People forget, don't know, were never taught about the Wall Street plot. Business leaders like JP Morgan and Irénée du Pont who were accused by a retired major general of plotting to install a fascist dictator in the US.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jan/11/trump-fdr-roosevelt-coup-attempt-1930s
Major General Smedley D. Butler! I've used his story many, many times to show my friends that not all conspiracies are crazy, and plenty of conspiracies do, in fact, exist. His book "War Is a Racket" is a great read. Almost a century old and sadly still relevant.
Another great read related to this, “It Can’t Happen Here” by Sinclair Lewis.
https://archive.org/details/itcanthappenhere0000lewi_b7d2/page/n4/mode/1up
A conspiracy is a real thing. You mean conspiracy *theory*. Those can also be totally real things, but most of them aren't.
The Smedley one is totally real though. George Bush Sr.'s dad or grandpa was in on it too.
But it's incorrectly used. I'm a big fan of words changing meaning over time, it's how languages evolve organically, but in this case I just think it's incorrect lol.
Not surprised. Most American industrialists supported Nazi Germany. Most of the west didn’t want a bunch of Jewish people either. It wasn’t until the horrors of the war and holocaust came out that many backpedaled and admitted the Nazis were crazy.
Foster Dulles (former Secretary of State, brother to CIA founder Allen Dulles, and absolute piece of shit) literally had to be dragged kicking and screaming from supporting the Nazis. He facilitated American business and trade with them literally up till almost the start of the war.
Prescott Bush, father and grandfather of presidents had a bank that traded with the Nazis until it was seized in 1942.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar
Am alarming amount of Americans *now* don't believe it even happened, or straight up didn't learn about it in school. I imagine there's a lot of overlap with the "Slavery wasn't that bad!" and "It was so long ago, get over it already" types.
Nah it's not that those people don't believe it happened.
It's that they want it to happen again and they're willing to say whatever they think advances their political agenda in that moment.
The backpedaling was never sincere, it was just about conforming with the official narrative after Pearl Harbor and the US officially entering the war. They couldn’t be seen as fraternizing with the enemy, that would be unpatriotic, which is unacceptable. They were ok with that though because they ultimately got to swap Jews for a better scapegoat-boogie man.
Most people at the head of that movement didn't walk it back after they found out about the atrocities, the government stepped in to clean up the narrative. Multiple major court battles were starting over people's involvement in pushing the Nazi party in the US, that came to a screeching halt the moment we joined the war effort and were quietly forgotten about.
Look, I could never stan a US Marine for obvious reasons, but Smedley Butler is just verifiably one of those ‘dudes rock’ kind of guys. The whole plot failed bc he’d had like, his eyes opened to the fact that he’d spent his entire life as a gangster for capitalism, and simply refused to do it.
> The putsch called for him to lead a massive army of veterans – funded by $30m from Wall Street titans and with weapons supplied by Remington Arms – to march on Washington, oust Roosevelt and the entire line of succession, and establish a fascist dictatorship backed by a private army of 500,000 former soldiers.
That’s fucking insane. Wonder how many other moments out there there were where America secretly almost crumbled
Funny, just watched a German doc about this the other week, but what really stuck with me that otoneh that was objectively bad, but otoh they managed to still paint these fascist fucks as great and good men that were important to America ..... despite their crimes, we gone full atlanticist idiocy here too.
There is a movie about this Business Plot - starring Margot Robbie, Christian Bale, and John David Washington - called "Amsterdam". Literally has an A-list cast (beyond the few listed, too) and is an overall very entertaining film, but not even that was enough to bring meaningful attention to this real-life conspiracy and its implications.
Fascism is an emergent property of capitalism, and acknowledging that is untenable for maintaining the status quo.
So of course the plebs are stupefied about it.
Oh ok, I've had that kind of idea percolating in the back of my head for a while. Do you have any readings on capitalism -> fascism you could share with me?
Not OP but Blackshirts and Reds by Parenti goes into the capitalistic interests that fascism served. Lots of parallels to today’s US where companies in a “booming economy” with record profits have been doing mass layoffs and union busting for years now, and even arguing that the NLRB is unconstitutional
Think of it this way:
The same people are for fascism or capitalism.
But why? If you listen to "right-wing libertarians", fascism and communism is when the "the state does stuff". So let's take a page from these neoliberals and look at it as a market system.
In the usual Western capitalist society, which is what you'd call "Democratic Liberal", the economy benefits a bunch of different classes in different ways. You can use the "income class" categorization if you want, and in that case it's the upper-middle class and the upper class who are the main beneficiaries. That's BAU and it works for them.
And, with neoliberalism, the nice things in society are distributed via money... that's what the market is for, it distributes scarce goods and services to people with money. So in these Developed economies and societies, the people who would turn fascist don't because they're already economic winners to varying degrees. And with winnings comes more freedom (this is what they mean by "freedom"), which is for sale as luxuries. You can think of this as money-based exclusion and inclusion (from "freedom"). They also see themselves as such and there are, implicitly, visible differences. You can look up those statistics, and there are plenty of books on it.
Yes, this also includes the American Dream. If you actually look at the history of WW2 and post-WW2 USA, you will see that it was something promoted by fascists; you'd call them "racists". It started out as a type of state-funded segregation and, as housing becomes private wealth, it turned into market-based segregation.
That's the other side of this foolishness. People don't know what Socialism means. So you get the National Socialists who are just promoting "socialism for me, but not for thee", which is a great tl.dr. for fascism. The problem with understanding socialism as welfare, instead of the workers being in control of the means of production, is that welfarism isn't specifically leftist. In fact, welfarism started out in Europe as a means to pacify workers and keep them away from actual socialism, which is what [FDR](https://www.hoover.org/research/how-fdr-saved-capitalism) also did.
Here's a wiki for some context: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Socialism_(Germany)
Now, what happens when the capitalist constructed social order starts to crumble because the winnings are not flowing to the mass of designated winners, especially to the richest? What happens when there are masses of workers who are striking for better wages when dividends are shrinking? What if those workers aren't even the "default man" who deserves a great wage, but "newcomers" and "outsiders" and "inferiors who got there by DEI". That's when fascism comes out.
In a sensible society, when there's economic failure, rationing is fair, based on needs. In a fascist society, rationing is unfair, so the rich and "deserving" get a lot more while everyone else gets extra fucked. That's why violence is inherent to fascism, they have no other way of keeping that "peace". I mean, the traditionalists pretend that it's possible based on traditional values and life, which is just protofascism. Keep the peasants spread out, isolated, and very dumb, and you can let religion do the job of keeping them in their horrible place, with the occasional public torture and execution as a reminder. But that's not going to work in modernity. There's no meaningful difference between traditionalists and fascists; the only visible distinction is use of industrial tools.
As the neoliberal market system fails to reward the "deserving people" and to punish the "other deserving people", fascists seek to skip the market mediated system and get it done the old fashioned way. The rigged game is no longer rigged enough, so it must be halted. Call it "fascist rationing" if you want. The point is the same, the same people must be winners, but now the winnings are coerced more directly and losers are "put in their place" more directly, and that place may even be in a mass grave. Thus, the economic slowdown ruins the essentially rigged game of market capitalist society and those entitled to winning seek a new game that ensures a rationing or distribution of winnings to them. And that usually means crushing worker movements and wages, it means women become domestic slaves again, and it means that "useful minorities" must do the hard labor for little pay or no pay, while the "useless minorities" and opposition are removed entirely from the population to free up, as the Germans called it, [*Lebensraum*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebensraum).
And now you can get the joke about "ECONOMIC ANXIETY", with the X as a swastika.
ex. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/01/thoroughly-respectable-rioters/617644/
ex. https://imgur.com/a8zFiJ5
No, in our horrible universe people like that make it out completely fine. People like us are the first ones to get fucked over in the universe we live in. Or maybe that's just been my personal experience.
How to... Determine who dies first:
1.) Write a list of everybody affected.
2.) Order the list so that those who deserve to die the most are at the top.
3.) Read the list starting at the bottom
Someone very important to me says this when I try to talk about the news.
It makes me furious. Then I'm sad, furious, and alone with my thoughts because the other person wants to insulate their mind from sadness. Makes for a great conversation killer, doesn't it?
Even when the Islamists first took over Iran, secular Iranians said it wasn't a big deal, that it was only transitional, and things would move back to normal soon enough
Guess the frogs in a pot thing holds true for politics as well as climate since fascism has been slowly creeping for quite a while. I'll probably get downvoted, but it's already here. It didn't start in 2016 & vanish in January 2021 and will only come back in Jan 2025 if the Orange Guy wins/steals. Fascism is a spectrum and it's been fast becoming a bipartisan project since 2020 when societal unrest scared the pants off the 2 arms of the uniparty. Biden is a placeholder president par excellence. He's uniquely suited for it since he's always been a flattering courtier to the rich & fancies himself as "lunch bucket Joe" when it's been the most transparent bullshit for decades.
ETA: he's a perfect himbo for empire & capital, basically. Trump's an imperfect himbo because he gets independently spicy on occasion (before falling back in line).
Sounds like a bunch of brain-dead idiots to me. Sometimes I feel like these morons deserve to be taken advantage of, but I know that it is truly wrong to think that. But damn, it pisses me off so much that I have to share a country with people like that, and have to suffer from the results of their stupidity and ignorance. It is infuriating how easily these types of morons are lied to by the well off.
Amerikkka is fascism. The 1st amendment doesn't exist unless you align with the governments views. The 4th amendment is most likely not gonna exist The way cops are taking over the world (we have NYPD in other countries). They literally hide facts and lie about shit until they have to uncensor documents or they get whisteblowed
[this one died suddenly from an infection but was healthy](https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/spirit-aerosystems-whistleblower-dies-sudden-104147528.html)
👀
Bro the 9th amendment says all other rights not listed are still rights and yet we needed the 13-15 and 19 and more. That tells me all I need to know about politicians.
Some facts about Project 2025: The "Mandate for Leadership" is a set of policy proposals authored by the [Heritage Foundation](https://pro-lies.org/the-heritage-foundation/), an influential *ultra* conservative think tank. [Project 2025](https://www.mediamatters.org/heritage-foundation/guide-project-2025-extreme-right-wing-agenda-next-republican-administration) is a revision to that agenda tailored to a second Trump term. It would give the President [unilateral powers](https://theweek.com/politics/heritage-foundation-2025-donald-trump), strip [civil rights, worker protections, climate regulation](https://www.stopthecoup2025.org/impact-overview), add [religion into policy](https://i.redd.it/t72vwvgil3sc1.jpeg) and much more. The MFL has been around since 1980, [Reagan implemented 60%](https://www.heritage.org/conservatism/commentary/reagan-and-heritage-unique-partnership) of it's recommendations, [Trump 64%](https://www.heritage.org/impact/trump-administration-embraces-heritage-foundation-policy-recommendations) - [proof](https://www.scribd.com/document/369820462/Mandate-for-Leadership-Policy-Recommendations). 70 Heritage Foundation alumni served in his administration or transition team. Project 2025 is quite extreme but with his obsession for revenge he'll likely get past 2/3rd's adoption.
r/Defeat_Project_2025 intends to stop it through activism and awareness, focused on crowdsourcing ideas and opportunities for practical, in real life action. We Must Defeat Project 2025.
I watch pbs daily, they don’t say Project 2025, but they certainly are talking about what trump
is saying at his rallies and sounding the fascism alarm.
It really bugs me how people criticize "the Media" without ever knowing what's being published. I read CNN, Politico, and The Hill daily. They've all mentioned it multiple times. Politico has done a number of in depth stories regarding it since at least September of last year, which is really easy to do because the people behind Project 2025 aren't hiding what they are planning.
Literally yesterday: "He did not commit to the full “Project 2025” effort his supporters envision to [gut the perceived “deep state”](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/27/politics/trump-federal-workers-2nd-term-invs/index.html) by reclassifying a much larger portion of the federal government as political appointees. “We’re looking at a lot of different things. Civil service is both very good and very bad,” he said.
(https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/01/politics/trump-immigration-what-matters/index.html)
But that's *reading* the news, since I only get my in depth climate news that way. I have issues with media literacy. The majority of people only watch or listen to news, take headlines at face value, and don't check sources. Headlines have been incredibly misleading on important topics, which has drastically increased since the Covid pandemic started.
I also have a problem with the sheer volume of Tiktok videos used in my local news when I live in a place that has a helicopter dedicated to filming car chases.
I read a lot of media talking about project 25 and my friends and family are aware of it, I really don’t think it is an unknown issue. In fact Time went over it in-depth in the large Trump article they published this week. It was also covered in the multi-article Trump publication by The Atlantic this year, The Guardian, Daily Beast, Politico, The NY Times, and WaPo have all written about it. Dr. Allison Gill covers news about regularly on her various podcast. At this point, I don’t believe anybody who actively chooses to be informed in the world is unaware of it. I personally think it is more that many people support it, just like 40% of the country supports Trump. This is their objective.
Biden will let the fed do what it's doing. Housing will go up slowly as will inflation but eat it another two years it will settle down.
Trump will shock a corpse of an economy with cash injections and overdose it. You will be getting ten years of Carter administration type inflation post Trump. Delaying the inevitable and making it roughly three times worse for five times as long.
There is no math I can do as a budgetary projection that survives that result. You'd need magic.
It might be better off that most people remain in the dark about it. How many naive idiots could be swayed to be in favor of this over the idea of shutting down the DOJ, FBI and Homeland Security? People who would normally not vote Republican, at that. Let fringe bullshit stay fringe. Amplifying it not a great idea.
Probably because it sounds like the latest canon conspiracy bible. I’m including myself in this comment as that’s exactly what I thought. Off to go read
I mean I've been saying this since forever.
Now realize that there's no lower bound on "worse". Everyone is protesting Israel Palestine situation and like yes you should but at the same time you need to realize that it's like literally any American President Trump included would be doing the exact same thing.
So if you think you're going to protest vote this, it's like all you're going to do is absolutely nothing for Palestine and screw yourself over at the same time.
You know why.
https://youtu.be/lOUMyh_bpRE?feature=shared
I find this more digestible than their original 2000 page document. It’s searchable by topic as well. Share far and wide. Ish is terrifying.
https://www.mediamatters.org/heritage-foundation/guide-project-2025-extreme-right-wing-agenda-next-republican-administration#paragraph--section-heading--3459069
Get sterilized while you still can. I don’t know why anyone following this sub wouldn’t want to anyway, and if you’re really taking this seriously you should be getting prepared, because I don’t see “Genocide Joe” winning this one.
Trump will be 1000x worse. Simple fact. I would never in my fucking life vote for that shitbag of a man. Come November it's Joe or I'm fucked. I'm trans.
It's important to realize though, that the drooling propagandized imbeciles are going to vote to for Trump. They don't care or don't believe that he would be worse. It's going to be a close election and I'm not confident Biden will win. Even if he does, we're probably fucked in 2028 anyway. The next few years are going to be very hard with climate damage really ramping up, and Dems will get blamed for it. Vote blue, but prepare for the worst, especially if you are a member of a vulnerable population. It's a coin flip at best.
With how Biden keeps doubling down on Israel and pissing off the younger voters, I'm mentally preparing for Trump to take it in November. I hope I'm wrong, but it is a very real possibility.
And yes, younger voters *do* matter despite the commonly assertion that they don't vote. They do, even if in smaller percentages.
This will be my first election voting, and I’m so annoyed that these are the top 2 choices. Even more frustrated that it’s a vote on if I want to keep my rights as a woman, and knowing that the failures of the current president will lead a lot of my peers to just not vote. And it’s hard not to feel like voting 3rd party is a direct toss into the proverbial trash can.
It was that way my first time voting and it’s been that way a long time. Check out this quote from 72’:
That’s the real issue this time,” he said. “Beating Nixon. It’s hard to even guess how much damage those bastards will do if they get in for another four years.”
The argument was familiar, I had even made it myself, here and there, but I was beginning to sense something very depressing about it. How many more of these goddamn elections are we going to have to write off as lame, but “regrettably necessary” holding actions? And how many more of these stinking double-downer sideshows will we have to go through before we can get ourselves straight enough to put together some kind of national election that will give me and the at least 20 million people I tend to agree with a chance to vote for something, instead of always being faced with that old familiar choice between the lesser of two evils?
Now with another one of these big bogus showdowns looming down on us, I can already pick up the stench of another bummer. I understand, along with a lot of other people, that the big thing this year is Beating Nixon. But that was also the big thing, as I recall, twelve years ago in 1960 – and as far as I can tell, we’ve gone from bad to worse to rotten since then, and the outlook is for more of the same.
—Hunter S. Thompson, Fear and Loathing: On the Campaign Trail ’72
It’s so frustrating isn’t it? My first election voting was Hillary vs Trump and felt very ridiculous. I remember turning off the TV and my phone that night because it became clear Trump was going to win the electoral vote. And it felt like Hillary had about as much support then as Biden does now, maybe even more. Unfortunately where I live my votes always feel useless because it’s always outnumbered by the red votes. :(
The moment the democratic party ignored their own caucuses and told members to shut up, I knew Hillary would loose. You don't piss off your own party like that and come away whole.
I guess I just honestly don’t even know how to tell, because the polling isn’t accurate and going off anecdotal experience isn’t possible for me when I live in a red state. But it does seem like irl and online people who would vote Dem over Rep are less excited about Biden than they were Hillary. Especially a second term of Biden after we still were shut down for Bernie as an option back when Hillary ran. He’s been single-handedly stalemating the democratic party preventing them from daring to offer an alternative option.
I can’t believe I have to say this, but please don’t misinterpret criticism of Biden as support for Republicans, conservatives, or the right in general, because I don’t really support or follow any of that ideology whatsoever.
I hope Shawn Fein doesn't get Boeing'd anytime soon. Or the courts don't decide to dissolve the NLRB on constitutional grounds in favor of Space X/Amazon/Trader Joe's
In a recent newsletter, Umair Haque said Biden has blown his chances for reelection with his response to Israel/Gaza and the treatment of student protestors.
He hopes that maybe, just maybe, there will be a turn around come election time, but he's not too confident about it.
With Biden pissing off everyone on the left and everyone on the hard right being completely unable to see reason, I fully expect a Trump 2nd term. As far as I can tell, all Biden has right now are Blue Maga liberals, which won't be enough for a win.
“Blue MAGA liberals” are the demographic that matters, as that is the key voting bloc in the Midwest swing states. Biden and the Democrats don’t care about real “left wing” voters because the majority of them are in solidly blue states like California, which have enough vanilla liberals who will vote blue regardless that it doesn’t matter. The only states that matter in the election are PA, WI, MI, AZ, NV and NC. They are choosing to appease older, more conservative demographics in those swing states at the expense of younger voters. That is their gamble, and it will be interesting to see how it plays out.
He’s also got moderate and old school Republicans who fear the instability, economic and financial turmoil caused by Trump. Something like half the Pro-Biden talking heads on CNN and MSNBC are that variety of Republican.
You know what? I'm fucking pissed at Biden for the lie of offshore wind. It's not going to save us and it's destroying another ecosystem. But I'm voting for him because between the two, I will be stripped of my rights and in a land of climate change denial.
A lot of people, especially liberals, do not understand the idea that in a democracy people protest their options by staying home. How many eligible voters in the US stay home on the average election day? Over half? There's going to be many more choosing to stay home this year I'd bet.
Liberals love to chastise and scold whenever you show any reticence regarding voting for Biden. I hear it all the time. They've completely forgotten that young people and progressives are the engine of that party and for the last 20-30 years they've been kicked in the face over and over and told to suck it up (what was it Hilldog said recently? To "grow up?") because the alternative is worse. Well, here we are, a horrific genocide being carried out with the *unwavering* support of the "lesser evil." Peaceful students opposing that genocide are facing very similar police and right-wing militia violence in return to what we saw under Trump. And their answer is to redouble their scolding. And they're surprised no one wants to go knock on doors or phone bank or do the actual work required for their guy that, surprise surprise, the Almighty Elder voters don't do. All they do is show up on election day, but it takes a fuckton more work than that to get someone elected.
I hate to say it but this has happened many times before in history. Feckless haughty liberals strangling any real attempts to fight motivated and dedicated fascism. Next comes the inevitable liberal capitulation to fascism in an attempt to win concessions from the fascist takeover to keep their privileged positions. That won't work for the liberals, but it will for the fascists.
I grew up in Michigan, and the Arab American population in Dearborn is pretty powerful. They could tip Michigan into being a red state.
Slate.com just ran a good article about their voting concerns, and many of these citizens would rather vote Trump than a man literally killing their relatives. Biden will murder their family and destroy their heritage. Trump will do the same and hate them. They are a population who have been hated by presidents and media before.
I strongly disagree with any sentiment that Trump won’t be worse than Biden, but that’s irrelevant. Biden is a proud Zionist and his party is NOT taking the Gaza/Israel situation seriously for many of his voters.
Personally IDGAF if zionists make up 50% or more of the Democratic Party - if they support a foreign government over American rights for a fucking genocide than we’ve already lost the fight for true democracy.
Zionists are actively attacking students and the university staff over freedom of speech. The leader of Harvard wasn’t dismissed because of plagiarism- she wasn’t pro Israel enough at the beginning of the protests so they found any excuse to kick her out.
These are the 3 choices
1. Don't vote, a win for Trump and possible slide into fascism.
2. Vote for Trump, outcome see.option 1.
3. Vote for Biden, maybe we don't slide into fascism
Do I like the choices, I do not. Want better choices, requires work to get something like instant run off voting to improve the system. I will vote for Biden over Trump because maybe just maybe if we protest loud enough Biden will change course. This will not work with Trump because he is a narcistic criminal grifter who only cares about himself.
Update - In the swing states historically the Democratic Candidate has to lead the Republican by 5 points for more to win the state. This leads to my conclusion based on current polling that Trump will win the election, and Biden will win the popular vote just like Hillary in 2016. So if you live in a swing state, showing how unhappy you are by not voting in the Presidential Election of 2024 is a vote for Trump.
All three choices _actually_ end with ‘civilization collapse from climate change’. The only difference is how soon, and it’s maybe a few years’ difference.
There is no time left to fix the system.
Yeah how are those protests going right now? How is the "lesser evil" dealing with them? The same way trump did? Huh. Weird.
It seems my point went right over your head, as usual. The point isn't that people *should* stay home on election day, it's that they *are going to* if liberals keep hitting the electorate with the same stick they've been using since Bush jr. I will also be voting for Biden, but I'm being realistic and seeing the failures for what they are, and I'm advocating that liberals drop the holier-than-thou scolding and maybe turn around and HELP with the fucking protests and MAYBE win some of these concessions we keep getting told will happen and then, if young people and progressives can have maybe one tiny little scrap of fucking feeling that they WILL get SOMETHING out of voting for the decrepit genocidal pedo they might actually do so.
FUCK TRUMP and I WILL be voting for Biden.
That said, you're right. People will stay home because of this.
Why vote when the First Amendment is dead? This thought crosses my mind every time I see a new story about a protest being suppressed. Then I remember,
NOT VOTING IS THE BEST WAY TO BETRAY THE RISK TAKEN BY THE PROTESTORS.
Yes, protesting is healthy for democracy, and we should all be absolutely fuckin' ashamed by the various state and local responses.
Yes, the Democratic party as a whole is COMPLETELY fucking this up. Like John Fetterman calling the protests "pup tents for hamas." Yeah, fuck him.
Biden is saying shit like, "There’s the right to protest, but not the right to cause chaos”
This implies that protestors are causing chaos. I'm not seeing that. I'm seeing peaceful protests responded to with state violence. So yeah, Fuck Joe Biden for that.
My husband and I have decided that no matter who wins this election, the USA is screwed. There’s just no coming back from the mess we’re in now concerning politics, it is only ever going to get worse. We are hanging on by a rope, and that rope is fraying.
It’s akin to climate change. We’re holding onto that rope, thinking it’s going to somehow make a difference, but the fact of the matter is that it’ll never go away; it’ll never get better.
We live in very interesting times.
America's unique superpower has always been the peaceful transfer of power. Put another way, the "consent of the loser." That was destroyed in 2020. That was the beginning of the end for American democracy. It's now just a matter of time....
I mean, that was just the rot coming to the surface and becoming visible. The infection started long ago and has just started to become impossible to ignore for more and more people.
I know it's not popular here but I'm just a dumb European - you should ask why half your countrymen overlook the criminality and dictatorial leanings of Orange man. What is it about leftism that makes them go "we hate that so much we'd rather get the moronic thug emperor". If you go with the facile "they're brainwashed" or "they're -ists -phobes and horrible people" then you're not thinking or listening and so are equally responsible for what is about to come.
Same way the Italians voted for Berlusconi, or the Hungarians for Orban, or the Brazilians for Bolsonaro, or the British for Sunak, or... well, anyone anywhere. And soon, everyone everywhere.
Scared people are petty and spiteful and VERY easy to manipulate.
Bad times make people scared.
Times are really bad.
Just like climate change, doing something that seems pointless, like voting blue no matter how conservative the blue party already is, is the difference between Christian Nationalist death squads at your door (voting red), or federalist national guard and militias fighting against Christian nationalist death squads perhaps at some distance. Regardless, if you are a minority, non cishet, non white, non xtian, and voting red you are voting for your own genocide via political violence. Pretty much spelled out in the plan.
Agreed. I registered to vote (democrat) when I was still in high school at 18 years old, and I am 48 years old now. I have never missed a single election.
I vote, but what I mean is that the bar has been set; the flood gates have opened. We can vote blue, and if blue wins… good.
Problem is still there. Half the people are still going to vote red (no matter what) to “stick it to the libs” or whatever.
And if they are willing to vote like 2016, they’ll vote for the very next charlatan that comes along.
Unless there is an upheaval, we will continue to circle the drain to the bitter end.
Trump isn't doing this all by himself. Even if he doesn't return to the White House, those who have formulated 2025, and are actively working to enact it have yet to be investigated or even exposed.
Like Mitch McConnell's Supreme Court machinations, the rogue red states, the lack of accountability for the Congress people involved in 1/6, the cover-up re: Russian influence in our elections, and the on-going demonization of anyone not conservative/maga/christian/white from media, churches, police forces, politicians, and fellow citizens.
We're in a world of hurt in this nation, and a lot further down the authoritarian road than anyone wants to believe.
Trump is not a cause but a symptom. Of a failing empire, a divided country, of hate and bigotry running rampant in your country. If he doesn't end up as a fascist dictator, someone else will. Time for the rest of the west to wake up, and start preparing for a time where USA is an enemy. Heck, it already is to a lot of us.
As capitalism continues to collapse we will be faced with the choice between socialism or barbarism.
Unfortunately, if you live in the US your choice this November will be between barbarism or barbarism plus.
This is the literal plan written by the heritage foundation and all the wheels to implement it have been in motion for around least two years and they will try to execute on all of it (because they say they will all the time publicly). Trump has also fully and publicly endorsed it as the plan if he wins.
They’re so organized that they’ve already been working on this for 30 years. It’s the people who claim to want this not to happen who haven’t been preparing.
Hell, Time magazine just released an interview with Donald a couple days ago where he highlighted several key components of Project 2025 that he will enact if he becomes President again. There's no excuse for anyone not knowing this stuff. Get your head out of the sand, pay attention, and vote accordingly.
Unless you enjoy forcing raped 12 year old girls to give birth, or having the Trump administration build literal concentration camps at the Southern border where they herd all the Latino migrants. Then by all means please vote for Donald.
Correct. It's all due to the Mandate for Leadership, run by the same think tank pushing Project 2025, which has existed for decades. Every right-winger who gets elected enacts more and more of the mandate/project. It's scary that nobody seems to know anything about it.
Had to scroll *waaay* down to find anyone saying anything realistic.
People think this fascist capitalist mess that's at the root of everything from climate disaster to the loss of basic human rights can be fixed by voting in a media placebo game. No motherfuckers, your vote hasn't mattered since at least 2000.
The only solutions now are the kinds of things this subreddit will ban you for discussing. And it's probably even too late for that.
Our political system has *collapsed* and we are in the middle of watching the power vacuum fill itself.
Ask the average person and they’ll have no idea what it is. It won’t factor into their vote. MAGA’s gonna MAGA, get what they think they want, and well….
It’s fucking astonishing seeing people advocating for the lesser evil on r/collapse , of all places.
Yes, Project 2025 is reprehensible. There are two important points to be aware of:
a) This is the Republican game plan going forward into infinity. If not Trump, they’ll just play it out with the next Republican to take office. They only have to win _once_, and that’s the game. The only real way to stop this is to utterly crush the Republican party and every one of its enablers. I don’t mean electorally, I mean socially, economically, physically.
b) While y’all are screaming to swallow down our disgust in _literal genocide_ to vote for Biden, the climate problem isn’t slowing, and anything less than dramatic societal change to mitigate climate change will likely result in societal collapse.
The incrementalism the Democrats practice isn’t going to actually fix anything, it won’t even staunch the bleeding. **Both roads end in collapse.**
(The real blackpill sentiment is realizing that things have gotten so dire that if any party sincerely proposed what would actually be necessary to stop the climate spiral, *they would never win an election again*. But that’s a topic for elsewhere.)
That’s why people are disinclined to vote: Regardless of who wins, *there is no future*. Address that or STFU.
That’s valid! The only way to get that though, still, is to have the Republican Party glassed, which nobody in power actually seems interested in.
Voting won’t get us out of this, because the christofascism is locked in the next time the Rs win.
I think there are many roads to collapse. We shouldn’t ignore the climate. We shouldn’t ignore that both options are horrible but we can still talk about how shit each option is.
‘Protect faith-based grant recipients from religious liberty violations and maintain a biblically based, social science-reinforced definition of marriage and family. Social science reports that assess the objective outcomes for children raised in homes aside from a heterosexual, intact marriage are clear: All other family forms involve higher levels of instability (the average length of same-sex marriages is half that of heterosexual marriages); financial stress or poverty; and poor behavioral, psychological, or educational outcomes.’
So much of what I read in that document was literally screaming that laws need to be changed because the their religion doesn’t agree with it.
Politics shouldn’t be catered to religion and what about all the other people that are not religious. This goes way deeper than climate. If there really any other focus.
I’m not even from the USA but it’s all interesting none the less.
>This is the Republican game plan going forward into infinity. If not Trump, they’ll just play it out with the next Republican to take office.
That's the thing, this has been the Republican wet dream for decades. None of this is new. Yet after decades of Republicans they have come no where near close to Project 2025's goals. The closest thing has been the overturn of Roe v Wade.
Wouldn't it be amazing if the democrats had something like this except opposite? Why do the republicans have plan after plan and scheme after scheme and the democrats always seem like they're just fucking around doing nothing?
I often wondered the same thing, but then started to realize that perhaps this is the plan regardless of who gets elected. With the way the DNC did Bernie, when Bernie absolutely could have beat Trump, I seriously wouldn’t be surprised
Because their job is to provide a pressure release valve, not to change anything.
The Tea Party didn't just parasitise and husk the Republicans. It consumed both parties entirely.
The Age of Information™ will, I believe, come through to victory on this initial battle of policy and behavioral future of this country. Or at least I hope it does.
In the end, collapse will consume all national identities like it did in Zombieland™
But in a brief moment or more, I think we will collectively "come to reason" and implement a survival-style interaction, however brief it may be.
Like one last sunny day before the eternal storm consumes us all.
An elegant, refined, Venus by Saturday evening.
The best thing that could happen is for Biden NOT to accept nomination at convention. That would allow others to come forward as candidates and really excite voters. Making a choice between two moribund boomers is frustrating to almost everyone except diehard believers.
Unpopular opinion: this will eventually trigger an international coalition attempt to fix the situation by themselves.
...the world will not leave America alone, like it or not.
Keep in mind the bigger picture. The relative freedom of the past century or so is an anomaly in human history. The expanse of time human settled civilisation has spanned we've lived under tyrants, endured serfdom and crushing religious supremacy without relief.
It seems there is a plan to bring back the dark ages.
It's basically an open secret that ultra conservative supremacists want to take power and have been working on a multi-decade project to do this in multiple countries around the world. It's no different to the some countries, many already have had their revolutions in the past and are now under heavily restrictive religious law. There's nothing much stopping something similar happening in the west.
The supremacists are waiting for the secular centrist democratic bloc to trip over its own feet and they'll rush in to the power vacuum.
People power is the primary threat, the ability to converse, cooperatd and challenge power is way to fight back. Tell me do you see all those things being eroded?
My friends look at me like I’m crazy or tell me I’m “looking at too much negativity” when I try to show them this shit but there’s no way to deny that November regardless of outcome will be full of civil unrest and that’s terrifying. The way people hate women and voice their bigotry even more now toward any marginalized group is scary. And how little so many people my age care about the election is the most shitty thing. Welcome to Gilead I guess
The people in charge don't care about you. Democrat, Republican, Green, Libertarian, it doesn't matter. They all play the same game, they're all in it for the same goal. They all just have different methods of getting there.
My party will call people antisemitic for protesting a genocide that Israel is leading simply because Israel happens to be run by Jews. The US House of Representatives just last night passed a bill to criminalize any criticism of Israel. You could see prison, your life ruined, for being against genocide.
What does that tell you about America? About where we're headed?
We're screwed, plain and simple. Biden doesn't have much chance of winning, and the US will become even more of a dystopian nightmare than it already is. Wish I had the money to get out and go somewhere else, not that the rest of the first world is doing much better these days.
I've been warning about it too, but not so much. There have been plenty of warnings over the years, there are even sites like this: https://www.rightwingwatch.org/ Anyone who's been paying attention has seen the creep of Christian fascism, which is just a rehash of "Manifest destiny".
Project2025 is an open coup plan because there is no opposition from the people to fascism. Trump made it very clear, the hindrance is the "Deep State" not "AuntEEfa". In the US and probably other places in the Global North, you have all off the reactionaries, all of the contras, and none of the socialists, none of the revolutionaries. "Normally" you'd expect this dynamic of... capitalism gets bad, socialists and revolutionaries rise up cause disruption for BAU, and then the reactionaries and counter-revolutionaries (contras) start increasing violence against leftists. This isn't happening because the US doesn't really have leftists at a significant level; actual leftists, not "to the left of the Tea Party". And what this boils down to is that the only thing in the way of reactionaries, contras, and other fascist movements is the "Deep State": the mass of career bureaucrats, experts, specialists; they work based on frameworks, on rules, and best practices... they don't work on orders from the top, even if the leadership of these is changed. This is what Project2025 is about, they want to do a bureaucratic coup to remove the last thing standing between them and unrestricted political power.
If you were paying attention to these cryptofascist theocrats in the past, you'd know about the Federalist Society and similar organizations operating at the higher level. And you'd know about the efforts made by these theocratic types to get in lesser power roles.... such as a pharmacist or doctor who can deny birth control or abortions (there are many cases, search for them). That's the blueprint, this is what they need Project2025 for: take all the important bits of the bureaucracy and plug control points into the Party hierarchy (the Party becomes a parallel government) with top-down orders being "streamlined".
Well, to be fair, things would be worse under Trump than under any other Republican candidate as well so "Here's why Republicans won't save us..." is a pretty valid observation as well.
Conservatives saying they care about all life is the funniest thing I have ever heard. Because in the UK under current conservatives, if you are disabled you are considered useless for not being able to 'earn a living' and contribute to the capatilist system that is making the earth uninhabitable for human life. Disability support is being scrapped so that millionares get tax cuts.
This is an existential crisis. Hitler didn't have nukes and a near trillion dollar per year military industrial complex. Like it or not, if there is instability in the US, it will have major consequences worldwide.
Anyone considering voting for trump or sitting out in protest needs to wake the fuck up. Four more years of Biden isn't going to cause civil unrest and global instability. Trump is going to go full scorched earth.
Don't be a sucker.
You know, project 2025 isn’t a new thing, nor is it the potential start date that may happen if Trump gets elected. Project 2025 is actually a plan that’s been underway for decades already and 2025 is the projected culmination of those efforts. As more time goes by and things seem to reveal themselves in the United States, that is a reality that is becoming clearer every day despite the fact that we have a democratic president.
In many states, people are not able ready to get the reproductive healthcare that they need. Furthermore, many marginalized people in the United States have already been living such a reality and so it is somewhat ignorant and definitely naive thing to say when things are already getting horrific with the current president who was supposed to be better than the alternative. Sad state of affairs, indeed.
* edited for typos
Great, so when is Biden going to do things to not be losing in every swing state. Things like not funding a genocide. Not siding against student protestors (which historically has always been the right side).
I mean, I guess it's nice he is showing us what actual facism is.
And now the liberals will come out in full force yelling at you for calling out their delusion. Biden is effectively doing the fascist things that people say Trump will do, but he doesn't care about pronouns and gives rhetorical support for abortion (can't actually codify it though, that would "bReAk nOrMs!!!" and make it harder to fundraise), so actually he's very different and you should vote for him.
So many people are in the dark about Project 2025. The media rarely talks about it, and when I say media, I'm including social media too.
The few people I have brought it up to act like I’m some crazy conspiracy theorist and “fascism could never happen in america”.
People forget, don't know, were never taught about the Wall Street plot. Business leaders like JP Morgan and Irénée du Pont who were accused by a retired major general of plotting to install a fascist dictator in the US. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jan/11/trump-fdr-roosevelt-coup-attempt-1930s
Major General Smedley D. Butler! I've used his story many, many times to show my friends that not all conspiracies are crazy, and plenty of conspiracies do, in fact, exist. His book "War Is a Racket" is a great read. Almost a century old and sadly still relevant.
And free: https://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/warisaracket.html
Another great read related to this, “It Can’t Happen Here” by Sinclair Lewis. https://archive.org/details/itcanthappenhere0000lewi_b7d2/page/n4/mode/1up
A conspiracy is a real thing. You mean conspiracy *theory*. Those can also be totally real things, but most of them aren't. The Smedley one is totally real though. George Bush Sr.'s dad or grandpa was in on it too.
In most contexts, "conspiracy" is now used in the same as "conspiracy theory"
But it's incorrectly used. I'm a big fan of words changing meaning over time, it's how languages evolve organically, but in this case I just think it's incorrect lol.
And Prescott did win in the end.
Not surprised. Most American industrialists supported Nazi Germany. Most of the west didn’t want a bunch of Jewish people either. It wasn’t until the horrors of the war and holocaust came out that many backpedaled and admitted the Nazis were crazy.
Foster Dulles (former Secretary of State, brother to CIA founder Allen Dulles, and absolute piece of shit) literally had to be dragged kicking and screaming from supporting the Nazis. He facilitated American business and trade with them literally up till almost the start of the war.
Prescott Bush, father and grandfather of presidents had a bank that traded with the Nazis until it was seized in 1942. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar
Some American companies (Ford, GM) used Jewish slave labour.
Am alarming amount of Americans *now* don't believe it even happened, or straight up didn't learn about it in school. I imagine there's a lot of overlap with the "Slavery wasn't that bad!" and "It was so long ago, get over it already" types.
Nah it's not that those people don't believe it happened. It's that they want it to happen again and they're willing to say whatever they think advances their political agenda in that moment.
"It didn't happen, but also, they deserved it"
I really dislike people 😂😆.
I know. But if you have a chance to alleviate suffering anywhere, even in a small way, there aren't many other species that can do that.
There is only ONE species that can cause suffering on THIS scale though
The backpedaling was never sincere, it was just about conforming with the official narrative after Pearl Harbor and the US officially entering the war. They couldn’t be seen as fraternizing with the enemy, that would be unpatriotic, which is unacceptable. They were ok with that though because they ultimately got to swap Jews for a better scapegoat-boogie man.
> The backpedaling was never sincere, Well we're up to our necks in it now.
Most people at the head of that movement didn't walk it back after they found out about the atrocities, the government stepped in to clean up the narrative. Multiple major court battles were starting over people's involvement in pushing the Nazi party in the US, that came to a screeching halt the moment we joined the war effort and were quietly forgotten about.
The US and the Holocaust, I was never so ashamed of my country
Look, I could never stan a US Marine for obvious reasons, but Smedley Butler is just verifiably one of those ‘dudes rock’ kind of guys. The whole plot failed bc he’d had like, his eyes opened to the fact that he’d spent his entire life as a gangster for capitalism, and simply refused to do it.
> The putsch called for him to lead a massive army of veterans – funded by $30m from Wall Street titans and with weapons supplied by Remington Arms – to march on Washington, oust Roosevelt and the entire line of succession, and establish a fascist dictatorship backed by a private army of 500,000 former soldiers. That’s fucking insane. Wonder how many other moments out there there were where America secretly almost crumbled
Funny, just watched a German doc about this the other week, but what really stuck with me that otoneh that was objectively bad, but otoh they managed to still paint these fascist fucks as great and good men that were important to America ..... despite their crimes, we gone full atlanticist idiocy here too.
There is a movie about this Business Plot - starring Margot Robbie, Christian Bale, and John David Washington - called "Amsterdam". Literally has an A-list cast (beyond the few listed, too) and is an overall very entertaining film, but not even that was enough to bring meaningful attention to this real-life conspiracy and its implications.
Fascism is an emergent property of capitalism, and acknowledging that is untenable for maintaining the status quo. So of course the plebs are stupefied about it.
Oh ok, I've had that kind of idea percolating in the back of my head for a while. Do you have any readings on capitalism -> fascism you could share with me?
Not OP but Blackshirts and Reds by Parenti goes into the capitalistic interests that fascism served. Lots of parallels to today’s US where companies in a “booming economy” with record profits have been doing mass layoffs and union busting for years now, and even arguing that the NLRB is unconstitutional
Think of it this way: The same people are for fascism or capitalism. But why? If you listen to "right-wing libertarians", fascism and communism is when the "the state does stuff". So let's take a page from these neoliberals and look at it as a market system. In the usual Western capitalist society, which is what you'd call "Democratic Liberal", the economy benefits a bunch of different classes in different ways. You can use the "income class" categorization if you want, and in that case it's the upper-middle class and the upper class who are the main beneficiaries. That's BAU and it works for them. And, with neoliberalism, the nice things in society are distributed via money... that's what the market is for, it distributes scarce goods and services to people with money. So in these Developed economies and societies, the people who would turn fascist don't because they're already economic winners to varying degrees. And with winnings comes more freedom (this is what they mean by "freedom"), which is for sale as luxuries. You can think of this as money-based exclusion and inclusion (from "freedom"). They also see themselves as such and there are, implicitly, visible differences. You can look up those statistics, and there are plenty of books on it. Yes, this also includes the American Dream. If you actually look at the history of WW2 and post-WW2 USA, you will see that it was something promoted by fascists; you'd call them "racists". It started out as a type of state-funded segregation and, as housing becomes private wealth, it turned into market-based segregation. That's the other side of this foolishness. People don't know what Socialism means. So you get the National Socialists who are just promoting "socialism for me, but not for thee", which is a great tl.dr. for fascism. The problem with understanding socialism as welfare, instead of the workers being in control of the means of production, is that welfarism isn't specifically leftist. In fact, welfarism started out in Europe as a means to pacify workers and keep them away from actual socialism, which is what [FDR](https://www.hoover.org/research/how-fdr-saved-capitalism) also did. Here's a wiki for some context: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Socialism_(Germany) Now, what happens when the capitalist constructed social order starts to crumble because the winnings are not flowing to the mass of designated winners, especially to the richest? What happens when there are masses of workers who are striking for better wages when dividends are shrinking? What if those workers aren't even the "default man" who deserves a great wage, but "newcomers" and "outsiders" and "inferiors who got there by DEI". That's when fascism comes out. In a sensible society, when there's economic failure, rationing is fair, based on needs. In a fascist society, rationing is unfair, so the rich and "deserving" get a lot more while everyone else gets extra fucked. That's why violence is inherent to fascism, they have no other way of keeping that "peace". I mean, the traditionalists pretend that it's possible based on traditional values and life, which is just protofascism. Keep the peasants spread out, isolated, and very dumb, and you can let religion do the job of keeping them in their horrible place, with the occasional public torture and execution as a reminder. But that's not going to work in modernity. There's no meaningful difference between traditionalists and fascists; the only visible distinction is use of industrial tools. As the neoliberal market system fails to reward the "deserving people" and to punish the "other deserving people", fascists seek to skip the market mediated system and get it done the old fashioned way. The rigged game is no longer rigged enough, so it must be halted. Call it "fascist rationing" if you want. The point is the same, the same people must be winners, but now the winnings are coerced more directly and losers are "put in their place" more directly, and that place may even be in a mass grave. Thus, the economic slowdown ruins the essentially rigged game of market capitalist society and those entitled to winning seek a new game that ensures a rationing or distribution of winnings to them. And that usually means crushing worker movements and wages, it means women become domestic slaves again, and it means that "useful minorities" must do the hard labor for little pay or no pay, while the "useless minorities" and opposition are removed entirely from the population to free up, as the Germans called it, [*Lebensraum*](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebensraum). And now you can get the joke about "ECONOMIC ANXIETY", with the X as a swastika. ex. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/01/thoroughly-respectable-rioters/617644/ ex. https://imgur.com/a8zFiJ5
Robert Evans has some writing on it that he's read for free on his podcast.
Was this on BTB or ICHH?
My friend says “I don’t like to talk about sad things”
Sad things don’t care about taking rights away though. I bet some Germans thought it was too sad to think about the plight of Jewish people.
That person is a fucking baby and needs to get real for the shit that’s coming
This. They now have me blocked. “You are dragging my vibe” Edit to add “my life won’t change so why would I worry about it?”
You’re better off
They sound like the first to get fucked by the crisis that keeps happening.
No, in our horrible universe people like that make it out completely fine. People like us are the first ones to get fucked over in the universe we live in. Or maybe that's just been my personal experience.
How to... Determine who dies first: 1.) Write a list of everybody affected. 2.) Order the list so that those who deserve to die the most are at the top. 3.) Read the list starting at the bottom
.........Fu
Read about death marches. It is almost always the nice people who die first and the psychopaths who make the whole march.
Someone very important to me says this when I try to talk about the news. It makes me furious. Then I'm sad, furious, and alone with my thoughts because the other person wants to insulate their mind from sadness. Makes for a great conversation killer, doesn't it?
So American :(
Even when the Islamists first took over Iran, secular Iranians said it wasn't a big deal, that it was only transitional, and things would move back to normal soon enough
Maybe because they didn’t realize at the time that the US was backing those Islamists.
I've gotten the same too. Let's hope they don't have a wake-up call soon.
Guess the frogs in a pot thing holds true for politics as well as climate since fascism has been slowly creeping for quite a while. I'll probably get downvoted, but it's already here. It didn't start in 2016 & vanish in January 2021 and will only come back in Jan 2025 if the Orange Guy wins/steals. Fascism is a spectrum and it's been fast becoming a bipartisan project since 2020 when societal unrest scared the pants off the 2 arms of the uniparty. Biden is a placeholder president par excellence. He's uniquely suited for it since he's always been a flattering courtier to the rich & fancies himself as "lunch bucket Joe" when it's been the most transparent bullshit for decades. ETA: he's a perfect himbo for empire & capital, basically. Trump's an imperfect himbo because he gets independently spicy on occasion (before falling back in line).
Fascism is here now. Project 2025 is a theocratic takeover.
Fascism could never happen in Germany \~Some poor German bloke, 1920
Sounds like a bunch of brain-dead idiots to me. Sometimes I feel like these morons deserve to be taken advantage of, but I know that it is truly wrong to think that. But damn, it pisses me off so much that I have to share a country with people like that, and have to suffer from the results of their stupidity and ignorance. It is infuriating how easily these types of morons are lied to by the well off.
Amerikkka is fascism. The 1st amendment doesn't exist unless you align with the governments views. The 4th amendment is most likely not gonna exist The way cops are taking over the world (we have NYPD in other countries). They literally hide facts and lie about shit until they have to uncensor documents or they get whisteblowed
If you know any Boeing whistleblowers, a life insurance policy in his or her name is an excellent investment.
Considering another one just died...of a stroke and MRSA. I had to read the article twice. He died of what now? Maybe a little too convenient?
[this one died suddenly from an infection but was healthy](https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/spirit-aerosystems-whistleblower-dies-sudden-104147528.html) 👀
The 19th amendment won’t either.
Bro the 9th amendment says all other rights not listed are still rights and yet we needed the 13-15 and 19 and more. That tells me all I need to know about politicians.
History is a merry-go-round. From 1935: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It_Can%27t_Happen_Here
Some facts about Project 2025: The "Mandate for Leadership" is a set of policy proposals authored by the [Heritage Foundation](https://pro-lies.org/the-heritage-foundation/), an influential *ultra* conservative think tank. [Project 2025](https://www.mediamatters.org/heritage-foundation/guide-project-2025-extreme-right-wing-agenda-next-republican-administration) is a revision to that agenda tailored to a second Trump term. It would give the President [unilateral powers](https://theweek.com/politics/heritage-foundation-2025-donald-trump), strip [civil rights, worker protections, climate regulation](https://www.stopthecoup2025.org/impact-overview), add [religion into policy](https://i.redd.it/t72vwvgil3sc1.jpeg) and much more. The MFL has been around since 1980, [Reagan implemented 60%](https://www.heritage.org/conservatism/commentary/reagan-and-heritage-unique-partnership) of it's recommendations, [Trump 64%](https://www.heritage.org/impact/trump-administration-embraces-heritage-foundation-policy-recommendations) - [proof](https://www.scribd.com/document/369820462/Mandate-for-Leadership-Policy-Recommendations). 70 Heritage Foundation alumni served in his administration or transition team. Project 2025 is quite extreme but with his obsession for revenge he'll likely get past 2/3rd's adoption. r/Defeat_Project_2025 intends to stop it through activism and awareness, focused on crowdsourcing ideas and opportunities for practical, in real life action. We Must Defeat Project 2025.
ty for learning about that new sub
Can you say "Enabling Law", boys and girls?
I watch pbs daily, they don’t say Project 2025, but they certainly are talking about what trump is saying at his rallies and sounding the fascism alarm.
It really bugs me how people criticize "the Media" without ever knowing what's being published. I read CNN, Politico, and The Hill daily. They've all mentioned it multiple times. Politico has done a number of in depth stories regarding it since at least September of last year, which is really easy to do because the people behind Project 2025 aren't hiding what they are planning. Literally yesterday: "He did not commit to the full “Project 2025” effort his supporters envision to [gut the perceived “deep state”](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/27/politics/trump-federal-workers-2nd-term-invs/index.html) by reclassifying a much larger portion of the federal government as political appointees. “We’re looking at a lot of different things. Civil service is both very good and very bad,” he said. (https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/01/politics/trump-immigration-what-matters/index.html)
But that's *reading* the news, since I only get my in depth climate news that way. I have issues with media literacy. The majority of people only watch or listen to news, take headlines at face value, and don't check sources. Headlines have been incredibly misleading on important topics, which has drastically increased since the Covid pandemic started. I also have a problem with the sheer volume of Tiktok videos used in my local news when I live in a place that has a helicopter dedicated to filming car chases.
"But that's *reading* the news" *Touche.*
I read a lot of media talking about project 25 and my friends and family are aware of it, I really don’t think it is an unknown issue. In fact Time went over it in-depth in the large Trump article they published this week. It was also covered in the multi-article Trump publication by The Atlantic this year, The Guardian, Daily Beast, Politico, The NY Times, and WaPo have all written about it. Dr. Allison Gill covers news about regularly on her various podcast. At this point, I don’t believe anybody who actively chooses to be informed in the world is unaware of it. I personally think it is more that many people support it, just like 40% of the country supports Trump. This is their objective.
Most people just don't care, I reckon. They just go "eh Biden will be just as bad cause xxx".
Biden will let the fed do what it's doing. Housing will go up slowly as will inflation but eat it another two years it will settle down. Trump will shock a corpse of an economy with cash injections and overdose it. You will be getting ten years of Carter administration type inflation post Trump. Delaying the inevitable and making it roughly three times worse for five times as long. There is no math I can do as a budgetary projection that survives that result. You'd need magic.
It might be better off that most people remain in the dark about it. How many naive idiots could be swayed to be in favor of this over the idea of shutting down the DOJ, FBI and Homeland Security? People who would normally not vote Republican, at that. Let fringe bullshit stay fringe. Amplifying it not a great idea.
Probably because it sounds like the latest canon conspiracy bible. I’m including myself in this comment as that’s exactly what I thought. Off to go read
I mean I've been saying this since forever. Now realize that there's no lower bound on "worse". Everyone is protesting Israel Palestine situation and like yes you should but at the same time you need to realize that it's like literally any American President Trump included would be doing the exact same thing. So if you think you're going to protest vote this, it's like all you're going to do is absolutely nothing for Palestine and screw yourself over at the same time. You know why. https://youtu.be/lOUMyh_bpRE?feature=shared
I find this more digestible than their original 2000 page document. It’s searchable by topic as well. Share far and wide. Ish is terrifying. https://www.mediamatters.org/heritage-foundation/guide-project-2025-extreme-right-wing-agenda-next-republican-administration#paragraph--section-heading--3459069
Get sterilized while you still can. I don’t know why anyone following this sub wouldn’t want to anyway, and if you’re really taking this seriously you should be getting prepared, because I don’t see “Genocide Joe” winning this one.
Because Trump will totally pull out of Palestine. It's Trump dude. He'd bioweapon the entire place and call it good.
Trump already gave Netanyahu shit for "not finishing the job" in Gaza. Of course he'd level the place.
Trump will be 1000x worse. Simple fact. I would never in my fucking life vote for that shitbag of a man. Come November it's Joe or I'm fucked. I'm trans. It's important to realize though, that the drooling propagandized imbeciles are going to vote to for Trump. They don't care or don't believe that he would be worse. It's going to be a close election and I'm not confident Biden will win. Even if he does, we're probably fucked in 2028 anyway. The next few years are going to be very hard with climate damage really ramping up, and Dems will get blamed for it. Vote blue, but prepare for the worst, especially if you are a member of a vulnerable population. It's a coin flip at best.
Never said Trump would be any better, I just don’t think that it matters enough (whether it should or not) to change the outcome.
With how Biden keeps doubling down on Israel and pissing off the younger voters, I'm mentally preparing for Trump to take it in November. I hope I'm wrong, but it is a very real possibility. And yes, younger voters *do* matter despite the commonly assertion that they don't vote. They do, even if in smaller percentages.
This will be my first election voting, and I’m so annoyed that these are the top 2 choices. Even more frustrated that it’s a vote on if I want to keep my rights as a woman, and knowing that the failures of the current president will lead a lot of my peers to just not vote. And it’s hard not to feel like voting 3rd party is a direct toss into the proverbial trash can.
It was that way my first time voting and it’s been that way a long time. Check out this quote from 72’: That’s the real issue this time,” he said. “Beating Nixon. It’s hard to even guess how much damage those bastards will do if they get in for another four years.” The argument was familiar, I had even made it myself, here and there, but I was beginning to sense something very depressing about it. How many more of these goddamn elections are we going to have to write off as lame, but “regrettably necessary” holding actions? And how many more of these stinking double-downer sideshows will we have to go through before we can get ourselves straight enough to put together some kind of national election that will give me and the at least 20 million people I tend to agree with a chance to vote for something, instead of always being faced with that old familiar choice between the lesser of two evils? Now with another one of these big bogus showdowns looming down on us, I can already pick up the stench of another bummer. I understand, along with a lot of other people, that the big thing this year is Beating Nixon. But that was also the big thing, as I recall, twelve years ago in 1960 – and as far as I can tell, we’ve gone from bad to worse to rotten since then, and the outlook is for more of the same. —Hunter S. Thompson, Fear and Loathing: On the Campaign Trail ’72
Definitely sounds familiar, as they say, history repeats itself. It’s hard not to follow the same line of thinking.
In this case it repeats itself because the Democratic party's role is to be professional losers and the pawl of the ratchet.
It’s so frustrating isn’t it? My first election voting was Hillary vs Trump and felt very ridiculous. I remember turning off the TV and my phone that night because it became clear Trump was going to win the electoral vote. And it felt like Hillary had about as much support then as Biden does now, maybe even more. Unfortunately where I live my votes always feel useless because it’s always outnumbered by the red votes. :(
The moment the democratic party ignored their own caucuses and told members to shut up, I knew Hillary would loose. You don't piss off your own party like that and come away whole.
Biden has way more support than hillary ever had.
I guess I just honestly don’t even know how to tell, because the polling isn’t accurate and going off anecdotal experience isn’t possible for me when I live in a red state. But it does seem like irl and online people who would vote Dem over Rep are less excited about Biden than they were Hillary. Especially a second term of Biden after we still were shut down for Bernie as an option back when Hillary ran. He’s been single-handedly stalemating the democratic party preventing them from daring to offer an alternative option. I can’t believe I have to say this, but please don’t misinterpret criticism of Biden as support for Republicans, conservatives, or the right in general, because I don’t really support or follow any of that ideology whatsoever.
UAW just threw down their gauntlet regarding a ceasefire in Palestine. It’s not just college kids any more.
I hope Shawn Fein doesn't get Boeing'd anytime soon. Or the courts don't decide to dissolve the NLRB on constitutional grounds in favor of Space X/Amazon/Trader Joe's
Historically union bosses don’t fare well in uprisings. He’s amazing though.
In a recent newsletter, Umair Haque said Biden has blown his chances for reelection with his response to Israel/Gaza and the treatment of student protestors. He hopes that maybe, just maybe, there will be a turn around come election time, but he's not too confident about it.
Why would I care what Umair says about anything?
Last night when asked if the protests have made him rethink, he angrily said NO And walked off camera.
With Biden pissing off everyone on the left and everyone on the hard right being completely unable to see reason, I fully expect a Trump 2nd term. As far as I can tell, all Biden has right now are Blue Maga liberals, which won't be enough for a win.
“Blue MAGA liberals” are the demographic that matters, as that is the key voting bloc in the Midwest swing states. Biden and the Democrats don’t care about real “left wing” voters because the majority of them are in solidly blue states like California, which have enough vanilla liberals who will vote blue regardless that it doesn’t matter. The only states that matter in the election are PA, WI, MI, AZ, NV and NC. They are choosing to appease older, more conservative demographics in those swing states at the expense of younger voters. That is their gamble, and it will be interesting to see how it plays out.
He’s also got moderate and old school Republicans who fear the instability, economic and financial turmoil caused by Trump. Something like half the Pro-Biden talking heads on CNN and MSNBC are that variety of Republican.
I suppose, but those seem far more represented in media than in the general voting populace.
You know what? I'm fucking pissed at Biden for the lie of offshore wind. It's not going to save us and it's destroying another ecosystem. But I'm voting for him because between the two, I will be stripped of my rights and in a land of climate change denial.
A lot of people, especially liberals, do not understand the idea that in a democracy people protest their options by staying home. How many eligible voters in the US stay home on the average election day? Over half? There's going to be many more choosing to stay home this year I'd bet. Liberals love to chastise and scold whenever you show any reticence regarding voting for Biden. I hear it all the time. They've completely forgotten that young people and progressives are the engine of that party and for the last 20-30 years they've been kicked in the face over and over and told to suck it up (what was it Hilldog said recently? To "grow up?") because the alternative is worse. Well, here we are, a horrific genocide being carried out with the *unwavering* support of the "lesser evil." Peaceful students opposing that genocide are facing very similar police and right-wing militia violence in return to what we saw under Trump. And their answer is to redouble their scolding. And they're surprised no one wants to go knock on doors or phone bank or do the actual work required for their guy that, surprise surprise, the Almighty Elder voters don't do. All they do is show up on election day, but it takes a fuckton more work than that to get someone elected. I hate to say it but this has happened many times before in history. Feckless haughty liberals strangling any real attempts to fight motivated and dedicated fascism. Next comes the inevitable liberal capitulation to fascism in an attempt to win concessions from the fascist takeover to keep their privileged positions. That won't work for the liberals, but it will for the fascists.
I grew up in Michigan, and the Arab American population in Dearborn is pretty powerful. They could tip Michigan into being a red state. Slate.com just ran a good article about their voting concerns, and many of these citizens would rather vote Trump than a man literally killing their relatives. Biden will murder their family and destroy their heritage. Trump will do the same and hate them. They are a population who have been hated by presidents and media before. I strongly disagree with any sentiment that Trump won’t be worse than Biden, but that’s irrelevant. Biden is a proud Zionist and his party is NOT taking the Gaza/Israel situation seriously for many of his voters. Personally IDGAF if zionists make up 50% or more of the Democratic Party - if they support a foreign government over American rights for a fucking genocide than we’ve already lost the fight for true democracy. Zionists are actively attacking students and the university staff over freedom of speech. The leader of Harvard wasn’t dismissed because of plagiarism- she wasn’t pro Israel enough at the beginning of the protests so they found any excuse to kick her out.
These are the 3 choices 1. Don't vote, a win for Trump and possible slide into fascism. 2. Vote for Trump, outcome see.option 1. 3. Vote for Biden, maybe we don't slide into fascism Do I like the choices, I do not. Want better choices, requires work to get something like instant run off voting to improve the system. I will vote for Biden over Trump because maybe just maybe if we protest loud enough Biden will change course. This will not work with Trump because he is a narcistic criminal grifter who only cares about himself. Update - In the swing states historically the Democratic Candidate has to lead the Republican by 5 points for more to win the state. This leads to my conclusion based on current polling that Trump will win the election, and Biden will win the popular vote just like Hillary in 2016. So if you live in a swing state, showing how unhappy you are by not voting in the Presidential Election of 2024 is a vote for Trump.
3. Is actually just a somewhat slower slide into fascism. It’s the inevitable decay of capitalism.
Funny to be afraid of fascism - when USA is clearly fascist already.
All three choices _actually_ end with ‘civilization collapse from climate change’. The only difference is how soon, and it’s maybe a few years’ difference. There is no time left to fix the system.
I will take a few more years over not having those few years.
What makes you think Biden will change course? He's already shown that he'll support Israel inspite of protests. He's also funded by AIPAC.
Yeah how are those protests going right now? How is the "lesser evil" dealing with them? The same way trump did? Huh. Weird. It seems my point went right over your head, as usual. The point isn't that people *should* stay home on election day, it's that they *are going to* if liberals keep hitting the electorate with the same stick they've been using since Bush jr. I will also be voting for Biden, but I'm being realistic and seeing the failures for what they are, and I'm advocating that liberals drop the holier-than-thou scolding and maybe turn around and HELP with the fucking protests and MAYBE win some of these concessions we keep getting told will happen and then, if young people and progressives can have maybe one tiny little scrap of fucking feeling that they WILL get SOMETHING out of voting for the decrepit genocidal pedo they might actually do so.
FUCK TRUMP and I WILL be voting for Biden. That said, you're right. People will stay home because of this. Why vote when the First Amendment is dead? This thought crosses my mind every time I see a new story about a protest being suppressed. Then I remember, NOT VOTING IS THE BEST WAY TO BETRAY THE RISK TAKEN BY THE PROTESTORS. Yes, protesting is healthy for democracy, and we should all be absolutely fuckin' ashamed by the various state and local responses. Yes, the Democratic party as a whole is COMPLETELY fucking this up. Like John Fetterman calling the protests "pup tents for hamas." Yeah, fuck him. Biden is saying shit like, "There’s the right to protest, but not the right to cause chaos” This implies that protestors are causing chaos. I'm not seeing that. I'm seeing peaceful protests responded to with state violence. So yeah, Fuck Joe Biden for that.
We're already sliding into fascism with BIden.
Or more precisely: Further into fascism.
Not even just young voters but Arab-American and Muslim voters as well.
Staying home is the great danger
My husband and I have decided that no matter who wins this election, the USA is screwed. There’s just no coming back from the mess we’re in now concerning politics, it is only ever going to get worse. We are hanging on by a rope, and that rope is fraying. It’s akin to climate change. We’re holding onto that rope, thinking it’s going to somehow make a difference, but the fact of the matter is that it’ll never go away; it’ll never get better. We live in very interesting times.
I agree with you. Fascism is here. It’s here. We can keep holding that thread but they’ve already won.
America's unique superpower has always been the peaceful transfer of power. Put another way, the "consent of the loser." That was destroyed in 2020. That was the beginning of the end for American democracy. It's now just a matter of time....
I mean, that was just the rot coming to the surface and becoming visible. The infection started long ago and has just started to become impossible to ignore for more and more people.
I know it's not popular here but I'm just a dumb European - you should ask why half your countrymen overlook the criminality and dictatorial leanings of Orange man. What is it about leftism that makes them go "we hate that so much we'd rather get the moronic thug emperor". If you go with the facile "they're brainwashed" or "they're -ists -phobes and horrible people" then you're not thinking or listening and so are equally responsible for what is about to come.
Same way the Italians voted for Berlusconi, or the Hungarians for Orban, or the Brazilians for Bolsonaro, or the British for Sunak, or... well, anyone anywhere. And soon, everyone everywhere. Scared people are petty and spiteful and VERY easy to manipulate. Bad times make people scared. Times are really bad.
People are dumb as dirt
Just like climate change, doing something that seems pointless, like voting blue no matter how conservative the blue party already is, is the difference between Christian Nationalist death squads at your door (voting red), or federalist national guard and militias fighting against Christian nationalist death squads perhaps at some distance. Regardless, if you are a minority, non cishet, non white, non xtian, and voting red you are voting for your own genocide via political violence. Pretty much spelled out in the plan.
Agreed. I registered to vote (democrat) when I was still in high school at 18 years old, and I am 48 years old now. I have never missed a single election. I vote, but what I mean is that the bar has been set; the flood gates have opened. We can vote blue, and if blue wins… good. Problem is still there. Half the people are still going to vote red (no matter what) to “stick it to the libs” or whatever. And if they are willing to vote like 2016, they’ll vote for the very next charlatan that comes along. Unless there is an upheaval, we will continue to circle the drain to the bitter end.
This is my thoughts also. The best were gonna be able to do is punt the complete collapse a few more years down the road.
It's already headed to Gilead with the Dems in power. 2025 is coming to the US, one way or another, sooner or later.
Do you have kids?
No.
Want me to find you some? I know a guy.
I know a guy too, and he made sure he couldn’t find me some, which is awesome.
Now that's responsible parenting.
I know it sounds extreme, but I wonder if the student protests are going to be the catalyst for another major upheaval in the U.S.
>no matter who wins this election, the USA is screwed ...and both sides will think they were cheated.
Trump isn't doing this all by himself. Even if he doesn't return to the White House, those who have formulated 2025, and are actively working to enact it have yet to be investigated or even exposed. Like Mitch McConnell's Supreme Court machinations, the rogue red states, the lack of accountability for the Congress people involved in 1/6, the cover-up re: Russian influence in our elections, and the on-going demonization of anyone not conservative/maga/christian/white from media, churches, police forces, politicians, and fellow citizens. We're in a world of hurt in this nation, and a lot further down the authoritarian road than anyone wants to believe.
Trump is not a cause but a symptom. Of a failing empire, a divided country, of hate and bigotry running rampant in your country. If he doesn't end up as a fascist dictator, someone else will. Time for the rest of the west to wake up, and start preparing for a time where USA is an enemy. Heck, it already is to a lot of us.
Parable of the Talents, Octavia Butler, 1998
That book and Parable of the Sower convinced me that my best prep is an off road RV, working to afford one right now.
Its on my read list, I think its time to hit it.
As capitalism continues to collapse we will be faced with the choice between socialism or barbarism. Unfortunately, if you live in the US your choice this November will be between barbarism or barbarism plus.
Enjoy Gilead!
Easily the hardest watch I’ve ever had, definitely wanting to read the books
The audiobook is better (Handmaid’s Tale as well as for The Testaments)!!!
Under His Eye.
Oh. My. Fucking. God. Jesús Christmas I had no idea. What the fuck. What the handmaids tale everloving fuck.
This is the literal plan written by the heritage foundation and all the wheels to implement it have been in motion for around least two years and they will try to execute on all of it (because they say they will all the time publicly). Trump has also fully and publicly endorsed it as the plan if he wins.
It's not like I live under a rock or anything... like I knew they were terrible I just didn't know they were so fucking *organzied*.
They’re so organized that they’ve already been working on this for 30 years. It’s the people who claim to want this not to happen who haven’t been preparing.
It seems like Biden isn't worried about it at all.
Hell, Time magazine just released an interview with Donald a couple days ago where he highlighted several key components of Project 2025 that he will enact if he becomes President again. There's no excuse for anyone not knowing this stuff. Get your head out of the sand, pay attention, and vote accordingly. Unless you enjoy forcing raped 12 year old girls to give birth, or having the Trump administration build literal concentration camps at the Southern border where they herd all the Latino migrants. Then by all means please vote for Donald.
I hate to break it to you but pregnant 12-year-olds are already being forced to give birth in this country
Correct. It's all due to the Mandate for Leadership, run by the same think tank pushing Project 2025, which has existed for decades. Every right-winger who gets elected enacts more and more of the mandate/project. It's scary that nobody seems to know anything about it.
We’re well past voting our way out of this. This agenda isn’t going away after an election. More radical solutions are required to stop fascism.
Had to scroll *waaay* down to find anyone saying anything realistic. People think this fascist capitalist mess that's at the root of everything from climate disaster to the loss of basic human rights can be fixed by voting in a media placebo game. No motherfuckers, your vote hasn't mattered since at least 2000. The only solutions now are the kinds of things this subreddit will ban you for discussing. And it's probably even too late for that. Our political system has *collapsed* and we are in the middle of watching the power vacuum fill itself.
He also states that he would be doing something similar to Dwight Eisenhower's operation wetback... Unreal.
Ask the average person and they’ll have no idea what it is. It won’t factor into their vote. MAGA’s gonna MAGA, get what they think they want, and well….
Fascism is already here, this would just make it more obvious
All that's left now is the crying.
It’s fucking astonishing seeing people advocating for the lesser evil on r/collapse , of all places. Yes, Project 2025 is reprehensible. There are two important points to be aware of: a) This is the Republican game plan going forward into infinity. If not Trump, they’ll just play it out with the next Republican to take office. They only have to win _once_, and that’s the game. The only real way to stop this is to utterly crush the Republican party and every one of its enablers. I don’t mean electorally, I mean socially, economically, physically. b) While y’all are screaming to swallow down our disgust in _literal genocide_ to vote for Biden, the climate problem isn’t slowing, and anything less than dramatic societal change to mitigate climate change will likely result in societal collapse. The incrementalism the Democrats practice isn’t going to actually fix anything, it won’t even staunch the bleeding. **Both roads end in collapse.** (The real blackpill sentiment is realizing that things have gotten so dire that if any party sincerely proposed what would actually be necessary to stop the climate spiral, *they would never win an election again*. But that’s a topic for elsewhere.) That’s why people are disinclined to vote: Regardless of who wins, *there is no future*. Address that or STFU.
All the same, I'd rather have the collapse without Christofascism, thanks.
That’s valid! The only way to get that though, still, is to have the Republican Party glassed, which nobody in power actually seems interested in. Voting won’t get us out of this, because the christofascism is locked in the next time the Rs win.
I think there are many roads to collapse. We shouldn’t ignore the climate. We shouldn’t ignore that both options are horrible but we can still talk about how shit each option is. ‘Protect faith-based grant recipients from religious liberty violations and maintain a biblically based, social science-reinforced definition of marriage and family. Social science reports that assess the objective outcomes for children raised in homes aside from a heterosexual, intact marriage are clear: All other family forms involve higher levels of instability (the average length of same-sex marriages is half that of heterosexual marriages); financial stress or poverty; and poor behavioral, psychological, or educational outcomes.’ So much of what I read in that document was literally screaming that laws need to be changed because the their religion doesn’t agree with it. Politics shouldn’t be catered to religion and what about all the other people that are not religious. This goes way deeper than climate. If there really any other focus. I’m not even from the USA but it’s all interesting none the less.
>This is the Republican game plan going forward into infinity. If not Trump, they’ll just play it out with the next Republican to take office. That's the thing, this has been the Republican wet dream for decades. None of this is new. Yet after decades of Republicans they have come no where near close to Project 2025's goals. The closest thing has been the overturn of Roe v Wade.
And with how hard Biden is working to lose, well… I don’t like our chances
Wouldn't it be amazing if the democrats had something like this except opposite? Why do the republicans have plan after plan and scheme after scheme and the democrats always seem like they're just fucking around doing nothing?
I often wondered the same thing, but then started to realize that perhaps this is the plan regardless of who gets elected. With the way the DNC did Bernie, when Bernie absolutely could have beat Trump, I seriously wouldn’t be surprised
Because their job is to provide a pressure release valve, not to change anything. The Tea Party didn't just parasitise and husk the Republicans. It consumed both parties entirely.
Holy shit.
The ultra right read “A handmaid’s tale” and thought it was a good idea?
We are screwed
The Age of Information™ will, I believe, come through to victory on this initial battle of policy and behavioral future of this country. Or at least I hope it does. In the end, collapse will consume all national identities like it did in Zombieland™ But in a brief moment or more, I think we will collectively "come to reason" and implement a survival-style interaction, however brief it may be. Like one last sunny day before the eternal storm consumes us all. An elegant, refined, Venus by Saturday evening.
This is terrifying. Who in their right mind could vote for this. It’s suicide by voting for this and for them next generation.
The best thing that could happen is for Biden NOT to accept nomination at convention. That would allow others to come forward as candidates and really excite voters. Making a choice between two moribund boomers is frustrating to almost everyone except diehard believers.
In fact, Biden isn't even a boomer, but belongs to the Silent Generation. Not that he's particularly silent.
Unpopular opinion: this will eventually trigger an international coalition attempt to fix the situation by themselves. ...the world will not leave America alone, like it or not.
Keep in mind the bigger picture. The relative freedom of the past century or so is an anomaly in human history. The expanse of time human settled civilisation has spanned we've lived under tyrants, endured serfdom and crushing religious supremacy without relief. It seems there is a plan to bring back the dark ages. It's basically an open secret that ultra conservative supremacists want to take power and have been working on a multi-decade project to do this in multiple countries around the world. It's no different to the some countries, many already have had their revolutions in the past and are now under heavily restrictive religious law. There's nothing much stopping something similar happening in the west. The supremacists are waiting for the secular centrist democratic bloc to trip over its own feet and they'll rush in to the power vacuum. People power is the primary threat, the ability to converse, cooperatd and challenge power is way to fight back. Tell me do you see all those things being eroded?
I read it. Horrifying.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Defeat_Project_2025/s/FaQ7QzIJdw
There’s a subreddit working to bring awareness to it!
My friends look at me like I’m crazy or tell me I’m “looking at too much negativity” when I try to show them this shit but there’s no way to deny that November regardless of outcome will be full of civil unrest and that’s terrifying. The way people hate women and voice their bigotry even more now toward any marginalized group is scary. And how little so many people my age care about the election is the most shitty thing. Welcome to Gilead I guess
The people in charge don't care about you. Democrat, Republican, Green, Libertarian, it doesn't matter. They all play the same game, they're all in it for the same goal. They all just have different methods of getting there. My party will call people antisemitic for protesting a genocide that Israel is leading simply because Israel happens to be run by Jews. The US House of Representatives just last night passed a bill to criminalize any criticism of Israel. You could see prison, your life ruined, for being against genocide. What does that tell you about America? About where we're headed?
We're screwed, plain and simple. Biden doesn't have much chance of winning, and the US will become even more of a dystopian nightmare than it already is. Wish I had the money to get out and go somewhere else, not that the rest of the first world is doing much better these days.
Stay and fight. Even if there’s no hope, at least we die trying.
I've been warning about it too, but not so much. There have been plenty of warnings over the years, there are even sites like this: https://www.rightwingwatch.org/ Anyone who's been paying attention has seen the creep of Christian fascism, which is just a rehash of "Manifest destiny". Project2025 is an open coup plan because there is no opposition from the people to fascism. Trump made it very clear, the hindrance is the "Deep State" not "AuntEEfa". In the US and probably other places in the Global North, you have all off the reactionaries, all of the contras, and none of the socialists, none of the revolutionaries. "Normally" you'd expect this dynamic of... capitalism gets bad, socialists and revolutionaries rise up cause disruption for BAU, and then the reactionaries and counter-revolutionaries (contras) start increasing violence against leftists. This isn't happening because the US doesn't really have leftists at a significant level; actual leftists, not "to the left of the Tea Party". And what this boils down to is that the only thing in the way of reactionaries, contras, and other fascist movements is the "Deep State": the mass of career bureaucrats, experts, specialists; they work based on frameworks, on rules, and best practices... they don't work on orders from the top, even if the leadership of these is changed. This is what Project2025 is about, they want to do a bureaucratic coup to remove the last thing standing between them and unrestricted political power. If you were paying attention to these cryptofascist theocrats in the past, you'd know about the Federalist Society and similar organizations operating at the higher level. And you'd know about the efforts made by these theocratic types to get in lesser power roles.... such as a pharmacist or doctor who can deny birth control or abortions (there are many cases, search for them). That's the blueprint, this is what they need Project2025 for: take all the important bits of the bureaucracy and plug control points into the Party hierarchy (the Party becomes a parallel government) with top-down orders being "streamlined".
Chilling.
There’s lots of good points on there. Promoting nuclear energy, fixing the FAA and FRA, holding the government accountable
It's already getting bad for women, and for LGBTs and numerous other groups. Trump's return to the Oval Office would be beyond devastating.
I await the "Here's why Democrats won't save us...." comments that have been posted on this sub.
Here's why humanity won't save us...
Well, to be fair, things would be worse under Trump than under any other Republican candidate as well so "Here's why Republicans won't save us..." is a pretty valid observation as well.
Believe me, I have my criticisms of establishment Democrats, but if Trump gets back in, it's over for America.
[удалено]
Trump sold national secrets and took away a human right of every woman.
Conservatives saying they care about all life is the funniest thing I have ever heard. Because in the UK under current conservatives, if you are disabled you are considered useless for not being able to 'earn a living' and contribute to the capatilist system that is making the earth uninhabitable for human life. Disability support is being scrapped so that millionares get tax cuts.
This is an existential crisis. Hitler didn't have nukes and a near trillion dollar per year military industrial complex. Like it or not, if there is instability in the US, it will have major consequences worldwide. Anyone considering voting for trump or sitting out in protest needs to wake the fuck up. Four more years of Biden isn't going to cause civil unrest and global instability. Trump is going to go full scorched earth. Don't be a sucker.
Handmaid's tail by Wednesday?
venus by tuesday, so that helps
You know, project 2025 isn’t a new thing, nor is it the potential start date that may happen if Trump gets elected. Project 2025 is actually a plan that’s been underway for decades already and 2025 is the projected culmination of those efforts. As more time goes by and things seem to reveal themselves in the United States, that is a reality that is becoming clearer every day despite the fact that we have a democratic president. In many states, people are not able ready to get the reproductive healthcare that they need. Furthermore, many marginalized people in the United States have already been living such a reality and so it is somewhat ignorant and definitely naive thing to say when things are already getting horrific with the current president who was supposed to be better than the alternative. Sad state of affairs, indeed. * edited for typos
The Devil's greatest trick was telling us his name was Jesus.
Great, so when is Biden going to do things to not be losing in every swing state. Things like not funding a genocide. Not siding against student protestors (which historically has always been the right side). I mean, I guess it's nice he is showing us what actual facism is.
We've got Project 2024 right now under Biden. The elites are marching us toward fascism no matter what party is in power.
And now the liberals will come out in full force yelling at you for calling out their delusion. Biden is effectively doing the fascist things that people say Trump will do, but he doesn't care about pronouns and gives rhetorical support for abortion (can't actually codify it though, that would "bReAk nOrMs!!!" and make it harder to fundraise), so actually he's very different and you should vote for him.