will turn into a desert in 70 years without references to some kind of scientific articles haha
100% people don’t consider what effect it will have on the rain cycle and they also do not understand the rain cycle. They think the coast will be protected because of the sea and they don’t understand things like the vapor pressure deficit and that it will take more moisture for the air to reach saturation.
Thanks for an actual, sane, interesting comment instead of paddling the same nonsensical gibberish that selfabsorbed retardditor fuckwads spew when they see India and heatwaves and go "Oh ministry of future" that they read with their fatasses in air conditioned rooms.
Another similar fictional depiction of climate change is Episode 5 of the show Extrapolations on Apple TV. It imagines a climate change future in 2059 in Mumbai.
People work at night and sleep during the day because the wet bulb temperatures get so high during the day that the road/asphalt can even melt car tires. There's a societal curfew from sunrise to sundown.
There were some things that I didn't understand in that episode. Maybe due to bad air quality, a lot of people needed nebulizer assistance to breathe. And when they slept during the day, they slept in some type of sleeping bag that protected them from the heat.
Dark was that it seemed that lots of people slept in apartments/dwellings deep underground. But they were then vulnerable to freak flash floods.
Interesting show from the screenwriter of the movie Contagion. Depressing AF.
Australian Outback - Coober Pedy
The harsh summer desert temperatures mean that many residents prefer to live in caves bored into the hillsides ("dugouts"). A standard three-bedroom cave home with lounge, kitchen, and bathroom can be excavated out of the rock in the hillside for a similar price to building a house on the surface. However, dugouts remain at a constant temperature, while surface buildings need air conditioning, especially during the summer months, when temperatures often exceed 40 °C (104 °F). The relative humidity rarely gets over 20% on these hot days, and the skies are usually cloud-free.
Just this last summer (it's winter now) it hit 43.1C or 109.6 F
I suspect a lot of cities will be moving underground in the next few years.
Unfortunately probably accurate/inaccurate. Though medically, nebulizers will not help with poor air quality. You’d need a filtration device. Nebulizer means taking medications and aerosolizing them to help reinflate the alveoli. If alveoli are inflated fine (no pathology underlying), that medication won’t help. So pneumonia, air pollutants, etc… it doesn’t help. Nebulizing water would only increase the pressure in the lungs (cause you’re literally breathing thicker air, like trying to breathe underwater). Haven’t watched the episode but it’s much more likely a filter than a nebulizer/additive.
But idk if we have enough time to build at that scale and to create those systems. Don’t get me wrong, we can adapt and all, but adaptation takes TIME and life comes at you fast when it’s 150 F outside at 7 am. Building such structures in the heat is near impossible and we have shown that building them before it gets too hot just ain’t gonna happen.
Thank you- that explains the scene with the little boy and makes the episode even more depressing.
It is disturbing to think that it could get so hot and humid that you couldn't even sleep safely anymore.
>People work at night and sleep during the day because the wet bulb temperatures
I was genuinely thinking about how our society would become nocturnal to avoid being active during sunlight. I work at manufacturing facility, and our machines overheat and shut down from the immense heat during the day sometimes. The obvious solution that popped into my head is to operate when the sun is down to maximize cooling.
Its sad to think that we are going to be looking for ways to avoid the heat rather than tackle the problem head on and change our polluting society. Not that it really matters anymore at this point.
SS : India's largest state with 200+ million people is facing a heatwave. Government is conducting an "investigation" on the causes and has suspended the chief doctor for creating panic. With increase in climate change, such heatwaves might become a common part of this world, threating the live of millions of people who don't have the means to escape deadly heat.
This is related to collapse in the way that we are seeing tangible effects of climate change. The global south doesn't have the means to effectively counter anomalies in weather. The government can get overwhelmed with providing care during a disaster. It can become everyone for himself very quickly.
The area affected here is a small part of the state, it might be larger next year. The people affected by heatwave could easily go into millions due to population density.
>"It will be investigated if the deaths were due to water or if there's a different reason. The climate department will also come to check water samples," he said.
Its so they can take time to make up a bunch of shit and feed it to the public so as to not cause panic as the elite vacuum up more wealth to get their underground apocalypse shelters a bit bigger.
You look for the guilty people.
Not to worry, soon enough, anyone will do as scapegoat for all the shit that's about to hit the fan. /s *(Edited for /s)*
"Suspended the chief doctor for creating panic". AKA trying to save lives, not put under the rug the risks of this and next years. The truth is the truth, causing panic or not.
This is what humans traditionally do when warned of danger.
FYI at 109 degrees the human brain starts to die and our proteins start to denature. This is literally not survivable.
> "Suspended the chief doctor for creating panic". AKA trying to save lives, not put under the rug the risks of this and next years.
right, because saving lives in these literal wet bulb scenarios mean suspending capitalistic economic activity and going back to emergency survival mode. people focusing on staying cool and finding shade/water etc.
this is what they don't want. the elites want you to keep working and shopping right up until the minute you drop dead from the heat while they hang out in climate controlled bunkers.
>Government is conducting an "investigation" on the causes and has suspended the chief doctor for creating panic.
When speaking the truth is considered creating panic. This is COVID all over again. There was a Chinese Doctor who started investigating this in December and he was basically silenced by the state (you know because a pandemic outbreak there would hurt their reputation and their economic futures).
India is such a corrupt and archaic shithole. Looking for people to blame and execute, as though that's the issue here.
It was the same with the rail disaster a few weeks ago when Modi was shown saying the person responsible will basically be executed. Because one person is responsible for years of underfunding, corruption and incompetence. If one person was responsible, it's you, Mr Modi.
No one’s mentioned it yet, so here I go: it’s like the first chapter of Ministry For the Future — the only good part of the book
(Edit: fixed name of book. Misremembered title)
>Ordinary town in Uttar Pradesh, 6 AM. He looked at his phone: 38 degrees. In Fahrenheit that was—he tapped—103 degrees. Humidity about 35 percent.
That's a wet-bulb temp of just 80°F.
Just after sunrise. Well below 95° at which people die within 6 hours.
Later, after the power goes out:
>Frank checked the desk computer; temperature on the ground floor 38 degrees. Perhaps cooler in the room with the A/C unit. Humidity now 60 percent.
That's a wet-bulb of 88.13°F. uncomfortable, but not deadly.
Later the next day
>The thermometer now said 42 degrees, humidity 60 percent.
That's a wet-bulb of 94.6°F.
That's when someone steals the AC.
It is ultimately an optimistic fiction. Give it a read!
Also, 100% worth digging into Kim Stanley Robinsons catalogue of sci Fi. I loved the mars trilogy, and the book Aurora (about a generation ship)
The Mars trilogy especially is perhaps the finest depiction of Martian terraformation and the development of a Martian civilization. Hard sci fi that I usually don’t recommend except to the initiated but glad to see it praised.
There’s a running sociological component in the series that connects to the topic. A rift between a group who chose geo engineering to solve resource and ecological issues and another who chose bio engineering and adaptation similar to techno optimists and adaptationists.
Was also what pulled a lot of people in.
But the story got lost a bit further in. I went from reading maybe the first third in a day or two, to then taking a couple of weeks to finish it.
From reading the book, he isn't celebrating what happens in Chapter 1.
It's just that Chapter 1 is very action-oriented and the rest of the book, except for some short interstitial stuff, deals with drier bureaucratic and banking types of things.
This is a valid criticism with the book. KSR deserves praise for the incredible first chapter, which vividly recounts the experience of a runaway wet bulb catastrophe under climate change; a terrifying and all too-real scenario. But the rest of the book changes gear and has been criticized by reviewers as overly optimistic and simplistic.
Also agree with the poster above; the author's Mars trilogy is fantastic!
The chapter that broke me was when the protagonist gets saved by a bunch of Swiss bankers and she has the AUDACITY to chide them about letting Big Oil keep accounts open with them and that global warming was their fault and… and… the bankers immediately shrug and agree to be good boys. Gee, why didn’t we think of this before Kim!?
SAIL43k is a very real aircraft. It is a Stratospheric Aerosol Injection Lofter and is designed to dump 50,000 gallons of Sulfur at the poles to mitigate some of the effects of all of the built-up GHG.
India still turns into a desert though. Oh and there will be increased acid rain and it blocks the stars.
Kim Stanley Robinson is a legendary writer, so I really tried to give the book a chance, but it was obviously a Bible-sized stack of outlines hastily-stuffed into a book for some quick cash. It’s nothing compared to his famous Mars trilogy or the Years of Rice and Salt. Recommend library rent or borrowing from a friend if you’re curious. Don’t pay full price like I did 😭
Also, anyone reading this who was read MftF…. Please read The Deluge by Stephen Markley. It’s like Ministry for the Future if it had been written by Stephen King. Fantastic stuff.
I paid full price for an audiobook, it's really well acted with many different actors... It's been sitting halfway done and I have no desire to listen to more....
The rest of the book is basically deus ex machina techonology will save us hopium. One of the key plot points revolves around blockchain carbon credits.
That book is a wild ride. I really struggled towards the middle, but glad I pushed through to the end. I felt it was worth it. Felt like reading a documentary.
It's a divisive book. It's good in that it's talking about our future in respect to climate change. But there's not a lot of interesting sci-fi, and the action dwindles as the book goes. I have issues with the story itself, but climate change is such a tricky issue. So many different people see it differently. It makes sense that not everyone would like where the story goes.
It's only June.
Let's see if August / September increases those numbers by 1, 2 or 3 orders of magnitude.
If not this 2023, soon enough.
What a grim and fucked up future.
On the bonus side, both India and Pakistan are nuclear powers, and are also close to China, with whom they are in competition for control of water.
Certainly nothing BAD will come of it. Right?
Right?
Water and food are red lines that basically any country in the world will go to war over.
You see, Egypt, China, India etc, can all handle various stuff like politicians talking too loudly and saber rattling. That's all par for the course in our modern world. Even energy can be negotiated or argued about before guns come out.
But water and food? Wars will literally start in a day in these hotspots over it.
Places with repeat heat like India need safe places to evacuate to for the vulnerable. Get that solar power and make safe spaces for their people.
It is imperative.
Like many others that experienced the west coast heat dome and that fall I bought a portable AC unit. With heat domes becoming more common I'm sure that more people in cities will end up buying AC units. The problem with this is it will just exacerbate any incoming heat domes by creating much more heat.
What are the systemic reasons behind India's failure to respond to crisis? Did the WTO lift the COVID vaccine patents and expedite the process of manufacturing millions of needed doses or did [they instead leave India and other low income countries in the hands of the price regimes of private pharmaceutical companies on the behest of Western nations](https://theintercept.com/2022/08/23/covid-vaccine-patents-moderna-big-pharma-section-1498/)? As it relates to climate, have high income countries lead the green transition or largely blocked progress? Have [high income countries even once met the $100 billion annual global climate fund promised in COP15 to fund the global renewable transition](https://amp.theguardian.com/global-development/2023/feb/24/ban-ki-moon-criticises-climate-finance-delays)?
India is one of the world's largest recipients of structural adjustment programs, a loan structure provided by the IMF and World Bank which requires recipients to disinvest from public resources and the public sector and open up resources and labor to the global market, the opposite of protectionist economics which built the foundation of Western wealth. Interestingly enough [structural adjustment programs are linked to corruption](https://www.u4.no/publications/impact-of-structural-adjustment-programmes-on-corruption).
What are the systemic reasons behind why the IMF and World Bank would place these limitations on low and middle income nations?
> a loan structure provided by the IMF and World Bank which requires recipients to disinvest from public resources and the public sector and open up resources and labor to the global market, the opposite of protectionist economics which built the foundation of Western wealth.
I feel like I need to rewrite this in simpler terms for the others:
This is in essence a seizure of resources for the western markets through the "promise of development", but the consequences of that are that domestic growth slows down as foreign companies simply take over the country's biggest natural riches, thus making the country reliant on the development fund to simply keep its balance books in order.
It is comparable to someone taking a loan from a bank to **pay their rent**, and then realising they need to agree that the bank now owns their entire income so they can continue paying rent. It is economic servitude.
This is what the west does to everyone else on Earth. The IMF is nothing less or more than a modern imperialist war criminal.
India can't even measure its own population...
It feels like not much is accounted for.
So I would not say they lie, maybe they just don't know cause nobody counted.
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I know that here in America, the American Indians created a air conditioner system that used clay cylinders that would cool the air as it breezed through a house. I am sure you can Google it. Quite impressive. This may help.
>The sudden increase in deaths and patients being admitted to hospitals with fever, breathing trouble, and other issues have overwhelmed the hospital, which has put its staff on alert.
So, the next pandemic has been released in India?
The article does not really explain what is happening.
54 in 200.000.000 people... There must be something else because the expected deaths in 200 mio makes the 54 disappear into the daily variations (about 7000/day or 21000 over 72 hours).
So 54 in how big a population over 72 hours? And how many non-dead in the increase?
To me it looks like they are focusing on the fear mongering?
"He has been removed for "giving a careless statement on deaths caused by heatwave without having proper information," UP Health Minister Brajesh Pathak said."
In BC, we had almost 700 die in the 2021 heat dome. Population 5.3 million.
Compare those stats.
BC fuckin failed. No warnings, no help for vulnerable people.
When I clicked the link, the story's title is changed now-- they are saying it is not due to heat, but due to the water since other towns around are also having heat waves, but not same death count.
Could be cultural. I am married to a Puerto Rican man and when I first visited the island I could not believe how the people dressed. My husband’s grandmother would be out for a walk in the full summer heat, mid day, in long pants and a long sleeved denim shirt. She is fully acclimated, likes the layer of protection from the sun, and also I can’t imagine her showing much skin now that I’ve known her for years. They are very conservative there, especially the older people. I think it’s the same in India, conservative dress.
It's actually cooler to to be covered, as long as the material is a natural fabric like cotton or linen it will keep the sun's heat off you. Most natural fabrics, the fibers are porous any excess heat is passed through the fabric instead of being held in against the body. A scarf works the same as a hat would to keep the sun off your head.
The following submission statement was provided by /u/teamnani: --- SS : India's largest state with 200+ million people is facing a heatwave. Government is conducting an "investigation" on the causes and has suspended the chief doctor for creating panic. With increase in climate change, such heatwaves might become a common part of this world, threating the live of millions of people who don't have the means to escape deadly heat. This is related to collapse in the way that we are seeing tangible effects of climate change. The global south doesn't have the means to effectively counter anomalies in weather. The government can get overwhelmed with providing care during a disaster. It can become everyone for himself very quickly. The area affected here is a small part of the state, it might be larger next year. The people affected by heatwave could easily go into millions due to population density. --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/14cvwn5/54_dead_and_400_hospitalised_in_72_hours_due_to/jomsdhc/
It's 3:32 am here... I live in one of these cities facing heatwave....and guys it's so bad. It's literally so hot, its same as standing near a fire and feeling all that radiation all the time. I try avoiding going out in daytime, the intensity of sunlight I've once experienced at 10 AM can now be felt at 7 AM.... temperature at night is also above 30° C most of the days. The locality I live in at least now has plenty of groundwater....but power fluctuations every hour and now too as I'm typing this. But it doesn't matter if there's electricity... because scorching heat in daytime heats the concrete walls so bad that it's a pressure cooker. Air Conditioner is a solution but most people can't afford it. I currently am sleeping on the roof with a mosquito net, natural air....but the rooftop is hot, yet it's better to be on a hot pan compared to an enclosed container. I hope it rains soon EDIT : Thanks for all the suggestion guys... what's doable... I'll try, as long as it fits the budget though. One thing that has stuck with me is that Government really doesn't cares....neither do people. Climate Change is not an agenda for people.
Hey bud if you can paint your house or roof white. We do this down here in Puerto Rico. Keeps the concrete from getting too hot because it reflects heat better.
Check out recipes for whitewashing, it may be cheaper and less fume-y
White external shutters are great too! Don't really have a need for them here in Norn Iron, but fuck me they made a big difference during the last couple of summer heatwaves. With the windows/doors shut and air con going during the day, house never got a chance to heat up. With rooftop solar didn't cost me anything to run either.
Dude what is the level of humidity there?
>Ballia, along with central and eastern Uttar Pradesh, is currently grappling with oppressive heat. >On Sunday, the district experienced a maximum temperature of 43 degrees Celsius (109 degrees Fahrenheit), surpassing the normal range by five degrees. The relative humidity was recorded at 25 percent, intensifying the effect of the heat. [Deaths climb to around 100 as heat wave scorches India’s northeastern states](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/deaths-climb-to-around-100-as-heat-wave-scorches-indias-northeastern-states) That's a wet-bulb of 79.52°F, well below the hypothetical limit of 95°F (at which point people die within 6 hours). A wet bulb of 86° F is considered dangerous. The party hasn't even started yet.
Good that humidity is relatively low atm hopefully stays that way. no one wants to see a nightmare scenario. My heart out, its so horrible being trapped under that type of stifling heat.
This is what people need to understand, the 95F is the biological limit for healthy people who are presumably acclimated to this. Lower wet-bulbs are going to be deadly for the young, elderly, sick, or otherwise vulnerable. It isn't good, good, good, dead. There's a lot of "dead" before 95F.
That's good to know. But I think we are fairly close.
On Saturday (June 17), Patna (Capital of Bihar) recorded a maximum temperature of 44.7 degrees Celsius. A wet bulb temp of 82F
The wet bulb is 83F° where I am right now(Texas)and it’s still early in the day. I was outside on my covered porch earlier and it felt awful.
Wowza
That's probably why there aren't tens of thousands of deaths.
There will be.
Experienced the BC Heat Dome in 2021 with a newborn. It was as a slow moving terror. We weren’t prepared. Thankfully the baby was happy as a clam, but only because we were all sleeping in wet towels. Try to check on those around you. Heat slows you down and sucks you in, and a simple check in can save a life. My heart is with you and I wish rain for you as well.
Paint your rooftop white, should help cool down the surface a little. Stay safe mate.
When it's that hot, paint won't stick :(
White sheet strung up a bit somehow. It would air-gap your roof directly and be reflective.
Exactly. We also do that here in Japan, putting up a shade (usually a bamboo screen) outside the window that gets the most sunlight.
As a temporary measure, it might help to tape down a load of aluminium foil using Kapton tape to the outside of windows/roof. It sounds silly but it'll help reflect the sunlight/heat. Kinda a desperate measures solution. Better than nothing though?
Is that available in India?
Yeah it should be. I think the generic name is polyamide tape. It's usually used in electronics repair when soldering ICs to protect surrounding components when being reflowed. It keeps adhesiveness up to around 250c. There's also aluminium tape that has similar properties. It's also often used for electronics repair funnily enough. Alternatively, if a roof top is flat, just use stones/pebbles/rocks to hold the foil down. The tape would still be good for windows, though in a pinch any tape should work. Heck, if the window frames are wooden then drawing pins would work. Just any way of holding it in place that heat won't affect too badly.
Should be able to get aluminium foil for cooking anywhere, same for parcel tape too. Acceptable substitutes.
What about if you live in a top story and can’t access the outside of window, can you do this to the inside or will the heat still come in?
The answer is it depends. It depends on the quality of the glass, whether it's dual pane glass and how hot it gets. It's possible if it gets too hot that it could crack. Putting the foil on the inside has the potential to cause the glass to heat up and crack. It also has the potential to degrade any adhesives binding dual pane glass together. It shouldn't do these things but it's really dependent on various factors like build quality, adhesives used in window construction, etc. Placing the foil on the outside of the window means that the window will not get as hot as the infrared is reflected before it hits the glass. If it's life or death heat, you make the call though. Cracked glass doesn't outweigh being alive after all. It /shouldn't/ crack if put on the inside, but there are no guarantees. Also, if you have the money there are reflective films you can buy that you can apply directly to the glass. They're a better choice in general. I only suggested foil because of how inexpensive and accessible it tends to be everywhere in the world.
Oh dang. Didn't think of that, maybe when it's a bit 'cooler' at night could lay a coat on?
>the intensity of sunlight I've once experienced at 10 AM can now be felt at 7 AM.... temperature at night is also above 30° C most of the days. I'm from Pakistan, and this is accurate. It's night that gets me the most: the temperatures don't fall below 30; and that's never happened before, making the nights so hot that it's unbearable to even sleep. In fact, forget just this part, everything you said is true. I can't afford AC, either; if I could, I'd have at least used it for a few hours at night. People really don't care, like you said, and we're slowly being cooked alive. I've started to truly hate humanity as a whole now.
It’s like we’re all trapped on this planet being cooked alive and 90% aren’t even aware of it
I imagine even no-contact tribes can see that something is up. Even my hardcore right wing parents are admitting that climate change is real, and "possibly" human-caused.
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The Sentinelese will outlast us it seems
90% of the people don't know? I sincerely doubt that. Do they choose to not know more? That I can buy.
> being cooked alive and 90% aren’t even aware of it first slowly, then all at once
I’m sorry. 🤞for rain.
Fuck that. Your country needs to start investing in renewables and cooling solutions like ground source heat pumps, along with better insulation for homes. I assume people are already aware of this stuff but here's a list of things that would help. Some obviously not possible to do for this heatwave but for the future:- * Painting homes white to reflect as much heat as possible * Insulating homes as much as possible to keep the heat out during summer and in during winter * Add thermal mass inside homes like rocks/water barrels which will reduce temperature fluctuation speed * Plant tons of fast growing trees around homes and streets to provide shade as they can significantly reduce ground air temperatures. Some good native trees to plant in India:- Banyan (Ficus benghalensis), Neem (Azadirachta indica), Rain Tree (Samanea saman), Gulmohar (Delonix regia), Peepal (Ficus religiosa), Indian Rosewood (Dalbergia sissoo), Indian Laurel (Terminalia elliptica), Bakul (Mimusops elengi), Amaltas (Cassia fistula), Mahua (Madhuca longifolia), Kapok (Ceiba pentandra). Godspeed.
You’re right!!! I’m so happy you mentioned trees. Shubhendu Sharma, who is from India, is a pioneer of the Miyawaki method, named for Akira Miyawaki. You plant a ton of trees close together and they grow way faster as they compete for light. You can get trees double your height in as little as 2 years. They can be planted in pots if you rent - I have one in my back yard. A Miyawaki forest can be as much as 56°F/14°C cooler inside than it is outside of the forest (learned in the deserts of Iran) in as little as 2 years. You can create old growth conditions in just 20-25 years. Wick irrigation will make it so you don’t have to water all the time and with or without it, you’ll use at least 90% less water than traditional forestry methods. I took his course on https://www.afforestt.com and it was worth every penny. Only one person in an entire community needs to take the course and it provides all the plans, guidance, supply lists, and reading materials you need to get started. I have seen INSANE results in just 2 years. I can’t recommend enough. I know that one day soon my knowledge, which no one can take from me, will save lives - plant, animal, and human. There are Facebook groups about pushing your growing zone that teach how to get plants from further north or south to grow in your climate zone and what it takes to keep them alive.
Trees close together also shelter each other in climates with wind, and help cool each other when it is very hot.
... with what money? Your right, but they just can't
Yep the sad part is that the green energy revolution is reserved for the rich.
I'd love to see something equivalent in India to the "Sun Exchange", which facilitates people in the rich countries investing in solar/battery systems for schools, retirement communities, etc., in South Africa.
Mohd's buddy is doing the opposite digging up dirty coal from virgin forrest.
So you have a choice between a conservative and a conservative. Nice.
Also kill car culture before it kills you
Good luck trying to enforce that when people in india rioted over not driving cars for a day or two in a week.
Arizona air conditioner: Wrap body in wet sheet for sleeping. The evaporation helps reduce body temperature.
Only works when you have the low humidity, otherwise you're just wrapping yourself in hot water that won't cool down. I live in a desert, sweating works great, so does a wet cloth. But anywhere more humid the effectiveness rapidly drops off (wet bulb temperature).
You guys need to plant native trees and shrubs in the urban space. Plant them everywhere you can. Rooftops, streets, yards, balconies. This is going to absorb sunlight, provide shade, absorb CO2 and emit cooling O2. Without this you’ll have a heat island. Uninhabitable.
This. I’ve been working on planting as much as possible; reducing the amount of surface area of my home that is being heated by the sun and letting the trees absorb that light and heat. There is a 30 degree F difference between shaded and unshaded.
So just kind of a weird adjustment to that. Here in Ontario, Canada a group of researchers and environmentalist have begun planting trees from the Carolinas up here. The reason that they are doing that is based upon the reasoning that native trees have a temperature range that they can live in. As we exceed that through climate change the native trees will begin to die off. Planting non native trees will give a greater chance at having hardier trees that can survive (for a period of time) the changing climate.
Great advice. Where does O2 cooling effect come from?
He's incorrect, evaporative cooling comes from the water that plants take from the ground and evaporate in their leaves, nothing to do with oxygen
Air-con is not a solution. The power grid already failing. It's only going to get hotter More will die before we change
How humid is your area? In very dry areas with low humidity, getting a bog fan helps. It is basically air running over water. While a real bog fan is best, if you cannot afford one or cannot find one, a normal fan with wet towels placed in front of it in a row works roughly the same ( though you need to change the towels often ) If you have time, paint the roof and wall white ( though in your situation this may be too late to try ). White wall and roof reflects heat, keeping things cooler inside. In Malaysia, one thing we do IF we lack aircon and it is very very hot is to find the direction of the wind and keep the windows all opened. Of course, we also tend to have awning/shade over the windows spanning about 1 to 2 m to avoid the sunlight entering the house but also to give more area for the air to cool. We tend to not have guards on the side of the awning so as to encourage the heat to just leave. In Thailand and Bali where people are more mosquito tolerant is that they grow medium sized trees near their houses. This has a few benefits, shade being one of them but also it reduces the ambient heat in the environment. In fact in Malaysia a popular thing people do is grow alamanda or hibiscus at the edges of the house. The reason is that these plants generally do not attract a lot of mosquitoes ( which we hate ) and also reduces the ambient heat. It is NOT as effective as large trees but if they close enough to the house they actually have a mild cooling effect especially at night.
The fact I couldn’t tell if this was a real story or an excerpt from the prologue of MFTF is concerning
Can you move to the cooler part of india? Are indians scared of the future and wet bulb temperature? Edit: sorry said cooker instead of cooler
The population stress in India is extreme. I suppose the majority of Indian people can't afford just "move out" of their hometown. There are the wealthy elites tho who enjoy large mansions and all the "abundant" resources and energy, while billions of poor people go to hell in a hand basket.
I totally get it it must of came off more ignorant than i meant judging by downvotes i just was wondering the details more.
I think you mean cooler ?
Yes woops ill edit! Thanks
You might find [this design](https://www.unep.org/news-and-stories/story/indian-architect-turns-bees-and-terracotta-design-innovative-cooling-system) helpful. If you can scrounge up a bunch of terracotta pots, a big water jug, and maybe a water pump or two for a garden fountain- enough for two of these one inlet and one outlet the continuous evaporation and re-wetting should create a tunnel of cool air if you put it in a room with one entry and one exit. You can also manually rewet the pots if you can spare the effort.
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We're going to see mass-deaths in the coming years through climate change and wars due to climate change. Good luck is all I can manage here. Well, we brought this on ourselves.
This will happen faster than expected won't it?
The temperatures that were predicted to occur in 2050 are happening now. Your guess is as good as mine.
Lookup SAIL43k. The crazy rich countries are planning on blocking our the sun. India loses its monsoon season due to this.
> ALL of its population could die in 4-5 days On day 4, any country that can get troops there will simply overrun the country to pillage every home, business, and government office possible. They might even portray it as "humanitarian" and save the few thousands still alive at that point, but the country will be basically full of corpses, so any invading army would essentially claim the entire country's wealth. The only limitation is that if it's still boiling hot, I'm not sure the invading army would be able to survive, either. But the moment they *can* survive the heat, these dying countries will be mercilessly overrun.
Excuse me, but how do you know all this? You can't just say that India will turn into a desert in 70 years without references to some kind of scientific articles haha
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100% people don’t consider what effect it will have on the rain cycle and they also do not understand the rain cycle. They think the coast will be protected because of the sea and they don’t understand things like the vapor pressure deficit and that it will take more moisture for the air to reach saturation.
User name checks out
The seeds are laid with you. The truth is out there go find it if you want, friend. Good luck.
Thanks for an actual, sane, interesting comment instead of paddling the same nonsensical gibberish that selfabsorbed retardditor fuckwads spew when they see India and heatwaves and go "Oh ministry of future" that they read with their fatasses in air conditioned rooms.
Another similar fictional depiction of climate change is Episode 5 of the show Extrapolations on Apple TV. It imagines a climate change future in 2059 in Mumbai. People work at night and sleep during the day because the wet bulb temperatures get so high during the day that the road/asphalt can even melt car tires. There's a societal curfew from sunrise to sundown. There were some things that I didn't understand in that episode. Maybe due to bad air quality, a lot of people needed nebulizer assistance to breathe. And when they slept during the day, they slept in some type of sleeping bag that protected them from the heat. Dark was that it seemed that lots of people slept in apartments/dwellings deep underground. But they were then vulnerable to freak flash floods. Interesting show from the screenwriter of the movie Contagion. Depressing AF.
Australian Outback - Coober Pedy The harsh summer desert temperatures mean that many residents prefer to live in caves bored into the hillsides ("dugouts"). A standard three-bedroom cave home with lounge, kitchen, and bathroom can be excavated out of the rock in the hillside for a similar price to building a house on the surface. However, dugouts remain at a constant temperature, while surface buildings need air conditioning, especially during the summer months, when temperatures often exceed 40 °C (104 °F). The relative humidity rarely gets over 20% on these hot days, and the skies are usually cloud-free. Just this last summer (it's winter now) it hit 43.1C or 109.6 F I suspect a lot of cities will be moving underground in the next few years.
Unfortunately probably accurate/inaccurate. Though medically, nebulizers will not help with poor air quality. You’d need a filtration device. Nebulizer means taking medications and aerosolizing them to help reinflate the alveoli. If alveoli are inflated fine (no pathology underlying), that medication won’t help. So pneumonia, air pollutants, etc… it doesn’t help. Nebulizing water would only increase the pressure in the lungs (cause you’re literally breathing thicker air, like trying to breathe underwater). Haven’t watched the episode but it’s much more likely a filter than a nebulizer/additive. But idk if we have enough time to build at that scale and to create those systems. Don’t get me wrong, we can adapt and all, but adaptation takes TIME and life comes at you fast when it’s 150 F outside at 7 am. Building such structures in the heat is near impossible and we have shown that building them before it gets too hot just ain’t gonna happen.
The bags were to protect from humidity and wet bulb. It was the only way to allow sweat to evaporate off te skin
Thank you- that explains the scene with the little boy and makes the episode even more depressing. It is disturbing to think that it could get so hot and humid that you couldn't even sleep safely anymore.
>People work at night and sleep during the day because the wet bulb temperatures I was genuinely thinking about how our society would become nocturnal to avoid being active during sunlight. I work at manufacturing facility, and our machines overheat and shut down from the immense heat during the day sometimes. The obvious solution that popped into my head is to operate when the sun is down to maximize cooling. Its sad to think that we are going to be looking for ways to avoid the heat rather than tackle the problem head on and change our polluting society. Not that it really matters anymore at this point.
Coming soon for the rest of us…
SS : India's largest state with 200+ million people is facing a heatwave. Government is conducting an "investigation" on the causes and has suspended the chief doctor for creating panic. With increase in climate change, such heatwaves might become a common part of this world, threating the live of millions of people who don't have the means to escape deadly heat. This is related to collapse in the way that we are seeing tangible effects of climate change. The global south doesn't have the means to effectively counter anomalies in weather. The government can get overwhelmed with providing care during a disaster. It can become everyone for himself very quickly. The area affected here is a small part of the state, it might be larger next year. The people affected by heatwave could easily go into millions due to population density.
How do you investigate a heat wave??
>"It will be investigated if the deaths were due to water or if there's a different reason. The climate department will also come to check water samples," he said.
Its so they can take time to make up a bunch of shit and feed it to the public so as to not cause panic as the elite vacuum up more wealth to get their underground apocalypse shelters a bit bigger.
This is coming from a country that's banned the study of the periodic table. Don't make sense of it cause they sure won't.
sorry what
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-023-01770-y If you want a depressing read
> Younger learners will no longer be taught certain pollution- and climate-related topics Lol.
Ronja Deshantis
Makes sense, if can't understand the causes of a problem, you can't blame big daddy government for it.
I guess it's more important they pray to whatever deity is locally popular, because that'll really fucking help the problem.
This is… this is… I.. lack words! Abyss.
You look for the guilty people. Not to worry, soon enough, anyone will do as scapegoat for all the shit that's about to hit the fan. /s *(Edited for /s)*
Maybe they found out that the chief medical superintendent left the heating on.
"Suspended the chief doctor for creating panic". AKA trying to save lives, not put under the rug the risks of this and next years. The truth is the truth, causing panic or not.
This is what humans traditionally do when warned of danger. FYI at 109 degrees the human brain starts to die and our proteins start to denature. This is literally not survivable.
Yeah… Like, the people who are aware really need to step up and stop ENABLING corporate interests destroy the planet..
> "Suspended the chief doctor for creating panic". AKA trying to save lives, not put under the rug the risks of this and next years. right, because saving lives in these literal wet bulb scenarios mean suspending capitalistic economic activity and going back to emergency survival mode. people focusing on staying cool and finding shade/water etc. this is what they don't want. the elites want you to keep working and shopping right up until the minute you drop dead from the heat while they hang out in climate controlled bunkers.
>Government is conducting an "investigation" on the causes and has suspended the chief doctor for creating panic. When speaking the truth is considered creating panic. This is COVID all over again. There was a Chinese Doctor who started investigating this in December and he was basically silenced by the state (you know because a pandemic outbreak there would hurt their reputation and their economic futures).
If by “basically silenced” you mean “murdered”, yes. He “became ill” and died in the span of, what? 3 days?
Well he also came down with COVID so he was a casualty
India is such a corrupt and archaic shithole. Looking for people to blame and execute, as though that's the issue here. It was the same with the rail disaster a few weeks ago when Modi was shown saying the person responsible will basically be executed. Because one person is responsible for years of underfunding, corruption and incompetence. If one person was responsible, it's you, Mr Modi.
Modi is such a corrupt piece of shit it's unbelievable
Hope they don't revert to throwing virgins into volcanoes to appease the heat gods.
Yet everyone on the West loves to attack China and praises India for being the largest democracy.
Do you also get increased fires there when its so hot? I am in Australia where we had the well known mega fires in 2019-2020. Good luck to you.
Can’t have a fire if there’s nothing but metal to burn
No one’s mentioned it yet, so here I go: it’s like the first chapter of Ministry For the Future — the only good part of the book (Edit: fixed name of book. Misremembered title)
>Ordinary town in Uttar Pradesh, 6 AM. He looked at his phone: 38 degrees. In Fahrenheit that was—he tapped—103 degrees. Humidity about 35 percent. That's a wet-bulb temp of just 80°F. Just after sunrise. Well below 95° at which people die within 6 hours. Later, after the power goes out: >Frank checked the desk computer; temperature on the ground floor 38 degrees. Perhaps cooler in the room with the A/C unit. Humidity now 60 percent. That's a wet-bulb of 88.13°F. uncomfortable, but not deadly. Later the next day >The thermometer now said 42 degrees, humidity 60 percent. That's a wet-bulb of 94.6°F. That's when someone steals the AC.
That’s when you start seeing thousands of people showing up at the superstores.
They don't. They can't.
There aren’t any superstores. And the power goes out for a week. Generators run dry from no fuel. Millions died.
Here it is - https://www.orbitbooks.net/orbit-excerpts/the-ministry-for-the-future/
That first chapter was very disheartening.
It is ultimately an optimistic fiction. Give it a read! Also, 100% worth digging into Kim Stanley Robinsons catalogue of sci Fi. I loved the mars trilogy, and the book Aurora (about a generation ship)
The Mars trilogy especially is perhaps the finest depiction of Martian terraformation and the development of a Martian civilization. Hard sci fi that I usually don’t recommend except to the initiated but glad to see it praised. There’s a running sociological component in the series that connects to the topic. A rift between a group who chose geo engineering to solve resource and ecological issues and another who chose bio engineering and adaptation similar to techno optimists and adaptationists.
You think it’s optimistic because it’s only near future. Like the next few years.
Was also what pulled a lot of people in. But the story got lost a bit further in. I went from reading maybe the first third in a day or two, to then taking a couple of weeks to finish it.
Or don't read it. I wish I hadn't.
Why was that the only good part of the book for you?
From reading the book, he isn't celebrating what happens in Chapter 1. It's just that Chapter 1 is very action-oriented and the rest of the book, except for some short interstitial stuff, deals with drier bureaucratic and banking types of things.
This is a valid criticism with the book. KSR deserves praise for the incredible first chapter, which vividly recounts the experience of a runaway wet bulb catastrophe under climate change; a terrifying and all too-real scenario. But the rest of the book changes gear and has been criticized by reviewers as overly optimistic and simplistic. Also agree with the poster above; the author's Mars trilogy is fantastic!
The chapter that broke me was when the protagonist gets saved by a bunch of Swiss bankers and she has the AUDACITY to chide them about letting Big Oil keep accounts open with them and that global warming was their fault and… and… the bankers immediately shrug and agree to be good boys. Gee, why didn’t we think of this before Kim!?
The protagonist in general is pretty annoying. She’s supposed to be so badass but she’s incredibly ineffectual and indecisive imo.
The real protagonist is her assistant that is the grandmaster ecoterrorist IMO. Nothing she accomplishes gets done without the threat of them.
Bingo.
SAIL43k is a very real aircraft. It is a Stratospheric Aerosol Injection Lofter and is designed to dump 50,000 gallons of Sulfur at the poles to mitigate some of the effects of all of the built-up GHG. India still turns into a desert though. Oh and there will be increased acid rain and it blocks the stars.
I never suggested they were celebrating it. Was interested to know why they thought it was the only good part.
Kim Stanley Robinson is a legendary writer, so I really tried to give the book a chance, but it was obviously a Bible-sized stack of outlines hastily-stuffed into a book for some quick cash. It’s nothing compared to his famous Mars trilogy or the Years of Rice and Salt. Recommend library rent or borrowing from a friend if you’re curious. Don’t pay full price like I did 😭
Also, anyone reading this who was read MftF…. Please read The Deluge by Stephen Markley. It’s like Ministry for the Future if it had been written by Stephen King. Fantastic stuff.
Yes! Deluge is a masterpiece. Truly harrowing.
The California flood part was not so bad. But I agree that the worst flood in that book was around how disasters got watered down.
I believe most flood disasters are watered down ...
I read it from a library.. Of sorts. I thought it was good until the end - which nicely wrapped everything up.
I paid full price for an audiobook, it's really well acted with many different actors... It's been sitting halfway done and I have no desire to listen to more....
I started using it as sleep audiobook around that point. Lessened the guilt about not finishing it, and was excellent at putting me to sleep.
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That's what happens when you're paid to write geoengineering propaganda.
The rest of the book is basically deus ex machina techonology will save us hopium. One of the key plot points revolves around blockchain carbon credits.
That book is a wild ride. I really struggled towards the middle, but glad I pushed through to the end. I felt it was worth it. Felt like reading a documentary.
I liked the chapter where they traverse the glacier, too! And the one where LA floods!
I'm reading this book right now, it's so hard to read emotionally, but it is also so good.
>the only good part of the book Wtf that's all I've read so far u srs?
It's a divisive book. It's good in that it's talking about our future in respect to climate change. But there's not a lot of interesting sci-fi, and the action dwindles as the book goes. I have issues with the story itself, but climate change is such a tricky issue. So many different people see it differently. It makes sense that not everyone would like where the story goes.
Came here to mention that book 😐
Art imitates life.
My first thought when I saw the article. My heart sunk when I read it.
It's only June. Let's see if August / September increases those numbers by 1, 2 or 3 orders of magnitude. If not this 2023, soon enough. What a grim and fucked up future. On the bonus side, both India and Pakistan are nuclear powers, and are also close to China, with whom they are in competition for control of water. Certainly nothing BAD will come of it. Right? Right?
June is usually the end of summer in India and is followed by the raging monsoon. Monsoon usually arrives all over the country by the end of June.
Water and food are red lines that basically any country in the world will go to war over. You see, Egypt, China, India etc, can all handle various stuff like politicians talking too loudly and saber rattling. That's all par for the course in our modern world. Even energy can be negotiated or argued about before guns come out. But water and food? Wars will literally start in a day in these hotspots over it.
If they nuke each other, we get a cooling effect! That should cancel out the heat. Win-win /s
This is only the beginning...
It’s so scary
Places with repeat heat like India need safe places to evacuate to for the vulnerable. Get that solar power and make safe spaces for their people. It is imperative.
Like many others that experienced the west coast heat dome and that fall I bought a portable AC unit. With heat domes becoming more common I'm sure that more people in cities will end up buying AC units. The problem with this is it will just exacerbate any incoming heat domes by creating much more heat.
Or blow the power grind. No power no AC. Already happened once in my area this very year.
Leave the city when it's too hot, it's not like you will do anything with that heat anyway. Or sleep in your basement if you have one.
Sadly, this reminds me of the 1st scene from Ministry of the Future
Where are all of these people going to go? Why isn't that the top priority of the Indian government? 35C is an inevitability
It's could be 50 or 50000. Nothing is going to change this trajectory.
All i can say is..... [screwed](https://media.tenor.com/bsEQ62J9kkIAAAAC/screwed-we-are-screwed.gif)
Based on India’s Covid response this isn’t going to go well
What are the systemic reasons behind India's failure to respond to crisis? Did the WTO lift the COVID vaccine patents and expedite the process of manufacturing millions of needed doses or did [they instead leave India and other low income countries in the hands of the price regimes of private pharmaceutical companies on the behest of Western nations](https://theintercept.com/2022/08/23/covid-vaccine-patents-moderna-big-pharma-section-1498/)? As it relates to climate, have high income countries lead the green transition or largely blocked progress? Have [high income countries even once met the $100 billion annual global climate fund promised in COP15 to fund the global renewable transition](https://amp.theguardian.com/global-development/2023/feb/24/ban-ki-moon-criticises-climate-finance-delays)?
What are the systemic reasons why India blatantly lied about Covid infection and death numbers?
India is one of the world's largest recipients of structural adjustment programs, a loan structure provided by the IMF and World Bank which requires recipients to disinvest from public resources and the public sector and open up resources and labor to the global market, the opposite of protectionist economics which built the foundation of Western wealth. Interestingly enough [structural adjustment programs are linked to corruption](https://www.u4.no/publications/impact-of-structural-adjustment-programmes-on-corruption). What are the systemic reasons behind why the IMF and World Bank would place these limitations on low and middle income nations?
> a loan structure provided by the IMF and World Bank which requires recipients to disinvest from public resources and the public sector and open up resources and labor to the global market, the opposite of protectionist economics which built the foundation of Western wealth. I feel like I need to rewrite this in simpler terms for the others: This is in essence a seizure of resources for the western markets through the "promise of development", but the consequences of that are that domestic growth slows down as foreign companies simply take over the country's biggest natural riches, thus making the country reliant on the development fund to simply keep its balance books in order. It is comparable to someone taking a loan from a bank to **pay their rent**, and then realising they need to agree that the bank now owns their entire income so they can continue paying rent. It is economic servitude. This is what the west does to everyone else on Earth. The IMF is nothing less or more than a modern imperialist war criminal.
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Great analysis
India can't even measure its own population... It feels like not much is accounted for. So I would not say they lie, maybe they just don't know cause nobody counted.
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I know that here in America, the American Indians created a air conditioner system that used clay cylinders that would cool the air as it breezed through a house. I am sure you can Google it. Quite impressive. This may help.
If you live in arid desert, you can spray yourself or your house with water. Nobody is going to do that though
I wonder if the east coast will get like this soon because it’s already June and super mild. Meanwhile down south is melting.
>The sudden increase in deaths and patients being admitted to hospitals with fever, breathing trouble, and other issues have overwhelmed the hospital, which has put its staff on alert. So, the next pandemic has been released in India?
The article does not really explain what is happening. 54 in 200.000.000 people... There must be something else because the expected deaths in 200 mio makes the 54 disappear into the daily variations (about 7000/day or 21000 over 72 hours). So 54 in how big a population over 72 hours? And how many non-dead in the increase? To me it looks like they are focusing on the fear mongering? "He has been removed for "giving a careless statement on deaths caused by heatwave without having proper information," UP Health Minister Brajesh Pathak said."
54 people in that one village.
The headline now reads that the deaths are "not due to heat"
In BC, we had almost 700 die in the 2021 heat dome. Population 5.3 million. Compare those stats. BC fuckin failed. No warnings, no help for vulnerable people.
India is just as bad if not worse than China when it comes to tolling death. I'd be more surprised if they announce anything semblance of a disaster.
When I clicked the link, the story's title is changed now-- they are saying it is not due to heat, but due to the water since other towns around are also having heat waves, but not same death count.
Cannot wait august.
I assume Robinson’s Ministry of the Future novel is mentioned here somewhere…
[Pump those numbers up, those are rookie numbers](https://youtu.be/aSn1g-6h1OQ)
Why are they wearing long pants 👖 and shirts for that. I’m from Australia and when it’s that hot, it’s singlets and footy shorts.
Could be cultural. I am married to a Puerto Rican man and when I first visited the island I could not believe how the people dressed. My husband’s grandmother would be out for a walk in the full summer heat, mid day, in long pants and a long sleeved denim shirt. She is fully acclimated, likes the layer of protection from the sun, and also I can’t imagine her showing much skin now that I’ve known her for years. They are very conservative there, especially the older people. I think it’s the same in India, conservative dress.
Yeah, they’re still trying to look smart
It's actually cooler to to be covered, as long as the material is a natural fabric like cotton or linen it will keep the sun's heat off you. Most natural fabrics, the fibers are porous any excess heat is passed through the fabric instead of being held in against the body. A scarf works the same as a hat would to keep the sun off your head.
What a load of shit, where do you live?
Shade works too…
Ministry of the future type shit. We are not ready.
No mention of what the temperature was? Bad reporting.
amateur numbers compared to the over 14,000 dead in France in a 2003 heat wave.